Mafia 3 (Improbable Role)

[MiriYami]

hmmm...A very interesting turn of events.So, question the first: ;is mudster actually dead or is he still about, just with a higher voice?And, yeesh ;Squirrels are very cute, as are plants, but the question is how they got turned. ;Maybe a form of protection? ;The question is about why they got turned as well as by whom.Anyway, as i have absolutely no idea right now, I will not vote yet; i will wait for a little more of the first day to develop, assuming the server stays working.

[MiriYami]

Hmmm...nice defense, sketch. ;I can't quite believe you made that up -- I certainly wouldnt have been able to.Wow, Quercitron came up with some pretty incredible roles. ;Someone who turns ppl into a plant, someone else who turns ppl into a squirrel, weird. ;Or maybe they're both the same person. ;And then also Johnny Cochran over there. ;Hmmm.I will vote for Radwulf for being the silent type. ;Must be mafia.*wanders off with a friend, chatting happily*

[MiriYami]

What, Quercitron, doesn't my vote count? ;I quite clearly voted radwulf above. ;And for now, I'll leave it that way, to make sure sketch doesn't die, as there will definitely be a death each night. ;I believe his role, and i don't know what radwulf is, so i'm more likely to get an evil by voting radwulf than by allowing sketch to die.BTW, what happens if there is a tie at the deadline? ;Two lynchings or none or flip coin or what? ;Thanks

[MiriYami]

well, I'm not sure what neo is getting at, but I don't think saberkitty is guilty, which is why my vote is still on radwulf. ;Saber, I'd suggest that you vote for someone rather quickly to give your bandwagon some competition, and the only available bandwagon is radwulf -- unless, of course, you don't want to vote for radwulf for some reason.Or we could all just not lynch -- wait, no, not possible, our mod said that the highest number gets lynched.*sets up shop belatedly, selling her wares*

[MiriYami]

Okay, first, I have a question:

[quote=Luna] last night, I tried to raise SaberKitty, but didn't do too well.[/quote]

Please explain. Didn't do too well? Did you partially raise her? Did you get any info from her about anything she might have seen? Or is that just your way of saying that you failed? Did you only manage to raise her left hand or something? :) Just curious.

And second, I'm completely lost. I have no clue who is innocent and who is guilty. But I feel the need to vote, as a somewhat lynch-thirsty townie. So I'm gonna

vote Radwulf

again, as I have no idea, but no one has shown Radwulf to be innocent. Usually, when a lynching fails (at least in my experience) someone with some investigative powers tries to figure out what's up with the failed lynchee.

[MiriYami]

Hmmm...well, first of all, I do not have an investigative role. And, given the complete weirdness of the information thus far received, I feel like day 1 still. So a random vote seems the only way I can go for now.

Also, though SaberKitty may be voting completely randomly, she may also know something we don't know. Therefore, I'm not changing my vote -- at least not for now.

As to the various ways that a zombie can or can't be controlled, I am inclined to believe, in this case, that it's more like what they did with Buffy -- truly bringing back to life. Granted, that wasn't *exactly* necromancy, but I think it's close enough to count.

[MiriYami]

Antrax: What you say makes sense. However, here's another option, just as a possibility:

Mith *thinks* he's a cop, but gets useless investigation results. He's still on the side of the town, and when we think we've found a mafia, he can make it easier for us to lynch him/her.

OTOH, if he is helping the mafia, then we may be able to find them in the IS bandwagon. Oh, wait, you're there, and so is Luna. Hmmm.

Anyway, my $0.02 again.

[MiriYami]

Okay, first, could someone please explain the Lepton Gambit to me, preferably in layman's terms? I haven't been playing mafia *that* long and I'd like to understand exactly what you are accusing mith of.

Second, Antrax is innocent because Sketch claims to have targeted him first night and there *was* a mafia kill, therefore meaning that Antrax could not be part of the mafia.

Third, Sketch, since no one has come forward thus far to claim that their good power didn't work, I think we might want to know who you targeted and lynch that person; that is the only even semi-solid evidence we have. Especially since we can't ask the doc if he protected anyone last night :(.

