open 841: concgratulations to the winners and losers

[Andante]

VOTE: innocentvillager

[Andante]

I don't TR pooky, you're kinda making it sound like you do? what're your thoughts on Pooky?

I have no read on Pooky beyond "collided = > rand town", I will probably remain that way for quite some time because I have a shite record of reading him.

lol alright, I usually just guess half the time, "There's nothing wrong with pushing Pooky, but.." had me thinking you had some sort of genuine read there

[Andante]

just because we play differently and have different styles of reading doesnt make me scum tmi'ing someone

Well I'm referring to the fact mare has basically 0 game related lines, nothing mare said is hard to fake as scum, you're calling it obvtown, and if you can't see why I don't agree.. idk what to say there. I don't tr someone off emotion, I look at reads and what they've done, I know we play differently, a lot differently, I think we already established that. But I don't like the reasoning for mare being obv town here, and with basically no explanation. You didn't seem happy when I asked for specific lines, didn't look like you were actually trying to convince me mare town. thus you quoted her entire ISO... and gave no thoughts about specific things

[Andante]

Datisi, I'm honestly not really vibing with IV's Mare tr, it's not an actual reason and feels like it stems from TMI, what are your thoughts with how IV is calling mare obvtown...

considering my own read is also close to "idk mare is pretty tonally townie" i can't really scumread him for it lol

you got a read on me at this point?

You don't think anything of the lack of explanation there? like if you think someone is obvtown, you should have some kind of conviction there, not just "here's the entire iso" "mare is obvtown" I clearly have a question on why mare is so towny, and why cake is a tr, the answer I got to both those questions don't help me see them as more town. Do you see where I'm going with this?

and umm still don't sr you yet

[Andante]

Do you see where I'm going with this?

and umm still don't sr you yet

kinda? but also i don't think it's scum! indicative for iv so yeah

why do you keep saying "yet"?

So I can just sit here, say all my town leans are obv town? andthat's that?

you're town till I sr you then you're maf, that's how I'm dealing with reading you lol what's wrong with yet?

[Andante]

this conversation is lowkey tanking my read of andante, feels like scum who saw a townie not feeling like backing up their read in detail and is now trying to make everyone see it as scummy

what even? is this datisi scum, IV town, I know you 2 are trying to pocket each other, it's actually hella annoying for reading yall, I don't see what is at all scummy with me asking about an obvtown read on someone who has nothing actually game related. This post does not feel like it comes from town

[Andante]

you're town till I sr you then you're maf, that's how I'm dealing with reading you lol what's wrong with yet?

the fuck lol? why would you deal with me like that? and it implies that you WILL scumread me at some point and you're just waiting for me to start being scummy or something, which is weird

what's wrong with how I make my reads?

[Andante]

you're town till I sr you then you're maf, that's how I'm dealing with reading you lol what's wrong with yet?

the fuck lol? why would you deal with me like that? and it implies that you WILL scumread me at some point and you're just waiting for me to start being scummy or something, which is weird

what's wrong with how I make my reads?

like, weren't you just going at me for not liking how IV made a read?

[Andante]

VOTE: Datisi
this is not town

[Andante]

he's literally trying to push me now... like what even?? I asked you stuff cause you were the only one here. I'm not "trying to make everyone see something my way"

[Andante]

what's wrong with how I make my reads?

do you treat everyone "town until otherwise" or just me? if just me, why?

no, everyone is town till I sr?

[Andante]

I'm done with this, it's getting no where, and this is no fun. so see yall whenever. this entire argument is dumb

[Andante]

I thought you townread both of them IV?

IV is too busy trying to pocket Datisi to actually read him

[Andante]

your stubbornness about iv having to provide Reasons and getting annoyed at me not seeing it as scummy feels like a shark that's smelling blood but the swimmer already got out of water and it's scummy, andante

really? to me it was more like "this is what Andante didn't do when she was scum before"

you have exp with her being scum?

Yeah I endgamed as scum, killed SS, I'm pretty sure he TRed me too Fish in the sea

[Andante]

wait, i thought i was scum pocketing iv?

you are. IV is also trying to pocket you, so I guess accepted your pocket? idk how yalls fancy terms work. I do know the 2 of yall have whatever going on and it makes a read in yall near impossible cause yall only interacted with each other

[Andante]

lmao "Im just gonna vote the person not here"

[Andante]

i have interacted with a bunch of other people the fuck you on about lol

IV hasn't

[Andante]

im past the point of no return on andante

someone could have a guilty cop result on her and i would immediately vote the cop

aww I like IV

[Andante]

Town:
skitter30 catboi SirCakez Something_Smart Faker
flow trap innocentvillager
Datisi

Scum:


Prism has talked, but idk who Prism is in this

Need more content:
Sleepless Assassin
northsidegal
Mare
PookyTheMagicalBear
midwaybear

here's roughly where I'm at, I have 5 I haven't looked into/they haven't given much, overally my reads are trash, THUS I was looking for explanations from people, but I think SS town, Cakez is doing well, skitter has basically been a tr all game, I think my read on dats is slipping, I need to look back later on him, I don't trust myself to have a good read on him right now, in a few hours it should be fine

[Andante]

ahhh ok ty

[Andante]

this is like some bucket list level stupidity if you're actually scum here dude

I just laughed way too hard at this lol
(yes I had to share that info with yall!!)

[Andante]

hey flow!! who is maf?

[Andante]

hey flow!! who is maf?

Smh Anda, you already know who it is

Current POE is like:

Andante 3 times

Midway, SS, Pooky, Mare, Cat, Skitter; Maybe Sleepless



I really like IV's progression on this page, though willing to sheep it as it is a good case and we need some more excitement VOTE: midwaybear

wow stealing my idea... I was gonna sheep IV here...

I also agree, that Andante person is super scummy...

[Andante]

wow stealing my idea... I was gonna sheep IV here...

Is your pfp is a sheepdog?

hahahaha sure XD
before I sheep I need to actually look at midway, I haven't really paid attention/seen anything from them

[Andante]

lol what?
*votes dats
"im ok with midway"

[Andante]

lol what?
*votes dats
"im ok with midway"

"too"

but nothing in that was about dats being scum

[Andante]

but nothing in that was about dats being scum

skitter has been pushing me being scum for like 4 years now, what are you on about

yeah I just realized lol

[Andante]

Like there are some people who are low content and not really being townread by anyone
SS, midway, sleepless, etc

Sleepless is VLA till today, why are you including them here? like, obviously no one TRs someone with no content? but doesn't mean I'm voting them out now?
SS has some lines I like - "not really being TRed by anyone" is a lie there, I've voiced a slight tr earlier

and I still haven't read a single midway post so idk there


I don't like how another person is now "I'm sheeping IV here" like uhhh what?

