Open 677: See Nayne Ples Ples [THE END]

[LicketyQuickety]

hey STOP WITH YOUR UNprtozufviyBR CONVRRSRATIKSN

yes momo has posted recently and yes they could be sk

Look, its Dyslexic Tepes!

I kid.

[LicketyQuickety]

[snip]

None of this is alignment indicative for RC and makes sense in the context of him being lolwagoned as town really frequently and that making the game unpleasant and hard to play for him.
I mean I think he's dealing with the situation sub-optimally but you'd be pissed and frustrated with people too if this shit happened nearly every game.

-- Mail

did you read the post where I said I was lynched Day 1 8 times in my first 16 games???

Yeah, I was frustrated as well, but I did 2 things:

1) Kept playing
2) Changed the way I played so that I WOULDN'T get Scum read early nearly every fucking game.

RC has done Step 1. He still needs to work on Step 2.

Mafia is brutal, Mafia is war. I have been in games where I was literally in tears because my responses were getting torn to shreds and I was made to look like a crazy person who was either Scum or beyond terrible at the game as Town.

Look who is getting universally Town read Day 1.

[LicketyQuickety]

did you read the post where I said I was lynched Day 1 8 times in my first 16 games???

Yeah, I was frustrated as well, but I did 2 things:

1) Kept playing
2) Changed the way I played so that I WOULDN'T get Scum read early nearly every fucking game.

RC has done Step 1. He still needs to work on Step 2.

Mafia is brutal, Mafia is war. I have been in games where I was literally in tears because my responses were getting torn to shreds and I was made to look like a crazy person who was either Scum or beyond terrible at the game as Town.

Look who is getting universally Town read Day 1.

Okay so do you actually think we're scum? If so, why? Tried skimming to find your reasoning and I couldn't really find much. Link me the posts?
I did see something about you thinking stuff sounded manipulative but manipulative =/= scummy. It's playstyle indicative.

-- Mail

Go ISO me and find the big post for starters.

[LicketyQuickety]

Go ISO me and find the big post for starters.

If you mean the wallpost you made near the start of the game then I addressed that already.

-- Mail

You didn't address shit. You gave a one liner for that thing.

[LicketyQuickety]

Because nothing in his ISO sounds genuine except for his push on momo.

-- Mail

BZZZZZZZT.

[LicketyQuickety]

Because nothing in his ISO sounds genuine except for his push on momo.

-- Mail

For this to be groupscum lynching SK you need to make several assumptions
1) You need to assume there's an SK in the setup (There's 50% chance according to the setup page: https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=C9%2B%2B )
2) You need to assume groupscum knows if there's an SK (Once again, 50% chance all groupscum roles appear both with and without an SK)
3) You need to assume momo is an SK.

I think the better explanation for why his push on momo feels genuine is that he's simply town that thinks they found scum.

I just checked your post count... holy fuck.

[LicketyQuickety]

Sorry what's that Abbreviation mean? It's one I'm not familiar with.

"Information Instead of Analysis"

-- Mail

Hawk is not the type of player to use that tactic as Scum I don't think. They are not a data oriented enough type of player to do that.

My twist on IIoA is slightly different than the norm from talking about the setup to providing facts from the thread laid out logically without providing a conclusion to the info provided.

So if I posted a rundown of who voted who when but didn't say what that meant, I would use that as a Scum tell.

I am not seeing Hawk do this, hence why I don't think Hawk is doing IIoA.

[LicketyQuickety]

Hawk is not the type of player to use that tactic as Scum I don't think. They are not a data oriented enough type of player to do that.

Evidence for this?

-- Mail

They have not done it yet this game.

[LicketyQuickety]

postie did anything happen in the last 10 pages or can i sleep now?

We all agreed momo was the worst and decided to lynch him.
Also Sakura and Hawk are still scum.

-- Mail

Pretty much the only answer I have ever seen RC give when people ask for a catchup post.

@Anti, I reopened my case on M&M. Its based on Hawk acting defeated because of RCs push on them.

[LicketyQuickety]

They have not done it yet this game.

Oh I see what you're saying. I disagree though. Take a look at some of the meta he was throwing about, particularly near the start of the game. It's IIoA.

You want I should link some of my games?

Sure that'd help.

I'm heading to bed now I'll let Anti take it from here.

-- Mail

Meta =/= Data, its kinda the opposite depending on how its used. I am talking about number and tangible concrete things, not things based on behavior at all.

[LicketyQuickety]

Meta =/= Data, its kinda the opposite depending on how its used. I am talking about number and tangible concrete things, not things based on behavior at all.

Well then you're not addressing my point. I'm using IIoA in the sense of

Information

Instead of Analysis, not Data Instead of Analysis. He's giving information and not analysing it. Whether or not he's giving data is irrelevant when that's not part of my point.

-- Mail

Would have expected you to argue that they are talking about the setup, but you didn't. That would have been the best argument.

[LicketyQuickety]

Is it just me or is RC just working total bull right now.

Reasons come when I feel like it.

I will act like I am better than you because it is true.

Everything will be for my own, unrevealed reasons.

Is it just me or is this obvscum.

it's just you

RCs case on Hawk is wank. They are straight up making up shit.

[LicketyQuickety]

hey m and m would it make you happy if I sheeped you

i mean I probably won't sheep u on momo but yknow ill sheep u not on hawk either... Hmm I'll sheep u on another person

@momo, lol stop wking lq and focus on actual game shit. i could give a fuck less the dudes iq but his play is stupid.

@Anti, can you sorta see this as a rf from KTS?

no

also, fun fact: i've not once in my 8 years here seen scum make a concerted effort to "rolefish"

Gives me much :/

Titus made a whole case about me that I was role fishing and I was lynched for it. I was Scum but I wasn't roles fishing. I totally should have turned that shit around on her. I was about 7.5 years shy of being able to make that argument, however.

[LicketyQuickety]

I think KTS is Town.

ah, yeesh...

...


...


...

really?

Their vote on Hawk when I said Hawk was being defeatist andI then instead voted RC because I thought something fishy was going on with RC/Hawk.

[LicketyQuickety]

Their vote on Hawk when I said Hawk was being defeatist andI then instead voted RC because I thought something fishy was going on with RC/Hawk.

i'm sure there is a universe where that sentence makes sense...

this one is not it

Its a tin foil hat theory that RC is bussing Hawk and Hawk is acting like "well, that's the plan" and is acting all defeatist because they are

supposed

to get lynched by RC here. I also really want to push RC because I honestly haven't seen anything you can call traditionally townie from them.

[LicketyQuickety]

lq if you want to lynch m+m, you will have to do it without my vote and against my advice

:/

Why is RC Town?

That hydra has acted objectively Scummy... I know meta is a thing, but acting blatantly anti-town is NO reason to Town read someone. I think RC is pulling strings. That haven't made a single solid push yet. Their current vote is on Hawk for reasons of IIoA used horribly wrong. Occam's Razor... If it looks like Scum...

[LicketyQuickety]

Their vote on Hawk when I said Hawk was being defeatist andI then instead voted RC because I thought something fishy was going on with RC/Hawk.

i'm sure there is a universe where that sentence makes sense...

this one is not it

Its a tin foil hat theory that RC is bussing Hawk and Hawk is acting like "well, that's the plan" and is acting all defeatist because they are

supposed

to get lynched by RC here. I also really want to push RC because I honestly haven't seen anything you can call traditionally townie from them.

what does any of this have to do w kts?

