Mini 639 - Sci-Fi/Fantasy Movie Mafia(Over!)

[Korts]

Vote: Muerrto

cos you're obviously not dead yet. LAL kicks in.

[Korts]

EBWOP: "I'm always in favor of a good bandwagon. I don't usually jump on random ones. This Muerrto thing has possibilities, though."

unvote, vote: Rishi

How is the Muerrto-wagon different from any other random wagon?

[Korts]

I always thought it was a second vote on someone that was considered a BW.

Meh. Semantics.

My point is that Korts was the first to vote Muerrto and then he criticizes me for voting Muerrto. Doesn't that seem strange to you?

My vote was purely random. You however imply reason other than random, in this following quote:

EBWOP: "I'm always in favor of a good bandwagon. I don't usually jump on random ones.

This Muerrto thing has possibilities, though."

There is an obvious difference.

[Korts]

I hate people hiding behind "It's page <insertpagenumberhere>" signs. So scummy.

Why is it un-page-two-esque to start attacking a player when I see something worth attacking? Assuming it's wrong play for page 2, what is the right play for page 2?

[Korts]

What I'm wondering is how you could possibly under any circumstances read this as something other than a joke? What possible reason could I have for wanting to lynch Muerrto? (Other than OMGUS since his random vote landed on me.) You're inferring reasoning from "This Muerrto thing has possibilities"?

You declare that you don't usually jump on random wagons. This implies something unusual here, which randomness isn't. Since it's not randomness, it must be some kind of proto- or pseudo-reason.

[Korts]

OMGUS much? If not, what exactly is your reason? That I don't have a sense of humor?

Also no need to get personal.

[Korts]

EBWOP

What exactly do you expect, when you contradict yourself (on purpose or not)? Do you think no-one will comment on it?

[Korts]

I don't think I've found scum, I think I've found something that's more worthwhile to take a look at than anything else so far. This reason is far from enough for a serious case or, say, a lynch, but the path to serious discussion leads through pseudo-serious discussion generated by contradictions and such in random stage.

I sometimes try to stimulate discussion in random stage with similar gambits. That doesn't mean they shouldn't be discussed. And coming up with "it was done to generate discussion" is an excuse, basically, even if it's true.

I have no problem with personal attacks, it's just not the time and place. Hey, even I know my sense of humor sucks, imagine how that must suck!

[Korts]

I also want to hear from some of the people who are being quiet and those who haven't had a chance to post yet.

[Korts]

Oh, hey, old fart

[Korts]

bickering=discussion around here

[Korts]

I missed Korts not answering my question. Here it is again.

Korts: Question on your last statement. You say the following:

I don't think I've found scum, I think I've found something that's more worthwhile to take a look at than anything else so far

Does this mean you don't think rishi is scum because that is what I'm reading? If not then why change your vote for someone you don't think is scum and leave it as an FOS?

I missed farside asking her question. Here's the answer.

I don't think rishi's scum, you're reading it right. However, my vote will go where my arguments go. My vote is a versatile tool which I intend to use in the most versatile ways possible. Starting discussion is but one thing a vote comes handy in.

[Korts]

BTW, Grimmy wins. Do we play for second place?

[Korts]

Alright well I think a lot of what just happened seems to be very immature and rather pointless. Other than us commenting on how stupid it all was, I don't really think anything important was gained from it. Now hopefully we can move on to some more helpful discussion rather than bickering.

What part was stupid? Who is saying it was stupid? Do you think neither player has a point?

For what it's worth, that post gained Impatient Townie points with me, even if it's giving off the wrong approach.

[Korts]

Alright well I think a lot of what just happened seems to be very immature and rather pointless. Other than us commenting on how stupid it all was, I don't really think anything important was gained from it. Now hopefully we can move on to some more helpful discussion rather than bickering.

What part was stupid? Who is saying it was stupid? Do you think neither player has a point?

For what it's worth, that post gained Impatient Townie points with me, even if it's giving off the wrong approach.

What is the difference between impatience townie versus impatience scum?

Basically tha fact that he expects more from discussion instead of trying to go with it.

[Korts]

let's stop quote pyramids.