[MiriYami]

Okay, I am completely confused. I have ideas about who may or may not be guilty, but mostly about who isnt guilty. I think Mith was misguided on trusting his results so much, seeing as how he *is* the spanish inquisition and all. I think Luna is most likely innocent, though the whole puppetmaster thing hadn't really occurred to me. And I think that we're barking up all the wrong trees and that people who don't post much are more likely to be mafia. After all, they are boring, aren't they?

And I know I don't post *too* much, but I do post some. Anyway, I sorta like Mike's idea -- if Groza really hasn't posted much (or at all) then I'm at least somewhat suspicious of him because I've seen him post in other games? Does anyone know if he knows where the board is now? I have no contact info for him, so if someone else could get ahold of him and check that would be great. Withholding vote for now, but FOS: Groza.

[MiriYami]

As I've said before, I think Groza is acting suspiciously. He's being very quiet; it feels like an attempt to be inconspicuous to me. Now, regardless of who sketchwick did or didn't target last night, I think that when someone acts suspicious, we should lynch them. Therefore,

Vote: Groza

[MiriYami]

I will be away for four days, starting now. I will be back Monday night/tuesday morning. I may or may not have limited net access where I'm going.

Oh, and my vote stands; Groza is being incredibly quiet, which is both pointless and makes me somewhat suspicious.

[MiriYami]

Hi there.

Huh, I coulda sworn I checked in everywhere. Ah, well, that's what happens when I play too many mafia games, I'll have to cut down the number slightly in the future.

Anyway, point being, I am here, and I am about, and have been reading this thread thoroughly, that's why I thought I had already told you guys I was back here. Meh on silly forgetfulbrains.

And I really do think Groza/Ralph is/are mafia, so

vote groza/ralph

. I stated my reasons 'yesterday'.

[MiriYami]

I think Antrax is missing something -- Eillid is not the serial killer, her creator is. Therefore, we don't want to kill eillid, because once the creator is dead, Eillid seems like she'll stop killing.

I say seems like because the creator may be able to reach from beyond the grave, but I somehow doubt it. I think that it's much more likely that once the creator is dead we will not have any more deaths. So basically, we've just created a serial killer, whom we now have to find and dispose of just like the mafia.

Good luck us.

[MiriYami]

um, does this mean that the person has changed their allegiance? I mean, if they are pro-town, then they can choose to not kill, right? and then they'd only kill when they hit suspected mafia.

Just want to be clear on the role is all.

[MiriYami]

First: Aack, IS, who did you replace? I went to record your vote, saw that you were dead, remembered that you replaced someone, but couldn't remember who. Please help!

Second: I have a sort-of investigative role. I'm a kind of craftsperson and I try to teach people my craft. I cannot teach mafia. I was unable to teach Groza, as he didn't want to leave his family. I don't know for sure that he is in a mafia family, but I can't think of any other kind of family out there.

I never get details on a person's role, only the general gist (or confirmation of their char's name and/or position) if I am able to convince them to be my apprentice.

Because of this, I will

vote: Groza/Ralph

Protector, please protect me tonight! Thanks! (Unless there is someone out there who needs more protection than me of course.)

I managed to teach Neo just before he was killed; Mith died before he made a decision; Antrax declined my offer. I will attempt to train someone who won't die immediately again to help prove my story.

[MiriYami]

Actually, no, my craft isn't robotics.

It is *trumpet fanfare* underwater basket weaving.

That's right.

And when I set up to peddle my wares on the first day (or whenever I did that) I was selling excellent baskets, made entirely underwater.

Anyone want to be trained in a craft?

[MiriYami]

IS, why is the fact that DP, Antrax, and Sketchwick are still alive highly suspicious? I'd like to go with your reasoning, but not until i understand it and know i agree with it.

Thanks!

[MiriYami]

Okay, sorry for disappearing for a while, but i couldnt get to the board this morning (it refused my connection) and just got home about an hour and a half ago and had to take care of a few things and such, and then read a page and a half of mafia here.

Anyway, here's what I did the last few nights:

Night 1: IS (first incarnation), he chose to not join.
Night 2: Mith, he chose not to join
Night 3: Groza: he was mafia
Night 4: Antrax, he chose not to join
Night 5: Neo, he joined but was promptly killed by the mafia scum.
Night 6: Luna, she joined.

