Mini Normal 2080 ft. My Cats [Game Over]

[Detective Pikachu]

on the plus side, Flubber is never scum with Sho ever after that post

[Detective Pikachu]

The fact the shoshin got run up despite ed and salad being equally likely suggests salad is scum

oh wait no this actually makes sense, sorry I think I misread this

[Detective Pikachu]

just a weird sentence really

thought you thought Sho and ED were different slots

[Detective Pikachu]

because she townreads me and I have been very insistent on him being town and she has been incorrectly paranoid about him in the past

why do I feel like you're flailing in a not particularly townie way nero?

[Detective Pikachu]

I'm not seeing what the big deal is

like you feel this way too right

every push on him is met with immediate, incredibly lazy omgus, and moonlogic mixed with poisoning the well and nonstop shade

how is this a town reaction to pressure?

[Detective Pikachu]

I think flubber l-2, urap l-3, nero l-4

pedit: looks like vc inc tho

[Detective Pikachu]

Dunn is Nero town?

[Detective Pikachu]

should we just do flubb and call it a day then?

if teacher, nom, vork, dunn, and buj aren't coming on nero then is this just a waste of time or what?

[Detective Pikachu]

For awhile teacher and urap were cross voting and sitting on each other with urap only getting off to delay OMGUS his voter.

this is kinda a delayed OMGUS vote but its kinda off b/c it seems like a pressure vote? Like Nom thought urap was scum for awhile and then started town reading him.

good thing it only took you 1500+ posts to finally OMGUS me. Also rando voting and then just happening to find a reason to stay on me is such a scum tactic.

Weird obsession with "delayed omgus" as a completely non-existent scumtell

So nice selective quoting

scummy shade; I had explicitly said I was looking for a stronger towncase than what Buj had presented, given what he says about his own meta in places like this:

I think we have played once but FMPOV it feels odd that you are using meta to defend Sho but not even considering my meta here.

***
on that same point --

there are alot of ppl that can read me off meta.

Unlike him, I do meta research.

if you did meta research there's no way that you think im scum here.

0 people are tring him off meta this game and I disagree that he's readable off meta so this seems like a scummy misrep of his scumrange

How did she even win a best scum scummie?

scummy overreaction to a push

looks like my read was right on you earlier.

mostly want slot to die for this post given he's asked me almost no questions in like 1000 posts and has basically put 0 thought into re-evaluating me but decided that me eventually reconsidering my read on him makes me omgusing. This is a wildly bad faith post if it's not a scummy overreaction, and I kinda think it's just a scummy overreaction

some of this could just be playstyle but at some point I feel like the combination of overreactions and moonlogic is really hard to see coming from town approaching this game in good faith

[Detective Pikachu]

@DP Why is scum more likely to use that tell (delayed-omgus) over and over than town?

I kinda think tells go through fads for me if that makes sense

it kinda reminds me of how a player like braffin tries to control the narrative of the game by trying to goad town into 1v1s. basically all he's doing is saying "person x voted person y, and now person y is voting person x!"

Like, that's not scumhunting, it reads more like a poor facsimile of scumhunting.

Maybe he just decided he wanted to invent a non-existent tell and see if it actually does anything, that's something flavor leaf might do, but basically I don't get the impression he's actually trying to sort people with these comments

[Detective Pikachu]

why's urap scum?

[Detective Pikachu]

I mean I think all you've said is that you think he's broadened his horizons? But I don't understand what you're seeing as scummy from him still. It's hard to re-evaluate my argument when you're just saying you disagree

[Detective Pikachu]

Would hammer if absolutely required: urap, Nero, flubb

also kinda curious why you're saying you'd hammer nero but not flubb, I guess just cause it's a townie wagon? can you expand on your read on flubber?

[Detective Pikachu]

Yeah it makes sense just kinda surprised me since Nero just reminded me of 333

I guess I just went back and found that I actually don't like 265 basically at all so just kinda interesting feels

I mean Nero literally just argued you had towncased him previously, given you had listed him in bottom two tiers what do you make of that?

[Detective Pikachu]

at least teacher and Buj have done that.

looks like my read was right on you earlier.

Unlike him, I do meta research.

if you did meta research there's no way that you think im scum here.

Teach, can you point me to your thoughts on Nero's alignment?

Nero’s hard pushes have been on me, urap and pika before claim. I’m pretty darn sure at least two are town. They demotivated over he course of the day. They are also cheerleading your lynch, but letting nom be the face of the effort. If your town, I think they have a strong possibility of scum. But on this slot I trust DP more than myself or you. I saw some pretty town thought processes in both the me and urap pushes, and I’ve become progressively less convinced of uraps alignment, though I still town DP for giving me reasons to strong town urap.

Does that help/answer? If not, I quoted my take on them last night within the last couple hours.

snip

I’m offline tonight for real life but I LOVE this post.

Yes I’m being useless w my vote. It is still on my RVS for familiarity. I haven’t gotten scum tingles yet. Actually the better way to word that is that I feel scum has been active (this hasn’t all felt tvt) but they haven’t localized yet.

