Mainstream Mafia II: D&D Edition [FIN]

[Bingle]

It’s D1 still so, I appoint myself as designated hammerer as always.

I was thinking on taking this on myself. Though it all depends on timing of when the opportunity comes up -- as someone who works 40-60 hours and volunteers on top of that there are large swathes of time that I might not be able to get to it fast enough.

The battle is on, but I warn you, Le Champion never loses.

Bro what happened to your post restriction Bro? Is it tied to your avatar bro? If so can you pick a dbz avi bro?

If he does does he have to paraphrase his last three posts and make various noises that sound like he’s constipated for ten minutes every time he posts?

[Bingle]

What about ele is readable?

[Bingle]

What about ele is readable?

Just meta wise I mean

I’ve been in two recent games with him and he was obvscum in both by the end of D1

Ah, I was confused because as best I can tell he hasn’t done a single AI thing this game.

[Bingle]

Me or Rauth?

The fella apparently hadn't heard of context clues. I was talking about his obsession with this "Amrun" person, obviously.

Oh cool, what do u think of amrun mr PI?

I decided to consult my notes on miss Amrun. I always carried my leatherbound field journal in my left coat pocket, next to the lighter. Some think it's too pretentious for a man in my position, but sometimes you gut alone won't catch everything.

My notes say that miss Amrun's hatred of a mere dog is overboard and she's clung to it remarkably hard while also discrediting herself. She's gone out of her way to find ways to bend what the dog did into evidence it should be put down. But I know evidence, and that's not it.

They also say she speaks a bit like a robot, but as far as I know, there aren't any robots involved with this case. I'm unsure that an innocent person would be likely to generate specifically third party suspicions so quickly. So, after consulting my notes, I conclude that she could very well be a criminal, which I had not noticed before. Even I miss details now and then.

Nonetheless, it would clear my head if Mr. Menalque could shut the hell up about it for like two seconds.

I love you.

[Bingle]

not sure why we didn't invite you exactly tbh

How many posts are by Kise rn

0

[Bingle]

Scum

Rautherdir - Do you see what I see?
RCEnigma - Seriously though, I'm done giving reasons for now.

Having just been scum with Rauth (and saved his ass with a gambit from the dead thread of all places)... not really?

Vote: Rautherdir

Soul read.

Care to point out what changed?

[Bingle]

There's nothing to point to that makes him scum over anything else? Disappointing.

If there’s an Amrun wagon that’s bad cause she’s probs town

Proposed counterwagon or actual towncase?

[Bingle]

I'm feeling significantly better about you, less sure about RCE, worse about Alidra off the top of my head.

I can't really remember where I used to be on a bunch of people, although I suppose I could go back and check if it's important.

[Bingle]

Oh, significantly worse about Zor, too, but that might just be frustration.

[Bingle]

Feels like e can't make up eir mind between wanting to lynch you because you're Nero Cain and calling you scum while not trying to get you lynched.

Also, you made a point about em following me around a while back and I can't get over how right it sounds.

[Bingle]

I'm not interested in lynching there rn, tbh, given that if scum e's helping me put pressure where I think pressure is needed.

[Bingle]

Did you ever go into why you think woops is specifically scum? I get why you don't put stock in my reluctance there, but is there a reason he's specifically scum other than early tonal read?

[Bingle]

Lynching Ali is like kicking puppies.

Agreed that Ali can be tryhard as scum, but I doubt that'd be the case specifically for this game as either alignment. E was talking about taking a break until TM b/c burnout and eir hydra partner has seemingly flaked, which are both good reasons for Ali to not be engaged.

[Bingle]

I'd missed that post, and I'd forgotten about 35.

I'm a little fascinated that apparently he got a class (I didn't, although the class my flavor is is fairly intuitive from my picture and role, so...) but otherwise it's a kinda meh case. What do you think about Rauth? I feel like I'm right and his reaction to me kinda proves it, but also the wagon company is making me a little antsy.

[Bingle]

I mean the oracle claim is kinda just out of the blue and why would you advertise that? It's putting a target on your back so its either some kinda gambit or he's not afraid to die as in mafia or SK (they are normally bp)

Also, the oracle claim allows him to feed potentially false info and make himself "needed" and less likely to be lynched.

I've also decided that TSE is dumb town.

I assumed it was a flavor claim. If its a genuine oracle claim, lynching it seems bad D1 because it’s probably getting shot anyway and the info he gives should be useful or a way to easily catch him. I also don’t see why not oracle wooper makes up specifically that role.

[Bingle]

wooper claimed oracle?

Maybe? It was page 2 and I’m kind of okay with leaving it vague whether he was claiming flavor or role.

[Bingle]

I'm going to sleep.

GOOD NIGHT EVERYONE SAY IT BACK

It back.

[Bingle]

There's a bunch of wagons on vaguely lookbad slots, tbh.

I'm pretty much waiting for a VC so I can decide where to throw my weight. I don't think we have a wagon of more than 5 or 6 at the moment, but there are wagons on iirc Amrun Rauth Wooperduck TSE and Drew of varying intensities that don't suck. Feel free to choose any of those.

[Bingle]

Are you going to give a reason on this one?

Well, you see, Chewbacca lives on Endor...

[Bingle]

What's the case against Doctor Drew?

Doctor Drew is scum

Spoiler:

VOTE: Doctor Drew

They look very political with their positioning. Like they’re setting themselves up to be in a decent spot socially amongst specific people.

This is also me making a play here. I’m curious as to what happens now.

There was something there that makes me believe DD is scum with the connection between DD and BB.

I don’t necessarily think Bb is scum, but I could see it being S/S. Regardless, individually, I’m still null-town for BB, logic stated he’s just town, but scum like to play town sided logically.

VOTE: Doctor Drew

They look very political with their positioning. Like they’re setting themselves up to be in a decent spot socially amongst specific people.

Nah, I liked BB as a player on my old account back in the day. I enjoy that I am playing in a game with him on my new account. Following him is both a way to get me into this game, and as a reaction test of sorts.

Ok back, no chance in hell I am going to read the whole game.

I will just drop a vote and let nature take its course.

VOTE: formerfish

This also is an easy opt out, and the fact he chose FF is incredibly political

I think Drew just doesn't like me.

Nah, it was a slight wink wink vote(ongoing game, so no one ask to elaborate). As Nero said, more RVS then anything.

If DD was like a +3 positive on being scum before this post, he raised to about +7 here.

The fact he has a prior relationship with BB, I can definitely see some Scummer’s Guilt, which shall now be known from this point forward as ScumGu, or scumgoo.

Scummer’s Guilt, when you’re scum, and you’re being friendly with friends in games, but you’re still trying to dupe them hard and somewhat doing it for positioning purposes even though you generally mean well, but you still feel kind of bad, but then you say “fuck, you know, that’s just part of the game.” and the friend completely gets it, but they got goo’d on so hard, it still isn’t pleasant, but they understand.

Doctor Drew dripping that ScumGoo onto Bb.

I took Gu from guilt, and it changed the pronunciation.

ScumGu

Scumgoo

Goo

No I get this but where is the goo in that drew oost?

Okay, so Drew actively brought up that it wasn’t because he disliked FF as Fishy said.

Had he actually disliked Fishy or was holding some grudge, that would have been town indicative. But wait, it’s not necessarily scummy to say it wasn’t because of that!

You’re right, but it

can

be. Hold onto that for a second.

Now we move onto BBmolla goo. In that same post he answers fishy he also is bringing up his relationship with BB, and that he likes him. Both segments are to reassure that he does in fact like them as players, and needed to put that out there.

