Mini Theme 2222: Open Draft Mafia [Game Over]

[Almost50]

The mafia team then decides the number of slots down the playerlist to move when passing packs.

You all suck BIG time. (Not ALL all, but those who did claim their cards and/or discussed it)

Can anybody read? The MAFIA decides how the packs move. I dunno why cyrus would reveal he has a Doctor shot, or how House thinks Dunn can pass his card to someone else (unless he thinks/knows Dunn is Scum)

Also,

HELLO HOUSE

. Yup. Sure is. I was planning on voting you of the bat, but you seem to have beat me to it. I'll need to think of someone else to RVS (problem is I've got something on almost each and everyone here, so I ... WAIT!)

VOTE: Taly

ALSO long time

[Almost50]

How is that different from me taking it now and then somebody else taking it later? Doesn't that activate the masons?

I was thinking the other person doesn't even claim and I tell you guys if a mason appears so they can claim it later

If you take it, we have 2 conftowns, if you pass it, we have 2 conftowns and a towny player in you. It would be a hell of a gambit for scum!you to claim to be taking a mason like you just did.

The other benefit is that scum won't know who the masons are

Add infinity to the pack!

I have no shame advocating the A50 tell now for real: One scum in Infinity/Dunn/cyrus

[Almost50]

Bingle is Town (joy), and is probably the N1 kill (damn)

[Almost50]

Bingle does.

[Almost50]

Can anybody read? The MAFIA decides how the packs move. I dunno why cyrus would reveal he has a Doctor shot, or how House thinks Dunn can pass his card to someone else (unless he thinks/knows Dunn is Scum)

This doesn't give scum viable counterplay, if the scum move dunn's pack to them and the masonry doesn't form, then whoever has dunn's pack is outed.

Did Dunn claim he had TWO Mason shots on his card??

[Almost50]

Hey guys, I am stuck here. The good news is I managed to early pocket Bingle it seems. That Doctor crumb that he turned into something totally different was hilarious

The bad news is I still hate rolling scum in this particular game a and don't think I am up to the challenge.

If you can't carry me, feel free to bus already. I may fight back a little, but the earlier you do it the more towncred you get from my flip.

[Almost50]

Bingle's pocketing game is real good.

They're called the Ghostbusters and they're in control

[Almost50]

Even if that's a joke it's still scummy imo.

Eh I know Almost50 well enough to know it wasn't a joke; I've a fair idea of what he was doing but elaborating beyond that would defeat the point of the move in the first place.

Feel free to explain to the crowd what you thought I was doing

[Almost50]

Seriously, I want to know ONE THING: How come almost everybody's defending me here? I obviously made a post that looked like a slip, then I disappeared. I was silent for long enough I could have been prodded if I didn't post by the time I did. I understand some of you (both the suspicious of me and the defenders of me) but I don't get the majority.

I am most disappointed in Bingle's response tbh. He didn't even take a solid stance!! Was it a slip or was it not, Bingle??

I also felt Infinity's vote was kind of scum indicative. I mean, Dwlee was already on me, and T3 is .. I dunno.. null?? Infinity felt like she

knew

I "wasn't with her in the Scum PT" so was thinking "I should vote this but I have no idea why or even why he's doing it". You know what I mean??

So, here's my request from EVRYONE:

Give a definite read on me, and try to speculate on what my "scum slip" was meant for. Thank you

[Almost50]

This makes me more confident A50 was just doing shenanigans. Shitty slips prove they aren’t slips yet again.

Mate, your defense of me doesn't earn you town points here. I expected a more solid stance with

some reasoning

from you (especially so since you were peeking before you replaced in)

Why did you not vote me? What made you think this was a "troll"?? What do you think was the purpose of my so-called troll?

[Almost50]

I realize you doubt that I would know and I also realize that you have good reasons to ask me because you want to know that I am not bullshitting here and I realize that you want an answer, but I am going to decline this request because on principle, I refuse; your actions have an explanation for them which I would see as town, but I am not going to project those reasons and use them to defend you and give them to you if you are scum. I realize that, regardless of your alignment, you want me to answer first, but regardless of your alignment, I want you to answer first. Which creates a bit of an impasse.