KTS didn't see what I saw, they just saw that Hawk looked like shit for lying down ready to die early D1 for shitty ass reasons.

[LicketyQuickety]

lq if you want to lynch m+m, you will have to do it without my vote and against my advice

:/

Why is RC Town?

That hydra has acted objectively Scummy... I know meta is a thing, but acting blatantly anti-town is NO reason to Town read someone. I think RC is pulling strings. That haven't made a single solid push yet. Their current vote is on Hawk for reasons of IIoA used horribly wrong. Occam's Razor... If it looks like Scum...

unless it's something measurably suboptimal like faking guilties or not claiming miller in the first post or something else technical like that, there's no such thing as "objectively scummy"

also i don't think the hawk push is scummy ...?

In my book (I have a lot of experience with getting Scum read for this) If you can't come up with a reasonable reason for Scum reading someone, it is likely that they are Scum because this is the corner stone of a good Scum game and something that must be taken under heavy heavy scrutiny. Honestly there is so much potential WIFOM surrounding what the read on RC is that it is borderline repulsive. Every defense that RC has given in retort of being Scum read is literally "If I was Scum you would not be suspecting me." In what universe of Mafia should this kind of defense fly? If you are proficient enough in the game to get awarded an award for being most cunning manipulator, you should damn well know that reasons for why you do what you do, even in the case of lynching Town, even if those reasons are hidden from other players, must be sound. You do not have a superior game as any alignment without superior reasoning skills. Because of this I know that RC has the ability to provide reasons and they are not doing this. They are coasting off their meta and it is damn right sickening. We should hold ourselves to a higher standard that using arguments such as "because I said so." I might be crazy here, but at least I give reasons for doing the shit I do and I am God tier Town read in some of the game I am Town because of this.

RCs case on Hawk is objectively bad. Not only are they reluctant to actually give reasons for their Scum read on Hawk, but the reasons given do are not logically, informationally, or site meta sound. There is literally no substance to the read whatsoever. It is all smoke and mirrors for RC to spin a story Day 2 on why they wanted Hawk lynched. Hawk has said they have insight into why RC is tunneling them, that reason being so RC can single handedly solve the game by looking at reactions from a lynch on someone who is giving up and town reading the person who is tunneling on them.

Take this example of literally the exact opposite of the situation we are looking at with Hawk and RC compared to Thor665 and myself:

viewtopic.php?t=67206&f=50&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go

Thor665 Scum reads me hard core, I don't give up, I fight with him for pages and pages of wall post after wall post. I am not even sure the guy is Scum, but I still think the stuff he is doing is shady. Town won this game in a landslide because I did not give up fighting. It was literally David and Goliath. This is the way games should be played.

[LicketyQuickety]

first things first, nothing is "objectively" anything right now

That's like saying Tells don't exist.

[LicketyQuickety]

In my book (I have a lot of experience with getting Scum read for this) If you can't come up with a reasonable reason for Scum reading someone, it is likely that they are Scum because this is the corner stone of a good Scum game and something that must be taken under heavy heavy scrutiny.

jfdslkaaaaa;jelk;vmal;dsjfewk;fsdmc;lkjfdew;lfj;lkdvjroie439jflkdedafwe392pfjdkl;afmcvmndskfjewi;9a23

Let me say it this way: The better the Scum game someone has, the more scrutiny they must be put under each and every game. Good Scum players should never get an easy Town read. They should have to bite and claw for every Town read they ever get. This is why I chose to get better as Town instead of Scum.

My philosophy on playing is that you should prioritize your Town game for the sole reason that you will be Town more often then any other alignment. People who prioritize their Scum game should get lynched... a lot.

[LicketyQuickety]

RCs case on Hawk is objectively bad. Not only are they reluctant to actually give reasons for their Scum read on Hawk, but the reasons given do are not logically, informationally, or site meta sound. There is literally no substance to the read whatsoever. It is all smoke and mirrors for RC to spin a story Day 2 on why they wanted Hawk lynched. Hawk has said they have insight into why RC is tunneling them, that reason being so RC can single handedly solve the game by looking at reactions from a lynch on someone who is giving up and town reading the person who is tunneling on them.

i don't agree with that

hawk didn't really do much in his first couple posts aside from say something about uzi and his PR game. now... i didn't really know what to think about that but i could see someone looking at hawk's early posting and going "scum trying to avoid doing anything meaningful."

these are SUBJECTIVE things, btw.

I don't have time right now to tear apart M&Ms case on Hawk right now, but if that is what it takes for you to consider M&M as Scum I will do so tomorrow.

[LicketyQuickety]

Thor665 Scum reads me hard core, I don't give up, I fight with him for pages and pages of wall post after wall post. I am not even sure the guy is Scum, but I still think the stuff he is doing is shady. Town won this game in a landslide because I did not give up fighting. It was literally David and Goliath. This is the way games should be played.

i don't rly know what parallels that game is supposed to have w this one....

He's just giving you an example of what he thinks RC should be doing here.

Nope, I am giving an example of what RC AND Hawk should be doing right now.

[LicketyQuickety]

tells don't exist

That is a matter of debate. Tells definitely exist. If they didn't, no Scum would ever get lynched.

[LicketyQuickety]

KTS didn't see what I saw, they just saw that Hawk looked like shit for lying down ready to die early D1 for shitty ass reasons.

and hawk's not scummy

your point?

Hawk IS Scummy. RC and Hawk are both Scummy.

[LicketyQuickety]

Motivation, thought process, and tone are all you need.

If all you need to read someone is Motivation, thought process and tone, then there are tells in each one of those. Yes, you should be able to identify the tells in those for them to be valid.

[LicketyQuickety]

Motivation, thought process, and tone are all you need.

If all you need to read someone is Motivation, thought process and tone, then there are tells in each one of those. Yes, you should be able to identify the tells in those for them to be valid.

And I agree, that's all you need.

[LicketyQuickety]

I don't have time right now to tear apart M&Ms case on Hawk right now,

errrrr.... what?

early d1 cases are not rly things to be "torn apart" and that's a pretty good sign you're in a tunnel

I am someone who thinks I can potentially can catch Scum in RVS, so I disagree that you can't tear someones case to shreds D1. Reason is the basis for getting reads, not evidence. Evidence is just the vehicle for reasoning. I also think everything has the potential for being AI given proper context. What makes catching Scum in RVS difficult is that there is not usually proper context to base a read on, but that does not mean that its never there.

I point you now to a play where the Scum was caught very early D1:

viewtopic.php?f=84&t=68132

This was done with evidence, but there was still a psychological component to the way this game was solved. It relies on knowing how Scum operate ie tells.

[LicketyQuickety]

tells don't exist

That is a matter of debate. Tells definitely exist. If they didn't, no Scum would ever get lynched.

objective and absolute tells do not exist.

i don't think you'd find much debate from anyone on that.

i think you're really fooling yourself (and doing yourself a disservice) if you frame your subjective opinion as an objective fact.