The fact that these happened together drips so much goo we’re essentially swimming in it.

Other than that, you can detect hints of deflection from him towards me where he’s actively not trying to continue an engagement of me because he’s trying to avoid getting the Third Degree Boon.

Also, Doctor Drew saying he would never do that to BBm is exactly why it’s ScumGu. He’s not doing anything wrong, but he feels dirty playing it, even though it’s the name of the game.

DD is scum, and all his reasonings are just trying to get me to logically back off of his case and not be able to push.

The way he’s defending himself against me is Scum Indicative.

Also, Doctor Drew saying he would never do that to BBm is exactly why it’s ScumGu. He’s not doing anything wrong, but he feels dirty playing it, even though it’s the name of the game.

DD is scum, and all his reasonings are just trying to get me to logically back off of his case and not be able to push.

The way he’s defending himself against me is Scum Indicative.

Seems you missed when I said I am an open book.

And you are taking my interaction with Big Balls way to seriously.

How about you interact with me directly instead of making a scum accusation first, then trying to find reasons second.

I think you think I am seeing your posts as super serious, which I am in fact not. Were it more serious, I might think that it’s townie.

You can read my posts just as much as anyone else. I have no doubt that you are most likely reading more than anyone else in this game, as you seem incredibly focused on my posts.

You are right, i don’t see your posts as super serious at all, that’s not what I’m pushing. The lighthearted nature of it all is scum indicative, and why there’s all the Goo up in there.

I admit, from your perspective, that’s probably annoying as scum to get pushed in such a manner, and annoyingly you probably have a “technically true, but still not correct” attitude towards my case, one that might have you respond “even if I were town, I would have said that stuff”.

Which loops back together coming to you being scum. I agree with you that you probably would have said similar stuff if you were town, however the situation itself would never have arrived if you were, because gamestate was placed there strictly because you are scum politically positioning.

Doctor Drew is letting the case on him disappear because it’s such an active game that if he stops talking about it, it’ll disappear.

That’s not gonna happen

Why isn't Vortuka a wagon?

I don't remember any chatter about lynching him, but he's not a terrible option. I do think we already have a bunch of not terrible options, though, so... :shrug:

[Bingle]

Someone who opened a noose store in this town could make a killing.



I'll shut up now.

[Bingle]

Hectic's PR is the least interesting of the PRs.

Also, Amrun is a she.

[Bingle]

Updated the VC

I half assed this, so don't assume it's right

Wooper -

BBmolla, Enter, Doctor Drew, Formerfish L-7

Amrun -

Dongempire, Iconeum, gobbledygook L-8

Rautherdir -

Bingle, KidAmn, InsideJob711 L-8

Creature -

Firebringer, Untrod Tripod L-9

Gamma Emerald -

zoraster, Menalque, L-9

Doctor Drew -

Flavor Leaf, Rautherdir L-9

Firebringer -

Creature L-10

Flavor Leaf -

Dr Easy Bake L-10

Vorkuta -

Nero Cain L-10

Menalque -

Virgo the Immaculate L-10

Chennisden -

TSE L-10

TrueSoulEnergy -

Cephrir, Chemist1422, AaronFrost, Gamma Emerald, Amrun, wooper, Chennisden L-14

So a couple of notes, L- numbers are assuming TSE will execute anyone other than himself at deadline.

FL was voting both me and DD in the last VC for some reason. Assuming this to be a mod error, I have removed the vote for me.

Amrun's vote on TSE made TSE the largest wagon. Wooper's vote on TSE then made Wooper the wagon closest to lynch. I don't think either of these is super important, given that no wagon is crazy close to lynch, but they're interesting nonetheless.

FB/Creat/FL/Mena wagons probably don't have legs, so those people should do something more productive.

Vork/Chenn/GE wagons don't have momentum, so if you're serious on one of them you'd better start convincing.

[Bingle]

01. Pine
04. Firebringer
07. Korina
11. The Fonz
17. xofelf
19. Pink Ball
20. Vorkuta
23. RCEnigma
24. davesaz
26. Elements
28. Hectic
36. jadesmar
40. EspressoPatronum

This is the list of people currently not voting. If you're on this list, maybe fix that.

[Bingle]

then jin me and lets start the wagon

I still feel Rauth is scummy, and apparently it's a more viable wagon than I thought.

Gamma, why does Rauth's self defense come across as town? Particularly the part where he misrepped my push on RCE as me trying to lynch someone off of faulty information I was putting out read disingenuous and designed to shade.

[Bingle]

Who should I be voting for? I feel like delegating.

Unofficial VC is literally on the previous page. At the very least you can tell who the people you think are most likely to be right in a vacuum are voting and sheep them.

[Bingle]

Ok, that still doesn't help the fact I have 50 pages to read, plus my phone screen got cracked through my case, so I have to get it fixed, plus I have a doctors appointment today.

pedit: I'll look at Vork's iso later, since I seem to always disagree on scumreads on Vork when I'm playing with them.

The joint ISO of me/Nero from my reads wall until the functional beginning of the game isn't a bad place to start either.

Vorks ISO is roughly: I want to be governor because I want to roleplay being soviet Russia. He's done literally nothing else, AFAICT, and avoided the discussion on whether governor itself was protown entirely.

[Bingle]

Agree with wagons on Wooper, Rautherdir, DD, and Vorkuta.

Strong disagree with TSE wagon. I can't fathom a reason for non-town to reveal that ability, even as a fakeclaim. The people who have an "awkward player" read on TSE are correct but I don't think it's AI.

Still maintain that the Amrun posts that I pointed out are town indicative. It isn't strong, but I'm gonna want to hear something rational behind the scumreads before I'd be willing to vote there.

I think Creature and Gamma are town. Not willing to vote either of them at this point. The rest of the votes are baseless as far as I remember.

There pretty much have to be scum who aren't being voted, but gotta find 'em before I can vote 'em.

VOTE: Vorkuta
Let's squeeze this one and see if it talks.
I'm flexible. Give me a reason.

Vaguely agree with most of this, which gives good tingles.

I don't think the amrun quotes from you are particularly town, but given that the scumreads there are /is being very political/ and /is playing like an oldschool player/ it's not a high priority slot imo anyway. At the very least she's actively playing.

TSE's role isn't /NEVER LYNCH THIS IS TOWN/ but I definitely want to use it today to not have to get 21 votes, so...

I think hunting out new prospective wagons is a bad use of today, given that there are 40 people. Sure, there's scum outside of the group that's being voted. Consolidating on what already has support seems like a better choice, given that there's so much that I wouldn't mind seeing lynched.

[Bingle]

Feel pretty confident adding chenn to the townbloc rn.

[Bingle]

Townbloc in no particular order:

Bingle
FF
Chen
NC
BB
Gobble* (Mech based)
Mena
Ceph
dave
EP

Not really a locktown block, but definitely worth operational status for the day.

Close but not really worth being in the list yet would be GE/Creat/FB/FL

[Bingle]

I need to look at EP/Ceph but otherwise... yeah I agree

Ceph has what looks like the most real of the PRs, and has been actively solvey with 100% of his posts anyway. In addition, he's not really being agenda-y and his pop ins have all been relevant. He's not trying to take charge like in either the scumgame he had in AliPine or Fogport. I don't have a recent towngame for comparison, but I'm confident enough there for the moment.

EP has been bleeding newbtown vibes recently.

[Bingle]

Yeah like

In order of appearance it's

chennis
chenny
chen
chennisden

and then there's THAT

Oh shit, I forgot. I'm supposed to refer to chen as "and then there's THAT" from now on.