So what I meant was that he thought that this was not proper discussion, which implies a desire to move further. I may have read too much into it, though, on second thought. You're right, that post's basically a substitute for real contribution.

@fuzzylightning: how do you intend to start proper discussion? What is your opinion so far?

[Korts]

@Panzer, I'd say I have waves of aggression, more like. I'm most agressive in or coming out of random stage. That's when the game needs the largest kicks.

[Korts]

@farside, what is your reason for avoiding meta talks?

[Korts]

unvote, vote: zoraster

other than a random vote, his only comment was about aggression being revealing of the aggressive player. Flying under the radar much?

[Korts]

What I don't understand is how you made that smiley simple text as opposed to a face like this:

[Korts]

What I don't understand is how you made that smiley simple text as opposed to a face like this:

I like text emoticons. I guess I'm old school.

cool, I didn't notice the "disable smilies" function... I like old school as much as the next man (who, it seems, doesn't exist, 'cos I'm the last man)

[Korts]

dammit, I thought I checked the disable smilies box...

[Korts]

unvote, vote: Muerrto

What overreaction? Overcompensating much?

[Korts]

unvote

Geez. I didn't remember that. How embarassing.

But please don't hide behind "it's page 5" excuses.

[Korts]

EBWOP:

okay, so you weren't doing even that. I'm going to sleep now.

[Korts]

Panzer's being more than aggressive. The case he made on Muerrto is entirely subjective. Fishing for reactions?

I'm liking Muerrto's reaction so far. However, read on.

FoS Panzer

because you seem to be making a case where there is none. Most of the quotes you are using are from the beginning of the game and that stuff has been put to bed a while ago. You have also made a case against me that was based on life getting in the way of me being on the computer and a stupid mistake. These are very weak cases against two people and you also don't provide much else.

Another poke not exactly trying to get rishi lynched and you say the obvious "we don't know your role PM so why would you do something to purposly make us distrust you?" Mafia is a game of lies, dude. Everyone is lying. Town - Scum don't matter. Cop is trying to lie and make us perceive him as scummy but not too scummy or just an vanilla or whatever. Scum is trying to be town. Vanillas are trying to scum hunt and not be viewed as scummy.

So what is there to make us think you aren't lying, you have just placed a seed of doubt in everything you say for the rest of the game.

unvote, vote: fuzzylightning

Why do you object so much to Panzer making a case out of little information? Also, things that have been "put to bed" aren't necessarily going to stay that way. I'm not liking how you're outraged at Panzer trying to show old arguments in a new light. The case on you wasn't very strong, and the case on Muerrto isn't very strong either, but you trying to set both cases up as something to be dismissed without further thought I see as trying to hinder this line of discussion.

Your reaction to the Muerrto-case is smelling strongly of Tarhalindur-style Chainsaw Defense. Either you're partners with Muerrto, or you're trying hard to buddy up, but it definitely warrants a

FoS: Muerrto

.

[Korts]

Anything substantial, ZS?

[Korts]

ZS, why not pick one or two from your laundry list and give indepth reasons?

If I did, all it would be would be several paragraphs, all of which say the exact same thing.

I prefer to say something using as little words as needed.

Give

some

reasons, at least. So we see the thought process and don't think that you're trying to go with the flow/fly under the radar/any such thing.

[Korts]

More votes on fuzzylightning, plz.

[Korts]

Farside, I already stated my case against fuzzy, in post 133.

About his V/LA, he says he will be away until Sunday. I'm fairly sure that's still within deadline.

[Korts]

No, I don't. Cos they're making an effort, at least, to get this game in gear. I don't like how you're pushing this. I may even consider voting you.

[Korts]

No, I don't. Cos they're making an effort, at least, to get this game in gear. I don't like how you're pushing this. I may even consider voting you.

When we have information, why in hell is it okay to make a case off of no information at all?

I can see much, much better ways to get the game rolling than to try to push a lynch on someone who has nothing against them.

Why don't you try, one, then?

unvote, vote: ZombieSlayer

For shooting down other people's attempts at furthering discussion, yet not getting the game rolling himself like he claims he can.

