Forgotten Hourglass [Game Over]

[Sakura Hana]

At this point i just wanna lynch both Muffin and Kats to stop the caps spam.

[Sakura Hana]

Like seriously it's annoying me.

[Sakura Hana]

If you guys are gonna behave like this then i rather you be dead.

[Sakura Hana]

I stg if i see more caps spam im out.

[Sakura Hana]

Hey spiffeh who's scum

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: TBG

[Sakura Hana]

3 votes, guys. Not hard.

4 now!

[Sakura Hana]

Sakura you will regret that don’t give in to the dark side

Also can you at least explain why you’re making the switch?

Because i trust Kats, Katsuki usually fake claims (if it is indeed a fake claim) for a reason.

[Sakura Hana]

Scum Neighborizer Poisoner?
Nah even if i stretch it like that it doesnt make sense.

[Sakura Hana]

Scum Neighborizer Poisoner?
Nah even if i stretch it like that it doesnt make sense.

Thoughts on voting TBG vs Prof Fridays?

My vote is enough.

[Sakura Hana]

I was more wondering why you're voting one over the other, but... okay?

oh i thought you were asking me who i wanted to vote, so i thought it was obvious since i was voting TBG.

[Sakura Hana]

I really dont have anything of more substance other than I feel like TBG is more likely to flip scum tho.

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: Kokichi
k

[Sakura Hana]

Im having some issues with my IP and Spamhaus apparently, talking with my ISP to try and solve it, but for the time being im pre-emptively going V/LA because i cant post without a VPN until this is solved. I can still read however.

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: Maria
I believe Kats

[Sakura Hana]

Why arent we lynching the guilty.
Katsuki fake claimed once in Minuet's Trio and even that got us a scum lynch, but i dont think it's a fake claim.

From my PoV, if all the investigatives were gunsmiths then we wouldnt be able to find the scum poisoner, and Kats role seems to be designed exactly for that purpose, plus the gunsmiths act as millers to each other, and if there's a scum gunsmith, it's purpose is probably to find the town ones.

Meanwhile Katsuki's claiming main character, he's also been poisoned, no one has claimed to have poisoned Kats so it came from scum, Kats inno on muffin even if fake must've been believed by scum enough to consider him a threat worth poisoning.

So I trust that Katsuki's actually a cop with a guilty on MariaR

[Sakura Hana]

He already said he's flipping Neighborizing JOAT

[Sakura Hana]

Why arent we lynching the guilty.

Because it's Katsuki

Boring

[Sakura Hana]

Ah right.
Katsuki fake claimed a guilty on Dunn back on Minuet's Trio, I guess that's why Dunn dislikes Katsuki so much.

[Sakura Hana]

My logic is still sound regardless, if scum had any reason to disbelieve Katsuki, then Katsuki wouldn't be poisoned, ergo, Dunn and muffin are town, possibly Wisdom too.
MariaR is also scum.

[Sakura Hana]

I mean, if scum does have a gunsmith AND a poisoner it makes Katsuki's role more believable.

[Sakura Hana]

when the scumteam is likely 3 people no it doesn't.

No, it is actually MORE believable if the scumteam is 3 people
We have a flipped roleblocker.
We have an existing poisoner.
We have a likely scum gunsmith.

out of those 3 the only one who actually gives any meaningful result is the roleblocker
the gunsmith is the equivalent to a scum miller for the other gunsmiths, so it's hard to tell if town/scum gunsmith from a gunsmith result.
the poisoner is the equivalent to a scum godfather for the other gunsmiths.

So only 1 scum actually gives any meaningful result to the gunsmiths and town doesnt seem to have any other way to figure out who's scum other than by day play entirely coz the investigatives are useless.
So an alignment cop can easily find the scum gunsmith and the scum poisoner and tell the difference, likewise can find a town gunsmith

Anyone with a "not gun" result can still be a scum poisoner
Anyone with a "gun" result that is a claimed gunsmith can still be a scum gunsmith.
An alignment cop doesnt care they'll get the alignment and i doubt there are millers or godfathers if the gunsmiths are already in a bad situation wrt investigations.

Just like the vanilla cops of last game, any non vanilla result didnt mean much for the town.

Ergo, i believe that Katsuki is the role he is claiming. And if the inno on muffin was enough to cause scum to poison him, i also believe that muffin is conf town.

[Sakura Hana]

Basically if you believe katsuki is fake claiming you have to believe that the town is more at a disadvantage than it already is wrt investigatives.

[Sakura Hana]

Yeah poisoner is totally not a godfather.

