Open 773: Masons and Mafia: RVS Awards (GAME OVER)

[Auro]

BoP is real, there is more value to this gladiate than I originally thought

I don't know how good I am at mafia, I don't remember Pops from StarCraft mafia, I'm confident her actions in game are what make her scum and I asked to BoP on that basis, not historical read accuracy

The Mason thing, read her early ISO where she said something like "I DIDN'T GET THERE YET AURO" when the next post was 4 posts after the one she found bad

[Auro]

@CSF: whenever one of them voted the other they changed vote pretty fast, now when cheeky voted her she took the shot, look at the contexts of their associations. I don't think there's evidence against SvS

[Auro]

I guess I'm still not seeing why her vote on Aldus was scummier than the other votes on Aldus

You're talking about Suji, right? And it was scummy, her pushes on me were also scummy, I think she's likelier than Egix but whatever

[Auro]

when he was a hydra in starcraft his hydra was my hardest townread and I remember moving my positional ability thing to try to get in range to where I would be allowed to doc him. I don't remember why or how much was him or his read on me

I was hydra'd with Nancy and Pink Ball then I think.

In White Flag (team Mafia) Pops' scumread me incorrectly, and Pops says because of some "wagonomics" and I thought I was super obviously town. Dannfloor and his team were able to read me correctly, and said town should lock townread me if they died. Was

[Auro]

Pops' reasons for scumreading me are also weak, like yeah my asking about a scumtell could be mimicking my townplay but she has nothing to say against my rationale for asking it. She says my reads are so bad I should be BoP'd even though they all make sense, other slots also scumread them, and flipped Masons also did (Yshtola said Egix and Suji slot were both good votes). Ye, she can't really explain her Egix read, nor her Suji read. Suji's playstyle matches hers... Okay, now how does that make Suji more likely town?
The CSF wagoning after Rhul died was also bad

[Auro]

Pops, which townreads of mine were/are bad?

[Auro]

I also have a confident Klick read and doubtful ML read leaning town.
Klick has been strongly towny since early game.

[Auro]

Can you identify anything scummy from Klick?

[Auro]

Not a good look for Auro at all.

VOTE: Auro

Could also vote TSE

LOL

[Auro]

How is Pops your second towniest solve?

[Auro]

UNVOTE: in case not hammered

[Auro]

"ofc"

[Auro]

It does.

[Auro]

I'll have to check whether scum Egix is statistically likely to say "Good luck town" on getting lynched

[Auro]

Subject: Micro 920 - Less Pressure [Game Over!]

Times up :/

Welp
Good luck at lylo I guess

He was scum this game

[Auro]

Tracer Bullet. :3

[Auro]

It was a joke btw, he said that multiple times as town.

[Auro]

I think we can actually use the fact that there's one Mason alive and check for shots by putting people at L-1, if they're scum there's a high chance they shoot wrong and kill themselves instead. They either have to accept the gambit and shoot, or miss a shot in case they're lynched anyway.

[Auro]

As long as town knows not to be antsy, it'd possibly work; scum can try to get townread but they forego their chance to shoot in the case of possible hammer.

[Auro]

Wow
That was all four shots right?

Wait you were under the impression that scum get only four shots?!

[Auro]

Oh God.

[Auro]

I'm sure Suji is a better lynch @TSE

[Auro]

Right here Guys is called “Bad Town”

What's disappointing is that Egix was pretty good at obvtowning himself as town long ago.

[Auro]

I don't know what makes ML scum exactly? There are good reasons for Suji scum. Yshtola Rhul also said Sujislot was a good vote.

[Auro]

Based on my interactions with ML, do you think we're SvS?

[Auro]

@Miss Lynch do you think cheeky is scum?

[Auro]

You didn't read the setup properly

[Auro]

@TSE, do you think Miss Lynch is faking all this?

[Auro]

Ugh.

[Auro]

I remembered liking her early posts, I checked her ISO - I don't find them as towny as I found them then, and can't recall why I did. However, I do like her questions and stances, so, eh.

Do you find it strange that a shot happened when she appeared?

I noticed that. But I also felt that scum could lurk and take shots - for example, I recall CheekyTeeky as being a much more active player than she is this game.

You believe I'd say this if I was SvS with Cheeky?

[Auro]

Meh. You'd know the answers if you read the game. TSE wants you dead. I'm saying you're more likely town because you're unlikely to have faked this. But sure, I'm scum.

I believe I've been towny this game. People's reasons for voting me are wild. Cheeky voted Pops and then made an incorrect Mason shot... So I'm scum? This is shit reasoning. How come it doesn't look good for me but looks good for Pops?

[Auro]

You caught my scum agenda of defending you when others want you dead, Miss Lynch. Congratulations!

[Auro]

Please look at Cheeky/Pops associations.

[Auro]

Lynch Suji with me.

[Auro]

Miss Lynch, if you lynch me and I flip town, will you follow my desired lynch(es) in the following days?

[Auro]

Are you willing to sheep my lynch today and then lynch me tomorrow if it flips town?

[Auro]

... wow. You should read White Flag, starting D4. You remind me a lot of Dongempire.
At least he agreed to sheep my correct read if I flipped town.

[Auro]

TSE, ML isn't scum, they're just "bad town"

[Auro]

Miss Lynch ignores the fact that the timing of Cheeky's woodchuck slot (it was 99% her, or even otherwise, the shot itself no matter who took it) had no relation to the gamestate at the time. Cheeky simply took shots when she thought someone was Mason.

[Auro]

Yeah this slot needs to die.

VOTE: ML

It’s probably this, Pops and Suji.

Your reads are so good. Did you push Egix to lynch, too?

Didn't you just name Klick and Egix as great candidates for scum just a page ago?

Like no one's to blame for Egix's lynch. Egix being unreadable because of his poor effort at playing the game when he actually can is totally on him.

[Auro]

Chemist is arguably one of the scummiest players in the game but no one has mentioned him much at all.

I dislike this kind of stream of consciousness posting. I'd say taking notes and posting them at the *end* is a less noisy and more productive.

[Auro]

All those correct shots seems difficult to peace together for Cheeky

She seems like the only one with the guts to do that. Cheeky as a scum player prolly found that a lot more fun than dayplay.

[Auro]

@TSE, do you think Miss Lynch is faking all this?

@TSE read her earlier slip wrt the mechanic. I don't think scum ML who knows the mechanic would decide to fake *that*.