[Korts]

This thread has dropped too far down my watched list.

Gorrad, why is disagreement such a bad thing? If we disagree, we can

discuss

it; if we agree, well, at least we'll be able to come to a consensus.

FoS: Panzerjager

Your vote should be placed somewhere definitely. Deadline is between two and four weeks, but according to the rules, we won't be told exactly when. It is therefore a

very

anti-town move to unvote and not place your vote somewhere else. Actually, let's make that a vote instead of a FoS.

unvote, vote: Panzerjager

[Korts]

ZS, pointing out that there are others who didn't contribute much doesn't change the fact that you haven't, either. As you yourself noted, both of those people are LA, while you yourself are not. Don't act like a complete idiot.

Your protests at being called out for no content and your finger pointing makes me think that you have something to actually hide.

unvote, vote: ZombieSlayer

@Panzer: As far as I understand, we will only be told of the exact day of the deadline on the day that it actually is deadline. That's not a very good thing, and I think it's

very

anti-town not to vote right now.

[Korts]

BTW hi, Darla

[Korts]

Okay, yes. You make a good point.

BTW, Gorrad, I forgot about you in my last post, but

not

explaining makes you scummier, especially when you outright refuse, compared to explaining. Please do.

unvote

[Korts]

Hmm. Seems I forgot to place my vote elsewhere.

vote: Panzerjager

[Korts]

unvote, vote: ZombieSlayer

I wanna lynch before deadline...

[Korts]

Remember, everyone, we have to have a majority to lynch even at deadline, so everyone who isn't voting is suspect. Please.

[Korts]

Since it's still causing confusion: the only notification you'll get that it's deadline day is the thread getting locked at 11PM EST, ending the day.

Also, where do you think I should put it? Make a convincing case, please.

[Korts]

Unvote, now. If we catch hasdgfas in a good mood, maybe he'll let it slide this time. Pretty please?

[Korts]

It wouldn't necessarily be too late, Grimmy, that's the thing. We don't know.

[Korts]

I endorse movie claims. There should be an order set up, though. Gorrad, will you volunteer?

[Korts]

What's popcorn style?

[Korts]

You can explain afterwards, but I think I see your motivation.

[Korts]

Serenity. Xtoxm go.

Remind me to say something about this after the claims go down.

[Korts]

Star Trek. Grimmy.

[Korts]

What was that last part, Grimmy?

[Korts]

Well, I picked Grimmy over ashmite because Grimmy posted just before me and I was sure to get the claim sooner.

[Korts]

@Gorrad: cleared how?

Oh yeah, on farside's claim.

Serenity. Xtoxm go.

This claim strikes me as odd, for some reason. All of Serenity's roles could go both ways, since the Firefly's crew is basically outlaw, and the Alliance guys are amoral.

[Korts]

...


You lost me.

[Korts]

Hmm. Yeah. I guess I should've thought before asking.

[Korts]

I don't know, I didn't watch the movie >_>

Awkward.

[Korts]

Oh, ASH-mite. I just didn't know the a propos. I know the show, though I've learned to loathe it...

[Korts]

I will do a player analysis soon enough. I don't have the time right now though.

[Korts]

I'm not lurking.

This post says otherwise...

[Korts]

ashmite: doesn't randomvote, votes Grimmy "for a reason" although he never elaborates. Hypocritical vote against ZS with "post some content pls". Calls Muerrto-Panzer argument semantics, implies that both are town--possible buddy-up attempt? Pressures ZS to give reasons. Acknowledges ZS's scumhunting efforts, but fails to unvote when his originally given reason for voting ZS becomes invalid. Names ZS and Panzer as top suspects (both are leading wagons at this time). Express suspicion of Gorrad for "quickhammer". This is my notes on him. I'm leaning

scum

on him, but I'm interested what the replacement will make out of it.

DBE (formerly Muerrto): Muerrto had been fairly pro-town in his posts, questioning motives and generally scumhunting. I'm not counting the getting personal part with Panzer as a tell either way. DBE, however, enters with a very vague reason to keep her vote on Panzer:

Panzer has done hardly anything beneficial for the town thus far, except be very hostile and pull at threads that have warranted no pulling and lead pretty much no where.

