Mini Normal 2205: RotITGBSMoD [game over!]

[Andante]

"As an anti-town role, the Neapolitan is equivalent to a Vanilla Cop and slightly weaker than a Role Cop, in that its primary purpose is to determine which players are Power Roles and worth killing. It gains utility in multiball games, where it can also be used to find the rival scumteam more effectively than the other alternatives."

hmmmm I could see it being a maf claim though

Yeah which is the annoying part about my role. I've targeted someone I thought was vanilla town though and playing to try to confirm players. A no result is useless to me because I could be outing a town PR or scum and it's high risk

I don't think we have hidden prs anymore lmao

[Andante]

if anything I honestly sr Koba/Crayon's slot even more right now...

[Andante]

who is your vt, I'd love to know the "clear"

[Andante]

you'd also definitely have a gun, so if you're real... that vig situation is still a thing...

Yeah so that's our next thing to figure out.

Someone good at setup spec tell me what the chances are between these too scum setups:
maf doc, maf traitor, maf something else = 1 gun and koba could still be vig
maf dof, 2 maf something elses = 2 guns, koba is lying

see, Koba is gonna claim they didn't shoot cause they didn't have reads, even though night was 2 days long...

[Andante]

so if you don't out it, and your claim is real. you are dead tonight...

[Andante]

actually, I want VFP out now. I'm like 100% certain they are scum, based on their flip off dragons after I kept yelling dragons was flipping town, like, it was almost like VFP also knew dragons town, but never gave strong reasons


VOTE: VFP

[Andante]

If you iso Koba their claim was really weird. So I could see it being a lie. But I would hate to eliminate our vig if I'm wrong on this. It might be best to leave koba and force them to shoot N2 and if not we elim D3. (Of course this doesn't work if we have a maf RB in play)

exactly, instantly knew about a gs in game, likely from scum chat... I don't care, koba is shooting tonight or dead tomorrow. all PRs are basically out, I'd recommend a lemons shot, but that's just me, VFP is certainly scum

[Andante]

yeah koba is pretty transparently lying here. they even said they were gonna base their shot decision on the dragons flip, and if they shot a protected scum they would've died because of the weak modifier. don't know why i didn't think of this earlier.

VOTE: DkKoba

@Koba what happened

@Asteria I don't think it's necessary to out it just yet. wait to see if you can catch scum in a fakeclaim, we have like 99% of D2 left

How would Asteria catch a scum?? she knows someone who is a VT, that's a town..

[Andante]

WE ARE NOT ELIMMING VIG RIGHT NOW. I WANT VFP HERE, vig is shooting tonight

[Andante]

what fucking sense does it make to elim the vig?

[Andante]

mafia roleblocker would mean there's a whole lot of PRs in this game. i could maaaaybe see even night doctor/odd night RB or something but that still feels unlikely. i'm new to setup spec though

pedit

lmfao why the fuck do you want me dead so bad

you dont seem towny at all lmao

[Andante]

guys, trust me, VFP is scum, he essentially claimed it yesterday. like I'm CERTAIN he is flipping scum

[Andante]

What fucking sense does it make to elim a vig claim right now? vig is almost self clearing. I KNOW vfp is scum. I want VFP out now.

[Andante]

I'm not so certain on VFP, Andante. And lemons has been obvtown to me. I think your reads are a bit off

no, my reads aren't fucking off, I told yall dreagons town, I KNOW VFP is scum, we are getting vfp here

[Andante]

I mean no one listens to me when I have confident reads. I've called half the people here scum/hard to read. unless I'm actively pushing, god. this is hella annoying. I've said since yesterday VFP is 100% scum who transitioned off of dragons to not seem scummy, but it just made him even scummier cause there were never any legit reasons behind it, and all yall ignoring it is what pisses me off. he's actually scummy, and I know I'm not the only one seeing it

[Andante]

so literally yall with the most resistance to me are going to get caught in the fire and read as protecting your partner.

[Andante]

VFP went from actively pushing dragons, to backed off wanting nothing to do with dragons, not even picking a side. and literally all that happened in the middle was me going "watch this flip town, and we know scum is on the wagon" cause Dragons was E-1 for a while the first time, and no one hammered it, which guaranteed scum to be on the wagon already, and I was thinking like 2 scum were on it, I have no clue where that VC is, but the first time, that wagon... I almost guarantee had 2 scum on it, and I KNOW VFP is one

[Andante]

you'd also definitely have a gun, so if you're real... that vig situation is still a thing...

not sure i understand this comment. are you speaking of the possibility that asteria is maf PR? what vig situation?

why on earth would you hammer if you were pretty certain dragons was flipping town? what was the thought process there?

neopolitans have guns, vigs have guns, I have a gun, that's 3 guns there, 1 more in play. at least 1 scum has a gun. so if the 3 pr claims are real, we have a traitor in play

you never answered my second question here

also, like i said, i also think VFP is scum. literally made a case on him yesterday. you have to stop with this me vs the world mentality

I mean, I said like all daty dragons and pooky were TvT but all yall didn't care to listen, and kept pushing him for 0 fucking reason, so I said fuck it, and let it happen, cause if he were here today yall would tunnel him some more. Just like you're completely ignoring my VFP thing now.

[Andante]

gonna poof for a bit to not bloat this thread while others are away. know that i am not attacking you, i'm trying to convince you to play this game in a more constructive and methodical way

More methodical way? please, not like anyone is gonna fucking listen, so guess what? I'll just spam the thread and make it suck for whoever is trying to catch up. Like I think salsa is scum, none yall do, so why the fuck would I try and make a case for that when all yall are like "omg we love you salsa" like, the amount of resistance I get to VFP here? no one is even entertaining the idea and considering it. I'm CERTAIN vfp is flipping scum based on their actions. I gave yall dragons, now I want vfp

[Andante]

VOTE: VFP

you voted VFP there now don't even want to discuss VFP here?

[Andante]

yooo I was rereading. VFP, T3, Pooky were 3 early Dragon votes.

And I had completely forgot T3 was in the game.. But Haschel had an early crayons vote.... I want VFP out

[Andante]

again. why the fuck are we going for vig right now?

VFP is 10000% scum, like, I know he is scum

[Andante]

I shot at vfb

so you're claiming there's a roleblocker. lovely.

[Andante]

You can tell the skill level of Andante here.

what is that supposed to mean? please share more

[Andante]

cause unless you wanna explain your flip from "Dragons for sure scum" to having no comment on Dragons...

[Andante]

You can tell the skill level of Andante here.

what is that supposed to mean? please share more

It's me calling your skill level low.
Why are you not dead?

cause the tracker claim is. you wanna call me scum?

[Andante]

cause the tracker claim is. you wanna call me scum?

Tracker isn't a greater threat than Gunsmith unless you have bad reads.
If you thought I was scum so bad, and was 100% why didn't you check me?

oh especially that tracker was bad, like, I can't explain that kill other than scum is bad. like, a traitor makes sense here, only 2 maf to discuss a kill.. idk, I'd have left that tracker alive lmao

[Andante]

I've found this game hard to get in to. I'll try to be more active in future. This has been very fast paced than the games I'm used to.

so are you the reason tracker died?

[Andante]

Andante may have given up that scum have a roleblocker there and be scum.
I'll think about it.

well obv if koba is real, scum have a roleblocker

[Andante]

I'm beginning to realize inflating this thread was the worst move I could have made lmaooo it's so hard to read for what I want

[Andante]

oh especially that tracker was bad, like, I can't explain that kill other than scum is bad. like, a traitor makes sense here, only 2 maf to discuss a kill.. idk, I'd have left that tracker alive lmao

So 2 people = dumb but add a 3rd makes it smart?
Why didn't you check me if I was 100% scum to you?

