Mini 2049: The Townsquare Game Over

[DuckDuckJab]

Oof I forgot to be here hello friends
VOTE: themilkcartonkid
bet you rolled scum this time <3 nice to see ya again

~ the duck

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Booducks is a cool hydra.

<3 I like the hydra of Teeky & Cheeky

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After we powerlynch Milky we can DWFINITELY go for LadyAngel then Robert

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A50!! <3
You town?

~ the duck

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@Robert - why the unvote?

Almost50 replaces Sickofit1138.

The BEST thing in this game is THERE'S NI BLOODY NIGHT KILL!

I thought getting nightkilled was your favorite thing?
You rolled scum this time?


Thinking Darklight and LA are scum based on first impressions.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Hello everyone,

Vote Lady Angel

Till you post

Hello everyone. Who wants to come over for tea?

Lynch all liars?

I think this is either TvS or SvS.

I dislike both their page 1 posting.

First I don't like Robert saying they'll vote someone until they post - it's a thinly veiled fake pressure vote. Then I don't like the immeadiate unvote after Lady calls him a liar. If he was pressure voting to get the game going why isn't he moving his vote elsewhere to get more people to post? The unvote in this instance is scummy.

Angel is less scummy but I dislike her asking "lynch all liars?" instead of commenting on whether being a liar is AI for Robert.

Nice .. this is the sort of thinking that comes out of my own jumbled mind usually. How does it feel Cheeky?
Feels like you saw their role PM in a dream doesn't it?

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Trivium sweaty would you rather we dwell in rvs forever? You're voting someone for trying to advance the game. the queues for mafia and "circularly shitpost for two weeks at a time for no reason" are in different parts of the forum

Try again. If you think part of her post is scummy point it out and talk about why it's scummy (I'd be very curious about this ). Don't shade her categorically for making a reachy read to get the game going because I don't see you trying.

~ the duck

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[DuckDuckJab]

why darklight?

Original ping was probably just because the "first" type comments are a pet peeve of mine, but the scummy part was the cheeky vote and unvote.

It doesn't seem like an RVS vote because of the timing, so why unvote just becuase cheeky said she's innocent.

And if it was in fact an RVS vote, the unvote makes less sense... did he suddenly get scared?

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

VOTE: themilkcartonkid
still wanna park this
~ tw

[DuckDuckJab]

Trivium sweaty would you rather we dwell in rvs forever? You're voting someone for trying to advance the game. the queues for mafia and "circularly shitpost for two weeks at a time for no reason" are in different parts of the forum

Try again. If you think part of her post is scummy point it out and talk about why it's scummy (I'd be very curious about this ). Don't shade her categorically for making a reachy read to get the game going because I don't see you trying.

~ the duck

Going that deep feels fake. If you're seriously developing a scumread off of people's RVS posts you're fooling yourself, if you're not you're scum. That's what you get out of rvs, people's indirect reactions to it that gets the game going, you don't analyse the content of the rvs posts themselves.

I think this comes from town but also I don't think it's a particularly great way to find scum

If someone doesn't make something from nothing, how do we kick off a spicy d1 and kill teh scumz? This will sound silly and I agree Cheeky's post was reachy. there's some parts of it I don't agree with, and bits of it which I think could come from scum -- but not just the fact she's drawing blood from a stone out of rvs. that's town.

For the record if this was her posting on like page 10 I'd agree with you 1000%

~ tw

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I thought getting nightkilled was your favorite thing?

I believe I've mixed my games.. AGAIN. I thought this one was NIGHTLESS! *Sigh*

I sure need to stop playing too many games and with too many accounts.

I dont buy this... the town description mentions other wincons being impossible for us to win. This def some sort of scum or 3p. VOTE: almost50

What kind of answer are you expecting...? serious question lmao

~ tw

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we r ★td
~ tw

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Why did he actually say there was no nk. I mean, hes not going to come right out and say it, but theres no way this isn't scum

...why?

~ tw

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I'm pretty sure people are voting A50 for a soft townslip. Not suggesting we lockclear him for it but like....???? If this isn't literally my username I don't know what is. :U am I missing something really obvious here?

{milky, LadyAngel, Robert} wagons all thoroughly endorsed

~ tw

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VOTE: Thor

@milky, if there is no NK we should look at a50
Realistically it's such a a dense slip it's more likely to come from another game than acrually come from scum (A50 is also good scum )

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Cheeky yiu make it hard to wagon with you
VOTE: Robert

~ tw

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Robert does seem defensive with his post but I feel it's rather honest. It's day one, so it can be pretty intimidating for newer players to vote when they know no one. I think this as either a town or scum read.

I'm going to

VOTE: CHEEKY

for punching down.

What does this post even mean fam

Ducky why are you voting so much

I'm in the mood for it

~ tw

[DuckDuckJab]

No other scummy reads so far.
I feel like your vote on a easy low hanging fruit, and that's pretty scummy.

Who's town?
does LHF have to be a mislynch? why else would someone vote LHF? you're not reasoning through anything

~ tw

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Mm, that's fine. I think your thoroughly offended tone is genuine and I don't think that's sunny

Unvote:

So you voted her to pressure
Then didn't pressure her
Then unvoted
And didn't pressure anyone else with your vote

what are you doin fam

[DuckDuckJab]

I know you're asking for accounts. You know 3 of my personal accounts already. Anything more may or may not be relevant to anything I may or may not have said. Thank you very much for being attentive.

So you voted her to pressure
Then didn't pressure her

You're claiming you don't see Cheeky's 10 or so posts in response to Crocolisk's vote to be pressure related?

No
I'm claiming Crocolisk's vote/push did not carry any weight whatsoever and pretending it was a pressure push is a farce

[DuckDuckJab]

@tw how are you reading cheeky?

leaning town but only leaning atm

fwiw i agree with your take on DLA (town), BuJ doesn't, we're gonna reconvene on that later

~ tw

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i'm not really feeling town!you yet; you feel kinda weird for you

we have time, I'm not feeling normal in this game for some reason

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VOTE: Robert

Why are you okay with Robert here and what do you make of Cheeky+me voting him first?

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Page 1

Page 3

scumposts imo
VOTE: joges

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Page 4

Meant to quote this one too

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yes on this, but I'm a sucker for big ISO posts. I still do not like A50's post at all. I have a crackpot theory that my first serious vote is always scum and it hasn't been wrong in the three whole games I've played!

I suffer from good gut reads sometimes as well (I recall you correctly picking that I was softpocketing you in that one newbie game) but A50 is a nightmare to gutread, he reads more agendaey as town than scum. take that how you will

~ tw

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He did an interesting slip that might be alingment relevant.
He declared it was an innocent error due to another game he's in.
We can't discuss ongoing games.
We can ask for accounts.
I can do my own research about ongoing games with certain info without needing to discuss them.
He's aware of this and is being oddly cagey in his responses to me - I suspect because he's aware.
Sheep me?

Uhh I think I might need to hear some less angleshooty reads from you because I'm not townreading a single syllable of this reasoning and your original vote was creepy

Where you @ w other slots

[DuckDuckJab]

VOTE: Thor

Good vote.

[DuckDuckJab]

eh, i like to imagine i can fake posts like that as scum

I'll second this

UNVOTE:
I don't think A50's slip is from scum

Also towny

Thor's posting between these doesn't interest me

[DuckDuckJab]

...which is on page 1-2. This doesn't even need commenting. If DDJ is this good at creating things out of nothing he should consider taking up a career as a magician. And then on top of that he uses a pet peeve to justify a scum case?

If you wanna talk more about this hmu, that was my partner's rvs ping (I had an absolutely different rvs ping and we agreed to discuss you at more length later).

But yeah needless to say I'm not super interested in this read. Crocolisk I'm also keen to come back to a liiiiiittle later

[DuckDuckJab]

Thor

This is probably a pretty good point and I'm happy to admit I inadvertently lean scum on Thor most of the time because we have vastly different playstyles (main diff was Gunner Mafia which I'm pretty sure you were there for too? where he was just this tidal wave of towny common sense)

Probably what's irking me is his most elaborate case is on A50 which amounts to NAI meta tells and angleshooting and makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand up.. I just need to see more from him imo

[DuckDuckJab]

Cheeky seem too...go with the flow.

Can you throw me a couple of quotes which made you feel this way?
I feel like Cheeky IS the flow so not sure I agree w you immediately

[DuckDuckJab]

BuJaber, you scum bro?

I took a peek at BuJ's role pm

Spoiler:

we're town... >: sorry

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lol, sensitive.

I personally love reading thors posts in thors movie voice. I don't know if I'd be paranoid with him being scum though. or maybe I'm naive with Thor.

Cheeky seem too...go with the flow. Course she may normally be like this.

Vote Cheeky

@Dark, why are you so certain A50 is town?

@cheeky, what lynch do you think Thor wants then?

I like this as a bad vote by new town

Why new town before new scum? Genuinely curious

[DuckDuckJab]

{Gamma Emerald, joges}
{Trivium, Thor, Milk}
{Skitter, A50, Lady, Robert}
{}
{DLA or DDJ, Soviet}

Whooo wtf

how is Joges town?
Gamma I agree with slightly but strong town feels kinda gross
Triv/Thor/Milk tier is probably
How is DLA a wolf?

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where he was just this tidal wave of towny common sense

Lol I think Thor gets like that with his fellow man friends. Like I noticed Toranaga brought that out of him. Also that playerlist was OP af.