[Auro]

Can you guys take a break from going at each other, critically analyse Sujimichi's ISO?

[Auro]

Can you guys take a break from going at each other, critically analyse Sujimichi's ISO?

[Auro]

Thoughts? I think the second way is more plausible

This is what I'm trying to achieve with you, me, CSF, ML, TSE.

[Auro]

Pops Defence on Suji.
ML’s vote on a Mason with Suji

I think town!Suji is pretty sensible as a player, her attack on Aldehyde was bad. Read the case about "leading questions". Read my response explaining how context explains those questions and his unvoting a few posts later weakens the case. Then read her response saying "agree to disagree" or something like that.

[Auro]

Why do you think ML is Town here

I'm not completely sure of this, but I don't think ML fakes the things they posted in the past few pages, especially wrt mechanics

[Auro]

Can you quote townslips they faked?

[Auro]

@Klick, whatever content they have is good. Apologies for not going into detail. I've been using my mobile for the last couple days, so detailed cases are harder to make.

[Auro]

CSF is likely town because of Cheeky and Chemist jumping on their wagon so quickly

Good point. Pops was also on this wagon and advocating the "CSF was active" theory at the time.

[Auro]

VOTE: Cat scratch fever

I still think Yshtola's theory is probably wrong, but I think this second kill was quite possibly motivated by the win/win of killing Y'shtola or generating a scumflip that distracted the conversation off of CSF.

That interpretation would still give her a remaining kill, and looking at CSF's posting patterns, she is likely to return in 3-4 hours. If we can flashwagon her very, very quickly here, we could lynch her before she can desperation shoot. As soon as she's aware of this level of pressure she's likely to keep more of an eye on the thread.

[Auro]

If we can flashwagon her very, very quickly here, we could lynch her before she can desperation shoot.

Especially this is really bad. Unless Pops was gambiting?

[Auro]

I did not read you as Town at the time of your comment, so I took in what you said but I did not wish to debate it.

I think you'd know this is a bad idea unless you're super confident someone's scum, and even then I'd say it's a bad idea. Saying you scumread someone isn't an excuse to avoid debating points they raise.

[Auro]

A valid excuse*

[Auro]

Without regard to the validity of your point, why do you think I would "know this is a bad idea?" Further, why do you "think town!Suji is pretty sensible as a player?" As far as I recollect, we have not played a game together.

I can infer from your posts, I occasionally check out parts of other games, I've seen you being nommed for Rising Star, etc.

[Auro]

Why did you say this when we potentially do not have a next phase?

It's 5T v 3S, right? So we have one mislynch to burn, assuming scum don't make a correct shot (and I don't think they'll take the risk)

[Auro]

From my perspective, at least one Mafia member has to have been on Egix96's lynch. Unless you view that lynch as entirely accomplished by Town, I do not know why we are looking at the players outside of the wagon for today.

Fallacious reasoning, Sujimichi. Think about it.

[Auro]

You are assuming that they have not already identified the last Mason and are waiting for an incorrect lynch today to follow up with an immediate shot and a win. We should be playing this day as if it is our last chance, not bargaining in hopes that your assumption is correct

I already am. My question was in the hypothetical that Miss Lynch got me lynched. I wanted to know her answer given that hypothetical.

[Auro]

It is not fallacious if you are simultaneously not on the wagon and have town role PM

Neither have any bearing towards the validity of the argument itself.
"The sun rises in the east, therefore I'm town" -> I have a town role PM but that's still a fallacy.

[Auro]

@ML: I'm not saying that one scum is likely on the wagon is fallacious, but implying that you hunt in the wagon while not lynching outside is.

[Auro]

Sure, it's likely there's one scum on the wagon (and I think it's Pops), but there's equal likelihood of scum outside the wagon as well; so "vote within the wagon" is incorrect.

This applies to the Egix wagon because it doesn't seem like a scum generated push; it was an entirely reasonable wagon. And that's strengthened by the fact that flipped Masons scumread him too.

[Auro]

Why are you ignoring the actual argument for looking on the lynch?

There is no argument. As I said, one scum being on wagon doesn't imply you look on the lynch.

Miss Lynch, you misunderstand. Sure, scum can be on the wagon. The idea that you hence look "on the wagon" is problematic.

We townbloc and lynch the highest equity scum (this also insures against an incorrect townbloc).

[Auro]

I'd like to point out that the only argument made against me or Sujimi (as far as I can tell) has been an argument of BoP

No. Suji's reasoning has been bad, her pushes have been bad, her actions have been scummy. This is not a BoP argument.

[Auro]

I think you just approach the game differently from Suji

Indeed, but I'm not suspecting her based on her playstyle.

[Auro]

What does that even mean? I'm calling out bad reasoning based on the bad reasons, not on playstyle, you're making little sense.

[Auro]

@TSE: there have been towntells from the slot; and from the way she posts I don't feel like her reasoning is outside townrange. In your experience, have they been reasonable/sensible as town such that this current gameplay is suggestive of scum?

[Auro]

More like they acted like this in their last scum game.

When you say "like this" can you go into specifics if possible?
Do you have a towngame of theirs to compare?

[Auro]

Swift Deity (Auro)

I'm curious, why that nickname? Is this a reference to something?

[Auro]

@Pops/Chemist: would you vote Suji? If not, why not?

[Auro]

When are you planning to read the game?
Till what point have you read the game - and do you think Suji is a good lynch at that point?

[Auro]

Sure, but give me your stances (especially wrt Suji) at the point you've read till, please?

[Auro]

I love your energy, TSE. Thanks for the support

[Auro]

Okay, finally on my laptop - time for my own case on Suji.

Part 1: The Aldusskel read.

Spoiler: Posts related to Aldehyde

I came to a different conclusion in that most of his questions, such as the majority of post 142, appear to be made with the intent to look like he is questioning, but without the intent to truly understand. His last question in post 142, for example, is a leading question with only one "correct" answer and yet he utilizes it to make it seem as if TrueSoulEnergy is Mafia "walking the line" with Auro until he needs to cast him aside.

He does something similar to Miss Lynch in post 322 using the word "weird" instead of being straightforward with assigning alignment. One could say he is guilty of doing something similar to what he accused TrueSoulEnergy doing to Auro in that he is keeping his options open with regard to Miss Lynch (and it is not lost on me the humor in that he is lightly attacking Miss Lynch for attacking Auro and not voting him whilst keeping his vote on Egix96).

