Large Normal 224 | Endgame

[NorwegianboyEE]

Vorkuta is good at hyperposting as scum.
VOTE: Vorkuta
Take my "random" vote.

[NorwegianboyEE]

This game isn't as active as i thought it would be for a 18 player game.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I gotta say, my favourite tea is genmaicha. It's basically green tea with bits of roasted brown rice in it. It tastes so freaking good. I'm awaiting a shipment of them from a webstore that specializes in Japanese goods because they don't sell the stuff here.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I'm good at pretending to generate "good" content.
This game.. I actually have to generate GOOD content.

Show me that good content boii.
Cus i'm not trusting you after that whole "pocketing" stunt ya pulled earlier.

[NorwegianboyEE]

VOTE: davesaz because his username doesn't start with a capital letter. splitfarve doesn't either but I only have one vote.

Layla's RVS vote has too much justification behind it. Only scum cares about justifying and "explaining" their RVS vote.

[NorwegianboyEE]

What is hyperposting? Posting a lot?

I always decide my rvs before role PM though.

I guess it’s NAI then.

What is hyperposting? Posting a lot?

Well in this case i am referring to a game where Vorkuta posted a lot of "helpful" posts that seemed like they were made in good faith, but he was scum.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Ops. Messed up quotes. God i hate using this site while on my phone.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I guess it’s NAI then.

Actually no, Layla's excuse can easily be made by scum. So since Gamma so kindly started the wagon, i'll put some more "oomph" behind it.
VOTE: Layla

[NorwegianboyEE]

I can already tell I was wrong to think FL was only one able to contest me when it came to posting rate.

Yep. Perhaps we should make a contest.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I guess it’s NAI then.

Actually no, Layla's excuse can easily be made by scum. So since Gamma so kindly started the wagon, i'll put some more "oomph" behind it.
VOTE: Layla

Why didn’t you start the wagon?

Because i didn't.


I'm hoping you guys are ready for some more infuriating answers in the future. Trust me, I've got hundreds of them.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I guess it’s NAI then.

Actually no, Layla's excuse can easily be made by scum. So since Gamma so kindly started the wagon, i'll put some more "oomph" behind it.
VOTE: Layla

Btw you

were

town in Haunted Village right

Yes. It just so happened that i shot town all the time. But i was town aligned don't you worry. Still is!

[NorwegianboyEE]

Tea's 57 is casting shade on what look to me to be a couple of good leads.
Tea would be a good vote but I think the careful play by Norwegian is scummier.
VOTE: Norwegian

What careful play lol.

[NorwegianboyEE]

The whole

'crafting an RVS vote before getting a role PM

' thing seems weird to me, though. I could see this being a lie, because I can't imagine why anyone would make an RVS post before the game has even opened.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Layla

This is a good point^

[NorwegianboyEE]

Like... I'm pretty sure Norwegian is breathing a sigh of relief after seeing yall vote Layla.

Nice narrative you're trying to build there.

Perhaps i should do the same?
Tea is most definitely breathing a sigh of relief here at the possibility of turning the vote away from his scumpartner and shading a town slot instead.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Oh...
Hi!

[NorwegianboyEE]

How long do you think it will take until i start SR'ing you Chemist?

[NorwegianboyEE]

I scumread Chemist already.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Layla (4): Gamma Emerald, NorwegianboyEE, Vorkuta, Luca Blight
NorwegianboyEE (4): splitfarvle, Zote the Mighty, Dunnstral, davesaz

What's funny about this current vote count is that i have played with all of the people that are voting Layla with me before in various games on this site. While all of the people that are voting me are totally unknown to me and scary. Brrr... Get away from me you frightening strangers.

[NorwegianboyEE]

The difficult thing about this setup is that i'm most definitely going to forget at least a couple of people here, especially the inactive ones. So if they're scum they can just coast along undetected because there are so many distractions.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Yeah i might switch to the tea wagon because those posts claiming i was breathing a sigh of relief were pretty disgusting.

[NorwegianboyEE]

His stance flip on Nor. He did say that his read on Nor have gotten worse over the span of 20 or so posts. Did people miss that?

If all it took was 2 minor posts from me between him vaguely implying to TR me for him to change his read and get needlessly aggressive then it wasn't a particularly strong TR in the first place.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Although I could see them being scummy.

It’s not so much that some people might find them scummy posts that bothers me, it’s Tea’s fast 180 on his read on me. It reads like someone that’s not actually trying to think about my motivations as either town or scum, but someone that sees an opportunity to go back on his initially stated read to push me as a mislynch.

[NorwegianboyEE]

VOTE: Tea

[NorwegianboyEE]

He only has 8 posts total on his profile. I have no idea what his meta is.

[NorwegianboyEE]

The difficult thing about this setup is that i'm most definitely going to forget at least a couple of people here, especially the inactive ones. So if they're scum they can just coast along undetected because there are so many distractions.

Do you think everyone else will forget about them if you do?

What a weird question.

[NorwegianboyEE]

It's wasn't just the lack of a vote from Nor fool, it was him waiting until someone else voted for a player he found scummy before hopping on the wagon.

Ok i’ll shoot first and ask questions later from now on.
AMERICAN STYLE!

[NorwegianboyEE]

I like how you're actually suspecting me in this game.
Thank god.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Then post 30, Gamma says your 30 reasoning seems valid, so all of a sudden, you do a 180 on your NAI reasoning say scum could make that excuse and vote Layla.