Fair. Towncase Joges for me? I'm gonna use the scum word..... he

reeeeks

of wolf to me
~ tw

[DuckDuckJab]

...which is on page 1-2. This doesn't even need commenting. If DDJ is this good at creating things out of nothing he should consider taking up a career as a magician. And then on top of that he uses a pet peeve to justify a scum case?

If you wanna talk more about this hmu, that was my partner's rvs ping (I had an absolutely different rvs ping and we agreed to discuss you at more length later).

But yeah needless to say I'm not super interested in this read. Crocolisk I'm also keen to come back to a liiiiiittle later

Didn't actually realize yall were a hydra until I hunted down the BuJaber Cheeky mentioned. Whoops!

You're probably the wrong person to answer to it then, but my thoughts about the post still stand.

Talk to me about something more exciting? :3
It was an rvs gut ping for my partner. It's not very exciting.

[DuckDuckJab]

I'm not sure its much of a recovery, I think he's really screwing around more then anything. I can't really take any of his posts seriously.

I investigated him n0 and he is aligned with "having a good time"

are you any closer to realising you're pointlessly tunnelled or....?

[DuckDuckJab]

I do not like how long it took for you to vote. I feel this first post is you having an issue with A50's post. But you didn't vote until someone else did. Why were you afraid to start this wagon?

I don't see this kind of observation coming from scum.

I haven't decided if I agree with this or not yet but I like your angle I think
It pinged me as fairly cheap considering Gamma's reaction felt totally natural to me :/ like its the kinda thing I think scum posts then fistpumps for being so closer and I'm not sure yet why town bothers outside of just like posting what's on their mind

[DuckDuckJab]

sorry cheeky you've lost my doublevote
VOTE: Robert

taking your joges tr @ face value for a minute

[DuckDuckJab]

I sure need to stop playing too many games and with too many accounts.

What are your current active accounts?

VOTE: Almost50

This whole conversation is just like angleshooting which is resolved by A50 answering the question if he chooses to which also he's welcome not to

It's also not going to change whether or not he's under pressure and I don't see how your votepark on him was actually productive

You then spun around and launched into a detailed defence of it which boils down to.......you're trying to use out of thread reasons to back up a read and basically no, I doubt pressure voting him is very unlikely to make him want to answer your question any more or less than he did before...

I hope this makes sense but I'm not really seeing much of a logical correlation between what you're doing w A50 and what you're saying you're doing w A50

[DuckDuckJab]

@skitter:

I can see your point regarding the unvote when you add it to the other posts he made with the apparent carefree attitude. It read differently to me on its own. As for the carefree thing it may not be a town thing depending on meta/personality. I'll need more time to learn about him. Are you saying it out of experience or is it your first game with him also?

Also this isn't AI for you but I've always wanted to ask why you say things like "you don't seem like town you" without elaborating to people. Don't you think it might give scum!them a chance to change it up?

[DuckDuckJab]

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lol, sensitive.

I personally love reading thors posts in thors movie voice. I don't know if I'd be paranoid with him being scum though. or maybe I'm naive with Thor.

Cheeky seem too...go with the flow. Course she may normally be like this.

Vote Cheeky

@Dark, why are you so certain A50 is town?

@cheeky, what lynch do you think Thor wants then?

I saw your response, so I won't ask. But I strongly disagree that cheeky is going with the flow here and I'm baffled that you ever thought so.

It doesn mean she's town, just this is a terrible reason for voting her.

BuJaber, you scum bro?

We are not. But what gave you the idea?

lol, sensitive.

I personally love reading thors posts in thors movie voice. I don't know if I'd be paranoid with him being scum though. or maybe I'm naive with Thor.

Cheeky seem too...go with the flow. Course she may normally be like this.

Vote Cheeky

@Dark, why are you so certain A50 is town?

@cheeky, what lynch do you think Thor wants then?

I like this as a bad vote by new town

This is a very specific read and it feels like TMI to me.

I do not like how long it took for you to vote. I feel this first post is you having an issue with A50's post. But you didn't vote until someone else did. Why were you afraid to start this wagon?

I don't see this kind of observation coming from scum.

I don't know.. it's purely objective and is easy to notice. What makes it town-exclusive?

@skitter:

I can see your point regarding the unvote when you add it to the other posts he made with the apparent carefree attitude. It read differently to me on its own. As for the carefree thing it may not be a town thing depending on meta/personality. I'll need more time to learn about him. Are you saying it out of experience or is it your first game with him also?

Also this isn't AI for you but I've always wanted to ask why you say things like "you don't seem like town you" without elaborating to people. Don't you think it might give scum!them a chance to change it up?

This was me btw.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Eww I took the pagetop. Now my font size will shrink by the powers of the mod edit.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

@Dark

My goal IS to become an RVS scumhunting magician. I like to think I'm getting there.

Even if my original pings are wrong, discussing my pings, especially with the person in question, helps me.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

why darklight?

Original ping was probably just because the "first" type comments are a pet peeve of mine,

but the scummy part was the cheeky vote and unvote.

It doesn't seem like an RVS vote because of the timing, so why unvote just becuase cheeky said she's innocent.

And if it was in fact an RVS vote, the unvote makes less sense... did he suddenly get scared?

-BuJ

Bolded indicates that the "first" thing was not in fact scummy in my eyes. It just made me look into you whereas I may have not paid that much attention to you.

But for the record if I did find that part actually scummy I would have pushed you for it. I know I do this as town and so I try to imitate it as scum. That part would not be something reliable to use for a case on me.

I've deathtunnelled someone for grabbing pagetops from the mod before. I did that before receiving my role pm (I was a rep in). He turned out being my partner. I continued to tunnel him. The reason why I actually look at things like that is that while I do realize that they are joke posts I wholly believe people joke differently when town or scum. It's almost impossible to tell right away, but when they start posting some more it gives an indication of their mindset and tone and then you compare that to the joke/timing of their RVS posts and see if it matches the tone/mindset of a townie joking as part of their personality or if it was a scum joking to appear nonchalant/jovial etc.

That's way too much explanation regarding my secret processes but since my partner thinks you're town I don't want you wasting time scumreading me for this if he's right.

[DuckDuckJab]

By the way I completely understand thor's point I just didn't read or talk to tw since monday. The reason why I personally didn't want to comment is that I feel we've stumbled into a grey area and I'm sure what to do. Thor is confident it is not breaking the rules if A50 gives us his alt's names and then we use the names to find his ongoing games but that still feels wrong to me somehow

Therefore I'm in favor of disregarding the whole exchange between A50 and thor and try to sort them from future posts but maintain like a massive FOS on A50 because it's his fault.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

I'm not* sure what to do.

[DuckDuckJab]

Cheeky can you respond to my questions?

And give some reasons for the changes in your readslist?

This game seems quieter than average, I can only imagine it getting worse in the upcoming two weeks..

Let's change it up.. is anyone NOT okay with a robert lynch? Why?

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

BuJaber, you scum bro?

We are not. But what gave you the idea?

I do not like how long it took for you to vote. I feel this first post is you having an issue with A50's post. But you didn't vote until someone else did. Why were you afraid to start this wagon?

I don't see this kind of observation coming from scum.

I don't know.. it's purely objective and is easy to notice. What makes it town-exclusive?

[DuckDuckJab]

Interesting. I actually have been noting the lack of

apparent

pushback against the rob lynch to tw. There was the one post where A50 asked what the case on Rob was, which MAY be a sort of low-key defense. However, 4 votes is not much of a threat yet. The lack of defense might not be an indication if scum don't feel any need to do so.

If anything that has been posted so far is going to make me TR robert it's this:

lol, sensitive.

I personally love reading thors posts in thors movie voice. I don't know if I'd be paranoid with him being scum though. or maybe I'm naive with Thor.

Cheeky seem too...go with the flow. Course she may normally be like this.

Vote Cheeky

@Dark, why are you so certain A50 is town?

@cheeky, what lynch do you think Thor wants then?

I like this as a bad vote by new town

This felt like a very weird read to me, especially with milk now happy to park his vote on robert. It feels like TMI. Add in the inconsistency of him voting who he called new town. So I'm a little concerned by the milk townreads as they seem premature and misguided to me.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

I can assure you nothing is going unnoticed but what you're describing seems highly exaggerated for a game of 12 pages and 3ish mini wagons. So please walk me through it. Name names. Describe your observations.

Sometimes there's power in silence btw. (Keeping things close to the chest until the apprpriate moment)

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

@A50 - Give me a full readlist please. If they're all null put them all at null if you have to

Also fwiw I think your gambit failed. It might be time to cut your losses if you ARE town, and go for a lesser of two evils plan B. Whatever your alignment is I cannot stop your lynch if things remain the same here. My best defense of your slot right now is literally "he's A50".

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

thor/duck/a50 looks pretty t/t/t to me. Vote's staying on robert.

I kinda instinctively dislike anyone stating a conversation between three players which is still completely unresolved looks like t/t/t. Does anyone have a confident read on Triv because I remember strongly disliking something by them and I can't remember if it was alignmenty or not

~ tw

[DuckDuckJab]

Sure

Eh this roughly makes sense I think we're just very different people

I'll remove my head from my desk for the time being.

~ tw

[DuckDuckJab]

hey

hey

we should probably hang out in real-time sometime on d2... you're not doing those things town you does..

[DuckDuckJab]

Thanks jingle, this is exactly the kind of moderation that keeps me coming back to this site.