[Andante]

there is a world of difference between being personally affable and being actively diplomatic

Hm, I can sort of see what you mean. Probably why flow took you out of his poe.

Which begs the question, why is their discussion not TvT?

I found it odd that they were willing to de-escalate their suspicions of each so quickly so I thought that one of them was scum looking to avoid a fight. I did not think that one of them was more suspicious at the time, but if you asked me at the time I would probably say Datisi for backing off first. Now, it seems more nai since it looks like they do similar stuff every gamestart.

Unclear where this factors in

Agreeing with his opening statement didn't factor into my read of him at all really.

Why did you begin to believe Datisi specifically was scum in these, and why did it strengthen?

I thought Datisi was scummy because his play didn't really fit in with my expectation of how a town him would play. I don't think I have played much with Datisi, but I have followed a few games he was in and I got the impression that he was pretty free flowing (speaking his thoughts) as town. ig his opening just didn't match up with that because now that I look back he looks ok.
The scumread strengthened because I'm sort of an ego player, but there really wasn't enough for me to actually push him.

Reading this, I TR midwaybear, I think more than Faker, and I'm pretty sure Faker is town, so midway and faker town I think

[Andante]

Midway, IV town.

Andante probably town for the level of sporadic jumping around? But so quick to jump on anything and push it without a sense of continuity beyond a few posts. Sleepless probably town.

Cakez still scum beyond just tonal things but doing not a lot but being agreeable.

Probably a scum in skitter/Datisi/catboi.

Rest is in null-world right now.

I'm playing Sona in an ARAM. Life is good.

ooh another midway tr, I last recall multiple people going that direction? (idk been a while) but someone else thinking midway town makes me feel good about that read then.

[Andante]

So if you want my GUT READ on a team it's like Andante/Cakez/Cat.

lmao what even?

[Andante]

i just actually like this tell a lot, it's fun to talk about and i'm now the mafia equivalent of an old person who just wants to tell people stories from their past so just let me have this

ooh I didn't know that was a thing lol definitely a good read/cool to learn about, and I was sitting here thinking about it like, "wow... yeah it's almost always exclusively when I'm town do I fight hard about a lim/sr on me"
thanks for the info!! I'm so using this tell for future reads

like here, a bunch of us were voting Pooky, and Pooky's reaction was "oh yes! give me all the votes" which I don't think I've ever seen pooky do lol and I think I've only seen town pooky, sooo pooky maf?

[Andante]

i agree with the logic that SS as scum would be trying more to look towny and it matches my memory of playing against (and losing against) him as scum, but at the same time it feels bad to actually put someone down as town based on that reasoning. so i guess i can just continue putting the problem of reading him off

I think it's funny to look at all the SS reads. SS was like in the POE range, I just go "Yeah SS town. don't ask me questions" like there was 1 or 2 lines I liked, most of it could easily be faked as scum... but to me, SS is a later read, but I've been seein people put SS as a higher tr, like what?? he shouldn't be much above null, I love this post from northsidegal, either partners with him, or it comes from genuine town, that's the only option here I really see

[Andante]

do you normally not vote for people until you have a read on almost everyone? i don't understand why you wouldn't at least park your vote on your current largest suspect

I mean, if I did that, I'm changing my vote at least once every page, usually after I see a VC I go "oh hey, I tr that person now!!" then change, but mehh I either never move it, or I move it too much, I feel like you're trying to push a weird thing "you're not voting? you must be scum..."

[Andante]

i predict that i will probably scumread sleepless assassin after he makes his big post

This feels like a weird thing to say. It's like you're gonna go into reading my post trying to find things wrong with it and the post hasn't even been made yet.

weird thing to say? that's the only weird thing said this game? I mean, I read that and laughed cause I'm fairly sure I'll be SRing you too, interesting how this is the first thing all game you're going "that's weird to say.."

[Andante]

I was gonna post it right before I go to bed. I have aspirations of finishing reading the thread first but realistically I just want to get as far as I can.

you keep talking/interacting, like, if I'm working on my long reads/catchup post for ALL game, I'm focussing on that... the more you put that off by interacting/saying random things in thread, which aren't even really reads, it's just like, "Do you really have town intentions here?" like, we just want to know where your head is at. who do you tr/sr? why? we have had 0 content from you all game, ok that's fine, so it's like, the content we are getting?? yeah...

[Andante]

ok, I'm caught up... that Sleepless post... I have some serious thoughts about it, I'm interested in others thoughts first though, cause that did not scream town at all to me, but since sleepless is caught up, sleepless should be back to normal, and not only communicate in paragraphs like that

[Andante]

I kinda want to vote sleepless here, but everyone else seems set on midway, who I think is town, so maybe I vote a midway voter? idk, I'm sure a tr somewhere is maf, but I'm not voting in my TRs on day 1

also, happy new years yall!!!

[Andante]

do you normally not vote for people until you have a read on almost everyone? i don't understand why you wouldn't at least park your vote on your current largest suspect

I mean, if I did that, I'm changing my vote at least once every page, usually after I see a VC I go "oh hey, I tr that person now!!" then change, but mehh I either never move it, or I move it too much, I feel like you're trying to push a weird thing "you're not voting? you must be scum..."

it's not a weird thing to ask someone why they're not voting their sole top scumread to get insight into their play and her response made sense

I mean, voting someone isn't the only way to get insight.. talking to them/interacting with them also works...

[Andante]

Do u want to read sleepless's wall + his iso and tell me what you think?

I know it's not directed at me but,
I think sleepless's wall is a repeat of a lot of what I said,which is why I don't like it, sure it could've been genuine thoughts, but a lot of it was like exact things I was saying so ehhh anyone going "I'll read later" then when they do read, there's nothing original, and it's all repeating stuff already said, makes you really question if it came from town

[Andante]

i'm just hoping that you'll have some content before eod

feels like a d2 thing to talk about, not here? like if you tell people "I hope you have content by eod" if they're scum, they become aware...

[Andante]

oh I'm down!!
VOTE: Sleepless

[Andante]

mehh if I had SS as null/sr I'd probably just start asking him stuff, instead of "I hope you give content"
like, Sleepless gave content, was super focused on that, cause we basically pressured, but what that content actually was? yeah no thanks

[Andante]

lol I only showed up to take my vote off dats (so no one got any ideas and pushed a wagon that way) but I'm more than happy with a sleepless vote here, that's probably my top SR at the moment, just something about hearing someone repeat stuff you said, but then give no mention of you like "I agree with Andante was saying here" so if you're trying to pass the thoughts off as your own?? but you were reading/catching up.... mmmk feels like maf trying to pass off "towny stuff"

ok see yall tomorrow new years eve/new years has taken too much out of me lol need sleep!