It was for pressure. I actually think Layla is looking more like town right now, that's why i switched to a objectively scummier looking slot which is Tea. I don't agree with Layla's reasoning for TR him, but i do think Layla's hesitation to vote makes her more town for it.

[NorwegianboyEE]

@Norwegian, I do like your play in this game alot more than the mini normal we played together though. Wanted to get that out there since I gave you so much shit for it in that game.

Hell man, i caught scum early in that game and did all i could to push him. Yet you kept saying i was playing like trash. Like doh, my read was right ya donut.

[NorwegianboyEE]

i have a weird gut feeling we hit scum in Tea for completely wrong reasons and now we’re in a holding pattern because scum’s awkward.

I don’t actually have a Tea read myself

Actually re-reading the game. This post is BIG yikes! Holy shit.

[NorwegianboyEE]

VOTE: Flavor Leaf

[NorwegianboyEE]

Hi again to Jigglypuff, Arcfield, Papa Leaf, Luca, dave, Dunn, Salad, Wake, GE, Zote, and Norskie.
Nice to meet the rest of you.

Holy shit I know like half the cast

Anyway let's start off with a >random vote on VOTE: Flavor

Something tells me this wasn’t random.

I don't like this post either.

[NorwegianboyEE]

VOTE: Flavor Leaf

Please explain your progression from your last four posts all of which happened in about 30 minutes.

I read the game again to evaluate whether i really was on the right wagon here, because the one on Tea built up really fast.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I don't like the aggressive tone of this part of the post. There's something else that bothers me about it, but I'll save that for later, when I'm actually able to talk about it.

If you're referring to my reply it was intended as a joke to show how easy it is to construct a narrative about how scum x is "breathing a sigh of relief" or whatever nonsense he was going on about.

[NorwegianboyEE]

i have a weird gut feeling we hit scum in Tea for completely wrong reasons and now we’re in a holding pattern because scum’s awkward.

I don’t actually have a Tea read myself

Actually re-reading the game. This post is BIG yikes! Holy shit.

Explain?

It's a bad post because Leaf is lightly shading Tea by claiming we "hit scum" and it's only the reasoning behind the wagon that's not good enough. Yet at the same time he claims he has no opinion on Tea at all. If so:

1: Why claim the wagon "hit scum" if he apparently doesn't have any opinion about Tea's alignment.
2: Why is he sure we "hit scum" in the first place. What sort of logic is he thinking here?
3: Does town have any reason to make this post? This seems like the sort of post scum makes to encourage a wagon on town, but not wanting to take any responsibility for the outcome.

[NorwegianboyEE]

You seem to be rather self-centered in your approach currently.

In what way?

[NorwegianboyEE]

@norskie
Did you grow more confident and less afraid of getting lynched for opening your mouth since village?

Well i’ve been playing a bunch of mafia games since Haunted Village and honed my playstyle a fair bit so yes. Actually this is more like my typical playstyle. Haunted village was a bit of an anomaly, i don’t even know why i was playing so submissively there. I’m usually a bit more aggressive.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Actually i remember now, it was all of those hydras confusing the shit out of me.

[NorwegianboyEE]

What is similar here to my scum!play in nomination mafia?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Are you NoNK?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Are you NoNK?

I dunno, am I?

Well yes. You are.
Just wanted to see if you’d admit it.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Vork do you have an opinion on the game so far?

[NorwegianboyEE]

i have a weird gut feeling we hit scum in Tea for completely wrong reasons and now we’re in a holding pattern because scum’s awkward.

I don’t actually have a Tea read myself

^Nobody else has any opinion on this post?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Moving on

To WHAT?!

[NorwegianboyEE]

Chemist is town apparently.

[NorwegianboyEE]

That's very surface level.

Just like your reads. OH HOH.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I’ve played 2 games with Chemist and he was scum in both of them. All he did was lurk. I don’t see anything town indicative from him. Why are you townreading him Tea?

[NorwegianboyEE]

town
{Chemist Billy}
{Layla GE}
---
{Luca Reundo}
{Vork Norwegian}
scum

there's a pretty big difference between the tiers separated by the line btw.

You claim there’s a pretty big difference between the tiers, but your top TR is just a "gut read" on someone that’s posted like 2-3 posts by the time you made this...

[NorwegianboyEE]

The question now is whether Tea is just bad or if he is scum-bad.
Btw @Penguin: It should be 4 votes on me, not 3.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Tea has been playing kinda badly imo. But the speed at which he gained votes + how nobody really defends him much makes me also lean slightly town on him for now.
In which case both the top wagons right now are on town. Better find an alternative, which i've already done. Flavour Leaf is looking kinda scummy for reasons i already mentioned.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Tea's play here is really giving me bad vibes not gonna lie. It's just that i'm not sure if its scum indicative or not.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I really dont think you believe in what you're saying Norwegian.

Yes i do. And the shit you're saying right now isn't making my unease any better.

[NorwegianboyEE]

And i really don't like how you act like you know me, but i don't know you because you're an alt.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I don't like Tea and i don't like how his vote is on either Vork or Luca Blight.
Flavour leaf you can be town in my eyes for now.

VOTE: Tea

[NorwegianboyEE]

VOTE: Tea

UNVOTE: Tea

Keeping the balance in the force.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Omg what’s going on? Wake is scum now? I’ll post my thoughts a bit later ahhh!