Anyways, I would usually be more speculative as town but because there appear to be strange things going on with winconditions I feel I'd rather come back through here when I have more information, so I've really just skimmed through a lot of this, especially the thor/duck/a50 interaction because I don't think the stuff a50 has done or talked about has been alignment indicative at all, and I feel the duck/thor interaction is t/t in my gut. I like my vote on robert; little justification for cheeky vote, questions I don't think lead anywhere, just not really buying the whole going with the flow argument in general. Feels reachy in an intentional sort of way to me.

hwaht.

[DuckDuckJab]

Skitter's hard town for me, Cheeky and Trivium also seem towny. I'm still not sure how to sort Almost, the frustration here feels genuine.

But why why and why

[DuckDuckJab]

I think I can lynch Almost50 but for the record I would like my distaste towards a slot to be noted

I have cleared my use of size 300 voting with BuJ and though it is in bad taste he has given me permission

VOTE: Trivium

[DuckDuckJab]

big vote from a big duck

[DuckDuckJab]

Skitter's hard town for me, Cheeky and Trivium also seem towny. I'm still not sure how to sort Almost, the frustration here feels genuine.

But why why and why

Also, frustration can come from either alignment. It can be genuine but is it town motivated?

(It’s not)

oh yeah I agree. sorry I meant to question her hard townreads because I think she's got like 1+ wolves in there (including a chance of her just being a wolf in which case it's probably like, 2

[DuckDuckJab]

talking to BuJ about A50 atm but the levels of WTF he's exhibited this game is probably net wolf indicative

[DuckDuckJab]

It never surprises me to see scum playing sub-par even after a quality scumgame. Especially if less experienced
There's like always the massive temptation to play against meta on the hopes that people will look at your scum meta and go "wrow this is so different" and it can be pretty easy to become exhausted by playing wolf

so I'm not sure I'd use that meta as a reason to...not scumread him but I get that's also what you're saying kinda

I just like pointing out the obvious

How many votes on a50 atm?

[DuckDuckJab]

talking to BuJ about A50 atm but the levels of WTF he's exhibited this game is probably net wolf indicative

Is that how you view my scum game, ducky? Interesting!

yes your scumgame is very confusing to keep up with!!
This is a compliment!
~tw

[DuckDuckJab]

Lolwagons do you have any other scumreads?

Nah

Joge and VLA are town too though.

DLA yes
Joges.... maybe? why?

[DuckDuckJab]

Doesn't A50 sort himself out after N1? He said he was happy that there was no NK or whatever, so let's see if there is/isn't?

Looking at it from the angles my over worked brain can think of at 1am:

N1 NK DOES happen I - We know that A50 probably got this game mixed up with another.
N1 NK DOES NOT happen I - We wonder how he knew it(which we already kind of are but at least now we know for sure he knew something that it appears the rest of us aren't aware of).
N1 NK DOES NOT happen II - Maybe scum are possibly trying to frame him, which means he is town so we shouldn't be lynching him anyways, and he essentially gets a 1 shot doc ability thanks to this claim and scum trying to make him look bad.

Am I missing a scenario? If not, it appears this is a bad lynch today.

Same point I made 80 pages ago when people were wagoning him for what looked like a soft townslip
Except it was a confusing and pretty jank slip and his follow through/reaction to pressure hasn't been towny

[DuckDuckJab]

Joges what possessed you to make that post at the exclusion of everything else in his ISO?

[DuckDuckJab]

That's because without milk's comments robert was still scummy to me and I do not really agree that the wagon had no resistance. I think it wasn't serious enough unfortunately for scum to be really worried if robert is in fact scum.

As for A50 I disagree with tw and I don't want us lynching him. Also joges is probably scum trying to get town cred.

Shoot me scum I got your number

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

This felt like a very weird read to me, especially with milk now happy to park his vote on robert. It feels like TMI. Add in the inconsistency of him voting who he called new town. So I'm a little concerned by the milk townreads as they seem premature and misguided to me.

-BuJ

BuJaber you know you guys were voting Robert at the time of this post and you've only just moved onto Trivium. Can you explain why you didn't move your vote right away or why you didn't put further pressure on Milk?

Also I considered voting milk but with A50 being ran up I wanted to be on a wagon that can contend A50's. This didn't really happen so I told tw I'm fine with a trivium vote if he wants.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Cheeky yeah we're probably looking at 1-2 whiteknights in {milk/joges/robert}. And then another 1-2 scum in {thor/gamma/omochao, trivium}

@omochao - the TMI part was him saying "new town". Why did he jump to that? Why isn't it a bad vote by scum? Sounds like he knows he's town.

VOTE: Milk

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Oh plus the person I'm sekretly scumreading. The list of "generally scummy" is a little big so I'm focusing on the 3 whiteknights / TMI tells first, while I narrow down the other suspects. Hopefully with help from tw because I'm a hydra this time and I don't have to do all the work.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Uh I've played with milk a little before and he's a hilariously easy lategame read but has wolfy tonality etc. etc.
Either way I'm cool deferring to BuJ, he knows pretty much where I stand with everything and is good at mafia

I'll be in transit for like 24hrs so y'know, activity will be hit and miss and I'll be tired and angery

~ tw

[DuckDuckJab]

Buj why are you suspecting Gamma, am I silly to townread him here?

I expect him to not jump to a quick conclusion on A50. It's not about reading him as town or scum, it's that his play should have been obviously very strange and uncharacteristic to the point that it warranted some patience to see where it will go. I've seen A50 gambit a number of times but I've never seen him go bananas (pun intended) before like he did here.

I have a -probably very misguided- meta reason for it based on recent games but I'm not confident yet it's valid and would like to keep it to myself.

the TMI part was him saying "new town". Why did he jump to that? Why isn't it a bad vote by scum? Sounds like he knows he's town.

I know that was your thought process but I think that's dumb.

like have you never seen a vote that makes you go "wow that's a newb town vote"? is that tmi or what? like when does it become tmi, is it the way he said it, the no explanation, what?

What made it newbish? If you see bad or flawed logic / reasons for voting someone why would you immediately assume new town?
Like even if he felt that the logic would not come from an experienced player why would he assume newb town instead of newb scum?
He showed no interest in calling out the flawed logic or provide a counter case or try to engage the player in question to know more about his experience/thinking process he just stated "new town" and moved on. How am I supposed to know what part of the post he doesn't like? And why would he not want to talk more about it with him, if not to correct his view, then at least to understand the player better?
Cheeky's explanation of "both are scum" actually could make sense because if he is town and did actually think rob was town but wrong why wouldn't he make some effort to correct him.

@Robert - what Cheeky said. A white knight is scum that defends or "townreads" someone who is suspected/is a popular wagon in order to earn some town credit because they already know the player in question is town.

Obviously it's not usually an obvious tell but I think all 3 of you have posted things that sounded like TMI to me. Milk wrt you. Joges and you wrt A50. Of course in this case milk and you can't both be whiteknights, but maybe cheeky is right and milk was outright defending a partner instead of defending someone he knows is town.

[DuckDuckJab]

@thor - you mean trivium? Yeah his was more subtle I forgot he made that blanket "this is t/t/t" statement.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Rober is already in my whiteknight list

[DuckDuckJab]

Okay yeah I get what you mean now. The distinction was more about what made them scummy to me, rather than me trying to categorize people.

Like those 3 specifically the whiteknighting was what really made me suspicious.

The group of you, gamma, triv slot are general scumreads but not necessarily for one common reason, even if some may overlap.

For you the original A50 push wasn't scummy to me despite what A50 thinks but it's a combination of tw has an SR on you, you seem to pick your moments to post, and your continuation of the A50 push despite his apparent meltdown which I've never seen from A50 ever.

I have recently only seen you play scum or 3rd party I don't remember anything about your town meta but something feels off here just not the kind of posting I'd expect from someone intent on figuring things out.

Oromo catchup posts pinged me but I don't know why specifically and triv posts seemed nullish scum to me but tw seemed to really really want him dead so I added him not realizing it's the same slot.

[DuckDuckJab]

@Thor

I mean you

could

have synced your other games but fine yeah I'll concede the activity thing.

You still think A50 is scum so I see no point in talking about why you should or should not have voted when you did. If you change your vote now it would not be AI because he claimed now and the cat's out of the bag he's town. I don't see any positive gain from us having long winded discussions on the strategy of our approach to A50 because it's already done. You're either scum or wrong.

The sorting:
Have you noticed that you barely gave any opinion or case regarding your own reads?
Take me. Without re-reading your ISO, I only know 1 read you have formed. That A50 is scum. Apart from that I can

imply

that you agree with my whiteknight list and thus are SRing them but that's the extent of what I am able to tell. What you have done a lot of instead is argue against or ask questions about someone else's arguments while seemingly not reaching any conclusions regarding the alignments of the people they are sorting.

To clarify let's see the example of your conversation with me:

You had an issue/needed clarification on how I ended up with the 2 groups I had.
Like I said, it is possible you implied that you agree with the 3 whiteknight reads plus trivium as a 4th whiteknight from your pov. However this could just be my interpretation it wasn't clear at all because it wasn't stated and expanded upon. Anyone reading your posts can't tell if you think I'm town or scum, and they can't tell how you're reading the 5 names in my list after excluding yourself.


I don't know maybe I'm too stupid to see it so feel free to show me but if this is just a personality thing and this is how you genuinenly sort then I gotta tell you that from my pov you might as well be sorting people by yourself and just placing naked votes because I feel in the dark about where you stand most of the time. I think also in overkill games the only posts that clarified your opinion on someone to me was when you get into it with someone to get them lynched. That's when I'm like "oh thor scumreads x".
And like I accept that some people might only claim reads when they're pushing a wagon or defending a person being wagoned, but what happens if they do this as town and the wagon they're on doesn't get much support/doesn't get hammered and then they get nightkilled? What was their contribution?

