Mini Normal 2021: Game Over

[Tchill13]

VT claim could be laughed off as a joke but could also be a way to be ignored by investigatives. She HAS made a lot of noise but seems to have only gained negative attention from me.

Like i said earlier i don't see scum approaching d1 in that manner. I'm a big proponent of the fact not everyone plays scum the same way or the way you'd expect them to. Purely off of possible scum motivation, oath is a strong candidate for scum here. Lack of stances, nothing to look back on, appears to be active but isn't doing much in all honesty, SUPER early VT claim.

[Tchill13]

i agree.

I CAN'T town clear Gus for you. I can tell you he's town based on familiarity with the player. I've never seen him tunnel in a toxic manner as town. Now if he wants to claim he isn't who i think he is, fine whatever idc im just gonna ignore that. He has the right to make an alt i have a right to believe who his main is. He's town because of the noise. Why attract that attention?

There's no self preservation in his play

. Unlike Oath he has been loud with multiple reads and aggressive with multiple reads.

He has made 2 weird claims and he is REAL close to becoming policied because i've seen what his play is like from here on out and its not benefecial to town.

I REALLY, REALLY wanted to have a meaningful d1 but that doesn't seem to be the case.

[Tchill13]

I feel comfortable about towns chances if you and I are both town Yuurei. The game would be much easier if I could place you where I wanted as town but that comes with time and flips.

[Tchill13]

SELF PRESERVATION, staying in the middle of the pack as far as attention is concerned, stances you can manipulate to benefit you in the future, pushing LOGICAL lynches that you can't be blamed for when said lynch flips town. These are things you can find in most scum players.

[Tchill13]

never seen him tunnel in a toxic manner as scum sorry. I've played with the gus account a few times but im referring to the other account.

[Tchill13]

if im town why would i want you in the game oath? if you're wrong and im town how can i show you that? im not subtly pushing for your lynch. im asking where i benefit from being your teammate.

[Tchill13]

if im town why would i want you in the game oath? if you're wrong and im town how can i show you that? im not subtly pushing for your lynch. im asking where i benefit from being your teammate.

When I presented the issues surrounding your scumminess to me, you basically called it ridiculous. You've offered nothing but push back when I've mentioned your inconsistency, hypocricy, and misrepping nature. So I'm frankly tired of going over these things with you. You know I'm town. So IF you're town, you want me here simply because the slot I occupy is town. If you and Yuurei are town and there for means the town is in good hands, then my one little vote here against you means nothing. We lynch scum. I am not scum and you know that. You may be annoyed with me. Unhappy that I won't bother elsewhere right now, but that is basically it.

inconsistent because im sorting on limited info considering its d1. the misrep conversation is futile as you believe i've done that on purpose. I'd be willing to discuss the hypocricy.

your one "little vote" is a chance for a major contribution form a player but you refuse to contribute in a meaningful away while there are MULTIPLE scum members. That is the issue. I DO NOT KNOW YOU ARE TOWN BECAUSE YOUR PLAY SHOWS...

self preservation if the form of limited reads, a VT gambit, a lack of sorting (even a lack of town hunting), refusal to meet your SR in the middle. We can agree to disagree on the misreps. You SR'd me before the accusation of misreps. I'm not concerned with having consistent reads that follow my early d1 reads. I'd be a fool to think i was correct about ppl's alignments first guess. Now you can work with me and point out flaws in progression of my reads, thats more than welcome actually, but to just sit and point at one slot is useless. It's justa less toxic form of what Gus is doing atm.

If im town and yuurei is town i feel comfortable not because im so great and wonderful but because we are the only ppl showing consistent effort in sorting and evaluating what we can. If i wasnt paranoid about tw's slot I'D PROBABLY LOCK TOWN YUUREI. Either way he''s doing a great job as either alignment at the moment. idk his range. If i seen this from a player i was familiar with i'd probably lock town them based off play alone.

[Tchill13]

like seriously oath and gus don't seem town but they just seem not town. They don't seem like scum. if that makes sense.

I really would like to lynch ceejay as gus avoided that wagon and instead voted you yuurei, he did have no problem voting osuka though. That and a few other vote changes plus ceejays play/lurk slot makes me think he flips red.

[Tchill13]

oath how do you expect me to react here if im town?

[Tchill13]

town is supposed to be town enough to not be lynched. Scum care more about and prioritize being universally TR'd.

learned my lesson from just assuming ppl would understand i'll give you that. You're playing for pride at this point if you're town. Some post game congratulations that you nailed scum d1 but town just wouldn't listen. I am not scum. Your time and energy have been wasted this game due to the fact you can't expand to multiple, in depth, reads with substance.

You're going to push me until one of us flip i assume? How do i handle that as town? Even if i was a cop, investigated you, knew you were town how would i go about making your presence in this game beneficial to me and the rest of town? If i was scum would i try to reason with you or just ignore the annoying voice, NK you, then throw a little wifom in there? you'd be a low info nk. It'd raise questions about whether tchill was scum. That'd probably get lost in the shuffle because of wifom potential then town would move on.

THERE IS NO POINT IN ME WORKING WITH YOU AS SCUM HERE. THERE'S ALREADY ONE SLOT TUNNELING THIS GAME. PLEASE STOP. 2 tunnelers, a handful of lurkers... what a d1. YOU MADE THE VT CLAIM, YOU REFUSE TO SORT. you're much easier to lynch atm than I am I can promise you that. Town does not benefit from that though given i can see this coming from town as much as scum and i can not adequately read you.

[Tchill13]

oath how do you expect me to react here if im town?

answer this.

[Tchill13]

If town want to win they need to play. It's that simple.

[Tchill13]

oath how do you expect me to react here if im town?

answer this.

[Tchill13]

How many lynches could I have had by now? Plenty.

You're town. I'm done with this.

[Tchill13]

I really really hope your scum. Like I really hope your scum.

I've tried to work with you, tried to explain things and it's pretty clear who's more sensible here. It's pretty clear who's determined to think certain things and it's an unattractive way to play.

Lynch ceejay. Let's go.

[Tchill13]

Also lol at "You're town" to "I really hope you're scum." in 6 minutes.

That's my stance on you. For real.

[Tchill13]

Gus do you hard claim Mason?

[Tchill13]

Do you hard claim day cop? Is that legal in normals? before I react to that.

[Tchill13]

I’m supposed to believe that after this game - viewtopic.php?p=10160423#p10160423

You are ignorant to what is and isn’t allowed in normals?

No. This is fake ignorance imo.

Besides the fact I already called you scum for believing such a ridiculous fake claim, you should know that a 2 shot can never resolve both shots in the same day.

Yes I’m hard claiming mason
No I’m not a day cop

Today town should lynch yuri or you. Hopefully they come to their senses once they realize this is all an act by you.

Scum should lynch yuurei or me.

[Tchill13]

Gus if there's a freaking weak neighborizer allowed in normals I do not care to know what the other roles are as I disagree with that.

You want to call me scum for assuming someone wouldn't make illegal claims in normals? How about the guy making illegal claims?

That first illegal claim followed reads that were synonymous to mine. That was targeted at me.

[Tchill13]

"It's a joke bro just a joke claim" gtfo. You attack ppl for what is gus's rules that so and so would never do "blank" as town. You tunnel after that. So if you want to openly push a lynch on the two players that are actually sorting Go ahead.

The best part of this is both oath and gus could have been lynched by now but I've hard defended gus and oath. I've waffled on oath for obvious reasons but I've defended as much as I've pushed oath.

This is infuriating.

[Tchill13]

Idk what you’re taking about

You said you 2 shotted lalendra and yuurei.

Yuurei scum lalendra town.

These were my leans at the time you made that claim.

[Tchill13]

The best part of this is both oath and gus could have been lynched by now but I've hard defended gus and oath. I've waffled on oath for obvious reasons but I've defended as much as I've pushed oath.

This is infuriating.

Your mad cause you could have lynched oath or me (town mason)?

Why would you be mad that you could of lynched me but now I’m basically confirmed town?

im a little irritated that before you claim i hard defend you at a time a wagon could have taken off on you and you still assume im scum when this is easily the most effort i've put into sorting d1.