[Andante]

i think that sleepless has a point in that this game is moving faster than the last game

I mean, don't all games start faster than they end? like, you can't expect us to sit here and do nothing day 1, THEN do stuff d2... idk, I don't like talking about activity levels, like, it does absolutely nothing for this game

[Andante]

Why I scum read Innocentvillager

- See above for why I placed my vote.

-His early talk is about himself. Why he picked his number and not what anyone else might have been thinking. The focus is just explaining himself where the natural town thought is "I wonder what scum did". There's a little bit of asking about people's meta picks but nothing to suggest he's attempting to read people's alignment based on it.

He seems reactionary OMGUSy. Datisi voted Innocentvillager and Innocentvillager wanted a fight but the second Datisi backs off its "maybe you're town". Then midway makes a decent point about that interaction coming off weird and Innocentvillager responds by calling midway "scumbear".

The timing of the Midway vote on page 30 felt weird. He mentions being the largest wagon and then switches from a vanity vote to a mini wagon. I know he already expressed a scum read on midway but it still seemed like weird timing

Reading this felt super off to me, this was just repeating the pages we spent discussing IV scum, with no mention of agreeing with anyone there, like, these are not original thoughts. and IV was the main person I was going after, so then to see Sleepless, only discuss a SR on IV... like... there wasn't much catching up... and I think with about 95% certainty, the only point of that post was "to look towny" not to actually catch up/ give thoughts

[Andante]

if skitter is maf, it is with sleepless. that is one thing I'm confident in

[Andante]

this list just confirmed my suspicions there

[Andante]

catboi is town

[Andante]

I don't see 1903 coming from maf, like, something about the way I read it, if someone who SRs you wants to talk with me about why you're maf, I'd be happy to discuss why I think you're town, but yeah. I'm pretty sure you're town. Should I be SRing you?

[Andante]

SA's wall seems very town. I can get more into that if people think it would help.

you should, I SRed the wall. Wall just summarized what I said, thus I don't think it's town, so I'd love to know what you found towny about it

[Andante]

i don't see it

you see maf writing 1903? and like the amount of effort catboi is giving? like I'm pretty sure he's not maf

[Andante]

if that means you want to catch up on all 77 pages before you describe what you like about the wall, i'd kinda just rather you talk about why you like the wall >.>

pshhh let him catch up!!! the content from catching up is gonna be better than discussing 1 wall post...
I'm already thinking you're maf with sleepless....

[Andante]

I don't see 1903 coming from maf, like, something about the way I read it, if someone who SRs you wants to talk with me about why you're maf, I'd be happy to discuss why I think you're town, but yeah. I'm pretty sure you're town. Should I be SRing you?

that's literally just a quotewall reply though

I've been okay with you being seemingly universal townread I just think this is not a great way to read me or anything

so you're maf?

[Andante]

how are you possibly thinking i'm scum with sleepless, i'm actively pushing him >.>

and i was just thinking he wanted to catch up on the whole game first, we'd probably be waiting a while which seems silly since he's said he's actually read the wall, he can just say what he thinks about it

I've been thinking it for a while lol, I guess you just ignored the first time I said I SRed the 2 of you

Why would SS be catching up on the whole game? he's been here...

[Andante]

i don't see it

you see maf writing 1903? and like the amount of effort catboi is giving? like I'm pretty sure he's not maf

1. posts like that aren't a significant amount of effort, as it is I feel like I'm running on fumes because I've overextended myself

2. you're going to get about half the people in the game telling you that effort is a nulltell for me

Yes, I know you've said you've overextended yourself or whatever, you'r busy, ok, I get it, and rather than just sit there only talking about how far behing you are/whatnot, you're saying stuff like "I still think midwaybear's posts like 1542, 1550 are fine and don't get where the scumreads are coming from" which is like opposite from everyone it feels like, I already voiced that I don't understand midway SRs, so seeing you here like "yoo why is there a SR on this person?" feels like it genuinely comes from town. Not sure why I'm not allowed to tr you. You want me to sr you. Cake wants Dats to sr him.. are we playing reverse maf or something?

[Andante]

if skitter is maf, it is with sleepless. that is one thing I'm confident in

this list just confirmed my suspicions there

excuse me what, how could SA's reads affect the probability of skitter-scum/SA-town? That doesn't make sense.

guess I'm explaining that thought process tonight

[Andante]

@andante i mean i agree, i'm just saying i *can* see a universe where town-him got stuck in catch-up mode and never managed to get out of it
all in all i do still scumread him tho

pedit >.>

^So here it was like "I do still scumread him" like, there hasn't been much of a push from skitter, skitter was not voting sleepless, so in my head I'm like "you SR someone, but are neither voting them, nor doing anything about it? feels like something you'd say about a partner"

pedit >.>

Hey that's not Beetlejuice. There have only been a few posts since I woke up

Their interactions read as scum theater/one partner talking to another, I haven't seen 1 interaction between them I liked

Skitter - Something feels different this game but can't figure out what. Maybe its just that she's pressuring me this time.

And this like backs up my thoughts on "one partner talking to another" like, up until this stuff I've been like "yeah skitter town!!!" but skitter's interactions with/around Sleepless feel so awkward. awkward enough to make me reconsider my skitter TR, I was gonna look into why people were SRing skitter, but I was not a fan of this stuff. For Sleepless's "Read" on skitter to be "idk" after that wall post? yeah.. no. that's a maf read on a partner

[Andante]

yes, I saw your vote went on after all that, I'm not even going your way today cause you're top of draft, but I do genuinely believe sleepless to be maf here, and that's all I care about, cause it's not like I live to tomorrow anyways, just giving the occasional thought I have, and trying to just stay out of people's way

[Andante]

it's more of a summary of his thoughts on topics he deemed important

uhhh the only main thoughts there summarized are the IV thoughts, and it's repeating the few pages where we were like "Iv is not town cause of A,B,C" nothing in that wall felt like a genuine original thought. You think it makes Sleepless town? like, it's SO MUCH EASIER to make a post like that as maf than to interact with people in real time

[Andante]

The Sleepless in Open 836 looks so much townier than the sleepless here... just saying

[Andante]

I'm not going to ding SA for not having interacted with people in real-time, he's clearly busy.

sure, but as long as his 1 true piece of content is summarizing what I said? I'm SRing him

[Andante]

not all posts people make are actual content...

[Andante]

Q&A time with Andante about my reads is now over! See yall next time I'm around, I still SR SA, I'm not sure why people are actually townreading that wall... when the entire IV paragraph is just putting everything I said together in 1 post... I legit still SR SA, and I think that's where my vote is gonna stay, see yall tomorrow

[Andante]

i know deadline is soon, i’ll at least make an effort to skim stuff tomorrow and probably change my vote
felt terrible today, just been sleeping most of the day, about to sleep some more ._.
I trust that yall can carry us though See yall before eod!!