Poisoners

and

Doctors

do not have guns

[Sakura Hana]

Ok so you get everyone to claim if they have a gun or not then you know poisoner has to be in the people without guns.
All done

we currently have 4-5 ppl claimed to have guns
that leaves 10-9 ppl without guns.

Good luck PoEing the later.
Now can we please lynch player that has an alignment cop guilty on them?

[Sakura Hana]

You know what i also just realized.
That if the poisoner is the scum's Main character, anyone that doesnt have a gun and gets revealed as non MC is conf town LMAO.

[Sakura Hana]

Not really?
When known that scum can use their ability AND their kill what do you think it's more dangerous, the scum poisoner or the scum gunsmith.

Basically I feel that if MariaR was a gunsmith she'd have mentioned she has a gun already considering it was requested, and considering the guilty hanging on her i believe it's highly likely she's the scum poisoner.

In other words i think leaving her alive an extra day will allow scum to double kill tonight (even if one of the kills is delayed) and considering she's screwed anyways i doubt she'd do us the favor of eliminating one of the gunsmiths.

[Sakura Hana]

I do admit that's immature of him.
But is it mature of you to ignore a guilty because of it?

[Sakura Hana]

I'm not ignoring it because I dislike him, I'm ignoring it because I don't believe him

Well at the very least scum did certainly believe his inno on muffin enough to poison him, to consider him a threat.
That's another reason I think you're town, if you legit dont believe him i doubt you'd have taken action against him as scum and would instead continue campaigning that he shouldnt be believed.

[Sakura Hana]

Doesnt change the point however, and makes the cop even more important, but oh well.
It still means that if someone has no gun and is not a main character they are conf town, but if all gunsmiths are town then there COULD be someone that's not a gunsmith and has a gone (or is fake claiming to be a gunsmith)

[Sakura Hana]

I see what muffin's driving at.

That's a legit scum claim LMAO

[Sakura Hana]

Even if Katsuki's fake claiming MariaR scumslipped, nice one i didnt see that one muffin.

[Sakura Hana]

If you're going to get into semantics then explain to me why does a town player leave open the possibility that Katsuki's telling the truth about the guilty on them.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh.
So that's what happens when people leave out parts of quotes.

In any case, I still believe the guilty.

[Sakura Hana]

Well ill be here voting conf scum.
You have fun sitting there letting the scum poisoner i.e. MariaR get one last poison tonight.

[Sakura Hana]

Muffin why couldn’t you post like this for the entire game?

That's just how he plays.
Also do u have any comments about Katsuki getting poisoned after claiming a cop inno on muffin even tho everyone gave him shit for it and tried to lynch muffin anyways?

[Sakura Hana]

I'm starting to think Dunn is just being bias.

[Sakura Hana]

I'm starting to think Dunn is just being bias.

Bias on what?

Because of what happened in Minuet's Trio, a.k.a Katsuki fake claiming and because MariaR is your friend.

[Sakura Hana]

Yeah and when you found that out, your immediate thoughts were to lynch Katsuki's inno.

[Sakura Hana]

Gee is like... i wonder why he fake claims in the first place.

[Sakura Hana]

UNVOTE: Temporarily

[Sakura Hana]

So MariaR's the Poisoner as predicted.

[Sakura Hana]

Well there's your flip Dunn are u gonna continue pretending there's no guilty?

[Sakura Hana]

In any case u have the power to hammer, but muffin wanted some extra time, which is why i unvoted.

[Sakura Hana]

Hmm seems like Katsuki thought the poisoner was town, but what town poisons katsuki like wtf.

[Sakura Hana]

Actually nevermind he says that if there's 1 poisoner then the poisoner might be town.

[Sakura Hana]

Well time to read the Cupcake muffin hood

[Sakura Hana]

i cant tell, he says there that he used his cop on MariaR but neighborized Brian or something.

[Sakura Hana]

non sane cop shots in your 3 shot cop when this game already lacks investigatives?

That's as troll as me being a 2 shot naive (unknown sanity) cop on tarot

[Sakura Hana]

"When I get home I'm claiming a guilty on maria. She needs to die."

The 'claiming' part makes me think it's fake

funnily enough I'm starting to actually come around on scum!Maria though lol

Ah yes you're right.

[Sakura Hana]

Anyway, Im sure Cupcake doesnt fake claim for no reason, he's usually right.
Too bad he didnt actually check MariaR and WHY THE FUCK DOES HE CHECK BRIAN

[Sakura Hana]

muffin is still 100% town regardless.