Anyway, I hope I (at least mostly) proved my goodness by turning a reluctant partial bandwagon for Groza/Ralph into a full-fledged, eager bandwagon. Yes, I know the lynch-the-associate-so-i-look-innocent ploy, but I'm not pulling that, I promise.

As to whether Corsato is mafia or not, I'm pondering it. It looks likely, but I don't want to cause someone else the fear that I had heading in here and reading the last page-and-a-half (that you guys had ended the day without me and i wouldnt get my say).

Someone asked what my role is -- it is effectively a trumped-up religion thing turned non-religious. I lead a group of basket-weavers, teaching them all my trade, and know that I lead a group of innocent townies. If you all believe me, then you know that whoever is in my group is innocent.

And as to the mafia not having illogical roles (someone asked about this about a page ago and I haven't seen anyone respond), Radwulf showed up as illogical because he was a mafia prostitute rather than just a mafia. Therefore, not all mafia are logical. I hope that we've eliminated all the illogical ones, but we don't know that for sure.

Anyway, I will attempt to recruit someone on the suspicious list tonight. If there's a protector out there, *please* protect me or I'm gonna die, as I seem to be the most useful person at the moment whose role is known.

All for now, I will check again before I go to bed and again tomorrow day. No vote yet.

[MiriYami]

I just remembered something that I wanted to ask but then forgot about in so many posts read: who killed Eillid? The mafia got Sir Dynadan, her creator, and Sir Dynadan got Raamawen, but who killed Eillid? Did she die as a result of the mafia killing her creator, as I first assumed? But our mod didnt seem to imply that that would happen, only that we'd be able to lynch her after we got her creator, but maybe different rules apply when the mafia kills, or when the mafia kills at the same time that he is killing, or something.

Grr. Mod, do we get any more details on how Eillid died? Anyone else got any theories?

All for now.

[MiriYami]

Okay, i have found an error in one of my previous posts. Radwulf was never indicated as illogical role; however, once he died, it was assumed that his role was illogical because, well, it seemed -- and seems -- so. It is still possible that it would have come up as logical, but somehow I doubt it.

The rest of my post still stands.

[MiriYami]

Well, an interesting turn of events.

I originally tried to recruit Dragon Phoenix, trying to find out if he was mafia; instead, I attempted a recruit of Sketchwick, who has until "tonight" to decide, which indicates that he is not, indeed, mafia, exactly as he has been claiming all along.

And this whole laser thing is really scary; whoever has the laser just started targetting us recently, and i want to know who it is. Maybe one of Neo's or Dynadan's apprentices, if they are allowed such? I dunno, I figured that we were done with our serial killer when dynadan died, but I guess not. Maybe a mafia with a trumped-up ability because he/she is the last mafia alive?

Hey, mod, do we even get to know how many more mafia we need to kill? I mean, this is really fun, but now we're hitting the point where knowing numbers is *really* useful. Ah, who knows.

Oh, and mole, was anyone at all targeting me last night, or would it be a good idea to not reveal such information? I'm not sure, especially given the new laser killer.

[MiriYami]

I have no idea where the flying pumpkin idea came from, but if that is the case, or if it is the case that the laser-wielder of whatever shape is a vigilante, then it would be nice to see him/her *not* shoot one night. Unless, of course, he/she can get the mafia if/when we dont lynch them.

Also, why is jesternl on your list? I thought that he/she was an actor, unless I'm misremembering. Sorta feeling lazy though, so don't want to go re-read the whole thread to find out.

I'm feeling sorta suspicious of DP myself, that's why I targeted him last night, to get data on him, but that's okay, getting proof that Sketch is innocent is a reasonable trade-off I think.

Oh, and Antrax, as to the other possibility that you were told comes of joining me, that only happens sometimes, to some people. Depends on the circumstances. But that's all I'll say about it, before the mod lynches *me*.

Anyway, don't want day ending too soon, before everyone has had their say, so I won't vote yet, but my biggest fos is aimed at DP.

And that is all for now.

[MiriYami]

Bah.

I'd wanted to be a part of the final bandwagon. Silly me for sleeping late when most of the players in this game are in europe. :P

Well, having gone over everything, I agree:

vote:jesternl

And hey, since we needed the clearance of sketch to prove who our mafia was, i'm *glad* now that my vote got switched.

