Starry Night [Game Over]

[Ankamius]

If unwnd flips town, then I am too

[Ankamius]

I don't advocate flipping that pairing atm btw

I don't think it will convince enough town to go through with that

[Ankamius]

Anyways back later

[Ankamius]

I feel GR is just scum

[Ankamius]

Bitmap first tho

[Ankamius]

Does the majority of the game really townread bitmap

[Ankamius]

If that's the case, I legitimately might just disengage

[Ankamius]

VOTE: Bitmap

[Ankamius]

Ftr kagami and deas both wanted dunnmap to flip next too

[Ankamius]

I mean, you probably want to lynch Bitmap almost no matter what.

[Ankamius]

You're behind creature

[Ankamius]

I'm pretty set on GR and bitmap

[Ankamius]

No we're trying to kill dunnmap

[Ankamius]

Find one TvT pairing and the game is solved outside of an outside SvS pairing

[Ankamius]

This game is a really big migraine

[Ankamius]

This game is a really big migraine

Well, like every townread has a potential scum partner.

Okay so which pairing simplifies the game the most

[Ankamius]

Like this is when you start lynching for info

[Ankamius]

Can someone come in here and tell me with a straight face that bitmap isn't openwolfing

[Ankamius]

He has one member of all four pairings that aren't his in his bottom four on his reads list, but he thinks it's unwnd/mariar and wants both of our pairings flipped if he dies

:thonk:

[Ankamius]

Can someone come in here and tell me with a straight face that bitmap isn't openwolfing

If he was scum he'd have left by now

Not if his partner isn't in fb/shiro

[Ankamius]

Leaving is actually very spewy in the first place

He HAS to fight

[Ankamius]

did i spew anyone when i left as scum? I don't remember it being spewy. I remember it being exceptionally trolly

Was it in a situation that flipping could singlehandedly screw you over?

[Ankamius]

This game is fucking stupid

VOTE: GRob

[Ankamius]

We're simplifying the game this way.

Follow.

[Ankamius]

We're delaying dunnmap to 3 pairings left

GRob gets sorted and then unwnd gets sorted to take care of the two most likely scumteams

Then we lynch dunnmap at 3 pairings left because it's going to be impossible otherwise, then I will leave the dance

[Ankamius]

Btw if dunnmap suggests dying at 2 pairings, it's a scumclaim

[Ankamius]

I'm going to put my money where my mouth is

FB/Shiro is the most accepted TvT pairing even if it isn't by a whole lot

It comfortably sorts mariar/unwnd

[Ankamius]

That means you have no reason to deny this bitmap if you ARE town

[Ankamius]

thanks for realizing that too late creature

[Ankamius]

stop the stalling?

I'm going all in.

[Ankamius]

Creature/GRob -> unwnd/pops -> dunn/bitmap -> mariar/me

that's the lynch order

[Ankamius]

I'm not going to be able to get past a town bitmap until they're flipped
and the game is just over with a scum bitmap

but they've been virtually impossible to lynch all game despite bitmap being the designated left out lady

I'm just done

[Ankamius]

VOTE: BitmapVOTE:

bye

[Ankamius]

VOTE: Bitmap

[Ankamius]

what are the odds that the scumteam is EXACTLY WHAT I SAID IT WAS?

[Ankamius]

okay then

time to see what grob was trying to do then I guess

[Ankamius]

I think GRob was active antispewing

[Ankamius]

I really don't want to rush the game anymore

[Ankamius]

I very strongly doubt the scumteam was playing for GRob to endgame.

[Ankamius]

scum need every TvT pairing lynched, or exactly one if there's a SvS pairing

[Ankamius]

gamma emerald

[Ankamius]

didn't Dunn have stuff to say about Shiro a while back?

it's worth revisiting that

[Ankamius]

yes but I'd still like to revisit what his original points against shiro were now that we know who a second scum are

[Ankamius]

it could be pops yeah

I didn't mention this until now, but the decision to towncase me specifically was really bizarre

[Ankamius]

pops why did you towncase me

[Ankamius]

we're talking about it in our PT

[Ankamius]

fire what does your PT look like?