MUFFIN THAT MEANS UR TIME MAY BE SHORT PLEASE HELP

[Sakura Hana]

The more u want ppl to get off mariar the more i want to vote her again.

[Sakura Hana]

Dunn, seriously speaking do I have ANY reason to trust your read on MariaR?

[Sakura Hana]

You're 0/2

you mean 1/2?

[Sakura Hana]

VoteCount 1.10

Sakura Hana [1] - projectmatt
Nosferatu [2] - Ankamius, Nancy Drew 39
Wisdom [2] - Dunnstral x2
zMuffinMan [1] - Kokichi Oma

Myloninja13 [9] - Sakura Hana, Brian Skies, Moment, Nosferatu, Spiffeh, Purrcocet, Katsuki, Wisdom, zMuffinMan [LYNCH]

projectmatt [1] - TehBrawlGuy

Not Voting [2]

- Myloninja13, MariaR

With 17 alive it takes 9 votes to lynch.

Countdown to deadline: (expired on 2018-07-26 15:00:00)

[Sakura Hana]

No. Tbg flipped town then you got caught wrong on katsuki telling the truth

What does it matter if MariaR is scum?

[Sakura Hana]

Dunn, truthfully, have you never been fooled by scum MariaR?

[Sakura Hana]

I mean.
If anything my track record at reading MariaR is worst than most.
Considering i scumread her when she's town and townread her when she's scum.

So im trusting Katsuki and muffin who are better at the game than me.

[Sakura Hana]

But at the very least.
I admit that im not good at reading her.

[Sakura Hana]

and the wagon movement turned to tbg instead

You're welcome for that btw

[Sakura Hana]

You think I'm biased because she's my friend?

It's possible yes.
I'm not discounting it as a possibility due to how hard your defense is.

[Sakura Hana]

Alright I don't know what I did to be so unenjoyable to do that but I'm sorry to anyone that I upset this game because that was never my goal to upset anyone.

Disclaimer that i dont think you're unenjoyable I just think you're scum

[Sakura Hana]

@nancy

flavour claim (not role, i want to know your character) in your next post

What does a flavour claim even accomplish, by the way?

A lot actually

[Sakura Hana]

I would actually endorse a mass flavor claim.

[Sakura Hana]

I would actually endorse a mass flavor claim.

I know nothing about the flavour, have they been tied to roles at all this game?

I dont want to reveal my cards atm, but im just going to tell you that it IS a very good idea to do so.
Kokichi not wanting me to break the game open via mass flavor claim is sus.

[Sakura Hana]

Revival. I just checked it. Does that mean anything?

White Rain for me, im not 100% familiar with flavor but muffin is and he may be onto something.
The gunsmith roles are randomized regardless so flavor wont out anything that hurt town, but may out something that hurts scum.

[Sakura Hana]

the remaining main character is almost certainly scum poisoner and it's one of three people that includes nancy (4 if you dont believe mariar but there arent flavour fake claims)

Yeah that's what i imagined.

[Sakura Hana]

well kokichi's confirmed not the poisoner at least.

[Sakura Hana]

Kokichi's a person that has had accuracy reading MariaR, i do think tho that finding the poisoner is very important coz it increases the KPN in favor of scum.

[Sakura Hana]

Prof is confirmed to not be a main character wtf are u talking about.
He's not poisoner unless poisoner isnt a MC.

We need to find and lynch the poisoner or scum can double kill each night.

[Sakura Hana]

Wisdom found no gun on me btw.
I think...
imma ISO him and see if i can find it

[Sakura Hana]

oh and, sakura doesnt have a gun

[Sakura Hana]

as for the other thing, Nancy, these games have 3 main characters, generally for balance 2 will be town and 1 will be scum, specially if it's a scumteam of 3. Which means that the remaining MC must be scum.

[Sakura Hana]

Considering how Poisoner increases scum KPN, then poisoner should be the scum's main character, hence why the flavor claims.

[Sakura Hana]

What if the poisoner claimed gunsmith?

Poisoner has no gun, Gunsmiths do, so if a gunsmith inspects a claimed gunsmith and finds no gun then they are caught lying.

[Sakura Hana]

Dunn's a double voter tho, so if he has gun he's a scum DV, and not having a gun means he's a town DV, i doubt poisoner is also DV.

[Sakura Hana]

now which gunsmiths have been found with a gun?
the remaining 2 could go and check on gunsmiths to see if there's a poisoner claiming GS

[Sakura Hana]

the list is who has been checked so we have everyone accounted for on whether they have guns or not.

