Labyrinth Mafia (Endgame)

[Wisdom]

hai
what do i need to know

[Wisdom]

im Hoggle

If sarah dies on n1 or n2 i die in her place
However n3 onwards if i die sarah also dies

I have no clue about the flavor and havent read shit besides the op so any input about whats happening would be great

[Wisdom]

VOTE: chickadee

[Wisdom]

Town: {nancy, tw, reality}
Nulltown: {sajj, Wheme}
Nullscum: {random, Shoshin}
Scum: {chickadee}

gut reads from reading d4

[Wisdom]

chick's claim feels like bs
Why would rc make her 1shot
And on top of that she supposedly used it on someone whose flavor was in the thread already

[Wisdom]

wheme feels like usual wheme and nancy's points are crap like usual

and shosin feels like manipulative scum and her claim is also most likely fake given my slot was a partial bodyguard for two nights

[Wisdom]

lel
looks like i hit a nerve
chick/shoshin are a given

[Wisdom]

how come nobody questioned the 1shot
Flavor cops are weak, whats the point of making them near useless

[Wisdom]

minuet doesnt matter, you continue being a moonlogic person and i continue not rolling scum against you so i can enjoy it

[Wisdom]

hi random
Both Chick and Shoshin are scum, vote with me

[Wisdom]

give me a reason why chick is town, nancy

[Wisdom]

Read 2762 and tell me where it says "im voting random because im sheeping shoshin"

Independent scumreads are a thing
Bussing is a thing

@nancy

[Wisdom]

Speaking of which

random did you use a communicative on nico n2 or not

[Wisdom]

i don't tend to go for svs, and if me and sho were scum with creature already down would it rly make sense to push each other this hard?

Yes actually, you might not go for it but manipulation-based players like shoshin feed off the towncred bussing gives

[Wisdom]

I mean youre not really pushing her, while shes been deathtunneling you
It fits

[Wisdom]

again, she didnt sheep
She voted random because she had a communicative action on nico and it could only be random, who claimed he had done nothing.
Who was voting random doesnt matter.

[Wisdom]

As for wheme im like 99.9% sure youre misunderstanding something, especially since reality doesnt seem to share your view

[Wisdom]

whatever you say

now vote chick

[Wisdom]

sure
Maybe she isnt, but random was trying to argue it doesn't make sense, so

[Wisdom]

pls
In necromancer i was right about every read bar srceenplay

[Wisdom]

target with what
Read the claim again

[Wisdom]

do you have comprehension issues
Both parts of my role are passive - if whoever sarah was was to be killed on the first two nights, she would live and i would die
If sarah still lived and i died on n3/n4/etc, sarah would also die with me
There is no targetting anyone involved

[Wisdom]

and in case it wasnt clear, it isnt specified who sarah was
Taly didnt know what player had her

[Wisdom]

Had ank claimed the protective result when shoshin claimed the bg on her?

[Wisdom]

Had ank claimed the protective result when shoshin claimed the bg on her?

nvm, shoshin claimed it first
Idk, in general those results on nico are confusing, the communicative one is still unresolved

[Wisdom]

In what world does scum!Shoshin protect the target she wants dead?

mastina did it in minuet, remember?

[Wisdom]

In what world does scum!Shoshin protect the target she wants dead?

mastina did it in minuet, remember?

Mastina was a Mafia vig, that’s not a protective

same thing
A usually town role, making it appear like it was used in a town way

[Wisdom]

no she doesnt
And what do you mean, my understanding is that mechanics are in her favor, not the opposite

[Wisdom]

Oh right, I completely forgot about that but whole "nobody deserved my protecting" farce

I just need to understand what caused the n2 nico protecting then, otherwise she's 100% scum

[Wisdom]

Macho cop, dude

[Wisdom]

Macho = cant be protected

[Wisdom]

though since nico was macho i don't know if reality should be seeing a protective action there

wouldnt the protective fail? Do investigatives see failed actions? I dont think they do

[Wisdom]

Even if they failed?

[Wisdom]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Macho

it says that they would be seen

youre right

[Wisdom]

commander shouldn't show up to reality since he was blocked
unless rc messed it up

[Wisdom]

Nancy read sajj's post. I was wrong about that.

[Wisdom]

d3 you mean

[Wisdom]

nancy i was wrong, read wiki entry for macho

[Wisdom]

ank can you ask rc whether you can see blocked actions/whether he made an error n2 about the communicative

[Wisdom]

we're talking about n2 nancy

[Wisdom]

now try mafiawiki

[Wisdom]

It negates the effects of a Doctor or Bodyguard protecting it, although both would still be seen as having visited a Macho role.