I came to a different conclusion in that most of his questions, such as the majority of post 142, appear to be made with the intent to look like he is questioning, but without the intent to truly understand. His last question in post 142, for example, is a leading question with only one "correct" answer and yet he utilizes it to make it seem as if TrueSoulEnergy is Mafia "walking the line" with Auro until he needs to cast him aside.

He does something similar to Miss Lynch in post 322 using the word "weird" instead of being straightforward with assigning alignment. One could say he is guilty of doing something similar to what he accused TrueSoulEnergy doing to Auro in that he is keeping his options open with regard to Miss Lynch (and it is not lost on me the humor in that he is lightly attacking Miss Lynch for attacking Auro and not voting him whilst keeping his vote on Egix96).

I thought you were referring to 143 as a question and thought you were misreading phrasing. I should have read that paragraph closer, sorry about that. Looking back, I think you were actually referring to post 140.
Anyway, it still didn't bother me at the time, and I'll explain.
I don't read that question ("What if Auro does the scummiest shit ever") as a leading question to nail TSE. It feels more like question from incredulity at TSE's stance of calling me a functional IC for D1 from one post. "Seriously?" and " " seem to be relevant context-setters here. Also notice he moved off TSE here:

ugh that is really different from here. plus, I'm getting reminded of town TSE during marathon weekend + me scumreading him for his playstyle rather than it being truly scum-indicative.

unvote

Given the context and his eventual shift from the TSE attack, I don't think that "leading question" can only have scummy intent.
You say he's "lightly attacking Miss Lynch" - he states in 432 that he isn't scumreading her, rather just disagrees with her scumhunting methods? His interactions with her are mostly appeals to tone it down. I don't find any unreasonable posts. His keeping the Egix vote isn't inconsistent with his posts around ML. Also, what does "keeping his options open" mean? How does one differentiate between scum "keeping their options open", versus town making light pushes but hasn't definitively sorted a slot yet?

My latter argument still holds, in that he seems generically towny in a holistic sense.

I do disagree with your explanation (though I conceded that Alduskkel later explained his statement on Miss Lynch, I do not find that to be genuine), and I do not see what you mean by "holistically town."

Thank you. What is it specifically about Alduskkel so far that makes him a town read for you?

His demeanor and how much effort he has been putting towards multiple slots in the game.

I'll preface this point by reminding you that scum *have* to generally push town in order to win; and knowing that the slots they're pushing are town, their reasoning often appears forced. It's also not easy to fake fluidity in read changes as scum -

you already know

that the person you've been pushing is town; so when someone offers evidence against your push, it doesn't change your stance the way it would if you were town believing they're scum.
Suji's progression on Aldehyde satisfies this. In 430 quoted above, one of her primary points in her case is that Aldehyde appeared to ask leading questions without intent to understand. She cites the specific instance of Aldehyde asking TSE "Would you still read Auro as IC if he did the scummiest shit ever?". Devoid of context, this appears like a legitimate attack - but once you read the posts around it, it's apparent that town!Aldehyde could have simply asked it out of incredulity that TSE treated me as an IC based on nearly nothing. Suji didn't notice this when she made her attack, fine. But after I point it out in 583, she responds saying "I do disagree with your explanation" and disengages soon after. I didn't substantiate my "holistically towny" point. But, Suji asks Yshtola Rhul why she townread Ald and Rhul responds with something similar in 419 - Suji never follows up on this. Her whole progression betrays

a stubbornness towards re-evaluation that comes from a scum mindset, not honest sorting.

Part 2: Her engagement with scumreads

Town should be more interested in clearing up disagreements, no? At the very least, town would want to understand where someone's coming from, to more accurately sort someone's slot. Suji says that she disengaged because she was confident in my being scum thus making it unproductive.
Now, read this progression in a game where Suji was town who suspected Titus.

Spoiler: Open 767: Nomination Mafia

Back on the computer now.
-snip-

Scum

PMysterious

: None of his posting feels genuine to me. For example: post 214 is comes across as hedging, and post 230 comes across as too much information. The follow up to NorwegianBoyEE pointing that out in post 232 feels fake (why say Vanilla Townie/Scum; I would think genuine posting would be Town/Scum). He also comes across as generally detached to the point he felt the need to post that he is reading the game in post 489.

Titus

: Disagree with her stance on mutantdevle's vote in post 36. Repetitive in calling mutantdevle scummy but doesn't really explain why (posts 59 and 106) and nitpicking mutantdevle (post 180). Don't like the call for early intent to hammer in post 194 , and there is no need to get role claim given the setup. The snark and chain posting in posts 194, 195, 197, 198, and especially 199 come across as fake and not really with the intent to do anything other than be snarky. Didn't like the Correspondence/GuiltyLion vote for reasons above, and I don't understand the townread on NorwegianBoyEE. The further push to lynch Correspondence/GuiltyLion (post 375 ) is bad especially since it was for untrue reasons ([Correspondence]'s posting just enough to avoid attention/replacement). I don't believe post 384 is genuine.

If you disagree with my reads, feel free to say so and where you disagree. If you don't, then I'm glad we're aligned.

Why would someone agreeing with your reads mean you have the same alignment?

It doesn't, necessarily. That's irrellevant as my usage of "aligned" there means "we're in agreement on our thinking" which should be obvious from the context of the sentence.

Scum attack when we make the protown move to lynch Correspondence or get info (GuiltyLion sub).

Why is it a protown move to lynch an inactive slot that is almost certainly to get replaced? You already asserted that the Correspondence was being just active enough not to get replaced or to avoid attention (375, 417), but that wasn't true as Correspondence's last post was 7 days prior to your assertion. I think it's a proscum move to try and lynch a completely inactive slot in it's absence.

If you disagree with my reads, feel free to say so and where you disagree. If you don't, then I'm glad we're aligned.

Why would someone agreeing with your reads mean you have the same alignment?

It doesn't, necessarily. That's irrellevant as my usage of "aligned" there means "we're in agreement on our thinking" which should be obvious from the context of the sentence.

It wasn't and it's honestly pretty gross that you'd try to put me clarifying that as something that should have been "obvious".

Given Awoo is likely town, this could be planting the seeds you two share an alignment when you could be scum.

I fail to see how it is gross to assume someone can put two and two together (a common definition of "align" in addition to a preceding sentence where the theme is discussing agreement), but I don't feel like getting chastised for discussing semantics again. I didn't try to assign anything toward you with my statement, as you seem to be thinking I did (hence "gross"). Actually, it feels as though you were using that as a lead in to project something you would do as scum to me.