[Ankamius]

Fire

100% loudest one though

Yes, looks like you initially had a scumread on FB that has recently flipped, GR had FB as townread when he made his list, and that's it among living players as far as I can tell.

Makes me somewhat skeptical of Shiro-scum unless we're hypothesizing a scum-scum pair. There's some plausibility in {shiro, GR}, I think, but that requires further review.

what do you think of this?

[Ankamius]

it's Shiro or pops

[Ankamius]

what are your overall reads pops?

[Ankamius]

can you go into your mariar read for me if you can?

[Ankamius]

I have no idea what you're trying to say with 4414 (?)

[Ankamius]

What I'm not happy with is a lot of dissonance coming from her slot right now that seems totally based on whether we'd be amenable to a MariaR last pair standing rather than changing her read of you based on her play. She literally went from planning to leave you after one more red flip to townlocking you when you had like no meaningful play in the intervening period.

Can you expand on this please?

[Ankamius]

which of her posts gave you those impressions?

[Ankamius]

btw I know I can look myself, but I want to see your thought process just as much as I want to see what the conclusion is

[Ankamius]

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Ankamius]

funny story, I haven't looked at VCs all game

[Ankamius]

relevant:

Golden Robster was voting FB/Shiro at the end of first dance
Firebringer/Shiro was on Dunnmap
MariaR/me/pops/unwnd were on Deasrir

[Ankamius]

Shiro was the only unflipped slot not on GR

[Ankamius]

GR is actually really spewy on a scum Shiro

[Ankamius]

okay my entire plan for the rest of today

is to get a confident read on pops

because if I can townlock pops, then that's the endgame pair

[Ankamius]

BUT

I'm like 90% sure it's just shiro scum

[Ankamius]

unwnd we need to talk at some point

I want to know what pops has been saying in your PT all game

[Ankamius]

truly wondrous

[Ankamius]

Thoughts, Shiro.

[Ankamius]

I will make my case for where the game is probably within the next 24 hours, depending on what happens

But I think I have the game mostly solved, I just need to make sure of some things

[Ankamius]

Why is pops town?

[Ankamius]

And mariar town too, actually

[Ankamius]

:thonk:

[Ankamius]

what makes unwnd different?

[Ankamius]

I don't, fire

[Ankamius]

What I also don't find town is anything related to shiro

[Ankamius]

Talk to me about pops fire

[Ankamius]

I can easily see that being town being frustrated that I shoved through dunnmap as hard as I did

[Ankamius]

I'll be more specific, frustration that I shoved through dunnmap as hard as I did after specifically going on and on about fb/Shiro being the endgame pairing

[Ankamius]

FB, look at how GR played the game

It makes by far the most sense with Shiro being scum

[Ankamius]

Fire, there's another thing

I'm struggling to reconcile a scum mariar with both oka and GR attempting to discredit me throughout first dance, that doesn't sound very productive considering that mariar and I were synced for most of the game

[Ankamius]

GR started first dance calling out oka and shiro, but never had a reason to scumread Shiro until AFTER oka was lynched, then she parked on Shiro for the rest of her time in the game

[Ankamius]

Also note that GR went antispew after I started calling for Shiro to endgame

[Ankamius]

Pretty much which means both other scum went all in on their bets on me winning.

No

GR was looking to endgame herself.

[Ankamius]

GR has no real reason to go so hard on Shiro for no reason when she was fully capable of coming up with reasons on her reads

And she came up with the reasoning to scumread Shiro based on Okas posting immediately after okas flip

FB/Shiro was an inevitable flip at that point, so GR pivoted to having 100% correct reads so she would have enough cred to endgame since she had creature pocketed

[Ankamius]

That was fairly impossible with creature sayiong from the get go they will walk out on numerous occasion.

how do you know Firebringer wouldn't walk out on you in the end?

how do you know I wouldn't leave mariar like I was pushing to all game?

[Ankamius]

Another good reason to go antispew, yes?

[Ankamius]

Why would you have to do anything?

Dunnmap was never endgaming and the rest of us were paranoid of each other

[Ankamius]

You thought my pairing was going to endgame?