[NorwegianboyEE]

Omg what’s going on? Wake is scum now? I’ll post my thoughts a bit later ahhh!

Literally wtf is that post? How is he getting townread?

Cus i'm better than you. And you know it.

[NorwegianboyEE]

In Nomination Mafia, NorwegianboyEE made similar aggressive statements as he did in the quote I posted recently. It turns out that he was Mafia that game, and because of that, I'm not comfortable about Norwegian's aggressive play in the quote I mentioned.

That's a bit of a weird statement because i actually feel like i was relatively toned down in nomination mafia compared to how aggressive i usually play when i'm town. Actually it is usually when i'm scum that i play less aggressively and is more calculated with my posts, because i'm much more self-conscious.

[NorwegianboyEE]

@PMysterious
And it seems like you ignored my post 188

[NorwegianboyEE]

A50’s entry is a bit sketchy to me because he has way too many townreads and doesn’t explain why he TR’s them. Meanwhile he’s presenting this dichotomy that it’s very likely there’s scum in either me or Tea. (He also mentions Luca Blight) Which i really want him to elaborate more upon.
@A50 What made you reach those comclusions you did in your reads list?

[NorwegianboyEE]

More votes on Wake, please.

I'll pass.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Yeah and i'm back to voting Tea again so i don't know what your beef is.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Nor have you played scum on this site before?

Yeah on nomination mafia.
viewtopic.php?f=51&t=80998

[NorwegianboyEE]

I actually agree more with Luca Blight here. It's not necessarily scum indicative to have a change of heart. The reason why people would find it scummy is because they assume that person "X" had a discussion with his scum teammates in the mafia PT and they decided that player "X" should push player "Y" rather than player "A". But this isn't as common as you'd think. Most likely it's just that someone literally decided they wanted to push elsewhere because they changed their stance due to new posts or they decided their previous vote most likely wasn't scum after all and they don't want to vote town.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I'm not making a big deal of it, it's 1 post.

[NorwegianboyEE]

It seems like you’re making a big deal of the fact that i’m not making a big deal sir. But you’re trying to frame it as if i am in fact the one that’s making a big deal about your scumreads. Yet i am in fact not making a big deal about it. Though it could be argued that i’m making a big deal of the fact that i’m not making a big deal. In which case it would be totally SCUM indicative, but i would much rather make a big deal of the fact that i’m rather bored so it might seem like i make a big deal of any topic which might not in fact have any pre-requisite of making it out to be a big deal.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Have i killed this game yet? ^^

[NorwegianboyEE]

Vork what are you talking about? D1 modifier?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Joke or not, I remember a similar post being made on Nomination Mafia. Allow me to find it.

That quote was me attempting to tie a connection between someone i knew would flip scum (Titus) to a townie (You) to secure a future mislynch. I don't see how that is relevant to this game.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Needless to say, I'm not a fan of it

I don't know if you're carrying a grudge or what, but i'm going to be very open about my previous behavior in nomination mafia. I constantly misrepresented your position and tried to paint your actions as scummy because my wincon wasn't based on solving the game, it was on securing as many mislynches as possible.
I'm actually pretty sure you're town in this game because i don't believe scum would go digging and analyze my behavior from the previous scum-game i had to find similarities. That's a very town motivated thing to do. Of course, i'm not going to give much of a TR to any future people who go digging in my meta. Because now that I've mentioned it as something i would TR, they might be planning to copy that behavior.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Vork what are you talking about? D1 modifier?

Yes

k thankz.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I still don't know what you meant Vorkuta. I'm just pretending to.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Wake88 (5): Luca Blight, Dunnstral, davesaz, Zote the Mighty, PMysterious
Tea (3): Reundo, Gamma Emerald, NorwegianboyEE
NorwegianboyEE (3): splitfarvle, Billy Pilgrim, Tea
Vorkuta (2): Layla, Wake88
Luca Blight (1): Chemist1422
Gamma Emerald (1): Fish Monger
Dunnstral (1): Vorkuta

Not Voting (2): Almost50, Flavor Leaf

###

Wake wagon: I don't fully understand this one because i'm not really seeing why Wake is scum. I don't have much more to say about it, nor do i get why it's got the most votes so far.

Tea wagon: It died down, but Tea is still looking kinda scummy, and lately he's been inactive... avoiding questions... yada yada. As i'm standing i think this is my most preferred lynch so far.

Norwegianboy wagon: THIS WAGON SUCKS!

Vorkuta wagon: The main problem i have with Vorkuta right now is that he seems to be much more low-key than his scumplay in haunted village where he was very active and even said shit like "apathetic town loses games!" yeah brilliant Vork. I'm not sure if the difference here is that he has a more subdued townplay or he is trying a different scum tactic of just staying low and not being the center of attention.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Your meta case is trash Tea.
I don’t know what else to say.
Like if you’re going to not look at my behaviour objectively and just case me on meta and claim i’m scum for it then you’re really not taking your read on me seriously.