[Wisdom]

unless the mod derped and showed him the failed action

[Wisdom]

dont see why random would lie about that

[Wisdom]

way more likely that cs returned communicative and the mod mistakenly included it in the result despite the jailing

[Wisdom]

Ask him if you should be seeing a blocked action

[Wisdom]

Neighbourizers recruit.

says who, btw? Neighborhoods are a means to communicate, not cults

[Wisdom]

reality is speculating as well

[Wisdom]

neighborizer does not recruit into a group of same alignment, like a masonry or a cult
They create a private space for communication
I call that a communicative role

[Wisdom]

exactly

[Wisdom]

ank do you think random would lie about sending a message
Why was that result an incentive to vote him

[Wisdom]

tw definitely, random most likely if chick and you are scum like i expect

[Wisdom]

Wisdom don't you know how I operate by now

meaning?

[Wisdom]

because i say so

[Wisdom]

whatever you do you're not saving chick today

[Wisdom]

i dont explain obvious things
Play with tw enough and youll know when hes town

[Wisdom]

so basically whoever figured out youre scum

[Wisdom]

Why is chick town, shoshin?

[Wisdom]

lol i knew it
Get roped

[Wisdom]

she just doesnt know i never explain my reads and thinks im pushable
she will learn

[Wisdom]

Make her explain why chick is town. She cant bs out of it if its not me asking

[Wisdom]

Or, you decided that you can sell not targeting anyone as a towntell and went for it

[Wisdom]

Like, why do you not apply your logic to me? I could have made up a million reasons to townread tw, especially if i was scum and thus knew for a fact hes town. Yet you instantly assume i cant explain it.

So how is it different when people dont buy your "didnt target anyone" thing?

[Wisdom]

ok enough theory more lynching chick

[Wisdom]

I don’t see you and Chick being w/w together but I could be wrong

you are

[Wisdom]

I don’t see you and Chick being w/w together but I could be wrong

you are

Not thinking you’re scum doesn’t mean this is persuasive. Try harder.

Give me your moonlogic about why theyre not scum together

[Wisdom]

Wisdom's townread on the worst is fake

How is it different than, say, my townread on Reality? I havent explained that one either

[Wisdom]

Then you are going to eternally scumread me

However i feel like you're smart enough to factor in different playstyles when reading people instead of relying in simplicities like "town explain things, scum don't", ie your read on me is bs

[Wisdom]

poe, theyre both scummy, and shoshin is actively pushing counterwagons
now remind me why you think they arent together

@nancy

[Wisdom]

And he's pushing a mislynch (me) while defending scum (Random).

correction, im pushing a scumlynch (chick)
But youre cute trying to twist things

[Wisdom]

oh yay more spam incoming

nancy id tell you not to do it but youll most likely not listen

[Wisdom]

poe, theyre both scummy, and shoshin is actively pushing counterwagons
now remind me why you think they arent together

@nancy

[Wisdom]

Which interactions?

[Wisdom]

Town: {nancy, tw, reality}
Nulltown: {sajj, Wheme}
Nullscum: {random, Shoshin}
Scum: {chickadee}

[Wisdom]

no clue, why?

[Wisdom]

talk to me

[Wisdom]

Which interactions?

Chick and Shoshin. It’s some pretty impressive scum theater if you’re right.

Quote/Link them please?

[Wisdom]

i dont follow
You think scum rb blocked nancy so she didnt jail cs and he showed up as communicative to you?

[Wisdom]

CShep dying makes perfect sense with a scum roleblocker

If Shoshin was town, then she would have been blocked.

?
Shoshin claimed she targeted nobody n3

[Wisdom]

Ah I see but why even bother with doing that when guarantee a scum kill?

For the same reason mastina and ank did it in Minuet
Ank jailed Purr while mastina shot Purr - mastina knew shes wasting a kill but she thought that would give her huge cred because she would claim she was blocked by scum

In the same way, shoshin would go "I am a doc, i protected nico" and she would be locktown forever

[Wisdom]

but did scum know that during n3

you mean that if they dont have a blocker they wouldn't shoot cshep because of protection fear?

[Wisdom]

idk, gif was flipped at that point, meaning they knew the jk is disabled
If shoshin is scum theyd assume theres no other protective, no?

[Wisdom]

or like, they also shot the outed cop without caring about protection
If they had a blocker, theyd block her and shoot elsewhere

[Wisdom]

And? Doesnt that just point at shosin being scum and thus not a danger to stopping the cshep kill?