OK, I'll explain (I could try to play it the hard way, but I'd rather just get it done with):

Mechanically speaking, I should be executed today. I was hoping more people would fall for it (and was

really

disappointed not enough did). I had even prepared a "final speech" for when I personally self-hammer:

Spoiler:

VOTE: A50

Sorry I didn't give you much time to analyze, Town. The thing is I needed to lose this lousy package which has:

<list of 5 abilities edited out>

I sure as hell didn't want that to fall into the wrong hands, and I dunno how TOWN can get rid of it either <explanation edit out>

My initial plan was to crumb DOCTOR and get myself shot at night, but Bingle trying to provide cover to that blew it. I was NOT getting shot tonight anyway, which means my package would have been transferred to someone else (eventually falling into scum's hands).

Best that I could think of, Sorry again.

If I may, I would recommend looking hard at Infinity for her 285. Something tells me this was a SCUM post expressing doubt because she actually knows I'm Town, but doesn't understand what I'm doing and doesn't want to let the easy mislim slip away.

I dunno how to feel about House's 290 either. I could see it being an innocent joke from a townie who thinks it's too obvious to be a genuine slip, or it could have come from a scumster who

knew

I'm not on their team and thought it was a “reaction test” to see who jumps on me 9which would be even sillier given Scum know I am not on their team, so they'd have to find a reason -like Infinity did- to vote me here). His 293 makes me feel better about him though.

[Almost50]

Damn.. my vote inside the spoiler doesn't count.

VOTE: A50

[Almost50]

Well, I know you, so, the purpose of the 'scumslip' was specifically for you to do what you just did in 477, except you were hoping to be more successful with it.

Just as I expected, you didn't really know what I was doing (which was getting myself ELOMINATED for real).

But you're Town; I think. It is BINGLE that I worry about the most, because he's smart and he also knows me well enough to realize 'something's up" but he steered away from it. he even took too long to come to this thread to post after my slip, and even then he didn't react as I would have expected him to. I think he may have been playing for time, knowing that I would have to come back sooner or later.

[Almost50]

No self-voting though please.

If you trust me, join me. I promise to explain before I leave the game.

[Almost50]

Are you saying it will be pro-town to eliminate you?

It is indeed.

[Almost50]

You know what?? Scum are clever, and Town are stupid (collectively, not as individuals). So I'm going to unfold the cards:

1-shot RB
1-shot Activated Strongman
ANOTHER 1-shot Activated Strongman
- Neighbor
-Vanilla

Do you want this to get passed to Scum?? How can a Townie get rid of the Activated Strongman (so as to prevent it from being used by Scum) without using it themselves?? Not just one, but TWO Activated Strongman shots. What am I supposed to do here?? Pick RB and fake a guilty on the person who gets my package on D2??

[Almost50]

I guess I am now waiting for Bingle to use his extraordinary mechanical skills on this one. My vote obviously is to let let me take that garbage to the grave with me.

[Almost50]

A50, is this another reaction test? Because I zero percent believe you think being eliminated day one is the "correct" play here if you're town.

And what do you think the correct play is? Should I be picking strongman enabler tonight? Or should I pass on both shots and let scum use them at will??

How about I take the RB? That should -at least- deny them that. But whom am I going to use it against? Or should I holster??

Are you suggesting I should pick Neighbor which may or may not put me in a Neighborhood with "unknown alignment", where it'd be easier for them to manipulate me?

My final option is to pick VT.

Please guide me with your infinite wisdom

[Almost50]

If you're town and grab one of them all the better

Which one would you suggest?

[Almost50]

FIA WRC

I googled those and I got

Fédération Internationale de l'Automobile
World Rally Championship

[Almost50]

So far I am roughly at (groups in no particular order. I used the mod's player list):

Honouable Judge:

Almost50

The Jury:

House mastina Taly T3 NDMath

Pool of Suspects:

Dunn Flea Bingle Infinity Dwlee cyrus Momrangal/NorwEE

[Almost50]

Why is House town?

@Almost50 and to a lesser extent everyone.

Tone and stances so far make more sense as coming from a town mindset

[Almost50]

Were you in that last game day one?

?? There has always been a last game that I was in on D1.

[Almost50]

I'm asking how you can play with Cyrus there and then look at this and not see how he is dripping with townie intent.

1- Meta is NOT my primary scumhunting tool
2- When I do use it; it's not off of one or two games

[Almost50]

Talk to me about Mastina and Dunn.

They're goof fellas. I mean, mastina's a wonderful person, a very good mod, and a not-so-bad a player (except when she tunnels). She has a habit of pulling readlists out of thin air early on, and then reposting numerous time with minor changes. I only hate her when she starts posting quote-wall after quote-wall.

As for Dunn, he's usually quiet. Still well behaved if you ask me, and 0if Town- his reads are generally worth more than mastina's.

But do you think it's proper that I should continue talking about them behind their backs?