[Andante]

y u confident on midway town again? quoting past stuff fine

i remember last time we talked about him you were kinda reconsidering/maybe nullish on him

I've also said midway town a bunch, you're convinced midway maf?

[Andante]

Here's probably where I'm at right now

Town: SS, catboi, Faker, datisi
Probably town, but I have some doubts that I'm not looking into right now: skitter, cakez, midway, northsidegal
Probably mafia: IV, flow, Pooky, Mare (with IV but not with flow)
Definitely maf: Sleepless

[Andante]

Here's probably where I'm at right now

Town: SS, catboi, Faker, datisi
Probably town, but I have some doubts that I'm not looking into right now: skitter, cakez, midway, northsidegal
Probably mafia: IV, flow, Pooky, Mare (with IV but not with flow)
Definitely maf: Sleepless

no one probably reads bottom of page so I'm quoting it

[Andante]

Town: datisi

when and how did this happen lol

few days ago or something like that

[Andante]

ok, that's when, what's the how

it's a secret

[Andante]

I'm thinking this is genuinely flow maf cause of how little I've seen flow here after the first 24 hours

[Andante]

i am genuinely starting to think catboi is scum, not just my meme push I always do on them because of past games

nah cat is town

[Andante]

ok, that's when, what's the how

it's a secret

I'm taking my secrets to the grave!!!

[Andante]

I love this game, it's gonna be even funnier when yall see I'm actually VT

[Andante]

I'd rather vote flow over pooky here

[Andante]

i am caught up now and if Pooky is possible he has to go, it's only going to get harder to elim him
flow can be elimmed whenever

hmmmm VOTE: Cakez

[Andante]

UNVOTE:

idk what vc is...

[Andante]

that's making me nervous

[Andante]

Do you genuinely think up until any point that there was a wagon on Cakez that would get him limmed.

I haven't read anything recent, so who knows

[Andante]

ok cool

do we just wanna vote flow here?

[Andante]

VOTE: flow

[Andante]

so we refuse to vote sleepless, speedwagon cakez, say we'll wagon flow, then go back to sleepless...

[Andante]

VOTE: sleepless

[Andante]

flow sleepless or cakez pick one people

why would cakez be a vote here? cakez is not on the flow/sleepless level...

[Andante]

I think IV is maf partners with sleepless

[Andante]

what has this game become...

[Andante]

Something_Smart, why are you voting faker here? we have to reach an agreement on who we're voting, and I guarantee you, we're not all agreeing to flip Faker here, I tr him anyways... so are you just trying to waste your vote?

[Andante]

ahhh rip I missed the initial stuff :/ just pull the game up like "uhhh faker vote gets us no where.."

[Andante]

lol in a newbie game, I was doc, they started voting me, I was like "yo I'm doc..." and they went "no real doc claims here!! byeeee" I was doc, it was funny XD

[Andante]

Something_Smart, why are you voting faker here? we have to reach an agreement on who we're voting, and I guarantee you, we're not all agreeing to flip Faker here, I tr him anyways... so are you just trying to waste your vote?

I am an expert at wasting my vote.

I think there is potential scum motivation in stirring up shit here, though of course I'm not pretending that Faker is a viable execution for today.

scum stirring stuff up, cause they don't want sleepless wagoned? Like half the reason I still SR IV is cause it feels like IV is doing everything in their power to ensure sleepless doesn't get voted out here

[Andante]

thus IV was pushing midway, now flow... never sleepless

[Andante]

sigh

we're out here grinding asleep assassin vs ghost trap

while midway is doing nothing but beetlejuicing, responding to a couple things, gives his new thought of the day and dipping, still with no vote anywhere or desire to help town with deadline

honestly, you sound really opposed to a sleepless vote, why?

[Andante]

like you'll casually throw out sleepless's name as scum, but you only push flow/midway

[Andante]

exactly, you make no effort to convince us why you tr sleepless, but you've made it clear you prefer the other 2? like, you're just like "yeah, I'd go along with sleepless" and now it's "Where have I called sleepless scum" like ok, what makes sleepless town. sleepless always shows up when we talk about him, and cares more about our read on him than his read for who scum is

[Andante]

scum stirring stuff up, cause they don't want sleepless wagoned?

Faker is defending flow, actually. I think it's reasonably likely that both wagons are T/T, in which case scum are just trying to increase divisiveness and cause arguments.

I'm not 100% sure flow is maf, like inactivity isn't really how I know flow is maf, it's more solving related/talking. but his computer broke and he's on phone, so idk how much that influences things. I don't think "defending" flow is unreasonable here

[Andante]

Flow and Sleepless feel like the functionally same elim so I prefer Sleepless who has said stuff recently that can be read posthumously and be somewhat meaningfully.

the 2 are in no way the same.... sleepless is actually scummy, flow just isn't talking

[Andante]

Andante are you an alt?

nope

[Andante]

don't forget pooky wasn't a tr... lol

[Andante]

I'm still convinced IV is sleepless's partner

[Andante]

I mean, if the numbers are on IV, I'd 100% vote IV here, but everyone here says IV is town.. so whatever, Sleepless is still maf

[Andante]

Could the team really be Skitter/Sleepless/IV? that simple??

[Andante]

I'm not gonna vote cakez here I will vote Sleepless and only Sleepless

[Andante]

there is too much resistance to a sleepless vote here for sleepless to be town

[Andante]

there is too much resistance to a sleepless vote here for sleepless to be town

I don't think this is a great heuristic. For all we know all 3 scum, none of whom are in danger, are vying for town credit with a Sleepless town flip.

I mean, it's not the sole reason I SR sleepless, but everyone is all "let's wagon cat/cake now!!" like, what's wrong with Sleepless wagon?

[Andante]

Do you not know who to vote?
Are you wanting to vote?
If you answered yes to either of the above, I have a solution for you!
Just vote Sleepless!
in 3 easy steps, you could be voting Sleepless today!
Step 1: Open Game
Step 2: Vote Sleepless
Step 3: Submit your vote
and sit back as Sleepless gets voted out! It can be done without leaving the comfort of your own home! Try it today!

[Andante]

I refuse to vote out cake here. Sleepless is mafia

[Andante]

What is wrong with a sleepless wagon?

[Andante]

Sleepless is trying right now and I don't see any scum motivation in shooting down alternate wagon suggestions; meanwhile flow has done jack shit so I think the choice for me is pretty clear

the scum motivation in being against people currently on your counterwagon exiting your counterwagon to split votes and leave you as the largest wagon seems clear.

i think that it may be a bit of a stretch (or at least i would need some kind of evidence) to say that flow trap's complete absence is indicative one way or the other.

ummm I'm not seeing what you're seeing re;SA wagon

so let me be clear – the scum motivation in shooting down alternative wagon suggestions is that the people that would be switching to those alternative wagons are already voting flow (sleepless' counterwagon), and so them switching would be splitting the vote between that counterwagon and flow, leaving sleepless as the top wagon. i'm not saying that sleepless is scum

because

of this (i think that it's reasonable regardless of alignment), but i don't think that it's towny like you think that it is.