[Tchill13]

Also I have a sneaky suspicion that yuri is boon but can’t prove it.

he is almost certainly not

Are you?

You bet

no im boon.

[Tchill13]

Yuurei tw and Tommy would be my guess atm.

Tacos, mumble, lalendra, gus, oath, ofrhz. I'm fine with confdenctly calling these players town.

Guys. I’m 2 shot day cop. Yuri is scum. Lalendra is town. Lynch him.

Guys. I’m 2 shot day cop. Yuri is scum. Lalendra is town. Lynch him.

Where was this action performed and why?

For the sake of transparency I'd like to say something about play from your main account. I can't prove it's your main account therefore I doubt it would progress anything. If yuurie is town here and you're VT you will be black listed.

VOTE: yuurei

There goes my town read on you. You should know that 2 shot day cop where both shots can be used on the same day wouldn’t ever pass normal review. I appreciate the vote but you should know that was a joke.

Gus if there's a freaking weak neighborizer allowed in normals I do not care to know what the other roles are as I disagree with that.

You want to call me scum for assuming someone wouldn't make illegal claims in normals? How about the guy making illegal claims?

That first illegal claim followed reads that were synonymous to mine. That was targeted at me.

Idk what you’re taking about

You said you 2 shotted lalendra and yuurei.

Yuurei scum lalendra town.

These were my leans at the time you made that claim.

I’m lost as shit right now. I don’t understand the words that are coming out of your keyboard.

Sounds like you are mad you got caught by a joke claim

[Tchill13]

are you still lost?

[Tchill13]

if we lynch tommy, ceejay, osuka, ofrhz, mumble, taco we win.

if im wrong with my TR's im wrong about boris, oath.

these are my locked in TR's.

willing to policy Gus, oath over lynching anyone except ceejay.

if we absolutely refuse to lynch ceejay im pushing PL.

i hope ppl watching the game have gotten a kick out of it if gus and oath are town like i assume.

[Tchill13]

Boris you see what I'm getting at with the gus illegal claim right? I feel like it was directed at me regardless of reaction because I just posted a reads list similar to his results.

[Tchill13]

Ego? What the hell does this have to do with ego?

If I'm wrong here I'd assume that's just as entertaining. Arguing with scum but TR'ing them. That's gotta be fun to watch too.

I could have stopped at the 2nd "flavor". There's a reason you're push isn't picking up steam. It's obvious I'm sorting and not just pushing lynches that will go through or we could have had a lynch A LONG TIME AGO.

You and gus have lost credibility due to your thick headedness and unreasonable line of thinking. He gets a hard TR though.

I ask how I would go about helping you as town. You tell me you don't want to coach me on how to be towny.

I refuse to push your lynch early as I can see you being town here. Well that's just one of the 7 "flavors" that didn't go through.

I ask what I could do to benefit from you being town with me in this game. You declare your one vote isn't meaningful and I shouldn't be worried about it. That statement in itself means you've self declared to be actually useless to town until a tchill flip happens.

I bend over backwards to have a very detailed, complex, cluttered discussion with you and I get accused of mindfully misreping you.

So regarding you, nothing personal. Regarding your play. It's is utter horse shit if you're town. You can't KNOW I'm scum. If I was to flip town and you were still alive you'd be a likely lynch candidate because now it's proven that you spent your time pushing one town slot that's left your slot with minimal info to look back on. That time could have been spent pushing MULTIPLE people. Having PoE discussions about who's town.

You've argued that "you'd just be ignored" since they ignore you about me. That's an excuse to lazily continue to do the same thing (if you're town). There's a reason they've ignored you about me. Your push is terrible. It shows clear bias. It has tunnel tendencies. You've been awful at persuading ppl to vote me. That's half the game. Find scum, persuade the group to lynch scum. You're terrible at both because I'm town and you can't even get 3 votes on me.

It's not a cop out. I just wanted to play day 1 the right way damn it. Not this scummy BS that site meta allows. Two players have effectively ruined that opportunity for me this game and worn me down to agreeing to a policy lynch.

1 claimed VT early and tunneled me shortly after. 1 has made 2 illegal claims and painted me as scum because of my reaction towards said illegal claims.

I'm done cluttering the thread. I'll only respond to players not named gus and oath at this point. I've adequately made clear where each one of them are in the wrong and will address others on that topic but not those two. I've bent over backwards to help. Once gus understands what I'm getting at about him targeting me with his illegal claim I'm done with them.

[Tchill13]

You're robbvna. You can just go look at his games km not linking them.

Still no response to your illegal claims targeting me huh?

[Tchill13]

I said you were getting black listed if you were lying lol.

[Tchill13]

1. I don't particularly have a strong opinion on Tchill right now, it's possible to explain what he has been doing on a town pov to be honest
2. Ceejay might be scum for real here

3. Tchill wagon right now is starting to look like a counter wagon to Ceejay, being driven by Gustavo.

hmm, do you think this is scum motivated?

or what i'm really trying to ask here is that do you not believe gus's mason claim?

I won't believe it till another person confirms it then we have a Mason flip. That's just me though.

[Tchill13]

Day vigs are commonly joked about, faked.

[Tchill13]

You joked about an illegal claim with the intent of discrediting me due to the fact the "guilties were similar to the reads I had just posted.

I did not call for that Mason go claim today. I'm just stating when I'll believe you're town.

[Tchill13]

1st time I see a day cop joked about.

Now respond to the fact your guilties were similar to the reads I had just posted. Did you or did you not use your fake guilties based off my reads?

[Tchill13]

Yuurei tw and Tommy would be my guess atm.

Tacos, mumble, lalendra, gus, oath, ofrhz. I'm fine with confdenctly calling these players town.

Guys. I’m 2 shot day cop. Yuri is scum. Lalendra is town. Lynch him.

Guys. I’m 2 shot day cop. Yuri is scum. Lalendra is town. Lynch him.

Where was this action performed and why?

For the sake of transparency I'd like to say something about play from your main account. I can't prove it's your main account therefore I doubt it would progress anything. If yuurie is town here and you're VT you will be black listed.

VOTE: yuurei

There goes my town read on you. You should know that 2 shot day cop where both shots can be used on the same day wouldn’t ever pass normal review. I appreciate the vote but you should know that was a joke.

Gus if there's a freaking weak neighborizer allowed in normals I do not care to know what the other roles are as I disagree with that.

You want to call me scum for assuming someone wouldn't make illegal claims in normals? How about the guy making illegal claims?

That first illegal claim followed reads that were synonymous to mine. That was targeted at me.

Idk what you’re taking about

You said you 2 shotted lalendra and yuurei.

Yuurei scum lalendra town.

These were my leans at the time you made that claim.

I’m lost as shit right now. I don’t understand the words that are coming out of your keyboard.

Sounds like you are mad you got caught by a joke claim

[Tchill13]

EXPLAIN WHY THE GUILTIES ARE THE SAME AS MY READS GUS.

[Tchill13]

That's fine. Idc. I just wanted to show the joke was consistent with my reads. Done talking to gus as well now.

Yuurei I don't think I'm a counter wagon to ceejay because gus has been fos'ing me for a bit and oath has constantly pushed me.

[Tchill13]

And to be quite clear it's for my own health and to maintain a playable non cluttered thread for everyone else. I apologize for the clutter and annoyance I've provided up until this point.

[Tchill13]

Ceejays a good lynch. Replaced in. Really did nothing to clear up his slot. No firm backed up stances. No sorting.

I refuse to find scum in the active players just to do it. I don't see scum motivation in those that are playing for the most part.

Ceejay is a good flip due to the fact some ppl hopped on osuka after leaving Tommy but not ceejay.

Yuurei if your negative reads are only from my interactions with oath and gus then I'd beg you to notice that and reevaluate. If it's more than that I'd be happy to discuss.

[Tchill13]

mmmh...

I should go drink some tea...

I might replace out honestly...

Don't blame you. If you don't replace out I'm working with you primarily moving forward. Boris seems like an ideal player to work with also.