[Almost50]

GOOD! Good fellas not goof!! GODDMAN!

[Almost50]

Gosh, man. You do want me to work my butt off, don't you?

OK.. mastina: Classical entrance, initial reads that I liked (house, me and Infinity), inquisitive (rather than wall posting with just comments), the push on Norwee looked genuine

Dunn is a suspect because I have yet to TR him, and the Mason thing could go both ways (especially with people asking him to pass it on). It could be fishing for whether there is another Mason ability in play. Either way it doesn't impress me for someone to announce they have a Mason shot on their card. There are abilities that you would/may claim and then their are abilities that you shouldn't.

[Almost50]

What if everyone who has mason

doesn't claim

and then uses night 1. Anyone who receives a mason card will know the person who gave it to them is scum, and we could potentially end up with multiple confirmed town. If scum have masons this would also force them to waste their night 1 card choice.

And this is why you're subpoenaed to the jury duty

[Almost50]

What if everyone who has mason

doesn't claim

and then uses night 1. Anyone who receives a mason card will know the person who gave it to them is scum, and we could potentially end up with multiple confirmed town. If scum have masons this would also force them to waste their night 1 card choice.

Never mind, there are only 2 masons max and Dunnstral has 1 so it doesn't really matter.

Is that in the rules?? Let me check

[Almost50]

OH. Only 2 Mason cards on the list indeed.

[Almost50]

Talk to me about Mastina and Dunn.

They're goof fellas. I mean, mastina's a wonderful person, a very good mod, and a not-so-bad a player (except when she tunnels). She has a habit of pulling readlists out of thin air early on, and then reposting numerous time with minor changes. I only hate her when she starts posting quote-wall after quote-wall.

As for Dunn, he's usually quiet. Still well behaved if you ask me, and 0if Town- his reads are generally worth more than mastina's.

But do you think it's proper that I should continue talking about them behind their backs?

This is a weird answer. Like I get that that this is a joke but why?

because it occurred to me at the time. Duh!

[Almost50]

ALMOST573710573629

You declared me a juror and I'm abusing that openly.

Read my interaction with Norwe about 2-3 pages ago. I want commentary. For a less vague premise - am I tunneling?

Tunneling Norwee isn't a crime in this court, so even if you were (which I don't think is the case) you are hereby vindicated of any wrongdoing in this matter. Case dismissed.

[Almost50]

I am really struggling to get my head in this game -.-;

Soory to have to ask: is it because your head is so big or is the game too small??

[Almost50]

I still am strongly against claiming packs. It gives scum a lot of help since they can choose which pack they want to eliminate from the game by forcing that pack to be passed to the NK target. If they want they can also pass it to themselves to take a strong role away from town.

If anything would help you get more into the game let me know

Not how it works, btw.

Scum kill resolves before pack rotation.

Via wiki: Pack passing is executed after night actions, all other actions are resolved using natural action resolution.

Why did you feel the need to point out this?
Also, does this count as a "townslip"?

[Almost50]

Frustration is NAI.

Your opinion, man.

That was his opinion.

[Almost50]

Fullclaiming packs is dumb.

NO U!

[Almost50]

A50 did you do literally anything with that catch-up?

Of course I did. I got caught up.

[Almost50]

Almost50 isn't doing anything. To meta Almost50, or not to meta.

My advice is to NEVER meta me before you've played/modded me at least a dozen times. but I'm not going to sue you if you insist to do it anyway.

[Almost50]

No, look for intent. A50 isn't doing anything. He doesn't have a town motive to make that "play."

You know I love you, Right? You should also know I couldn't care less with your opinion on my play, but since there are others listening (ahem, reading) I will try to explain:

1- I already made my decision that it was best for me to be the lim of the day. Others disagree, so they can take the wheel
2- I have NOTHING to lose. I don't even NEED to look townie here. My death is still NO BIGGIE from my own PoV
3- The game is mechanically complex somewhat, and I need time (and info) to start working it from a mechanical PoV
4- I am NEVER that good at catching scum on D1 (they'd have to be OBVIOUS, and I doubt anyone in this PL would be that obvious ion D1)
5- This isn't the only game I am playing. However, this game is still on D1. More of my attention needs to be directed elsewhere, but I won't be abandoning this game either (just in case I do make it to D2, so I won't have to read everything from the start)

TLDR; I am not too invested in this game yet, and probably won't be before D2 (or D3 even)

[Almost50]

Actually that makes sense.