"Pulling threads that have warranted no pulling" strikes me as a very vague and unhelpful comment, since she doesn't cite any examples of this activity. Also to be noted is the fact that she puts hostility (aggressive playstyle is what I assume she means) as one of the reasons for voting, although that in itself isn't a tell either way. Also, she seems to attempt buddying up to ZS. Then some other posts which I'm fine with, and four days of absence later, she comes back with this:

Popcorn is fine for me

also don't like the hammer, and I still suspect Panzer by his play yesterday, but I am looking forward to how this all plays out, and what the claims will be.

I feel like she's not contributing enough. Also, she still cites Panzer's play (aggressive I assume is what she alludes to) as the main reason for suspecting him. Her movie claim I can't comment on; excuses herself lurking, RL reasons; fingers Xtoxm as suspicious based on lurking, and repeats that Panzer is her top suspect, yet stays vague on her reasons. I'm currently

Middle of the Road

with her, leaning a bit towards

scum

.

farside: she's acting unusually pro-town compared to previous games we've been in where she turned town. For this she deserves a finger of suspicion, but there is no case to be made against her; I'm leaning

town.

fuzzylightning: I'm getting a

town

feel right now, as opposed to D1. fuzzy seems to be genuinely questioning motives and scumhunting so far as the speed of discussion allows, which is good right now and exactly what we need.

Gorrad: I'm not familiar with his playstyle, but I assume from others' comments that he's not a lurker, which makes me think he wants to be staying in the background in this game. His softclaim makes me think he has some reason for this lurkish style. I think that after ashmite's replacement claims their movie, he should fullclaim, otherwise the town would possibly never learn the basis for calling zoraster confirmed. I'm leaning slightly

town

right now.

Grimmy: he's in usual joke-mode, which makes him hard to read; his analysis post is a bit haphazard, but otherwise valid. I'm

Middle of the Road

with him.

Panzer: his aggressiveness I find is definitely a pro-game thing, although from other users' comments I gather that this is his usual playstyle, so that's definitely a null tell. His procrastination about placing the vote on ZS near deadline D1 is a mild scumtell in my eyes, though. I'm leaning slightly

scum

right now.

Xtoxm: his playstyle is generally a bit lurkish, so I'd dismiss that as a scumtell, and otherwise, he's answered questions and posed questions D1, though considerably less so D2. I'm

Middle of the Road

, maybe slightly

scum

.

zoraster: I feel he's overall null. Actually, he didn't stick out as either town or scum to me all through the game. If he's trying to fly under the radar, he's doing it very well. I will do a PBPA on him soon.

[Korts]

WEM and Weather Mafias. Was town. Was VERY active.

Ok, but Desperate Mafia. Was town. Was VERY lurkish. I think he just lurks when the game's a bit boring.

[Korts]

Sorry for not posting since the big one, I'm packing for first years' camp. I'll be away from Thursday to Sunday without access.

[Korts]

Ok, I'm back, and glad to see there's stuff to read. Will get on it pretty soon. Also, welcome Knight of Cydonia!

[Korts]

Ok, I've read up. I was just about to ask the same thing as Gorrad; from the LotR, Sam is the least likely to be vig. Did you shoot N1?

[Korts]

Glork?

So, top 3 suspects would be:

1. DBE for failing to give reasons any further than "I don't like his style" for vote on Panzer
2. KoC for the fishy claim (fishy in that only SKs are usually NK-immune
3. maybe zoraster, but only because I don't have a proper read on him. I know I promised a PBPA on him, but it's taking a while to get to it >_>

As far as the vote goes, I think I already am voting DBE.

[Korts]

EBWOP: seeing the votecount above, make that

Vote: DBE

[Korts]

...What? Yes it did. Voting for xtoxm when he was away served only to stall the game, and I can't see how a day that's been slowed to near stop benefits the town.
It was the right vote, IMHO, but for the wrong reasons, at the wrong time.