I’m town on cinnamon from their reaction to my push on their claim, and on urap and one other (blanking on who rn) for melding on that reaction. I wasn’t crazy about the commie sheeping, but this post totally redeemed you for that point of view.

I’m offline for my last night of real work this semester. I will be back tomorrow. But thank you for this.

I liked that you called out early posts, which justified your early read. I liked that it showed a consistent focus on how a player was using their vote - a consistent scunhuntubg mindset. I liked some of the analysis on his wording - even as I disagree with it and view it as playstyle rather than alignment.

You’ve shown me how you think. It is consistent. And it is an approach I do not have so it can help me.

This.

This is him talking about why I'm town in this game. Yes, he said he'd hammer me but I'm still a bit down his totem pole.

there are alot of ppl that can read me off meta.

hey guiz, I'm voting Nero cause if I do ppl will have town cases on him.

ppl have already done this

but one called u scummy and one is sheeping me so what is this reaction. it's so bad!

This is just strongly worded bullshit.

like, he said that me saying that you hadn't towncased him was "bullshit" and that when I was asking for towncases on him "ppl have already done this" -- so he pretty clearly thought that you were 'towncasing him' and was giving me shit because I should have read your "towncase" as a towncase

so given you basically just said you'd hammer him and that you basically aren't townreading him, idk, what do you make of this string of posts?

[Detective Pikachu]

blah blah blah if Nero is town then he's town because he's 'solvy' in posts like this

01. nomnomnom-I think nom is town, that break town when no one was sheeping him looked real
02. Cinnamon-is town by role
03. NerfedBuJ-this is not fleshed out at all and my history of correctly reading him is lowish but im also not hard scum reading him.
04. skitter30-not sold this is town
06. Saladman27-his posts are kinda bad but I'm not sold on that being scum. Kinda seems genuine though.
08. Dunnstral-this seems kinda like normal useess Dunn. Could be scum but weak town lean atm.
10. EvilDeanius-like his posts
12. Flubbernugget-not sold this is town
13. Vorkuta-town

why is this towny for nero? because he bothers to express townreads, whereas as scum he tends to go heavy on large, wide lynchpools that include like one or two soft busses

problem with this towncase is that:
a) no one agrees that this is sort of tell is actually town indicative given that half the town wants to lynch urap when I could townread him
b) Nero doesn't think this sort of thing is town indicative for urap himself so it's kinda ridiculous to towncase him for the same thing
c) don't really understand why vork is strong town, don't like the skitter read, don't get why he thinks Dunn is "normal useless Dunn" when I feel like Dunn has significantly above rand reads almost every other game when he's town? also Dunn is capable of more than this so I don't get either part of that read

on the whole though the iso doesn't seem that solvy to me, he starts with the vork townread which looks identical to pocketing to me
spends just as much time insisting he is town as analyzing other people for town
frequently shades townreads other people express

like, it's nice that nero has townreads in the list compared to his scum games, but ultimately just having a list appear at some point in the iso that includes townreads that haven't really been discussed as town beforehand more or less looks a lot more like how someone like scum!urap would play, where at some point they realize they need more townreads and so they do a list. the 'i'm more solvey' argument therefore doesn't really convince me

like I don't like moments like 1788 to 1968 even though I know this is partly playing off Sho's line of questioning

like page 2 of his iso I think his only townread is himself frankly

compare to something like boonin' in the slums where his read on sheldon takes longer to develop but where he's more aggressive in defending the slot as town:
viewtopic.php?t=79391&f=3&st=0&sk=t&sd= ... er_sort=Go

he expresses the read in iso90 and then defends it in iso92

and the problem is that even as town he tends to have very wide lynch pools: viewtopic.php?p=10883437#p10883437

like, I think what Nero argues is that he is sortable by post count, because this was the impression people had of him after games like his large normal here: viewtopic.php?f=55&t=77628&activity_overview=1

but that was a meta he exploited in BTE which is why it's kinda bullshit, even if he obviously prefers playing town over scum overall and is slightly more likely to post more as town than as scum, I don't think that's a hard tell for him or that he's town just for having lots of posts which I think is the closest anyone actually got to identifying a meta tell for him.

and other things he does here more or less match his scum game -- instigating paranoia about his green flip and pushing people who push him -- viewtopic.php?p=10558882#p10558882

insisting the default position on him should be town rather than anything else -- viewtopic.php?p=10608933#p10608933

braggadocious wave dick around attitude -- viewtopic.php?p=10610262#p10610262

scummy overreactions and needless hostility -- viewtopic.php?p=10612286#p10612286

obsession with omgus over people voting him after he has expressed suspicion on them -- viewtopic.php?p=10618152#p10618152

Frankly I don't think Nero is sortable off meta overall, I don't think anything here is like a 100% slam dunk, but there's plenty of similarity to his scum games

there Sho--the argument that nero is solvable off meta is bullshit, there's a few extremely poor reasons to townread him off meta and several only so-so reasons to scumread him off meta

[Detective Pikachu]

Buddy Dunn more. It's true he does have decent reads at times but he's usally somewhat lurky as town and I felt like he's doing that now.