This makes like 0 sense? Sleepless is maf, and partners are refusing to vote there, instead partners are like "ayyy im voting here" which is why none of you will vote sleepless

[Andante]

ohhkay I think I get what you're saying

that made sense to you?

[Andante]

sleepless is maf and yall are letting him get away...

[Andante]

"oh hey sleepless is e-1, LETS GET FLOW!!" yalls logic.... sleepless flips maf

[Andante]

and if sleepless flips town.. hahaha maf is gonna kill me so it's ok, if sleepless town, ignore everything I've said. sleepless maf? IV and skitter are partners

[Andante]

IV is getting tunneled tomorrow if this flips maf like I think it does

[Andante]

day was hammered right?

[Andante]

my mind is blown. uhhh since IV flipped town, I'm kinda thinking just sheep his read on midway, but I agree that some people need more attention here

[Andante]

so uhhh I fully expected to die, and my reads are very wrong, I was thinking most maf probably stayed off the Sleepless wagon. leaving maf in
Datisi, SirCakez, Something_Smart, flow trap, (IV was here too)

but there is no freaking way any combo of 3 of those 4 names is maf. IV was there, but now dead, So was flow maf? making most maf go to the Sleepless wagon?

meaning maf in
northsidegal, Menalque(Pooky), catboi, midwaybear, Mare, skitter30, (Faker was here too)

Like obviously I know maf probably would bus for towncred where possible, idk, I need to let yall do whatever and stay out of the way this time, cause after the sleepless flip I was pretty certain maf was in Dats/SS/Cakez/flow/IV but now I'm not too sure

[Andante]

I should've actually put more thought into this last night lol I feel like an idiot sitting here looking at the 2 options. If I considered for 2 seconds, town!IV. "maf in dats/cake/ss/flow" or.. "maf in nsg/mena/catboi/midway/mare/skitter" bruh.. this 2nd list just sounds more likely to have maf. I did not kill IV, believe it or not. so maf probably killed IV cause of his reads. he was deadset on midway. while I was tunneling a town, so that just tells me I was probably off on skitter too, so 3 maf most likely in nsg/mena/catboi/midway, I need to relook at my catboi tr, but I'm definitely thinking just yeet midway here. or flow, actually. cause if flow does flip maf, the wagons say a lot. flow/midway here is what I'm thinking. even though I don't really buy that everyoe genuinely SRed flow's innactivity... ughhh I have to actually go read stuff.

[Andante]

There was major resistance to the sleepless wagon, it was almost like people were refusing to join it, like, they kept wanting flow and midway over sleepless, so I think there's something there, also 2 of my SRs were town so woooo

[Andante]

what's the end goal of this conversation?

[Andante]

lol I just realized, the 2 with the highest post count died, it's probably nothing with their reads for why they died then, and more maf couldn't keep up. that's kinda funny

[Andante]

VOTE: Andante

?

cause I was supposed to die last night would be my guess

[Andante]

And you weren't acting like someone with a healthy fear of death, yesterday or today.

why would I fear death? I knew I was off the table yesterday, today, I don't want to lead town to yeet another town out

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=88352
that game, I led town basivally in yeeting 2 towns out, and defended a maf definitely feeling like I'm on the same track here

[Andante]

It would also be kind of a terrible double scum shot though? Why wouldn't they go for anybody high on the list?

Why would town shoot IV or Faker? IV was a universal TR, no one liked my SR there, I guess town would hero shoot Faker? Unless they found a PGO, it's from maf

[Andante]

Why wouldn't they go for anybody high on the list?

This feels like maf setting it up... you know full well why I didn't die. I basically strongarmed the Sleepless lim, why kill me over IV who was likely on to something

[Andante]

just cause I am a PR, doesn't mean I picked an ideal one, or I'm using it correctly, maf aint scared of me

[Andante]

why would I fear death?

why would the top draft spot be afraid of getting NK'd? Gee, I don't know...

afraid of NK? I figured I was going to die, thus I didn't put a whole lot of thought into what I did last night what are you talking about with not scared of nk?

[Andante]

why is this turning into tunneling me?? I just wanna sit back and see what yall do, and if someone claims something that disagrees with info I may have, then I'll out stuff, but I'm seriously not a fan of Alyssa interrogating me, then SS all "Why didn't you die?" like, you're maf, just tell me why I didn't die then, cause quite honestly, idk why I'm alive, and idk how 2 PRs are dead

[Andante]

the more andante speaks, the more she is reminding me of the way she acted in the dance game

lol how is this even remotely similar? I didn't out a single read there

[Andante]

What I didn't like was that you seemed to skip that step and just went right to "double scum kill on actives = scum can't keep up".

uh that's not my main line of thinking? It was just a "hey lol look at this!! they were the top posters, now they're dead" I'm fully away IV was universal TR, and Faker was fairly TRed, I can see a town shooting Faker, trying to be the hero

[Andante]

lol getting TRed and SRed over the exact same game. that's fun

[Andante]

the more andante speaks, the more she is reminding me of the way she acted in the dance game

lol how is this even remotely similar? I didn't out a single read there

you're getting extremely defensive over normal mafia conversations, your entrance to this day basically said a whole lot of nothing, and you completely ignored my 3242.

I LITERALLY DIDN'T IGNORE YOU. I LAID OUT ALL MY THOUGHTS, but the process there and everything. This is getting annoying, seriously, yall are all wasting time tunneling me

[Andante]

yall are all wasting time tunneling me

Oh shit Andante softed PR, better back off

lmaooooo I softed? oh no!! maf might learn my true identity...

[Andante]

Can we just make Andante claim

lmao cause that's a towny idea

[Andante]

oh I so SR datisi now after that whole exchange

[Andante]

I don't think midway is maf, and that is really wrecking my thoughts going into today. so what about a Datisi/Pooky/flow team... Like, if any maf in the world would pick the same number, it'd be pooky and dats... I don't think this is unreasonable

[Andante]

Datisi seems more interested in people's reads on him than actively finding maf, that's one thing I've really noticed here, probably means he's maf, but not a path I'm going down right now.
Datisi, who is maf?

[Andante]

unless I'm asked

in depth reads on everyone here please

jk

[Andante]

Datisi seems more interested in people's reads on him than actively finding maf

why do you assume that doing the former means i'm not doing the latter?

like, everytime I'm here it's "explain your read on me!" "What have you gained from voting me" stuff that if you're town, really isn't helping much I don't think. like i understand the side of "well if I'm being called town for this reason, they probably have tmi" but overall, I fail to see how you're actively trying to find maf, like, you don't have strong reads on anyone, and so far this game, you haven't even tunneled anyone for some bad reasoning of voting you, so like, it really feels like you're not trying to find maf

[Andante]

again, this is why andate is scummy here. posturing around a scumread on me, while doing absolutely nothing to sort me, or to acknowledge my questions, and making up a push on me that clearly doesn't hold water.

no, seriously, can anyone actually say what her progression on my slot has been this game? because i sure can't.