I'm just saying, a 3rd brain may have helped them realize.... killing the scummiest tracker known to man was not the move....

I checked a tr so obv wasn't checking you

[Andante]

Andante may have given up that scum have a roleblocker there and be scum.
I'll think about it.

well obv if koba is real, scum have a roleblocker

So I'm not scum then?...

wanna be the sr? I'm just thinking we may have better options, such as in andres/T3

[Andante]

I really think Andante fucked up here and trying to play it off as naive now.

what does that mean?

[Andante]

and you trying to tunnel me cause I sr you is honestly just annoying

[Andante]

fuck this game. people are just fucking annoying.

VOTE: no one

adding UNVOTE: for the vote counter -D

[Andante]

How to you go from screaming I have to be the lim as if you want it before I can post to having other options.
I'm either 100% scum or not.

Cause I was having doubts on my read on you?? I'm sorry I'm not gonna pointlessly tunnel someone.

[Andante]

There's no traitor either btw.
Andante is lying about 4 players with guns.

Why would Andante be in the game to find 1 Mafia? It won't happen.

It's your lines like this, like, the only purpose of stuff like this is to just flat out attack me. As if I could fake a gs claim, I didn't even fucking know what the ms version of gs was. I thought it gave guns

[Andante]

Someone else find scum, I'm so over this. see yall in 24 hours

[Andante]

I shot at vfb

so you're claiming there's a roleblocker. lovely.

??????????

there is literally a mod confirmed mafia doctor in this setup

yeah, but koba claimed weak, meaning koba would be dead if vfp was simply just the save

[Andante]

so you all wanna call Koba fake vig/ assume VFP was rolestopped....

rolestopper on VFP makes about 0 sense.


Guys, lets consider Asteria for a second. D1 had 0 pr tells, panic claimed a gunned role here once I said they have a gun. I do not like Asteria's claim, and I also feel like VFP/Salsa are scum together, but I'll let yall do you

[Andante]

2 scum docs would mean, Koba will likely only be able to shoot town :/

[Andante]

well what's the plan here? leave pr claims alone again? even though Asteria is basically confirmed scum?

[Andante]

mafia doc + mafia rolestopper + mafia rb sounds a bit too stacked to me

also i would imagine a mafia rolestopper on vfp would stop weak vig from dying, since the action never happens? is that right or am i wrong?

Most probably right (I'm not the right person to answer this question though). If

DkKoba

are a town weak vig, mafia has a doctor + a rolestopper + ?.
What do you think about

VFP

atp?

VFP

's being town makes sense in that scenario, or they being scum?

vfp is scum

maf didn't realize koba would've died if they didn't roleblock them

[Andante]

mafia doc + mafia rolestopper + mafia rb sounds a bit too stacked to me

also i would imagine a mafia rolestopper on vfp would stop weak vig from dying, since the action never happens? is that right or am i wrong?

Most probably right (I'm not the right person to answer this question though). If

DkKoba

are a town weak vig, mafia has a doctor + a rolestopper + ?.
What do you think about

VFP

atp?

VFP

's being town makes sense in that scenario, or they being scum?

vfp is scum

maf didn't realize koba would've died if they didn't roleblock them

maf also had 0 way of knowing who koba was shooting, so they played it safe with a roleblock

[Andante]

so you all wanna call Koba fake vig/ assume VFP was rolestopped....

rolestopper on VFP makes about 0 sense.

why does this make no sense to you? it's one of the only ways VFP and koba could have both lived

why would VFP be the one rolestopped? unless he's scum?

sorry, never played with rolestopping before, only rb, I feel like koba was simply just RB'd

[Andante]

so lemons is your VT?

[Andante]

also, I'm not calling my NG'd person town just from having no gun....

[Andante]

scum is salsa/vfp/asteria I think...

[Andante]

VOTE: T3

give us some content please T3

[Andante]

i would start to look at salsa today, too, because that slot seems to be flying pretty low on everyone's radar and it doesnt look like anyone actually took an iso dive there

Flying pretty low?? I'm active!

I mean the entirety of your D1 content was a page by page analysis. I'd say the bulk of your lines are reacting to posts, not so much engaging

[Andante]

also, I'm not calling my NG'd person town just from having no gun....

You said earlier you were confident they're town. I guess now with setup spec we're looking at only 1 maf having a gun.

I still don't think that setup is really making sense, feels really scum balanced since that would mean andante only has 1 maf they can out, I'm anti-town in role since I out PRs unless I get vanilla, doctor(s?) work against Koba. But I should really stop with this spec until we know more

I said I was checking my tr for a gun, and if they had one, I wouldn't have insta outed them, and just trusted them being town

[Andante]

scum is salsa/vfp/asteria I think...

VOTE: T3

give us some content please T3

This is when scum is just taking the piss out of town for being so bad.

god you're annoying

[Andante]

also, I'm not calling my NG'd person town just from having no gun....

You said earlier you were confident they're town. I guess now with setup spec we're looking at only 1 maf having a gun.

I still don't think that setup is really making sense, feels really scum balanced since that would mean andante only has 1 maf they can out, I'm anti-town in role since I out PRs unless I get vanilla, doctor(s?) work against Koba. But I should really stop with this spec until we know more

To me you're just really sounding like scum. not gonna lie, this "VT" you're gonna "out" is literally just going to be you as maf seeing if someone is pr or not.

[Andante]

god you're annoying

It's only going to get worse, I have no care in the game until 1 of us is the lim.

how about you lim yourself then?

[Andante]

I'm pretty sure town only had a cop and vig in that game too.

I want to know how do you make the connection of having a town cop.

Everytime you 2 talk, I read it as scum talking to scum. idk what it is

[Andante]

how about you lim yourself then?

No I'm fine with my vote.
Would you like to try and vote me here?

I'm good right now, Yall are good at speed voting people, I'd rather get some T3/Andres content here, probably some from Pooky too, cause pooky was the main dragon leader

[Andante]

also, I'm not calling my NG'd person town just from having no gun....

You said earlier you were confident they're town. I guess now with setup spec we're looking at only 1 maf having a gun.

I still don't think that setup is really making sense, feels really scum balanced since that would mean andante only has 1 maf they can out, I'm anti-town in role since I out PRs unless I get vanilla, doctor(s?) work against Koba. But I should really stop with this spec until we know more

To me you're just really sounding like scum. not gonna lie, this "VT" you're gonna "out" is literally just going to be you as maf seeing if someone is pr or not.

Sorry but you're wrong. And nobody incorrectly "outed" as a VT will ever be like well actually I'm a PR. PRs actively want scum to think they're just vanilla

riiight cause that's how this game ended up

[Andante]

VOTE: Asteria

I'm 100% down to speed vote this though lmao

[Andante]

so you all wanna call Koba fake vig/ assume VFP was rolestopped....

rolestopper on VFP makes about 0 sense.


Guys, lets consider Asteria for a second. D1 had 0 pr tells, panic claimed a gunned role here once I said they have a gun. I do not like Asteria's claim, and I also feel like VFP/Salsa are scum together, but I'll let yall do you

i mean yeah im with you, i wanna see an asteria lynch

i'm cool to sheep you on this one because that looked like caught scum to me

That was my biggest thing in that, at first she was like, "crap, idk what to do" and basically claimed not VT, like I had, then figured out a role to fake claim? idk, got super stressed about who has guns, which is why I think they regretted not roleblocking me as well, idk

[Andante]

And no one finds it odd that Andante doesn't want to speed lim me, but will others even though I am obviously the top scum read for them?

you've reached the point you're just really annoying, like that fly buzzing in your ear? so I'm about to just ignore you

[Andante]

I'll claim my result later. I want everyone to have a chance to give their thoughts before I say who it is. I'll be back tomorrow. Don't speed-eliminate anyone while I'm gone

haha ah yes, the classic "just give me some more time, and in that time someone else will be scummier"

[Andante]

if we're claiming how many guns we have.