[NorwegianboyEE]

There’s too many people in this game for me to case perfectly. I’m fine with getting voted as long as long as it’ll ultimately help the town catch scum. But god that case Tea has on me is so horrendous. What you’re doing is look at my posts and apply them to your own already established narrative, but it’s simply wrong. I’m wondering if you’re a town grasping at straws here or whether it feels so artificial because you’re scum attempting to metanalyze.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I get the feeling town is completely on the wrong track right now. If people could start posting their townreads that would be great.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Looking at people like Davesaz and Splitfarvle. They have been going a bit under the radar, and i don't see anything town indicative from them. This gamestate seems like it really benefits scum and i think they should be put more upfront.
Who are your townreads @Davesaz and @Splitfarvle?
Also if i remember correctly Billy Pilgrim claimed he liked my play better in this game, yet he's voting for me. What is that about?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Reundo and Fish Monger be looking kinda town from their ISO.
Dunnstral hasn't really said that much.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Luca's progression from TR'ing me to voting me after Tea posted the awful meta-case is a bad progression. Kinda seems like he could be proactive and opportunistic scum that tries to seem reasonable but really just wants to facilitate a mislynch that won't incriminate him.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Time to look at this Wake dude. I hear he's the talk of the town.
Hmm.. i don't see anything all that noteworthy from his ISO that could be constructed as scum indicative. I'm not satisfied with voting this dude as a D1 lynch. It will give us nothing, and he seems like just a slightly withdrawn townie anyway.
His wagon= SUCKS.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Gamma Emerald has a very logical and coherent though process which i can understand so his slot screams town to me. I think the only thing i don't really agree with is his TR on A50.
A50 still kinda sketchy lookin to me.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Last game I couldn't get any reads on you because it felt like you werent trying. This game it feels like you're trying hence my comment. Still think your play has been scummy though. Also, I made that comment like 4 irl days ago. Why did you just now think to mention it?

"Felt like i wasn't trying"? Lel. I caught Kraeg out as scum in that micro and tried to lynch the mofo. How is that not trying? Are you really being honest with your thoughts here?
I'd like to hear exactly what about my play is "scummy" in your opinion. And i don't care if you've said it already, because it obviously wasn't a good enough reason for me to even care to remember it. So try again.
I mentioned it now because i often have thoughts lingering in the back of my mind and voice them at later points when i feel it's relevant. Don't go saying that's scummy now mr: "i misread you as scum when you were town" back in the micro game.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Oh, Chemist you're voting Luca already. Have my vote too.
VOTE: Luca Blight

[NorwegianboyEE]

Luca initially scumreads Tea and TR's me. Then when the narrative is appearing to be switching [Tea loses votes and posts a case] he immediately goes back on his principles and votes me. It sure looks like a scummy and opportunistic wagon hop to me.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Oh, Chemist you're voting Luca already. Have my vote too.
VOTE: Luca Blight

I thought you were scumreading me

No, not really. You're a big fat null read to me.

[NorwegianboyEE]

It was for the MEMES!

[NorwegianboyEE]

Luca initially scumreads Tea and TR's me. Then when the narrative is appearing to be switching [Tea loses votes and posts a case] he immediately goes back on his principles and votes me. It sure looks like a scummy and opportunistic wagon hop to me.

You’re misrepping me here, I’ve had Tea as a Town-lean for a while now.

I’m not going back on any ‘principles’, I merely reconsidered my read on you. The only reason I was TR’ing you was due to meta, and after reading Tea’s case I looked back at our previous game together and your recent scum game and realised I was mistaken in my reasons for TR’ing. I’m also SR’ing you for reasons independent of meta which I will expand on in a while.

F the meta, why am i scum in THIS game according to you?
Why wait? If you’ve got anything juicy you should say it now.

[NorwegianboyEE]

@Norwegian: in short, your reaction to the Wake wagon and the general aimlessness of your play.

You're going to have to elaborate.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Why is aimlessness on D1 scummy?
And another question for you, why is not being aimless on D1 town indicative?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Not that i even agree with your assessment that I've been aimless, but i want to know why you think that comes from a scum POV.

[NorwegianboyEE]

As for the Wake wagon i've already said what i think about it. I think Wake is town.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I will elaborate when I’m on a computer, i hate quoting multiple things on my phone.

Btw, are you no longer scumreading Tea, or do you just SR me more?

Well that's quite obvious isn't it? I already explained that i'm thinking this gamestate suggests that only town is being voted right now. And scum is just switching their votes nilly dilly.
So yes i think you're more scummy than Tea right now.

[NorwegianboyEE]

What is my motivation for switching votes if I’m scum and all three main wagons are Town?

You were voting Wake before switching to me. Assuming Wake and me is both town and you're scum then it doesn't make much sense because Wake's got a lot of votes already. So alternatively Wake could be scum and you saw a opportunity to change. Or you're misguided town, but if you are. Then explain how you went from post 294 to 494. What changed between those 200 posts?

So far I’m townreading NorwegianboyEE, and have slight scum leans on Zote, Chemist and Wake88.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: Wake88

Will go into more details once I’ve had some sleep.

I'm starting to re-consider my NorwegianBoyEE view. Ive played with him before when he was Town and he was similar in terms of his activity and not being overly serious, but looking back at that game he definitely showed more care in sorting people than he's doing here. It feels like he's being more floaty, which doesn't seem out of place with his scum meta, at a glance.

UNVOTE:

VOTE: NorwegianBoyEE

[NorwegianboyEE]

Oh well. Not like i expected much of an reasonable response from scum.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Because your backpedaling and reason to scumread me is bad.