So I'd respond to this but idk what you want me to say? reading you is not my main focus early game, if it was, I'd quite honestly be wasting my time, cause I'm pretty sure you're one of those people who is much easier to read late game, your entire game has basically revolved around my read on you. what do you truly want from me? I'm making an effort, said I'd step back, been trying to step back, I was wrong on Sleepless and IV, you KNOW I'm a pr, so it feels real odd that I've been your main focus all game, and instead of discussing actual reads with each other, you want me to come up with thoughts on you, which isn't how I really work, if I've outed stuff, there's my thoughts. I try to focus where I think needs my focus. I'm not gonna sit here and talk about why I TR a universal TR, I put effort/attention where it's needed.

I am a pr who still has use this game, so if you want to keep tunneling me, so be it, but I think it's a genuine waste of time to keep going at me - if you're town.
I'm not fighting people, so if you want to vote me out, have at it. but I'm playing this my way, and keeping it fun

[Andante]

your entire game has basically revolved around my read on you

lol what? is this another game you're scum talking out of your ass? because this is complete bullshit.

for the record, the only things about me that i've asked of you were things that you openly said yourself. at one point you said i was becoming townie after you were suspecting me early game. why? oh no it's a secret. then you suddenly jumped in saying i was scummy. why? you ignore me. like don't play it as if i'm asking you to write a 14 page annotated case on me, i am asking you to elaborate on the things you've already said.

this is how i sort people. especially as i've noticed that scum you has no clue on how to elaborate on your read on me; you continuously evaded me when i asked you about it in dance game. why would i let it go now? i don't care that you're a power role, that doesn't make you town.

- uhhh what? every interaction you've had with me here has been you yelling at me for not explaining reads on you? and it has felt like too many times, at least I'm pretty sure that's been the case here

- yeah, the elaboration stuff, I don't elaborate. that's how I work. and it's never enough for you here. I'll read one post like "yeah comes from town" so if I say "X is becoming townie" that's kinda all there is to that case, but you always seem to want more. yeah sure I could case people, but that takes too much time, and I've been wrong on cases before. like I'm not trying to ignore you, but idk how to explain this, I'm really not wanting to sit here and fight you on this. I'm town, and if you're town too, can we like find scum instead of this "omg you refuse to explain your read on me!!" cause this stuff isn't fun and just makes me want to go dissapear till tomorrow or whatever

- dance game was different. I wanted to replace out of that early on, I couldn't keep up, too busy IRL, but my partners were fun couldn't leave them. I didn't read like any of that game. and I've read almost all of this game, when people start fighting I check out, don't care to get involved there, this is just a game, and I'm trying. I literally gave you my exact thoughts at daystart here, but due to people going at it, half the table has like checked out and isn't even trying right now, and I don't blame them. however, maf sitting back letting us do whatever? yeah. I'm alive cause I'm trash at reading people, I could be some crazy good pr, but maf would leave me alive cause I'm just that bad.

[Andante]

also, due to barely sleeping last night and having a stressful test today, i will be going ti bed much earlier than planned. however, i will be around more tomorrow because we're moved online for the week, again.

good luck on the test!!!

[Andante]

VOTE: cakez

why is cakez maf?

[Andante]

re 3387:

- saying that the entirety of my play in this game has been focused only on you is blatantly false.

- and what was the reason you couldn't say that when i asked, instead of going "hehe it's a secret" or just disappearing? like, this is the similar kinda defensive backtrack about your reads that i feel like i've seen before somewhere. like, if you actually thought "ok you're scummy because post x, y, z" why didn't you say it?

- i read your start of day thoughts. they were "maf could be in group 1 or group 2" that essentially said nothing about who is mafia. and saying that you've actually read this game, but still haven't given even a hint of explanation about your progression on me... how is that supposed to make me feel better about your alignment, exactly?

- uhhh no hasn't only been on me, I saw you asking someone about what info their vote on you was giving them, then I was like "only dats stuff I can even recall is why did you go from tr to sr to tr? what do you read me as now?" then it got me thinking, but like I'm not even voting you so like, it was just a thought?

- you think I intentionally disappear? I'm still on winter break, hanging with my family before I leave them again for a year, it's not like me not being here is scummy, when I return I say stuff if I missed important stuff. when I'm here I give you plenty of content.

- why am I expected to be more active than I want to be? Like, I don't have it in my head my exact progression on everyone here, I'd have to go read my own ISO and fgure stuff out, and half the time my ISO is full of garbage.


look, I'm not trying to be the most active person here, I don't want to lead town, someone else can. I've failed town way more times them helped lately. and when my top 2 SRs flip town, it's a sign I need to back off cause I'm clearly wrong somewhere. If people just wanted to leave me alone, I'd probably give detailed thoughts on stuff, but if people just wanna 1v1 like this and talk in circles, this is where all my time will go

[Andante]

i don't even think andante is scum atm i am just heavily annoyed at everything she's been posting today lol

WOOOOOO 1v1 over!! best day ever!! Happy to have annoyed you my friend!

[Andante]

is it bad I kinda TRed flow, but I SR Alyssa? Alyssa seems to be leaning too much into the "you all have no reason to SR flow!! yet you sr them!!" and it's like, ehhh

[Andante]

Alyssa was a strong town in that holiday dance party, and here she just pushed me, I forget why, and talked a lot about how no one actually SRs flow... flow as town/scum... is honestly just tricky to read, I don't sr the replacement part, but I could definitely see flow being scum based on the drop in activity, like flow's content I TRed is from the very beginning, basically wher eI asked them for stuff

[Andante]

catboi, cakez, nsg, alyssa i explicitly dont think are town
I'm kinda going back and forth on ss, midway but leaning on town

Everyone else i feel like i have a reason to townread

nsg hasn't even been here yet for d2, so do you feel confident enough in a sr on nsg from day 1?

[Andante]

also on the neighborizor thing, Mare can be a maf neighborizor... it's not specific to town...

[Andante]

I've been looking at possible roles left... is there any world in which claiming is a good idea? I'm considering claiming cause it might genuinely beneficial, but I'm not saying others should, if vig is town and shot, you better be claiming though


night 3 vigilante or vengeful
1-shot vigilante or 2-shot PGO (active) - either vig was used or PGO was active
ascetic cop or bulletproof
1-shot watcher - dead
lime doctor or roleblocker
universal backup-dead
neighborizer-mare
jailkeeper or tracker

[Andante]

ahhhhh I probably should've said nothing tbh, but I have a very good reason in my mind, but I just thought about how my reasoning would be bad

[Andante]

I mean, I literally don't want anyone else to claim, 0 benefit lol but I kinda want to/I think it's either beneficial or my death sentence

[Andante]

I just want doc to save me

[Andante]

I mean, I realize as soon as I was like "I think I should claim" I was claiming, so now it's like, ehhhhh I wasn't roleblocked last night, so that's a good sign!!