My problem is there were a lot of people slowing the game down. Gorrad asking for movie claims, people waiting for Ash to claim, no one really doing anything during all that either. Just because he voted for someone that was on V/LA is no worse then the claim and the fact that most people sat on their thumbs instead of moving on when we were down one person. I think your vote for him is based on poor reasoning.

I digress. KoC makes a pretty fair point, to my mind. Deliberate stalling is anti-town, deserves at least some pressure.

You say that this reason is invalidated by the fact that multiple people could've been voted on for the same reason?

[Korts]

unvote, vote: Xtoxm

L-2

ACTION!

[Korts]

ninja'd

And the game stalls again. More xtoxm votes plz.

I would like to hear from Panj myself, but xtoxm is on my hit list.
Also Korts: Why DBE? What about the interaction yesterday between Panj and Muertto leads you to your conclusion?

My reason is completely unrelated to the Panzer-Muerrto argument. When DBE came in, she fingered Panzer as her top (I think) suspect, but she never went further with her reasons than "I have this feeling". If anything, that deserves some pressure; I don't like gut votes in general. You either know why you're voting, or you need to find out.

[Korts]

Sorry about that, I was ninja'd...

[Korts]

Xtoxm, full claim please

[Korts]

I'd imagine Inigo Montoya as either a full vig or a lyncher. I'm not sure I buy Xtoxm's claim. Fuzzy's is much more plausible to my eye.

I endorse a hammer.

[Korts]

If anyone protected KoC or RB'd Fuzzy, now's the time to say so.

Also, if anyone RB'd anyone other than Fuzzy, I'd say this is the perfect time for claiming that, too.

[Korts]

EBWOP: didn't read Grimmy's post. What he said, then.

[Korts]

KoC, you are one-shot according to your claim, right?

[Korts]

Whoa!

What warranted that claim, DBE? That was very anti-town. No more claims unless necessary, please.

[Korts]

I actually don't think Fuzzy is scum. His reasoning behind targeting me is good enough - he wanted to test my NK-resistance claim, I presume. Fair enough - it's a tactic that crap scum often use to dissuade night-killers, and it was a perfectly logical move for town. I think that a Doc - if we have one - may have blocked the scum kill, in which case that would be helpful. Otherwise - the scum may well have targetted me as well - again, to test my NK-resistance, since it would also make sense for protective pro-town roles to claim something like that, in some situations.
I will re-iterate though: I don't think Fuzzy is scum. I believe him, simply because his reasoning was good, even if he jumped to conclusions remarkably quickly.

The problem is where once he realized his kill didn't go through, effectively proving your NK-resistance, or so it seemed at the time, he chose, instead of believing you, to vote you for staying true to your claim.

[Korts]

I did it because I didn't want a PR Lynched (assuming Farside is town...)


I still dont like all the semantics and WIFOM in this fuzzy case, and Im leaning towards him being scum, or our scum being very smart and not sending in a kill.

also: KoC if you are a vig, why did you not kill anyone?

Not sending in a kill looks like you're smart only if you're short-sighted.

KoC is one-shot. Why would you expect him to choose a suspect this particular night?

[Korts]

I am not saying you are lying about being a roleblocker, but just about blocking me. It seemed awfully opportunistic that you said you role-blocked me when KoC was asking for it. The whole situation seems suspect, but I also believe that if I were role-blocked then I should have my shot still, correct?

I just looked it up.

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?ti ... -shot_role

Apparently it is used up when RB. That bites.

I think it depends mostly on the mod. These kinds of things usually do.

Gorrad - I think I know what you mean by "that extra bit" but I won't say anything.

Are you softclaiming something? If not, what was the relevance of this comment? Also, what SensFan said.

KoC, well if I was role-blocked wouldn't it make sense that my shot wouldn't have gotten to your NK-resistance? Now I would believe that had I been roleblocked I would still have my shot, because my role essentially didn't exist for that period. That is why I would think that farside may be lying.

Again, as far as I know, it is up to mod discretion whether or not you lose your shot when RBed. Therefore it can't be a valid tell either way.

I'm sorry I haven't dug up any more, I just don't have a lot of time on my hands right now.

[Korts]

I don't want a fullclaim, but rolename would be nice. Not required though. Honestly, it's probably nothing, but it could be something.