Unless Jesternl is our pumpkin and there are two mafia left, but wait, that doesnt work either, because antrax has been cleared, and he has now cleared dp, and oh, i guess jesternl *is* the last mafia.

And yeah, i did wonder about all the colors. :) Interesting to find out they actually had a use. :)

[MiriYami]

Okay, here's what I see. First, I see no reason for DP to reveal his role, as Antrax (the pumpkin) cleared him:

I can assure you DP is innocent, I aimed at him on night 3 and missed him on night 4.

Now that Antrax is dead and proven to be who he says he is, I personally at least take that as enough proof, as antrax also said taht if he aims at mafia he will hit them with 100% accuracy.

So, who hasn't been cleared yet? The only person who I see as uncleared independently is MikeAmok, who is claiming to be an actor. But, in improbable mafia, mightn't one of the mafia be an actor too? Just a thought.

I am unready to vote yet, but I will share my list of who has been cleared and by whom:

Beaudoin/IS: cleared by Jesternl, whose role was proven by his death
Dragon Phoenix: cleared by Antrax, whose role was proven by his death
Luna: Cleared by MiriYami, see below
Mike Amok: uncleared
MiriYami: Cleared by Antrax's, sketch's, mole's, and luna's corroboration of her story (among others iirc)
mole: cleared by MiriYami
sketchwick: cleared by MiriYami

If you disagree with any of these, please let me know and we can discuss. I'm also starting to wonder if Mike's use of color might be a quick pick-up on something the mason group was doing and he decided to do it too; I know I occasionally wondered about it and considered playing with the color tag because of it but was too lazy to do so; maybe he wasn't so lazy.

Anyway, what does everyone else think?

[MiriYami]

Well, IS, i find it highly unusual that you refuse to acknowledge that I wasn't cleared already -- various people ahve confirmed that I offered to have them join my group, and have either declined or accepted. Sketchwick was one of them, and the fact that he was given the choice to join me is proof enough that he can't be mafia (mafia cannot be trained). Mole has been given the option and has said that he will join me. Luna joined me. I am now the head of a 3-person mason lodge.

I actually went for Mole last night because I realized that his abilities were very much in line with what a special-role mafia might be, so I figured that I would see if he were trainable. As he is trainable, he cannot be mafia.

I am vaguely to rather suspicious of DP except for the whole targeting thing.

And hey, mightn't one of the mafia hide in the actors' guild? Seems a perfect place to me. Therefore, as IS has been cleared by Jesternl, I still think MikeAmok is reasonably likely to be mafia.

[MiriYami]

I was informed that some people would not be offered the option to join but would just be informed that they were joining. As such, making them give up their roles seems strange anyway. Others would be offered the join, but only if they gave up their roles. Other methods (that may or may not have come about yet) are out there too; Neo chose to join, so he may or may not have been required to give up his role; I'd also be interested in hearing from Mole whether he was required to give up his role.

I can tell you that if you continue to suspect me and lynch me, you will be wasting a lynch (unless there's something going on here that even I don't know about). Ah, well.

[MiriYami]

sketch, I'd rather you didn't block me, as my recruitment skills are the skills most likely to find us mafia. Proving your innocence at this point, when it's already proven, seems sorta strange; however, if you're trying to prove/disprove mine, I guess you can go ahead, but remember that we're losing one night of me getting another answer of "so-and-so does not want to leave his/her family."

And yes, sometimes someone is simply told that they join. When this is done, I suspect that their power is not taken away, as that would be unfair in the extreme (and though Quercitron has an obviously wild imagination, I refuse to believe that he would be that unfair to his players).

Anyway, if you think my innocence still needs proving, fine, but remember that, among other things, I provided extra data (that I didn't need to provide at all; no one knew what my role was at the time) to help with the lynching of groza/ralph, who was mafia. I know, that can be done by a mafia, but not usually by revealing role; were I mafia and to do that, I would be much more likely to do this without revealing nearly so much data, or to semi-quietly join the bandwagon and then say later, "but I helped lynch so-and-so," rather than exposing my entire role.