Again, throwing shade is not the same as "solving" and bad-faith responses like this are precisely why I want to see your slot go. I don't see how you think I'm "buddying Dunn" when I basically just said his play so far has been below par. That's the opposite of buddying, Nero, so you're once again taking me calling you out on something (making a lazy/uninteresting read of Dunn) and then misconstruing it for reasons that suggest you can't even fully process what I am arguing.

Your self town-case is that you are "more solvey" as town, but my general impression of you is that you're:
-throwing shade at anyone whose reads don't align with yours
-overreacting to anyone who pushes you
-insisting you are town
-insisting anyone who doesn't townread you is bad

if that's your "solving" I hate to imagine what your AtE looks like

[Detective Pikachu]

at least teacher and Buj have done that.

looks like my read was right on you earlier.

So nice selective quoting

Buddy Dunn more.

If you're town you've worked really hard for this mislynch. If Flubber is scum you've basically been on a one-man quest to save his slot since last night. If you put a lot of work into making me not want to townread you then I'm just not going to townread you.

when I basically just said his play so far has been below par.

That is

NOT

what you said.

don't get why he thinks Dunn is "normal useless Dunn" when I feel like Dunn has significantly above rand reads almost every other game when he's town?

you basically said that I can't think Dunn is "normal useless Dunn" when he has decent reads some games.

it's buddying and you lied about what you even said.

yeah except I also said:

also Dunn is capable of more than this so I don't get either part of that read

You were saying Dunn is normally useless and a lurker and I disagreed with both points, he sometimes lurks but he's also certainly capable of presence in the thread. He's not useless when he's town and he's very strong as a wolf, and I think other people even argue he is more likely to tunnel as scum so literally no part of your read matches my understanding of his meta either as town or as scum.

So once again it's like you're just blowing up at everything I say without even really trying to understand my point.

If I feel like I'm talking to someone that just doesn't want to understand me then you can be scum. Otherwise you're approaching me with such wildly bad faith that you might as well be scum. I kinda have stopped caring either way. You literally just took two sentences and managed to only read one of them.

[Detective Pikachu]

and then if you are scum then "yay" I was right about you p9

lol, I've done nothing "scummy" but I guess your ego just can't admit that you were wrong.

kinda a funny juxtaposition actually lol

[Detective Pikachu]

pagebot

[Detective Pikachu]

[Detective Pikachu]

We're not no lynching

[Detective Pikachu]

I'm still v/la but I'm not waking up tomorrow to a no lynch. Intent on flubber in 3 hours.

[Detective Pikachu]

It's that time again, that's right it's time to

BAIT THE NIGHTKILL WITH A HYPOCLAIM

Weak hider: Vork
Weak visitor: Dunn
Weak motion detector: salad
Weak doctor: nom
Weak fruit vendor: nero
Weak tracker: sho
Weak babysitter: teacher

[Detective Pikachu]

Nero agrees that I'm a top tier nightkill tonight. When was the last time me and Nero agreed on anything? Scum should take note.

[Detective Pikachu]

Ladies and gentlemen, we got him

I don't get why you went for this joke?

[Detective Pikachu]

OK DP - I'll give you that he looks bad there and I am considering him as a possible vote

I don't like Flubber's turn on me where he goes "maybe I should give Dunn more attention"

the tone of this post kinda bothered me over night

still deciding how I feel about it but I'm gonna start here

VOTE: Dunn

[Detective Pikachu]

life?

[Detective Pikachu]

dunn can we talk

I kinda think my nero case was garbage which is why you saying it made him look bad was kinda ???

and if nero + flubber was t/t then you were kinda slightly pushing both wagons day 1 which concerns me a little bit

am I wrong tho and you were just like 'ya do whatever nero is an idiot but ya lynch flubber' or what was goin on there

[Detective Pikachu]

I don't get why urap scumreads the only person towning him as scum unless he's just ready to die and playing for post-flip.

[Detective Pikachu]

don't get why you're leaving it at "reasons" for teacher

[Detective Pikachu]

I would have thought pisskop was an alt of fus not the other way around

[Detective Pikachu]

VOTE: nomnom

I'll see where this goes lol

[Detective Pikachu]

Spoiler:

I dont suppose youre an openly out alt?

You do have a certain 'feel'

One person has figured me out but I am not open yet no

[Detective Pikachu]

Detective Pikachu your posting this day phase has been pretty bad... what happened? Why are you pushing on nom now?

Wanted to see what pisskop would do. Also my read on nom has been kinda all over the place and I didn't mind a fresh take there. I wouldn't have minded seeing if she had a townie reaction but I guess piss has already moved on. Are you townreading her?

Doesn't help that the only wagon with momentum has been urap who I'm still townleaning despite his last readslist being kinda bad.

[Detective Pikachu]

Why are you townleaning him?

Pretty sure his thought process within the first 60 posts of his iso was strongly town indicative. I know his play dropped off a cliff but I think that's due to rl stuff and becoming disengaged with the game from fatigue.