Not really, but you are of a weak personality it seems. Your argument about me not faking was good enough 9and should have been even better from your PoV since you're the one who came up with it in the first place). If I'm lying -about my pack- it should/would be known by the start of D2. There's no way I can cover it, so I am doomed already if I was lying.

[Almost50]

A50 is low-key lurking out my push and I'm trying to not derail like other times. And I'm like the only one on him other than himself rn :I

What do you expect me to do?? Try to to push me harder than you???

[Almost50]

I mean, do your job, mate. I've done all I can to help you out, Now YOU help me help you

[Almost50]

A50 could be scum, I feel like it's mostly a matter of the people who know a50 best and mastina/bingle think he's town so.

No, I can't. If I was Scum I wouldn't have been UNHAPPY about people claiming "some" of their abilities at one point, and then claiming ALL mine next. I am better than that as Scum because I'd usually have a plan, so I won't be contradicting myself.

[Almost50]

Townreads: mastina, dunn, cyrus, NDMath, taly, T3 somewhat

These are MY TRs, minus Dunn/cyrus and adding House instead.

So, why is Dunn Town here (aside from the Mason shot claim)?? Why does Dunn always get TR'd for doing nothing?? because in my experience it's NAI for him.

[Almost50]

Love u buddy

[Almost50]

Mine are: Baby Jane, Infatuation, Here To Eternity, Every beat Of My Heart, Passion, Some Guys Have All The Luck, Sweet Surrender, Love Touch

[Almost50]

Oops! That was in response to House

[Almost50]

Is anybody reading my posts?

I think I've seen your name before..

[Almost50]

If you really think I'm being taken for a ride with Mastina for fuck all reason that I know, tell me now.

Please please tell me now
Please please tell me now
Please please tell me now
Please please tell me now

[Almost50]

Mine are: Baby Jane, Infatuation, Here To Eternity, Every beat Of My Heart, Passion, Some Guys Have All The Luck, Sweet Surrender, Love Touch

I'm a little surprised to not see Total Eclipse of the Heart in that list

sorry, but Bonnie Tyler's version is the better one for me

[Almost50]

@Norwee: Can you talk about something else? Like, pretend that you were not on the chop here. Let's assume you were somehow confirmed, Now what are your impartial views?

[Almost50]

There is only one roleblock this game

?? How do we know that? Because the list on the wiki says 100-104 are all 1-shot RB

[Almost50]

@cyrus: My current pack has TWO 1-shot STRONGMAN abilities. THAT is what I wanted to "execute". not the RB shot

[Almost50]

Another day on mafiascum

[Almost50]

Bingo! Bright man. I never doubted you for a second.

[Almost50]

You know what?? Scum are clever, and Town are stupid (collectively, not as individuals). So I'm going to unfold the cards:

1-shot RB
1-shot Activated Strongman
ANOTHER 1-shot Activated Strongman
- Neighbor
-Vanilla

Do you want this to get passed to Scum?? How can a Townie get rid of the Activated Strongman (so as to prevent it from being used by Scum) without using it themselves?? Not just one, but TWO Activated Strongman shots. What am I supposed to do here?? Pick RB and fake a guilty on the person who gets my package on D2??

I do realize how hard it was to understand my phrasing, especially with the emphasis on the word ANOTHER. My bad.

[Almost50]

I am sooo lost here. Since I last posted my readlist I've basically been trying to narrow down my PoE by focusing on my suspects and trying to figure them out. The result was catastrophic, as I now have only 2SRs left, which made me not only suspect I TR'd one of my former suspects too soon, but also made me suspect I may have had one scum on my initial jury!!

In short: I am TRing -to various degrees- Flea, Infinity, Norwee, cyrus & Bingle, leaving only Dunn & Dwlee from my initial PoE. I am reconsidering T3 specifically from my intial jusry pool, although T3 was in my top 3 TRs.

So let's say I have 3 pools now:

The Jury:

House mastina Taly NDMath

Pool of Turmoil:

Flea Bingle Infinity cyrus Momrangal/NorwEE T3

Pool of Suspects:

Dunn Dwlee

[Almost50]

Okay sure maybe you wanna OMGUS me but why are you scumreading Dunn here?

To camouflage my OMGUS on you, of course. What did you think?

[Almost50]

@T3: This post specifically looks bad in my eyes. It kinda "feels" (GOD, how I hate that word being used to explain a read) like paranoid scum cracking under pressure.

cyrus please unvote me. You're voting me for a bad reason.

I am even considering voting you to try and even the scales between your wagon and Norwee's for future analysis.

[Almost50]

I hArDcLaIm Pr.