I'm a town cowboy. I have two guns, I'm allowed to shoot up to two people a night or go into PGO mode and shoot two people who visit me, I'm looking for my horse who was stolen by a notorious horse-thief known as "Dutch Henry"

I'm a little sad here, Pooky lied about having two guns :/

[Andante]

mine

[Andante]

so you all wanna call Koba fake vig/ assume VFP was rolestopped....

rolestopper on VFP makes about 0 sense.


Guys, lets consider Asteria for a second. D1 had 0 pr tells, panic claimed a gunned role here once I said they have a gun. I do not like Asteria's claim, and I also feel like VFP/Salsa are scum together, but I'll let yall do you

i mean yeah im with you, i wanna see an asteria lynch

i'm cool to sheep you on this one because that looked like caught scum to me

Why

Asteria

's claim isn't believable to you?

did you not read the context around it?

[Andante]

like, what makes it super believable to you?

[Andante]

so you all wanna call Koba fake vig/ assume VFP was rolestopped....

rolestopper on VFP makes about 0 sense.


Guys, lets consider Asteria for a second. D1 had 0 pr tells, panic claimed a gunned role here once I said they have a gun. I do not like Asteria's claim, and I also feel like VFP/Salsa are scum together, but I'll let yall do you

i mean yeah im with you, i wanna see an asteria lynch

i'm cool to sheep you on this one because that looked like caught scum to me

Why

Asteria

's claim isn't believable to you?

did you not read the context around it?

you've reached the point you're just really annoying, like that fly buzzing in your ear? so I'm about to just ignore you

hold up, you refuse to interact with me at all, and you're comparing this to how VFP is, he's literally just antagonizing me, I'm asking you valid questions, none of which you're answering, I wonder why I'm scumreading you

[Andante]

Salsa. I fucking swear. if you keep quoting that.

[Andante]

whatever fuck yall, I need to step away

[Andante]

if we're claiming how many guns we have.

I'm a town cowboy. I have two guns, I'm allowed to shoot up to two people a night or go into PGO mode and shoot two people who visit me, I'm looking for my horse who was stolen by a notorious horse-thief known as "Dutch Henry"

I'm a little sad here, Pooky lied about having two guns :/

Here, Andante highlighted it.

lmao I found exactly what I think of, with pooky and his guns

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z5JFc8 ... Pangilinan[/youtube]

(maybe that works....)

"boom boom firepower" - Pooky

[Andante]

if we're claiming how many guns we have.

I'm a town cowboy. I have two guns, I'm allowed to shoot up to two people a night or go into PGO mode and shoot two people who visit me, I'm looking for my horse who was stolen by a notorious horse-thief known as "Dutch Henry"

I'm a little sad here, Pooky lied about having two guns :/

Here, Andante highlighted it.

lmao I found exactly what I think of, with pooky and his guns

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8z5JFc8 ... Pangilinan[/youtube]

(maybe that works....)

"boom boom firepower" - Pooky

lol didn't work, oh well. Night at the Museum, boom boom firepower XD

[Andante]

Okay that shifting claim is definitely worth executing - I find that Town rarely engage in that gamesmanship. You claimed something that would make you less likely to get visited, and you presumably give guns away? C’mon now.

ok but you know cowboys don't exist in normals right? lol

Pooky... You have... no guns.... got my hopes up for nothing :/

[Andante]

whatever fuck yall, I need to step away

hope u are ok

ty for caring <3 just had to step away and I'm not here seriously right now, just enough so I'm not stupid far behind later, and replying to stuff that's making me laugh lol

[Andante]

Okay that shifting claim is definitely worth executing - I find that Town rarely engage in that gamesmanship. You claimed something that would make you less likely to get visited, and you presumably give guns away? C’mon now.

ok but you know cowboys don't exist in normals right? lol

Pooky... You have... no guns.... got my hopes up for nothing :/

But what if...

I have..

The Ring of Power

Well, I can't check for rings... so I can not confirm nor deny that info, but I can confirm you don't go "pew pew"

[Andante]

yeah Asteria is scum here lmao the fact any of you would believe she's real at this point..

[Andante]

I think Asteria is only now picking VFP as the VT cause of how much pressure we've put on VFP and VFP hasn't cracked, so vfp was safe to go "yeah they're a vt"

Like, VFP's "I subtly said something" doesn't mean much, Asteria outed due to a panic claim, so of course she has to keep it. idk, I hate her initial claim, then waiting forever to out the vt, and her timing of it? no thanks

[Andante]

I just don't get why we'd have informed gs, weak vig, and a non consecutive night neo.. this isn't making any sense

[Andante]

we could always leave the neo alone, and yeet VFP, and VFP flipping scum confirms asteria. I just don't tr vfp

[Andante]

I mean yeah Andante I agree with you. I think the timing is suspect. I’m just trying to think logically through this.

same, cause logically yeeting a pr is a stupid idea, but like, ahhhhhh idk, why would scum inno their own partner, and I'm trying to think who dies tonight, neo 100% livescause it's non consecutive, I die, vig roleblocked again? so night kill won't help anything

[Andante]

Koba they wouldn’t have flipped though, you would have. See that’s the thing I don’t get. Why didn’t they just let you shoot? They could have easily WIFOM’ed out of that, argued that I looked the worst or something.

This theory makes

VFP

scum if

DkKoba

is town and roleblocked.

But only if the Scum knew that the Town would have figured out that Koba intended to shoot VFP. I’m not convinced that’s the case. Does that make sense?

it made perfect sense to roleblock vig there, I mean, they decided to kill tracker over me, so I see their thought process a bit lmao. I feel like Koba as scum there would've just claimed to have not shot cause they weren't sure on reads, like that's a super safe claim, that's also believable, but by claiming they shot, I think koba is legit

[Andante]

@Everyone

, should

Andante

reveal the name who she checked at the previous night atm?

Yeah we do need this information.

I already outed it

[Andante]

So salsa, maybe if you weren't so busy calling me annoying, you'd have seen the claim

[Andante]

it was pooky not gunned

[Andante]

Salsa, koba literally subbed in day end... this feels so much like scum, like, back to the dumbtelling stuff. You know fully well Koba just voted and left, the direction of this question? yeah no


VOTE: Salsa

[Andante]

it made perfect sense to roleblock vig there, I mean, they decided to kill tracker over me, so I see their thought process a bit lmao.

But it’s a weak Vig. If they shoot wrong, Town dies. Yeah the Vig is confirmed as existing and probably clears Koba. But so what? You have an extra Town death. If the Vig targets Scum, they die. And since Koba didn’t definitively say this is what I’m doing, then they could have WIFOM’ed out of that, or just let the Town speculate.

means there's probably only 1 doc, 2/3 chance koba would shoot scum, the fact the scum shot tracker there, shows their thought process isn't the best

[Andante]

I think Salsa's actions mixed with the "you're annoying" crap points to scum, I don't think town would be refusing to answer questions as much as salsa has, and I just overall get bad vibes from her slot

[Andante]

Also, I hate how T3 literally coasts all game then scumread someone off "vibes" like, the town T3 I've played with before actually tries... and builds cases...