If someone claimed no gun and is found with one then they are scum.
If someone claimed GS and is found with no gun then they are scum.
If everyone's claims check out then we try to find the poisoner amongst the ppl without guns, and remember, the poisoner is likely a main character, so FG's daily announcements help us thin the pool down.

[Sakura Hana]

What am I the "only real option left" for?

for checking if u have a gun or not.

[Sakura Hana]

Okay

Purr: Checking Nancy
Kokichi: Checking Prof Fridays
Wisdom: Checking ???
Nos: Checking ???
Moment: Checking ???

Kokichi Oma

Sakura Hana

Nancy Drew 39

MariaR
Dunnstral

zMuffinMan

Wisdom
Moment
Spiffeh
Prof Fridays
Purrcocet
Nosferatu

projectmatt

did matt get checked already?

so i guess that dunn is the only real option left.

See here.

[Sakura Hana]

Look at you Kokichi, Organizing things and giving people orders like an actual Ultimate Supreme Leader.

[Sakura Hana]

I just realized that Dunn is back to being the old Dunn that I always liked.

[Sakura Hana]

Speaking of which, since when does sakura just tunnel somebody like this?

Guess you've never met the aggresive side of me.

[Sakura Hana]

To be fair i've only put like 10% effort this game.

[Sakura Hana]

In solving it I mean.

[Sakura Hana]

I also admit to explicitly voting TBG previous day phase for the sole purpose of shifting the wagons.

[Sakura Hana]

Maybe if part of D1 and D2 hadn't been a snooze fest and we didnt have 2 people yelling in all capsrage that made me just want to not even bother reading i'd be paying more attention to the stuff that happened.

[Sakura Hana]

Im liking the idea of a pmatt lynch
VOTE: pmatt

[Sakura Hana]

...

[Sakura Hana]

Hello Math, we're mass flavor claiming, what's your flavor.

[Sakura Hana]

as for the other thing, Nancy, these games have 3 main characters, generally for balance 2 will be town and 1 will be scum, specially if it's a scumteam of 3. Which means that the remaining MC must be scum.

and the posioner, right?

Most likely yes.

[Sakura Hana]

Well that's as close to a scum claim as it gets, considering it wasnt even me who suggested some sort of flavor claiming, I just figured out the why due to how these games usually have 2 town MCs and 1 scum MC.

[Sakura Hana]

I dunno math, for balance i dont see there being 3 town MCs.

[Sakura Hana]

There are gonna be some serious issues if pmatt ran away due to us flavor hunting the last MC since it had very high chance of being scum.
If he really didnt have time tho that's another story.

[Sakura Hana]

if math is really the last main and town, prof is almost certainly scum
I think thats who math should poison

People confirmed to not have guns are either poisoners or doctors if scum, or town, Poisoning ppl to not have a gun would either do nothing if scum or work if town

[Sakura Hana]

Wait, now i remember that prof hasnt been checked, i forgot.

[Sakura Hana]

Math could also be an even night ninja, poisoner.

[Sakura Hana]

Who is the 3rd main character? town!Katsuki, Math and who else?

Brian

[Sakura Hana]

Brian Skies, who was Alice, and Town Main Character - Non-Consecutive Night Doctor, has been killed in Night 2.

Quite interesting that Brian is Non consec Doc, but Math is an odd night poisoner.

[Sakura Hana]

In any case im confirmed to not have a gun so, poisoning me is a bad idea, coz i'd either be immune to it or town.

[Sakura Hana]

In any case:
Minuet's Trio: 1 scum MC, 2 Town MC.
Queen of Hearts: 1 scum Alice, 2 Town Alices.
Nightingale's Tale: 1 scum Alice, 2 Town Alices.
Through the Looking Glass: 1 scum Alice, 2 Town Alices.

By virtue of the Alices/MCs in games they are the strongest PRs, so for balance one needs to be scum and two town or either side is gonna be overpowered.

I do NOT believe for a second that Math is a town MC.

[Sakura Hana]

@Math:

oh and, sakura doesnt have a gun

[Sakura Hana]

For me to be scum i'd have to be a poisoner, so you'd have to believe I poisoned Katsuki over muffin.

[Sakura Hana]

For me to be scum i'd have to be a poisoner, so you'd have to believe I poisoned Katsuki over muffin.

And
Pedit: Why aren't you voting math then

I am

[Sakura Hana]

I voted projectmatt after math got into the slot, so i dont see any reason to change my vote after that claim.

[Sakura Hana]

I voted projectmatt

after

before math got into the slot, so i dont see any reason to change my vote after that claim.