[Andante]

and I realized I'm like the only actual info getting role left lol but ummm that means I'd have to actually have decent reads lol

[Andante]

The funny part is I think it's very likely I was between maf and IV last night. Good thing I picked IV XD

[Andante]

is it bad I kinda TRed flow, but I SR Alyssa? Alyssa seems to be leaning too much into the "you all have no reason to SR flow!! yet you sr them!!" and it's like, ehhh

what

I guess I'll clarify this

my point is that the wagon was not really about scumreading my predecessor nearly at all

yet it gets replaced and people are posturing like they want to wagon me anyways for reasons I either can't see or can't understand while not even acknowledging my existence

do you see how that chain of events looks a bit strange

You have more posts like this than actual "these are my reads"

[Andante]

You targeted iv last night?

yeah. fun fact. universal backups don't visit

[Andante]

Today I really want to hear from nsg tbh

[Andante]

and I realized I'm like the only actual info getting role left lol but ummm that means I'd have to actually have decent reads lol

What are you talking about, cop exists...?

fake cops, actual cop would be the universal backup that's dead?

[Andante]

maybe they're important.. idk!! look, I was just like "ok, maybe doc isn't gonna want to save me cause in no way have I given a hint to what I am. so yolo

[Andante]

yall i don't even know, lets move on and just like get a maf here please

[Andante]

ayyy at least I picked the right role here better than keeping people in jail!

[Andante]

ayyy at least I picked the right role here better than keeping people in jail!

Well, JK is also more picked by town, but less so. In a vacuum it is probably the stronger role, but in PYP they're pretty close.

ahh, well uhhh maybe it's good I picked it so maf doesn't have this, but I am in no way a good tracker lol sooo we'll see what happens next

SS, who are 3 names you're SRing here/considering voting

[Andante]

No idea why andante claimed they were already obvious town

there's never a reason for anything I do lol.

question goes to you too. 3 names you SR/are ok voting here

[Andante]

not a bad answer, I think cakez town, I've also been debating Mena/Alyssa here, so I might go look at mena

[Andante]

you were defending flow trap until he got wagoned so associatives are there if he flips scum.

This makes no sense to me

Why does scum!IV switch from defending at the worst possible time to a bad bus when he’s already set up to play defensively

Like this sounds more like IV!town, plus bussing is p much suicidal in PyP from my relatively recent memory

A lot of people won't bus until their buddy is already in trouble.

Mmmmm, idk

Feel like people will try to get hammer cred or hardbus normally not just moderately change opinion once someone’s getting heat

Anyway, IV is an easy read, if he looks incredibly limbait he’s prob town, if he reads like a v towny boi then he’s scum

ooh do these mena lines stem from knowing IV was town?

[Andante]

mwb is like my truest null here, so he gets middle of the pack because I feel p much nothing from anything I've read of his so far

makes midway a likely partner, which lots of people SRed midway yesterday, so I could see them both being maf

[Andante]

I think we vote Mena here, cause that also gives us the info with people voting Pooky day 1 cause that was definitely a thing, Mena isn't doing too much here, and what has been done? some sleepless/IV talk which really doesn't look towny

VOTE: Mena

[Andante]

mwb is like my truest null here, so he gets middle of the pack because I feel p much nothing from anything I've read of his so far

makes midway a likely partner, which lots of people SRed midway yesterday, so I could see them both being maf

if i remember my scum!mena meta right, it's "hard scumread or hard townread your partners, never ever put them in null where people look" so probably not

but does that same meta hold for replacing in? most people are different when they replace in vs play the whole time

[Andante]

mwb is like my truest null here, so he gets middle of the pack because I feel p much nothing from anything I've read of his so far

makes midway a likely partner, which lots of people SRed midway yesterday, so I could see them both being maf

if i remember my scum!mena meta right, it's "hard scumread or hard townread your partners, never ever put them in null where people look" so probably not

cause I'm kinda thinking mena/midway/SS and mena had SS very high on their reads list, and with everyone else SRing midway, it'd stand out too much to hard tr midway?

[Andante]

Like, dats, I could be wrong on midway, but like if you said was true, SS + Mena? I think yes...

I like how quick Cakez was to answer me, and it was a good answer, I feel like scum!cakez would've put more words, not just "here's the names" SS ignored me...
Mena/Pooky + SS + 3rd.... maybe?

thoughts might be something of an ask but I can give impressions if that works

I didn't like cakez' very end of day push toward me, but I especially didn't like that his pretty gung-ho "kill mena" seemed to be entirely forgotten today, also that he hasn't actually addressed me or spoken to me since I repped in, and that insofar as his read on me isn't purely based on pooky it seems to be from a v lazy "mena not here therefore mena scum" outdated meta read

other than that I feel pretty floaty?

reads list is something like, uh:

andante, S_S
skitter?
datisi?
mwb
mare?
alyssa
catboi
cakez

actually, now that I see that list S_S should probably be between skitt and andante given that he has also snowed me on various occasions

[Andante]

SS, who are 3 names you're SRing here/considering voting

Andante skitter Cakez I guess? I hate these kinds of questions though and they don't often lead anywhere in my experience.

knowing im tracker you still want to vote me?

[Andante]

Like, dats I might be wrong on 3rd, but I'm heavily leaning Mena/SS here, I'm kinda hoping someone else sees what I do here and I'm not crazy for thinking this

[Andante]

why are you attempting to make a 3/3 solve right after being proven wrong on two of your strongest scumreads...

cause it's a lot easier than "HEY X IS MAF!" it's called partner interactions...

[Andante]

also: andante has claimed, now what do you wanna do with her slot? @s_s

Kill it, if that wasn't evident.

dang... that's rough.

[Andante]

I could track maf though!!!

[Andante]

why are you attempting to make a 3/3 solve right after being proven wrong on two of your strongest scumreads...

cause it's a lot easier than "HEY X IS MAF!" it's called partner interactions...

i think you got something horribly wrong about the game of mafia if you're claiming that pre-flip scum/scum interactions are easier to read than singular scumreads

It's genuinely how I play... House/frogs... that game? yeah. same concept... "A and B aren't together" "A and C... nope"

[Andante]

lol this is actually really funny I have my own scum category!!! WOOOOOOOOO

[Andante]

okay, can you then make a super simple list of "people i think are town, scum, neither"

Sure.
Town - midway, Mare, nsg, Alyssa
Scum - Andante
Neither - skitter, Cakez, catboi, Menalque, Datisi

ok, my scum partner, can we vote them out here? who are they?