Sorry, but I'm gonna have to CC you

[Almost50]

I hArDcLaIm Pr.

Sorry, but I'm gonna have to CC you

My pack is 4 masons and a goat. What's yours?

I win. I have a

Straight Flush

[Almost50]

Is there ANY chance I get lim'ed today, or are you going to force me to take the game seriously now?

[Almost50]

So simply math 65 roles 13 x 5 = 65 minus 10 by day 2 = 55 - 13 = 42 so so my big play may not work.but I'll try.

Go on.. I am listening..

[Almost50]

@Titus: Did you read my posts? How about you ISO me?

[Almost50]

E-2

Can you believe we might actually end this cursed day 1?

*checks to see n_m isn't in the game*

[Almost50]

T3 is scum here I think the way he wants a flip so badly.

Does this men you TR Flea? (Forgive me.. I honestly wasn't keeping track of everyone's reads. Only my own)

[Almost50]

Imagine wanting a flip.
Let’s all sit down and drink tea and meditate about the secrets of the universe until our end of days.

It's too hot in here I won't have tea (unless it's ICE TEA)

[Almost50]

Lol see infinity doesn't want to see a flea flip.

T3 is scum here I think the way he wants a flip so badly.

These 2 statements imply that Ininity anf Flea are scumpartners and I'm scum for wanting to flip town Flea.

*Blink blink*

[Almost50]

Really? I thought the weather in "right here." is quite rainy.

You got confused. It's probably rainy "over there" but it certainly isn't "right here"

[Almost50]

Nope. Right here is wherever I am. I live in Cairo, Egypt.

[Almost50]

Oh wow, really?

I swear to God Almighty.

[Almost50]

You're making fun of me.

[Almost50]

Can people start doing stuff

Is it Thanksgiving already?? Should I stuff the turkey?

[Almost50]

T3 is just scum here so I'm vote parking. Haven't had the opportunity to do my reread yet and only been able to respond in real time. I'm hoping to do that tonight after work

Can you talk to me about this in more depth?

[Almost50]

Well, I did say my read on T3 has been demoted , but I am still nit totally sold he is scum. I agree though some of his posts ping as scummy, and I did wrongfully TR him in The Mindmeld Theory until the final round, so I am not exactly against his wagon either.

[Almost50]

Can anyone who is good at meta take a look at the game I linked in 1481 and see if they can find similarities to T3's play here? I am not as good at using meta off a small number of games, so I could use the help.

[Almost50]

@T3: Since nobody's taking my offer, would you be willing to compare your own play in Mindmeld with your play here? I know it's not an easy task, but I'd really appreciate it if you could try.

[Almost50]

I fluffed a lot and I gave unexplained reads. I also posted much less frequently.

Mate, you're fluffing much here too.

OK.. how do you define the difference between your scum play and your town play? What would you be looking for if you were a spectator watching your identical twin playing a game of Mafia?

[Almost50]

Packs have been moved 3 spaces

Is that up or down??

[Almost50]

VOTE: House

[Almost50]

My pack had two commutes.

The final commute and a 1shot roleblock coming your way.

My deck had a commute

How interesting!!

[Almost50]

Oh, you're already at it. Go on..

[Almost50]

I'm sorry if I'm being an idiot but

If he took a 1-shot activated ascetic

Why not say that he took a 1-shot activated ascetic

What is the benefit to saying he took a commuter instead??

Commuter cannot have another action. Ascetic can perform the factional kill.

[Almost50]

Autocorrect. cyrus.

How does cyrus get corrected to communism??

[Almost50]

I took the RB (as advised) but I didn't use it

[Almost50]

So Dwlee gets my pack (which was originally Dunn's). My original pack goes from mastina to Titus. That's all I "know"

I'll wait for mastina's response to Dwlee's call. Other than that.. I'm just a statue in this game.

[Almost50]

Dwlee99 - Gut, terrible action choice likely wasn't scum trying to fake the action.

I'll play devil's advocate here (I hope Dwlee doesn't take it personal as I would have said the exact same thing if it was anyone else): WHY is it Townie to WASTE the check on someone who already claimed to have taken a killing role? Would you expect Scum!Dwlee to: (a) Guilty a partner? (b) Clear a Townie? (c) Fake an inno on a partner? (d) Fake a guilty on a Townie? (e) Claim to have taken the ability and not use it? (f) Pass the ability to someone else??

Give me ONE of these over targeting the claimed "killer" as a better option.

[Almost50]

Btw what happened with the mason cards?