Ftr I'm not saying your arguments are bad. I find myself agreeing some of them. Just there's no clear direction for where it's going and what reads you're forming based on them.

[DuckDuckJab]

Damn it I hate this logout timer thing sometimes.

I was typing this huuuuuge reply to Thor that took probably over 40 minutes and I'm afraid it's lost forever.

I'm just going to accept that it will take us a lot of games for us to learn to get along because either your process is so very different from mine, or you're scum who intentionally tries to get me riled up by making me overexplain (something I need to work on).

The only part I will try to replicate from my lost post is the bit about A50:

The commuter claim is probably the scummiest thing in his ISO. That's not what makes him town. His reactions do. I think after he explained everything to all of us, it should be pretty obvious in hindsight that his play fits with him trying a gambit, that failed miserably, that then frustrated him because gambits are a huge factor in his enjoyment (I think) and he realized it was actually going to get him lynched, and he didn't want to get lynched without at least trying to protect himself.

Why did he not just try to be the towniest town that ever towned I do not know, but him playing suboptimally is not an indication that he is scum.

And ftr after seeing a few people still suspecting A50 I entertained the idea that A50 is trying to pocket me, but if that is the case it would be really funny to me. I don't know why any scum would choose to try and trick just one specific player so early in the game when the gamestate could change so drastically before it ends but if they choose to play badly we shouldn't complain.

Also I tend to trust my day 1 reads a lot and I have a bunch of reasons why but it's really not important to talk about it. Hopefully the results will speak for themselves eventually. And if they don't I'd like to think that I am capable of learning, analyzing, adapting, and improving as I have done in the past.

I guess I can try to summarize the main point in my paragraphs about your play also: which is that it doesn't matter how much you think you are sorting, to me as a player in this game, I am not getting that from you. You seem more interested in interrogating people about the way they arrived at their conclusions like we're lab rats in your experiment, instead of discussing/debating the conclusions themselves. This is more appropriate for the post-game not during the game. You can sort alone but there is a required balance of sharing some thoughts/reads and not sharing others. For example, if you determine all scum but then die without ever telling us, it's the same as you not being here at all.

Like I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for a second. Let's say you are doing this in an effort to correct a read you think is wrong. Just straight up tell me why I or omo or cheeky are wrong. And then we can either agree or we'll tell you why you're wrong about us being wrong, and so on and so forth. What you seem to do instead is just continuing to ask people to explain until nothing in the conversation makes sense anymore and it diverts far away from the actual read which is the important part.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Does he only do gambits as town/not get annoyed if they go sid3ways when he's scum?

Of course not.

What do you imagine the gambit would be here then if he's scum? Because you seem to accept the commuter claim at least.

The crumb, followed by the gambit to get NK'ed, followed by the reactions, followed by the claim only fits town PR.

If he's town VT his death wouldn't be a big deal, so his reactions are unwarranted.

If he's scum and commuter why would he claim commuter?

If he's scum and not commuter, why would he bait night targets?

The only thing that might make sense is if his slip was actually an unintended scumslip. But I can't imagine how anyone could make a mistake like that. How do you go into a game find out it's SECRETLY a nightless game and on the first post you make you announce it to everyone? And then his response to being 'caught' is to mention being overgamed and his alt is playing a nightless game, instead of coming up with pretty much any better explanation?

So I believe he is in fact town commuter.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

What do you imagine the gambit would be here then if he's scum? Because you seem to accept the commuter claim at least.

The crumb, followed by the gambit to get NK'ed, followed by the reactions, followed by the claim only fits town PR.

If he's town VT his death wouldn't be a big deal, so his reactions are unwarranted.

If he's scum and commuter why would he claim commuter?

If he's scum and not commuter, why would he bait night targets?

Thor.. bro.. there were 4 separate pats to A50's ISO.

Let me label them with numbers this time.

The crumb (1), followed by the gambit to get NK'ed (2), followed by the reactions (3), followed by the claim (4).

I'm saying all 4 of them in this order only makes sense for town PR.

If VT, 1 and 2 are fine, but 3 is not, and probably 4 doesn't fit either.

If scum commuter (or say something like ascetic or BP, some sort of defensive ability), then 1, 2 make sense to bait town PRs to investigate/kill him (as he was being intentionally mysterious/weird), even 3 sort of makes sense because he got too suspected, but 4 would not happen because commuter claim completely negates all that he did before it.

If scum but NOT commuter, we can argue he might do 1 and 4, possibly 3 was AtE to avoid a lynch, but why would he do 2?? Surely that would not be favorable for defenseless scum?

Now we can always yell "WIFOM" but does it really make sense to you that he would deliberately do all he did exactly like he did for wifom?

What I'm arguing is that the existence of all of these elements together, and in the natural order that they occured in, does not seem to fit if he is scum.

I would argue that he would be the best townie to lynch in a hypothetical scenario where all town get gladiated but it is far better to lynch scum, so let's go with someone with a far higher chance of flipping scum. If the paranoia about A50 from others persists we can deal with it at a later stage.

[DuckDuckJab]

Lady I would like an update on your reads.

Overall I'm not seeing much to change any of my reads and I'm ready for some flips.

It would be incredibly funny if thor and gamma were scum together because the activity overview right now is almost identical for them. It's like they're in-sync. That's the kind of stuff I'm noticing because the game is getting boring.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

@Thor - at the time I posted you both had 57 posts and had posted at roughly the same time (few minutes apart max). There's no connection. It is a coincidence. If I had posted some random fact about something video game or sport related that was clearly off topic, would you have commented?

Do you actually think I would think that you two are coordinating your posting like that? Are you secretly robots?!

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

I'm pretty behind sorry. I'll try and be here d2 if I'm still alive.
Skitter is a wolf

~ tw

[DuckDuckJab]

I'm pretty behind sorry. I'll try and be here d2 if I'm still alive.
Skitter is a wolf

~ tw

What makes Skitter a wolf?

What makes her hard town?

[DuckDuckJab]

Sry to be difficult but we're gonna advance the game more if you explain first.
I enjoy playing with skitter a lot and a lot so it goes w/o saying a fair bit goes into me blanket wolfreading her d1 when I'm only ~mildly~ up with the thread

[DuckDuckJab]

I'll give cookies to anyone on the milk wagon at EoD
~ tw

[DuckDuckJab]

@Thor - what can I say.. it was funny to me.

@All - I believe Thor is town. I have been racking my brain trying to make sense of this rather confusing game and to me the scenario that makes the most sense is that A50 v Thor is TvT.

Let's start with A50. I have explained my case very extensively to Thor. I don't need to get into it further. What I want to point out is that given the reactions to the A50 wagon right after it got really serious (just before his commuter claim) and right after the commuter claim do contain some TMI spewing him town. Now unfortunately I personally can see 4 maybe more of such 'tells' so it's almost guaranteed that not all of them are from scum but I also don't think it's likely that ALL of them were coincidences. So I think scum realized they accidentally spewed A50 town and needed another mislynch quickly.

Enter thor. Thor is a respected player, and probably a threat to scum but at the same time he has gotten on some people's nerves and been suspected by at least half the playerbase at one point or another during the game. With the approaching deadline and the milk wagon not reaching hammer, scum realized they had an opportunity to lynch Thor, because some players are already eager to vote him and others will be willing to compromise lynch him to avoid a no lynch.

That leaves us with two options regarding the counterwagon to both which is milk. He's either scum (imo the likely option) or he's town that scum could not push fast enough and were too afraid to pile votes on at the very end of the day when it had sat there for so long.

Don't lynch thor. Lynch scum.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

@Duck - what are your reads on skitter and Omo?

Scum and townish respectively. (I didn't like trivium but Omo is okay)

Why'd you move your terribad vote off me Cheeky?
You're saying Duck's case (that basically requires you or Flub to be scum) made sense to you?

Wait I townread these slots. What makes you think the later votes on you are scummier than the early ones?

[DuckDuckJab]

Is this the part where we flash lynch Robert?

Since you don't seem interested in milk anymore then yes.. it's worth a shot to counter thor's wagon.

VOTE: Robert

[DuckDuckJab]

Is this the part where we flash lynch Robert?

Since you don't seem interested in milk anymore then yes.. it's worth a shot to counter thor's wagon.

VOTE: Robert

Plus he's clearly been pro-thor wagon for a while, but subtly pushing it by pointing out how close he is to being lynched instead of voting, without offering like a defence or counter case so it's not like he's pointing it out out of fear that we mislynch.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Uh oh somebody got caught trying to squeeze his toothpaste back into the tube.

D2 gonna be interesting.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

That’s a very good flip. Anyone have reason to

not

lynch off Thor’s wagon today?

Why only off wagon?

Pretty sure it's milk lynching time.

[DuckDuckJab]

thor/duck/a50 looks pretty t/t/t to me. Vote's staying on robert.

I know we don't have A50 flip yet but since I'm quite confident he's town this post now looks really bad also.

[DuckDuckJab]

Uh oh somebody got caught trying to squeeze his toothpaste back into the tube.

D2 gonna be interesting.

-BuJ

This was referring to DLA. I thought that rob was the one who got hammered, so dla's vote on thor was him trying to undo his mistake.

