Seconded.In post 75, Flubbernugget wrote:Culted, please remove your fos on everyone. It's making the vote counts hard to read.
I kinda like Kairal, Cloud, and Mini so far.
Grey's vote was opportunistic.
Seconded.In post 75, Flubbernugget wrote:Culted, please remove your fos on everyone. It's making the vote counts hard to read.
Thought Flubber was addressing the mod.In post 77, I Am Innocent wrote:Seconded.In post 75, Flubbernugget wrote:Culted, please remove your fos on everyone. It's making the vote counts hard to read.
Yeah the half day came and went. If I can't get caught up by the end of the weekend, I'll replace out. Sorry all and thanks for your patienceIn post 270, I Am Innocent wrote:Sorry busy in real life. Tomorrow is a half day for me so will catch up then. My apologies all
I assume you mean his town meta? How is his scum meta different?In post 287, MiniDeathStar wrote:That's kind of part of his meta on Day 1.In post 286, Flubbernugget wrote:That being said (as I've highlighted already) Saj is doing very little
Cause I'm a good scum hunter and you are apparently bad as scum.In post 598, Secret Agent Jin wrote:How did i get lumped in your scumreads? Is there reasoning?In post 597, I Am Innocent wrote:I assume you mean his town meta? How is his scum meta different?In post 287, MiniDeathStar wrote:That's kind of part of his meta on Day 1.In post 286, Flubbernugget wrote:That being said (as I've highlighted already) Saj is doing very little
As of this post, my top 3 scum reads are Jin, IO, & Newman.
Can I finish my catchup first? Make sure I still feel good about this list as I still have 12 pages to go.In post 599, -Grey- wrote:Why aren't you voting one of them, then?In post 597, I Am Innocent wrote:I assume you mean his town meta? How is his scum meta different?In post 287, MiniDeathStar wrote:That's kind of part of his meta on Day 1.In post 286, Flubbernugget wrote:That being said (as I've highlighted already) Saj is doing very little
As of this post, my top 3 scum reads are Jin, IO, & Newman.
This post of mine was out there for five days, why are you just responding to it now?In post 600, -Grey- wrote:Speaking of voting, yours was hypocritical.
At four pages into a game, EVERY vote is opportunistic. Including yours.
I expect to try to find what your agenda is. Are you saying you missed a vote on you back on page 4? Then missed my name next to yours each vote count thereafter?In post 604, -Grey- wrote:What do you expect that question to accomplish?In post 603, I Am Innocent wrote:This post of mine was out there for five days, why are you just responding to it now?
Do you think scum or town are more/less likely to miss a post?
aka, let me find a horrid reason to move from my single vote on cloud/shadow to the already formed wagon of two MDS.In post 544, HellloooNewman wrote:Building a case? It's day 1. The post you're referring to was on page 6 (if I recall correctly). I gave you my thoughts/read on what I felt was the scummiest play so far. To me, CK was not playing a pro town game. From "hard claiming scum", to feeling the need to remind everyone that he "made a townslip", to his bizarre fight with MDS.In post 380, Aj The Epic wrote:And 'hungry/happy' is actually 'hellooo' for HelloNewman....
His post 79 is fine, calling CK out for congratulating himself on a townslip is all well and good. The only issue is HelloNewman never actually interacts with anyone outside of CK and tunnels a bit that he's scum long after most of us have him as town. I don't mind contradictory viewpoints, but with an unpopular view comes a burden of proof, and I don't think Newman attempts that at all in his post. His reasoning CK is scum doesn't change at all (propped himself up on a townslip) even though he challenges CK multiple times through different wordings for the same thing. As I've said, I feel CK's play there was anti-town (aka looking at himself instead of others) but still NAI. Newman should've been tasked at building a case to actually make something happen rather than just stating he didn't like CK. At that point in time, nothing was happening with CK as a wagon so he either needed to drop it and refocus or force a real reason behind it.