[Andante]

So salsa, maybe if you weren't so busy calling me annoying, you'd have seen the claim

it was pooky not gunned

Thank you for the info, and I was actually ignoring your posts that time, and also sorry for annoying you

yeah, thinking you were so funny... saying I was acting like VFP who was literally just pestering me, not asking anything, the constant "Andante or me goes today!!!" yetI ask you questions and you blew me off. so whatever. I'm keeping my vote on you, I gave you a chance to interact with me yesterday, to which you thought it was funny to just piss me off, so I've said multiple times why you're scummy, and yeah, leaving vote here

[Andante]

What the Scum could have been thinking (but this is a massive trade-off) is that if Koba shoots incorrectly, and is cleared, then if they more firmly indicate where they’re shooting, it absolutely condemns someone if Koba comes out dead the following day. But I just don’t understand that. Clearly they have an RB. Until they make themselves obvious with their shot, you let them shoot. It’s negative utility. That’s just how I see it.

you're currently sounding like traitor pissed at your scum partners, and are trying to tell them to not roleblock Koba again. I could be wrong, but it just really feels like you're the traitor, with the number of times you keep saying this.

[Andante]

Wait so basically Pooky is Town almost for sure unless Traitor right? Might be interesting to see how that wagon was building yesterday.

ng means nothing really, pooky just can't claim cop lol

[Andante]

What the Scum could have been thinking (but this is a massive trade-off) is that if Koba shoots incorrectly, and is cleared, then if they more firmly indicate where they’re shooting, it absolutely condemns someone if Koba comes out dead the following day. But I just don’t understand that. Clearly they have an RB. Until they make themselves obvious with their shot, you let them shoot. It’s negative utility. That’s just how I see it.

you're currently sounding like traitor pissed at your scum partners, and are trying to tell them to not roleblock Koba again. I could be wrong, but it just really feels like you're the traitor, with the number of times you keep saying this.

You must think I’m an idiot.

no, not at all, whoever killed the tracker was not the smartest lmao so if that wasn't you, you're good! I'm just saying, you sound like the angry traitor XD

[Andante]

no, not at all, whoever killed the tracker was not the smartest lmao so if that wasn't you, you're good! I'm just saying, you sound like the angry traitor XD

I was openly dismissive of the Tracker Claim, strongly fighting the slot, and calling them Scum. I never shoot there. You must realize there aren’t a lot of situation a Scum containing me shoots there N1.

oh I know, just like osuka wouldn't have shot there, Koba wasn't even sure who the tracker claim was? which idk, if Koba was shooting VFP, a sr, they surely would've seen Robert was our tracker, so ehhh could koba be like an even night maf vig? but then that's super scum sided idk, I'm not sure on this setup, but salsa is acting exactly like I do as scum, so I'm more inclined to call her scum, the page analysis stuff... 100% me as scum, giant analysis posts/reactions to old old posts is super easy to do as scum, and it makes everyone tr you for 0 reason

[Andante]

Which almost certainly means that one of {Asteria, Koba} is Scum.

If there’s a Town RB, you probably never block Koba there. I would think. I can’t think of a good reason you would, unless you thought they were Scum and lying about their role.

Nope, Koba could have been roleblocked by scum. Scum wanted to get the "tracker", roleblock the vig, leave the GS because in this case scum only have 1 gun anyway so it's not very likely they would get checked (maybe this is indicative of Andante townreading the gun holding scum?).

I'm having a hard time not seeing this in bad faith Andres. I'm reading it as you want town to eliminate a PR while scum goes ahead and NKs another.

bad faith in andres? you sure about that? I really don't see andres killing Robert there

[Andante]

ill explain later but asteria admitting that they saw i would choose my shot based on flip and choosing the person people were scumreading most there is like peak admittance of guilt. like knowing that it was going to potentially be dead and checking it ? yeah ok.

like wow the person thats being pushed on is suddenly cleared lol

yeah they were flipping scum and u needed to pull a miracle out of your hat.

I didn't know you were shooting at vfp.

LMAO bs

[Andante]

Hey pooky,

you've had like no game related reaction today, what's up? you were the one who really wanted Dragons, we got you Dragons, and dragons flipped town, now you're basically MIA

[Andante]

Asteria, you said you checked VFP cause everyone was SRing the slot, but you also said you're trying to check VT's and not PR/Scum

I fail to see how checking a top level SR is trying to find a VT

[Andante]

Well, I think my vote will be in {

Asteria

,

VFP

} today and I also think having a mafia doc implies town has to have a killer role which clears

DkKoba

as a town.

VOTE: Asteria

That was also my thinking with Koba, like, no one here has CCed a killing role, yet Koba found themself E-2 at the start of day...

[Andante]

Asteria, you said you checked VFP cause everyone was SRing the slot, but you also said you're trying to check VT's and not PR/Scum

I fail to see how checking a top level SR is trying to find a VT

I didn't share the same scumread

so you decided to not take into account what people said? It's why I checked Pooky, cause of all the mixed comments on the slot, and reading your ISO, you had almost no interaction with VFP d1...

[Andante]

I'm kinda conflicted here, logic says don't vote a pr claim. Yet that's all people seem to want to do?

[Andante]

I need to think about this whole thing. Can somebody run down what they think it means if VFP flips VT? If VFP flips Scum, that’s really obvious. Asteria is Scum and we’re close to a victory. But if VFP flips Town?

VFP will flip town. Which honestly proves nothing about me which is frustrating. People are saying I could be scum who is guessing who the VTs are to claim them.

I'm half inclined to tell you to just vote me if you're going to try to elim VFP instead. At least then you know VFP is town when I flip neapolitan and I doubt I survive to D4 to out my next results anyway

I’m asking about what it means for other people’s alignments. It wouldn’t clear you completely but it definitely buys you a day probably you know that.

VFP flipping town means nothing for us. just like everyone is apparantly ignoring the Dragons town vote that everyone here was so confident in.... no matter how many times I told yall dragns town...

[Andante]

I'm half inclined to tell you to just vote me if you're going to try to elim VFP instead. At least then you know VFP is town when I flip neapolitan and I doubt I survive to D4 to out my next results anyway

Wanted to give that it's own post. If you end up set on VFP, elim me instead. You'll get more info that way, I won't survive to use my role again anyway

I don't think anyone is even voting vfp right now...

[Andante]

I have another unpopular idea.... wanna just go "yolo" and yeet T3?

[Andante]

and deal with the consequences of that later?

[Andante]