Only Dunn claimed to have received one, and it wasn't in the pack he passed to me, so Dunn took it and there has not been another (or there has not been another that was announced)

[Almost50]

I did not know or forgot Mastina claimed a killing role. I just remembered thinking that Mastina and House had scummy interactions and should be checked.

Do you understand where I'm coming from though? Bingle makes it look like your bad choice in AI, while I am saying it's NAI. I accept that Town!you could've made that mistake, but I also think Scum!you would have deliberately done the exact same thing, and since I don't "know" which it is I am calling in NAI.

[Almost50]

If you want to discuss it in depth, look at the choices I provided. Can you find any other choice that I failed to consider? If not, don't you agree that "claiming to have checked mastina" is indeed the best choice for scum here? I mean, hypothetically you could have checked just about anyone else but claimed to have targeted mastina because she already claimed having grabbed a killing role. Scum!you in this case had the perfect result to announce (because it clears no one and guilties no one. It doesn't even bring any new info to Town's attention. While you would have made sure you know whether "your true target" has grabbed a killing role or not.

So, at worst you targeted mastina to get rid of that GS check without bringing in any new info, and at best it was also used to make sure "someone" doesn't have an investigative/killing role.

You do realize Cop-like roles return positive results to a GS, right? If you are aware of it, I find it even more bizarre that you should ask mastina to claim here, even if you forgot she claimed taking a killing role. Like, for all you know she could've grabbed Vig, GS, Vengeful, Detective or Rolecop (not quite sure in the Rolecop, but to me it is a "Cop-like" role and should appear to be carrying a gun).

[Almost50]

Also, Titus's result on math was a rolecop, so it's NAI for math

I'd let the Rolecop (Titus) decide. Like, without trying to "fish" for info, let me give you a hypothetical example: You Rolecop me and find that I'm still Vanilla on N3. Do you think that's NAI? Like, what scum would pass on taking ANY kind of ability for 2-3 nights??

I'll stop at this point. Please don't try to argue further for now. Maybe post-game.

[Almost50]

Do you have any reads?

Yes. Whoever replaced momrangal is probably Scandinavian. I'm almost positive on this one.

[Almost50]

Bingle what is your read on Titus here?
And A50 too.

Titus is being Titus. I can't read her of late. Looks like my old tools of reading her are outdated.

[Almost50]

Bingle what is your read on Titus here?
And A50 too.

I wasn't asked but I think her shit push is bad

That's not a read, but giving how I have been responding to you (and Norwee) I'll allow it.

[Almost50]

A50 exists. I thought his vibe was good end of day one when he finally pushed back against me but he still hasn't really done anything.

You're getting my pack (which was originally Dunn's) tonight. ENJOY! 'nough said.

[Almost50]

In Cats v Dogs, I was set up from the beginning in multiball with everyone and their brother FoSing me

First; I wasn't in that game. Second; neither of my 2 brothers plays mafia. This is hence an obvious lie; I say.

[Almost50]

I don't think town!Titus triples down on bad logic.

Let me tell you a short story..

Once upon a time (not long ago) Titus was Town in a game where she TR'd me and SR'd Toog. I was confident Toog was Town and defended the hell out of him, so when he flipped green she decided to sheep someone else's read on me and voted me next because "Oh, well.. my reads suck".

Now what were you saying?

[Almost50]

Dwlee's sticky vote on A50 looks terribad.

If we're determined to not eliminate T3 today, I'll have to

VOTE: Norwee

tie the wagons up.

I refuse to vote with my top scumread, and I'm not a fan of how Norwe doesn't seem to even be trying to sort me.

This vote is explicitly tying the wagon so I think this points to town!norwee

I also did take a (sort of) position on Norwee.

Thanks for reminding me why I'm not voting "the cute and lovable goofball."

[Almost50]

What were your old tools of reading her?

Well, one of them was "Titus never busses unless absolutely necessary" and that was proven wrong in a recent game (NSG's Situation Room).

[Almost50]

Hmm why does scum!dunn pass a mason wouldn't that be a scumclaim?

I think the keyword is CLAIM, NDMath is saying Scum!Dunn would have taken the Mason ability without claiming it.

[Almost50]

Mastina's case on Norwee looks really really bad ON HER.

Like she totally left out the posts where T3 states a TR on Norwee and calls cyrus' reads bad. Here are some examples:

Wouldn't surpize me if infinity and ee are scum. But I'm currently trying to see if I can get t3 to make a mistake

There once was a mafia player named cyrus.

He was completely wrong about everything but he was obvious town.

He lost.