[Wisdom]

yeah but how is the blocker relevant

[Wisdom]

so youre saying thay either shes town and they have a blocker or shes scum, right?

[Wisdom]

because it felt like you were saying they have a blocker even if she's scum

[Wisdom]

because shes scum maybe?

[Wisdom]

perhaps
But shes definitely with chick

[Wisdom]

Actually the way she doesnt want to lynch chick before random points to random being town; once random flips town she will conveniently forget her read on chick and push elsewhere

[Wisdom]

tw there was already an explanation provided

[Wisdom]

gambit
she saves the same person her team kills
she gets locktown status forever

mastina and ank attempted the same thing in minuet

[Wisdom]

yeah

[Wisdom]

besides it doesnt make sense for any bg to exist since i exist

[Wisdom]

VOTE: shoshin

[Wisdom]

random will vote this based on his posts, so we just need nancy or wheme on board

[Wisdom]

Because he wasnt
It was csheep and the mod derped

[Wisdom]

Speaking of which

random did you use a communicative on nico n2 or not

not intentionally but i'll double check

[Wisdom]

besides why the hell would random send a message to nico
And why would he lie about doing it
Doesnt make any sense

[Wisdom]

how do people feel about the fact Shoshin claimed bg in her pt with CShep tho

bg is a better fakeclaim because it makes the others want to leave you alive in case you autoresolve
Or maybe it fit her flavor claim better than doc
Or maybe rc literally gave her a bg fakeclaim

[Wisdom]

oh come on tw
Its chick and her, it cant be anyone else

[Wisdom]

nancy dont make me repeat the same things one million times

[Wisdom]

why would he lie about sending a message
would you suspect him if he had said he sent a message
Its a fucking message

[Wisdom]

Like, imagine you are scum, and for some reason, you sent a message to someone
Come massclaim, will you say you did nothing (and risk getting caught) or just out you sent a message (which is harmless and nobody will suspect you for it)?
Use your brain ffs

[Wisdom]

nancy dont make me repeat the same things one million times

You’re pushing this too hard based on unproven assumptions. RC would have messaged me back if my NA didn’t go through. I’m calling bullshit on this.

This is wrong on many levels.
First of all, the mod derp is not YOUR action, is his listing CShep's action in Reality's result.
Second, the mods do NOT tell people if their actions succeeded, so no, he would tell you nothing.
Concentrate, nancy. Im using common sense.

[Wisdom]

remind me not to play with you again. Even yume is more bearable

[Wisdom]

this is the last time ill try
One more message that indicates you refuse to use your brain and im ignoring you for the rest of the game and blacklisting you

Reality got a communicative action on Nico.
Cshep used a communicative action on Nico.
There is no other claimed communicative action on Nico.

What are the possibilities here?
A. Someone obscured using a communicative action on Nico. That would be random, obscuring sending a message to Nico.
B. RC mistakenly included CShep's action in Reality's report despite CShep being jailed by you.


How likely is A? Not very. A message is not an implicating action. Random has no scum motivation to hide such an action, when it will just get him in trouble if an investigative caught the action (like it happened).

How likely is B? Very. RC often derps, with most recent example this very day, where he sent a result he should have sent on D1. Its easy to imagine he forgot to remove the action from the result while resolving.

Therefore, anyone with a brain understands that B is way more likely than A. It has nothing to do with my alignment, with random, or wih anyone else. Its common fucking sense.

[Wisdom]

Wisdom, why don't you want to lynch chick first?

Either is fine, but shoshin is way better scum while i dont imagine you will let chick win lylo even if im gone

[Wisdom]

That's fine, Wisdom. Why can't Random be scum?

because its you and chick
No matter how many times you repeat youre achieving nothing

[Wisdom]

It’s not really similar to Ank/Mastina because they already knew the outcome.

[Wisdom]

Wisdom, why don't you want to lynch chick first?

bc chick isnt shitting up the thread like shoshin is

hi wisdom

i would say that a reason for chick lynch.
going by claims it would be more beneficial to lynch now vt claim of chick than possible protective shoshin.