11 alive, 3 scum at most
d2 yeet town
8-9 alive, 3 scum
d3 yeet town
6-7 alive, 3 scum


~~~~~


Doing quick maths, even if we yeet a town here, we're fine, and we can potentially yeet another town and be fine, depends if vig shoots town

[Andante]

Asteria is hard town..

LMAO I SWEAR. Are you just lurking in this thread? You need to ellaborate on read if you expect us to listen. you also said Dragons was scum, and dragons flipped town. So feel free to ellaborate on why you fwel Asteria is town

[Andante]

Salsa is a fos for tomorrow, I'm on team "YOLO, yeet T3 and see what happens"

VOTE: T3

[Andante]

Asteria is hard town..

like, if you're claiming cop on Asteria, then we have other things to deal with, since cops have guns

[Andante]

So salsa, maybe if you weren't so busy calling me annoying, you'd have seen the claim

it was pooky not gunned

Thank you for the info, and I was actually ignoring your posts that time, and also sorry for annoying you

yeah, thinking you were so funny... saying I was acting like VFP who was literally just pestering me, not asking anything, the constant "Andante or me goes today!!!" yetI ask you questions and you blew me off. so whatever. I'm keeping my vote on you, I gave you a chance to interact with me yesterday, to which you thought it was funny to just piss me off, so I've said multiple times why you're scummy, and yeah, leaving vote here

Okay, I'm saying this straight rn, you're confbiasing me, and it's very difficult for me to change someone's mind who is tunneled/confbiased over me and have 0 capability to listen keeping an open mind. Every time I have been in this situation, every time it feels like I'm talking to a wall that is not useful at all and a total waste of time of mine. And it's my nature that I behave with people exactly the same way they're behaving with me.
Also, if you're not biased towards me, you should notice that I actually replied to you but later. You decided to read me as scum, then cherry toping from my posts to fit your read which is not productive at all.
So I just decide that I actually don't want to engage with you anymore, if I get an elimination for that, I've no problem cause I don't care. I'm pretty sure you'll keep scumreading me no matter what, so there is no point to engage with you anymore.

I mean, when I tried to un conf bias VFP, VFP yelled at me, and hey, I'm giving you more time, I'm yeeting T3, you're just a slot who's gotten 0 attention, so I'm a little sus of that, idk I have 1 solid tr here, and everyone else feels suspicious, and I guess I'm secretly hoping someone cracks under pressure

[Andante]

The game is over so I can talk about it now, the last time I YOLO yeeted someone not talking they flipped scum, soooo lmao

[Andante]

Happy Birthday VFP!!! Go enjoy the day!!! don't stress about this, I'll fight people trying to lim you in the next 24 hours

[Andante]

I'm kinda conflicted here, logic says don't vote a pr claim. Yet that's all people seem to want to do?

You could just vote Andres here.

but a T3 yeet..... sounds so tempting

[Andante]

I feel like scum is genuinely doing a good job not being scummy... except for T3... T3 scummy af, everyone else is doing good!! Pooky, is questionable... Can't wait for some real thoughts today from him...

[Andante]

omg I have over 500 posts... I'm so sorry guys...

[Andante]

yeah, no, limming you literally gives us nothing if you flip town, and is a really dumb move, like if asteria is real, you're conf town, don't worry, I give up on my case on you lmao, team YOLO yeet for the win

[Andante]

Asteria is hard town..

@ Salsa... T3 recently did talk!!! lmao

[Andante]

yeah Asteria is scum here lmao the fact any of you would believe she's real at this point..

between asteria and vfp, whos your exec today?

obv it'd be asteria, but I'm not down with a pr elim here

[Andante]

I can’t find a really strong justification for the first one, and since it doesn’t quite square with a VT Claim and check, I’m leaning towards the second.

VFP is town. If you're town try looking at the game with the assumption I am being honest here, even just temporarily

if i assume youre being honest, the game state makes very little sense. why would mafia shoot the tracker but leave a gs alive? why the fuck did you check vfp? how did the weak vig not die?

the scenario that makes the most sense in my mind is vig got rb'd and didn't die because of that, even if i'm not sure why scum would rb a weak vig. maybe they didn't trust that claim? I don't know if i would

my guess is maf didn't realize what weak vig was, and that matches them killing the tracker claim lmao

[Andante]

I'm kinda conflicted here, logic says don't vote a pr claim. Yet that's all people seem to want to do?

that's not entirely true is it

it takes zero effort to fakeclaim tpr as scum

I know!! and Asteria panic claimed neo, but half me is like, what if Asteria really is neo, but I believe nothing about the claim, including the fact she checked VFP for VT, and non consecutive neo?? idk really not making sense to me, like, the vig has to be real, so our only investigative stuff is me/ a non consecutive VT checker???

[Andante]

Asking for a lot but can you guys trust me for a bit and help me out with eliming andres? Honestly I think I could do osuka too.

I don't want to elim T3 or pooky from my pool.

Salsa and anya I'm not particularly interested in eliming but I could compromise there.

Those are my options

dude, this is the definition of self preservation. 0 chance osuka kills robert there. wanna chop Andres and if he's town you go tomorrow?

[Andante]

I feel like scum is genuinely doing a good job not being scummy... except for T3... T3 scummy af, everyone else is doing good!! Pooky, is questionable... Can't wait for some real thoughts today from him...

t3 has done literally fucking nothing all game and the only reason for an exec there is policy, but i think there are far better options here and doing a policy exec with at least one fakeclaim on the board is really stupid

exactly, he's had plenty of chances TO do something, not towny, thus.... YOLO

[Andante]

what could possibly go wrong with a YOLO yeet... just saying, I've already gotten all our PRs out lmao

[Andante]

actually wondering if i should vote vfp instead

we gain nothing from a vfp elim here, I'd rather get asteria than vfp

[Andante]

actually wondering if i should vote vfp instead

we gain nothing from a vfp elim here, I'd rather get asteria than vfp

[Andante]

oh LOOK it's almost as if i said this like 1500 posts ago

like i'll cut you some slack here but i can't sit here and say yeah it's okay to flashtrain a lurker because that's just actually fucking stupid and it's anti-town, because that's essentially a random slot you're lynching and statistically that slot is town

ok, at what point are they required to talk? cause not talking is clearly working for T3, and I guarantee he plans on contining this all game

[Andante]

no i mean dont get me wrong, id love to get rid of the lurker but i'm saying there are better slots to kill here. if killing vfp does nothing for us in terms of information, what the fuck does a t3 exec do? there's not even associatives to make for that slot

I mean if we take out VFP, and Asteria really is a neo... At least with T3, there's a chance he's scum, like, I think he's half paying attention to this game, and he'd be a scum who killed tracker and roleblocked the weak vig...

[Andante]

but if yall are gonna yeet asteria, I'm not really opposed to that

[Andante]

that whole reaction check felt pretty fake to me. would not be surprised in the slightest if VFP is scum and Asteria's claim is baloney. mafdoc!VFP, anyone?

i agree with the first part but what makes vfp the mafia doctor specifically?

if you're gonna pick a scum to clear as VT in order to solidify a neapo fakeclaim, why not kill two birds with one stone and "confirm" your most powerful role as VT?

even if this is true and vfp is scum, I feel like we'd need to get Asteria first

[Andante]

ehh I'll bite VOTE: Asteria

worst case, Asteria is real, but VFP would be confirmed town

[Andante]

right exactly. the worst outcome is okay i guess

yeah like, VFP being confirmed town honestly would not be bad, and having a conf town would be super nice here

[Andante]

and i dont even think were in that situation tbh. i'm fairly confident asteria is scum

oh same, I think how she claimed and all that was so bad

[Andante]

an Asteria lim today is probably my top choice but not sure how i feel about putting her down to L-1 so early into D2. agree with what's been said about the pros and cons of a VFP vs Asteria lim

there's 0 pros to getting VFP first, also it's VFP's birthday, so We're not chopping VFP right now

[Andante]

in fact if asteria flips nea i think i'm gonna be looking at you for scum next

lmaoo I mean, it sounds like you're setting up for her to flip town

[Andante]

im gunsmith. not scum my friend

[Andante]

I don't get why you guys want to flip the claimed TPR on d2

What's your next plan after the Dragons elim? you really wanted that one, and it was town

[Andante]

im gunsmith. not scum my friend