Not tells that apply to everyone, no. But they do exist for individuals.

[LicketyQuickety]

ok you're getting distracted by generalities so i won't go there any more

(and of course if you use a large enough sample size pretty much ANY method is going to "catch" scum eventually)

i'm saying that in this SPECIFIC instance, rc+postie's hawk case is not something you have "torn apart" and it's something you are not likely going to be able to "tear apart"

Well, I am going to attempt it nonetheless. Its just a matter of finding counterarguments, that is all a debate is.

[LicketyQuickety]

@Uzi, tell me how crazy I am on a scale from 1-10. IDK if I am out to lunch or if I am standing of firm ground.

[LicketyQuickety]

I stand by what I said.

[LicketyQuickety]

Okay sure creature can be town for now I'm keeping an eye on you tho just in case.

You still feel off but I guess not Scummy off.

WTF kind of post is this?

[LicketyQuickety]

null and null-town, i have no idea how to read Creature, and LQ is playing differently than in Gistou where he got ran up hard even by his own scumteam.

I played like shit that game, even for my Scum game it was bad, honestly. Not a good indication on that way I play except like day 1 maybe day 2.

[LicketyQuickety]

Blah, that's all I got for the pages I missed.

I am fine with a Hawk lynch.

[LicketyQuickety]

BTW, I was kinda manic yesterday and today I am kinda depressed until I get manic again, so fair warning.

[LicketyQuickety]

I am not thrilled with ETL, honestly. Looks like they are buddying Anti here.

[LicketyQuickety]

I am not thrilled with ETL, honestly. Looks like they are buddying Anti here.

He's one of my best friends in the world. Like... actually.

There is plenty of evidence to back this up - check any of my past like 20 games.

I don't meta dive, but I don't think you are lying since easily confirmable through Anti. You get that I have to poke you on that though right?

What is your read on me and what page are you on?

[LicketyQuickety]

BTW, I don't at all remember Sakura, Sorry.

[LicketyQuickety]

You hate playing scum, right?

Indeed i do, to the point that rolling scum 3 times in a row last time was demotivational enough to replace out of all 3 games, or 2 of them.

Yeah, I noticed about your replace outs...

That is weak. Playing as Scum is like Leg day: you do it because if you don't do it you look ridiculous.

[LicketyQuickety]

Fine, but I like to discuss game theory more, specially when my reads aren't changing at all.

Well, just point this out because Scum already know this, but momo isn't Vig because if they were they would know there could be 2 kills at night without a SK.

[LicketyQuickety]

Did momo ever claim to be an alt?

Yes, but that doesn't mean they even knew wheat that meant when they said it.

[LicketyQuickety]

Mmmm I think Momo has been playing pretty scummy. His play feels very forced and consistently just trying to snowball some kind of pressure. His counter pushes to pressure on himself is to OMGUS and or draw up misreps. Mail and myself (possible music) actually scumread him for reasons concerning his play but he doesn't engage with that instead presses us as policy lynching him. He misreps me saying that I'm following M&M when I was the first one to objectively scumread him. I don't think he's as new as he acts and it reflects in some of his statements meaning I think he recognizes what he's doing he's just choosing to ignore it for newbie shield.

M&M I think at least RC's head is very passionate and has displayed a very apt desire to be the center of attention and lead town. Confident to the point of being cocky I don't think even an experienced Hydra wants to draw that much attention as scum. I do find her stubbornness to refuse to give cases and only give one or two reasons at most with no follow up for her pushes to be annoying and kinda scummy so I can see how LQ and Uzi don't like it.

Mail on the other hand has been rather collected and calm. A nice compliment to RC but no less manipulative/cunning in their play.

Overall I think that slot is more likely town than scum but I don't think I could see reason to lynch there over Momo today. Not unless Momo's play really picks up and he stops playing so objectively terrible -_-;

I like the content of this post, but I don't like the timing of it.

[LicketyQuickety]

Just in case people are literally retarded, Doc is on Anti tonight.

[LicketyQuickety]

I like the content of this post, but I don't like the timing of it.

I asked him for it.

Oh, NVM

[LicketyQuickety]

What are the chances we've got a lurking scumteam? Because I'm seeing a lot of activity from the same like 5 or 6 people and none from the others.

Your slot happens to be one of those lurkers.

[LicketyQuickety]

What are the chances we've got a lurking scumteam? Because I'm seeing a lot of activity from the same like 5 or 6 people and none from the others.

Your slot happens to be one of those lurkers.

no etl is pretty good in comparison to others

Not who they replaced. That was my point.

[LicketyQuickety]

i havent read the first 20 pages still so im probably being dumb with what i thought was an obersavtion so feel free to disprove me or whatever

@lq, oh well give etl a chance lmao they're picking up activity reasonably enough

Point being: they argue lurkers could be Scum all the while picking up a slot that was a lurker.

[LicketyQuickety]

someone asked to be invested lol

@lq, ok fair enough but etl seems town so it doesn't really apply

LOL. You think someone like ETL is going to just obvscum it right off the bat? I don't think so. They've been here since 2013. I think that means more than it looks. I'm not just going to hand our a Town read for someone catching up.

[LicketyQuickety]

tbh I don't use this "oh scum can't be all lurking" as a mindset. Lurking is bad and scum shouldn't get away easily with it.

Well, at least you are consistent wanting to pressure lurkers.

[LicketyQuickety]

Feeling like LUV joined this game without knowing the setup.

Not likely.

[LicketyQuickety]

Innocent Child doesn't balance out Godfather to be honest.

Holy shit, Creature might be right about you not knowing the setup.

[LicketyQuickety]

Wouldn't be surprised if LUV thought he was joining a Large Theme.

OK, lets take it easy here.

[LicketyQuickety]

I'm feeling like we're wasting time and that's sorta odd.

I just don't feel motivated atm.

[LicketyQuickety]

VOTE: KTS

[LicketyQuickety]

VOTE: KTS

Def agree with Antihero's reason.

Feeling like this would be a good D1 lynch.

oh jeez...

ALL GAME LONG...

[LicketyQuickety]

well that killed the vibe for me

UNVOTE:

We didn't even get to see how he reacts.

[LicketyQuickety]

We should just lynch momo.

VOTE: momo

Choochoo.

[LicketyQuickety]

You wouldn't have gotten anything out of KTS. There wasn't any pressure.

Disagree. Even a "WTF?!" can give info.

[LicketyQuickety]

Where is M&M?

[LicketyQuickety]

Guys I am telling you that if you investigate me I will come out town. So just wait one game day.

I don't think you are the best choice for investigation..

[LicketyQuickety]

Wait...what is this godfather thing.

I am aware of roleblocker, but not godfather. Are they two names for one role???

A bit too convenient.

[LicketyQuickety]

hmmm

antihero post me a rap song right now and i'll show you why i'm town

Here I'll do it (and I don't even like rap):

[LicketyQuickety]

Kinda miss RC's anger now to be honest. It was least a little entertaining.

You got a Town/Reads list yet?

[LicketyQuickety]

I'm bored, someone Scum hunt me.

[LicketyQuickety]

did ETL leave for the night? I thought they were catching up but they disappeared.