[NorwegianboyEE]

294 and 494

[NorwegianboyEE]

Saw a request for town reads -- here you go, no particular order for strength other than knowing my alignment .
davesaz
Luca Blight
Almost50
Gamma Emerald
Zote the Mighty

Norwegian might be town. I didn't like the early reluctance to vote, when at that time a vote meant very little. Later posting is good but I tend to have reservations about the possibility that it's a recovery tactic.

This pings me a bit, dave listing himself as a townread apropos of nothing. Like, of course you read yourself as towm, and you’ll say you do even if you aren’t town. It seems, I don’t know, overcompensating in a way?

This isn’t really something i’d say to be scum indicative.

[NorwegianboyEE]

@Billy Pilgrim
That seems valid. Like i’m not scum. But your thought process seems town. The fact that you’re voting me as town is unfortunate, but if i flip then i won’t think you were scum pushing for my mislynch.

[NorwegianboyEE]

These "shades" and "unnatural reactions" you’re seeing is really just my natural thoughts. All over the place. I often say some spur of the moment shit and then reconsider. Like i’d probably put you as a slight scumlean prior to your post here, but your detailed description and attempt at clarifying your view seems really sincere so after that i’d put you as a townlean.

[NorwegianboyEE]

VOTE: tea
I’ll expand more on why Tea is scum later. Just want to get my vote out.

[NorwegianboyEE]

The benefits of voting you outweigh the harms

In particular you seem not to be playing in good faith... so there's really no point not voting you.

Also, voting you is more likely to make that change than not voting you, and you're also really likely to be scum. So

This is just absolute bullshit and i don't think you even believe what you're saying right now. Obviously you have to stand by what you said as scum, but truth is your case is awful and just an excuse to vote me. I don't believe any of it was made in good faith whatsoever.

[NorwegianboyEE]

"Like I know this seems based off of meta but the takeaway is that he's trying to artificially establish a presence in a scum-motivated way without really getting called out/noticed for it"

Like wtf does this even mean? What about my play is scum-motivated? You seem to be avoiding saying anything of substance and just repeating "oh his play is scum-motivated". Well you actually have to explain WHY my play is scum-motivated.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Ok, the content is better, but I still don't like the way you're saying it

It feels... off

You really don't have anything better to say do you? Apparently all you can muster is that something is "off".
What exactly is "off"?

[NorwegianboyEE]

"Like I know this seems based off of meta but the takeaway is that he's trying to artificially establish a presence in a scum-motivated way without really getting called out/noticed for it"

And what's the deal with the quotation marks? Did you copy this from the scum pt or something?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Never mind it was from your case post lel.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I'm primarily attacking Tea right now because his vote feels the most dishonest.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Because of his case and the posts he made afterwards. His argumentation isn't genuine. I could still see you as possibly town Luca Blight, even though i have my suspicions. But Tea feels like he's been doing nothing but scumpost since i had my spout with you.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Tea then expands on his suspicion of you and you’re back on him again. It’s all very reactive.

Is it though? I held back on Tea while he had the most votes and now i'm back on him again when he's gotten less votes because i'm very suspicious of his content. If i really was reactive i would be pushing for why Wake is scum. If you knew he wasn't my scum partner (which he isn't) then this makes a whole lot of sense.

[NorwegianboyEE]

In particular you seem not to be playing in good faith... so there's really no point not voting you.

Why would town say this?

[NorwegianboyEE]

My reads right now.

Strong townlean
- Gamma Emerald

Townlean
- Chemist1422
- Billy Pilgrim
- Vorkuta
- Wake88
- Flavor Leaf (Changed my read on him over time)

Null
- Almost50
- davesaz
- Dunnstral
- Reundo
- PMysterious
- Fish Monger
- splitfarvle

Scumlean
- Luca Blight
- Layla
- Zote the Mighty (For post 246)

Scum:
- Tea

[NorwegianboyEE]

Because Chemist doesn't seem like scum in this one. He's actually doing some minimal solving.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Vorkuta wagon: The main problem i have with Vorkuta right now is that he seems to be much more low-key than his scumplay in haunted village where he was very active and even said shit like "apathetic town loses games!" yeah brilliant Vork. I'm not sure if the difference here is that he has a more subdued townplay or he is trying a different scum tactic of just staying low and not being the center of attention.

And this doesn't suggest a Town-lean. What's changed between now and then?

Because Vorkuta is acting differently from his scum!meta so i'm more inclined to TR it.

[NorwegianboyEE]

You're scumreading Zote for 246, but you're strongly TR'ing Gamma despite that fact he's been using very similar logic in this game?

I don't like how eager he was to unvote and join the Wake wagon.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I'm basing my TL on Wake being a counter wagon to Tea.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I think you're defending Tea because you're his scum teammate.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Where's the tunnel vision? I've been cased as scum by Tea, and now i want to flip him because i don't think he's genuine and i know i'm town. That's possibly the best lead i've got so far.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Pardon me if this doesn't seem correct, but, weren't you saying I was Town earlier? In fact, I think this post on 472, just 5 pages before, should do the trick.

Yeah i made that reads list very quick because i wanted to get most of my SR out there. I just couldn't remember why i TR you.

Could you please clarify why you're Townreading me?

Because post 609

Dear Sir;

We regret to inform you your application to the A50 haters club has been declined. To reapply you need to -at least- have A50 as an explicit SR. Thank you for your consideration and we look forward to your reapplication soon.