Titus, why did you fail to address my comment on your Correspondence assertion?

Scum attack when we make the protown move to lynch Correspondence or get info (GuiltyLion sub).

Why is it a protown move to lynch an inactive slot that is almost certainly to get replaced? You already asserted that the Correspondence was being just active enough not to get replaced or to avoid attention (375, 417), but that wasn't true as Correspondence's last post was 7 days prior to your assertion. I think it's a proscum move to try and lynch a completely inactive slot in it's absence.

Scum attack when we make the protown move to lynch Correspondence or get info (GuiltyLion sub).

Why is it a protown move to lynch an inactive slot that is almost certainly to get replaced? You already asserted that the Correspondence was being just active enough not to get replaced or to avoid attention (375, 417), but that wasn't true as Correspondence's last post was 7 days prior to your assertion. I think it's a proscum move to try and lynch a completely inactive slot in it's absence.

Well, the move is to either get content or lynch it. Your post forgets the night phase in the middle.

If Correspondence prod dodged only, then yes we should lynch it as he'd be scum coasting on the assumption scum would never put a lurker in.

Yet, he got replaced by GL who is a very weak townread based on his under weak to moderate pressure content.

I was also townreading Nee at the time. So it's the best play in the situation we had. I would love to be stringing up Melanque but I can't do that.

Correspondence had two posts in game which occurred on the same day. There was no history of prod dodging, and a phase change does not impact the inevitable replacement given the violation of activity rules. The protown move is to wait so that we can get content. The proscum move is to lynch the slot before we do.

Even if I ignored (or "forgot") the phase change, there were 7 days between the last post and your assertion, and the moderator prodded Correspondence (317) almost 4 full days before your assertion. This is well outside the activity requirements and you should have known a replacement was coming. We were (and are) in no rush to end the day phase, so pushing Correspondence was very scummy for you.

If GL is town, scum want that slot empty and without production as its mislynch bait later.

Or, scum wanted to include one of their own for town credit knowing there was an easy push on either a player that (you admit) is mislynch bait or a player that arguably quickhammered.

I didn't like your responses.

VOTE: Titus

The push prevented GL's slot from remaining empty so *shrug* teach me to play day 1

How did your push have anything to do with preventing Correspondence/GuiltyLion from remaining content-less (I assume this is what you mean, and not that your push was responsible for someone filling a slot that had replaced out)? I've already covered Correspondence's inevitable replacement. Did you think that GuiltyLion would have come in here and posted nothing but for your push?

The way she interacted with Titus in that game is starkly different from how she interacted with me this game. I don't think I should really spell it out; it should be obvious upon skimming our conversation. If it isn't, do let me know and I'll detail. It stands that her engagement with me this game

is not how town!Suji approaches scumreads.

Part 3: Her activity today

Some of us have been hardpushing her. She had already been suspecting me. One more mislynch and game can end with a scum victory (if scum makes a correct shot). If you were town and had people hardpushing you in maybe-MyLo, what would be your first reaction? Probably one of aggression, right? You'd try to find out the reasons people are pushing you, point out that they're inaccurate, and try to figure out who's scum pushing you (or) misguided town, to make the correct lynch. Instead, Suji argues in 1128 that town should be hunting on-wagon. Even if her argument was valid, this looks like a

rational appeal to town to get off her

; there's no sorting based on this, or defense, otherwise. The reasoning itself is problematic because

scum are equally likely to have been off-wagon too

, and literally nearly everyone was suspecting Egix (for valid reasons, as I pointed out) - so pinpointing a single push as coming from a scummy motivation is hard. She doubles down on her reasoning when I point out the fallacy. Maybe I just suck at explaining things, but why it's bad reasoning isn't complex logic.

--------------------

There's more in her posting that's scummy that I haven't covered here. Her attack on me was bad, and I can write a section on that as well. She said she needs to reassess things following Ald's flip in 735, but also mentioned Yshtola Rhul as a scumlean in her readslist in 476 - Rhul's flip should have also been a strong reason to re-evaluate things. She never really pushed Rhul, inspite of suspecting her. Questions like "between Egix and Auro, who's more likely mafia" (606) don't really make sense from a town mindset. Homura's ISO has two "valid questions" sure, but no stances, and the questions were in-line with other attacks on TSE; not novel gamesolving questions. Homura replaced out and is active elsewhere (this might be perceived as an "angleshooty" argument but I don't care; Homura is a newbie and I think it's a good possibility they replaced out largely from being scum).
She has associations with Pops: Pops is her "strongest townread" in 476 and claims there are in-game reasons in 414 but never detailed them; she wasn't asked for it maybe but my hard-pushing of Pops should have been a good reason to do so, no? 606 actually looks like her asking her buddy who the better attack is. Pops similarly townreads Suji and has a lot of weird stances towards her.

--------------------

Klick, if you're too concerned about CSF I can probably towncase her - it's harder to towncase people, but I can try to show you why I think she's strongly town. Suji's scum equity is high enough that paranoia about other slots isn't too much of a concern, though. CSF, same goes re: Klick.

[Auro]

@TSE: I understand your worry about ML and she's my weakest townread; BUT, every scumlynch affords us an extra mislynch because the setup is nightless. If we're 4T vs 3S, a scum lynch brings it to 4T vs 2S - you can lynch a townslot after that and not lose the game. Right now, though, it's important to get a correct scum lynch!

[Auro]

TSE, another towntell for Miss Lynch - I think as scum she'd focus more on pushing slots and spreading paranoia over purely defending Suji. She's not making -strong- attacks anywhere else. At maximum, she said Klick had less content and was more likely scum than Suji.

[Auro]

And backed down from that attack pretty quick, no? With the level of conviction she presents in the game she could absolutely have continued to tunnel.

[Auro]

Pops, I'm curious - what do you think of my abilities as a town player? I'd like a honest answer. I won't be offended

[Auro]

If not why, why not: because you are supporting the lynch

Haha

[Auro]

Can you tell me, why have you scumread me more than Sujimichi all game when this seems much more coherent than your stances on me?

You'll get a wall-case, after we lynch Suji!

[Auro]

Klick, TSE, CSF town
Miss Lynch I don't know.
Pops, Suji, Chemist is my current guess for the scumteam

Auro to what extent are you good at mafia where I should BoP you on a really bad solve
Not a leading question treat it goodfaithy please

You also admit Suji hasn't been towntelling... Which means there was no real reason to townread her even at that point, and you wouldn't vote her only because I'm pushing her. I'm sure you'll say the same about Chemist, too.