Fixed that for me.

[Sakura Hana]

Actually why am i arguing with scum.

[Sakura Hana]

Except there are 17 players in this game, so there could conceivably be 3 town mains and 1 scum main.

There are

three Main Characters

in this game. At least one of them is aligned with Town.

[Sakura Hana]

Sorry i think FG didnt put it big enough so i helped

[Sakura Hana]

Wisdom, read above

AGAIN YOUR N2 RESULT

AND IF I WASN'T A MAIN I WOULD BE CC'D INSTANTLY.

I believe you're a main that's why im lynching you.
And wisdom has claimed his N2 result several times already i think you're just ignoring it coz it doesnt help your case on me.

[Sakura Hana]

I believe you're a main that's why im lynching you.

my point is proven

I never intended on disproving the point that Math being MC is literally the only reason im lynching him.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh nvm i thought Math was yelling at wisdom again.

[Sakura Hana]

{Wis/Kokichi,Sakura} looks like the team.

There's 2 scum remaining lol

[Sakura Hana]

I love how Math thinks there's any way out of this for him coz he has no experience with the Alice setups.

[Sakura Hana]

For the record, if you think of setup balance there is no current way to find Poisoner as is right now. Only way would be for scum poisoner to be a main character and being count down (considering Kat's cop ability was very bad as he said)

Yes because in a 3v14 scum game we should have a definite way to find scum!

You mean like the Tracker Watcher from Minuet's Trio?

[Sakura Hana]

Oh and the weak friendly neighbor from the same game too!

[Sakura Hana]

if you succeed in your stupid AF push today.

So you think you wont be lynched, despite you yourself saying you should be lynched?

[Sakura Hana]

yes exactly and you don't think fakegod went "hey hang on that was a bit op" let's nerf that a little!

yeah the MCs have been nerfed i dont think the town:scum MC ratio was changed tho. since MCs are STILL the strongest PRs.

[Sakura Hana]

lynch Sakura tomorrow then a ton of innocent town that have no guns.

Again, i have no gun, so if im scum im the poisoner, you can have literally all 5 gunsmiths check me the same night if you dont believe me.
OR
Im just town.

[Sakura Hana]

I don't see what's so wrong in leashing math. We've played a game where there were 3 alice town pr's before (masons yes)

Really? Which one? Daughters isnt Alice game you know.

[Sakura Hana]

Just follow the prequel links you wont find it there, in fact you'll find that all my claims are correct and easily verifiable.

[Sakura Hana]

Idk guys I feel like having leashed killing power is pretty good to me I like having more than 1 lynch where if math is scum has to poison someone of our choosing but sure go nuts

Remember the argument i made when i thought you were the scum poisoner.
It's literally just letting a scum slot live so they can do a 2x kill again.

[Sakura Hana]

but if he doesnt poison who we say hes scumclaiming

True, but, if he poisons who we say he's playing against win con anyway or just flat out helping town in any case, He might just poison someone else and for the same result of getting lynched anyway so.. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Besides as I said im fairly sure that there has to be a scum MC for balance.

[Sakura Hana]

Ok so here's another thing:
If scum has a poisoner along Math, then WTF is Math's role for an MC, scum's wouldnt be an MC coz there's 3 MCs, so scum cannot have something as strong as math's role or stronger, which then leaves Math as the only poisoner.

[Sakura Hana]

Minuet's Roles:
Scum: N2 Vig, Double JK (MC), Vanilla Cop
Town: Weak FN (MC), Tracking Watcher (MC), N2 Vig, Vanilla Cop x4, Rest VTs

[Sakura Hana]

scum had a vig
town had a vig

what's to say poisoner can't be the same thing if we're assuming scum in gunsmiths

they werent MC.
If you agree that Poisoner is something MC level (which should be if you believe Math), then there's no way there's another poisoner, which means pmatt poisoned Katsuki.

[Sakura Hana]

If you dont believe MCs are strong in this game basically we have.

Scum: Roleblocker, (Poisoner of some kind that's not MC), Something (Maybe gunsmith)
Town: 4-5 Gunsmiths, Neighborizing JOAT (MC), Non Consecutive Doc (MC), VTs?, Something else?

So currently as we know the only way of finding scum are the gunsmiths and Katsuki's cop shots (which supposedly were bad, but we dont know exactly how yet).
And a bunch of Gunsmiths that cannot find the poisoner and are also millers to each other so we cant find the scum gunsmith if existant either.