[Ankamius]

Yes I remember

[Ankamius]

I don't get it shiro, I never really considered making my own pairing thee last pairing until recently, and even then I'm still looking to sort pops primarily to be certain they are endgame worthy

And atm, I find your pairing to be the only one that can't endgame

[Ankamius]

But I wanted your pairing to endgame when GR died???

[Ankamius]

..............yes?

I specifically outlined that when I pulled the trigger on creature/gr

[Ankamius]

Fire are you reading any of this?

[Ankamius]

Do you honestly think anyone in my team(if I was scum) or in the game made any assumption I would endgame, if anything I should have tried to get myself lynched to assist gold on actually pocketing creature, this whole play is counterpoductive.

P.edit

You did?

You didn't do anything to protect yourself until now

Which is when only one scum was left.

[Ankamius]

Literally everybody else has been consistent with how they've been playing the game

You haven't.

[Ankamius]

VOTE: Shiro

I don't want the pairing lynched yet but I'm parking anyways

I still want to be certain on one TvT pair before removing Firebringer from the game

[Ankamius]

Unwnd when you're caught up, I'd like your general reads atm too

[Ankamius]

oh

joy

[Ankamius]

Unwnd

Please sell me on pops

[Ankamius]

I'm like inches away from just leaving and being done with this game

[Ankamius]

You don't know the half of it

[Ankamius]

I'd be legitimately really upset if Shiro scum endgamed for the sole reason that we literally allowed paranoia to lose us a win game

[Ankamius]

Won*

[Ankamius]

No, because that means I solved the game and didn't push it through

[Ankamius]

I'm not actually leaving yet, I'm just being an overemotional bitch

[Ankamius]

To be fair
Wasn't GR not in your original solve?
I thought if he flipped scum and maybe people calmed down we could get Bitmap to endgame
Apparently I am very very stupid for thinking/wanting that.

I wanted bitmap flipped beside I was never ever going to be able to townread him

[Ankamius]

Because

[Ankamius]

Pops I'm scared

[Ankamius]

Will you lynch Shiro if I leave

[Ankamius]

ok

[Ankamius]

I'll be back later

[Ankamius]

Oh good, me leaving the dance is gamethrowing

[Ankamius]

And if I'm right, it is

[Ankamius]

I leave

[Ankamius]

This looks like a straight lose if Shiro is scum then

[Ankamius]

If there's literally no way to convince you, then fb Shiro is the only possible endgame pair, Maria

[Ankamius]

Maria are you 100% certain on fb Shiro being tvt

[Ankamius]

Same to unwnd and pops

[Ankamius]

I'll at least wait for that catchup

[Ankamius]

But I legit think nothing is going to change with it

[Ankamius]

UNVOTE: Shiro

I'm taking a break from the game for a bit

[Ankamius]

this is me posting that I am here and caught up

and not hammering as of this moment

[Ankamius]

I do want hammer though if fb/shiro is what we end up doing tho

[Ankamius]

um

[Ankamius]

what the fuck just happened

[Ankamius]

MY BRAIN JUST BROKE WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU TRUST ME TO WIN THE GAME

[Ankamius]

I am too

[Ankamius]

oof :(

you played well though pops, I'd be proud of this game

[Ankamius]

sorry I suck

[Ankamius]

I'm glad that I corrected my reads enough to be on the right track at least

I still kinda feel like the pairings weren't really well designed and we didn't handle the lynch order correctly

meh

[Ankamius]

ya I think if town strategizes the game really well, it's very hard for scum to win this setup

[Ankamius]

Well glad to know I was right in the end. Still sucks Ank probably would've left soon

it's the highest control option :/

finding one confident TvT pairing that isn't my own allows me to not have to convince every other slot to lynch one pairing since I can just do that myself

[Ankamius]

always interesting to see a dead thread all talking about how pocketed I am by town

spooky

[Ankamius]

I was literally looking for a video to post with the hammer when you spewed, shiro

[Ankamius]