[LicketyQuickety]

VOTE: Kop

[LicketyQuickety]

VOTE: momo

[LicketyQuickety]

what the hell is going on here

vote momo, be a hero.

[LicketyQuickety]

I don't even know anymore...


This game is confusing af

You've been playing off peoples feefees all game long. You are like a parrot. And you are Scum.

[LicketyQuickety]

Ill be honest i just want to end this day but

but

uh

i still need to get a good read on people

Yeah, you've made like no stances all game. What gives?

[LicketyQuickety]

hmm i dont feel any aggression in my heart because i think i got into the game being more of a mediator than a mafia player

that is bad people should be mediating me

I'm going to be honest, I have no idea wtf you mean by that.

[LicketyQuickety]

If some of you alt-slip with Prince Lyon, please tell me. Else, I would assume that Prince Lyon is a troll and I would report it to listmod

Wasn't me.

[LicketyQuickety]

R.I.P. Lyon.

I would normally think it was momo, but that post is not his style.

[LicketyQuickety]

not it

also if anyone hammers before kop posts may you feel the swift vengeance of a vig's bullet

Anti is both vig and IC, you heard it here first folks.

[LicketyQuickety]

But seriously, Anti, you have been kinda low impact this game. Why?

[LicketyQuickety]

i feel like everyone has been low impact thus far

Except me. I joking... kind of.

[LicketyQuickety]

Anti, do you remember that case I made against MonkeyMan in The Cougar's Den game? I sorta feel like its the same thing for my case on M&M here.

[LicketyQuickety]

does everyone want a new IC?

etl's thing is to motivate me so i took that but now i feel like i'm doing something wrong and i don't really know what it is.

No, we don't want a new IC, we want you to stay. Viewing this as objectively as I can, its not often I get to play with super vets who have like 4 times the experience that I do. Its a great learning experience.

[LicketyQuickety]

Anti, do you remember that case I made against MonkeyMan in The Cougar's Den game? I sorta feel like its the same thing for my case on M&M here.

yeah, yeah...

i mean... what can i say? it's brilliant.

I feel like you are being facetious :/

I realize I have some different views on things, but like I feel like I do have solid reasons for why M&M is Scum that are pretty standard and I just hate that "meta" fucks that over completely :/

[LicketyQuickety]

Anti, do you remember that case I made against MonkeyMan in The Cougar's Den game? I sorta feel like its the same thing for my case on M&M here.

yeah, yeah...

i mean... what can i say? it's brilliant.

I feel like you are being facetious :/

I realize I have some different views on things, but like I feel like I do have solid reasons for why M&M is Scum that are pretty standard and I just hate that "meta" fucks that over completely :/

You hate that you can't lynch someone because everyone else knows that your reasons for voting me are terrible?

No, I hate that play style covers up what is shitty play.

[LicketyQuickety]

Sorry would you rather everyone just let you lynch us because it makes you feel bad that people won't let you do stupid shit?
Get off your high horse you not being allowed to lynch town isn't some grand slight that town is pulling against you.

Literally ALL you do is push. Its like 90% push 10% reasons.

[LicketyQuickety]

Like that's why I fucking hate you and momo it's because you're both so fucking self righteous about being bad at the game. Acting like we should take you seriously or something.
People caring about your reads is a priviledge, not a right, and having the attitude that you should lynch me because I happen to be good at scum even though I'm a billion times better than you at town as well doesn't get you taken seriously. And no my play isn't bad; everyone in this game knows that I'm a better scumhunter than you. fuck off.

No, You fuck off. You literally have no respect for the game. I am not self righteous, I want to see things done the right way there is a difference. And lets be honest, this is still basically the same fucking argument you have been giving all game. "I am so good at this game, I can do no wrong, hence why I am not Scum." And I find it deplorable that you only show up now that the pressure is completely off you because Anti, the experienced vet who is IC thinks you are Town for IDK what reason.

[LicketyQuickety]

Sorry would you rather everyone just let you lynch us because it makes you feel bad that people won't let you do stupid shit?
Get off your high horse you not being allowed to lynch town isn't some grand slight that town is pulling against you.

Literally ALL you do is push. Its like 90% push 10% reasons.

is there something wrong w this ratio?

IMO, yes. It SHOULD be 50/50 or so the wiki says according to Rampage. The problem with a 9:1 ratio is it makes it extremely easy for Scum to hide behind that because then they don't have to actually put effort into making their reads believable, they can just keep saying the same shit over and over.

[LicketyQuickety]

or so the wiki says

I think there's your problem.

Nope, I just used the wiki as evidence. I am not even an avid wiki reader, I mostly just do what makes sense to myself, but in this case, Rampage makes a very good point.

[LicketyQuickety]

@Anti, why is M&M Town? I'm willing to back off if you give some decent reasons.

[LicketyQuickety]

VOTE: Kop

[LicketyQuickety]

@Mod, have you prodded Kop yet?

[LicketyQuickety]

@Mod, Charloux needs a prod as well

[LicketyQuickety]

@Mod, Charloux needs a prod as well

I think...

[LicketyQuickety]

@Uzi, why did you unvote momo?

[LicketyQuickety]

If you have a claim to make, do it now.

Does this rub anyone else the wrong way?

[LicketyQuickety]

We were on Hawk because I hated iso post #6. It's hugely IIOA as opposed to actual content and even in that IIOA it's a ton of waffling. It feels like the kind of post scum makes about scum, too: which is why I'm perfectly comfortable jumping over to LUV. Obviously it's early and either or none of them may be scum but I don't like the way this game is playing out.

One post. That is the reason for Scum reading Hawk. And its not even accurate. That post is in no way IIoA.

And if you're going to read us as anyone else: then sitting on a scumread on you is a perfectly safe and easy play. I instead 180d my scumread on you (which looks scummy) then came up with a large set of reasons why you were town (and spent a considerable amount of time doing so that I could have spent doing literally anything else.) I would NOT use that reasoning because I am fucking RC and I don't tend to sit on easy lynches because I seek challenge, and none of that is outside the range of what I am capable of doing as scum: but if you're going to read me without meta that's super towny amirite? So either read me with meta, I'm town, read without, I'm town. bye.

This is right Bull Shit Posting here. RC has been sitting on the Hawk vote for ages. you telling me you Town game is this different from your Scum game? Don't make me laugh.

[LicketyQuickety]

no

asking for a claim at l-small number is standard

With like 10 days left tho?

[LicketyQuickety]

yes

l-"small number depending on wagon momentum" is claim time

I don't like ending day when there is 75% of the day left, but maybe that's just me...

The reason for this is that any time Town can get to talk about stuff is good. If Scum LOLCats, then its good time to Town hunt to see who shows up to discuss things. If The claimee is Town they we are out a PR (depending) with 75% of the day remaining, which gives Scum an advantage to pick a good target to try and lynch.

[LicketyQuickety]

Plus its Day 1 and because of this setup, if momo is Scum they are not getting lynched.

[LicketyQuickety]

We were on Hawk because I hated iso post #6. It's hugely IIOA as opposed to actual content and even in that IIOA it's a ton of waffling. It feels like the kind of post scum makes about scum, too: which is why I'm perfectly comfortable jumping over to LUV. Obviously it's early and either or none of them may be scum but I don't like the way this game is playing out.