well if youre alive tomorrow i think thats really funny. if asteria flips nea, why on earth would scum keep a gs alive?

well now scum will likely do it cause you said you'd get me :/

[Andante]

i maintain that salsa is probably scum here regardless of whatever asteria flips though. i cant imagine a way that asteria flipping red or green clears salsa

I agree with salsa scum

[Andante]

so really if somehow asteria flips nea, and if somehow you make it to d3, i think we need to have a talk about why the fuck that even happened and the fact that a claimed gunsmith is alive on d3 is alone reason enough to ask questions

well if Asteria is nia, then I have effectively helped scum out more than town this game, but I doubt I'll live, we can evaluate it if I do

[Andante]

VOTE: Andres

Yeah, I can't justify voting out a pr right now

[Andante]

I mean, Asteria, I'm super scared you're real, cause then I'm toast lmao

[Andante]

T3, we'd love some explanations with your reads....

[Andante]

I mean, Asteria, I'm super scared you're real, cause then I'm toast lmao

I am real

I mean, it's like I sr salsa and T3, and neither of those are people that anyone wants to get, so I'm forced to follow whatever other wagon, and idk

[Andante]

T3, is there a reason you're not like voicing reads, saying who you'd like to elim, you had no thoughts on Asteria's claim, like, please fam, use some words it's driving me crazy

[Andante]

and honestly that slot doesn't even deserve this volume of discussion around it because the more i think about the fact that he's got 30 fucking posts in a game with 110 pages, the more annoyed i get

why do you think I was down to YOLO yeet him?

[Andante]

people choosing to not participate genuinely makes me mad, cause I'm over here putting in lots of effort/time, then the low effort folks... yeah Haschel had nothing good for us, and neither is T3

[Andante]

Anya.... I look forward to hearing more, idk, I kinda liked her at the end with STD where she agreed to not hammer STD, then I forced her to lmao

[Andante]

and honestly that slot doesn't even deserve this volume of discussion around it because the more i think about the fact that he's got 30 fucking posts in a game with 110 pages, the more annoyed i get

why do you think I was down to YOLO yeet him?

yeah honestly it's a pretty stupid thing to do but i'm warming up to the idea

I mean... me claiming was also stupid, I could have played better and avoided the whole thing... I'd say norms have been tossed out the window this game lmao like, I'd bet T3 is only here right now because of all this talk of yeeting that slot... means it has a decent shot at flipping scum...

[Andante]

So the game is over so I can talk about it? I was super towny, gave T3 a super towny slot to sub into,
viewtopic.php?p=12717548&user_select%5B ... #p12717548

Just skimming their ISO of that game... compared to lines from this game... Like, I literally can not see T3 as town

[Andante]

Sure the game I linked was less players, less posts, but I'm not seeing any glimpse of T3 actively trying to find scum, when I know they are capable of it

[Andante]

Like, I don't remember the exact context I subbed out there and left him in, but like, I look at the effort there... and so I know he's capable of it, here there's way more content, yet... the lines we get from T3 are either not game related or "Pretty sure STD is scum at this point" with no further explanation as to why.. and T3 is jumping on any wagon, seeming to randomly play

[Andante]

like honestly a 30 second skim convinced me that he knows how to put in effort and just didn't decide to do it here, so yeah i'm fine with getting him the fuck out of this game already

i'm warming to the idea of that flipping scum too because he's made zero prods and pokes and he clearly knows how to do that

haha yeah that linked game was still IP earlier, so I was like, I know I can't link it yet, but to me, if T3 is town here, I have no idea what he's trying to accomplish, only logical explanation is scum, YOLO time to yeet him!!!


VOTE: T3

[Andante]

okay so let's suppose for a second t3 isn't scum. who's your exec today? andres?

ideally T3, I'm done with his antics, idk about andres, salsa would be a good elim, idk, if someone has a good case for someone, I'd love to hear it, but considering neither Haschel nor T3 are taking the game too seriously? yeah..

[Andante]

Pooky might end up on the chopping block tbh, tomorrow though, I was T3 gone first, but pooky is like "oops, people are wrong on reads" in reaction to dragons being town, and we haven't heard anything good from him on d2, has no gun, so could be the maf doc

[Andante]

Time to try so we don't throw another townie off a cliff.

LMAOO hey, if you can bring forth some valid reads (reads include reasonings) I'm down to listen to them, it's just kinda funny the situation it took to get to this point where you're like "ok, now I'll try"

[Andante]

That game is honestly a complete shit show. It’s actually quite entertaining.

lmao it's funny looking back, pissed me off way too much, I subbed out cause of that, and I've literally never subbed out before :/ I randomly tunneled a scum D1, they OMGUS'd me, the 2nd one slipped.. scum chat that game was beautiful, I love HOG so much

[Andante]

Asteria is employing a classic Scum play I have seen before. I can even point to the exact game. They are saying trust me, execute Andrés, and if Town, you can try me tomorrow. But things will be drastically different tomorrow. And they know it.

I’m happy executing {T3, Asteria}. They have all either hard TR each other, linked themselves mechanically, or tried to dissuade others from pushing in between them. I can’t understand it.

@Koba you better not be pocketing me here. I should be suspicious of you calling me Town so surely and under pressure when you’ve always been suspicious of me in games.

Asteria... like, I'm almost certain Asteria is flipping scum, but in the off chance they're town... If Asteria is town, it's a role mafia will kill, and if Asteria is town, vfp is town, meaning we need a read in Pooky/T3/Anya and those 3 are about on the same page for relevant content this game... and they're going to be a pain to read, unless Pooky does something... Pooky would be the easiest of those to read

[Andante]

That game is honestly a complete shit show. It’s actually quite entertaining.

lmao it's funny looking back, pissed me off way too much, I subbed out cause of that, and I've literally never subbed out before :/ I randomly tunneled a scum D1, they OMGUS'd me, the 2nd one slipped.. scum chat that game was beautiful, I love HOG so much

I might go find it, it’s so bad. It has to be the worst collective Scum play ever. Like a long post revealing their Partner, self-voting, and the day ending in a No execution?! How?! I have never seen such play before. Unbelievable. I can be self-critical at times, but I have never done

that

.

lol HOG posted something that made 0 sense in the context, I don't think it revealed the partner, but it's like, it was a very obscure post that had everyone going like "whhhaaat??" lmao it was a funny game, but hey, T3 played that completely differently from this...

[Andante]

I'm not sure if I'm voting or not, but I'll give T3 some time, we're almost 3000 posts in, I'd love to see something from the slot, but basically consider my vote on T3, but I want reads from him before I lim him

UNVOTE:

[Andante]

Why is Asteria so uninterested in flipping T3? They had Robert and SMH as Scum, voted STD, and had them as a compromise vote. And yet, they have cleared them after they called them hard Town? How is that even remotely acceptable?

cause T3 is likely a partner.... Asteria isn't the powerful scum thus "get me first"

[Andante]

Why is Asteria so uninterested in flipping T3? They had Robert and SMH as Scum, voted STD, and had them as a compromise vote. And yet, they have cleared them after they called them hard Town? How is that even remotely acceptable?

cause T3 is likely a partner.... Asteria isn't the powerful scum thus "get me first"

Yeah but you know I tend to think games are hard and the answers are never straightforward. I’m beginning to think there’s some setting up going on here. Though to be honest T3’s play looks pretty horrible from an ISO perspective but it could be completely uninterested Town.

I mean, the only setting up I see is osuka setting me up to not die, but Haschel said twice he'd say something after work... never did. T3... sounds like he's outing fake reads/ jumping on any bw.. I'm not so sure that slot is bored town

[Andante]

And Asteria clearing T3 just shows that they’re not looking at the slot particularly carefully. Like it doesn’t make sense. They don’t want to execute amongst the PRs, but the players they’re happy to leave off are Pooky and T3? Like c’mon now this truly doesn’t make sense.

nothing in this game is making sense anymore

[Andante]

It strikes me as if someone here clearly has insider information. I don’t understand how any of this is possible otherwise.

so the solution is just yeet Asteria since she seems to be in the center of it?

[Andante]