Basically, I think we have to lynch between DLA/Milk/omochao.
I've felt that milk has been objectively one of the scummiest, but we should also do more homework and look for associatoves between these 3 and rob. I'd be interested to see how y'all interpret such tells so if everyone could do this it would be good.

[DuckDuckJab]

DDJ what's your read on skitter?

She's my secret scumread hence my "sekret" mispell. I'll leave it to tw to explain his case on her because he has it better defined objectively. For me it was just a feeling that while her posts were noisy it wasn't actual scumhunting.

[DuckDuckJab]

@skitter when are you free to jam for a bit?
I need to catch up & also want to make sure i get my read on you right; would appreciate a catchup buddy

~ tw

[DuckDuckJab]

Basically, I think we have to lynch between DLA/Milk/omochao.

Why Omo?

Trivium's slot

[DuckDuckJab]

lynching between {milk, skitter} seems good for today. lady angel is good pick for scum off wagon for staying on Robert for so long, but she's also lurking so it's hard to make that argument.

VOTE: milkcarton

I dont see skitter as scum in the slightest

Hit me up why's she town?

[DuckDuckJab]

I don't understand why there's any suspicion on me today? I was hoping to cruise until I felt like dedicating more time to the game.

Angel can you please explain your read on me apart from today? Like why did you open thinking I could be scum? You too joges please.

This is a townposti and I kinda think Gamma's one above it on the same page was as well where he talked about wagons and stuff. Also I agree wrt not really understanding why CT is under suspicion today

[DuckDuckJab]

I don't understand why there's any suspicion on me today? I was hoping to cruise until I felt like dedicating more time to the game.

Angel can you please explain your read on me apart from today? Like why did you open thinking I could be scum? You too joges please.

Your first few posts of the day were really tone-shifted, otherwise I think you're town. So really, I'm just curious about the sudden shift.

As I said, I'm overgamed. I'll still play but just not at the pace I was. My tone doesn't stay the same - I am all over the place as a player. It's ma thang.

Jokes aside, I would probably be using you noticing this to validate a read on you but I have nothing. What's with your tone shift/pick up in activity?

VOTE: joges dude rep out if you're too busy that you need to keep V/LAing.

Probably rather policy lynch uou for asking people to replace out rather than policy lynch joges for v/la lmao

[DuckDuckJab]

Vote Count 1.Final

Flavor to be added.

With 13 Alive, it is 7 to Lynch!

Thor665: (7) themilkcartonkid (711), skitter30 (713), Almost50 (720), Omochao (744), Flubbernugget (761), Robert2424 (801), DarkLightA (812),
Robert2424: (5) Lady Angel (326), CheekyTeeky (791), DuckDuckJab (522), Gamma Emerald (796), Thor665 (808),
Gamma Emerald: (1) joges (266),
Almost50: (0)
themilkcartonkid: (0)
Lady Angel: (0)
Flubbernugget: (0)
Omochao: (0)
CheekyTeeky: (0)
joges: (0)
DuckDuckJab: (0)
skitter30: (0)
DarkLightA: (0)

Not Voting (0):


A LYNCH HAS BEEN ACHIEVED!

Important Notes:
-

The Game is currently in Day One.

-

skitter30 is permanently V/LA on Fridays and Saturdays.

I think the entire Robert wagon is town.

Last two(?) scum in {flubber, joges, DLA, milk}

HRRRKKKK i think I agree on offwagon but why is skitter not in your PoE?

That was one of those day one endings where scum were probably really happy to get the mislynch on a reasonably strong player thru and then the vig shot really ruined their week (kinda reminds me of another game I played once where Kokichi ducked the d1 lynch thru some scum god tier ate then got vigged and his team melted)

[DuckDuckJab]

lynching between {milk, skitter} seems good for today. lady angel is good pick for scum off wagon for staying on Robert for so long, but she's also lurking so it's hard to make that argument.

VOTE: milkcarton

I dont see skitter as scum in the slightest

lol are you scum then?

Can you walk me through how you're making this association?

*gigglesnort*

[DuckDuckJab]

remind me what you don't like about this slot again?

I actually twisted Buj's arm on this slot a bit when trivium was in it and just after this new person rep'd in -- we should probably have a decent jam about it & get back to you about what was SCUMTELLING and why I'm turning around on it.

also I'm really sorry to hear your WIM is low. lmk if there's any way I can help you get more into this game. I think yiu know it's mostly out of of fear of your scumgame thwt I see infrequently posting wallpostibg skitter asking lots of questions with few conclusions and go like "asdfghjkl;'scum" but you're also like in the top tier of people I don't want to mislynch

/shameless AtE

[DuckDuckJab]

Tell me why your post is a good post and not a terrible post?

Yeah that's cool, I mean I only have 141 other posts to judge me off. You're full of it - this is the definition of fake scum hunting, nice try though. The point is for discussion, and for congratulating the vig - what stupid scum or PR would actually answer and it had to be the vig because a fucking maf died you silly man.

If you took a look at Roberts posts or even EOD yesterday you would know I'm obv town. Says to me you're not really trying to solve the game.

(sorry!) this was pretty similar to my reaction as you see above, except I think you're town

I like heavily scumread Joges d1 but I'm getting really lukewarm on this read and I think the only real... concern right now is that the gamestate is consistent with lurking scum imo. still think there's better candidates than joges.

[DuckDuckJab]

I kinda wanna vote Flubbz but I think that's a natural tendency I have~~

DLA?

[DuckDuckJab]

I've been a bit phased out due to travel and entertaining fam and other mafia stuff

I'm begging BuJ to forgive me and help me get recalibrated fully T_T

[DuckDuckJab]

{ddj}
{CT, GE}
{Omochao, Lady angel}
{joges}
{skitter30, themilkcartonkid}
{DarkLightA, Flubbernugget}

about here fyi, it just feels bottom heavy but I'm not having an easy time calibrating my reads on these slots.

@milky when you're around next, given the metadive I did on you to see if you were mislynchable in that one newbie game do you think I should be townreading you? Why/why not? (this is the worst btw, quack quack)

skitter I've reached out to


DLA and Flubbz I need more real-time ans observation on, plus I want BuJ to help me get there


OK I'm ready. Bring on the onslaught.

[DuckDuckJab]

Surprised I've got Omo so high btw I was like "lol nice role pm u got ther" d1 with trivium but Omo's been... oko I think

[DuckDuckJab]

lynching between {milk, skitter} seems good for today. lady angel is good pick for scum off wagon for staying on Robert for so long, but she's also lurking so it's hard to make that argument.

VOTE: milkcarton

I dont see skitter as scum in the slightest

Hit me up why's she town?

I mirror a lot of her thoughts in handling the thor wagon. In addition, she is incredibly transparent and to my knowledge has a meta where she struggles with that as scum. I think the fact that nobody has really tried casing her is also telling.

Can you show me the transparency that you think is difficult to fake as scum / doesn't feel uncomfortable? I'd suggest you might want to read one of her scumgames. This is a carbon copy of it :/ what she's contributed so far is not difficult for her to fake imo.

[DuckDuckJab]

VOTE: Flubber

[DuckDuckJab]

that lolclear based on meta he clearly hasn't checked is pretty damning imo. I don't want to clear this as a s/s reaction to my question, either.

[DuckDuckJab]

I don't mind the DLA wagon as he is one of my suspects but also let's not forget milk&trivium's TMI posts.

Trivium called A50/Thor town at a time when I think nobody could have TR'd either of them confidently let alone TR both of them when they were arguing.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Any chance you'd be happy tiering your reads rq skitter? (I'm struggling with it a little)

[DuckDuckJab]

@all - Except that triv lumped us in there with thor/a50 also. Just doesn't feel like a genuine read, just a dismissive, LAMIST, "let's move on guys, we're sll friends here" type post.
If omo hadn't been townie by tone I would have been aggressively pushing this. And tone is not that hard to fake.

But y'all aren't feeling it and I feel milk has been even worse this game. He's in a different reality.. the way he sees CT/us doesn't even make sense. He's not reading not sorting not engaging.

I will note that even though I have been picking out TMI tells and pushing them I think odds are these two are not both scum. I think it would be pretty rare for 3 scum (rob included) to all townspew the same player (a50) unless it was intentional, and I see no reason for a scum team to do that intentionally.

If milk gets votes I believe my p would be happy to switch our vote. Also I'd probably hammer dla if he gets to L-1 again.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

I don't mind the DLA wagon as he is one of my suspects but also let's not forget milk&trivium's TMI posts.

Trivium called A50/Thor town at a time when I think nobody could have TR'd either of them confidently let alone TR both of them when they were arguing.

-BuJ

Skimming a shit argument and going "yeah this is tvt" is pretty common from either alignment.

This defence creeps me out more than trivium's actions

[DuckDuckJab]

Obviously just lynch obvscum Flubber tomorrow if this greens lol.

[DuckDuckJab]

VOTE: DarkLightA

This is L-1, so as promised, IT'S HAMMERTIME.

VOTE: DarkLightA

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Valid

[DuckDuckJab]

I don't care at the moment.
I said I will hammer if it got to L-1 again for a reason, and I'll share my analysis when the time is right. (Factoring in the flip snd NK)

[DuckDuckJab]

@skitter - I wasn't sure what to make of the dla wagon. The circumstances of the hammer certainly made it look like he was looking for any excuse to lynch a townie, thor, instead of his buddy, robert, but then the speed of the wagon and the weak votes on it were suspicious. So I promised to hammer tp gauge reactions. I figured any decent scum would easily find a reason to make it L-1 without appearing scummy. But flubber didn't put a reason and that vote didn't come quickly after my promise nor were there any unvotes so none of the voters seemed to care that dla was getting so much heat. I'm concluding that all scum were on the wagon.