I dont mind
So far ive been the only person trying to lynch chick so its not me you have to convince

[Wisdom]

lol

but seriously, maybe im this bad at explaining

If someone else can make nancy see sense please do it

We need to work together here

[Wisdom]

i'm only judging base on mechanical stuff and he looks worse than chick is.

how
One is a messenger and the other is a 1shot flavor cop who claimed a result everyone already knew
How is random possibly worse than that

[Wisdom]

dat bus tho
comes out of lurking to vote her buddy so she doesnt miss out on cred

[Wisdom]

yeah there was already someone saying there is exactly one scum in that, i think it was the worst?
and yeah, its chick

[Wisdom]

Why the hell does identity cop gets nerfed to 1shot
Its already a useless role

Also, random is a proven messenger so it's not a provided fakeclaim
If hes scum he does have the power to message

[Wisdom]

Which sounds ridiculously weak in a game full of prs so no

Chick has some other strong scum role and the 1shot flavor cop is bs she made up

[Wisdom]

Especially when you consider she outed a result that was already in the thread, and managed to get the name wrong on top of it

[Wisdom]

anyway just read her play
and her predecessor play
Even if we ignore the claim this is just not town

[Wisdom]

Unofficial VC

Shoshin (4): Reality Check, Wisdom, randomidget, Chickadee
Wisdom (2): Nancy Drew 39, Shoshin
Chickadee (1): WhemeStar

Not voting: Scioness Sajj, Nancy Drew 39, the worst

5 to lynch

[Wisdom]

?

[Wisdom]

what
Deaths resolve last, gif was still alive when your jail resolved

[Wisdom]

lmao
lynch this already

[Wisdom]

Ive explained in much more than needed detail why this obviously was a mod derp and i think everyone other than nancy was getting it anyway

But nooo, shoshin tries to twist it into "too much information"

You cant be more obviously scum even if you try to

[Wisdom]

check literally any town game of mine then try again

[Wisdom]

i knew youd say that as well

so predictable

[Wisdom]

Nancy when are you going to vote shoshin

[Wisdom]

that's not how nar works but whatever

[Wisdom]

VOTE: chick

that works too

[Wisdom]

what are you waiting for random?

[Wisdom]

Who is scum with chick if shoshin isnt, nancy?

Cmon. Its not a reach. You just dont understand it.

[Wisdom]

what are you waiting for random?

figure out which of the two is a better lynch
chick is probs a stronger PR but shoshin shit sup the thread more

We're killing both anyway. Sajj will take care of shoshin

[Wisdom]

yep and they have a scum-scum neighborhood

[Wisdom]

If sajj doesnt shoot shoshin we're lynching shoshin
No fucking way this stays alive

[Wisdom]

Hammer please.

[Wisdom]

I cant stand to read any more shoshin posts

[Wisdom]

Nancy you have the wrong idea again. Chick was fakeclaiming, she has something stronger.

[Wisdom]

You cannot prove shit

[Wisdom]

Oh i don't know, whats the harm in letting scum live?

[Wisdom]

Nancy, can you explain how Chick/Sajj can't be aligned with each other?

What?

Sajj if Chick flips red, promise you’ll shoot Shoshin.

Can you promise this or I want Shoshin lynched instead. I would just prefer to wait for Chick flip.

This. If Sajj doesnt promise shes shooting shoshin we are lynching shoshin instead.

[Wisdom]

ank hammer chick

[Wisdom]

i just hope sajj isnt scum
Otherwise we're fine

[Wisdom]

Then we're good, she shoots shoshin and it's game over or one scum left which should be easy

[Wisdom]

sajj is not clear, nancy
You saw a mafia vig in minuet

[Wisdom]

sajj explain yourself

[Wisdom]

Tbh

If Shoshin doesn't die tonight, Sajj gets powerlynched after her

Actually before

VOTE: sajj

[Wisdom]

1shot mafia vig
Makes sense that mafia vig would be 1shot

[Wisdom]

We repeatedly told you that if you dont shoot shoshin we should lynch her
You could have told us you cant shoot her and you didnt
You are scum with her

[Wisdom]

we dont
Just lynch sajj and shoshin and win

[Wisdom]

wheme/nancy hammer pls

[Wisdom]

sure

[Wisdom]

Im not big on setup spec
Maybe there are only 3 scum to balance
Though town has plenty of power to counter anyway
What i do know is that nancy, tw and random are town and you and shosin are obvscum

[Wisdom]

oh thats a good point i guess

scum doc is useless without a vig
But its also pretty useless just for a 1shot vig
Maybe youre an sk?

[Wisdom]

Either way im lynching you over shoshin because you lied and that held non-town motivation
"you wouldnt believe me" is bs
We wouldnt believe you then, we dont believe you now

[Wisdom]

This game is solved.

I'm town
Wisdom is obvtown
Random is obvtown
I strongly believe the townread on the worst is sheepable.

That leaves three slots. Either there is two scum left and it doesn't matter which order, or there is three and it still doesn't matter.