Unfortunately with his last readslist I'm just not inspired to defend his play anymore, but I think that's also what makes me think he's still kinda townie. If he was scum he basically has left literally no one with a reason to defend him which is a... wild strategic gamble if I ever saw one.

[Detective Pikachu]

Town: Piss, Buj, Skitter, Urap
Uhhh, town I think?: teacher
Kinda leaning town but have some doubt sometimes: Salad
Hmm?: Vork
[Nero: Nero]
Scattered pings: nom, Dunn

[Detective Pikachu]

Can you detail your read on Skitter, Buj and Teacher

Never played against scum skitter but I've felt like we've mindmelded a lot this game
Buj is feels like he's had some wildly townie reactions to things to me
Teacher I still kinda feel like was being pushed for reasons that I would push him for as scum, and I think at least some of his play has fallen largely within his town meta, but since he's doing the mobile-only posting thing it's kinda hard to get a firm read on him cause he just kinda seems different.

I don't really like your reasoning for having him as town. I feel my play day 2 has been pretty different from my play day 1, yet you didn't have much to say about that either

I'm more focused on individual pings, I kinda felt like your end of day reactions to the flubber/nero 1v1 felt kinda off to me so I'm still not sure what to do with your day 2 play. I'm not deadlocked on you scum, and I did like your early posts with Vork on day 1, but I'm kinda just looking at my PoE and not seeing who is a better candidate for scum than you

[Detective Pikachu]

Pretty sure his thought process within the first 60 posts of his iso was strongly town indicative.

How so?

I explained in 963 and 964 -- I'm fairly confident that urap making a conscious effort to townblock and find specific townie posts from players is town indicative because this is something he struggles to do as scum, instead he only pretends to scumhunt and then at some point throws out a list when he feels he needs some townreads but doesn't explain them that well. Teacher is right that it's not impossible he has gotten better at this particular thing but I feel like it's a pretty sharp and dramatic improvement in his scum play if so, which usually just makes the person town in my mind.

[Detective Pikachu]

oof

[Detective Pikachu]

VOTE: Nero

feel like I'm having deja vu all over again!

[Detective Pikachu]

yeah it was

that doesn't mean he's town tho and this gamestate is getting boring

[Detective Pikachu]

unless you wanna join on nom and get a spicy fiesta going on in here?

[Detective Pikachu]

hmm why don't I join on the one person I have the most familiarity with and where my read is the strongest let me think

[Detective Pikachu]

nomnom-->Dunn-->Nero-->Vork-->Salad

is a list of names that I would lynch in LOL

pedit: wow suddenly a lot of posts

[Detective Pikachu]

Since when is your read the strongest there?

since halfway through day 1? I townblocked urap ages ago it feels like

[Detective Pikachu]

i wouldn't put dp in that list

Their play day 2 is atrocious

the only wagon the entire day has been someone I strongly townread and I've had no traction anywhere else so *shrug* h8rs gonna h8

[Detective Pikachu]

Why are people still scumreading Nero

This is an unreal gamestate.

why are you townreading him again

didn't you spend day 1 insisting he was unreadable day 1 and that he would be automatically solved later on or something

I'm pretty sure you never actually townread him despite how much you pushed against his lynch

[Detective Pikachu]

@dp maybe it's time for you to revisit ur urap read

I feel like I have?

[Detective Pikachu]

Spoiler:

@nom while you’re on who do you town.

Townreads?

I'm fairly sure Skitter with that entrance is townie. Cinn is town for that early game, Dunn has incisive posts that read town, Nero is currently playing like the town game I played with him so I am inclined to put that as town.

My gut says DP is actually town here although it's a completely stupid reason to believe so and I'd rather not delve in it.

I'm also inclined to believe that URAP is town leaning when re-reading a few things from him too. That's where I am at right now.

Nom do you have a metric to read nero by?

I do.

But not day 1.

The only reason I townread him in our large is because I saw clear as day that he was a player doing his job throughout the game. The fact he interacted with everyone in equal terms is a strong indication of him being town. I believe he is a talkative player in general regardless of alignment but like... he's a hard player to sort unless we reach that part of the game where I have to actively sit down and go through everything that was said. That's how I sort slots like him. I don't believe you're going to sniff him as scum this way.

His lynch is a crapshoot today. But I guess my opinion doesn't really matter.

The next best lynch today is between vork and teacher.

It even has nothing to do with annoyance. People can be annoying sometimes (nero certainly was an annoying idiot at certain times of our large normal for example) but it's never a reason why I scumread people.

It's just the agenda that I see.

Trying to sort Nero day 1 is a crapshoot.

I wouldn't advise it.

If he's town he's probably just as likely to cost us the game as if he was a fourth scum, and I see no problem with just believing he's scum right now.

Unload the baggage so the rest of the town can carry = least risky option

That's a gross assessment given that the last time I played with Nero he was the person that managed to make himself known as the obvtown slot on a LYLO and allowed me to basically solve early on.

If it wasn't for a personal grudge from another person we would have won that game.

Nero is good in those spots. His alignment will be clear as day eventually.