[Bingle]

davesaz is either town or scum, IMO. possibly third party

Hot takes by enter: They come prepackaged and frozen for any occasion!

[Bingle]

Not terrible not really good, I am feeling a bit depressed today but i will pull myself out eventually

It's okay warmpuppy. You're still a boy's best friend and an arsonists best ally. <3

[Bingle]

He didn't say republican...

Okay, back to not trolling the thread actively.

[Bingle]

Enter made an alt. He likes playing under like 7 different accounts over the course of a game.

[Bingle]

Just in case anyone is wondering, many of the buttons on MafTiger simply don't show. Including the "Quote" button.

Yeah it’s a broken skin.

Anyway, I was just reading some of mainstream mafia, and I noticed something. There was a lie detector.

[Bingle]

I know that Nero Cain is unaligned with me.

[Bingle]

I am town aligned.

[Bingle]

I know that Nero Cain is unaligned with me.

^lie detector fodder, not a claim. I’m willing to make the same statement about any other slot on request.

[Bingle]

I know that Nero Cain is unaligned with me.

^lie detector fodder, not a claim. I’m willing to make the same statement about any other slot on request.

You know lie detector can work with groups, right? So you could post a list of people and ask if they're all the same alignment. Or if they need to be dead for town to win. That would work better, actually, in case there's a survivor or similar.

Untrue. Lie detector can only tell if the person is lying. Most mods make the action fail if the person says something they can't know (For example "There is a doublevoter in the setup" as a VT) and some return it as a lie. Listing a bunch of town would therefore fail, because I don't know their winconditions for sure regardless of my own.

I know that Nero Cain is unaligned with me.

Actually, this wouldn't work unless you are cult or scum. Since there is a cult, then even if you had a cop investigation on someone you wouldn't be able to tell if that investigation was still valid (And thus wouldn't know if that person is still aligned with you or not).

This is strictly better than "I am town" in most situations, actually. If the mod differentiates between lies and things that are incapable of being known, this means that a lie result means Me and Nero are partners (or masons), a truth result means that I am scum of a faction that doesn't contain Nero (which would include say, Serial Killer and Survivor as they are self aligned), and an unclear result means that I am a member of a faction that doesn't know all of it's members. The reason I made both posts, and encourage everyone else to do so, is because "I am unaligned with X" makes you a godfather in the case of traitors. I also suggest everyone makes these posts every day phase, just in case, to deal with potential cult recruits. If I say I am town today and then am recruited, then I am no longer town but was not lying when I said I was.

[Bingle]

I'm Cobble-Aligned.

Good catch.

Me. Goddammit.

[Bingle]

I'm Cobble Aligned.

[Bingle]

Why are we assuming there’s a lie detector? Have I missed something?

That seems like a lot of shit to sort through on the off chance that someone is a lie detector who wants to detect that particular post.

I mean... 40 posts per dayphase doesn't seem like a bad trade off for enabling a potential cop.

And I'm not assuming there is a lie detector. I'm saying there was one in the previous incarnation and thus it's worth it for those 40 posts per phase to be made. There probably isn't one (and debating whether there is is a waste of time), but it doesn't hurt to hedge our bets.

[Bingle]

Why are we assuming there’s a lie detector? Have I missed something?

That seems like a lot of shit to sort through on the off chance that someone is a lie detector who wants to detect that particular post.

I mean... 40 posts per dayphase doesn't seem like a bad trade off for enabling a potential cop.

And I'm not assuming there is a lie detector. I'm saying there was one in the previous incarnation and thus it's worth it for those 40 posts per phase to be made. There probably isn't one (and debating whether there is is a waste of time), but it doesn't hurt to hedge our bets.

I don't understand the connection to post amounts.

Playing around the existence of a lie detector requires everyone to make the post: "I'm Cobble Aligned" at the beginning of each day phase. 40 posts per day.

Rauth's thing is a waste of time, as all scum has to do to make the list useless is include 1 scum buddy in a list of players.

[Bingle]

No. It needs to be a post that is explicitly "I'm Cobble Aligned"

No additional words, reads, subjective values, jokes, etc.

[Bingle]

Haha, I made pine skim my iso.

[Bingle]

Spicy.

[Bingle]

So Miss Lynch, FL (Lol, cause that's a real claim), and PB have all claimed benevolent 3p. All under fairly innocuous circumstances.

[Bingle]

I win when specific people are dead in a specific way. I'd like to not talk too much more about it.

If there's a way I can help and it doesn't hurt the town wincon, I always 3p side when I can.

[Bingle]

FOTM springs to mind (you had two accounts in the top 5 posters), but I think I've seen it other than that too.

[Bingle]

VOTE: Vorkuta

[Bingle]

I am

deep one

Cobble aligned

Don't do this for lie detector posts. Mods can get prickly.

[Bingle]

I really don't understand why wost wooper is being so incredibly useless.

He's been very lurker recently. AliPine he did fuckall until basically LYLO and I had to beat activity out of him in the C9 that just ended.

[Bingle]

Someone give me the TL;DR on why we're not voting this?

If a 3p doesn't hurt my wincon, I don't want to waste a lynch on them. If he wins and exits the game without me losing a lynch I can use on actual scum, great.

Plus, there's every chance he gets shot by SK or group scum because they have no more reason to want him around than anyone else and if he's not a viable mislynch and IS willing to help town, he's still potentially dangerous.

[Bingle]

Why the shit are people voting vork?

Wynaut?

I am

deep one

Cobble aligned

Don't do this for lie detector posts. Mods can get prickly.

Bingle u say this like I have any idea what you’re talking about

I am

deep one

Cobble aligned is probably a lie, even if you are Cobble aligned, because

deep one

Cobble aligned isn't likely an alignment in this game.

If you're going to humor me on making the lie detector post, you should simply post "I am Cobble aligned." No additional words. No additional formatting. Nothing that could potentially change the veracity of the post. No reads. Nothing subjective. No stories about how your Great Aunt Ida likes to go streaking during Westham matches.

The long and short is bingle has really bad day 1 reads this game.

Just this game?

Nope. My reads are fairly consistently for shit. My talents as town are more along the lines of making the setup my bitch and keeping town from imploding, which I argue are more important.

If you are with me bold

"I am with Formerfish"

so I can do a thing.

Formerfish lives in my pocket.

[Bingle]

It's a lie I'll do an awful lot just to hear.

You're the hottest girl in this barn.

[Bingle]

What is the lie detector post? Like bingle I haven’t read this game in like 20 pages

The reason people have been posting

"I am Cobble Aligned"

Is because I found evidence that chk may have included a lie detector in the setup. Not hard evidence, just evidence. If everyone posts that specific post, lie detector becomes a full cop.

There are other various things that can be done with it, but without confirmation that it exists it's probably a waste of time and an arbitrary inflation of the thread.

If you're town, you should make the I am Cobble aligned post. If you're a benign 3p like Survivor, you should post "I can win alongside town."

That's it.

It's a lie I'll do an awful lot just to hear.

You're the hottest girl in this barn.

Talk dirty to me bb.

[Bingle]

I should have posted that, btw. I regretted my decision immediately.

[Bingle]

How does that work for cult recruited slots? Say Deb posts he's cobble aligned day 1 and he is recruited that night. But when he posted the statement it was a true statement.

That's why it's 40 posts per day (high estimate) instead of just 40 posts. You repost it every day until we flip a lie detector or there's a good reason to believe one doesn't exist.