I think the lack of impulsive leaves had a lot of influence yes

[Ankamius]

thank you for the pairing mariar

I think I understand you a bit better now

[Ankamius]

Any town that can't find a single T-T pair and townlock it and win deserves to lose 2 mafia games not just 1.

it was supposed to be dunn/alisae

I would've locked that for life

[Ankamius]

<3

[Ankamius]

I was literally looking for a video to post with the hammer when you spewed, shiro

Was it really that townie?

it was obvtown yes

[Ankamius]

pops why didy ou towncase me

[Ankamius]

that was the closest I ever got to catching you

[Ankamius]

Aw pops :( It was fun playing with you. I left because the pace was way too high (190 pages in 10 days!?). I hope you have fun in your next games and we can play together sometime in the future.

Should have nuked Ank. :shifty:

yeah I had a big iso

[Ankamius]

I lost as scum and didn't get blacklisted so I'm counting this one as a "win"

what

you played a phenomenal game, why would anyone be upset at you?

[Ankamius]

I would've shielded gaiden forever

[Ankamius]

I think merchant's daughter was closer to the optimal dance setup even though the coin mechanic was kind of ridiculous in practice I think

[Ankamius]

Q: How bad an idea would it be for scum to deliberately pair together? I looked through all the previous games and I think it has happened at most once?

It's risky af but it screws with the theory really hard (for instance, scumbloc > superbasicallyconfTownbloc in 2v2)

a SvS pairing is risky

if it's on a pairing that has lasting equity, town requires an extra strong TvT pairing read to beat it

but if it goes bad, then scum is just mega screwed lol

[Ankamius]

Q: How bad an idea would it be for scum to deliberately pair together? I looked through all the previous games and I think it has happened at most once?

It's risky af but it screws with the theory really hard (for instance, scumbloc > superbasicallyconfTownbloc in 2v2)

a SvS pairing is risky

if it's on a pairing that has lasting equity, town requires an extra strong TvT pairing read to beat it

but if it goes bad, then scum is just mega screwed lol

*one more strong TvT pairing read

[Ankamius]

Ank, did you really think I was scum the whole game or were you loosening up towards the end?

idk when I went from "scumlock" to "can't ever townread"

but it happened and I legitimately could not get past it until you flipped

[Ankamius]

actually I think I was mostly just tilted because it felt like trying to lynch narna in undertale all over again

[Ankamius]

I was in guns & roses :V

not while you were in it though

[Ankamius]

blake is me :(

[Ankamius]

RC, did u actually read this whole thing?

Almost all of it, mostly to complain about how bad all the pairings were where everyone was locktown paired with a scummy slot

what were your reads in predance?

[Ankamius]

I was specifically avoiding pairing with my strongest townreads because I didn't actually think I'd end up having endgame equity like that

it's been a good while since I've been a universal townread

[Ankamius]

I've heard scum like... don't win at all on a bunch of them lol

[Ankamius]

I feel like a relatively small player base makes games more townsided than they would otherwise be

[Ankamius]

is this setup intercourse simulator now

[Ankamius]

you got screwed by who got the bps :V

[Ankamius]

oh that reminds me

oka why were you specifically engaging me as hard as you did first dance?

I thought it was really bizarre that I had oversoul specifically shading me predance, then oka focusing a lot of effort on me up until he died

that really messed with my head when I saw the GR flip

[Ankamius]

i had fun playing with everyone here!
except oka
fuck oka
oka smells

Oka is a good player fu

I laughed a lot when he said bruh

bruh

[Ankamius]

I think merchant's daughter was closer to the optimal dance setup even though the coin mechanic was kind of ridiculous in practice I think

If coins were approached more carefully I'd 100% support that being the norm, I feel not doing that threw the game in scum's favor

they were in the cancelled version!!!

[Ankamius]

ty for playing cephrir

sorry for the betrayal

[Ankamius]

Thank you for being hilariously obvtown fire

even when you were deathtunneling me

[Ankamius]

hey she always had her hands where I could see them

[Ankamius]

furret will be back within 3 days

[Ankamius]

altina sees all

[Ankamius]

thanks for playing GR

let's be TvT next time :V