So that's what I've got on Newman for the 4 posts so far.
Speaking of which.....
Here's the thing. We KNOW that Cloud was replaced because he was playing against his wincon. We know this because the mod told us so. Now, I'm not saying that the mod "lied" when he later attempted to clarify. I believe that the mod accidentally said too much when announcing he was replacing Cloud, and was simply trying to cover for it and progress the game, hop get that would be the end of it.In post 409, -Grey- wrote:No. You're mod-confirmed to share alignment. It's the only way a force replacement over playing against wincon makes ANY sense.In post 374, MiniDeathStar wrote:I'm going to repeat this: nobody has confirmed that CK and I share alignment. Do not assume he's conftown when I die as town, or assume I'm conftown or confscum if he dies as town/scum. Like, pretty please.
The second one of you dies, we'll know the date of the other. I just happen to believe you're both town.
So, Cloud was playing against his wincon. Which means that when he locked his vote onto MDS for the game, he was playing against his wincon. That is only accomplished in 1 way. If they are BOTH scum. If they are opposite alignments, then him voting her is not against wincon. If they were both town, then his voting her is not against wincon (because as town, Cloud would have no way of knowing that MDS was also town). However, if both are scum, that would punch the ticket.
I'm more than happy to lynch either MDS or Shadow today, preferably MDS. She is a strong voice that, as scum, could really dictate the narrative to the scum advantage.
Unvote Cloud/Shadow
Vote MDS
Why did you address this to him vs. other people that have voted MDS post-cloud force replace?In post 547, Secret Agent Jin wrote:@Newman: You reali that if MDS flips town then you would most likely be next, right?
I'm sorry I fell behind or I would have been there the whole time with you on this.In post 572, culted wrote:I'm sad that nobody wanted to vote this with me.In post 508, Secret Agent Jin wrote:Well its blatantly obvious to me who scum is, ill give you a hint, its flubber. He doesnt take much interest in the game until he feels he can strike at an opportune time and argue his way into getting a player lynched. He also, like Massive, doesnt really explain much. He also is just pointing fingers at MDS and pushing the points she is making aside. Its sort of like when you argue with your parents and they say "That doesnt matter, listen to me, i am the parent" he is just deflecting what she says with minimal effort.
Pretty much sums up where I'm at at this point.In post 573, culted wrote:@modAn actual votecount instead of just saying "VC" would be great. : )
Rather a newman lynch > massive at the moment. With massive he's got a track record of bonking heads with mds so the benefit of the doubt that he's just tunneled and omgusing is there and despite how bad the push is as a whole I can kinda see the where he's coming from on the 'protest too much' stuff if I squint.
And on the other hand, like grey said, newmans mds vote is just pure opportunism.
My other preferences are jin and io; more enthusiastic about jin. Also kinda don't think these two are scum together.
Wouldn't end the day without content from IAMI.
cult still think IO can't be scum with Newman?In post 601, Io wrote:Newman's town but the scummiest of the group solely, not that he had other content, from the push that the only way Cloud could have been replaced is if he was Mafia hard bussing. His reason for the initial tunnel was also pretty trash with it just being that he claimed scum which no one should even take seriously. The other part of his scum read of Cloud that they were overly pushing the town slip was OK and a valid argument I think. The reason I think he's not scum pushing for 2 mislynches, as he's pushing to lynch both of you, is just because of how genuine he is in the push itself. He is stubborn, but not scum.
Certainly.In post 618, -Grey- wrote:I'm not seeing scum in massive.
Just clumsy town.
Can we lynch in {Newman, Io,IAIJin} please?
Get your setup questions crap out of here. Your obv town since page 12, but when I put out a scum list of 3 players and saw someone immediately attacks me for something I posted on page 4, yeah, I wondered if there was some chainsawing going on and I hit the mark on 2 scum and #3 was coming after me. Since I now feel your town, I obv don't think you had ulterior motives with that post.In post 621, -Grey- wrote:His attempt to push me with setup questions that don't come from a town mindset.In post 620, massive wrote:Hey I never promised you a ballet.In post 618, -Grey- wrote: Just clumsy town.