Mr. Spock.

[Korts]

Vote: Panzerjager

LAL, and if he is replaced, I really want to hear this birdie sing. Hasn't done much other than buddy up to others and slide under the radar, which really irritates me, since only scum should feel the need to avoid posting or garnering attention, out of fear they make a scum-slip.

I can get behind this wagon. His OMGUS doesn't help him at all, and he doesn't address major points in KoC's post.

unvote, vote: Panzer

[Korts]

What those two said. This game's standing still for Panzer's claim right now, and I don't see anything I could question to start discussion right now...

[Korts]

Well we must have 2 RBs if farside is telling the truth, I got blocked trying to track KoC.

Maybe a jailkeeper, you'd have been an obvious target for NK. I'm almost thinking we should massclaim.

[Korts]

Did you choose me entirely randomly, KoC?

[Korts]

Yup. I'm actually kind of glad someone blocked or docced, since you're probably the only person I would say is almsot certainly town.

Um, if you're so sure that I have pro-town intentions, then why didn't you choose someone else? I mean, I understand the concept of randomness, but if you'd rather not see me dead (which I assume you as pro-town wouldn't want) why would you go through with the kill anyway? And with that, we have reached a place where I'm comfortable putting my vote.

vote: Knight of Cydonia

[Korts]

Dear lord, did everyone get blocked?!?!?

I wouldn't put it out of the question we have a doc instead of a third (?) blocking role.

[Korts]

I'm having second thoughts about the KoC-wagon, actually. Xtoxm had pushed the notion that he's an SK pretty hard and with absolute conviction. Also, he counterclaimed him. I don't consider it a realistic scenario for scumbuddies to both claim one-shot vig.

unvote

I still would like a proper explanation of the randomness vs. Korts being pro-town dilemma. Why choose randomness and killing me over your conviction that I'm town?

[Korts]

Hmm. Reconsidering the interaction with Xtoxm around his claim, SK springs to mind. One-shot SK (?) or an SK withholding their kill or getting blocked. Also, NK-immune, which is classically an SK trait. My vote goes back.

vote: KoC

[Korts]

Careful, that's L-1.

[Korts]

We have at least 1 RB, possibly also a jailkeep or doc.
Just because one player has been blocked, doesn't mean the mafia haven't just expected this and with-held their kill, or that the mafia target was docced.

Your point?

[Korts]

I'm not liking DBE's reaction right now, but I'm a little out of sync with this game tbh... I'll do a proper reread sometime this week (preferably monday)

[Korts]

@Gorrad, there's one episode when a bounty hunter gets aboard Serenity. I seem to remember River doing some physical stuff. The flavor and the connection between role and rolename seem credible.

[Korts]

At this point the game needs something to have it start again. I propose fullclaims.

[Korts]

Oh. Yeah, sorry. I'm really out of sync with this game.

I'll claim next, then.

I'm Mr. Spock. I'm so smart, I don't need abilities to find baddies. So basically a vanilla.

[Korts]

You hiding behind the fact that you pushed for a KoC lynch does make me raise my eyebrows, Grimmy. I'm undecided about the claim itself, but it's definitely one of the least pro-town roles one can make of MST3K. Maybe one of the actual movies would be more anti-town, but, you know.

[Korts]

This is just a wild guess, but searcher may be something like a gunsmith. I just can't think of anything to translate the character from the movie into a conventional role. Something like can or can't communicate at night is possible.

[Korts]

vote: Grimmy

The claim, mostly, and the hiding behind an "I bussed KoC" sign.

[Korts]

Yeah, I would've expected Spock to be a RB mostly, since he has that Vulcan thing to make people unconscious. But I'm just claiming the role hascow gave.

I don't think much information can be gained by prolonging the day. I'm open to someone hammering.

[Korts]

night choices?

[Korts]

farside, can you confirm having blocked DBE?

[Korts]

Not the strongest of points that you bring against me.

During the deadline block on Day 1 you changed your vote 5 times in 5 days trying to get a deadline lynch. Now Why couldn't you just settle on one and have a legitimate case rather than hopping from wagon to wagon?