[Andante]

like, SS is either definitely maf, or like, being too funny to be maf, it's just figuring out which one, cause yeah

[Andante]

okay, *why*

Top draft is decently correlated with being scum, her play has done nothing to shake me off of that, scum presumably made two kills and neither was aimed at the top 3 (which I believe is fairly rare? might be worth checking the stats there), she's been playing up how she is a known PR and how much that matters and then she claims under basically zero pressure with zero info, her reaction to the double kill was pretty awkward and may have betrayed knowledge that it was a scum vig, and now she's shading me off of Mena associatives rather than push me directly which may be to avoid OMGUS accusations.

what's wrong with me claiming? I've done it before too "I think I have info... here's my role" only this time I have no info, and it's pretty likely if midway is maf, they picked a role that was already claimed, knowing skitter/I had it, so didn't even try to kill there

[Andante]

the heck? I'm tracker. stop voting me

[Andante]

Eh. I don't know actually

don't know that you don't wanna vote me here?
I don't see the benefit of voting me here

[Andante]

what use does maf tracker even have?? like I'm telling yall my actual reports.. why not let me get another?

[Andante]

I should've picked vig

[Andante]

oh yeah!!! if I was maf, why wouldn't I pick vig or PGO? Like, pick PGO, if thee's doc, doc saves me and dies. Tracker makes 0 sense as first draft pick as maf

[Andante]

No, you should have picked like ascetic cop, which i think you forgot exists >.>

I don't even know what that is lol

[Andante]

what use does maf tracker even have??

well, since you tracked the dead guy, we don't know that you're really a tracker. And maf jailkeeper has a lot of use.

I didn't know I was tracking the dead guy

[Andante]

actually, now that i say it, i think it's kinda weird skitt is coming to me to tell me andante is town in reaction to my lazy sheep vote, while ignoring s_s making a case on her

not necessarily scummy but definitely weird

skitter is town

[Andante]

I'm like 99% sure she is

[Andante]

wait, ascetic just can't be targeted? I don't even see how that's useful? so if I picked it, doc couldn't save me, but maf could kill?

[Andante]

For now i dont want this to become a wagon

who do you want me to vote

Catboi nsg alyssa or cakez
Really dont want andante

I think cakez is town tbh, I liked how he gave the names he'd vote when I asked, like idk felt towny to me

[Andante]

I'm like 99% sure she is

Why so confident?

I mean, are you confident she's maf?

[Andante]

I think cakez is town tbh, I liked how he gave the names he'd vote when I asked, like idk felt towny to me

You don't think scum-Cakez would keep track of who he wants to vote?

he answered a lot quicker than you, and you were like "haha I wanna vote the tracker claim"

[Andante]

Why is answering fast instead of thinking about it town indicative? Town has to put more thought into it than scum...

You really thought about it? I don't see how voting out the tracker claim is ever a good idea here

[Andante]

I never said I was asking for a free pass? I’ve been giving my best effort all game, I claim tracker and you and Dats are like “Andante is maf!!!” like I feel like I’ve been towny all game??

[Andante]

tbh i’m probably just more confused than anything as to why I have 2 people here pretty set on voting me, like dats voted because of my tracker claim… yeah idk what’s going on here

[Andante]

maybe I should just shut up, see yall sometime tomorrow

[Andante]

I never said I was asking for a free pass?

That's kinda how I'm reading it; you saying it's weird for me to be voting the tracker claim implies that your tracker claim means you shouldn't be voted.

I mean, I know there's genuine content in my other 400 posts here, unless you want to present some genuine case as to why I'm maf here, yeah it's very odd to be voting the tracker claim. It's 1 think if I had posts like Alyssa/Mena(Pooky) here but I've genuinely been like "yo reads are here, I think X maf cause this" it's literally not my fault people choose to ignore my actual solving, and instead go "ewww why are you team reading. that's a bad way to play" yet not even engage with my reads like "I think you're off on this part, I tr this" so I'm doing what I can with what I'm being given, meanwhile half the table is just coasting/not here

[Andante]

Like ALL of your game has been "must. tunnel. top of draft" why is that like a top thing to worry about?? if I had known this was such a huge deal I'd have just chosen some stupid large number to be VT, it's literally not like I even wanted to be a pr, cause of all this. I picked tracker so there was minimal work. track a sr. easy. yet now it's all like "OMG SHE'S MAF JAILKEEP!" like what? no. Does no post I've even made thus far mean anything?? I've been genuinely trying to find maf, it's a tad hard when you have stuff like "top of draft must be maf!!" and well, I know my logic is a pain to follow at times/hella confusing, but I'm trying, and so to me that's all that matters.

Like, at least my entire ISO isn't spent talking about draft order....

also it just hit me that Andante is top in the draft. That's another reason to scumread her, I guess.

There's a pretty clear correlation between being high in the draft and being scum in PYP games.

The reasons I can think of are (a) scum are less likely to collide in general because they will avoid colliding with each other, (b) based on (a) they are more likely to go for low numbers because it's safer, and (c) they are likely to put more calculation and thought into the draft than town.

You're just jealous cause you were bottom of the draft

I literally spent the entirety of the last PYP game I played correctly calling the top drafter scum

pretty sure this time the top drafter isn't

maybe not, but one of the high drafters probably is.

Spoiler:

Ydrasse.

o/

I think this does lessen my townread somewhat, exactly because of what happened to her last time she was high in the draft.

I'm not a good neighbor target, in all seriousness. I don't sort much in hoods, and I'm low on the draft so not likely to have PR info, and I would smoke her ass at chess (Faker has seen my lichess profile and can confirm this).

and what is that?

Based on my data no scum has landed 3rd in the draft with a number lower than 8, in fact they have been pretty consistently high (8, 9, 10, 11). If this sounds like a bullshit statistical coincidence, that's because it is, but I think the logic makes at least a tiny amount of sense because based on the data when scum go for a medium-low number they often also go for a lower which might collide, but it if it does, the medium-low number is likely to score a very good place in the draft (higher than 3rd).

Look, I warned you that it was dumb.

why would I fear death?

why would the top draft spot be afraid of getting NK'd? Gee, I don't know...

okay, *why*

Top draft is decently correlated with being scum, her play has done nothing to shake me off of that, scum presumably made two kills and neither was aimed at the top 3 (which I believe is fairly rare? might be worth checking the stats there), she's been playing up how she is a known PR and how much that matters and then she claims under basically zero pressure with zero info, her reaction to the double kill was pretty awkward and may have betrayed knowledge that it was a scum vig, and now she's shading me off of Mena associatives rather than push me directly which may be to avoid OMGUS accusations.