I'm not seeing Newman (you can probably guess why) and not crazy about your company on that wagon. Talk to me about I Am Innocent? What has you putting him into the scum pile?
But why? It was the third vote on that wagon, what specifically did Newman do differently than the other two voters for MDS?In post 644, Secret Agent Jin wrote:EBWOPIn post 642, Secret Agent Jin wrote:The post above that one 544 is the reason for that post.In post 636, I Am Innocent wrote:Why did you address this to him vs. other people that have voted MDS post-cloud force replace?In post 547, Secret Agent Jin wrote:@Newman: You reali that if MDS flips town then you would most likely be next, right?
Scum also like to tunnel and minimize scum reads to not help town when they do flip.In post 660, Kairal wrote:This feels like a semantics debate waiting to happen. I'll sidestep it. The question I'm really getting at is: Was Newman's vote opportunistic? I don't think it was. By the time he voted Mini most of town had agreed that the mod confirmed mafia argument was a non-starter. If he were just voting for the easiest to lynch town why not jump on any of the other people I mentioned. There are too many for them all to be scumpartners so he passed over an easy mislynch on a town to argue for a fairly difficult lynch in Mini.In post 658, -Grey- wrote:He didn't. massive voted for adjacent reasoning. Newman piggybacked my trap logic.In post 653, Kairal wrote:Why fall for the same trick massive already did? I dunno it doesn't seem all that likely to be scum play to me.
It just doesn't really make sense to choose the hard road rather than the easy road. More likely he just genuinely believed the mod confirm argument (even though I agree it's not a very compelling one).
Well you have expressed many reads/different votes today: Cloud, AJ, MDS (gimmick), massive, Newman, IOIn post 667, -Grey- wrote:I have two players in willing to vote.In post 665, I Am Innocent wrote:Scum also like to tunnel and minimize scum reads to not help town when they do flip.
There was a game recently where scum was like 'I'm fine with either transcend or maria D1', and moved his vote between them D1 depending on who was the bigger wagon.
Newmans play/tunneling here feels very similar to me.
How is my play any different than what you're describing?
If you were Newman and you were town, wouldn't you believe that scum is driving your wagon? Because calling the people wagoning him silly doesn't give me the vibe that he feels that way.In post 659, HellloooNewman wrote:Y'all are silly.
Shadow, any reason you haven't moved your predecessor's vote off of MDS? Where are you at currently?
Io, do you think your wagon vote of one of AJ is going to go anywhere?In post 166, Io wrote:Just kind of sat at my computer doign things for 30 minutes then suddenly realized I was forgetting something. So. Here I am.
I want to kill you just for that logic.In post 101, Elhabe21 wrote:A little new at this but
VOTE: CloudKicker
Cuz you're standing out more than others
OK caught up.
Firstly wanted to address the 144 since I disagree with that entirely. I get the vibe from Cloud that they are trying to convince people they are town from the town slip, but Cloud's logic as to why it's a town slip is pretty shaky yes town slip quite a lot, but really thinking there is 9 players isn't much of a slip if anything it's just you didn't read. Kai also mentioned Town are usually in a panic under pressure but I think that's more a personal thing, I for one always try to remain calm even if it's frustrating being ignored.
VOTE: AJ
I'm going to have to agree with Kai after reading their accusation.
I don't really agree with the SAJ wagon in general after hosting a game with him, he mostly just feels like a fairly easy mislynch to push.
And nvm my question at the top of this page, ur apparently still catching up.In post 681, Shadow_step wrote:Yeah nvm, you were baiting.
Why the negative attitude. I personally am happy with most of the wagons here, and would be shocked if none or only one of them are on scum.In post 701, Secret Agent Jin wrote:Well, you all can vote on any wagon you want as it seems there is a few (massive, Io, Newman) but i think there are too many thoughts and conversations and not enough cohesive togetherness or focusing on a player we all think is scum. The scum have done exactly what they set out to do and have caused confusion among the town.