[Bingle]

Also like... post 1 includes that town = cobble aligned so it doesnt mean anything if someone doesnt know

Post 1 had a presumably town flip that was Cobble Aligned. Most of us have already posted that we are Cobble Aligned. That does not mean that every town-aligned player is also cobble-aligned.

p-edit
Actually, Miss Lynch if you could also confirm if your wincon is a standard 'win when all threats to town are eliminated' or similar? Just a 'my win condition allows me to win with town' or similar would be great. That would be better to check instead of just checking to see if you are aligned with death.

p-edit 2:
Yeah, from now on we should either post 'I am cobble aligned' or 'my win condition allows me to win with town'

I am cobble aligned.

Try again without quoting. Seriously, this isn't complicated. Just "I am cobble aligned" all by itself. Nothing else in the post.

[Bingle]

Guy Fieri is actually the same person as Sammy Hagar and the lead singer from Smashmouth, who has no name and can only be described as the lead singer for Smashmouth.

[Bingle]

Chen not being leadery is +town, source: meta.

I need a new name to ISO

Currently Elements seems like a juicy wagon to go if someone here doesn't want to waste their time with a shitty policy lynch D1

I'd enjoy a shitty PL on Elements.

ico is just scum. Maybe, prob, like Bingle brings up a decent point about him being lynchbait but jesus fuck the guy is scummy.

Wat? I don't think I've talked about Ico at all. My thoughts there are people are townreading him for

That's it.

Also not sure why people suddenly think “OH, there was a lie detector in the last game, there has to be a lie detector in THIS game” AND “If there is a lie detector, it is probably so unbalanced that it can detect alignments.”

Actually, the thought was "There was a 3 shot lie detector in the last game, this game was designed and balanced like a month later (look at the review date) and thus playing around a lie detector being present is a reasonable precaution that doesn't hurt us much. But sure, I'm clearly nuts.

Honestly this day continuing any longer is pointless, pick a lynch, let’s get some night actions going

Otherwise our player list is going to flake from boredom

#TRUFAX

What is your D1 read accuracy like as town anyway, FL?

Mm, pretty good. I generally have decent reads as town, and if I have laughably bad reads, you know I’m town and that scum are in the players who know me well and want to abuse my wrong pushes, and they usually play up to me, in a friendly way, and stroke the ego, even then scum usually like to kill me.

Wait, people nightkill you? Why would they ever do that, you never want to lynch me.

[Bingle]

Oh, also Alibae defending creat's hyperposting and shading FL for defending creat from DD is all sortsa badnastybad.

[Bingle]

Also, creature, vork aiming trackers at himself is not towny at all. At best it's null. At worst it's a ploy to get towncred.

[Bingle]

Creature was posting a lot and I skipped the last 6 pages because of it.

Imma bout to glad creature just to stop him.

Should I do a 3rd person, or just 1v1 creature?

Bad fish. If you're gonna gladiate, pick wagons that aren't shitty.

[Bingle]

There is a wagon there. Me and Nero are on it and it's pretty damn sexy.

Dr Dre is also a sexy wagon.

[Bingle]

Could we save the bitching about spamposting for the postgame or MD? Cause you know what bitching about spamposting is? Not content. You know what defending spamposting is? Also not content.

[Bingle]

"Hey we should probably check D1 because it usually contains valuable info"

ngl, this is a weird stance in a cult game, but w/e.

[Bingle]

I wanted a Vork wagon b/c I think the guy is a massive lurker as scum and I thought his insistence that the game hadn't started back in pre-game was wildly scummy. So I had wanted to poke @ this.

I humbly request a tracker slot on yours truly due to the bastard/RNG nature of my roll

I am very irritated this ^ is his only post since d1 started. I guess one could argue that he's more likely to be town based on having a "bastard role" (if this is to believed)

thought Bingle?

It's an odd claim, for sure, but there's definitely a scum motivation to it. (Not being able to be held accountable for his actions and directing trackers away from a buddy making the kill are two, for example). Probably not a serial killer claim, but who gives a shit about a serial killer, they're crazy protown when we have like 500 lurkers.

The fact that he's done fuckall is concerning since he was like THE most active useful player in ONUW as "town" (it's not really mafia so much as dethy) which had 80 something players and a comparable amount of spam.

[Bingle]

Day 1 has been going along fine, and we will get more info from what I do because it will force people into a smaller lane to choose and we get info from that.

Agreed with the second part. But if the lane you're offering is "Do we policy lynch someone" then the benefit dies a horrible death on the steps of hospital as the doctors passionlessly watch on.

Pick hot topic wagons. DrDrew seems to be divisive, he'd be an interesting inclusion. I wouldn't mind seeing a Vorkuta inclusion. Someone who has done fuckall to be read on.

Creature has both started on the "I'm going to actually content" portion of the game and is likely to be shot by a serial killer who he's pissed off. He's playing the exact opposite of survivalist in what should by all rights be a game with a million guns.

He's a fine vig shot, I guess, but he's a shitty info lynch because none of the people who are voting him are voting him for being scum. We'll just be walking into D2 with one less person making noise that can be read.

[Bingle]

I wish I was townreading Amrun.

[Bingle]

lie detectors used to be p common, yes

They were disappearing by 2013, but there was one in the direct predecessor to this game, run just before the mod designed this game. It's basically a way to include a cop in a setup while forcing them to hint to their status. They do traditionally duck PGOs and trackers because they don't target the player.

And no, we're not counting on there being one in this game.

[Bingle]

Here are some alternatives I'm thinking about:

04. Firebringer - just landed a vote on me and ran away
08. Rautherdir - posts are rather meh
09. BBmolla - his constant bugging about me being top poster is starting to feel disingenuous
16. Nero Cain - hasn't felt town Nero here
17. xofelf - occasionally making useless posts
18. Gamma Emerald - more than occasionally making useless posts
19. Pink Ball - low hanging fruit scum
23. RCEnigma - his name showing up yet me not remembering him is nagl
24. davesaz - don't remember much content
26. Elements - just fluffed
28. Hectic - insists on roleplaying over playing the game
31. Dongempire - same as RCE
38. KidAmn - another low hanging fruit
40. EspressoPatronum - been being called town for ??? reasons

RCE claimed a daycop on Rauth.
PB is claimed benevolent 3p
BB is a claimed vig.

NC/Dave/Gamma/EP all bad takes. That leaves Fire/xof/elements/hectic/dong/kidamn. Lukewarm take at best.

How about you join me on UT who repped out of his last game because of the pace and hasn't done it in here with a much quicker pace?

Gross.

[Bingle]

Dong is towny

Do tell.

[Bingle]

Why would you say this? What’s the point of doing this? Was he even town that game?

He was, but he repped out 100 pages into a game where LLD and GICE were having an out and out battle D1. It was legitimately the most toxic portion of the second longest game in site history.

[Bingle]

Yes but... I read a solid 10 posts of Elements ISO, so not sure why you're assigning that read weight

That's literally all of Ele's ISO. They have two posts that can be called playing the game if you're generous.

[Bingle]

GI being toxic? that is the least surprising thing I've ever heard

It wasn't any one person's fault. The thread just got really bad for a while and that was the main event going on. I don't blame anyone for their actions during that, least of all UT or xof's replace outs.

[Bingle]

If we're going to try to start a cw at this point, btw, my money's on Zor. His treatment of UT doesn't read as natural, he's done fuckall with regards to following up on his "early posting AI" and his pl push on creat was easily the worst of the bunch.

[Bingle]

Who is the otter?

[Bingle]

Was site meta as keen on neighbours back when this was designed as it is now?