Given that, 869 seems to make little sense from you. I don't see why you felt it was such a "really bad solve" that I might have to be BoP'd.

[Auro]

869 predates Sujimichi's day 2 posts?!?!? pls no time travel BoP

I know it did. I inferred that you didn't have any real reason to townread her then too, and then made my argument.

[Auro]

You wanted a Suji case and I gave one - thoughts?

[Auro]

let's talk about these votecounts

Yes, perhaps we can have a look at your position in those VCs.

[Auro]

Chemist isn't doing any gamesolving, do tell me what you think of his ISO

[Auro]

P1, scum knows that the town slots they're pushing as scum are town, so cases can appear unnatural

[Auro]

P2, too much of an adjustment

[Auro]

Auro, in BoP 1, how much of Michael Scott was you?

Also, do you think I'm a competent mafia player?

Yes, and I don't know. I think your logic is wonky at many places.
I can absolutely fake this energy as scum.

[Auro]

I'm wondering what Pops' strategy here is if she's scum with Suki (and Chemist?)

[Auro]

misreading me means this is an offgame for him

I know you hate self meta and I feel like I've asked this before, but how should I recognize you're town here? Your CSF flashwagon attempt was gross, your pushes on me were all weak and you kept pushing the "Auro could be scum leading a town circus" angle, you kept defending one of my strongest scumreads with weak reasoning.

There were large parts of ML's posts I disagreed with heavily and even though ML entered the day with that attack on me, I read her town from some towntells she dropped.

Are you out of your scumrange, Pops?

[Auro]

Yup, IIRC.

[Auro]

I remember having asked my buddy to start protesting when you said you'd guess us as the team, unfortunately she went offline at that moment

[Auro]

The problem I'm trying to overcome is whether or not you'd have the motivation to fake it.

To win?
Although now I hate playing scum so I dunno if I'd be as enthusiastic, but whatever.

[Auro]

I am not -actually- a Nancy Drew 39 alt so I'm not going to scream the reasons at you you should be townreading me, I never do that as either alignment.

Don't scream, just tell me?

[Auro]

You repeatedly make these little mentions that would imply you could sympathize with an Auro scumread but then go on to talk about how bad the scumread is and how you think I'm scum for it. Like 4 posts ago you told ML you could be high energy as scum and the circus metaphor was precisely about how you've been high energy and I sense you're the kind of player that could do that as scum.

Wait did I say I sympathize with your Auro scumread? I don't and I find it annoying, especially after you misread me in WF where I was putting in -a lot- of effort gamesolving. You keep framing me as some potential monster who has to be killed if scum, while making it hard for me to get the lynches I want first. That's unfair if you're town, don't you think?

The other reasons you've called me scum for I think are bad, independently, like the meta tells thing.

[Auro]

I also hardclaim Mason :V

[Auro]

These are all softs

Why would you be softing Mason?

[Auro]

I mean softing Mason as a Mason is a bad idea, like there's no universe where you'd want to confirm yourself as a Mason because of scum shots

[Auro]

You didn't say it, I'm saying the logic for sympathizing seems like it's there

No. I don't think I'm an unreadable player. I think it's very unfair to try and push me on paranoia with bad supporting reasons, especially without giving me a chance to lynch scum (especially since you believe I have good reads as town).

[Auro]

@whoever's Mason, you should probably consider that counterclaims can be slots protecting you. On the other hand, if you're Mason and someone else claimed it they could be gambiting to draw the shot (although this would be bad timing)

Let's stop the Mason discussion and just lynch scum.

[Auro]

I thought about it, but not acting on it actually helps scum better. Shutting it down is what's important.

[Auro]

@ML: or we've nailed the scumteam and they're making a last ditch effort to draw out the Mason by claiming it.

[Auro]

@Pops just please tell me how I should recognize you being town from your own perspective. We can stop talking then. If you've already answered it, apologies but I missed it.

[Auro]

VOTE: Chemist

Whatever

I claimed to get myself out of the PoE so I might as well just die

Why would you when you're not the desired lynch today if you're Mason? Like it could be a gambit sure but I have a really hard time imagining this is a good time to pull off a gambit as town, and as scum there's good reason to.

[Auro]

I don't think Pops shoots even if she's confident in someone being a Mason right now, for ~reasons~

[Auro]

I agree, still Suji

[Auro]

Thank you.

[Auro]

VOTE: Sujimichi

[Auro]

@Klick: Are you townreading CSF now?

[Auro]

UNVOTE:
Thinking

[Auro]

VOTE: Sujimichi

[Auro]

While Pops' recent posting and a few others this day make me a tiny bit less sure about her, Suji is still the correct lynch. I've picked up some things that I strongly believe she wouldn't say as town, but I won't be going into them right now.

[Auro]

I'm going to go more in depth with her later tonight, but right now I'm leaning scum there.

ML's recent posts make me stronger on her being town, especially her reaction to my saying I can fake this energy as scum.

When I said that, she acknowledged that I could, but then thought about whether I *would* portray that energy in

this

gamestate and concluded correctly (fmpov anyway) that I'm town.

I know I'm town. There's no reason for Miss Lynch to conclude I'm town if she's scum, unless I'm horribly wrong in my reads (but pretty sure that's not the case). The nuance in her reasoning is extremely towny.

I'm reaching the conclusion that the game makes no sense if {Suji, Chemist, Pops} aren't all scum.

[Auro]

@Miss Lynch: Sure, take your time. I don't think a lynch -now- is necessary for a win anyway. If you have any questions, I'll be here.

[Auro]

UNVOTE:

[Auro]

Claiming Mason if he's actually Mason is a horribly dumb play, and the reasons he gave for it are stupid.

There's zero reason to claim it to "get out of a PoE" when you're not the lynch.
He said something about not pushing partners, which makes no sense.
He used his Mason claim as an excuse to lurk this game "to avoid getting shot" which is again very dumb if he actually was a Mason.
If you know you'd get shot, and that's functionally no different from a lynch (which was an option if you're in a PoE) and there's no benefit at all to be derived from confirming yourself as Mason. It's terrible for town to out yourself.

On the other hand, it makes a lot of sense if {Suji, Pops, Chemist} is the scumteam or even just {Suji. Chemist} - he's throwing a Hail Mary to distract town and add noise, and maybe draw out a Mason counterclaim. He seems a bit angry at other players "obfuscating" it, and tried to make TSE back down from the claim in case he was VT - this is suggestive of fishing.