5 HellloooNewman (culted, AJ, IAI, Grey, Shadow)In post 757, massive wrote:I mean, I'm pretty sure you're voting me currently, man a vote count would sure be nice.
Just looked thru ur ISO and yeah no unvote.In post 766, Io wrote:@IAI I unvoted some time ago.
Debating whether or not to push Flubber a bit, but it's really not going to do anything, not like I can do much to convince you guys that Newman is pretty clear town.
VOTE: Massive
Um I'm just trying to figure out why you lied.In post 769, Io wrote:Also I don't see why you would use my ISO to justify not lynching massive.
Wow this is all you have to add?In post 770, HellloooNewman wrote:Can we get an official vote count please?
Anyone else notice that this post was made 47 hours and 49 mins after his last one?In post 770, HellloooNewman wrote:Can we get an official vote count please?
Like this was on the same friggin page for crying out loud?!!??In post 758, I Am Innocent wrote:5 HellloooNewman (culted, AJ, IAI, Grey, Shadow)In post 757, massive wrote:I mean, I'm pretty sure you're voting me currently, man a vote count would sure be nice.
4 massive (Flubber, MDS, Jin, Kairal)
1 MiniDeathStar (Newman)
1 Aj The Epic (Io)
1 Io (Dierfire)
1 Secret Agent Jin (massive)
7 votes needed for lynch.
At least that's what I got.
Still think the AJ and MDS votes are wasted votes. I don't see either of them taking off. I'd be ok switching to Jin or Io, but am totally happy with Newman at this point.
So why did u lie about the unvote? It's not like u've made a ton of votes/unvotes this game that you would have forgotten.In post 789, Io wrote:Dude you only fake hammer when Newman is online so they may accidentally claim scum.
In post 834, Io wrote:What?In post 791, I Am Innocent wrote:So why did u lie about the unvote? It's not like u've made a ton of votes/unvotes this game that you would have forgotten.In post 789, Io wrote:Dude you only fake hammer when Newman is online so they may accidentally claim scum.
In post 766, Io wrote:@IAI I unvoted some time ago.
Debating whether or not to push Flubber a bit, but it's really not going to do anything, not like I can do much to convince you guys that Newman is pretty clear town.
VOTE: Massive
In post 792, I Am Innocent wrote:just checked my spreadsheet and u made exactly one vote and no unvotes at the point of the lie lol
Two votes all game. Massive in post 10 and now Massive here. I need more than this. Based on the flips, who else do you think is scum with Massive?
Great contribution so far. I still think you're scum.
http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?a ... 4&sr=postsIn post 892, I Am Innocent wrote:Need more from Dierfire. So far two votes, Cloudkicker/Shadows slot (who I read town) and Io. 21 posts between him and his predecessor.
In post 892, I Am Innocent wrote:Need more from Dierfire. So far two votes, Cloudkicker/Shadows slot (who I read town) and Io. 21 posts between him and his predecessor.
Makes me feel even better about scum DierfireIn post 893, I Am Innocent wrote:http://forum.mafiascum.net/search.php?a ... 4&sr=postsIn post 892, I Am Innocent wrote:Need more from Dierfire. So far two votes, Cloudkicker/Shadows slot (who I read town) and Io. 21 posts between him and his predecessor.
Dierfire's predecessor had no problem joining another game and being active there. Newbie scum pressure?
I'd say Dierfire is my #2 suspect at the moment.
Sorry blanket statements about what is and isn't AI don't work with me. I look for motive:In post 920, MiniDeathStar wrote:Townlean. I don't think I want to vote him atm. Replacing out is not alignment indicative.In post 912, I Am Innocent wrote:Everyone, your read & willingness to vote/not vote for Dierfire in your next post please.