It strikes me as if someone here clearly has insider information. I don’t understand how any of this is possible otherwise.

so the solution is just yeet Asteria since she seems to be in the center of it?

I think T3’s progression is more suspicious. They could be right about Asteria and Asteria just going wrong.

I'm willing to give T3 a bit more time to come up with actual reads, like, idk, I feel like if they were town and behind they'd have said something instead of faking reads all along, so like, idk, I feel like T3 is behind, but he's been faking reads, struggling along, but it's also like, if you're town, you don't fake reads, you just say you're behind. I'm conflicted at the moment. this is why I was YOLO yeeting T3. No 2nd thoughts. just doing it

[Andante]

Asteria is employing a classic Scum play I have seen before. I can even point to the exact game. They are saying trust me, execute Andrés, and if Town, you can try me tomorrow. But things will be drastically different tomorrow. And they know it.

pretty sure ive done that at least once but i dont think you were in that game

I’ve seen an excellent Scum player do it against a Town player and I called them out on it the next day, and instead they succeeded in not getting killed. I almost rage quit it was spectacularly frustrating. I think I actually got executed in the end instead.

https://forum.mafia451.com/t/sodope-maf ... =andresvmb

I actually went looking for it in my old forum and found it. In case you wanted to read it. Josh is the player that did it in that game.

LMAO "I give up. Get me out of this game. This Town is truly horrible." I know that feeling really well

[Andante]

I'm cracking up over here LMAOOO

"Loving this game btw" the timing of that was gold

[Andante]

I also tr t3, based on knowing who they are as a player

Ok perfect. T3 goes.

VOTE: T3

[Andante]

fine, I'll go asteria

VOTE: Asteria

[Andante]

am i bored? yes

am i sick and tired of this shit? absolutely

am i gonna pull out my python hat to explain why? you betcha

let's look at some beautiful graphs. here you can see the post count by player, and you'll notice T3 hasn't done fucking anything:

source: the post counts

an interesting insight. i decided to pursue this line of investigation further, and i came up with the following:

source: the post counts

it seems like t3 replaced into a slot that hadn't done fucking anything, either! this seems like an outlier in this game, so it warrants a bit of research. let's look at the following:

source: t3's iso

it looks like that slot somehow managed to only make shit posts so far! those are not to be confused with shitposts, which are not shit. let's contrast this with my own posts:

source: my iso

i will leave figuring out which one of my posts is shit as an exercise to the reader.

let us look at some related data:

source: yo mama hahaha

in this graph, notice that the line is also shit-colored. this is not by coincidence.

the astute among you may realize that, then, there may be a correlation between the quality of the thread and the aforementioned data points. that would be correct - let us look at a graph of post quality over time:

source: my ass

conclusion:
T3 is a slot that has somehow avoided adding anything of value whatsoever to this game and, as a result, is pissing me off. whether or not t3 actually wants to play this game or is just fucking with us is unclear; further research is warranted.

LMAO I LOVE THE GRAPHS, I have the most posts by a lot XD

[Andante]

We could always lim scum Andres

nah we can't Andres is fun, fun people can't go

[Andante]

t3 could easily be demotivated wolf tbh he pops in regularly enough where it appears like he's reading but he doesn't really have any comments or reads to give and those are a lot more effort to fake as wolf so maybe he's fatigued and ran out of energy drinks

there's probably one wolf in dkkoba and asteria and it still feels dkkoba to me for the stuff they were saying earlier

so if it's between t3 and asteria VOTE: T3

this makes no sense and feels like a last ditch effort to push the wagon off asteria lmao

I disagree with that. Anya had her vote parked on Asteria D1, if makes no sense for the D1 thing to have been a bus.

have u ever heard of ~scum theater~?

ooh pick me!! I have!!! I've participated in it a lot!!!

[Andante]

pshhhh having fun is the reason town kept me alive as confirmed scum one time, then town ended up losing, it was so funny, not saying I'm scum here, but I'd rather have fun, like, I have my reads, I'm caught up, and I can spam this thread for the rest of yall, sorry not sorry. just think, it'll be like a ghost town around here when I'm gone

[Andante]

I'm still torn, my mind is super confused, not sure I can justify elimming this town pr...


UNVOTE: Asteria

[Andante]

like, playing like "well if she is town, we know VFP town" I really feel like that's not the optimal plan here. ahhhhh

[Andante]

my mind is in shambles right now trying to figure out a move that sounds good...

[Andante]

Well that flip definitely would have made for some unhappy scum.

VOTE: anya

like, what scum starts the day with this. I think she's flipping town

[Andante]

and vig + neo being real isn't fully out of the picture, no one else jumped in claiming cop, ahhhhh I just need to collect my thoughts. Pooky help please!! I need some direction on where to go

[Andante]

Yeah, but I'm not thinking about a T3 flip instead of Asteria anymore, like, I'm thinking about finding an actual scumread.

[Andante]

Cause literally everyone on the Asteria train keeps saying she's flipping neo, I don't feel good about it... ahhh

[Andante]

Yeah, but I'm not thinking about a T3 flip instead of Asteria anymore, like, I'm thinking about finding an actual scumread.

name starts with an a and ends in ndresvmb

I was thinking more along the lines of starts with s and ends in alsabil Faria

[Andante]

Yeah, but I'm not thinking about a T3 flip instead of Asteria anymore, like, I'm thinking about finding an actual scumread.

That would make sense if scum want to selim a pr but still seem like reluctant voters.

I truly can not justify elimmming a pr claim coming from a towny mindset either, like, I get the claim was sketchy... but I feel like maf would be more inclined to start with silence here and "WTF?" in scum chat about their kill..

[Andante]

I could see Lemons scum as well

[Andante]

Yeah, but I'm not thinking about a T3 flip instead of Asteria anymore, like, I'm thinking about finding an actual scumread.

name starts with an a and ends in ndresvmb

I was thinking more along the lines of starts with s and ends in alsabil Faria

i can also get behind this if you think asteria is a bad exec, which is also something ive said

yes I know you've said it, but you're just 1 person. I'd rather not get Asteria or T3 here, my mind is so confused though an I haven't even been drinking tonight, I'll sort stuff out tomorrow and get back to yall, but I'm not voting asteria or T3 at the end of this, or andres either

[Andante]

sorry to keep flip flopping on and off of asteria but we have more than enough time and i want to talk this through even if it turns out i'm being stupid

exactly we have plenty of time.

alright, what's the plan here? not sure I like the fast wagon on the neo claim...

[Andante]

sorry to keep flip flopping on and off of asteria but we have more than enough time and i want to talk this through even if it turns out i'm being stupid

exactly we have plenty of time.

alright, what's the plan here? not sure I like the fast wagon on the neo claim...

yes
exactly

Who would you elim here and why?

[Andante]

sorry to keep flip flopping on and off of asteria but we have more than enough time and i want to talk this through even if it turns out i'm being stupid

exactly we have plenty of time.

alright, what's the plan here? not sure I like the fast wagon on the neo claim...

yes
exactly

Who would you elim here and why?

Probably Andres for lack of interaction. Maybe Pooky for not doing anything, I'm rethinking my tr.

Ok, other than people for not doing anything, has anyone done something you find suspicious?

[Andante]

sorry to keep flip flopping on and off of asteria but we have more than enough time and i want to talk this through even if it turns out i'm being stupid

exactly we have plenty of time.

alright, what's the plan here? not sure I like the fast wagon on the neo claim...

it was a sketchy claim and asteria was in plenty of people's scumpools already by the end of D1. think about it -- if you know there's a gunsmith and they might target you or one of your buddies, what kind of gunned PR claim do you want to make? probably one where you:

don't have to provide results every day (check!)
can clear your buddies as conftown (check!)
don't have to clear your buddies as PRs, thus eliminating the need to explain why they haven't been NK'd (check!)
don't claim an especially powerful role, so that it's plausible you yourself wouldn't be NK'd (check!)

i'm just saying, it's an extremely optimal fakeclaim that could've easily been hashed out as a contingency plan in scumchat. in the same position as scum, i probably would've done something very similar.