Not really, no. Also, daychat isn't guaranteed, because this came from a time before daychat was standard in the newbie queue and encryptor was considered a strong scum role.

Me.

What’s the current vote count now?
Is confirmed scum top wagon now?

Drew is at like 13 votes and vork is at 10, I think.

[Bingle]

I'm not sure how not bringing up your drew vote (or your gamma vote) as a reason I find you scummy is a misrep, tbh.

[Bingle]

hello there. i wish the game didn't start without a notification PM, but here we are.

Everyone who posted earlier than me is slightly suspect.

This. This was a thing you brought up, people noted as potentially good to look at, and then you promptly never addressed again.

[Bingle]

You mean the post I explained here?

Also, how much stock do you really expect me to put in something like that anyway? It's not null, but it's not exactly going to control my actions entirely (because there had been way too many people who had posted for all to be scum for one thing and for another, there's been roughly 160 pages since then.) Plus, some people felt it was "angelshooting" and while I don't entirely agree, it's also not necessarily a comment I find entirely wrong either.

My issue isn't the thought itself, but the lack of followthrough. For example, I saw no analysis of who would be likely to have seen the thread on their own, no mention of a glance at the signups thread to see who was necessarily aware of the game start because of banter and links there (myself, wooper, Kise, pops, AFrost and Drew all posted in that thread after chk promised to link to this one in it, btw and dong outright asked for a game link there before that happened), no mention of people who showed a lack of awareness being more likely town (creature, for example), no analysis of whether your theory had more or less impact with people like xof who doesn't often play mafia, nothing.

If you thought it worth bringing it up in the first place as AI, I would expect some additional analysis at some point, but by now it's clear that was never going to happen.

[Bingle]

I was popular last night.

I visited BB and KidAmn, because someone gave me the ability to act twice. That ability should probably go to someone else in the future.

I got a nice shiny gift from someone who loves me very much. I can only regret to inform the sender that all marriage proposals should carry with them a copy of your most recent bank statement so that I can make an informed decision. I will be keeping the diamond though, because I am just Classi like that.

[Bingle]

Depends entirely on the comp of the cult team. Given 40p game, I doubt cult white flags here. I also kind of doubt cultafia given only two kills.

Also:

VOTE: TSE

We need A LOT more flips.

[Bingle]

Do we know if they just started with 1?

yes

Not explicitly, actually. It's implied, but not outright stated, in the OP.

[Bingle]

There is a cult. They start with a leader,

really Jingle?

They start with a leader is true if they start with a leader, three puppies and an elephant tamer. All we know for sure is that there is a role called cult leader and it can recruit people.

Anything further is supposition, and while potentially accurate, unconfirmed.

[Bingle]

Because I always know how many cultists there are. And there are 2 right now.

That’s cool.


Kinda wish it had been saved for later, but cool.

Probably not cultafia then. But I honestly expected a vig and those shots just don’t look like it to me.

My guess is multiple protections, or this game is going to be a true nightmare.

[Bingle]

Because I always know how many cultists there are. And there are 2 right now.

How many were there at start of D1?

When does the ability activate?

[Bingle]

No idea wtf Orcus is though. Is that the scum kill?

Orcus is a chaotic evil god exclusively worshiped by orcs if I remember my D&D lore right. Probably SK, possibly groupscum, unlikely vig.

[Bingle]

If groupscum race is AI, which is probably not at all helpful. If anyone wants to claim orc/drow they should probably do it now though.

Orcus was a kill flavor, Dong. Probably not town based on "wants to kill and/or enslave all non orcs."

[Bingle]

I checked, Orcus is a demonlord, not the deity I was thinking of. Still, likely not town friendly.

[Bingle]

Also, not going to be sheeping Flavor Leaf anymore. Probably sheep Bingle after he moves off of TSE. Or maybe 37 people alive is low enough to figure this out myself, who knows.

My vague plan for the day is to throw my weight behind the largest wagon I'm not townreading the subject of, so...

chkflip says he uses NAR, which has Hide before recruit. I wasn't culted, but if I was, I don't think it'd affect Alisae's hiding.

Vaguely want to point out that there are a ton of hider variants and not knowing which one Ali has (is e immune to block attempts? Is e targeted by all actions targeting eir target, or just killing ones?) Zor is a bad place to hunt today.

VOTE: vork

Vaguely agree with Nero that EP's posting looks p shit today.

[Bingle]

RCE’s fell victim to it more times than most people, and he’s the Flavor Leaf expert on site.

Excuse you, how many times have I misread you?

How many times have you caught scum me?

[Bingle]

RCE’s fell victim to it more times than most people, and he’s the Flavor Leaf expert on site.

Excuse you, how many times have I misread you?

How many times have you caught scum me?

A broken clock is right twice a day.

Not a digital one.

i'd vote Rauth for $20 too

The going rate for mislynches is $5, as established in turn of camn.

I checked, Orcus is a demonlord, not the deity I was thinking of. Still, likely not town friendly.

So Orcus is not an orc? Or is he like a bad orc?

Orcus is not a player, but a demonlord and kill flavor.

Please tell me you can confirm Bingle as Town here so I can -at least- stop having nightmares about him saving me to last to mock me.

Don't worry, I'll only lynch you after someone cop clears you.

We have 3 claimed 3rd party

I am only aware of Pink Ball and (fake) Flavor Leaf. Who's the 3rd?

Miss Lynch.

Mod: Please replace me with my main, Titus. I feel scum figured this out and it's not fair to town.

I'll try to post some more tomorrow but it's Goddaughter day and I am not having some people know my RL status and not others.

Who do you think is likely to have caught on to your identity?

Nevermind i cant even get wagon leader, people are just resting their votes on the fucker

I'm just going to silently join that then

VOTE: TSE

what's so great about TSE wagon?

Policy.

@Dong @Ico
TSE is more likely 3p than scum + there's still a possibility of him being town. I think davesaz mentioned that a little while ago if you want to go back and find it.

In short, we should have a better idea of TSE's his alignment once we flip scum somewhere else.
If scum factions(s) is/are goblins, there's a very high chance TSE is town.
If scum = pretty much anything else, TSE is probably 3p SK or something.

I've already stated i think TSE is unlikely to flip scum. That doesn't take away the fact that I'm interested if anyone is scumreading there.
Also I think it's +

town

sanity if we keep a role around that lets us have easier lynches.

And with a misstep on TSE's part wrt the use of his powers, we can always lynch there next.

I'd lynch this.

[Bingle]

take your fukken pick dude

I probably have more game content than any two players excluding Nero, and the rest of that list is all shitty lynches. Especially the dead guy.

[Bingle]

show me where I said I wanted to lynch them

You didn't. You posted NAI grumbly bullshit in the thread to complain about NAI spammy bullshit and I responded with the derision your comment deserved.

Vork is D1 town for the way he approached the gov shot. Could maybe be cult in the same way you could be, but not interested in lynching there for the same reason I’m not interested in lynching you

Wat? Vork doing fuckall useful and copying people who were being townread for doing fuckall useful while aiming to get the powerful scumtool makes him a townread? Can you teach me how to contort my brain like that?

[Bingle]

Again, cork approached that in the exact same way I did

After a bunch of people called you town for it.

Like... that's the distinction.

Player A does antitown behavior.

Player B says Player A is probably town because scum wouldn't be so blatant.

Player C immediately copies Player A.

Player C gets no towncred there.

Vork is the intersection of "Lynching townvork probably helps town win the game anyway" and "vork has been around enough that people can be read based on their treatment of the slot once it flips."