In post 101, Elhabe21 wrote:A little new at this but
VOTE: CloudKicker
Cuz you're standing out more than others
Typo fixedIn post 936, I Am Innocent wrote:Interesting you didn't include me as a player that would have to be town if Jin istownscum since I've pushed Jin more than anybody not named culted. Which interestingly enough you didn't mention him either...
Care to explain why?
Mafia theory time, regarding this and the 'who didn't believe the Newman claim' patterns you are pointing out.In post 972, MiniDeathStar wrote:In post 867, Gamma Emerald wrote:6 - Io: Dierfire, MiniDeathStar, Aj The Epic, HellloooNewman, -Grey-,I Am Innocent, cultedEither we were all absolutely totally wrong as town and scum didn't even need to wagon these people (and make themselves look bad), or scum decided to sponsor them a little bit.In post 960, mhsmith0 wrote:Secret Agent Jin (6), Flubbernugget , massive , -Grey- , Kairal LYNCH!culted , I Am Innocent
Do you notice a certain pattern here?
For massive, the player that recently caught my eye that also dropped a huge town tell is kairal. Her posts today have been giving me scum vibes but that town tell is pretty strong.In post 978, I Am Innocent wrote:Mafia theory time, regarding this and the 'who didn't believe the Newman claim' patterns you are pointing out.In post 972, MiniDeathStar wrote:In post 867, Gamma Emerald wrote:6 - Io: Dierfire, MiniDeathStar, Aj The Epic, HellloooNewman, -Grey-,I Am Innocent, cultedEither we were all absolutely totally wrong as town and scum didn't even need to wagon these people (and make themselves look bad), or scum decided to sponsor them a little bit.In post 960, mhsmith0 wrote:Secret Agent Jin (6), Flubbernugget , massive , -Grey- , Kairal LYNCH!culted , I Am Innocent
Do you notice a certain pattern here?
Do scum usually vote together like I think you are trying to hint with me and culted?
Do scum usually like to be on all the town wagons? (Look at DGBs scumputer and it shows a greater correlation to being scum for players on some town wagons and off other town wagons)
Scum would have known Newman was town, so they would have likely believed his claim. So how would scum act? Once again I think you throw out patterns and assume 1, maybe 2 did not believe him and 1, maybe 2 scum did believe him. (Yes this assumes 3 scum total) like voting, scum are usually pretty careful to try to mix it up and blend in, not go all united together as you are hinting.
I did not like these posts by mini at all, but iso'ing her again I still think she is town. Misguided on me yeah but still prob town none the less.
Like I said I still want to check some voting histories and would like to ISO a few players if not all. Two players that I have not suspected much this game have recently caught my eye, tho one dropped a very strong early D1 town tell that is usually right :-/
More to come.
Kairal do you think mini and shadow could be scummates? If not why?In post 1075, Kairal wrote:For what it's worth I think you are the least scummy of the three. I'd prefer to start with culted and then see where that goes.
I feel this claim actually clears three people. I don't see how scum Cloudkicker gets forced replaced for playing against his win con for leaving a vote on town Mini.In post 1089, massive wrote:VOTE: Kairal
I'm unlikely to make it through N4 so here it is: I'm the even cop. Checked MDS last night, she's town. I really figured someone would have picked up on that and not made me spell it out - I thought it was AJ early on, but then it was clear he hadn't from 1954.
I've been run up so many times on Day 1 that I know what that wagon composition is. It's too easy for scum to push on something NAI (usually it's my postcount, but this time it was "explaining my vote") that they look at me as an easy mislynch. I just happen to be a little more sturdy than a D1 mislynch ... most of the time. But yeah, I was purposefully needling Kairal to see how deep he'd bite, plus also trying to survive to now to get my likely only investigation through. And personally I think he's bit a little too deep.
IAI I trust you to some extent, so do you want to talk about this towntell you saw? I saw something D1 but now I want to go back and look and see how legit it really was.