The end

- T3

For some reason Norwee reminds me of bloodhail in the Micro Normal. By play, really scummy but I got really good gutvibes from him. I eventually realized my townread was not based in logic and I was the hammer vote on his mislim.

I'm like 75% sure Norwe will flip town but tbh I'm fine with that if it gets discussion rolling tomorrow.

[Almost50]

Oh I forgot to include T3 in there--yaknow, the weird-ass random-ass nightkill scum made. For no reason I can discern but clearly having a reason.

The more obvious reason would be: T3 got House's initial role list. House must've passed him a couple of good roles and scum decided to take that list out of play.

Second most likely reason would be his reads, and that points to Titus being scum here. I do not subscribe to this one over the first one, but it's something to consider.

Third (and probably least likely): DUNN is Scum who got T3's initial role list and looking at it scum deduced T3 picked something strong, so they sent him to the dead thread. The reason why I won't entertain this is T3 himself claimed having pocked the 1-shot Hider (which also shows in his flip) so it doesn't look like had much better options.

[Almost50]

^PaGeToP^

I double-checked T3's flip and he took the Even-Night Neighborizer, so would've been able to neighborize someone (Infinity??) on N2. (I know mastina claimed she was the target, but Scum didn't know that beforehand). 2 Town Neighbors (almost a Masonry) would net each double as much info about the moving roles. Who knows what else was on that pack that could've threatened Scum so much they decided to remove it from play.

[Almost50]

Neither cyrus nor T3 make much sense as nightkills

cyrus claimed he had the multi-tasking modifier he flipped with. I know I'm not quite experienced in this setup (I only played it once before as a late replacement) but maybe Multi-tasking is reason enough to off a player? Not sure about this one, but I wasn't arguing about the cyrus kill. I was arguing about the T3 kill on N2, and -in my world- that's when "role-driven" kills take priority over "read kills"; so to speak.

[Almost50]

A50 can you vote someone?

Sure.

VOTE: someone

What's the case on them though?

[Almost50]

Vote Count 3.3

[3] NorwegianboyEE: mastina, Infinity 324, Bingle
[1] Bingle: Titus
[1] Titus: Dwlee99
[0] NDMath:
[0] Infinity 324:
[0] Almost50:
[0] mastina:
[1] Dwlee99: NorwegianboyEE
[0] Dunnstral:

Not voting: Almost50, NDMath, Dunnstral

With 9 alive it takes 5 to eliminate.

Deadline expires in

(expired on 2021-08-01 15:47:09).

Only change since last official VC is Norwee's vote on Dwlee 9which I don't like any better than the wagon on Norwee).

I honestly do not

scumread

anyone, but gun-to-my-head I'd prefer a Dunn lim here.

[Almost50]

What more do you need out of this day phase before you're confident enough to place a vote?

I was hoping an elimination would go through without me having to be voting anyone to be honest.

[Almost50]

In fact, can you give me you reads? Preferably with a 1-2 sentences explanation, but it's not mandatory

[Almost50]

That was @Infinity

[Almost50]

@mastina: #1 is already valid. cyrus did take multi-tasking. #2 Titus and Norwee should have more knowledge about it, as that pack (passed from Titus to Norwee and to Dunn tonight) is what cyrus would have gotten on D2 if he lived (provided the kill didn't hit T3 or NDMath), so they should be able to tell if that pack included an ability that was either "not time restrained" or "specific night that isn't N1/N2" in it.

#3 .. ok
#4 Who the freak shoots cyrus on N1/N2??? I mean, he's a good player, but not a nightkill priority, and he sure as hell wasn't killed over his reads because he SR'd T3 & Infinity along with Norwee, so unless you're telling me Norwee was being set to be the deepwolf (which totally negates him being @E-2 on D1) or is the "scum leader" (tell me who of the currently living players would be submissive to Norwee's will) I don't see it.

What remains is either that (the multi-tasking) or something else he crumbed or claimed (truthfully or jokingly) that made scum shoot there over virtually anyone else on the list (again, not belittling the guy.. he's a good player. He just isn't usually a priority scum kill and -probably- better used as a mislim sometime later, or -at least- NK'd after having received a package scum want to take out of the game, so definitely not N1)

[Almost50]

VOTE: Dunn

Although I'd still disagree on Norwee upon a Dunn scum!flip, but whatever..

[Almost50]

PEdit: I think Cyrus was killed because he was obvtown and not likely to be protected

If his reads were bad (and they obviously were) he should've been left alive to -at least- keep the thread noisy. I wouldn't even shoot an Innocent Child for being that on N1, but that's just me it seems.