He attempted to break the townbloc before by suggesting "scum in Auro/Klick" based on Suji being a counterwagon to Cheeky - where everyone one Cheeky was lolwagoning her at the time.

He's done no real gamesolving this game. Sure he might be useless lynchbait as town, but whatever he has done this game has very plausible scum motivation. There's no critical thought in his posts.

[Auro]

@Klick I'd make some points but if you'd rather Miss Lynch respond to you first, I'll wait.
Pops also made a milder setup slip - what do you think of that? Something along the lines of "so all four shots are done, right?" After Cheeky's death.

[Auro]

literally 31 seconds.

I thought MS only shows the minute of posting - how do I see the second?

[Auro]

Should have guessed!
User profile -> Board settings -> choose the custom option in the date and time setting and modify to "D M d, Y g:i a s"

[Auro]

g:i:s is more natural, actually

[Auro]

I find it somewhat unlikely that you can discern intent or alignment from three, brief posts.

"I know the slot is scum" no
"This is scummy and a good basis to push on at this point in the game" yes

[Auro]

I'm happy you both are approaching this in good faith.

[Auro]

"is active elsewhere" should be a perfectly fine point to make, I'll be disappointed if *that* is against forum rules lol.

Who are my partners, Suji?

[Auro]

Suji, I'd like to hear your thoughts on the other slots. Can you comment on my post about why Chemist is scum?

[Auro]

She is not re-evaluating her stances based on Egix96's reveal as Town,

Suji, I'd like you to go into more detail about this - which stances of hers do you believe should have been re-evaluated post the Egix flip?

[Auro]

Claiming Mason if he's actually Mason is a horribly dumb play, and the reasons he gave for it are stupid.

There's zero reason to claim it to "get out of a PoE" when you're not the lynch.
He said something about not pushing partners, which makes no sense.
He used his Mason claim as an excuse to lurk this game "to avoid getting shot" which is again very dumb if he actually was a Mason.
If you know you'd get shot, and that's functionally no different from a lynch (which was an option if you're in a PoE) and there's no benefit at all to be derived from confirming yourself as Mason. It's terrible for town to out yourself.

On the other hand, it makes a lot of sense if {Suji, Pops, Chemist} is the scumteam or even just {Suji. Chemist} - he's throwing a Hail Mary to distract town and add noise, and maybe draw out a Mason counterclaim. He seems a bit angry at other players "obfuscating" it, and tried to make TSE back down from the claim in case he was VT - this is suggestive of fishing.

He attempted to break the townbloc before by suggesting "scum in Auro/Klick" based on Suji being a counterwagon to Cheeky - where everyone one Cheeky was lolwagoning her at the time.

He's done no real gamesolving this game. Sure he might be useless lynchbait as town, but whatever he has done this game has very plausible scum motivation. There's no critical thought in his posts.

Sure, re-quoted.

[Auro]

You are also ascribing behaviors to me that I do not exhibit which, if you have read my previous games as you obviously have done, you would be aware of.

When I said "You" in the post it was rhetoric, and wasn't describing your play - rather how I believe town would behave. Can you point out the behaviors I falsely ascribed you of?

[Auro]

we just said this player is freshman Creature, cmon, can't we make you feel bad for needing any kind of crutch at all?

I'll think about it... Information is information but I get your point.

@Suji, CSF has Chemist/PopS/You all in her scumpile, so I'm not sure where you'd expect her to end up on a re-evaluation given the new information.

Scum in Chemist/Pops/Suji/Egix/ML -> Egix flips town -> scum in Chemist/Pops/Suji?

Like this seems like the logical conclusion? Maybe I don't get what you're saying and I'll think about it more.

[Auro]

I assumed maybe ML has some familiarity with CT that made it seem less impossible.

For what it's worth, I think it's absolutely believable coming from ML. It doesn't look like the kind of thing someone would fake.

@Chemist: How come you were more interested in sorting Pops first over me?

[Auro]

@Chemist: Can you give me a scumteam solve?

[Auro]

You haven't read the game or yet to analyze?
Whatever you feel is the highest % rn

[Auro]

What comes to mind first. Go.

[Auro]

One thing I was kind of expecting from you unprompted today was a coherent townbloc proposal, even if it's only two or three cards at this point, and I don't remember seeing that type of thought.

I was conversely expecting a scumteam solve.
Proposing Auro/CSF/Klick doesn't seem to make much sense if scum!her believes I won't change my mind and TSE won't.

[Auro]

Auro townreading this slot for reasons that don't make me sense

Which reasons specifically? I'm cool if you disagree that the nuance in her read of me after I claimed to have high energy as scum is a towntell, but you can't see why I'd believe that's a legitimate point?

[Auro]

I can tell you. It was for her slips and the catch up where she was scumreading Cheeky - I said I find it difficult to believe she'd be faking that as scum. I also said something about her having portrayed a lot of conviction before in thread, so if scum I'd expect her to carry that right now and she didn't.

Either of these points?

[Auro]

Pops, how is TSE's counterclaim scummier than Chemist's? You do agree only one of them can be scum, btw, right?

[Auro]

I think the fact that no one's taking a shot right now is slightly indicative of Cheeky having taken all 4 shots earlier.

[Auro]

I don't disagree on lynching their partner, it's just that the positioning of their slots in your list seems odd.

[Auro]

Townslip scavenger hunt seems like a convenient way to approach a partner slot in general.

That wasn't the only thing though? And if we're SvS ML would have had to fake her outburst D1 as well knowing I was a partner...

[Auro]

I just want to say I'm enjoying playing with you all, this is a great playerlist indeed! Apologies if I'm making the game un-fun to some of you though

[Auro]

I feel like I see signaling posts from you, Pops.

[Auro]

Posts conveying stuff to your partner, if you're scum. Just making a note about it now for the record.

[Auro]

I think Chemist invited.

[Auro]

Unvoted*

[Auro]

Maybe she's signaling you to concentrate more on trying to get into a townbloc instead of necessarily convincing people on cases

[Auro]

Now you can see why I'm so paranoid about Suji! :p

[Auro]

But still I think it's not nothing that my teammates didn't see enough in my piece to carry the torch the next mile on this, which is a reason to be less confident.

The phrasing here strikes me weirdly, too!

[Auro]

But still I think it's not nothing that my teammates didn't see enough in my piece to carry the torch the next mile on this, which is a reason to be less confident.