[Tchill13]

I think it's a personality thing. I don't like to be mean or openly antagonize. My "humor" is actually my way of calling someone out without being mean. I'd hope my play shows at least I try to be nice. There's a lot of toxic aggressive play here and I try to avoid that.

[Tchill13]

I avoid name calling.

[Tchill13]

Not everybody should ignore the guy. That's mean.

[Tchill13]

Trying to pocket hard or finding a little bit of comfort in the only reasonable voice in 3 active posters I'm playing with? You gotta wonder how you'd react if you were in my position. You knew you were town. For the first time ever on mafia you really don't know how to convince someone you're town. 2 ppl for that matter that are determined to SR you. Then there's another active player actually sorting. It's not pocketing at all. It's literally the fact you're the only person I can justifiably work with atm.

[Tchill13]

Well sorry for playing town so poorly. I'd like to blame it on things but that's just excuses.

I don't usually have good progressions early game. I usually don't worry about being consistent until d3. I work towards getting to a game solving state d3 then with flips and associations solve the game. I tried to do that without the "lynch to lynch" mentality of d1 and d2 this game.

[Tchill13]

why are oath and guerilla probably town from your pov ceejay?

tbh nothing happened to tommy thats AI. if your scum, your teamates are MIA... are you gonna risk defending your scum partner that is rando wagoned? I doubt it.

[Tchill13]

osuka would you rather lynch tommy or ceejay?

of oath, yuurei, me and guerilla's slot whos the scummiest and why?

I'd personally like an investigative to clear the masons n1 thats just me though. "tchill is scum because he wants to waste an investigation" i'd rather not be tricked by a scum fake claim.

[Tchill13]

ceejay im town for effort? not because i lock towned gus before his claim, tr'd lalendra before her claim, tr'd both guerilla and oath which you seem to agree with...

looks like a go with the flow agreeance than an actual read here.

[Tchill13]

Gus flips town here guys.

People need to grow up.

[Tchill13]

I'm just referring to lalendra. Play here so far lines up with play in last game. Eager town that reads too much into things.

OK play times over.

Guerrilla and oath could easily be TvT.

Scum had had to have posted already unless the scum team is the 3 I mentioned earlier which I doubt.

I'm hoping the worst is actually town here.

VOTE: tommy

My name is tchill, you killed my father, prepare to die.

IF THIS WAS A SIX PLAYER GAME SURE TWO PLAYER SCUM TEAMS ARE GOOD GUESSES BUT HALF THE PLAYER LIST HASN'T EVEN PLAYED YET.

PUMP THE BRAKES.

Gus flips town here guys.

People need to grow up.

yep. i've been looking for easy lynches the whole game

[Tchill13]

this is d1 with 4 active players. not d4 with 4 active players. there is no late game here. there is no consistency. we're 43 pages into a game that has a handful of lurkers and no flips. play with that in mind.

[Tchill13]

I already said I'm ignoring you.

[Tchill13]

Also I'm trying to lynch lurkers because I believe they're actually scum... I've given reason for that...

[Tchill13]

If we lynch ceejay, tacos, osuka we might have a game to actually play.

[Tchill13]

True. Thanks for the apology. Yes ik my reactions to jokes were weird. I understand the suspicion but I don't degree with the extent of it but I understand the basis.

If I'm scum here I'd have to be playing a pretty solid d1 with some MAJOR foot in mouth moments. I'd like to feel like I exercise caution a little more as scum.

Mumble plays well when he picks up activity. He lurks as scum. 80 percent of the time he lurks as town. I was pretty irritated one game when he lurked to a win simply because town let him.

Lurkers gotta be lynched. Simple as that. Specifically when it comes to this game the mod hasn't been very active, we can't find replacements and half the player list isn't playing.

I'm almost willing to create a town block of gus, oath, yuurei and me and just mow through the rest of the game.

[Tchill13]

Gus, lalendra, me, oath, yuurei.

I think we can agree at most there's one scum there unless you believe yuurei and I are together.

So why not just work towards getting it to this group? By the time that happens we should have AT LEAST 2 scum flips if not the whole team. If we haven't. We can look at yuurei/tchill as scum. Does anyone have any issues with what I'm proposing?

[Tchill13]

I highly doubt all 3 scum are in the group I just listed.

If we get down to that group without 2 scum flips the masons would be in question and yuurei/tchill would be in question.

If we get to that group with 2 scum flips I'm pretty sure I'd be a big target, gus and lalendra would be cleared. Oath, yuurei and I could be narrowed down by PoE, flip associations stuff like that.

[Tchill13]

my gosh stop possting such scummy things. do you two know what the flip will be? you're acting like it.

[Tchill13]

AAAAAAND we're just gonna let TChill line up lynches? Seriously at this point if TChill is scum we might as well call it a scum win.

If we're just gonna let oath play this way the whole game we might as well just ask the mod to force replace her.

[Tchill13]

Could you honestly imagine if everyone played the same way oath was rn?

[Tchill13]

I'm not saying it is I'm just going with the "might as well" flow you know? Might as well assume oath isn't gonna contribute at all to the game until I'm lynched. If that's the case why should I want oath in the game? Even if I do TR her? I've been down this road. No way does my game benefit from oath being in it. As town or as scum.

[Tchill13]

If ik someone is tunneling a player that's town yes I feel that way towards everyone that tunnels. In this case ik I'm town so that's the point.

If this guy flips town by all means grab a pick are and dig that tunnel with oath.

[Tchill13]

It's a game play issue. Tunneling is just a refusal to change perspective as much as it is a refusal to work with someone.

[Tchill13]

i have tried harder to work with oath than i have anyone i've ever played with. thats a fact.

oath what would you say about your play in the instance i flip town?

[Tchill13]

so... if im town is it my fault for playing town so terribly or your fault for not realizing it? or a mix? if so how much of a mix?

[Tchill13]

thats interesting most ppl tunneling give their target a lot of responsibility for the read...

also you say im only not lynched because of activity? thats the only reason im not the lynch today? interesting. i'd argue the opposite seeing how taco, mumble, osuka havent played much and haven't reached 3 votes. I could have done that. In fact it'd be more beneficial for me to do that as scum here. The game state even shows that.

[Tchill13]

Aren't you an alt gus?

[Tchill13]

Meta diving players gives alts a pretty big advantage... I'm joking I dont meta anyone. I only know play through familiarity of playing with them.

[Tchill13]

I'd like another reaction from oath though.

[Tchill13]

Well look for games I've been in with robbvna. That's the ones with the most tunneling I have to deal with.

[Tchill13]

Is it odd to not like tunneling?

[Tchill13]

That was a joke.

[Tchill13]

But gus's claims seemed like a joke right away right?

[Tchill13]

Just a question.

[Tchill13]

I'm not about to start a pissing contest.

Oath is just determined to view whatever I do or say in a negative light. Gus said I should quite mafia. 4 others aren't playing. Fun group.

[Tchill13]

[Tchill13]

yeah cj got lynched mumbles.

[Tchill13]

This twilight will probably last 4 days lol.

[Tchill13]

Besides I'm a bullet proof odd twilight 2 shot weak neopolitan cop. Who should I investigative?

[Tchill13]

Why you voting me?

[Tchill13]

By the way. I'm death tunneling oath. It's either me or oath this day phase and I'll be treating oath the same way she's treated me.

Oath is conf scum. Refuses to make multiple reads when there's multiple scum. Refuses to work with town. Refuses to reevaluate reads.

[Tchill13]

Oath has lied about the fact that she knows I misreped her intentionally (she can't read my mind).

Oath claimed VT page 1 limiting Scums options and providing a reason she's never NK'D.

Oath refuses to take multiple stances on any players and will just say "sorry guys lol my bad" once I flip town.

[Tchill13]

Oath refuses to help provide a cooperative atmosphere that would benefit town. Instead oath goes out of her way to make sure she's blindly a pushing a lynch that was never close to happening d1. Of course oath would love to scream for my lynch and never seen me lynched absolving her of any credibility.

Oath is scum.

If you do not vote me or oath this day phase you are scum claiming to the max and if town you're refusing to do what's best for town.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: oath

Nero why am I scum?

[Tchill13]

Naked vote.

Much conviction.