Daily reminder

[Wisdom]

tw i don't fucking bus chick when game is full of scummy people
I don't kill reality whom i have in my pocket
I don't make any sense as scum
Pls dont be bad

[Wisdom]

he changes his meta EVERY damn game so maybe??
she was going down honestly

She had zero votes when i came in, i voted her and nobody other than wheme was listening to me
I could have gotten random or wheme or even you lynched on a whim, you know im capable, why push chick?

[Wisdom]

reality is the person that knows me the best in this game and she was townlocking me
Theres no universe i make that kill

[Wisdom]

And if reality is "the obvious kill" you wouldnt target nancy, would you?

[Wisdom]

sajj and if theres another, wheme
but you arent, so

[Wisdom]

dude

[Wisdom]

tw are you scum
I cant fathom you believing i could be scum here

[Wisdom]

This wifom bs is weak as hell
Youve played with me
You know my capabilities and what im likely to do and not do
What youre pushing here is not realistic
Tell me why i killed reality

[Wisdom]

tw can you use your gladiate just to make sure you actually have it
its useless anyway

[Wisdom]

VOTE: shoshin

[Wisdom]

if youre town stop advocatong for your lynch thanks

[Wisdom]

"reads only d4"
lol'd

[Wisdom]

Ive read the whole game, shoshin
I had only read d4 when i made my few first posts

[Wisdom]

then who is scum shoshin? I refuse to consider Nancy and tw and wheme are unlikely

[Wisdom]

you make the most sense as scum with chick and in general
I dont particularly care about why you claimed bg

[Wisdom]

Ive seen a game that had it

[Wisdom]

true

[Wisdom]

other than the fact we dont know sajj didnt make up her "oh i just got the loud thing", i thought that was a decent point

[Wisdom]

all i know is that you and random are town
Idk anymore about tw and wheme
Shoshin continues feeling like she wants to force her agentas through

@nancy

[Wisdom]

As for the hood, why are we assuming that Chick and Random didn't fake being in a hood together? Why couldn't Chick be in the same hood with Reality/Wheme? And Random just be scum who isn't even in a hood?

this makes absolutely no sense
Reality and Wheme shared a neighborhood because they also shared a role, chick had no reason to be there
Reality wouldnt lie about it
Just accept random is town instead of trying to find ways for him to be scum

[Wisdom]

Wisdom, I'm not saying Reality lied about anything... Reality was the one who suggested that scum had access to their neighborhood...

quote?

[Wisdom]

yes, thats a hammer

random, wheme, tw, nancy

[Wisdom]

If Sajj flips red and the game doesn’t end, lynch Shoshin. If he flips green, then lynch Wheme.

Isnt that backwards? If sajj is red, shes not likely scum with shoshin because maf protective makes no sense without some town killing ability

[Wisdom]

nico n2, nobody n3, nancy n4
i don't remember n1

[Wisdom]

her action failed on n2 (she targeted cshep)

[Wisdom]

shoshin if you are town you are absolutely targeting someone
It will help the game immensely if you flip
Im accepting no bs excuses tomorrow

[Wisdom]

though its more likely youre scum and youre just saying this to cover for yet another night without a save, but yeah

[Wisdom]

not how this works

[Wisdom]

were you town

[Wisdom]

shoshin/wheme or shoshin/tw?

[Wisdom]

neighbors with scum

[Wisdom]

werent there only two hoods
The others were caused by a power i thought

[Wisdom]

dead, you killed him nancy

[Wisdom]

her*

[Wisdom]

yeah i wish he had gladiated today

[Wisdom]

nancy this isnt your first game

once you hammer you cant take it back, you know that

[Wisdom]

i think shoshin is a safe bet but which out of wheme/tw is gonna be hard
hopefully i wont be alive for that

[Wisdom]

not voting because probably lylo but consider my vote on shoshin

[Wisdom]

Sell me on a scumteam that doesnt contain you

[Wisdom]

nancy, its shoshin and tw
Unless its only one scum left, in which case it's just shoshin

[Wisdom]

Don't waste my time if there's no way you're going to change your mind.

Youre not telling us who the scumteam is

[Wisdom]

Like, your only option is to push it's tw solo but youre not even doing that
So its prolly both of you

[Wisdom]

more likely than nancy or random being scum, yep

[Wisdom]

I already answered that

[Wisdom]

As for the hood, why are we assuming that Chick and Random didn't fake being in a hood together? Why couldn't Chick be in the same hood with Reality/Wheme? And Random just be scum who isn't even in a hood?

this makes absolutely no sense
Reality and Wheme shared a neighborhood because they also shared a role, chick had no reason to be there
Reality wouldnt lie about it
Just accept random is town instead of trying to find ways for him to be scum