I really dislike that you've been going for "the least risky slots" because that was your rationale to go for EvilDeanius too in the first place.

I already know Nero Cain is an awful lynch. Scums are using this tide to redirect today's lynch on a random poor sod they can find a fastest case on, and that person is NC. And it's not even because of reads, it's just because of his posting style and kind of antagonistic attitude that is NOT alignment indicative. It's literally the reason we lost our previous game. Do you want to let things happen like that again? I don't. I already know where this is going.

VOTE: shoshin

Nero is still a bad vote/lynch.

Hey Nom, what do you think of my analysis of Nero?

Can you help me understand what makes Nero town?

I don't think much of it, because Nero is not actually a townread of mine. He's a nullread even though this has been fairly similar to how he played as town in the large normal I played with him.

He's fairly belligerent when challenged and will not hesitate to 1v1 people for the sake of going 1v1 against people, which he had done with my mason partner last game. That's why I find the scumread on him for doing this thing here by whoever said that (I think it was flubb?) completely asinine.

I just think NC is a bad day 1 lynch period.

like, to be honest you've been kinda all over the place on him. you start with a townread, then spend half the day insisting he basically just can't be read but that he shouldn't be day 1, then get really upset that the person you say can't be read is getting wagoned

like this whole progression is just weird af to me and it's one of the things I least like about your slot

[Detective Pikachu]

since we're having conversations about re-evaluating people when was the last time you all re-evaluated nom btw?

[Detective Pikachu]

I think nom is more likely scum and nero is more likely the pocket if we want to go back to nom

[Detective Pikachu]

how did nero pocket nom then?

[Detective Pikachu]

I feel like nom's AtE is wildly inconsistent with the read she expressed on nero

nero has kinda done an overexplainy thing he does sometimes do as scum but his day 1 post rate was pretty significantly above average and that was before he was really getting pushed

like I don't get how nom's thought process is working irt Nero, it's like she wants to white knight him but like, not really? it's just weird man

[Detective Pikachu]

doing what on purpose?

[Detective Pikachu]

idk i think the ate could be real ... she def does an ate-y thing as town, she feels more ~calculated~ as scum to m

i don't think they're both town

It could be, it's not impossible, if I was totally sure she was scum I'd have been on her way more

I thought the vork push early game didn't necessarily feel t/t to me though, the kill on sho would reflect her believing sho was a cop, and her read progression on nero makes little sense to me.

nero could definitely be scum here but I think nom is maybe scum more frequently with those points in mind, just not sure either way

[Detective Pikachu]

she feels more ~calculated~ as scum

when did you play with scum nom?

[Detective Pikachu]

but you didn't... I asked for towncases on Nero and you said "nero is unsortable but not today's lynch" which was not a towncase

it's actually your weird, ate-full but nonetheless non-analytical defense of nero that has left me so baffled in regard to your two slots

[Detective Pikachu]

Kinda at a loss as to how evaluating 18% of the game is a waste of time

[Detective Pikachu]

i dont think nom is scum rn

what do you think of nom's read development irt Dunn?

[Detective Pikachu]

I don't really feel like I can understand her reads development for his slot either.

[Detective Pikachu]

I'm fine letting her cool down but I wouldn't mind a reads list at some point, we're at page 133 and she basically just implied she has 3 reads out of 10 players.

[Detective Pikachu]

if hammer goes through while I'm offline

Spoiler:

Weak hider: Dunn
Weak visitor: Vork
Weak motion detector: nom
Weak doctor: salad
Weak fruit vendor: teacher
Weak tracker: nero
Weak babysitter: [gated, cannot use tonight]

[Detective Pikachu]

VOTE: Dunnstral

Why wait? Let's go then

[Detective Pikachu]

Fuck nero let's do dunn

Piss, skitter, you should join me on this

-his poe has at most 1 scum
-he thinks he gets nightkilled when lolnope
-his eod on day 1 was sketch af
-he's setting up a push on me tomorrow when urap flips town

Teacher don't fucking hammer urap when we can lynch actual scum in dunn

[Detective Pikachu]

I conducted an investigation last night and learned that Detective Pikachu is aligned with the town. This was surprising given yesterday but my investigation was conclusive.

As far as urap, I would say I went wrong in reading him town off meta, which was a lot easier when I didn't know he exclusively pushed town day 1.

[Detective Pikachu]

-his poe has at most 1 scum

This was still accurate though so I don't regret giving Dunn lip

even if I was wrong on which of the three was scum in that list

[Detective Pikachu]

Hmmm is salad the type that sits quietly on a bus for his first scum game or vork the type who busses early in the day then gets off later

[Detective Pikachu]

I can check tonight, good question.

[Detective Pikachu]

Rl tonight when I'm off work that is, not referring to game night

[Detective Pikachu]

I was certainly right about the TR interaction with me in the early game...

Hmm that's a pretty good point

Nero what do you think about vork rn?

[Detective Pikachu]

Nothing really. I more just vaguely feeling like nom/vork wasn't t/t and dunn's point about the miller stuff early game means more now that I'm feeling better about Dunn. And feel a little bit better about nom now I guess.