I don't explicitly hate nor TR you though. ;(

[NorwegianboyEE]

Where's the tunnel vision? I've been cased as scum by Tea, and now i want to flip him because i don't think he's genuine and i know i'm town. That's possibly the best lead i've got so far.

You’re basing your entire view on the game on Tea being scum. That’s tunnel vision.

If i believe there's a high probability Tea is scum then it's entirely withing my rights to analyze the game like he's flipped scum already. If for some reason he turns out to be town i'll adjust my reads accordingly, but i find it to be very unlikely at this point.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Well Tea, (or Menalque) clearly doesn't know me that well. He's analyzing my Towngame in Haunted Village vs my scumgame in nomination mafia. The problem is that i was playing much more submissively in Haunted Village as town than i usually do, and now he's using that as a reason to scumread me for playing my normal towngame in this one.

[NorwegianboyEE]

And i don't know why he's denying it's a meta case when it's clearly a meta case. He's judging me based on an artificial construct of how "town!me" plays. Even though it is entirely my thing to make playstyle changes between games even if i get the same alignment.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I can do the same type of meta casing for Tea. Here's him in open 768 C9++ literally saying 2 days later from this game starting:

I have rolled scum a lot this year tho

Him saying that he "literally rolls scum a lot of this year" could be taken as him suggesting that he rolled scum in this game too and expressing surprise at constantly rolling scum.
Of course this is all based on me figuring out his alt, but he's playing dirty by analyzing my meta game while using an alt so i don't even feel too bad.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I still think Tea has more scum equity than Vorkuta. But i'd also like Vorkuta to give more serious reads. He has been joking around a bit too much and avoiding making any serious reads. That much is true.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Vork if you could post your reads that would be great.

[NorwegianboyEE]

18 player game lol. Are like 60% of the duder's here lurkers?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Well Tea, (or Menalque) clearly doesn't know me that well. He's analyzing my Towngame in Haunted Village vs my scumgame in nomination mafia. The problem is that i was playing much more submissively in Haunted Village as town than i usually do, and now he's using that as a reason to scumread me for playing my normal towngame in this one.

If that’s Menalque then I think that raises his scum equity
His push on you feels similar to his push on me in Pokémon Ruby Mafia

Interesting. Can you link me that game?

[NorwegianboyEE]

The reason i suspect he's menalque is because he's the only player that has played in both Nomination mafia and Haunted Village, which are the two games he took my quotes from. Also his way of typing fits his profile.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Excluding me of course, since i've also played in both nomination mafia and Haunted village.

[NorwegianboyEE]

It is interesting how Tea/Mena excluded showing any examples of my towngame in C9++, (viewtopic.php?f=51&t=81049) which is another game me and him played in just recently. He was scum, i was town. I believe my towngame was much more similar to here as in that game, so it really shows his dishonest character to not compare my current play to that game, which he should be well aware of if he really is Menalque.

[NorwegianboyEE]

To be clear, mena was I believe the more active half of the Beta Sapphire hydra in Haunted Village. That game was awash in hydras.

Yep. He was a hydra and i know my bad playing as a vig made an impression on him since he noted how badly i played as vig when i played with him on nomination mafia. So this sort of analysiz he posted in this game can only come from him. In which case i have good reason to believe he is intentionally manipulating his case to make me seem more scummy than i really am. Ergo he has very high scum equity from my POV and is basically conf!scum at this point.

[NorwegianboyEE]

That is a good point. And if you take a look at my difference in townplay at Haunted village compared to C9++ you’ll see vastly different play. And i’m town in both of them. So his argument really doesn’t hold water and i doubt he made it as an honest attempt to scum case me.

Tea is scum. Plz lynch.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Assuming you played in both of the games you linked my posts from then that seems like the most likely possibility.

[NorwegianboyEE]

And you could just be saying you’re not him to avoid the noose so...
Hmmmm

[NorwegianboyEE]

Oh ok. That’s believeable. I forgot to take the moderator of nomination mafia into account. You did indeed play in HV if i remember correctly.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Knowing your true identity i don’t overly scumread you anymore.
UNVOTE:

[NorwegianboyEE]

Now it feels like i’m back to square one though.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Maybe it’s just Chemist after all. Always lurking in the background. Probably laughing at us in the scum PT. That FIEND!

[NorwegianboyEE]

Do you have a scumread on anyone Leaf?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Do I have a scum read on anyone or do I think anyone is scum?

Um... answer both i guess?

[NorwegianboyEE]

The thing about Wake is that everyone seems to have no qualms about him being voted today. Which suggests mafia is ok with his wagon. And there’s no real counterwagon other than Vorkuta right now. That’s why i’m a bit reserved about voting him.

[NorwegianboyEE]

If there are about 4-5 mafia (which i’m asduming is the case since this is a bigger game) i think they would be quite vocally opposed if anyone actually got a wagon started on scum today.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Maybe not now that i’ve mentioned it. But something to consider about the prior and current wagons.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I'll be back tomorrow.
Right now I'm occupied with this shiny new Pokemon game.

Now i want to go back to this initial vote.

VOTE: Layla

[NorwegianboyEE]

So you think mafia gave up on him assuming he's one of their mafia buddies?

[NorwegianboyEE]

And I can't lie, I'm kinda sick of people saying they dont want to play D1.

Yep, those people are lame. I've had a game where i caught scum on D1 and lynched them. There's no excuse not to play on D1 just because you "don't think there's enough information".