It's not often that I have solid opinions of players by Day 1. I was trying to decide.

Actually, it's pretty obvious you would try to attack me, since DBE and farside have pretty much confirmed themselves through their actions. I'll have to go look through their previous night choices again and do a PBPA on you (fuzzy).

[Korts]

DBE's night choices (tracker).
N5 Korts, no result (blocked?)
N4 KoC, no result (blocked?)
N3 Sens, tracked to fuzzy
N2 Panzer, didn't go anywhere
N1 farside, tracked to Grimmy

DBE, can you confirm this?

farside's night choices (blocker).
N5 DBE
N4 Gorrad (confirmed by Gorrad's no result)
N2 fuzzy
N1 Grimmy (confirmed by DBE)

I can't seem to find a N3 choice, farside, can you help me out?

Anyway, on first sight, my opinion is that farside is confirmed town by both Gorrad's no result and DBE's N1 result, and DBE is confirmed as having been blocked N5, and also pretty near confirmed by correctly claiming farside's N1 target. It would be a very unlikely scenario in which DBE wasn't town, and I'm ruling out the possibility of farside being scum.

That leaves fuzzy, pretty much. I was gonna examine the claimed and resolved night actions on those nights when there was no kill, but I don't see the point now that I'm convinced anyway.

I'm not gonna vote yet, though, I'd like to hear the rest of you speak up.

[Korts]

farside, how did you eliminate fuzzy as scum?

[Korts]

EBWOP: don't worry, I'll address your points when I have more time.

[Korts]

I didn't read properly in the morning, I see now how fuzzy's confirmed to you, farside. The only possibility I can think of is you, farside being a mafia RB. Which, considering your choices, actually make fair sense. You blocked the claimed rolecop twice in a row, and then the other investigative role last night. My guess is that you didn't want incriminating results.

To answer your points, farside, both the Xtoxm and the D3 Panzer votes were fully justified. The reasoning in the vote on Xtoxm is pretty obvious, too, "ACTION!" meaning a pressure to post.

Your points on my Day 1 votes are pretty weak. Activity wasn't at its best, so I think voting ZS for consecutively failing to contribute was pretty much justified; and with the precise time of the deadline being unknown, I think pressuring Panzer into voting was the best thing I could do with my vote at the time of the quoted vote.

What exactly is your point on the popcorn pick issue? That's just BS, and you know it; I had two choices, did you mean to imply that it's incriminating to choose the one who'll actually answer the same week?

I hadn't considered this before, but nothing actually points to farside being

town

, only her role is confirmed, but it's a role that can be found with both alignments. Her night choices weren't really pro-town from my point of view, either, since three nights in a row she blocked claimed investigative roles. I'm pretty confident voting her.

vote: farside

[Korts]

night choices; also, DBE is pretty much confirmed, and you made me realize fuzzy is, too.

[Korts]

EBWOP: but I'll dig up some dirt for you tomorrow. It's getting very late and I have classes early in the morning.

[Korts]

mod:

could a theoretical mafia RB block and kill the same night?

@DBE, what role could you see Spock being? Honestly, his main trait is that he's really intelligent, which fits with the idea of a vanilla.

[Korts]

interesting fact: I'm the first to vote farside in the whole game, and fuzzy is the first to vote me outside "random voting stage".

farsides starts Day 1 aggressively, questioning motives, pro-town overall.

ashmite starts the ZS wagon, and farside is the next to hop on. I find that a bit suspicious, considering that ashmite's posts themselves were hardly more than check-in posts at the time.

Top 2 scum:

1 ZS - I don't feel he is giving anything without using sarcasm to hide behind. When questioned about anything game related he uses the well it's been said already crap that bugs me.
2 Panzerjager - I didn't really like the way Panz jumped on Fuzzylight. I don't know I read him as being jumping.

Note: both of her top suspects are easy wagons (ZS more so).

unvote, vote: ZombieSlayer

I wanna lynch before deadline...

I'm in the same boat and alas I'm a bit behind in a few game and with things on my desk.

Note that at that time, farside has no objections to my "vote-hopping"; she seems to support it.