You want to regurgitate the BS being spewed already? That the road you want to go down?

[Tchill13]

To be fair, TChill has to try and lynch me. Because I've known he's scum since the beginning - he pushed for ceej lynch and now Gustavo is dead.

It really is his only option.

VOTE: TChill

Can you guys believe me today? Or what's up?

WILL YOU SELF VOTE IF I FLIP TOWN?

[Tchill13]

Btw Lalendra is conftown

makes sense this is the only other read you're capable of making.

[Tchill13]

like everything tchill posts makes my skin crawl.

why am i scum?

[Tchill13]

To be fair, TChill has to try and lynch me. Because I've known he's scum since the beginning - he pushed for ceej lynch and now Gustavo is dead.

It really is his only option.

VOTE: TChill

Can you guys believe me today? Or what's up?

WILL YOU SELF VOTE IF I FLIP TOWN?

I've literally said countless times I will die on this hill with you if you're town.

I will grovel at your feet and beg for forgiveness.

You're not town though so I am not at all worried.

I won't listen. I won't care. You're scum and you gotta do what you gotta do. This is the most disgusting scum game i've ever seen that does nothing except birth toxicity which is what scum would want.

you have to be scum.

[Tchill13]

like everything tchill posts makes my skin crawl.

why am i scum?

you can't answer it because im not scum.

[Tchill13]

oath is terrible obv scum. Terrible scum gambit page 1. so stupid. then making the easiest play possible as scum tunneling someone who won't get lynched. Stupid stupid scum play.

misreps, gut, and a lotta BS is her scum case. nothing solid. nothing that makes any sense. this isn't stupid scum it's lazy scum. Ignorant scum.

[Tchill13]

Hey Tchill, are you a big game of thrones fan? What did you think of the last season?

Also, mini normals have 3 scum in a 12 player setup right? I haven't played on this site in a while and don't remember the meta of these setups, but I remember it tended to be light on power roles. Are we assuming that if there's 2 masons that there's nothing else on the town's side and Lalendra is definitely dead tonight? So basically if we mess up today we are at mylo thereafter?

Just trying to get back in the swing of things. I've been playing on a site that goes a lot heavier on power roles so trying to remember the general patterns of this site.

I LOVE GoT tyrrion is my favorite fictional character ever.

i apologize in advance for what you're aboutt o see and i ask that you don't judge me on our first impression. Like seriosuly, im so sorry.

this site has tried to give town more PR's due to town being terrible here recently. so there's more than the masons for sure for town.

[Tchill13]

oath is terrible obv scum. Terrible scum gambit page 1. so stupid. then making the easiest play possible as scum tunneling someone who won't get lynched. Stupid stupid scum play.

misreps, gut, and a lotta BS is her scum case. nothing solid. nothing that makes any sense. this isn't stupid scum it's lazy scum. Ignorant scum.

Speaking of toxic

Ouch.

this isn't toxic? im town i can't be toxic. I'm tunneling i get a free pass for my behavior. This isn't a plea. You're scum. No emotion.

I've got such a better, solidified case against you than you do me.

[Tchill13]

Then why did you ask?

TChill this emotional plea is weak. OMG Oath so toxic when all I've done is be flirty with you and let you know it's not personal. You're literally mad at me because I didn't want to lynch anyone but you because I have a scumread on you. Do you realize how ridiculous that is compared to you lynching town and then Gustavo turning up dead. If you were town and your slot occupied by another player you wouldn't let it fly. I honestly think you would have had a better shot killing me last night, but I think you get off on this power thing and you like playing with me. It's okay I already told you we can get married after you're lynched.

i get off on lynching scum. You're scum. you should be lynched with fire. I didn't lynch town by myself i was "one measly vote" like you characterized yourself about voting me d1.

You're scum. You're the lynch. You claimed VT page 1. Thats anti town. Town have no reason to do that. Scum do. You're scum.

[Tchill13]

Hey Tchill, are you a big game of thrones fan? What did you think of the last season?

Also, mini normals have 3 scum in a 12 player setup right? I haven't played on this site in a while and don't remember the meta of these setups, but I remember it tended to be light on power roles. Are we assuming that if there's 2 masons that there's nothing else on the town's side and Lalendra is definitely dead tonight? So basically if we mess up today we are at mylo thereafter?

Just trying to get back in the swing of things. I've been playing on a site that goes a lot heavier on power roles so trying to remember the general patterns of this site.

Have you read the game? Please go do that and keep the fluff posting to a minimum as people need to not get behind.

Do you have a read on TChill? Or anyone else for that matter?

how dare you? can't ppl have fun?

oath has told multiple ppl to replace out and now keeps ppl from enjoying the game with lighthearted convo. He has never met me.

That goes hand in hand with creating a toxic state.

Dictator oath is scum.

[Tchill13]

like everything tchill posts makes my skin crawl.

why am i scum?

b/c u rolled scum. duh

like everything tchill posts makes my skin crawl.

why am i scum?

you can't answer it because im not scum.

I mean, even if I was scum (as you kinda imply here) you don't think I could make a false case on you? And if you think I'm just mistaken town then I'm not sure why you'd think I couldn't case u/have reasons to vote. Like this half-baked reactionary stuff only makes me think you are scum.

FTR, I think his buddy (or buddies, since it used to be standard 3 scum but it might be 2 now or did it go back to 3?) is in Crazy, Osuka and TW

make a false case on me then. You can't.

[Tchill13]

oath is terrible obv scum. Terrible scum gambit page 1. so stupid. then making the easiest play possible as scum tunneling someone who won't get lynched. Stupid stupid scum play.

misreps, gut, and a lotta BS is her scum case. nothing solid. nothing that makes any sense. this isn't stupid scum it's lazy scum. Ignorant scum.

Speaking of toxic

Ouch.

this isn't toxic? im town i can't be toxic. I'm tunneling i get a free pass for my behavior. This isn't a plea. You're scum. No emotion.

I've got such a better, solidified case against you than you do me.

Toxic is toxic regardless of alignment. You are name calling for no reason. Your case is based on the fact that I tunnelled you which is NAI and you've now decided to tunnel me sooooo...is that a scumclaim? Not to mention you read me as town yesterday. Gustavo's flip made you think I'm confirmed scum now? Please walk me through how the only person listening to me AT ALL should have died? Please tell me how Gustavo town and Ceej town equal Oath scum?

TChill your entire case is OMGUS because you KNOW it's me or you today. It'll be you eventually though because I'm flipping green and they'll see you so I don't know how far you think you can play this. Neither of us is making it to end game

not name calling. im describing your play.

the gus nk is obvious wifom.

my case isn't you tunneled me i have facts that do not involve me that prove your scum. d1 vt claim, refusal to make multiple reads, refusal to work with others. none of that involves me.

i was wrong yesterday. You're scum. You tricked me one day. good job.

[Tchill13]

how is this OMGUS? you're scum. I was wrong plain and simple. I'm not right all the time.

if i was you would have been lynched d1.

[Tchill13]

the absence of a case=//=your alignment and it's laughable that you think that.

i think you're full of it and you can't give me reasons im scum.

you'd rather argue about justifying not having a reason than giving a reason.

[Tchill13]

hey tchill, I'll vote oath tomorrow if you flip town. deal?

nope. Vote her today.

[Tchill13]

town don't try to get themself lynched. You're trying to get town to do that.

oath is scum. Oath is jealous ppl listened to me d1 and not her.

oath keeps saying i called her a name and i continue to describe her play. She keeps dictating ppl can't have fun.

[Tchill13]

slanderous in emotionality? i don't understand?

stop saying im name calling. If you cant handle ppl talking about how poor your scum play has been replace out.

[Tchill13]

scum carries a negative connotation. Oath is scum.

oath carries negative connotation. pretty simple to me.

[Tchill13]

i think you're full of it and you can't give me reasons im scum.

whats my alignment?

you said i was scum first. You took a position on me i haven't taken one on you.

stop deflecting. Why am i scum? You can't say because im not scum.

[Tchill13]

Hey Tchill, are you a big game of thrones fan? What did you think of the last season?