[NorwegianboyEE]

Often times those people actually are scum because they want to lurk out as much as possibly and not commit to anything. Which benefits them as scum.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Is this the only reason you find me scummy fool?

No it's also your needlessly abrasive language.

[NorwegianboyEE]

nah dawg, i changed my reads quite drastically after that whole Chennis revelation. So i have you more as null now.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Basically if Tea had been Menalque i would still be hard scumreading him for that case right now. But Chennis is a person that i don't believe is as familiar with my meta so his meta case is more of a "meh, i guess he's just a town that's trying to scum case me but he's wrong" situation so i'm much more willing to forgive him for it.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Btw I have two approaches to the game I am considering and I feel like making it a democracy. So here’s the options. Either I go super-chill this game and let others drive it, or I go super-hyper and try to drive it myself, and will also aim for top poster of the game (I wouldn’t do this if there were a lot of threats to that position

Pretty sure i stole this position.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Oh i just realized we're awaiting an replacement for the Layla slot.
Maybe i shouldn't be voting there then.
UNVOTE:

[NorwegianboyEE]

Like I said, I hate Day 1 for obvious reasons. I've got nothing to work with.

And if THAT's your reason to mislynch me, LOL. You're not going to force me to post when I hate Day 1.

I do, however, notice who acts and who doesn't in response to me saying I don't like Day 1.

Wow.
VOTE: Wake88

[NorwegianboyEE]

The apathy in this game is palpable. Losing enthusiasm to play.

Let's just lynch all the apathetic players and then we can play some real mafia.

[NorwegianboyEE]

^this guy deserves more scrutiny

Yeah...

---

PMysterious was talking about me "flip-flopping" on my reads.

So, why the null read now? As far as I can see, there wasn't any real reason given for switching to null when you had me as Town before. Seems more flip-floppy than a pair of flip-flops. Very strange.

Then we get a pretty big difference on how he's describing the Wake wagon from post 378:

With that said, I see the Wake wagon as being justified, and as long as there's nothing to really suggest that he's Town, then he's also a safe lynch for this first day.

To post 731:

there also hasn't been a hammer yet, so it's possible that all of the Mafia are on the wagon right now.

PM's post here is a bit suspicious because it's designed in a way that sets up suspicion on the people that are voting town!wake.

[NorwegianboyEE]

VOTE: PMysterious

[NorwegianboyEE]

Wake kinda sucks as a town player right now, and i almost want to policy lynch him based on that. But i don't think he's scum.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Uh oh.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Hectic asked me in the mafia PT to say something about Zote. I was a bit sceptical at first, but he was adamant about it. So i guess i’ll have to.

Zote be looking kinda scummy yo. He’s just a paper tiger. All bark and no bite. We don’t want THOSE kind of people hogging up space in our overcrowded town. No sir-ee-bob.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Better lynch him quick mafia. He’s about to solve the game.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I’m getting town pings from Dunnstral and a bit negative vibes from Davesaz.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Is the amish told the greeting the thread thing?

No. It's the "My predecessor sucked and looked scummy".

And he still does.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Wake what is your opinion on PM describing "all scum" being on your wagon? Do you have any reads at all?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Billy, maybe I’m more ‘hoppy’ due to the fact we’re in a Large Normal?

Yeah that makes sense. Actually thought that at the time. So you saying that definitely works.

UNVOTE:

Nice push.
I’m sure Luca really felt that pressure.
/S

Anyway wanna do a real wagon on PM now?

[NorwegianboyEE]

I don't ever remember davesaz being so hung up on "avoiding scumhunting" being a reason to scumread people like he is right now, or being concerned about a lack of info from a lynch (which is a honestly a pretty dumb reason to be against a wagon anyway)

It's independently scummy by it's own right to say things like:

Deadline restarted at 3 days, and trying to run up PM doesn't seem promising at all. What are we going to learn from that?
Sure if it flips scum I'll take it, but then what?

Wake feels like he's actively avoiding scumhunting, which seems more scum motivated than just lurking would.

But the knowledge that this is not his normal play kinda cements my scumlean on him.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I'd vastly prefer a PM or Dave lynch rather than Wake today.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Also, why don't you want to lynch Wake?

Because i found a better slot to push when PM posted that scummy post. (731)
Wake should be easier to sort later.

[NorwegianboyEE]

What's your read of Wake though?

More town than PM and Dave.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Actually i think there's only about 8 hours left?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Oh no wait. its 1 day and 8 hours.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I forgot deadlines actually change and don't stay static from the time it's posted on this forum.

[NorwegianboyEE]

@Luca Blight
If he's scum we'd call it partner defense.
If he's town we'd call it: "Mild scumcoasting, blatant attempt at buddying, manipulative accumulation of towncred, purposefully keeping up the pretense of defending a townie with the true intention being to blame the other townies for the mislynch and pre-emptively excusing himself for scumreading them in the next day phase."

[NorwegianboyEE]

@Luca Blight
If he's scum we'd call it partner defense.
If he's town we'd call it: "Mild scumcoasting, blatant attempt at buddying, manipulative accumulation of towncred, purposefully keeping up the pretense of defending a townie with the true intention being to blame the other townies for the mislynch and pre-emptively excusing himself for scumreading them in the next day phase."

Stop buddying me, Norwee.

I ain't your buddy, friend.