The phrasing here strikes me weirdly, too!

Suji, does this look odd to you? If so, can you tell me why?

[Auro]

I was hoping you wouldn't intercept that question, Pops
Question still stands, first to Suji.

[Auro]

From what I read neither has the other as their preferred lynch today

Spoiler: sure

More like they acted like this in their last scum game.

When you say "like this" can you go into specifics if possible?
Do you have a towngame of theirs to compare?

No.
That’s why I’m more confident on Suji flipping Mafia now compared to Blood Wiplasher.
Because I can compare Suji but not Blood Wiplasher.

The only game I was in with Blood Wiplasher they were third party scum.

We win once Auro/CSF/Klick

All acknowledge each other as Town.

And vote Suji with me.

Auto realizes it.
I need to make sure Klick and CSF do too.

As I think PoE wise Suji never flips Town here.

@TSE: I understand your worry about ML and she's my weakest townread; BUT, every scumlynch affords us an extra mislynch because the setup is nightless. If we're 4T vs 3S, a scum lynch brings it to 4T vs 2S - you can lynch a townslot after that and not lose the game. Right now, though, it's important to get a correct scum lynch!

That’s why my votes on Suji.

[Auro]

I feel like Pops as town would have presented a lot more annoyance at my accusations and that kind of language nitpick

[Auro]

@TSE: I think so, but I'd like to wait for a day and let the game play out a bit more.

[Auro]

And, it's actually probably really town indicative, because scum!Auro would see what I posted and think "that's what town!pops posts here, I know because I just read it and I have her role PM in notepad", but town!Auro is speculating.

Regardless of alignment it's not too hard to notice a difference in the way you react to things. As scum who wants to sell you as scum, I'd constantly be thinking of additional reasons to build my case and would jump on the opportunity to portray a change in behaviour as scum-indicative.

Your calling it "extremely town indicative" for -me- here seems a little forced, to be honest.

[Auro]

@Auro
Do you still think Suji is the correct lynch here?

Having Egix and three Masons as her solve is still wild, lol, when save Egix the rest were very towny

[Auro]

Actually ignore that.

[Auro]

Oh wow I thought you actually said that, excuse me.

[Auro]

Interesting. Still, would you agree Suji is the best lynch here? Or do you aim to sort in {Auro, Miss Lynch} and lynch there?

[Auro]

One of Auro/Suji town

Didn't you have Auro/ML as SvT before?

[Auro]

I'm conscious of the fact that if it's wrong you are a) pretty likely scum

Why so?

[Auro]

Do you believe it's plausible that scum!Chemist claims Mason while town!Suji is getting pushed by many townslots?

[Auro]

around page 10ish where you were arguing and spamming up the thread

I see you loosely followed White Flag - would you say "arguing and spamming" was not an element of my D1 play when I was pushing people based on their push on me?

[Auro]

her interactions with the Suji slot don't really feel like SvS to me

Which interactions in particular? Please show me. Keep in mind that Sujimichi is a relatively new player (and was apparently coached to a good extent in her previous scumgame by Mastina), and the game has no daytalk.

[Auro]

It would look pretty awesome for a ML/CSF/Chemist scumteam.
If they're confident in Mason it's a win. If they're not, I will still be under heavy suspicion.
There's all reason to believe Pops will hard-push me and perhaps even vote me.

Why would scum!anyone claim unprompted? Clearly there must be some gamestate reason for it.
That there was significant pressure on Suji is pretty clear.
So Chemist must not only be dumb, he must also be ignorant of the game?
Does Chemist strike you as dumb?

Would you agree that claiming Masons if Suji was his partner, on the other hand, is not necessarily dumb play (it still kind of is) but more explainable?

[Auro]

I didn't pay a huge amount of attention to that specific game - I could go back and reread if you'd like but I'm not sure it'd help me sort you

Yes, but it should stop you from repeating the "Auro argued hence must be SvT with ML" line of reasoning.
Once you acknowledge that's no more random % than my being TvT/SvS with ML at worst, I'll continue with the next part of my argument.

[Auro]

I agree I've been calling you "dumb or scum", but with the implication that you're scum because I refuse to believe you're dumb.

If someone wants to show me that Chemist can be dumb regarding simple mechanics, feel free to back up that thought with any example from a previous game.

[Auro]

It has kind of been easy to tell that TSE is a mason for a while, Chemist

Do you have any thoughts to offer about this particular post, especially in the context of her latest posts, Klick?

[Auro]

I don't think this comes from scum about a scumbuddy?

Encouragement?
I feel like she was avoiding placing any real read on Suji, and instead said NAI things.

[Auro]

I've basically come up null on his Mason claim because I could see him doing it as either alignment if he had just been skimming and seeing that he had a decent amount of pressure on him.

Incorrect, Klick. If this was true, it would have reflected in the reasons he mentioned for claiming. "To get out of the PoE and avoid a TSE tunnel" were the first two reasons he mentioned. "To avoid lynching a buddy" or something was a reason for crumbing.

If he actually felt lynch pressure it's highly unlikely he would have said "to get out of the PoE". I don't think there's anyway he comes to the conclusion that he's the one getting lynched today anyway, upon any skim of the thread.

The rationale for crumbing is also obviously bad if Mason, and that isn't a function of gamestate for Mason.

He also doubled down on the claim, tried to confirm it, got frustrated when others started claiming it - that's scummy.

[Auro]

Heading out for now but I'll look at white flag when I'm back

If it probably won't help you sort me it's a waste of time - I'd rather you just spend that time engaging with me, because if you're town I need your vote on scum.

[Auro]

It has kind of been easy to tell that TSE is a mason for a while, Chemist

Do you have any thoughts to offer about this particular post, especially in the context of her latest posts, Klick?

I'm also re-quoting this question, since you might have missed it.

[Auro]

Okay, ignore the further WIFOM - how is "it's been easy to tell that TSE is a mason for a while" not anti-town?
What purpose does that serve?

[Auro]

@TSE: Right now, I believe Chemist is a better lynch than Suji.

[Auro]

To your pedit: No, I was telling you to read that one comment specifically while ignoring the succeeding WIFOM.

[Auro]

1. I'm sort of losing my Klick townread.
2. I'm considering the possibility that I'm wrong about you and scum want me to mislynch you - Klick keeps branding you and I as SvT; Pops doesn't seem to care *too much* to convince me off lynching you, when there's such a clear associative that Pops would know she probably dies next.