Also, mini normals have 3 scum in a 12 player setup right? I haven't played on this site in a while and don't remember the meta of these setups, but I remember it tended to be light on power roles. Are we assuming that if there's 2 masons that there's nothing else on the town's side and Lalendra is definitely dead tonight? So basically if we mess up today we are at mylo thereafter?

Just trying to get back in the swing of things. I've been playing on a site that goes a lot heavier on power roles so trying to remember the general patterns of this site.

Have you read the game? Please go do that and keep the fluff posting to a minimum as people need to not get behind.

Do you have a read on TChill? Or anyone else for that matter?

how dare you? can't ppl have fun?

oath has told multiple ppl to replace out and now keeps ppl from enjoying the game with lighthearted convo. He has never met me.

That goes hand in hand with creating a toxic state.

Dictator oath is scum.

Dictator Oath- the one who people listen to? Oops nope, das YOU
Dictator Oath- the one who leads the lynches? Oops nah, YOU AGAIN FAM
Dictator Oath- Calling people names and being mean as scum? OOOOOOOOOOUUUUUPS - not. me.

We'll have fun when you're gone.

I really hope you all notice that the tunnelling he's doing it specifically slanderous in emotionality and not fact to create an atmosphere where my name carries a negative connotation.

It would be brilliant if it were such a 180 from yesterday when he decided I was town and chose to ignore me.

Yeah TChill you wanna offer yourself up for the lynch? Cuz I'll double down on that bet. One of us is scum and it's not me

.

wait a sec if i flip town you'll self vote?

[Tchill13]

OK. I won't agree to that. I'm town.

The fact that you're OK with lynching yourself means you're scum.

[Tchill13]

Because scum want to look like they don't show survival tendencies. You'll scream you're OK with being lynched until the hammer.

[Tchill13]

I don't understand? Don't want to be a liability for town in endgame because of our back and forth? Where did you think this would lead after d1? In what world do you not become an endgame liability after that?

You're scum. Refusing to sort, claiming in anti town manners and refusing to work with scum IS AI.

IT MEANS YOU'RE SCUM. I DID NONE OF THAT.

[Tchill13]

I want everyone to weigh in on my proposal- I'm dead serious. I want TChill gone because we'll never win if you guys aren't interested in lynching him. He's scum, it's obvious.

IF I WAS SCUM IT'S NOT OBVIOUS. YOU COULDN'T EVEN GET THREE VOTES ON ME DAY 1.

You're full of it. You have been the whole game.

[Tchill13]

I don't understand? Don't want to be a liability for town in endgame because of our back and forth? Where did you think this would lead after d1? In what world do you not become an endgame liability after that?

You're scum. Refusing to sort, claiming in anti town manners and refusing to work with scum IS AI.

IT MEANS YOU'RE SCUM. I DID NONE OF THAT.

*town

[Tchill13]

I want everyone to weigh in on my proposal- I'm dead serious. I want TChill gone because we'll never win if you guys aren't interested in lynching him. He's scum, it's obvious.

Correction. You want everyone to buy into the fact you're not about self preservation and to lynch me this day phase.

Town being not interested in lynching me is the best thing that can happen to town.

[Tchill13]

I doubt I can get a tchill lynch tomorrow by myself but I'd begrudgingly agree to this plan of attack if we just can't get tchill lynched today.

Where's my case? Are you just gonna deflect all game?

You said you could come up with a fake case. I haven't even seen that yet.

[Tchill13]

I don't understand? Don't want to be a liability for town in endgame because of our back and forth? Where did you think this would lead after d1? In what world do you not become an endgame liability after that?

You're scum. Refusing to sort, claiming in anti town manners and refusing to work with scum IS AI.

IT MEANS YOU'RE SCUM. I DID NONE OF THAT.

I didn't refuse to sort- I take notes on all my games. I didn't share them in thread because you are the scum that needs to go. You are most active scum. You are the most vocal scum. You are the hardest scum lynch because of that and you need to be gone from this game so the rest of the town can sort without you fogging up the works.

I knew I was always an endgame liability. The weird thing is you not acknowledging that you are too. If you were town you would want this cleared up one way or another. You won't even agree that me flipping town should result in your lynch,.

No it shouldn't. I'M TOWN. YOU'RE SCUM. I will never lynch a townie ik is town. I KNOW I'M TOWN.

You're scum. I'm the most vocal TOWN. I'm the most active TOWN. Scum want me gone but had to kill the masons.

[Tchill13]

I want everyone to weigh in on my proposal- I'm dead serious. I want TChill gone because we'll never win if you guys aren't interested in lynching him. He's scum, it's obvious.

IF I WAS SCUM IT'S NOT OBVIOUS. YOU COULDN'T EVEN GET THREE VOTES ON ME DAY 1.

You're full of it. You have been the whole game.

Oath thinks you are super-obvious scum. Just b/c others don't agree doesn't mean her POV is incorrect.

These are the reactionary ravings of flailing scum that's desperately trying to throw things against the wall and hope they stick.

You caught me. I'm basic af scum... Such an ignorant read Nero Cain. So lazy....

Just because others don't agree doesn't mean I AM scum. Such a weak case. I thought you'd do better than that garbage when you said you could make a fake case.

[Tchill13]

Oath is scum. Oath is scum. She keeps pushing she doesn't care about her survival. She keeps giving reasons why she doesn't. That's what she want everyone to see first and foremost. She even pointed out scum care about survival.

She is scum and she knows exactly what she's doing. She's scum that claimed VT on day 1 to avoid any night actions on her and to explain why she was never NK'D.

[Tchill13]

I don't want to have anything to do with scum.

Oath is scum.

[Tchill13]

I can make cases on cases but blah blah blah-nero Cain 2018

[Tchill13]

Why do I have to be lynched first? I have a better, unbiased, case on oath today than oath on me d1. She was clearly biased in her push anyway. I'm not biased. She is.

[Tchill13]

Nero I'm not offended. I'm not a child. I hardly ever get offended.

Why am I scum? I'm scum because I'm offended I was called scum? You just said both alignments get offended at being called scum so that should be NAI.

I'd say that's another weak case but your case is simply missing. It's not there.

[Tchill13]

how can i be biased? I sorted multiple ppl. I took notes that I shared with town in hopes town would be in a bteer position. I did not withhold info in the form of reads and notes for myself only, I shared in hopes it would help town.

Oath refuses to share her thoughts, refuses to sort, expects us to believe she's a genius that caught scum her first try without revealing her thoughts on anyone else, expects us to believe there's no reason for scum to claim vt pg 1 (there clearly is). She stated she knew she would be a liability endgame by starting her tunnel, which shows she's not willing to work with town.

She's biased in the sense she hasn't looked at the other players. I've looked at everyone i'm capable of. Had discussions about them.

i am not biased here.

[Tchill13]

That's some really bad discrediting. So Oath didn't have a guilty on tchill d1 she (and I) can still scum read his scummy play.

why am i scum? because im scummy?

[Tchill13]

mumble has a bit of a lurker meta. He lurked to a win against me once im still irritated about.

I'd love to see him lynched, right after oath.

[Tchill13]

whats my motivation as town to keep oath in the game if i believe she's town?

I have much more to lose as town if i never lynch her and she's scum opposed to lynching her and she's town. I can work with players that will work with me. I can justify my actions here.

Oath can't, as either alignment.

[Tchill13]

Ceejay has been scummier than Tchill,

Ceejay has barely posted. His actions don’t make sense from scum which I’ve explained already.


Tchill’s actions don’t make sense as town. You’ve been giving him excuses all game. It’s very noteworthy that’s for sure.

tchill's actions make sense as both scum and town and that's why i cant sort him. half his posts are towny and the other half reeks of scum so I really don't know what's going on there

which half is scum?

[Tchill13]

i cant sort tchill, but his flip would yield good associatives as well (gus, yuurei, oath)

so far advocates for my lynches are... a tunneler, someone who states they can make a case but has yet to provide one, an associative flip, and lalendra.

I'm better than flailing scum. This is an insult to my scum game if you believe im scum.

[Tchill13]

what are his "town" posts?

where's my case?

[Tchill13]

From the perspective of pure statistics, though, I maintain that we are more likely to hit mafia outside the tchill/oath duo than we are inside it.