Anyway, that's my take on things. I'm really not entirely sure who is mafia; otoh, we have seven people, of whom probably only one is mafia (seeing as how we've gotten three mafia in a 25-person game). Which means that even if we screw up today, we still have a chance at winning. In fact, if we lynch every day, we have until day 10 to win; if we don't, we have until day 12 to win. Not that I'm advocating not lynching, mind you, unless more people think that it's a good idea.

Does anyone have real information that would lead us to the mafia? If so, please share it!

[MiriYami]

I'm only too happy to die for my town in most cases. However, I feel like this is one place where I'm more useful alive than dead. I'm the last quasi-investigative role! Without me, you're all shooting in the dark.

However, if you really do need me to die to believe me, then be my guest.

I was planning on inviting Mike tonight, as I'm starting to feel that his role holds less water -- until I realized that actually most of us are potentially suspicious as godfather because of the whole appearing innocent thing. However, as Mike hasn't even been proven innocent once, I was still planning on that route, but if someone wants me to invite someone else, feel free.

[MiriYami]

I dunno, DP, you ask for a chance to explain your role, and then basically say you can't because that will make it obsolete. This sounds awfully suspicious to me. On the other hand, I don't know if antrax's laser would target a godfather -- if his aiming basically works like an investigative role, it wouldn't. I still think everyone in my group is innocent, as no mafia can be trained -- I doubt the godfather would be any more trainable than any other mafia, but I'm not 100% positive on that one either. And I'm certain that anyone else's investigation would come up innocent (if Quercitron is running the godfather that way).

Then again, there's Mike. No one has investigated him, ever, that we know of. Maybe he's mafia in the production group/masons. He certainly seems to be doing his best to be quiet/unobtrusive.

My mafia sense is tingling with both of them, so I'm not sure who to vote for. *rolls die* Okay, it's

vote: Mike

and attempt a recruit of DP tonight if we have a tonight.

[MiriYami]

Meh, are we not gonna lynch today? I won't vote for sketch because I think he's innocent, and I'm on the only other bandwagon around.

Argh. Oh well. I'm certainly not changing my vote.

[MiriYami]

Meh. I got distracted for the past 24 hours by a new game I just bought (Roller Coaster Tycoon). And before that, I was waiting on everyone *else* to see who/what they got.

I attempted to recruit DP. He did not join. No reason was given, but I have never had an innocent not given an offer to join yet. Unfortunately, that doesnt mean that he's guilty, but nor does it mean that he's innocent.

DP, whatever your ability, I trust you even less now than I did before.

Luna, were you blocked in the night?

That is all.

[MiriYami]

There is one problem with your defense, DP: everyone else was given overnight to decide, to the extent that when Mole chose to join, he had to wait until the *next* night before officially joining. If you had been given that choice, I would have been told that you were thinking about it and would tell me the next night.

Also, I thought of another thing: maybe Antrax was unable to target you because you are the Godfather, and therefore, are immune to most forms of inquiry. In fact, that would fit quite appropriately with the fact that I was not told *why* you didn't join.

Therefore, based on this plus your obvious lie (claiming to have been given the choice when you weren't based on the way this has worked since the beginning), I will:

vote: Quercitron

Anyone else willing to join me to rid the town of mafia scum?

[MiriYami]

Meh. Very tired brain connected to very tired fingers. I

meant

to do this:

Vote: Dragon Phoenix

NOW, anyone else willing to help me rid the town of mafia scum? :)

[MiriYami]

I was told immediately about Luna's joining, but then, she was not given the choice in whether to join or not; she stated this specifically, and it is why she still has her ability. DP first claimed that he was given a choice and declined, then *later* claimed that he never received the choice because he sent a pre-emptive email to the mod declining the invite. It all strikes of inconsistency to me, personally.

And DP, the only thing about the response that indicated that you were mafia was that you weren't admitted, and nothing was said about your likelihood of guilt or innocence. For EVERYONE else, I got responses that at least indicated my feelings about the person who had just refused membership -- like, declines joining but seems innocent, doesn't join because he doesnt want to leave his family, etc.

And also, your whole thing about not being able to tell us your role seems like junk to me (I just realized) because *no one else* has had a role with such a condition. And every time we ask you to defend yourself, you refuse. So, yeah, your one-off ability could be of use to us in the endgame, you claim. Well, newsflash: we ARE in the endgame! Use it or lose it, buddy, but I personally think that you're really the Godfather mafia type and that Antrax's ass worked exactly like any other investigator in the game, therefore allowing him to miss you because you're the Godfather.