[Auro]

you and me*

[Auro]

To clarify, that's reasoning for why I'm moving off Suji.
I simply think Chemist has highest scum equity.

[Auro]

If you are considering the possibility that you were wrong on me, why do you suspect Chemist1422 to be the best lynch? Were you not using his claim as Mason as a reason to suspect we were both Mafia? If you believe that I am town, why does a Mafia-aligned Chemist1422 claim Mason when I am the one being pushed at the time?

This might sound wonky but I'll try to explain; if the rational conclusion is that you both are Mafia and it's also logical to lynch you over the claimed "Mason", how harmful is it to scum!Chemist exactly? That while also drawing a counter-claim actually sets up a pretty good win% for scum in the event you're lynched, if {Pops/Chemist} are both scum but you aren't.
In addition to Pops slightly nudging the Suji push (by calling the case 'persuasive' and suggesting that town sheep my reads if I'm town and my reads are good, etc) she also tried to divert off Chemist by suggesting the lynch be outside {TSE, Chemist}. Her message "TSE has been obvious mason, Chemist" (or something like that) seems like a message to Chemist. I see there's a possibility she townreads both somehow and wants to muddle the waters with WIFOM, but... meh.

[Auro]

Suji, I will appreciate it if both of us assume each other town for a while and engage towards a solve from that perspective.

[Auro]

@Klick: Add to it that Chemist feels that TSE's counterclaim is scum because "it's gamethrowing" if VT; would be sort of hypocritical for him to start wanting to thunderdome TSE if he gambited as a VT to draw the shot lol.

[Auro]

Perhaps hypocritical is a wrong word the way I use it, but I'm arguing that he wouldn't believe what he believed about TSE if he was actually doing the same thing

[Auro]

I'll concede that Chemist knows what he's doing.

[Auro]

a mislynch greatly favors Auro-scum

This is an empty statement, a mislynch favors anyone-scum.

I am very much against a CSF lynch. No one has a solid case on her - give me one? "IIoA" where? Which questions of hers "lead nowhere"?

[Auro]

I was hoping the mafia would try to shoot TSE and we'd get a redflip to work with but it didn't happen

Sorry Pops, but that's a poor application of WIFOM if you're town and makes all the sense if you're scum.

[Auro]

I'll towncase CSF when I can.

[Auro]

You realize -any comment- about Masons can be written off as "intended WIFOM" right?

[Auro]

How should I course-correct when you want to lynch one of my confident townreads, Pops?

[Auro]

How is it a good case? There's something about people not including her in teams, and her "minimizing interactions" - I never got that impression through CSF's posting this game. She's been asking questions whenever she comes online.

[Auro]

VOTE: Cat Scratch Fever

Jfc I'm away for a day and my two buddies die

VOTE: Cat scratch fever

Ok I think Auro, Egix, Chemist, TSE and maybe pops are town.

VOTE: Cat scratch fever

I still think Yshtola's theory is probably wrong, but I think this second kill was quite possibly motivated by the win/win of killing Y'shtola or generating a scumflip that distracted the conversation off of CSF.

That interpretation would still give her a remaining kill, and looking at CSF's posting patterns, she is likely to return in 3-4 hours. If we can flashwagon her very, very quickly here, we could lynch her before she can desperation shoot. As soon as she's aware of this level of pressure she's likely to keep more of an eye on the thread.

[line][/line]

VOTE: Cat Scratch Fever

let's build a coalition
of people
who realize
that everyone just posted a gajillion pages of team configuration speccing
and CSF's name mysteriously went unmentioned
despite no one having any reason whatsoever to write her off as town
only Chemist actually included her
because he brute force mentioned every possible scumteam from a town!chemist pov
he is the best fake mason to ever not have to ask hectic for a mason pt link and get sorely disappointed
during my catchup I started a little earlier into stuff I had already read and I realized engaging CSF about Auro go interpreted as a yes/no answer
because she is scum minimizing her interactions
I think this lynch can actually happen because half of these 3 card teams people are making up are scum deliberately excluding her from even touching namedrop and half are people who are not townreading her so much they forget she's in this game and those people can vote with me and then the first group of people will feel uncomfortable and vote with me and we will have something beautiful
VOTE: Cat Scratch Fever

a mislynch greatly favors Auro-scum

This is an empty statement, a mislynch favors anyone-scum.

Ah, but I said 'greatly', and I already (and recently) explained why that is the case.

VOTE: Cat Scratch Fever

@Miss Lynch:

Join me here, or chat it through with me. I think a CSF lynch has the highest chance of hitting scum at this point.

[line][/line]
:thonk:

[Auro]

@Miss Lynch: Join me here, or chat it through with me. I think a CSF lynch has the highest chance of hitting scum at this point

You think she's scum, no?
Name a team where ML is town but CSF is scum.
CSF, Auro, _____

[Auro]

Yeah I think Suji is the correct lynch here.

There's a good chance the team is {Pops, Klick, Chemist}. Notice their CSF push gets more aggressive after I say Suji isn't who I want lynched today.

[Auro]

"Auro is likely scum"
Who are Auro's partners?
Why is he giving Suji new leash?

[Auro]

That first point is pretty good

No, it's not. She's interacting with people when she comes to the thread. Every instance she's been here she's been asking questions. Point me to any question directed to her she avoided.

[Auro]

Why not just include TSE on that list?

Pedit: He listed every possible configuration where he's town IIRC lol - please name them. Please name the CSF/Auro teams.

[Auro]

Vote Suji or ML

TSE, ML is very likely town and Suji is possibly town given the gamestate - tell me why {Klick, Pops, Chemist} is a bad solve? Apart from your townread on Klick.

[Auro]

TSE is the only townread I feel like I want to bet the game on/never revisit, so that's why I didn't list him.

Lol I thought you were meming with that "solve".
I don't expect a solid 3/3 solve but surely you must have some picture of it, right? Like, one of your teams suggests Suji and I are SvS: that really sounds likely to you?

[Auro]

Suji, if you're town I hope you see the agenda here.

[Auro]

What? The extra lynch favors town greatly.

Suji do you really believe Pops believes we could possibly be SvS?

[Auro]

You expect that this is how I'd treat my scumbuddy without daytalk in thread? (Before I started wanting to not lynch her)

[Auro]

Nice excuse to avoid naming teams which are pretty blatantly unlikely?
"Logical thought" is the skill category we're talking about here, not "finding the scumteam preflip"

[Auro]

^By Klick.