I don't at all like how LUV is feigning casualness and making gif posts to try to downplay the fact that they're voting us when momentum is actually forming.
Their single point on us makes no sense whatsoever. We are literally the only slot in this game who has done any actual scumhunting in this game. We've told people voting us that they're being shit. That's standard.

LUV would have known that this would piss me off. They would have known that I would react negatively to all this. I don't think that this setup is coincidental nor that it's town motivated.

Idk like LQ is really bland and neutral tone-y and kinda inanimate as scum. I read stuff like 'makes me want to blurt out in laughter' as over the top posturing but that doesn't seem as likely from this specific player as scum.
There's also a lot of 'scumhunting' stuff that I don't like, like calling Persivul out for 2 posts which makes no sense and the whole assuming newbness but it's not like, alignment indicative necessarily I guess?

-Music

Mail has not posted in thread yet and she is the one who is better at signing consistently so if it's unsigned you can assume that it's me.
I actually for some reason mixed up LQ and EE when I was making a comparison to something EE did in Slavic 2 but then I realized that it wasn't.
LQ this game has been spastic and extremely posturey and usually that kind of stuff is scumtells but as far as I've read into his scum meta they're absent from his scum meta and he does it constantly as town.
So like it still comes across as insincere to me but given LQ's mislynch rate I suspect it comes across as insincere to everyone and I suggest he tones it down; but that's beside the point.
Town this game unless something happens to make me reevaluate.

Actually I just spent a while metaing you and a whole bunch of things that are scumtells for normal people are either NAI or towntells for you. We're good for now.

VOTE: Creature

Bam, I gave reasons for everything.

Lets see what's wrong with this:

Post 1 = 172
Post 2 = 171
Post 3 = 138
Post 4 = 134

See the pattern? Well guess what? Post 3 is meant to throw us off that posts 1 and 2 were made by RC, but they were not made by RC, they were made by Potsie. Why does this matter? because it makes it look like RC is giving reasons for reads when it is not RC giving reasons for reads.

[LicketyQuickety]

Gunter, you're embarrassing me!

This is the third time Uzi has subtly hinted that they are VT.

Uzi, why do this?

[LicketyQuickety]

This is an alt. Have played on other sites before, not on this one. And for LQ I was just showing a gut feeling.

Also, would a cunning person say they are cunning.

I was playing like a noob so that the scum would let their guard down.

Bold: this is a defence of RC. I am remembering this for if momo flips Scum.

[LicketyQuickety]

i don't rly think the hawk read is terrific either but i don't think the push is necessarily scummy...?

kinda hard to gauge rn

The hawk read is amazing you're just being a butt

AtE without reasoning.

[LicketyQuickety]

BTW, who like my new profile pic.

I do.

Hawk's continued IIoA and insistence there's nothing for him to comment on reads scum to me.

-- Mail

There really isn't anything to comment on. We just need to wait for Charloux and KTS to give content and we can go from there.

No mention of Kop...

[LicketyQuickety]

Fuck no Sakura there is no way Anti is town this game.

VOTE: Sakura Hana

Town!Sakura would never have suggested anything that dumm.

When Anti entered the thread you made a cheeky comment that Anti was Scum...

[LicketyQuickety]

Have you looked at their interactions with Momo? I don't like what they've been pushing.

I personally dont like momo's hastyness but im shrugging it off as different site meta.
I'm not exactly sure what you see wrong with their interactions with momo. I went and gave a quick ISO on E&O and all i saw was that they were annoyed at momo ignoring their replies or something.

57, 337, 495 and 509.

Ari attempts to make a show about the hydra comment Mo had made earlier. Not only did he assumed Mo was serious but he also assumed Mo wanted to policy lynch him, Ali, and M&M.

Ari continues to try to push Mo on more stupid shit. It isn't uncommon or strange for people when they're scum read to say they're clearly town or obvious town. Mo probably didn't answer because he knows any answer is just going go through one ear and out the other.

Ari's anger here feels out of place. Mo's clearly new to the site and he may not have had the time to fully master the site due to being eager to play. Rather than just restating the questions or even saying you should really look at what I quoted because of this and that, he just yells.

Is there something specific you want me to look at? im having trouble finding it.

kinda wondering why luv isn't more paranoid of being pocketed here

Nothing to fear but fear itself.

This is what I expect from a Town or SK Uzi. Good shit.

[LicketyQuickety]

K, I reread the whole damn thread. Here's what I got:

I still don't like M&M.
E&O are not as solid as at first glance
I like Creature for Town
Uzi COULD be SK, I am leaning Town currently.
KTS doesn't look that great either
I also am not in love with ETL
Ironically, I can kinda see momo as just having a very odd way of playing, so they could actually be Town here.
Hawk looks better on a reread
Sakura also looks Town from my angle
Charloux and Kop could very well be Scum, but maybe not both?
Anti is Town obviously, but I want to see him do more

[LicketyQuickety]

Eh, don't post 3 come before post 1 and 2?

Yes, but read the tone of the post.. That does not sound like RC in the slightest.. Leading off with "Idk" is just not the way RC writes shit.

[LicketyQuickety]

RC is Music right?

AFAIK, yes, it SHOULD be RC, but its not, its Potsie.

[LicketyQuickety]

Also, When I made my wall post on M&M originally, I don't know if I pointed this out, but it really seemed like M&M was trying to get me to vote for them and get my vote off momo.

[LicketyQuickety]

Also, When I made my wall post on M&M originally, I don't know if I pointed this out, but it really seemed like M&M was trying to get me to vote for them and get my vote off momo.

Sorta like they were thinking they would be harder to lynch than momo so they wanted my vote on them instead of momo. *shrug*

[LicketyQuickety]

I just don't have the concentration to catch up properly with 60 pages.
Who is the most scumread/townread guy; Were there any claims? Any big fights that happened?

Don't be lazy. You signed up for this game, you better either play the damn game or replace out.

[LicketyQuickety]

1) I wrote that
2) if I didn't and Postie did and signed as me it's totally NAI. I've done it with FA and Titus as both alignments
3) but I wrote that and we're not doing that here.

Links or it didn't happen.

[LicketyQuickety]

why would I waste my time getting links for you to prove that I do something that I didn't do

Because you could be lying.

[LicketyQuickety]

so I could.

Well I think you are lying and I don't think its NAI.

[LicketyQuickety]

good for you.

Thanks. Pretty sick read, huh?

[LicketyQuickety]

@Uzi, why did you unvote momo?

Wasn't ready for the day to end.

Gunter, you're embarrassing me!

This is the third time Uzi has subtly hinted that they are VT.

Uzi, why do this?

Why are you looking for crumbs? Why are you trying to role fish?

I'm not actually looking for them, I just noticed. Seemed weird to crumb VT.

[LicketyQuickety]

I see it as an exaggerated attempt to act like a VT but I have several lynches that need to go through before LUV.

Oh, I see you're not worried about getting NKed then.

[LicketyQuickety]

I am not worried about being NKed in this game because scum would see it as essentially giving up hawk for dead and if they leave me alive I'm liable to get mislynched or have my reads ignored.

There's kinda a contradiction here. Should I point it out?

[LicketyQuickety]

NKed!RC's reads are a lot more liable to get taken seriously than living!RC's in this lobby.