If you think there's a better wagon, argue why it's a better wagon.

[Bingle]

this fast Elements wagon kinda freaks me out.

Vork is super fucking hard to lynch and he shouldn't be. Makes me think there are buddies that won't vote him.

I'm expecting more scumhunting from a50.

Bingle is also being real quit today and its odd.

Didn’t there elements wagon that didn’t take off yesterday? Lends more credence to cork scum being protected, methinks.

Also, I’m quiet rn b/c I’ve lead on just about everyone who’s claimed investigative or been investigated. I’m gonna sheep for a while.

Still around if questions I need to answer come up, just kinda fucking done with being wrong for a minute.

[Bingle]

the idea that Vork is obvtown b/c he pushed to be gov and now is "bored" is laughable. He's just scum lurking it out. Also not that Mena is pushing FL as scum (even b4 the guilty claim) So why is vork gov push town but not FL's?

VOTE: Menalque

Agreed, Mena comes across as the scum in this convo. Ceph and FL both look vaguely towny (yeah, FL is probably gambiting, but even if he isn't I'm okay with letting ceph have a couple days to conceal the gambit/nongambit nature from multipleballs).

Elements also looks bad, fwiw, because of the way Mena is trying to chain lynches from Ele to FL.

Still more than happy to lynch vork.

[Bingle]

It remains ridiculously hard to lynch Vorkuta for no reason.

I await the claim largely ambivalently. It's not a bad lynch, just an incredibly meh one.

[Bingle]

Yes, usually when you try to lynch someone for no reason people dont go for it.

I mean... 98 posts and not a one of them doing anything even close to useful is a pretty good reason imo.

He might be town, sure, but if he is he's not a big loss.

[Bingle]

Asking red haired elf to claim is like outing IC. The very small information advantage town has over scum should stay that way until a good opportunity presents itself.

This is aggressively wrong. Bodyguard is not even approaching a clear in multiball, especially when killflavor supports sk kill. It’s just not an important piece of information.

Mena trying to frame tse as not policy based on his role and then omgus omg Dave when he pointed it out is all sorts of icky.

Dave seems obvtown.

Motivation remains low, mod interference strongly implies flavortown, alisaes complaints completely valid.

[Bingle]

This whole conversation about who chemist protected is aggressively dumb. It confirms nothing about anyone, and makes a bunch of noise about slots that aren't getting lynched today. Can we just kill someone already?

I liked RCE’s point, I don’t like the way bingle is defending Dave and I couldn’t be fucked to fight him heads up if he wants to shade me

Tell me more.

[Bingle]

Oh, masquerade ended? Did I win?

[Bingle]

I'd probs support lynching Gamma based on 7051, btw.

[Bingle]

Oh, hm. Nvm. Went back to check, but I'd thought we flipped longer ago than we had. I was thinking you saw the L5 flip and continued pushing TSE afterwards but then 'decided to reevaluate' when the game ended.

Turns out you didn't know TSE was town until roughly 22 hours ago.

[Bingle]

I dont think we should jump to conclusions about this vote moving power. If I were scum, I'd probably use it when both wagons were on town to make it look like I either had an agenda or was wifoming

It's almost certainly scum though, in that there's no town motivation to use it and not claim to be using it here.

Which means very little before massclaim, but is worth noting.

This has been Bingle, not really catching up, but pretending he has anyway.

[Bingle]

Damn, Nero was the inventor. He targeted me n1 and gave me a passive ability, unless there’s another inventor out there. It’s a very obvtown ability, sadly. PB was my target last night, no useful result.

VOTE: insidejob

Let’s not have a 100 page day this time.

[Bingle]

That said, there is something to be said for looking through Vorkuta's wagon yesterday for scum, because as far as I remember, Nero was the only one really pushing it.

I was pushing it. Pushing it real good.

[Bingle]

00.

coldheartedking was pelted to death with arrows!

They were

Jane Doe:

Ascension-Aligned Cult Recruit

13.

Menalque was sacrificed to Orcus N2!

They were

Margaret Krimsen:

Ascension-Aligned Lover Turned Cultist

@Leaf

[Bingle]

I targeted Firebringer.

I have not yet received results, but it is unlikely they will be useful.

if flavor leaf is a lyncher and his target is ceph, then he is linked to a wincon of having to get ceph.

And if they share a flavor it will make sense. I think the game has a theme based on a real book.

My flavor is explicitly from a homebrew campaign, so not completely.

[Bingle]

When do we think InsideJob was recruited? That may have influenced whether their hider claim was true or not.

Point.

@mod: If a cult recruiter had asked whether they would succeed in recruiting a hider on the same night as the hider acted, would you have answered? If I targeted a hider on the same night as they targeted someone would a non killing action go through?

[Bingle]

I'm going to take that as confirmation that a cult recruiter would not be told whether their action would go through on a hider, which in turn implies that inside job was a N1 recruit. OTOH, ali didn't have a motive to clear scum Zor as cult, so Zor is at worst cult and we're really not hurting against the cult atm.

Results came through, I continue to have no reason to believe that there's anything useful about FB you all should know.

I'm kind of interested in the reasoning on why we should believe the FL guilty in light of the flip.

[Bingle]

Theoretically they were town when that happened, but why was the lie detector tipped off then? :/

It's possible Mena was culted N1 and they were N2.

Maybe it's because they were wrong about a hide proving zoraster to be town? Like, if the wording of their hider role didn't preclude him from being third party, for example

Alternatively, they were a different investigation faking hider to draw a shot as a joat with bp.

If they were either cult or town with a result on group scum they would out it. If they were cult with no result, why fake clear zor when he could potentially know they were lying and thus shoot them? (Reminder: scum and cult are actively playing against each other.) tl;dr zor is probably town for the moment.

Someone asked and yes I do get information. Mostly it boils down to I wasn’t roleblocked, but :shrug:

Cult targets are slightly more difficult this game. Several people have claimed unrecruitable and the scum team are bombs. So cult not only has to target people who will live, but people they’re sure aren’t scum. Cult also has no reason to fake reads. That means the cult leader was likely someone townreading mena, although we still don’t need to focus there today.

Without explicit reasoning, the proportions are probably 6v1v1 or 4v4v1v1, not including benevolent 3p.

[Bingle]

I am Cobble Aligned.

[Bingle]

I mean, gobbles is conftown for the day. As is rauth.

I’m okay lynching Cyrus (sorry man) but none of the other suggestions speak to me so far.

I should probably go through the old and organize links and stuff too. I remember there being a ton of pseudoclears.

PEdit: not a bad take, but hunting cult is pretty meh rn.

[Bingle]

I’m vaguely supportive of AF Cyrus and Ico wagons. I need to organize notes and shit, but zor wagon is bad and I’ve explained why several times today.

[Bingle]

Maybe? I want to see a VC and I want to sit down and read the thread (yes, the whole thing) again before EoD. That should be today or tomorrow IRL.

[Bingle]

He claimed like some weak role. And not weak as in it does if it visits scum. Just that the power/utility of it is weak to the point he said it was not worth motivating.

I am technically an investigative role, but the worst investigation role I can possibly imagine. I am probably less likely than BB to get useful results.

If we're playing the flavor gaming game, why aren't we forcing a flavor massclaim while we still have a flavorcop to semi ensure that people don't lie about their flavor?

I'm Delilah "Chastity" Fenton, specifically noted to come from a homebrew. From the picture, I'm likely an elf (although the long white/silver hair covers my ears so I might be a human) and probably either a paladin or and inquisitor. Full plate, bigass sword.