If salad is town then... not a ton of room in my poe at this point

[Detective Pikachu]

Hmm there was the thing where urap insisted vork was town like three times at game start. I wonder if he wanted to go full wolf this game vs. Vork pocket? Townread on scumbuddy would match a full wolf day 1?

[Detective Pikachu]

Actually maybe just all my reads will keep being garbage because I think I have no idea where scum is lol

[Detective Pikachu]

Skitter being scum would explain why this game feels hard.

Is this one of those games where my reads are so bad I'm only being defended by scum?

And yet I still don't really scumread her lol

[Detective Pikachu]

Can I just say it's weird teacher was full doctor but sho died n1

Anyway yeah question is does urap spew salad town, vork town, both, or neither

[Detective Pikachu]

I keep rereading page 11 and I keep thinking at some point it will be clear which of the two is scum. Like urap is at l-2 and nom comes in and basically takes a baseball bat to vork for his vote. That page really does not read t/t to me but I'm not sure if vork starts a fight with nom to get off his bus or if nom tries to dismantle the wagon by scumcasing vork for his vote hopping.

I do remember kinda not liking vork's posts around that time though.

VOTE: Vork

I feel like I should go here but I honestly don't know if I don't have it backward again

[Detective Pikachu]

Here's another thought avenue.

If pisskop or saladman are scums, they were taught to act this way by partner. I think pisskop's slot has more chances to have been told to fake a miller claim given pk's entrance to the slot, but I think urap isn't the kind of player making bonkers play like that, let alone ask someone else to do them. So it would have to be someone in this playerlist.

Urap asking saladman to vote his slot for towncred and excuse his lurkish nature is possible though. Urap really seemed like he gave up on this game and probably gave his scumpartners a go for bussing. I think it partially explains the wagon going this flowingly. Scums must have come in to yesterday expecting to bus urap. That's what I think.

like this post pings me too though, nom has pinged me a bunch of times this game, feel like people keep arguing she's town and I did like some of her thought processes in the early game.

I think there's a scum between Vork and nom, I disliked vork more early, I disliked nom more later, I kinda felt a bit better about her after the urap flip and some other things I saw but she still keeps writing individual posts that ping me.

My slot is probably too toxic for my reads to matter anyway right now so it doesn't help that I genuinely just don't know lol

[Detective Pikachu]

I feel like it's you as scum explaining why you would talk Cinnamon into a miller gambit for instance, or force Shoshin to be lynched purely because scumteam was informed there was no cops or something. It's more like you are explaining why you are scum than why I actually think you would think pisskop is scum, who is someone that definitely does not need coaching to play scum. Like how would you even begin to reach that conclusion? pisskop entered the thread explicitly denying the miller claim, that's not a play someone who is uninformed of the game or his claim does.

VOTE: NomNom

You "starting to feel confident" on me also feels fake to me. I suppose it does make more sense that between you and Vork, you browbeating Vork with a fabricated read to disrupt the urap wagon makes more sense then Vork getting caught up for bussing.

[Detective Pikachu]

I also keep forgetting vork is playing this game, he's been silent as hell

Like a page ago you're shading Vork, I'm thinking about Vork and trying to sort you vs. him when I'm pretty sure there's a scum between the two of you, and you ignore my thoughts about Vork and focus on me observing that you speculating about scum coaching pisskop is sketch, which it is. And me making this observation and saying that you making a ridiculous post about pisskop "pinged" me makes you "feel more confident in me"? That does not feel like a town thought process to me

[Detective Pikachu]

If pisskop or saladman are scums, they were taught to act this way by partner.

You said you think pisskop was coached *this game* and I do not see how you reach that conclusion

[Detective Pikachu]

If pisskop or saladman are scums, they were taught to act this way by partner.

You said you think pisskop was coached *this game* and I do not see how you reach that conclusion

I said Cinnamon. You are a god damn liar.

If I'm misunderstanding what you're saying in that post, that's an extremely fake response to me misunderstanding you.

[Detective Pikachu]

Like why would Cinnamon need to be coached to fake a miller claim? Why do you think I'm a "god damn liar" when you literally say you think pisskop was "told to act 'this way' by a partner'" -- I don't even know what 'this way' means. The post is weird and confusing and I don't get your thought process there. I don't see why those are logical inferences based on what's in the game

[Detective Pikachu]

I mean Nero is already acting like he's god gift to scumhunting so if you're going to start being a prick too then just get my mislynch over with because I'm pretty over this game.

I don't even know what the fuck that last post means. How the fuck am I supposed to interpret a post where you say the slot was coached if it's scum?

Like I thought salad was theoretically coached into spewing a reads list, and I can see your thought process for him, but I basically asked why you think Cinnamon or Pisskop would be coached to act "this way" and you explode on me? wtf?

[Detective Pikachu]

"11 was TvS and you were the S" is a pretty simple explanation for you basically trying to turn every interaction with you into a toxic mess. That's a really shitty way to play scum by the way. If you're town here I get it but if you're scum you really should find a different strategy.