[MiriYami]

Okay, I have had some clarification from our mod that makes DS look a little less guilty in my eyes. That is, a townie *can* be targeted and can automatically not join. I am asking for clarification of a second factor; as soon as I have it, I will share it.

However, given my other suspicions of DP, I will not unvote at this point, unless my other clarification comes through in a direction I don't expect.

That is all for now.

[MiriYami]

Those doubts are starting to go away again, as I have received clarification of the last point I wanted it on. Were your claimed pre-emptive refusal to have been the reason you didn't join, I would have been told that you had been offered and had refused. However, this is not what I was told, which means that you are either townie who just didn't join (and given the lack of *any* of these so far, I somewhat doubt it) or you are mafia. What I mean by my parenthetical statement is that, even though it is possible for this to happen, the lack of it happening so far suggests to me that there is a low probability of it happening. What I am picturing is a six-sided die, with one meaning don't join, 2 and 3 meaning do join, 4-6 meaning offer of join but lose ability. Or something like that.

This renews my suspicion of you, DP. I'd suggest a role reveal right now -- and it better be convincing.

That is all.

[MiriYami]

Sorry for the double post, but Antrax (or anyone else), do you know when Luna gets back?

Thanks!

[MiriYami]

I don't buy that, DP. I mean, you chickened out? Please! You're an active and agressive player, and I can't see you chickening out from just about anything. And we have enough players left that losing one extra innocent wouldn't have killed the town.

Besides, claiming a role like that is very convenient for you -- you've never used it, of course, so there's no way to prove it. I don't believe you, sorry.

My vote stands.

[MiriYami]

I will not vote for sketch simply because I offered him to join and he had the choice. This means that he *cannot* be mafia (unless we have a spy hereabouts). I have had a feeling about you for a while dp, and with this evidence (which I tried to get the night Moles set up his "smoke and mirrors" thing but it got redirected), I am (almost) convinced that you are mafia.

That is all for now.

[MiriYami]

Okay, we have left alive:

MiriYami
Sketchwick
Luna
MikeAmok

All have been invited; some have chosen to join, some have not. But all have been given the choice.

Therefore, there's a spy around. But who?

Sketch's ability does seem to be a mafia-ish ability. But so does Luna's. I know I'm innocent, and I've had multiple people say that I'm not terribly suspect. And as the rest of the actors were innocent, I feel that Mike is *less* likely to be suspect.

I think it is most likely that Sketch is mafia because he did not accept the invite; I know he said it was because he didn't want to lose his (admittedly relatively useful) ability, but I wonder if part of that ability was that he is mafia.

But then, Luna with her occasional puppet vote, looks kinda suspicious now too.

Meh.

No vote for now.

[MiriYami]

Okay, news of a sort: I have to leave for a whiles. Sunday will be my last day with access. So, if anyone else has posted info by then, I will post a vote, and then find out how things came out when I get back. And if not, I won't be able to vote.

I don't know for sure how long I'll be gone, but it'll be at least a week and possibly as long as a month, or maybe even longer.

That is all.

[MiriYami]

Well, I got an extra 12 hours or so, but its time now to pack my computer, and still nothing.

Given my various odd suspicions, I will

vote: sketchwick

. I will be happy to change my vote when I get back, or someone else might post to change my vote for me; if someone else posts for me, they will either know my password and post as me or will be someone with Toon in their nick or personal description.

So, I'm out, I'll talk to you later.

[MiriYami]

Well, I'm back. Actually, I was back a couple weeks ago, but this place was gone.

I'm glad I didn't miss the end! My vote stands.

Luna, I hope you show up soon.

Mod, what happens if Luna doesnt show up and we don't get either a clear majority or a tie? Just to be devil's advocate.

[MiriYami]

Hmmm...my reason for voting Sketchwick is stuck on my pute, which is still packed. I am posting from a friend's computer. However, I remember feeling that Sketch's role was the most suspicious of all the roles. I consider Mike squeaky clean as part of the cast of Joseph; Luna is almost as clean as a member of my group. Therefore, I voted for you, Sketchwick.

All for now. Waiting for Luna's replacement to show up.