Wooper push looks pretty garbo for EP specifically. All Amrun's role says is that there is a killing role in {EP/Zoraster/Wooper/UT} which targeted FF IF the flavorspec that an Aasimar killed FF is accurate, and the false dichotomy of that role being Wooper/Zor is just that. I can't remember any good reason to think EP was town recently, and while he did have a few good posts in the early game, nothing wasn't pretty easily fakeable as scum. UT is probably? town by role, but there's nothing preventing a Cult Cop from being scum. Hell, if the cult cop IS scum claiming early like this is a good way to get targeted by cult and kill them.

Amrun's role is best used to give us additional information after our suspect pools are narrow and not to unilaterally guide lynches when there are four potential names in her pool.


FWIW, I'm about 2/3 of the way through on my reread.

[Bingle]

If they thought it might earn them towncred or they could pass it off as benevolent 3P, sure.

PEdit: Fine, I suppose this can't go any worse than our last leashed geek

Unvote

Vote: Flavor Leaf

Still think this is correct too.

There is a > 80% chance flavor is town.

[Bingle]

Claimed:

Wooper Paranoid Bat Owner (Reflexive Silencer)
Untrod Tripod (Cult Cop) - {Gamma, Ceph, PB}
Amrun (Gated Forensic Investigator) - {The Fonz, UT, Pine, Titus, Gobbledygook, PB} {Korina, EP, Zor, TSE, Woop, UT} {FL, EP, Korina, Zor, BBmolla, Pine}
Bingle: Investigative, nothing useful on BB, Kidamn, PB, FB. Received an Invention (unused) N1.
xofelf: Knows how many cult are alive.
Pink Ball: 3p
Flavor Leaf: Universal Deputy
RCEnigma: Daycop (Rauth town)
Miss Lynch: 3p
Elements: Vig (Creature N2)
zoraster: Blocked N2

Confirmed-ish

Firebringer - Poisoner {Nero killed by poison}
Rautherdir - Gated Lie Detector (Guiltied on AliKise N1, No claim so far on N2?)
BBmolla: Flavor Cop (Confirmed by FL N1)
gobbledygook: FN (Confirmed by BB)


Extant, but unclaimed

Post restrictor: Gobble claims to have been targeted N0
Roleblocking role: BBmolla (N2) and Zor (N2) both claim to have actions that have failed.
Vote Manipulation: Zor voting vork.
Motivator: Targeted Bingle N1, BB N2.
Messenger, possibly informed (Sent message to Gobbles N2.)

Unclaimed:

Pine
Iconeum
Gamma Emerald
Dr Easy Bake
AaronFrost
davesaz
pisskop
cyrus62
Cephrir
chennisden
Almost50
KidAmn
EspressoPatronum

I think this is an accurate summation of current claims.

[Bingle]

Addendum, Implied by {messenger} that redirection exists.

Also, you can just say redirection. You don't need to say :bad, but super bad with vigs:.

[Bingle]

Also no it's not explicitly stated that scum are or are not multitasking but I think by default I'd assume they aren't. That seems like something the mod would make known to the town. But it's another reason I asked about daychat. That's also not stated by the mod either way.

Eh. Multitasking was the norm when the setup was designed and daychat was not. Both are resounding maybes.

[Bingle]

- Do not ask about roles, the setup, or if you should have received a PM.

Just gonna assume the mod's answer is a giant ASCII middle finger because he seems to be anti clarification.

I was going by your info on the roleblock, Zor, so if it's N3 that should be fixed. No idea if anyone else has claimed blocked, but I thought both you and BB claimed your actions failed last night and for some reason thought that was N2.

I am okay with wagons on any of {wooper/Ico/DEB/AF/Cyrus/EP} I don't particularly want to end the day just yet. I DO think mass flavorclaim shuts up a bunch of noise while giving us very little risk, as roles seem to be only vaguely connected to flavor.

Don't particularly want to lynch Elements, despite it likely being an SK. SK has to deal with both cult and scum so should be townsiding at this point and scum doesn't want to leave them alive because they're a source of kills that can target scum. It's probably self resolving. Besides, more bodies is good.

I also don't care about giving elements a pool to shoot from, because if they make a hilariously bad kill we just immediately lynch them so SK Elements is always going to at least shoot within the PoE.

[Bingle]

I checked a post by Bingle (3768) night 1.

Fucking dammit. I don't want to be conftown. Why did everyone target me N1.

[Bingle]

Nah, outing your result here was right. I'm just annoyed it was on me. Probably still not gonna eat a nightkill for it because I've been really low impact + cult, but :shrugs:.

RCE, was your invention a ring? Don't claim what it does, I just want to know if it's likely we got the same power.

[Bingle]

Chenn was pinging me as town earlier

If y'all wanna lie detect Wooper, we lynch Icon

I mean this in the nicest way because I know you're trying to play the game too but being claimed 3p I'm more inclined to not follow any of your lynches or reads. Same goes with the rest of the 3ps trying to play chief.

I unironically trust PB fully.

[Bingle]

I'm not sure we should do that. Scum can use the flavor to hunt PRs in the night posts.

You mean as opposed to the claimed Lie detector, universal cop backup, multiple conftown, and multiple town killing role claims? Also, I don't think there's a clear enough connection that the concern is pressing, tbh.

I don't think scum wins this by playing Power Role Whack A Mole and if they'd like to try then I say let them.

[Bingle]

Bingle is your dominance fleeting?

I understand your question but decline to answer. I AM notified whenever I use it though.

[Bingle]

Excuse you, but he's in the list of 6 I just said I'd lynch.

[Bingle]

We're not even forcing people to make posts I can check at the moment. That will happen before I even consider a flavor mass-claim.

Who hasn't posted I am Cobble Aligned/can win with cobble?

Also, people should really post the former if it's true, as the latter implies 3p and we should probably keep track of how many 3p claims there are.

[Bingle]

bingle thoughts on zor

I've actually liked his recent stuff a lot more. His claim to have been blocked on the same night as we already have a missing action (I think) seems >rand town, his reluctance to full claim is NAI, and his approach to wooper wagon seems consistent with town trying to figure it out.

Honestly, EP is the scummiest of the 4 in Amrun's pool atm, but none of them are particularly KILLITWITHFIRE.

[Bingle]

Roleblocker wouldn't have targeted me night 1 as town.

Actually backwards, I think? You claimed a day action, so you were the best roleblock target from a town PoV.

[Bingle]

Spicy.

[Bingle]

I mean...

I think he's probably lying. But he also said it kills him eventually and he's a cop, so... Let him kill himself?

[Bingle]

kidman probably town though.

[Bingle]

So, I just realized that The Fonz has the same last name as me. That's a thing, I guess.

[Bingle]

VOTE: Iconeum

VOTE: Iconeum

"A wagon that forms via blank votes after encouragement from a claimed 3p is not attractive to town"

Ok buddy

VOTE: Iconeum

[Bingle]

Ugh. This makes it more complicated.

Not really.

It means your role is best used as we get a bunch of lists of potential killers and solve in those lists when we hit endgame. You're like a tracker. You get significantly more useful the longer the game lasts.

[Bingle]

People scumreading Flavor here is pretty hilarious, ngl.

[Bingle]

That's how you know he's town.

[Bingle]

People scumreading Flavor here is pretty hilarious, ngl.

Staaaaaahp. No pocket

[Bingle]

50% Wynaut
50% Good Company

[Bingle]

I dunno, Amrun's claimed role makes it extremely likely that it's just Wooper?