Time to lynch milk honestly. He has been very scummy, disconnected from the gamestate, TMI'd, was a solid wagon in day 1 that got countered, started getting votes day 2 but dla was thrown in there to counter.

VOTE: Milkcartonkid

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

We should never lynch {CT, milk} after that claim
UNVOTE: sorry need to re-evaluate

[DuckDuckJab]

Give me a break A50.. if you don't want to play the game don't expect people to follow you. You must know by now that you've made this game harder than it needed to be. Not to mention the whole thor thing. I don't blame you for thor's lynch but I blame you for making thor suspect you.

You claim effin commuter and then you suddenly believe a JK claim stopped two kills in a row? Yeah-fucking-right

The king of NK-baiting doesn't suspect that maybe he got shot? Don't make me laugh


Sorry CT, you're a great NK for scum if you're town but I don't think you're the only target. It makes 0 sense for you to be the target twice.

My partner wants to keep you and Milk both alive and I'm not interested in arguing with him when there are at least some advantages to that I guess so I'll go with majority opinion here on milk.. but we're not no lynching.

Investigative(s) should check skitter in case we have 4 scum.
We should lynch either omochao or lady.

Scum are already outed in this game.. the shitty part is that we also apparently have townies that have posted TMI-sounding things and it's been a pain in the ass trying to sort which is which.

Also for the record gamma was a strong SR for me day 1 but I can't read gamma at all because he's now at the grandmaster level of mafia where he could be any alignment and also he efforts more as scum so it's hard to know when he's being pro-town because he's town or because he's faking. My opinion on him anyway. But like voting patterns suggest he's town if I ignore my spidey senses.

As for flubber I think scum would have bussed him if he were scum with them. He doesn't sound like he's following any particular agenda or working with a particular team, if that makes sense to anyone. Him not being pushed much until now makes me think he's town honestly. Though I wish he would suspect people that could actually flip scum instead of me and CT.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

To summarize the post above:

A50 is either lying or not thinking clearly.
Lynch should be omochao or lady.

[DuckDuckJab]

We gain more from the flip than we do from 'not risking a mislynch'.

Basically the only downside to lynching is that you MIGHT kill a townie.

If we are indeed winning (there is a wild theory between me and tw that involves a delayed kill mechanic which could mean we're in trouble but I have decided not to assume the improbable), then it makes sense to take more risks than less.

Compare that to no lynch:
-If there is a vig (most likely explanation) they can still kill again if we lynch.
-If there is a cop with a guilty, we should have heard from them by now. Unless we literally lynch them the risk of scum shooting the cop doesn't change much if we lynch or no lynch. (Only 1 less choice)
-If there is a way to prove someone's innocence or prove what Milk is saying, no lynch would affect such a role unless we literally lynch that role.

So unless we are about to lynch someone and they claim one of the above and we believe their claim there is no reason to not lynch.

And even if we do end up forcing a cop to out themselves to avoid a lynch, we can use them as bait for the NK.

Lynch is far more information than no lynch. Lynch would not stop the majority of pro-town night actions unless we lynch specific PRs. Lynch is less risky when we're winning. Lynch gives us a chance at outright winning before scum can take another move (if only 1 remains).

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

1. The advantages are related to forcing milk to make suboptimal decisions if he is lying. Lynching someone else has nothing to do with it.

2. How are we benefitting from our advantage if we choose the 'safe' play that generates no additional info? No lynch is a step backwards. It is literally a stepback and reevaluate type of move. Or it can be used when we are confident we have control of night actions. Which we don't with the current flips/claims we have.

3. You are telling me I should trust you based on my knowledge of you and my reading ability. Tell me what you would do different as scum here, because so far your words this game do not match your actions. You imply that I shouldn't 'ruin' your gambits and I try to, but you aren't giving me any confidence in return.

I do not want to get into detail of how night actions could help or not help us and I don't want to reveal how much I know or don't know about what you're doing if town.

Day 1 I believe I read you correctly, which lead to my conversations with thor, which lead to me reading him correctly also. I'd like you to trust that my opinion on no lynch here is not a hasty one and that I am capable of factoring in hypotheticals of information I don't have.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Maybe if we get more than 2 people talking to each at a time.

[DuckDuckJab]

@A50 - we will discuss just how aware I am of what's going on in the game after the game if you so wish. You should make up your mind on whether I am in sync with you or I'm not. I can't be both perceptive of your play and ignorant of it at the same time.
I don't care that you want to keep things to yourself. What I am saying is that there is no set of circumstances or roles that could justify no lynch here to me in this dayphase with the public knowledge we share. So don't reveal, but just change your position.


@skitter - maybe I don't know.. I don't have a solid case on it with tangible evidence, just the way I felt about flubber. What about the second part of that quote? Do you feel that any of his posts are indicative of someone having a team with him?


I sadly obvtowned way earlier than this.. at this stage I might as well just post whatever I want until scum NK me or we win.

But yes I didn't want to say it because I didn't trust my pov on the issue but now that some of you have mentioned it I likely got targetted at least once which is another reason why I'm skeptical of the whole cheeky being JK'd twice thing. Not to mention A50 also being alive.

VOTE: Omochao seems like there's more support for Omo than lady A.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

@Flubber: To me, voting Cheeky is the unacceptable choice. Please vote no lynch. Thanks you.

The only reason I would vote no lynch is if town decides they want to let the vig shoot for a Scummy

That's the idea. Considering the Vig is 2/2 so far (as opposed to us being 0/2) I figure we let them do their thing for tonight before we intervene, maybe?

How exactly does a lynch stop the vig from shooting?

[DuckDuckJab]

^Oops. Was doing so well until that.

[DuckDuckJab]

Buddy I'm sorry you felt I was being unfair to you.

I heavily suspected you weren't commuter. I don't remember what I said to tw exactly but I told him that based on your play and your posting you were some PR that wanted to avoid the NK by pretending to pull off one of your gambits attracting the NK so that scum think you're baiting the NK so they don't shoot you. It's so beautifully A50-ic.

That said we're playing a game of deception. It would be terrible play from me, and somewhat insulting to you, if I didn't consider you might be scum. My argument was based on evaluating the impact of lynch/no lynch on regular roles. Not some original super PR combo-role made for this setup. So whatever you were saying didn't matter to me because you're either town and wrong or scum.

Though now that you explained... (wasn't actually warranted tbh) it still doesn't make me want to no lynch. Still don't see how it makes a difference to you and your action if we lynch.

You don't want us to lynch milk that's fine, most of us moved on from him. Even me the person most hungry for milk's lynch have begrudgingly agreed with tw to delay that lynch/wait for extra info. We lynch someone else. Whether you claimed or not, whether we lynch or not, your action would have not been affected.

And actually given that you were pushing for no lynch and all that there was always a chance they would have shot you, so I would argue that we're better off by you claiming now.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Ugh. Buj you owe me a trust sheep when I ask for it.

I don't think I did anything.

It wasn't that I didn't know what A50 was doing (I didn't know they were a super vig sure, but like yeah I doubted he was a commuter). I just didn't agree that no lynch makes any difference.

Also I didn't force him to claim. I'm surprised he even thought his explanation would change my mind. I still don't understand how no lynch is better.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

FFS, I AM THE BLOODY VIG AND I HAVE THE BLOODY INFO I NEED!

First off, let me come clean: I lied about being a Commuter. I didn't know how to handle my "slip" otherwise. And yes, it was a slip indeed, just not a "scum slip".

My role is bizarre. I simply submit a list of 3 living players each night. If one (and exactly one) of them is Scum, they die and the scum kill is blocked. If none, 2 or all 3 are scum my action fails and the scum NK goes through.

On N1 I picked DDJ as a slot I hard TR'd. My 2nd choice would have been in Cheeky/Flubber/LA (as TRs), and Robert as the 3rd (the counterwagon to a flipped townie), and I decided to go for a Cheeky. If it ended up with someone else dying I would have assumed Robert was Town because DDJ was already all but confirmed in my eyes and Cheeky was close enough and was not on the lynch wagon on D1. I guess I was a bit lucky with Robert, thus confirming the other 2 as Town and from then on it was an easy job.

On N2 I was torn between 2 thoughts: Pick 3 others and see what happens (at best it could have confirmed 2 more townies, but at worst it could have resulted in mine or DDJ/Cheeky's death at the hands of the Mafia and I would have taken a step back rather than forward, so to speak). I picked the alternative of using my 2 confirmed townies with someone I suspected, so as to either kill scum or confirm a third townie 100%. I picked joges over milk.

N3 is going to be even easier. I am using DDJ+Cheeky+milk. Either milk dies or he is confirmed a townie.

The thing is if we hypothetically assume milk to be Town then we most probably lose a Townie tonight due to the Mafia kill. And now that I fully claimed I suspect that Townie would be me. This is partially why I didn't want to out, because as long as they thought I was a Commuter they would not have risked shooting me anyway, and especially so with the situation they're in. They simply cannot afford a failed NK.