@asteria in your perfect world where andres and salsa are the next 2 elims (imagining for the sake of the hypothetical that no one is NK'd),

who do you check N3?

p-edit @VFP if you're VT, it might actually be in scum's best interest to kill you tonight if asteria flips neapolitan. they can eliminate the only 100% conftown player, and continue to cast doubt on andante's claim by not making her the NK. koba will probably self-resolve tonight either way, so that's less of a motivation than i'd originally thought, but in the universe where asteria is neapolitan this does seem like an okay scum strategy that negates the mechanical utility of flipping asteria today in a worst-case scenario.

I mean true.. I'd bet scum brainstormed a claim in case I checked them, and Asteria took that claim... I might be down to just kill this neo claim, the claim itself is PERFECT for scum, like, it couldn't be much better... I might just yeet asteria tbh then we go from there, like I'm liking T3 a bit more, but idk, not sold he's town yet... I'm kinda down with just hammering day here with an Asteria elim, and we discus stuff tomorrow

[Andante]

VOTE: Asteria

She's E-1 now

[Andante]

I find it a little weird VFP doesn't think to question Asteria at all... like, sure you're VT and someone guessed correctly that you are, just feels like VFP has no doubt with Asteria, so I'm not so sure she's actually neo

[Andante]

I also tr t3, based on knowing who they are as a player

Ok perfect. T3 goes.

VOTE: T3

Yeah, but I'm not thinking about a T3 flip instead of Asteria anymore, like, I'm thinking about finding an actual scumread.

what happened between these 2 posts? why are you liking T3 "a bit more"?

it's kinda meta stuff, I think I understand his playstyle a little more idk we'll see if he has a gun tonight

[Andante]

it's not strong. it's just, he's not worth me tunneling right now, when I know therre's better options

[Andante]

like, he could be completely fooling me right now.. I have no clue what his scum game looks like. I'm fine with yeeting Asteria, if she's town, I'm sus of Koba. like really sus

[Andante]

I find it a little weird VFP doesn't think to question Asteria at all... like, sure you're VT and someone guessed correctly that you are, just feels like VFP has no doubt with Asteria, so I'm not so sure she's actually neo

It's more that voting off someone who can potentially get a result tomorrow, or at least force scum to make a choice if the 3 PRs are all town seems better than a lim here.
You're looking to lim for the claim, more than for being scum. It's day 2 and that's just makes no sense to me.

On the side though, I think Asteria is town here. They should only be considered scum here if I am.
I'm not sure why they would be accepting to be the lim over me other wise. Not to mention picking me as VT was an un needed risk since I've been for 1 of the PR claims to be scum.
If I were going to be the lim anyway, it wouldn't hurt to claim someone else as VT.

UNVOTE:

see that's where I'm torn, it'll force scum to make a decision, and she could be an every night neo, just saying non consecutive to not die here...

[Andante]

Like, I just don't know a good alternative. I was gonna say salsa, that slot is subbing, so whoever can catch up. Pooky scum? I have no clue

[Andante]

I do not like how pooky hasn't done anything today...

[Andante]

like honestly, I feel like T3 is looking better than Pooky right now...

[Andante]

If Asteria is fake, I think she just randomly picked someone everyone fossed. Like, I'm confused why she picks someone everyone else was sus of, then goes "well I didn't fos VFP" like, she also never said she TRed VFP either d1... idk, I'm kinda just down with yeeting her and just a "sorry if wrong" mindset


like, so many are already voting her, and most have barely said anything, like Koba and osuka are so convinced she's flipping scum... yet idk

[Andante]

I do not like how pooky hasn't done anything today...

I don't understand the Asteria wagon and I'd love for someone to explain why Asteria is like definitely scum here

who's a better vote here?

[Andante]

I believe the 4 voting are the ones who are super convinced, but like the same reason we didn't yeet the tracker d1... logic is telling me to not yeet the neo claim... let maf deal withit

[Andante]

I find it a little weird VFP doesn't think to question Asteria at all... like, sure you're VT and someone guessed correctly that you are, just feels like VFP has no doubt with Asteria, so I'm not so sure she's actually neo

It's more that voting off someone who can potentially get a result tomorrow, or at least force scum to make a choice if the 3 PRs are all town seems better than a lim here.
You're looking to lim for the claim, more than for being scum. It's day 2 and that's just makes no sense to me.

On the side though, I think Asteria is town here. They should only be considered scum here if I am.
I'm not sure why they would be accepting to be the lim over me other wise. Not to mention picking me as VT was an un needed risk since I've been for 1 of the PR claims to be scum.
If I were going to be the lim anyway, it wouldn't hurt to claim someone else as VT.

only she couldn't potentially get a result tomorrow unless she's lying about the non-consecutive bit. we'll be waiting at least 2 more days and who knows what will have happened by then.

you also both keep raising this point about how Very Town it was of asteria to choose you as VT and to Selflessly And Heroically suggest herself as the lim instead. it's a towntell under most circumstances, sure, but you guys seem very determined to keep reminding us just how much of a towntell it is.

also: skimming through your ISO, 2566 catches my eye. i didn't bother reading into it at first, but the more i think about it the more my head hurts. these are the relevant posts:

My conftown result is VFP

I targeted them because people were scumreading them at the end of the day and I didn't think they were scum.

Asteria is lying.

oh you're saying you're not VT vfp? that would make things easy

VFP is most definitely VT. I'm not sure why they think I'm lying

I guess you picked the wrong person there. Was a worthy try.

Nice reaction test. And very understandable since people think I'm playing a guessing game with it

I am 100% certain VFP is VT

UNVOTE: Asteria
I am VT for the record. I also did a subtle post to make Asteria not want to pick me if they were lying.

Just give the name of the VT so I can convince them that Andante is scum.

the idea here is that by subtly crumbing PR while actually being VT, you are trying to coax lying!asteria into picking someone who isn't VT and will catch her in a lie. the problem with this is that you had no reason, as far as i can tell, to suspect that asteria would pick you in the first place if lying. you weren't obvtown D1, you hadn't claimed or crumbed VT. so what was the motivation for this "test" besides providing support for the idea that you really are VT? the more i look at it the more i start to read it as scum!VFP creating evidence for themself that they can fall back on after a planned "VFP is VT" result from asteria. this back-and-forth between VFP and asteria could easily be an example of the same -- them creating evidence of a reaction test to save themselves if questions were raised about the veracity of the nea claim. am i going full tinfoil? it's possible, but when there is conclusive proof that they are definitely the same alignment, it does raise the odds of this being scum collaboration.

> only she couldn't potentially get a result tomorrow unless she's lying about the non-consecutive bit
* Yeah, if she's real, she's either lying about the consecutive bit and will have a report tomorrow, or will be dead D4, Scum has already proven they'll kill the scummy PR claims (they killed Robert when they really didn't have to)

* I probably missed a lot of the "how much of a towntell it was to pick VFP" but to be fair, I did say D1 I was gun checking VFP, and Asteria was like "We probably checked the same person" - She's probably real tbh

* Yeah the issue with VFP subtly claiming pr, was that Asteria was stuck with this neo claim after I forced her to claim it, so whichever VT she picked, she had to stick with it.

honestly... I think Asteria really is neo, but neo could be town or scum, maybe not... ahhh tbh I shouldn't have knowingly let town!Dragons die d1

[Andante]

it doesnt matter what I think

it matters whether YOU are super sure asteria is flipping red

I'm sheeping you again

[Andante]

i kinda dont really want that responsibility cuz I could just be wrong.

I just want to know what every1 is seeing in Asteria's play that makes them want to kill her even when she's claiming a Neop

I mean, I'm down with voting her cause no one else is attempting to find scum, just "well if she's real we have VFP town" like, I can't solve this game by myself, and the others aren't doing a whole lot, lemons is now, and everyone else has been MIA

[Andante]

tbh I think I'd be good with an Anya elim. the timing of when she shows up here.. is very convinient