The pressure on Xtoxm seems overly done; especially Xtoxm's answers make me think this argument was pre-fabricated and made to possibly set up a Xtoxm lynch based on unhelpfulness (he was the goon, and probably the most expendable member of the mafia) or otherwise distance. Xtoxm's answers are strange because I know he usually has some kind of opinion.

Her popcorn pick is Xtoxm, which is at least as suspect as me choosing Grimmy over ashmite.

ashmite84 - I don't feel I have a full read on ashmite. He is posting more then some, but has been absent a lot too. I would like a full analysis from him to get more information from him. So far nothing he stated has stood out or been very strong. Someone to keep my eye on.
Questions: 1) Do you still feel panzer is scummy? 2) Do you think claiming the movie title helps scum or town any more or less and why?

Posting more than some? Lies. Ashmite was the one player with the least amount of posts at that time. While farside pressured Xtoxm for not contributing, and did the same for ZS, she stayed Middle of the Road with ashmite, only "someone to keep her eye on" but not enough to warrant a vote for pressure when she voted ZS and Xtoxm for pretty much the same.

Do you feel that Korts and Rishi were town and town arguing about nothing

Loaded question much?

Ah, yes, and the movie claim itself struck me as odd then. The characters of Serenity are all shades of grey.

Notice how Panz quietly slipped above Xtoxm above farside's scumlist amidst all the shouting at Xtoxm:

Farside how is voting me scumhunting?

My top 2 scum suspects are you and xtoxm if you read my write up.

With KoC replacing, farside makes a weak jab at him about him voting fuzzy, then quickly concedes her point. In retrospect, I have to say Panzer makes a fair observation about this the following day.

I voted KoC after he didn't die because I have never seen a game with an NK resistant pro-town character, not saying it has never happened and I will gladly take any proof showing me that it has, and therefore immediately associated it with an SK or Godfather. Maybe it was a little hasty, maybe not, but I can tell you that from this point on I have no powers.

I thought that if someone was one shot and it was blocked they still have that one shot. Am I wrong?
Your right about KOC. The only time I see NK is typically SK roles.

This is a point which she does not admit when Xtoxm raises it; afraid to be in agreement with her scumbuddy?

Sigh. I need to write the minutes of an experiment for tomorrow, so I'll be continuing from here next time.

[Korts]

Sorry for the hold-up, I have three exams next week, I have to study... I'll get to it tomorrow probably.

[Korts]

Um, just posting that I have an exam tomorrow at 8 o'clock sharp, and it's 8 PM here, so as much as I'd like to spare an hour for you guys, I'm stuck with studying.

PS. vote farside guise, kthxbai

[Korts]

Oh forgot.

Love, with many kisses, Korts

[Korts]

BTW, fuzzy, do you still have your one shot?

[Korts]

ok, nevermind then

[Korts]

While I struggle with my RL workload and try to find some time for the full farside analysis, I ask you guys to seriously consider farside's actions, especially her night choices. It doesn't really make much sense from a pro-town view to block Gorrad TWO times in a row, and then block DBE, the other claimed investigative role.

[Korts]

Very nicely played, farside. I figured it out far too late to swing the town around, and I didn't have the time resources to make a case that would swing... But I guess I owe you guys and "I told you so"

I loved this game, actually, hascow. I think the setup was very nice, and the flavor was awesome. First class modding all the way.

More comments later, when it's not midnight with classes from eight tomorrow.

[Korts]

EBWOP:

Very nicely played, farside. I figured it out far too late to swing the town around, and I didn't have the time resources to make a case that would

swing

stick... But I guess I owe you guys and "I told you so"

I loved this game, actually, hascow. I think the setup was very nice, and the flavor was awesome. First class modding all the way.

More comments later, when it's not midnight with classes from eight tomorrow.

[Korts]

Wait, does that mean that fuzzy still had his one shot?

[Korts]

Well, it was still an awesome game. I just wish there had been more discussion in the endgame, if DBE and fuzzy would've considered, even for the sake of a couple questions, you being scum, I would've had a chance.

[Korts]

But hey, I figured it out in the end. The moral victory is mine, all mine!