Dunno it seems to me that INDEED the MCs are more powerful here again ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Sakura Hana]

Ok so here's another thing:
If scum has a poisoner along Math, then WTF is Math's role for an MC, scum's wouldnt be an MC coz there's 3 MCs, so scum cannot have something as strong as math's role or stronger, which then leaves Math as the only poisoner.

math is town
if you guys want to lynch a townie then go with mariaR lol but apparently we got past that

im pretty fine with that flip cause it would have cleared up a lot of dumb shit in this game

But Purr, 3 town mains would screw up the balance, because the mains have the most power. What I don’t understand is my role PM doesn’t specify that I’m a minor character, so I’m assuming that only mains do? I wish I had asked Ank that before she replaced out.

There are sample role PMs for both Nancy.

[Sakura Hana]

Apparently town!Sakura is lockscum to Math due to VCA.
LMAO

[Sakura Hana]

Muffin is more familiar with the flavor, since he actually played the game (i tried but gave up coz my phone sux and android emu sux for rhythm games).
Hence why I trusted him to point us in the direction of who the MC would be if the player was being clever and only claiming his flavor name but not whether they were an MC or not.

[Sakura Hana]

I think Math went and checked that muffin knew his flavor would be MC, and decided to be honest about being MC and gambit that way.

[Sakura Hana]

Because Math is an expert scum player and is fooling them.

[Sakura Hana]

Like i would even think Math's play could be town, but setup wise... i think it's caught scum.

[Sakura Hana]

I've even won as literal setup confirmed scum.

See this proves my point.

[Sakura Hana]

1. There is not necessarily one scum in the MCs (see: Alice in Wonderland - all three Alices were town).

Was there? I dont recall seeing it in any of the prequel links when I went looking for it.

[Sakura Hana]

Ah i found it yes you're right

[Sakura Hana]

I blame FG for not putting a link to it in through the looking glass lol

[Sakura Hana]

Ok so basically what i said earlier but there was THAT alice game that was the first game and had 3 town alices.

[Sakura Hana]

So basically, FG has done it before, but did it on his first game.
What conclusion do u draw from the fact that all the rest of the games had a 2:1 ratio?
that 3:0 ratio was unbalanced?

[Sakura Hana]

Nancy Drew.
That translates to: "I have a high win rate as scum so you scumreading me means im town"

[Sakura Hana]

Ok so basically what i said earlier but there was THAT alice game that was the first game and had 3 town alices.

You'll also note that the Alices weren't necessarily the strongest PRs. My scum team that game had an Odd-Night Role Cop (me) and a Jailkeeper.

Yes, but i mean, that was his first game. If the ratio and power of the Alices changed it means something i think.

[Sakura Hana]

Nancy Drew.
That translates to: "I have a high win rate as scum so you scumreading me means im town"

hey this seems familiar

It does yes.

[Sakura Hana]

I would actually prefer more Alice themed games tho, I love Alice in Wonderland

[Sakura Hana]

In any case, even in Minuet's trio, i had a belief that at least one MC had to be scum.

[Sakura Hana]

Although im not sure if i actually wrote it in a post or not.

[Sakura Hana]

Nancy, probably because I intentionally shifted the wagon from prof towards TBG.

[Sakura Hana]

So it makes VCA look awkward.

[Sakura Hana]

In any case, even in Minuet's trio, i had a belief that at least one MC had to be scum.

But it does not have to be so.

So do you believe scum has an opposite poisoner to Math and is NOT an MC?
I mean i would believe it if Math was a non MC poisoner that scum probs had also a non MC poisoner, but that is just awkward design.

[Sakura Hana]

Math i unvoted coz i was asked to.

[Sakura Hana]

would prefer someone unvotes at least temporarily anyway until some stuff gets sorted

UNVOTE: Temporarily

[Sakura Hana]

Tell me math is still scum I'll wait

Math is still scum.

[Sakura Hana]

And seriously at this point im done arguing with scum, anyone can see how wrong that statement he made about me is.

[Sakura Hana]

Im just gonna go back to active lurking like I did D1 and D2 if this is how im gonna be treated when I actually try to solve the game.

The only person here that has done a modicrum of trying to make me see a possible reality based on previous mod meta that Math may be town MC is prof.

SO yeah never lynch prof. he's also actually trying to solve the game.

[Sakura Hana]

LOL
I've given several this game.
Look for them yourself i wont quote them to you.
Wanna lynch me for not cooperating? go ahead, i rather be lynched than appease setup confirmed scum.

[Sakura Hana]

I am the alternating poisoner.

Again alternating. He didn't submit N1. He can't have submitted N2.