The other reason was for fear they may have a Doctor or a roleblocker. *Sigh*

At first I thought NO WAY we have a JK with my role. Then it hit me: WHAT IF the game had went another route on D1 and I wasn't as lucky on N1? There would have been every chance that >I< would be the NK (the designer certainly didn't account for my "slip" resulting in me faking Commuter, did they?). If that was the case then would the Town be without an investigative/protective for the rest of the game? Because my role IS THE BLOODY INVESTIGATIVE, PROTECTIVE AND KILLING ROLE ALL IN ONE. That's why I didn't go for a milky lynch and decided it's better to verify him via my night action. It makes sense that a JK may exist as a backup for my role minus the killing part. Also the investigative part of his in nerfed compared to mine under the current situation.

Now how bloody hard would it have been for you to just trust me on a MECHANICAL DECISION? It has nothing to do with "gut" or "associative tells" or anything like that. A purely mechanical play by someone in the know.

Any chance of making this skitter + milk + us?
11/10 would help my paranoia

[DuckDuckJab]

~ the head that is bad at signing and also this game

[DuckDuckJab]

Keen to end this before LadyAngel is replaced.
A50 if you can't signal one way or the other before deadline please proceed with YOUR PLAN not mine

[DuckDuckJab]

Oh my mission failed.
some replacement queue pilot I am.

[DuckDuckJab]

Anyway Trivium was lolwolfy, Omo was towny at the start but heavily inconsistent so idrk or mind how this flips

I'll jam with Buj over night if this game continues because I have been an AWFUL hydra partner and I think we can nail this

[DuckDuckJab]

Happy to be here fam

How do you feel about my suggestion for A50?

[DuckDuckJab]

Who should #3 be? (obviously having us in there is brilliant because I believe were softconftown from his previous night actions)

Actually if there's only one scum left he should pick 3 scumspects but I can't recall if this is confirmed 3v10 or not

[DuckDuckJab]

MY DAY OF REDEMPTION
IS UPON US

though like I was thinking 3:10

and kinda townread tmck

my bad

[DuckDuckJab]

MY DAY OF ATTEMPTIHG REDEMPTION
IS UPON US

Fixed

Buj is gonna laugh at me for that flip

[DuckDuckJab]

So like, can we lynch flubber now?

Yes, Flubber greens

Tonight A50 targets {us, Lady, skitter} in case there's another red flip

[DuckDuckJab]

@Mr. Jingle sir

any chance of an update to post#0?

[DuckDuckJab]

Uh if there's no jk a50 shouldn't be alive

Maybe there's just no nk for scum and there's like 5 of them?

Nvm I kinda like this for a derpclear

Let's massclaim ye

[DuckDuckJab]

I'd rather Lady Angel/DT slot to Cheeky, vveryslightly

[DuckDuckJab]

Also think massclaim is good ideas bc need to remove some tinfoil

[DuckDuckJab]

You have to try sorry man

[DuckDuckJab]

O hi this is the worst btw so I'll try not to misread you this time

[DuckDuckJab]

Actually with a fresh set of eyes and shit would you mind isoing themilkcartonkid and seeing jf there's anything spewy in there?

[DuckDuckJab]

Just switched this account over to Brave browser and my WIM shot up another 50 points

LET'S COOK SOME WOLF

[DuckDuckJab]

Don't massclaim yet. Not while a50 is alive.

If it is nightless he knew it and should be lynched for that alone. So flubber's setup theory doesn't work if we also believe a50.

What should happen is we lynch thomas or flubber. T and F for short.

If we lynch F and he greens or the game doesn't end, a50 must check skitter and T and us(I prefer it over CT just for the paranoia).

If we lynch T and he greens or game doesn't end, a50 must check skitter and F and us.

If game still doesn't end tomorrow we discuss again based on night results/night deaths.

Questions or concerns??

I prefer lynching Thomas ftr, and skitter is scummier in my eyes than gamma. Heck scummier than flubber tbh. But since I know her I felt she as town could be appealed to easier than the people I don't know.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

A50 there is no version of this game where you are town and there are also 5 scum.

So it's a bad idea to check 1 scum with 2 confirmed.


Actually you know what just check 3 scummy people. By default you'll have 1 scum and 2 town.

So check skitter/flubber/gamma. And let's lynch thomas.

Game over. We lynch A50 if none of those die at night.

Even if not all of you agree, (please discuss), massclaim is definitely not recommended. Scum already know a50, and he is likely the nk target if his action fails, so the only scenarios we're dealing with are if a50 is scum or if a50 is town and his action fails but the nk is blocked somehow. In these two scenarios all massclaim is doing would be to expose a PR.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

So check skitter/flubber/gamma. And let's lynch thomas.

Game over. We lynch A50 if none of those die at night.

I withdraw my previous sentiment and entirely support this
(Buj is very good at bending arms)

[DuckDuckJab]

O hi this is the worst btw so I'll try not to misread you this time

ok when did i play with you?

i thought i only played with you in turbos and that's been a while?

i will try i guess how does iso work here? wheres da button at

also can you give me a overall catch up / reads you have on others? i am def not reading all 50 pages. if you think there are important bits i should look into carefully lmk

only turbos ye I have more time to get you right this time

[DuckDuckJab]

So check skitter/flubber/gamma. And let's lynch thomas.

Game over. We lynch A50 if none of those die at night.

I withdraw my previous sentiment and entirely support this
(Buj is very good at bending arms)

You think Cheeky looks townier than Skitter?

ye do you disagree?

[DuckDuckJab]

FFS, I AM THE BLOODY VIG AND I HAVE THE BLOODY INFO I NEED!

First off, let me come clean: I lied about being a Commuter. I didn't know how to handle my "slip" otherwise. And yes, it was a slip indeed, just not a "scum slip".

My role is bizarre. I simply submit a list of 3 living players each night. If one (and exactly one) of them is Scum, they die and the scum kill is blocked. If none, 2 or all 3 are scum my action fails and the scum NK goes through.

On N1 I picked DDJ as a slot I hard TR'd. My 2nd choice would have been in Cheeky/Flubber/LA (as TRs), and Robert as the 3rd (the counterwagon to a flipped townie), and I decided to go for a Cheeky. If it ended up with someone else dying I would have assumed Robert was Town because DDJ was already all but confirmed in my eyes and Cheeky was close enough and was not on the lynch wagon on D1. I guess I was a bit lucky with Robert, thus confirming the other 2 as Town and from then on it was an easy job.

On N2 I was torn between 2 thoughts: Pick 3 others and see what happens (at best it could have confirmed 2 more townies, but at worst it could have resulted in mine or DDJ/Cheeky's death at the hands of the Mafia and I would have taken a step back rather than forward, so to speak). I picked the alternative of using my 2 confirmed townies with someone I suspected, so as to either kill scum or confirm a third townie 100%. I picked joges over milk.

N3 is going to be even easier. I am using DDJ+Cheeky+milk. Either milk dies or he is confirmed a townie.

The thing is if we hypothetically assume milk to be Town then we most probably lose a Townie tonight due to the Mafia kill. And now that I fully claimed I suspect that Townie would be me. This is partially why I didn't want to out, because as long as they thought I was a Commuter they would not have risked shooting me anyway, and especially so with the situation they're in. They simply cannot afford a failed NK.

The other reason was for fear they may have a Doctor or a roleblocker. *Sigh*

At first I thought NO WAY we have a JK with my role. Then it hit me: WHAT IF the game had went another route on D1 and I wasn't as lucky on N1? There would have been every chance that >I< would be the NK (the designer certainly didn't account for my "slip" resulting in me faking Commuter, did they?). If that was the case then would the Town be without an investigative/protective for the rest of the game? Because my role IS THE BLOODY INVESTIGATIVE, PROTECTIVE AND KILLING ROLE ALL IN ONE. That's why I didn't go for a milky lynch and decided it's better to verify him via my night action. It makes sense that a JK may exist as a backup for my role minus the killing part. Also the investigative part of his in nerfed compared to mine under the current situation.

Now how bloody hard would it have been for you to just trust me on a MECHANICAL DECISION? It has nothing to do with "gut" or "associative tells" or anything like that. A purely mechanical play by someone in the know.

@DT this is currently the most significant part of the game since we've b2b2b lynched town and scum has b2b2b flipped without any town deaths

there was no cc to this and the claimed Jailkeeper has flipped red which makes me think scum have some way of knowing there's no roleblocking going on / they wouldn't be cc'd

deaths are semijanitored roles aren't revealed

this game is advertised quirky mechanical without being bastard and Jingle does indeedy have a history of very eccentric power roles

unless a50 is some kinda third party role OR there's more than 4 scum we basically need a PoE of 4 people to win the game tonight

[DuckDuckJab]

gamestate is incredibly unusual so sorry for the kinda wishy-washy answer

[DuckDuckJab]

basically we're pretty obvtown (mostly Buj's doing)
Cheeky is widely townread and has been consistently reasonably obvtown
A50 shouldn't self-taught

outside of this I think we're roughly @

{Gamma}
{you/LadyA slot}
{Flubber}
{skitter30}

I'd probably rather not explain my reads in massive detail publicly yet but for some starters themilkcartonkid's iso is a pretty smooth albeit long read and skitter's iso is pretty short

talk to me about what you see in either of those?

[DuckDuckJab]

Why would we be?

[DuckDuckJab]

actually that is prob >rand town because i would be asking my wolf mates "hey bud, whats happening?" and when duckduck says one thing i will be like "oh tru" and pretend i got it frmo him but i am low key saying duckduck i dont understand what you quacking about

ye I'd say slightly >rand town (that's how I read it) unless.... secretly everyone is a death miller? which would be mean and Jingle is too cool for that also it'd be bastard which this is nawt

so A50 can target 3 players, and only if there are exactly 1 scum, the scum dies and theres no kill?

that sounds op as shit?

is that 1shot?

what happens if there are more than 1 or no scum at all? does a50 die?