[Detective Pikachu]

Because the guy comes straight out of the newbie queue with an earnest and honest tone and is upfront about being a miller which is a textbook play on the wiki. So either he's honest either he needs to be coached through it because I literally do not see a slot like this making a miller fakeclaim out of the gate.

Except it wasn't textbook, he said there was other shit in his role, and if Cinna was just going off the wiki... that's not coaching?

I'm starting to get frustrated with you, because you are using faulty logic to attack me and that only reads as scummy to me.

Like have you actually reread the post? Why did you say they were coached to "act this way" if all you were referring to was the miller claim? Do you not get how that is like, an objectively confusing sequence of sentences if you are not telepathic or the author of the post in question?

I feel like this argument is really stupid actually but I think you going for toxicity as a go-to response for every misunderstanding or point of confusing or claiming that people are deliberately trying to misunderstand you is pretty gross

[Detective Pikachu]

I'm not turning my interactions into a toxic mess I just hate when people outright lie and misrepresent me over and over to push me.

Yeah sure I'm crying a river, person who just said they were scumreading me for using the word "ping"

I think I'm done with this thread for the night

[Detective Pikachu]

I've lost my shit this game a few times because of that. Actually you were also the reason why I lost my shit the previous day claiming scums thought Shoshin was cop while simultaneously pointing at me being a likely culprit for that

when I literally put myself forward the entire day to push that as a fakeclaim

.

And THEN you backtrack on that logic to try and push me with outlandish logic such as "lol the scumteam must know that there are no cops this game"??? Are you for real????

OK.

You wanna call me "slime"

If I was scum, I would have shot you over Sho. Because you were pretty clearly softing being informed. You were cross-claiming Shoshin in a way that strongly implies you were either:
A) a town investigative that would preclude there being a second cop
or
b) informed there were no cops

There is no reason that you, as a VT, would assume that Sho was *not an investigative role*. If Shoshin was scum, she could have still been a scum visiting role. The way you were strangely insistent on her not being a cop and this being *the primary* reason you were scumreading her came off as informed as fuck.

Sho, as the person under pressure, had much more reason to fakeclaim no matter what. You as the person not under pressure were much more likely to be a real investigative, if you are town.

Given you are currently pushing me for stupid fucking reasons, you pretty clearly have no cop result on me. Vis-a-vis, my logical conclusion is that you are more likely to be scum informed there are no cops in the game, and this is why you felt confident you could push Shoshin without backlash.

ADDITIONALLY, Cinnamon said there was more to his role, but he never said what. One likely addition to a miller role would be either: a neighborhood, or informed. Vis-a-vis, it's possible that you:
-are in a neighborhood with pisskop
-are scum with pisskop
-or are yourself informed about some part of the power structure of the game

Dunnstral seemed to think you were a town investigative yesterday. Given you are pushing me currently, you are either only even night, if you are town, or you are not a town investigative.

Given you moved off the urap wagon, you pretty clearly did not actually have a guilty on him. You clearly don't have a result on me. Vis-a-vis, you're probably just not a town investigative.

Given you are not a town investigative, why were you so certain Shoshin was "not cop"? There's not THAT many explanations, and the most direct one would be "scum informed there is no cop." This would also explain a miller fakeclaim.

But yes, I'm definitely scum because I think the way you pushed Shoshin does not preclude you from knowing she is town but maybe thinking she is some sort of valuable TPR but not COP. Since you knew she was not COP, you would have felt more confident pushing her because you knew her flip would not totally implicate you given she was lying. But as scum, you would not have known her real role. Given she fakeclaimed cop, and this is not a logical play for a VT to make, *you could have still thought she was a strong town power role.* Because as scum, you would need to have an explanation for why, as town, she would fakeclaim cop.

Does any of this fucking logic make sense? I have no fucking idea, but the way you pushed Shoshin STRONGLY IMPLIED YOU ARE NOT VT and trying to understand at this point WHAT THE FUCK YOUR ROLE IS is not easy.

But if you think I'm scum and don't fucking night 1 you every single time after your play around Shoshin day 1 you're out of your mind so fuck off.

[Detective Pikachu]

That helps I'm sure, continue being a prick and I will be happy to explain my thoughts on every single player and whether they're a TPR or not. Continuing to push me on why the way you pushed Sho does not make you town is an incredibly stupid idea given you have been softing TPR basically the entire damn game.

[Detective Pikachu]

Yeah, I was saying I would have shot her night 1, not night 2

Teacher should have been on Shoshin night 1 which is why her death is weird. Teacher is a strong player but I'm surprised he gambited going off Shoshin frankly. That or scum had like a 1-shot strongman or something.

[Detective Pikachu]

Also choose your version of the facts. You're trying to fish for my role by invoking a thousand possibilities.