[NorwegianboyEE]

(I've read "something worth mentioning" three times in PM's second post)

So, in the first post, Tea says voting Norwegian is a bad vote, but in the next 20 posts, he claims that Norwegian is a good vote and Layla is a bad vote. It's quite the contradiction, and

something worth mentioning

. Looking through the ISO, I don't see it as AI or anything worth pushing, but it's

something worth mentioning

, because 20 posts is in most cases, not a lot of time for an opinion like that to change. The crazy thing is, in the gap, Norwegian only made 2 posts. Again, not AI, but

something worth mentioning

for future reference.

Lol that's a really funny observation.

[NorwegianboyEE]

I think he's lurking out of panic, guys. Is it time to use the day vig shot?

I don’t think he’s even been online since his last post. So is he lurking? Maybe. But panicky lurking?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Just vote him man. We’ve got 14 hours left until forced no lynch.

[NorwegianboyEE]

[NorwegianboyEE]

The good reason is that we have 9 hours left and unless you think all the players can change back their vote to Wake in time we're going to end up with a no lynch scenario.

[NorwegianboyEE]

And also that PM is objectively a better lynch as Reundo clearly pointed out in post 844.

[NorwegianboyEE]

No lynch gives us nothing to work with. It's just a waste of time. I'd personally prefer any lynch other than no lynch.

[NorwegianboyEE]

If PM is scum then you're going to be my public enemy number 1 Luca.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Wake wagon built up quickly too.
You're claiming this wagon is scum motivated even though by your metrics, the Wake wagon would also most likely be scum motivated.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Just for reference in case i die the next night:
If PM flips scum i would take a closer look at Luca for his strong attempt at discrediting the wagon and wanting us to switch back to Wake.
Davesaz might also be worth looking into since he joined the wagon late. Cop check maybe.

If PM flips town then Wake should be put under more scrutiny.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Claim PM.

[NorwegianboyEE]

As for who the scum are, I don't know. If I had to take a guess though, I'd say Norwegian is a possible candidate. I notice similarities to Nomination Mafia in his playstyle, but since Norwegian wasn't the primary wagon, I don't feel as much of a need to bring it up.

You're very awkwardly tunneling in your approach this game.
Am i really your only scumread?

[NorwegianboyEE]

As for my claim, I'm a Vanilla Townie (again).

What do you mean by "(again)"?

[NorwegianboyEE]

As for my claim, I'm a Vanilla Townie (again).

What do you mean by "(again)"?

This year alone, I've been a Vanilla Townie in so many of my games (and that's not anecdotal evidence, it's provable by looking at my profile when it comes to completed games). So when I say "again", I mean that it's a common thing for me to the point where being something else will not only be a surprise, but also a blessing. A blessing for who, I wouldn't know.

I'm not sure if that's an argument scum would make. Because it's really not convincing to say "i'm always VT, so that means i'm in this game too!".
If you are town. Then seeing as your only observation is that i might be scum and Wake is town, i really don't feel bad about voting you. Because you're wrong about your read on me anyway.
And there's only 5 hours left so not keen on unvoting when you might be scum. Someone should hammer before we run out of time.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Luca’s going out of his way to defend PM without townreading them

Honestly I wanna kill that slot regardless of PM’s flip

Same feeling here honestly.
If PM is town then Luca's behavior seems like he is attempting to capitalize off it by being against the wagon.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Luca’s going out of his way to defend PM without townreading them

Honestly I wanna kill that slot regardless of PM’s flip

Same feeling here honestly.
If PM is town then Luca's behavior seems like he is attempting to capitalize off it by being against the wagon.

Which is ironically, exactly the reason why PM seemed so suspicious in the first place.

[NorwegianboyEE]

@PMysterious
If you think i'm scum and Wake is town, then there was absolutely no reason for me to change my vote from Wake to you. Much better to just stay on Wake and encourage someone to hammer.

[NorwegianboyEE]

But you can't claim i'm scum with Wake can you? Because you were townreading him earlier and that would go against your established narrative.
It's also pretty interesting that you keep bringing up Nomination mafia when you've never even seen my townplay. So why would you keep using it as an example? I would also like to add that i don't see any particular similarity with my play in nomination mafia compared to here.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Hmmmm... 2 deaths huh?
SK?

[NorwegianboyEE]

I have a guilty on Flavor Leaf

VOTE: FL

Nice.
I’ll wait with voting because i want more discussion first. But count me in.

[NorwegianboyEE]

-7 Luca Blight

oof.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Hectic now has -15 points.

[NorwegianboyEE]

You got a guilty. Why listen to this scum joker?

LYNCH! LYNCH! LYNCH!
VOTE: Flavour Leaf

[NorwegianboyEE]

Yeah so I was never actually a cop

I'm actually a Loyal Neighborizer, and if FL was really a miller he'd be neighborized. He isn't.

I withheld this for this exact scenario

Ohh that’s really clever.
I need to remember that strategy.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Looks like Chemist can actually be useful when he isn’t an afk scum like everygame i’ve played with him prior.

[NorwegianboyEE]

Any idea on FL’s teammates? Or do we worry about that the next day?

[NorwegianboyEE]

Wow i guess you’ve got a point.
UNVOTE:

[NorwegianboyEE]

Did you get your hopes up for a second there?
VOTE: Flavour Leaf

[NorwegianboyEE]

I like chocolate better.