[Almost50]

Dunn I just have the mason claim

You keep repeating this like it has any value. There is NO MASONRY, so it's NAI at best. NDMath thinks it AI for Dunn to have announced it, but I still think it's NAI

at best

.

Let me explain further: Scum!me gets a Mason card (of only 2 available on the list). I claim it and see if someone else claims having the other one. If they do, I shoot them at night and claim I picked that and had a Masonry with a dead person. No biggie. Corpses can't CC.
If nobody claims it then it's safe to assume there are no Masons in this game, and that's IF I had a Mason option to begin with.

Now let's consider me taking a more dangerous route, like.. claiming I have a Mason option when in fact I don't. That is risky because if 2 others claim they have it I'm screwed. If Only one does then I know whom to shoot tonight and -same as above- except I can take the ability I want from my pack and pass it and the next person to receive it won't know the difference.

Now let's consider a THIRD option: My PARTNER had the Mason card. >I< claim it. Again, someone responds and that's the NK. Nobody does and my PARTNER takes the card (to hide it) and I take the ability I want from my package.

The difference between Scum claiming a Mason card they have in their own package and one who claims it from their partner's package is how good the other options on one's package are. I won't bother making all the -unneeded- hypothetical propositions and analyze them, but I'm sure you get the picture by now.

Let me give some extra points: I did have 2 Strongman shots in my starting package and I claimed them on D1. You'd think someone who had a 2-shot Doctor ability would want to eliminate me and pick that over Mason. Dunn passed me that ability (which -with 3 Strongman shots floating- is totally useless.)

I have more, but I think I've said enough. I don't buy the Mason claim, and if I chose to do I still think it's NAI. I dislike his "none-existence" in the game thread (I know he is usually low on activity but I also know Town!him has a higher impact on things while being of a low post count), and I dislike his choice of a "claimed Mason ability with no confirmation that another exists" over a 2-shot Doctor, and I find it odd he never voted me despite me claiming I had 2 Strongman shots.

Can you reevaluate now and tell me how you feel about Dunn?

[Almost50]

'nother PaGeToP! I'm HOT!!

[Almost50]

House taking 1-shot hider kinda makes me think that might not be the case though, as if anything was worth night killing over it would also make sense to just take it to deny it.

The same package evidently had an Even Night Neighborizer. What if the other 3 were strong for Town and unworthy to Scum? Like.. I dunno.. N4 Tracker, N3 Watcher, N3 Follower, N4 Vig, N4 GS.. etc. (I am going by the list on the wiki. I am sure there are more options that are (a) Strong in the hands of Town, (b) semi-useless to Scum, and (c) to be used later, so not an immediate pick from T3's PoV

[Almost50]

Wasn't the plan for someone else not to claim mason and pick the masonry?

That's the plan Bingle proposed after Dunn had claimed his ability. Unless Bingle himself is also Scum there's no guarantee the Scum team thought the same as Bingle did.

[Almost50]

Wasn't the plan for someone else not to claim mason and pick the masonry?

And besides, this isn't the main point. Here.. let's me try again: You receive a package that contains a 2-shot Doctor and a Mason ability. Someone claims they have 2 Strongman shots (and a RB shot to top it all). Would you still go for the Mason ability or would you support the elimination of the claimed Townie and pick the 2-shot Doctor instead? Also, let's remember there was another suggestion that Dunn should pass the Mason ability to someone else. I don't remember who made that proposition so perhaps I should go back and check (iirc it was either NDMath o House, but I can't say I'm sure it was one of the two)

P-edit: Ok.. so that's your opinion here and I have nothing to add.

[Almost50]

A50 can you tell me your reasons for voting Dunn?

Sure!

Spoiler:

READ THE BLOODY THREAD

[Almost50]

FFS, Dwlee's post doesn't even compute. He did suggest to use a Rolecop on Dunn right in the middle of the discussion, so he was following the discussion already.r

[Almost50]

3rd pagetop in a row. Do I get to keep the trophy?

[Almost50]

I think I play mafia better with people yelling at me and calling me scum for not explaining my reasoning. Now I just don't really care

HEY, SCUM! Why aren't explaining your reasoning?

I hope that helps

[Almost50]

Eh.. a win that I probably don't deserve, but I'll take it anyway.

GGa

Thanks for modding, MC

[Almost50]

a little disappointing dw giving up like that .

There wasn't a way to win at that point. I had a guilty on me

There's always the possibility of 5 simultaneous modkills!

Or just .. Say it wasn't you