Err... So how is this different from anyone else exactly?

[LicketyQuickety]

Other people in this clown don't have the two worst people in the game sitting there calling them scum.

That's not even a proper sentence.

[LicketyQuickety]

Guys...before you lynch me, l am going to role claim.

I am a one shot cop.

Why the fuck did you claim? Especially as I was just starting to see you as Town.

Oh well, I guess this slot sorts itself out now.

[LicketyQuickety]

Someone give me the basic argument on hawk? I thought his posting yesterday was ok.

Its literally based on a single post. I think its post 6 of his ISO or the 6th post of the thread I can't remember. The case is that he was using IIoA and tone.

[LicketyQuickety]

There has to be more to the cases on hawk than a single post?

Well, according to RC there is, but they are not going to explain it until Hawk is dead apparently. I don't like that move by RC because well, its RC. I feel they can pretty much just try and sell us a story if they are Scum so I want more reasons for why RC wants Hawk dead and RC isn't giving them.

[LicketyQuickety]

Not that I've been made aware of.

UNVOTE:

Not lynching a PR claim not that he should live for long sans a Doc helping him out here.

yeah, Doc is still on Anti.

[LicketyQuickety]

I've got a pretty strong town read on MM, so I'd prefer to check a scumread, but clearing MM would still do a lot to furthering the game, as I don't think hardly anyone has the same feeling about them that I do.

Couple problems with this:

1. momo isn't cleared until dead
   
2. investigating to get a guilty is not the correct play to make. The correct play to make is to investigate someone who is likely to live till end game.

[LicketyQuickety]

I've got a pretty strong town read on MM, so I'd prefer to check a scumread, but clearing MM would still do a lot to furthering the game, as I don't think hardly anyone has the same feeling about them that I do.

Couple problems with this:

1. momo isn't cleared until dead
   
2. investigating to get a guilty is not the correct play to make. The correct play to make is to investigate someone who is likely to live till end game.

I don't see how those are contradictions to what I've said? I agree with you on both points. A guilty would still be fantastic though and is the ultimate end purpose of a cop. Duh

My point is if momo is Scum we can't trust the investigation either way. At this point the claim is WIFOM until momo is dead, cleared or confirmed through setup info.

[LicketyQuickety]

Okay LQ, who would you like me to investigate???

I'll have to think about it for a bit.

[LicketyQuickety]

Possibly Uzi or a lurker.

[LicketyQuickety]

If it were me I'd pick Creature. Or KTS.

I like Creature for Town, but that investigation choice isn't

that

bad cuz I can see where it could be good. KTS is a better than Creature I think. I am pretty sure by Day 3 (if i am alive) I will have a pretty good read on Creature.

[LicketyQuickety]

Charloux's slot would be helpful if we don't just run that up. same with Kop.

I wish these two would just start playing the game so I can get a read on them. Otherwise, I don't know. I've never been a fan of LAL, but I also feel like lurkers shouldn't have the privilege of making it to end game just to fuck up all the work the rest of the active town put in just to get NK'd.

QFT.

[LicketyQuickety]

I am pretty sure by Day 3 (if i am alive) I will have a pretty good read on Creature.

Why?

I'm fine a KTS check.

Cuz I just kinda "get" him. I can kinda get a good feel for him as games go on. This is partly due to me being Scum when I was Town and me trying to run him up for a lynch that didn't work. It also has to do with me being Town in a game where I caught him as ObvScum in a multiball game.

I have a much easier time reading people who play different from the norm than people that do play normal. Its a lot easier for me to tell if/when they are giving me a BS line. Takes time, but I get better as the game goes on.

[LicketyQuickety]

I am pretty sure by Day 3 (if i am alive) I will have a pretty good read on Creature.

Why?

I'm fine a KTS check.

Cuz I just kinda "get" him. I can kinda get a good feel for him as games go on. This is partly due to me being Scum when

he

was Town and me trying to run him up for a lynch that didn't work. It also has to do with me being Town in a game where I caught him as ObvScum in a multiball game.

I have a much easier time reading people who play different from the norm than people that do play normal. Its a lot easier for me to tell if/when they are giving me a BS line. Takes time, but I get better as the game goes on.

EBWOP

[LicketyQuickety]

Speed wagons are usually on town

Scum are the only ones that can tell if wagon is on town or on scum (except there's the possibility of an SK)

That means wagons on town gain more support by scum than wagons on scum

So if you call KTS and momo wagons on town because they're speedy, then there are scum on it

You can clearly see who is/was on these wagons

So who's scum from these wagons?

Say names, not groups

There is a subtle distinction between different kinds of wagons that form really fast though. The biggest difference is whether there was actual legitimate reasons for the wagon - whether the wagon formed fast because someone did something incredibly Scummy or not. Context is important. In this example where KTS was run up, its really only basis was that Anti voted them and people started following with no real reason given aside from momo who simply agreed with Anti's reasons. So the other factor is who was around during the time the quick wagon happened? If it was people that were largely Town read then I would argue that the wagon is then NAI to that player having a better chance at being Scum. If there is a mix of Town and Null reads or Town and Scum reads, then that has an impact on the wagons composition. With a mixed party reads wise then the person run up has a better chance of being Town. I have to go back and check, but I think I am at least slightly Town reading all the players who jumped on KTS so I would say there is just as much chance that KTS is Town or Scum based on that. Quick wagons that happen without good reasoning are not indicative of the wagoneers alignment since its essentially random chance. With most of the players being town (reads) who run up the wagon, then statistically there is a better chance of the player who was run up is actually Scum.

[LicketyQuickety]

You guys are pretty bad at mafia theory

Says you. If you were actually thinking about the situation and you had that view you could have said Sakura was trying to buddy me or I was trying to distract the conversation talking about theory when I should have been Scum hunting.

[LicketyQuickety]

Actually, momo has a point. Are you going to contribute anything meaningful to this game or is it going to be the same nothing content we are used to seeing?

[LicketyQuickety]

And KTS is also bad at mafia.

[LicketyQuickety]

Nah

Spoiler:

I'm kidding

[LicketyQuickety]

And KTS is also bad at mafia.

now you finally understand

I'm kidding, man. At least your not butt hurt.

[LicketyQuickety]

I don't get angry lol

You get stabby?

[LicketyQuickety]

People either objecting to or not supporting either the Hawk or LUV lynches: why?

Because they haven't been Scummy enough to vote.

[LicketyQuickety]

Possibly ETL???

That ones going to take some time to read. ETL is prolly better at Scum then RC.

[LicketyQuickety]

why does 'chill' mean not lynch?
do you think that there is somehow a magical shield preventing scum players from acting 'chill' about things?

yes

I mean unless ur thinking the wrong thing since chill people r non scummy people

This make no sense. Some people do not get flustered, some people do. Its a playstyle thing.

[LicketyQuickety]

well your reads are shit or you are scum so.

Just when you were starting to show promise.

[LicketyQuickety]

I'll never lose to you

what a g

The bromance is real.

[LicketyQuickety]

RC thinks I white knighted UZI early on cause were scum buddies his case is based off preflip associatives.

This makes literally no sense why you are voting for M&M.