I mean sure but that's just ignoring content and sidelining.

what are his "town" posts?

where's my case?

I just like to watch you sweat.

i'm accusing you of the ignoring content and sidelining also. Provide a case. Stop sidelining.

[Tchill13]

whats my motivation as town to keep oath in the game if i believe she's town?

I have much more to lose as town if i never lynch her and she's scum opposed to lynching her and she's town. I can work with players that will work with me. I can justify my actions here.

Oath can't, as either alignment.

in a sentence can you try to convince me why she's scum for a reason other than your pushes on each other

she claimed vt page 1 which provides reason for scum not to nk her and for PR's not to investigate her.

she's openly admitted to taking notes and refusing to give stances on multiple players.

She's made one push so there's limited info to judge her on in later day phases.

not one mention of "shes pushing me" there.

[Tchill13]

mumble has a bit of a lurker meta. He lurked to a win against me once im still irritated about.

I'd love to see him lynched, right after oath.

Compared to osuka's self-vote and whatever is going on with taco, why of the three lurkiest lurkers (iirc) do you prefer Mumble?

they'd all be lynched if i had it my way. In fact i said if we lynch all the lurkers town probably wins and made multiple statements saying town will find scum regardless of the fact scum are actually posting or not. As in town are determined to see scum no matter who are participating.

[Tchill13]

what are his "town" posts?

sorry completely missed this until it was quoted

this page and the one before it have been pretty towny except for maybe one or two in the last page

I can't believe death tunneling is considered town. This is infuriating how ppl perceive ultra terrible play.

[Tchill13]

whats my motivation as town to keep oath in the game if i believe she's town?

I have much more to lose as town if i never lynch her and she's scum opposed to lynching her and she's town. I can work with players that will work with me. I can justify my actions here.

Oath can't, as either alignment.

I have no clue what this is. She's death tunneling you and you have to get her lynched/killed. "If I'm scum why didn't I kill her last night?!" sure, its WIFOM but getting your biggest opponent nightkilled possibly brings heat on you. You don't believe she's town so...

I never said that about not killing her last night? why are you making arguments for me that you can easily discredit?

Why do i have to get her lynched or killed if she's death tunneling me and i'm town?

[Tchill13]

whats my motivation as town to keep oath in the game if i believe she's town?

I have much more to lose as town if i never lynch her and she's scum opposed to lynching her and she's town. I can work with players that will work with me. I can justify my actions here.

Oath can't, as either alignment.

I have no clue what this is. She's death tunneling you and you have to get her lynched/killed. "If I'm scum why didn't I kill her last night?!" sure, its WIFOM but getting your biggest opponent nightkilled possibly brings heat on you. You don't believe she's town so...

I never said that about not killing her last night? why are you making arguments for me that you can easily discredit?

Why do i have to get her lynched or killed if she's death tunneling me and i'm town?

but what if you aren't town?

why ain't I? I'm scum because i could have rolled scum? What if you're not town.

weak play nero weak play.

[Tchill13]

what are his "town" posts?

sorry completely missed this until it was quoted

this page and the one before it have been pretty towny except for maybe one or two in the last page

I can't believe death tunneling is considered town. This is infuriating how ppl perceive ultra terrible play.

i never said it was, i just said it wasn't scummy. tunneling is nai behavior if you're looking at it in a bubble

thats pathetic that you're correct. Tunneling should be met with a lynch every time.

[Tchill13]

if she refuses to give stances she is refusing to take stances she could be pushed on in later day phases. THATS SURVIVALISTIC. It also goes hand in hand with not helping town. She could actually give good reads and ppl could sort her more easily and she could proclaim her town status with her play through reads and votes. she refuses to do so.

[Tchill13]

oh nero you've mistaken yourself

this isn't the save tchill movement, this is the stop shit pushes movement

if you're confusing the two so easily that might say something about your push

Isn't attempting to discredit a case (that I haven't even posted!) one in the same?

cant discredit something that doesn't exist.

[Tchill13]

they'd all be lynched if i had it my way. In fact i said if we lynch all the lurkers town probably wins and made multiple statements saying town will find scum regardless of the fact scum are actually posting or not. As in town are determined to see scum no matter who are participating.

You don't see any significant differences among those three slots?

mumble actually looks scummy through the fluff. Tacos seems to line up with his town meta. Osuka could be scum based on post before picking up activity.

i'm assuming you've seen something.

[Tchill13]

whats my motivation as town to keep oath in the game if i believe she's town?

I have much more to lose as town if i never lynch her and she's scum opposed to lynching her and she's town. I can work with players that will work with me. I can justify my actions here.

Oath can't, as either alignment.

I have no clue what this is. She's death tunneling you and you have to get her lynched/killed. "If I'm scum why didn't I kill her last night?!" sure, its WIFOM but getting your biggest opponent nightkilled possibly brings heat on you. You don't believe she's town so...

I never said that about not killing her last night? why are you making arguments for me that you can easily discredit?

Why do i have to get her lynched or killed if she's death tunneling me and i'm town?

if nero can't answer this question someone that can answer should.

[Tchill13]

what are his "town" posts?

sorry completely missed this until it was quoted

this page and the one before it have been pretty towny except for maybe one or two in the last page

I can't believe death tunneling is considered town. This is infuriating how ppl perceive ultra terrible play.

i never said it was, i just said it wasn't scummy. tunneling is nai behavior if you're looking at it in a bubble

thats pathetic that you're correct. Tunneling should be met with a lynch every time.

that's objectively not true

there are legitimate reasons for you to tunnel someone (e.g. guilty result in a situation where you don't want to claim)

how many times have you seen a tunnel result in a justified way? a lot less times than you've seen a tunnel because of a read. i can promise you that.

It's objectively true. You just listed one reason which is the only reason.

[Tchill13]

if she refuses to give stances she is refusing to take stances she could be pushed on in later day phases. THATS SURVIVALISTIC. It also goes hand in hand with not helping town. She could actually give good reads and ppl could sort her more easily and she could proclaim her town status with her play through reads and votes. she refuses to do so.

you have a good point in that she's town she probably wants to be sorted, but i think you're mistaking antitown for scummy

explain to me whats anti town from her opposed to scum motivation.

[Tchill13]

thank you for restating why i gave her a town read d1 and actually still believe she's more likely to be town here than scum.

[Tchill13]

i think its probably more likely that it is tvt than isnt.

[Tchill13]

because if so that's a big shift from multiple "YOU'RE SCUM" in all caps

whos asking? someone i can work with or someone i have to get on their level to talk to?

[Tchill13]

You're trying to play. You seemed to be sorting. So to you i will ask actual questions.

What benefit do i have from keeping oath in the game if im town and i think she's town?

there is a chance she can be scum. I have a lot more to lose if i write her off as town than if i just go ahead and lynch her and she flips scum right? Why should i take that risk?

Answer both please.

[Tchill13]

I mean its a pretty pointed question and it doesn't seem to have much relevance. You each think each other are scum. This whole "why would I do this as town?" is just you trying to enforce the idea that you the only reason that you are tunneling her is b/c you are town that just thinks she's scum while asking us to ignore that a scum you would want her dead just as much (and even more) as scum. The next question from you will be "y didn't I nk her?!?" And that's just WIFOM, of course.

apparently now you think she's town? This needs to die.

why are you putting questions in my mouth i haven't asked?

Tell me why as town i would want to keep her alive if i thought she was town?

[Tchill13]

What benefit do i have from keeping oath in the game if im town and i think she's town?

there is a chance she can be scum. I have a lot more to lose if i write her off as town than if i just go ahead and lynch her and she flips scum right? Why should i take that risk?

Answer both please.

im gonna keep asking until i get multiple answers from multiple ppl. If you want to push me answer this. Then we can talk.

as far as im concerned wanting her lynched is NAI until someone can give me answers.

[Tchill13]

You're trying to play. You seemed to be sorting. So to you i will ask actual questions.

What benefit do i have from keeping oath in the game if im town and i think she's town?

there is a chance she can be scum. I have a lot more to lose if i write her off as town than if i just go ahead and lynch her and she flips scum right? Why should i take that risk?