Thoughts are if it's fake he's probably some kind of serial killah pulling the strings so I figure we try tonight out then see how things land tmrw

It's not............. necessarily op just hilariously swingy.........

[DuckDuckJab]

so its not even one shot? sounds op as shit because if shit goes right (which apparently it did like here)

you instantly clear 2 town plus stop a mafia kill

I'm p aware of this and am equally wary, Buj and I have had a similar conversation on Discord and acknowledged there's like 10000 solutions to how this has come up

We've also had 3 scumflips and 3v10 is very heavily sitemeta so it's a bit of a mystery that the game is ongoing. That said we now have confirmation of no death millers, which has stopped me from hyperventilating aggressively.

but ye a50 could be some kinds whack tp role fakeclaiming but we may as well play this at face value and lynch him tmrw

[DuckDuckJab]

at rand (I'm bad at maths so someone correct ne if I fucked it up) assuming single TPR vs. 4 scum

n1: (4/13)(8/12)(7/11) = ~13.05%
n2: (3/11)(7/10)(6/9) = ~12.73%
n3: (2/9)(6/8)(5/7) = ~11.90%
n4: (1/7)(5/6)(4/5) = ~9.52%

assuming all mislynches which we've been doing :>
the fact succeeding n1 perpetuates chance of succeeding in subsequent nights does increase the % above rand but this is a role which very strictly rewards strong day play/sound reads which is what Jingle is very strongly about AFAIK.

even assuming you keep targeting your 2 ICs after n1 your chance of nailing the other scum is (3/9) => (2/7) => (1/5) respectively

this is not a lolpowerful role just very swingy and extremely rewarding for a player of A50's calibre (don't mind the irl pocketing here)

4v9 is pretty scumsided from a vanilla pov and I low key suspect this game is heavily vanilla so like this COULD be a real role and if it is, lmfao, but there is another world where a50 is like a scum redirector or something? and he's just nailed the scum performing the kills but uhh the probability of that is hilariously low

basically nobody has cc'd him on either the vig shot or the roleblock so

I'm talking myself into believing him tbh

[DuckDuckJab]

dat pagetop
ヽ(｀⌒´)ノ

[DuckDuckJab]

Need the wording but antitown 3p usually included as "scum" categorically but yeah we cld have a tp

[DuckDuckJab]

just own the fact Buj has obvtowned imo, I can't obvtown anymore

[DuckDuckJab]

I'm too jaded and angry at the world

[DuckDuckJab]

quack

[DuckDuckJab]

Thor665, Townsperson, lynched Day 1.
Robert2424, Innocent Evil Person, left the town Night 1.
DarkLightA, Townsperson, lynched Day 2.
joges, Innocent Evil Person, left the town Night 2.
Omochao, Townsperson, lynched Day 3.
themilkcartonkid, Innocent Evil Person, left the town Night 3.

just quoting for convenience btw

[DuckDuckJab]

I'd swap gamma with lady A. I've kinda been comfortable with gamma!town after seeing some of the flips.

Tw is leaning town for thomas I believe though. So I guess overall it doesn't really matter.

[DuckDuckJab]

Has someone cracked this yet

In the sense that I can tell you everyone's alignment with absolute confidence? No.

In the sense that we as a hydra believe we know how to guarantee town's win? Yes.

A50 checks the 3 people we're suggesting. We lynch one of the people he's not checking. CT is excluded (and preferably gamma but that is my personal opinion only).

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

Tomorrow if the game doesn't end and a50 is alive we lynch a50. But if he's dead and game is not over we massclaim.

[DuckDuckJab]

Hi. I haven't had the time to actually play today, but I have just read the new posts.

I will check the 3 DDJ tell me to.

Please confirm (in bold) your 3 choices (I'm assuming skitter+Gamma+DT/Flubber and we lynch Flubber/DT?)

Oops.. lady A is DT.

So yeah actually that's who's left.

Please check

{skitter, gamma, DT}

VOTE: Flubber

[DuckDuckJab]

So the reason this works is:

We are currently 7 alive:
skitter30
CheekyTeeky
Gamma Emerald
DuckDuckJab
Almost50
Flubbernugget
DT


With the assumption that this game is not completely scum-sided, we are looking at a maximum of 4 scum of one faction. The different possible setups as I see them are as follows:

Town:Scum:SK
9:4:0 (this means a50 is either town or last scum, in which case we win today or tomorrow by lynching him)
9:3:1 (a50 is SK and will be lynched tomorrow)
8:4:1 (a50 is either town, last scum, or SK, in which case we will end up with a 3p lylo of 2 town 1 anti-town assuming a50 gets lynched tomorrow)

Yeah a50 has to be town tbh.. when you look at this shit there's absolutely no way he can win by killing off so many scum like he did.

So for the lols let's consider
8:5:0 (a50 is town or scum. If town we win because it's too late now to stop him. His result tonight will tell us all we need to know to find last scum. If he is scum and has a living partner, worst case scenario is a 3p lylo with 2 townies and his remaining partner if he is lynched tomorrow)

I'm ready to end this game guys.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

^ one smart ducky

let's do this.

[DuckDuckJab]

I am no longer sure how to play this game.
skitter is still probably a wolf

[DuckDuckJab]

Can anyone claim the A50 kill?

[DuckDuckJab]

Is this like fucking mafia with a twist all over again

[DuckDuckJab]

Is us claiming now beneficial or want me to hold off

[DuckDuckJab]

Look the fact we've only lynched town and literally only had scum NKs at night with no explanation probably means there's some fuckery going on but Idrc about guessing what it's meant to be I just wanna lynch wolfy people

[DuckDuckJab]

anyone object to skitter => DT/GE => NSG => us?

[DuckDuckJab]

Think I just worked it out tbh
I'll consult with Buj

[DuckDuckJab]

anyone object to skitter => DT/GE => NSG => us?

yes, me
i know why you're reading me the way you are, but i am not getting mislynched here for the first time since like last may in a game where i've had four freaking correct vig shots, thank you

you're just town and i think nsg is too based on cheeky's play and how milk tried to guilty her day3; i'm pretty sure lynching and shooting in {dt/ge} just ends the game.

i'm a little nervous because if i'm wrong a townflip today and another tonight coupled with me dying tonight means that the game just ends overnight but i think that *probably* isn't a thing? given a50's slip from early day1 and how the game has played out i think he really did just fuck up and slipped something he wasn't supposed to, and that he spent a lot of the rest of the day trying to sort of play around it; i think that means that there will probably be another day tomorrow and a mess of a lylo to sort through if the game doesn't just end with {dt/ge}

show me your crumbing or softer?

[DuckDuckJab]

softing*

[DuckDuckJab]

NSG, I'd suggest you claim before us

due respect but Buj is obvtown as hell here

[DuckDuckJab]

Gamma's next

[DuckDuckJab]

@skitter sorry to be insistent. last time I singlehandedly nailed the scumteam I was a serial killer. I face value do not trust highly accurate vig claims in games with >4 scum

[DuckDuckJab]

direct cc?

[DuckDuckJab]

I suspect I have it worked out as well but who the fuck knows.
Be curious to see what you've got.

Did you not think skitter was scum earlier?

pedit: we're VT. low key wanted you and skitter claimed before claiming, GE/DT either cc or are just town

[DuckDuckJab]

did I imply you were a SK? why so focused on that?

[DuckDuckJab]

I said last time I was a super accurate vig I was scum as wrll
like a deus ex machina vig claim isn't heartwarming

[DuckDuckJab]

have you been playing into your wolf meta intentionally or

[DuckDuckJab]

i thought you were likening me this game to your sk game

I said I would not be taking it at face value

[DuckDuckJab]

That's something Buj and I just floated on Discord lol.
I'd be down tbh. if it's just scum don't have a nk then 1v3 nightless with us alive this is an autowin anyway

[DuckDuckJab]

Well we floated that it might be a lynch by lynch system scum have already won (town lynch = mafia nk; mafia lynch = town nk)

[DuckDuckJab]

@skitter who's the last scum?

[DuckDuckJab]

Just gonna add that even if nsg is not right, I was just telling tw that because we know that scum have no NK right now, and that we absolutely must lynch scum to win anyway, there's no reason to keep skitter alive even if she's town. Just remove that risk from the game, guarantee that there are no nightkills, and lynch the last scum.

So now that there's a 2nd, even stronger reason to lynch skitter (never heard of extradition mafia before or such a different win condition, that was an interesting post to read @nsg), let's lynch skitter.

-BuJ

[DuckDuckJab]

"highly nonstandard mechanics" "strong emphasis on day play"
Hntfjjfjc

taking my granted authority per the far mightier Bujaber
VOTE: skitter30

[DuckDuckJab]

NSG (ironically) marry me

- not_BuJaber

[DuckDuckJab]

I had it down to a coinflip bc when I entered the thread like "lol skitter is scum" you mentioned not feeling it this game and needing time to get engaged which I thought was a soft back to Jungle Republic and mistook for a tpr claim so when you claimed vig then said you hadn't softed I was almost locked in

asking you to claim first was something I stole from Buj

I didn't nail the setup

NSG is a god

[DuckDuckJab]

NSG softing TPR against your setup and the split second need to make a decision on whether to go for it or not was like.. 100 times more pressure than most scum are required to face during regular dayplay. It was a total "do or die" and I still think you played it well.