[LicketyQuickety]

Funny you say that because I forget why you think that I'm scum oh wait you never said shit about why I'm scum.

I did though

For fucks sake, this is fucking ridiculous. RC, you are wack.

[LicketyQuickety]

Go ahead make the case RC. Let me see it with its perfect logic that can scumfirm me d1 being based off of Preflip Associatives.

Hey, you gunna answer that post I quoted from you?

[LicketyQuickety]

RC thinks I white knighted UZI early on cause were scum buddies his case is based off preflip associatives.

This makes literally no sense why you are voting for M&M.

[LicketyQuickety]

Why should I TR Uzi?

Because he says new shit practically every time he enters the thread.

[LicketyQuickety]

My apologies I've had 2 busy days at work and my body is crying for sleep. I will catch up tomorrow as I have zero energy right now.

He lives!

LMAO.

[LicketyQuickety]

Yeah, so, Anti, I have pretty much no hope of reading ETL so when you get a read on them can you tell us please?

[LicketyQuickety]

So like, I'm kinda pissed that people are too lazy to read the whole thread when I have literally read through the whole thing more than once...

[LicketyQuickety]

So like, I'm kinda pissed that people are too lazy to read the whole thread when I have literally read through the whole thing more than once...

Not everyone is going to play the same way as you. I'm doing the best I can. Reading through 50+ pages isnt' going to make my reads any better, it's just going to make me tired. I get my best reads through interaction.

K, I'm here. What's your read on me?

[LicketyQuickety]

And you disappear...

[LicketyQuickety]

Sorry, you can't read me at all.

You're starting to sound like someone I know

[LicketyQuickety]

Hello. 65 pages will take awhile. D1...fcuk...how many overposters does this game have ffs.

Just me.

[LicketyQuickety]

Hello. 65 pages will take awhile. D1...fcuk...how many overposters does this game have ffs.

you can skip my posts

they all suck anyway

That's my line...

[LicketyQuickety]

I am worried I am posting too much. I push too many different angles, there is no finesse. It makes me feel like I suck at this game.

[LicketyQuickety]

People either objecting to or not supporting either the Hawk or LUV lynches: why?

because i'm bad and stupid

that's why

hey same

Me too. All I do is push. No finesse required. Just attack anything that moves. Its pretty barbaric actually. I mean, really anyone can come up with reasons for poking holes in things. My ISO is a right mess, there is no focus. bleh, I am rambling.

[LicketyQuickety]

So like, I'm kinda pissed that people are too lazy to read the whole thread when I have literally read through the whole thing more than once...

Not everyone is going to play the same way as you. I'm doing the best I can. Reading through 50+ pages isnt' going to make my reads any better, it's just going to make me tired. I get my best reads through interaction.

K, I'm here. What's your read on me?

I told you I had a dinner date.

Anyway, I'm willing to discuss with you any aspect of the game other than my read on you. I find explaining my read to the person the read is on is pretty well pointless and only leads to bullshit.

Why did you make this post like Anti?

[LicketyQuickety]

I don't understand the question LQ.

Creature/LUV? ISOing.

The way you framed the response was the way Anti has been posting all game.

[LicketyQuickety]

I thought you said you would be willing to talk about ANYTHING.

[LicketyQuickety]

I don't understand the question LQ.

Creature/LUV? ISOing.

The way you framed the response was the way Anti has been posting all game.

I dunno what to tell you. It happens.

p-edit: me?

What's the motivation for posting that way. Its looks nearly identical to the way Anti has been posting.

[LicketyQuickety]

VOTE: ETL

[LicketyQuickety]

I will also be going to bed.

[LicketyQuickety]

*grumbles*

Well if ETL isn't Scum and M&M isn't Scum, then I guess I can only do this:

VOTE: KTS

[LicketyQuickety]

Anti thinks you are Scum and I am sheeping Anti.

[LicketyQuickety]

I feel completely lost in this game. I feel like there is a high chance Scum is flying under the radar and that could mean they are lurkers, but then I would expect Scum to be lurking as a playstyle and Charloux just got replaced so I don't think its that likely they are Scum because of that specifically.

[LicketyQuickety]

We're just directionless due to having no town leader.

Which is pretty ridiculous considering we have Anti in the game who is IC and me who everyone is Town reading.

[LicketyQuickety]

Town is directionless because half of the town is pushing on me and making the game impossible to organize.

No offense, but you deserve pressure.

[LicketyQuickety]

I don't react well to pressure. The best way to get me to produce more content and play better is to leave me the fuck alone so I can do my thing.

If you are Town, yeah. What if you are Scum?

[LicketyQuickety]

Don't pressure people. How else do you catch scene. Ridiculous

I am not the type of player to lurk when not under pressure but I am the type of player to lurk when under pressure. Best way to sort me is to ignore me until you've got a serious body of evidence behind your read on me.

And LQ when I say that you're best off just eating the loss I mean it sincerely. I will have weak scumgames every once in a while that can be realistically caught, and I'm generally playing poorly as both alignments atm: but if I ever get my spark back as scum consider it a loss from champion select kinda deal. Having fallen down to my current level (and I'm still pretty solid as scum!) gives me some perspective on it.

It's nice to be able to just entirely write off the possibility of your slot getting lynched without a cop investigation because you know no one's going to ever be able to pull it off.

This does actually make me angry. Like there is absolutely no modesty there. There ARE people who can catch you as Scum, I am sure of it. So for you to say the only way you ever get caught as Scum is LOL.

Along with this, I made a comment back a bit that ETL prolly has a better Scum game then you. What's your comment on that?

[LicketyQuickety]

Can we at least consolidate on a No list?

People I won't consider lynching today:

Creature
Fitz
Hawk
KTS
LQ

Errr... why KTS and Fitz?

[LicketyQuickety]

Not giving Fitz a pass. He just hasn't posted anything AI. There is no reason for me to consider lynching a null read on Day 1.

As for KTS, he's probably town.

Re: giving Fitz a pass because they are MIA: We have over half the day left. Its a little too soon to be saying you won't be lynching them. They could very well obvscum today.

Have you seen KTS do ANY Scumhunting at all this game? Cuz I have not.

[LicketyQuickety]

Not giving Fitz a pass. He just hasn't posted anything AI. There is no reason for me to consider lynching a null read on Day 1.

As for KTS, he's probably town.

Re: giving Fitz a pass because they are MIA: We have over half the day left. Its a little too soon to be saying you won't be lynching them. They could very well obvscum today.

Have you seen KTS do ANY Scumhunting at all this game? Cuz I have not.

I mean he could be but I doubt he'll say anything that'll ping me more than my top 3 scum reads have been doing.

KTS has been scum hunting, just a bit unconventional.

EBWOP.

Mind pointing out where KTS has Scum hunted, because I am not seeing him do anything he couldn't do as Scum.

[LicketyQuickety]

What are we gonna go do right now?

Might be just best to wait for Kop and a VC.

Why Kop and not Fitz?

[LicketyQuickety]

I'm on mobile so might take some time but just take a look at his ISO. His reactions and stances seem designed in a way that helps him sort people and figure out the best course of action.

I can see it just as well as him doing it as Scum being opportunistic.

[LicketyQuickety]

I didn't even realise havingfitz is playing, so he can be lynched. So can Kop.