Answer both please.

if you keep her (assuming you think shes T), you get to lynch someone you think will flip red. if that's not enough incentive, then i dont know what is

you only have "a lot to lose" if the two of you keep this up until mylo or something, because that's the point where town actually needs to have their shit together

you'd take that risk the same you would with any other player: if you think they're more likely town than they're scum, you shouldn't lynch the slot based on your thoughts of how the game is laid out. every time, unless you have some way to confirm a slot's alignment, youre taking a risk and with her its no different

ok why would i risk lynching a slot the same way i would with any other player when other players have not said "im lynching tchill and my one measly vote can be ignored until then"

other players will help me, other players will sort, and i believe every slot has a chance to flip red unless conf towned, oath isn't conf towned.

[Tchill13]

What benefit do i have from keeping oath in the game if im town and i think she's town?

You are (or were) trying to lynch her! That pretty much invalidates your question. Also a town you has no ability to get rid of her (well aside from like a vig) Asking pointless questions isn't being helpful or making me not want to watch u swing.

its not pointless YOU CANT ANSWER IT. YOU CANT DIFFERENTIATE WHY SEPERATE ALIGNMENTS WOULD WANT THAT. ITS NAI.

be the better man. answer a question that to you has no vailidation. you can't answer it.

[Tchill13]

Tchill was scumreading Oath and now he's apparently not. I think he's trying to argue that he has to be town b/c he's town reading Oath or something. I'm not really sure. FMPOV, he tried to get Oath lynched and when he couldn't he changed his tune.

Don't replace out Serg. Help me lynch tchill.

did i move my vote? i missed that.

answer my question as to why a town tchill would want her in the game if i believed she was town.

provide a case.

[Tchill13]

nero doesn't even know what im doing lmao but he knows im scum.

no case, no anser, but he knows im scum...

[Tchill13]

What benefit do i have from keeping oath in the game if im town and i think she's town?

You are (or were) trying to lynch her! That pretty much invalidates your question. Also a town you has no ability to get rid of her (well aside from like a vig) Asking pointless questions isn't being helpful or making me not want to watch u swing.

its not pointless YOU CANT ANSWER IT. YOU CANT DIFFERENTIATE WHY SEPERATE ALIGNMENTS WOULD WANT THAT. ITS NAI.

be the better man. answer a question that to you has no vailidation. you can't answer it.

but see, that's not even what happened in the thread, Your question is invalid.

what do you mean thats not what happened?

im town, im death tunneling oath. In what way is it different from me doing it if i think shes scum and me doing it if i think shes town? If i think shes town does that make me scum?

[Tchill13]

Tchill was scumreading Oath and now he's apparently not. I think he's trying to argue that he has to be town b/c he's town reading Oath or something. I'm not really sure. FMPOV, he tried to get Oath lynched and when he couldn't he changed his tune.

Don't replace out Serg. Help me lynch tchill.

did i move my vote? i missed that.

answer my question as to why a town tchill would want her in the game if i believed she was town.

provide a case.

youd want her in the game if you were t and thought she was town too for the very same reason you'd want any other bad town versus a chance at lynching scum

if thats not obvious then i dont know what to tell you

whats the advantage of being in lylo with bad town i can't work with? aren't they more useful to scum at that point if im town?

[Tchill13]

Tchill was scumreading Oath and now he's apparently not. I think he's trying to argue that he has to be town b/c he's town reading Oath or something. I'm not really sure. FMPOV, he tried to get Oath lynched and when he couldn't he changed his tune.

Don't replace out Serg. Help me lynch tchill.

did i move my vote? i missed that.

answer my question as to why a town tchill would want her in the game if i believed she was town.

provide a case.

youd want her in the game if you were t and thought she was town too for the very same reason you'd want any other bad town versus a chance at lynching scum

if thats not obvious then i dont know what to tell you

whats the advantage of being in lylo with bad town i can't work with? aren't they more useful to scum at that point if im town?

if you replace one of the town slots with a scum role then you're not in lylo anymore, you already lost the game

thats not my question. You cant turn a town into a scum. answer my question please. im in lylo. Oath is there with me. she wont work with me. She has tunneled me all game. I think shes town.

Now why did let this happen. Where do i benefit from this?

[Tchill13]

Scum win by manipulating the game. A bad town is as good as a day pr for scum. Just another tool for scum to use. It is against my wincon to not do everything i can to put town in the best position to win.

there's a reason nobody can answer my question because ppl REFUSE to treat bad play as they should on this site.

As town Why would i want to be in lylo with oath if i feel shes town? its a simple question nobody can answer.

[Tchill13]

So I'm still at work so I can't really do a fancy post with lots of quotes and stuff, but tchill still strikes me as null. The scummiest thing I think I've seen is Mumble's unvote on Gus yesterday. I see literally nothing townish at all in anything Mumble has done and the unvote seems way scummier than tchill and oath tunneling each other.

Vote Mumble

Tacos, osuka, tchill, what do you think about unvotes generally, and Mumble's in particular? Do you feel like town in that situation has any good reason to unvote Gus without pursuing a new lead or pushing in a new direction? Do you see anything else in Mumble that makes him seem like he isn't the scummiest player here? Because all I see is active lurking, terrible votes, and defensive play.

youll have to pardon me because i actually havent read the whole thread but do you mean real world yesterday or game d1?

game d1 osuka.

[Tchill13]

Scum win by manipulating the game. A bad town is as good as a day pr for scum. Just another tool for scum to use. It is against my wincon to not do everything i can to put town in the best position to win.

there's a reason nobody can answer my question because ppl REFUSE to treat bad play as they should on this site.

As town Why would i want to be in lylo with oath if i feel shes town? its a simple question nobody can answer.

lets say im in lylo with oath. we're both town. 3 scum me oath and 2 townies. oath votes me. 3 scum vote me. scum win.

i have no reason to believe it would play out differently as oath as assured me thats what wpuld happen

why would i put myself in that situation as town?

[Tchill13]

Scum win by manipulating the game. A bad town is as good as a day pr for scum. Just another tool for scum to use. It is against my wincon to not do everything i can to put town in the best position to win.

there's a reason nobody can answer my question because ppl REFUSE to treat bad play as they should on this site.

As town Why would i want to be in lylo with oath if i feel shes town? its a simple question nobody can answer.

lets say im in lylo with oath. we're both town. 3 scum me oath and 2 townies. oath votes me. 3 scum vote me. scum win.

i have no reason to believe it would play out differently as oath as assured me thats what wpuld happen

why would i put myself in that situation as town?

because if that's the best you can get, you should take it. if it's 2v2 you've already lost anyway

"because if thats the best you can get" BOOM. THERE IT IS. THATS THE FLAW.

why is that the best i can get? we're on d2. I should be working to avoid a situation with oath in lylo right? Do i have more control of never reaching lylo or never reaching lylo with oath? Now which one shoul i take action to avoid?

i dont play to be in sitautions that are "the best i can get"

I play to put town in the "best situation possible" I actively work towards that days 1 2 and 3. Any competent mafia townies should be able to lynch scum with all that info and limited amount of bad townie baggage. Why shouldn't i work towards that? should i risk going all in on scum on days with limited info or should i work towards an atmosphere where its easy to lynch scum while lynching ppl that can actually still flip scum? I'll never lynch a conftown to get there. Oath isn't conftown.

You avoid "best you can get" by putting yourself in the best situation possible. Now again.

what do i beneft from having oath in this game if im town? i don't. i do not benefit at all even if she's town. She's not conftown. My push on her is justified GIVEN, this is the important part, GIVEN her play this game.

[Tchill13]

Like there's a shit ton of scum motivation in being useless with your vote and trying to lynch "bad town". Who is scum, tchill?

I said case me not oath. Did you read d1?

[Tchill13]

all I'm asking for is 2 or 3 names. Y is that so hard?

you sound like me day 1 addressing oath. Go back and read please.

[Tchill13]

ins not 2v2 its 4v3 i outlined the situation.

[Tchill13]

You sound just like me pushing oath day 1. Ignorance is bliss and lazy townies are Scums best friend. Hope you're scum or your just as bad as oath here.