I feel like you're fishing your own fucking role, I was being intentionally oblique about my thoughts on you because I didn't want to draw any more attention to your softing than necessary, and that was one of the reasons I was thinking Vork was better for today than you given he is more likely to either be VT or goon whereas if I'm wrong on you I would be leading on some sort of [town something]

[Detective Pikachu]

Damn urap rode my ass on Sho's wagon like all day 1

1.8 and the EoD d1 hammer wagon are both kind of interesting. If there is 0 scum in skitter and piss then the Nero wagon was 100% town which, even if Nero is scum would be sliiightly surprising? Also would be very slightly surprising if the vork wagon that sprang up when urap had 2 votes in day 1 was 100% town even if vork is scum, but not sure on that. VCA tends to be wifomy but it also isn't actually making me feel better about my reads here at all.

Unless this is a very divey scum team, skitter does fit the pattern of conventional scum spread, unless scum felt like nero just 'could not go day 1' and fully committed to save him I guess. I've seen scum teams that fully committed to day 1 lynches just because they wanted to be shown as proactive in the context of a deadline lynch so nero's wagon being scum-light doesn't really damn skitter in my mind

too tired to really analyze more beyond that tonight, idk tho

[Detective Pikachu]

I would more say I dove into his pocket than that he pocketed me lol

but yeah hit interactions with me were definitely very careful in early game because tris's game hadn't resolved at that point, I kinda knew they would be murky and that he'd be dealing with me lightly due to the tenseness of the other game

I didn't think I had been so transparent about what I most valued in his meta in tris's game but this wouldn't be the first time that someone rapidly improved their scumgame after I metacased them; I try to factor that sort of thing into my future games but it's hard to catch every time

[Detective Pikachu]

I had an early TR on froggy

is salad froggy?

[Detective Pikachu]

there were TWO kills night last so a ml today and 2 kills tonight spells utter doom 4 the town. Scum are the ones that WANT to lynch today. As where if we nl then we get an extra nights info and if there are two kills we get another day. YAY!

Also we don't even know that the vig is every night, or that the scum have no roleblocker. No lynching when the vig could be even night would be dumb AF.

[Detective Pikachu]

Sure
VOTE: vork

[Detective Pikachu]

VOTE: nero cain

B

Wait aren't you voting nero

Do you want nero or vork today?

[Detective Pikachu]

The funny thing is that's how I feel every time I look at this game too lol

[Detective Pikachu]

While that's surprising for anyone's first game outside newbie queue I wanna say it's even less likely for first red game on site?

[Detective Pikachu]

I think he's recognizing the game is stale and deciding it's ok he gets mislynched because he's disengaged? I don't take it for a scumclaim

[Detective Pikachu]

He meant today

[Detective Pikachu]

Well she did claim cop. We could call that clue #1

[Detective Pikachu]

What does lifkt mean?

[Detective Pikachu]

Remind me why nero and nom are not in the pool?

also just from playstyle why are you including yourself in your lynchpool?

[Detective Pikachu]

An attempt to ate people like nero into not being a little whiner?

LOL

[Detective Pikachu]

Your what?

[Detective Pikachu]

Well I'm still with you on Vork. I certainly don't really love thinking more about urap at this point. I will say that urap and skitter have scummed together before and put a fair amount of work into theater so them having a prolonged engagement doesn't really clear her, but your impression of whether it's s/s is still pretty fine. When they were s/s I remember them being more 'feisty' with each other I guess you could say, but they probably wouldn't take that tact if they did somehow roll scum together a second time.

If this game was skitter/urap then my reads have been so shitty for so long I'm just like like... ugh... but there's still something about skitter I haven't seen that would make me feel better on her being town. But its absence also does not make her scum in and of itself. So. I'm not categorically opposed to vork/skitter, I'm still prefer doing one out of vork/nom and it seems like I'm never getting nom, so still basically happy with where I'm at even though this game feels super dead

[Detective Pikachu]

Every time someone says "gamestate" on MS team rocket steals another pokemon

[Detective Pikachu]

Another bad-faith snipe from nomnom, cool. Real "analytical" of you there

[Detective Pikachu]

"Nom trying to mislynch shoshin doesn't make her town" isn't really contradictory logic, if you thought she was cop you hard push during the day to make a doc protect less likely and then kill at night. It's an aggressive play but hardly unthinkable.

If I was contradictory before it was in trying to reconcile your softs with your actions, but strictly speaking that reconciliation is unneccessary to my read of you. At the end of the day I don't really need to know *why you knew sho wasn't cop.* Your obsession with shading my slot makes it hard to see you as town. If you're scum, somehow your play must have made sense to you as scum.

Your ate seems manipulative and your reasoning often fake and forced. In any case you seem really unpleasant to play with here and you're not dying today it seems so... Idk I guess I'll have to brainstorm other solutions.

I would really discourage you from continuing to be so manipulative emotionally if you want your wins to mean anything on this site... Winning games because people simply don't want to keep playing with you is a pretty poor way to win. Losing games because you alienate anyone who disagrees with you is also really cool.

[Detective Pikachu]

Same @Dp if he's reading this btw. I just played to my wincondition. Sorry.

I know but saying you dislike someone personally because they scumread you kinda isn't cool. I'm here to have fun and make friends first and win games second, frankly.

[Detective Pikachu]

DP are you a Krazy alt

What makes you think that?

[Detective Pikachu]

Do u wanna know who i think u are?

Sure