Why does it feel like when you talk you are not really talking to anyone in particular?

[LicketyQuickety]

What are we gonna go do right now?

Might be just best to wait for Kop and a VC.

Why Kop and not Fitz?

Kop because of 136 and 1582.

I don't get it.

[LicketyQuickety]

What are we gonna go do right now?

Might be just best to wait for Kop and a VC.

Why Kop and not Fitz?

Kop because of 136 and 1582.

I don't get it.

Votes Momo without having even mention him previously or in that post.

Doesn't bother to unvote after explaining his absence.

He could have been distracted with things from rl or forgot he voted.

[LicketyQuickety]

I hope Anti gets a good read on ETL today.

@Anti, still waiting on those reasons for why M&M is Town.

[LicketyQuickety]

So I'm thinking I may have been wrong giving E&O a townlean.

VOTE: E&O

They're basically sit on Momo all day from the beginning with very little actual reasoning besides he's playing poorly and won't link him to epic mafia etc. etc. nothing actually pushing the game forward in any other meaningful way. While I agreed heavily that I thought creature was playing off and not contributing upon inspection of creatures scum games I'm willing to give him a pass for today. I want to pull up some other conncerning posts by them but I'm at work so I'll go into more detail later.

I was kinda thinking that E&O kinda got off easy for no real reason other than looking reasonable. I don't mind this vote.

[LicketyQuickety]

I don't think I even read the majority of this game.
-Electra (Ali)

Why not? You've been here since the beginning so there is really no excuse this time.

I had a tin foil hat theory a while back that Ali isn't posting because that hydra knows Ali is new and hasn't played Scum yet so they would be an easy Scum read.

[LicketyQuickety]

Anti, I can totally see the sleaze in momo. Its what I have been thinking nearly all game.

[LicketyQuickety]

My guess is ETL and Kop are scum reading me for play style and Mo is just sheeping.

I don't really feel like you are Scum here ftr.

[LicketyQuickety]

I don't support any votes on EO or MM. Both feel very town to me. I'm good with either LUV or Creature.

VOTE: LUV

My problem with E&O is that Ali usually obvtowns it up to kingdom come and they have hardly posted at all and that has me thinking it could be cuz he's Scum.

[LicketyQuickety]

What do you mean sleaze.

My vote on E and O is pure scum hunting.

I just want them to convince me that they are town.

Has to do with the way you make so many 180's on things.

[LicketyQuickety]

I don't support any votes on EO or MM. Both feel very town to me. I'm good with either LUV or Creature.

VOTE: LUV

Who do you Town read?

I'll add my hat into knowing why you are Scum reading Uzi.

Uzi got a lot of undue suspicion early (primarily by me) so this push on Uzi looks bad if Uzi flips town.

The push on Uzi looks like a technically sound play as Scum - pushing a likely-but-not-likely to get lynched.

[LicketyQuickety]

Ali usually obvtowns it up to kingdom come

But they are in a hydra which changes the dynamic significantly. Is that the only thing bothering you about the slot? Because on the whole, the ISO looks great to me - I see a lot of probing questions WITH follow-up, not just busy work, and I see critical thinking happening; responses show conclusions and thought process. Scum are more often than not unwilling or unable to provide that because not only does it attach accountability but it gives town things to pull apart, and since scum arguments are bullshit by necessity, most explanations by scum are relatively easy to dismantle if you really get into them. Which is why when I play scum, I often tell my partners to talk as little as possible without looking absent. The less you say, the less the town can use to build a case.

How is Uzi different here?

[LicketyQuickety]

What do you mean? We were speaking about E/O I thought?

My read on LUV is more peripheral than anything but nobody is listening to me about Creature.

Uzi has done pretty much the same things Ari has done this game, what's the difference between Uzi and Ari in terms of info they have given?

[LicketyQuickety]

and you didn't answer my question.

[LicketyQuickety]

What do you mean? We were speaking about E/O I thought?

My read on LUV is more peripheral than anything but nobody is listening to me about Creature.

Uzi has done pretty much the same things Ari has done this game

, what's the difference between Uzi and Ari in terms of info they have given?

I disagree with this statement. I don't feel that LUV is giving the same consideration to the game that E/O has. I feel more strongly about Creature, and I keep saying this, and you keep not acknowledging it, my read on LUV is peripheral to my read on Creature, but you don't want to lynch Creature and I don't have the motivation to ra-ra-rally a wagon in a game I'm not 100% familiar with pre-flip.

Based on what that Uzi hasn't given consideration to the game? I am trying to see what you are saying here and its not at all how I see how Uzi has played.

I am not the only one not willing to vote Creature, I think there are better options.

So your only two Scum reads are Uzi and Creature and you are Town reading who again?

[LicketyQuickety]

And I interrogate people, its how I scum hunt.

[LicketyQuickety]

I am trying to see what you are saying here

And I interrogate people, its how I scum hunt.

If you want to understand me, have a conversation. I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt and willing to work with you but not if you're not going to actually

have a conversation

. It's off-putting and makes me less likely to respond favorably and less likely to actually

want

to work with you.

You and I disagree about LUV's play. I've explained my thoughts on it. Me repeating myself isn't going to convince you or make it any different than when I said it the first time. I disagree with you about E/O. Unless you give me concrete evidence to the contrary, my conclusions about their posts remains the same.

Was hoping you would get more detailed so I could read you based off how developed the read was. Def was not expecting you to say the same thing you already did. If you think I was asking the same question, then LOL, I was not.

P.S. I happen to be very articulate so I can kinda see how you didn't get that initially.

[LicketyQuickety]

you are Town reading who again?

Are you actually asking me because you don't know? Because I've stated multiple times now that I'm strongly town-reading both hydrae to begin with.

K, so you have 4 reads: Hydras are Town and Uzi and Creature are Scum. Everyone else besides Anti is null.

[LicketyQuickety]

I am surprised more people don't go after players based on their stances before flips.

[LicketyQuickety]

Was hoping you would get more detailed so I could read you based off how developed the read was

None of my reads are very developed and I expect they wont really be until D2 to be honest. I haven't read much of the game and I'm relying on interaction to get a better feel for people, but I'm not getting it. You're the only one who has really talked to me, and the only thing you've talked to me about are what I think, which doesn't help me to actually generate thoughts about anything. I need information about other people.

By all means, feel free to ask questions, no one is stopping you.

[LicketyQuickety]

you are Town reading who again?

Are you actually asking me because you don't know? Because I've stated multiple times now that I'm strongly town-reading both hydrae to begin with.

K, so you have 4 reads: Hydras are Town and Uzi and Creature are Scum. Everyone else besides Anti is null.

Not really. Those are my strongest reads. I'm still trying to figure out the arguments between people.

So I'm just guessing the rest of your reads are just vague impressions based on one of your more developed reads bein Uzi...

[LicketyQuickety]

Motivation:

[LicketyQuickety]

no AM isoing

Its Kill Tepes!!!

[LicketyQuickety]

quick i need ANOTHER person to iso

ISO Creature.

[LicketyQuickety]

do me

Spoiler:

[LicketyQuickety]

This is not at all what I expect from Alisae's Town game. Not in the slightest.

VOTE: E&O