[Tchill13]

naw, i think I'll just lynch you instead.

And the ppl that have actually kept up with the game knows how ignorant that looks. At least gus does lol. Especially given the fact gus knows I'm town now.

[Tchill13]

Nero you've never answered a hypothetical?

[Tchill13]

Just answer the question. Even if you don't think it applies. You've spent more time not answering the question than it would have taken to answer it.

[Tchill13]

Why would ever town? My push is NAI

[Tchill13]

Bad town? I'm sorry is oath conf town? I don't believe so. Looks like there's at least a decent chance she's scum here.

I named a SR. It's oath. Lynch oath. She's scum.

It doesn't make sense for me to put town in the best position for town to win? That's quite odd. Makes a lot of sense to me.

[Tchill13]

mumble.

[Tchill13]

please read the game if you're gonna accuse me of what oath is doing.

[Tchill13]

VOTE: mumble

i'll stop messing with osuka, nero and oath. I doubt they ever understand or give in to my reasoning of the tunnel and what im trying to prove.

There's enough reason to lynch mumble here. Scum will never kill me or oath as long as we are both alive. I'm fine with this lynch.

lurking mumble and scum motivation equal scum mumble. Great breakdown krazy.

[Tchill13]

the vote history in particular is quite telling on top of the fact he's not sorting.

[Tchill13]

Nope. That's not why I wanted to lynch oath.

If I'm town and I think oath is town what do I benefit from having oath in lylo with me?

[Tchill13]

I've yet to see anyone answer this. Go ahead give it a shot.

[Tchill13]

Also I'm assuming oath has been keeping up with the thread and watching what's happened. I engaged you oath.

You never engaged me. Never had a real discussion with me. Never tried to understand why I scum read you.

That question extends to you as well oath.

[Tchill13]

Nope. That's not why I wanted to lynch oath.

If I'm town and I think oath is town what do I benefit from having oath in lylo with me?

You know what's cool? If we lynch scum instead of pushing lynches on town just because we don't like them we probably won't end up in a lylo situation.

FOOD FOR THOUGHT

Do I know you're town? Do you know I'm scum?

FOOD FOR THOUGHT.

[Tchill13]

It's also interesting how you're constantly concerned with lylo this early in the game - that's more of a scum concern because they HAVE to go through lylo to win. Town could win this game without ever being in a lylo situation, I don't know how often town ends up in lylo across the board but it's not necessarily bound to happen.

P-edit: You engaged me with name calling. I've had several discussions with you. Most of this thread is discussions between us, TChill lol. I understand why you scum read me. Why do we need to talk about it more?

I mean I'm like 99.99% sure you're scum and I'm cool with those odds.

if town never reaches lylo town wins. thats whys im concerned with lylo. if we dont get there great. if we do we need to be best equipped to handle it. If you don't worry about lylo till lylo then you get...

"thats the best you can get"

[Tchill13]

and before you misrep like you like to do...

"I understand why you scum read me" is I understand that as scum that is your only play during this and any subsequent day phase you make it to.

whats my play as town concerning the amount of danger id be in with you if we were both to make it to lylo, which is what scum would want.

[Tchill13]

scum isn't going to want to deal with either of us an after mumble's lynch i demand that either me or oath are lynched.

[Tchill13]

like thats the issue. scum thing late game, scum think about who they want to take to lylo.

town fail to think late game time and time again. Early days with minimal info should be spent getting rid of baggage that can actually flip scum. Throwing scums tools away in the form of bad play. GET RID OF THAT. every time, every game. Then after you've accumulated info after a few day phases you can best set yourself up to lynch competent scum.

yall are hung up on the fact "its a PL" NO ITS NOT. its a PL if they're conftown. If theyre not conftown they can be scum. If theyre not scum you have eliminated a scum tool.

[Tchill13]

Mumble is actually a garbage vote - we can agree there.

no we can't. if i didn't actually think mumble is scum then i wouldn't advocate for his lynch over yours.

[Tchill13]

thats why scum can lurk. People refuse to lynch baggage. People refuse to lynch bad play, even anti town play. It's never gonna stop as long as it's never lynched. You can't give town enough PR's to fix bad town play.

[Tchill13]

she is. why would town play like that? whats the benefit from that?

[Tchill13]

why shouldi want you in the game if im town and i think you're town? where do i benefit from it?

[Tchill13]

will scum want this handled oath?

[Tchill13]

You never told me why I should keep you in the game if I think you're town.

Why should I think you're more likely to be town than scum?

[Tchill13]

Should I assume I'll be NK'D if I'm town? That's why I'm scum?

Should I not be putting town in the best position to win while I'm alive? I only have control of one slot while I'm alive. If I'm dead I have no control. This means while I'm alive I should work towards putting town in the best position to win regardless of the fact that I'm in lylo or not. Until I'm dead I should assume I'd be in lylo I'd there was a lylo. No reason not to assume that.

Would scum want this handled? It's a yes or no question.

[Tchill13]

I want town in the game so we don't reach lylo? there's town in the game at lylo. Should I just no lynch every time? Then i wouldn't be responsible for any town dying. Thats what i should do?

your bad logic is bad.

[Tchill13]

funny, yes it is a team game and im thinking in scenarios im not in also. If i die i want players in that i can trust to win town the game. Why should i trust you to win town the game if im town?

STOP SAYING I COULD BE SCUM AS AN ANSWER. THATS NOT AN ANSWER. THATS A LACK OF AN ANSWER IN A HYPOTHETICAL THAT VERY WELL CAN BE TRUE.

[Tchill13]

YOUR COURTESY is an insult. It answers nothing. IT helps no one.

[Tchill13]

To be fair, TChill has to try and lynch me. Because I've known he's scum since the beginning - he pushed for ceej lynch and now Gustavo is dead.

It really is his only option.

VOTE: TChill

Can you guys believe me today? Or what's up?

WILL YOU SELF VOTE IF I FLIP TOWN?

I've literally said countless times I will die on this hill with you if you're town.

I will grovel at your feet and beg for forgiveness.

You're not town though so I am not at all worried.

btw I haven't seen something like this from town like... ever. so yeah.

[Tchill13]

you said coming in you knew this discussion would lead to a scenario where you couldn't be in the end game. Town would never willingly put themself in that position unless they have a guilty.

[Tchill13]

I WILL SELF HAMMER ONCE THE REMAINING MAJORITY (Not you and I) AGREES MY FLIPPING GREEN CONFIRMS YOU AS SCUM

ABSENCE OF THE SELF HAMMER IS A SCUM CLAIM FROM ME

get this done. If you flip town I can still contribute to the game and my d1 is a testament to that.

[Tchill13]

i have tried harder to work with oath than i have anyone i've ever played with. thats a fact.

oath what would you say about your play in the instance i flip town?

Honestly? I would laugh, but that is because I'm so confident that I would probably think I've lost my mind. I wouldn't even be mad if you flipped town and that led to my lynch, other than the position it puts town in.

Also, I would owe you an apology, but I said as much.

Also... you're talking to me again <3

you said if i flip town you can not contribute. You would have lost your mind.

If you flip town there's reason to believe i can still contribute.

If i flip town YOu said you have lost your mind. Wouldn't be mad if im lynched.

self vote. you should be lynched before me.

[Tchill13]

if you consider it a courtesy to post you should replace out. Not hard to play a game you signed up for. thats not a courtesy.

[Tchill13]

Just because someone shows posts that think like you do doesn't mean they play alignments the same way you do.

[Tchill13]

Scum doesn't want me or oath lynched rn. Isn't that right oath?

I can contribute regardless of the alignment she flips. She can't contribute when I flip town.

[Tchill13]

As far as I'm concerned anyone pushing me as scum is biased. I've done nothing to show I'm scum.

Oath has. She's scum.

[Tchill13]

Where's my case?

[Tchill13]

I'm not letting up on oath. I'll be useless until then unless we lynch mumble this day phase. Other than that I will not participate in doing anything else other than lynching oath.

[Tchill13]

Where's my case Nero? Do you have a guilty on me?

[Tchill13]

You have a guilty on me?