Btw friendly reminder that Math is fake claiming.
From the sample roles PM explains how an Alternating role works:

Name - Celia
Role - Main Character - Alternating Cop/Vig
Alignment - Town
ABILITY
You may investigate or vig a player during the night. You may not use the same ability two nights in a row.You may investigate or vig a player during the night. You may not use the same ability two nights in a row.

And then changed his claim:

o since I am odd night poisoner we have one scum left with a gun one scum left without.

[Sakura Hana]

I thought Math meant alternating as in alternating nights, lol. Not that hard

Even if that was true, that'd be the same as non consecutive (which not only is a different role name as alternating, but also, the fact that he could've submitted N2 if he didnt N1)

[Sakura Hana]

Because Math's game winning scum play is to tell everyone to lynch him

Reverse Psychology

[Sakura Hana]

Pretty sure Math is an alternating poisoner/something else. And the something else would be scummy if known so that's why he only said poisoner.

[Sakura Hana]

Yelling it more is not going to magically make me scum Math.

[Sakura Hana]

Well, thanks a lot Math, your dying words will give scum a free mislynch.

And you know, im not even gonna bother defending myself either.

[Sakura Hana]

...

[Sakura Hana]

I'm pretty sure someone said something similar back in Minuet's.

For future reference in case you do flip town, if you want me to see youre town ate is not the way. Try not lock voting into obvtown and doing nothing instead.

I've just had about enough of people telling me how i should play.
Math was nowhere close to obvtown. Math claimed one thing then claimed another, Math misrepresented my posts and also said i was lockscum due to VCA.

[Sakura Hana]

I dunno, I kinda wanna kill all of everyone who thought Math was town yesterday, aside from Wisdom.
Or die trying.

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: prof
Looks like scum taking advantage of wrong town

[Sakura Hana]

Theoretical Poisoners is literally anyone without a gun aside from Dunn tho.
Now that all MCs are dead we know whoever poisoned Katsuki is not a main character.

[Sakura Hana]

The fact that MariaR didnt open the day guns blazing towards me and wisdom make me think that Dunn's right and Maria is town.
Meanwhile Prof is scum.

[Sakura Hana]

as I believe he's likely a better scum-hunter

pffft
lemme go laugh for a momment

PFFTAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

No, you're scum that knows math is wrong.

[Sakura Hana]

He's at L-2 tho, so Dunn cannot vote without hammering.

[Sakura Hana]

Not releasing the PT would've made u lynch MariaR, what is scum muffin's motivation on preventing that?

[Sakura Hana]

Ugh, no this confirms MariaR as scum I think (she pretended not to have a neighborhood pt)

Then muffin PM'd the mod to correct the error:

So the neighborhood wasn't with Maria? Wow

He lied about his guilty. Get your votes off Maria

[Sakura Hana]

Hmm, i guess you do have a point there.
But still, i dunno, he even lowered his SR of MariaR after the fact.

[Sakura Hana]

I thought Katsuki was the one with the guilty or am i misremembering.

[Sakura Hana]

muffin as scum fake claims a lot of things he can take advantage of (i mean scum PGO fake claiming novice reflexive fruit vendor is like woot), i dont think i've seen him fake claim a guilty, he CAN push mislynches as scum without such tactics.

[Sakura Hana]

he CAN push mislynches as scum without such tactics.

Like tbg?

...
You know what.
This is a waste of time.

[Sakura Hana]

If you're going to try to lynch muffin, then you might as well lynch me too because im gonna be defending him, unless im very certain he's scum, and hey, if you mislynch me MAYBE you will then notice that prof is pushing a scum agenda.

It feels like you're confbiasing and are using literally every single thing you can find to counter me.

[Sakura Hana]

Don't act like I'm not seeing things in Prof - I still think he has a good chance of being scum but I'm less sure after seeing his recent posts

Why do I keep getting the opposite impression from people like...
D1 i thought muffin was scum but D2 onwards i thought he was town, and ppl had the opposite impression
now i early thought prof was probs town, but today i think he's just scum, and you have the opposite impression.

Did I enter some topsy turvy game?

[Sakura Hana]

Who do you think poisoner is if it's not Prof, though?

Not muffin!

[Sakura Hana]

And by that i mean, i dont even remember who's what at this point.
I also dont think muffin kills kats, much less poison him.

[Sakura Hana]

(it probably is mariar actually)

I actually think a scum MariaR would've come guns blazing at me.
She has the SR she had on me to support it, and no one would be none the wiser after I flip, specially after screwing up so badly by literally doing the one thing I keep telling people not to do.

[Sakura Hana]

Dunnstral cannot be the poisoner he's DV, unless u think he's not a main character who's both DV and poisoner and on top of that started the voting D1.

[Sakura Hana]

Did you even read what Katsuki said about his cop ability in the hood?
It was flat out useless, Katsuki dying would reveal such a thing, meanwhile Katsuki alive defends muffin.

[Sakura Hana]

And he couldn't be shot night 2 because brian just claimed "doc" and they had to use the shot on him instead of poison

So by all accounts, Katsuki said he was cop checking muffins day 1 then got shot at so

Ok, next time you're cop and im scum and you say you're checking someone i know to be town ill kill you ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Sakura Hana]

Let me put this straight.
Katsuki dying makes muffin look guiltier, muffin scum doesnt do this, scum that thinks katsuki has a legit inno does, if muffin is scum he knows that katsuki's BSing and defending him, and so does the scum team. They dont kill Katsuki.

[Sakura Hana]

No let's make this REAL simple: He wasn't telling the truth about the cop inno because I read that in the neighborhood and you know that as well as I do

THAT's exactly why muffin is town OMG

[Sakura Hana]

ok but proscum play is to claim gunsmith even if theyre not if they know who the poisoner is.

This requires scum to have a gun IE gunsmith

Scum has a gun regardless of whether they are a gunsmith or not, the only exception would be a Scum doctor or Scum poisoner.
Town doesnt have a gun by default unless they are gunsmith, cop?, or vig.

[Sakura Hana]

The main problem right now is that all gunsmiths are out, so scum can easily fake a gunsmith role regardless of whether they are one or not, the poisoner cant coz he will be found as gunless

[Sakura Hana]

Does that apply to the few people that outted early.
Mmm but yeah I suppose I still think lynching in non guns is the correct play

Yes, because poisoner is in non guns and they increase Scum KPN even if by 0.5.

[Sakura Hana]

Unless you have reasons to think scum has a doctor (which would be very bad design against town that has a lot of gunsmiths) on top of the poisoner, once the poisoner is lynched all the non guns become kinda inno.

[Sakura Hana]

Kokichi being the first one to find Wisdom had a gun leads to his role being more credible UNLESS he's scum gunsmith, and even then the way he handled the guilty without flat out saying "wisdom has a gun" makes me think he's town, do you disagree with that logic?

[Sakura Hana]

I've said before that i've kinda had a gut scumread on purr.
He feels... different than minuet, but that's about it.

[Sakura Hana]

I don't really believe it because he doesn't really ever reaction test me.

Citation Needed, coz my memory sux.
I for one do NOT remember him reaction testing you, but i dont trust my memory on that one.

OTOH: Yes it's possible scum doesnt have a gunsmith, im busy right now so i cant neither ISO kokichi or look at the probabilities of scum gunsmith existing tho. I do promise ill take it in mind.

[Sakura Hana]

I for one do NOT remember him reaction testing you

Addenum: On other games.

[Sakura Hana]

he reaction tested me this game in his own words

I am aware of that much, the addenum was to avoid the misunderstanding that i meant in other games xD

[Sakura Hana]

i dont think poisoner can both kill and poison on a single night

Rules say he can

[Sakura Hana]

I'm wondering if we can even use Mylo's fencesittery to figure anything out

[Sakura Hana]

Eh, idk if we can or not, but i cant make heads nor tails of anything coz im bad at finding those kinds of associatives.

[Sakura Hana]

Tbf i wasnt hard scumreading prof until this post:

Remind me why I'm scum again and

why we aren't lynching among MathBlade's picks?

[Sakura Hana]

I will agree that I don't think that scum in Prof Fridays' situation would claim Vanilla Town, but I think it's incorrect to give everyone a free pass because of that. It would make me willing to lynch elsewhere first, at the very least (elsewhere, say, on MariaR).

With regards to those quotes, they don't do anything at all for me. It's more of a reactionary comment than a deliberate crumb and I don't actually see how this specifically comes from a town gunsmith over a scum gunsmith, or even just a scum player faking a townread. What's more, it ignores the possibility of Spiffeh being the scum poisoner; that's not entirely unreasonable, of course, but I would consider it towny if he seemed to consider that somewhere along the line.

And what are u expecting the poisoner to claim?

[Sakura Hana]

First of all, all 3 MCs are dead, we have 5 gunsmiths running around, and a dead JOAT with presumably cop similar abilities.
I dunno but it feels like Poisoner claims VT here 100% of the time.