My reservation on the wooper thing is: EP's push there is gross. I see it as likely to be chaining town lynches. Wooper's reaction seemed entirely reasonable, but everyone was acting like it was unreasonable.

With that said, I'm not townreading wooper and it's not a bad wagon. It's just not the slam dunk OMG THIS IS SCUM 100% people seem to want to paint it as.

[Bingle]

I dunno, Amrun's claimed role makes it extremely likely that it's just Wooper?

My reservation on the wooper thing is: EP's push there is gross. I see it as likely to be chaining town lynches. Wooper's reaction seemed entirely reasonable, but everyone was acting like it was unreasonable.

With that said, I'm not townreading wooper and it's not a bad wagon. It's just not the slam dunk OMG THIS IS SCUM 100% people seem to want to paint it as.

his reaction sucked rhino cock. are we reading the same game?

if you don't think it's a bad wagon then let's just do it and get this over with. we have to deal with the slot at some point unless we want to just ignore Amrun's role.

VOTE: iconhe seems to be acting weird this game

I thought this was getting replaced?

I don't like how this Icon wagon appeared out of nowhere. We need to lynch in Amrun's list. Period.

This, btw, is exactly what I don't like about the wooper wagon.

"There's circumstantial evidence that there might be scum in (list of 4 people) so we ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO LYNCH THERE AND NO WHERE ELSE!"

Also, what about wooper's reaction doesn't seem town? This seems like a perfectly reasonable response to the solidity of the guilty on him. He's lurking, sure, but so are half of my townreads, so... :shrug:

[Bingle]

Can I just say I have reason to exceedingly believe EP is town

So if anyone is remotely thinking that is scum you're a fool

Press doubt to x.

[Bingle]

Dude, the lie detector who was cop innod says I’m town.

[Bingle]

Because of cult, you can’t really say people are town inno’d because they can just get culted afterwards

Actually, xof has to be cult for me to be cult right now. Further, given the info was outed today y’all can pretty much assume I’m not cult cause anyone who would recruit me wouldn’t be sure enough I was town to risk it. There’s a pretty good chance I get culted tonight though.

[Bingle]

No we shouldn’t.

Like, if you think people are scummy say so, but targeting a vig beyond don’t shoot conftown has a high potential of backfiring.

I posted a list of people I’d lynch a while ago that is a decent start if they’re absolutely without direction.

[Bingle]

Claim: FBI Agent. Elements is an SK.

[Bingle]

I’m gonna be low availability for a while, because cross country move. I intend to check the site at least once per day in the interim, but am unsure how long I will be on data and thus phone posting without in depth reading.

As such

@mod: V/LA 2 weeks. I will endeavor to post during this timeframe, but cannot guarantee 1 per 48 hours.

Additionally, all of my previous targets are confirmed not SK.

UT’s role mirrors mine and is thus likely true. If we can reasonably lynch cult we should do so today. Which means we shouldn’t lynch elements.

[Bingle]

Bingle, how do you suggest we go about lynching cult?

Someone with more free time should compile the list of people that are potentially cult leader. We lynch out of that pool.

PB full claims.

Elements is probably going to try to help miss Lynch’s wincon so that he has a chance at winning and exiting before endgame as miss lynch just implied is possible.

Regardless, elements is confirmed to not be the biggest threat to town right now and has to kill both cult and scum to have a chance, so we can safely ignore him for the moment. I’m not really worried about him shooting me tbh, as there isn’t likely to be a second sk so my utility is minimal.

[Bingle]

Im kind of for leashing an sk, if only to not waste a lynch on what ml is claiming. and the extra town-driven kill is nice

^

Also, lynching elements means we have to then lynch ml, which is two cult recruits without a lynch between them.

EP claimed to be confirmable, btw, resolve that today.

[Bingle]

Menalque: (xofelf, Rautherdir, Amrun, Elements, Pine, EspressoPatronum)

TrueSoulEnergy: (pisskop, Miss Lynch, Untrod Tripod, Cephrir, zoraster, KidAmn)

I haven’t analyzed flavor yet but assuming at this moment that TSE was killed by zoraster.

If bingle didn't get my letter n3 then I was also blocked that night which confirms multitasking.

I got a letter during a dayphase and crumbed it shortly after receiving it, but my night result that night was delayed that night too.

This enter/ico byplay is dumb and neither is a good lynch choice. Ico, this is a cult game. We literally can’t afford multiple lynches on roles that can’t snowball into us losing in the next couple of days. Stop arguing that we do so.

We need to confirm both flavor cops abilities, but neither is a good lynch for today.

Cult recruiter is likely a player with no confirmable role or an anti scum investigation role. People with confirmable roles who haven’t been scanned by rauth should claim immediately. EP should claim whether he is multi shot or not.

RCE and Gobbles have my personal endorsement as “the most conftown player in the game” for listen to their posts, because both are objectively saying the right things to focus on today. Gobbles, could you wallpost your reasons for discounting others as cultist? I trust, but want to verify.

Ico should redirect ep onto one of me/RCE/gobbles/anyone else who is consensus or mech obvtown at the end of day today to prevent nk/rolestopper shenanigans.

[Bingle]

@People who received inventions: Without telling me what the inventions are, are they strong abilities?

Conditionally so, in that they're useful if certain things happen.

They are vastly stronger because of their nature as inventions, vastly weaker if it is known precisely what they do, and pretty much useless if they go to scum.

I'm being intentionally confusing, but they are very protown in nature.

[Bingle]

Can we please get some unvoted. Chennisden claimed double voter and could very easily lolhammer Ico. Ico is at L-3.

Chenn, doublevote me to confirm.

[Bingle]

I am significantly more worried about the mafia right now than a cult that's at 2 members

Agressively backwards, but understandable. Cult snowballs, mafia is limited. We've already taken out three mafia players, and the more mafia there are the more likely we are to get a cult suicide result.

[Bingle]

Eh.

I think the dual factors of there being likely 4 more scum at most and the sheer number of not groupscum players left in the game make them a minor issue. FWIW, I agree that full massclaim is unnecessary, but massclaim within Gobble's list of likely cult players is a pretty decent middle ground. Particularly Dave and DEB.

Also,

@Dave: Solve?

[Bingle]

Miss Lynch isn't an SK. At least for now.

[Bingle]

I'm not sure why that matters.

[Bingle]

I mean...

If we actually care if the outed SK is a nexus the correct answer is use a flavor cop to check.

I don't know why we'd care if the outed SK is a nexus.

I am also continuing to act on the chance that there is another SK, although I kinda doubt it.

Either way it's really not important rn.

[Bingle]

@Rauth. This one, not the death-aligned post.

i literally just have to ensure that there is enough death that orcus is satisfied and we win and then leave. which we achieve by getting to <10 players

which is something i've personally been pushing for by killing scum

but if you kill elements i become sk and then i lose that wincon and it's two more players you ahve to worry about

Eh. Miss Lynch dies if we get below 10 players and he doesn't exit (and there's something to be said for group scum shooting Miss Lynch, because then we have to lynch Elements). I'd prefer finding
scum players who don't already have an expiration date.

[Bingle]

I feel like Ceph's call to slow down is reasonable. We have a normal game's worth of players at this point and a very small pool of recruiter options. The speed of the dave wagon is interesting, but not the only thing we need to focus on today.

[Bingle]

So I agree with Ceph, Bingle, and Xofelf about needing to re-examine the game, but I also feel like it’s slightly hypocritical in that they do not offer any insights or leads on to how or where we should focus.

I mean... you are correct sir.

I'm interested in dave/gamma/ceph but I feel those are all lukewarm takes at best. I just don't have enough of a finger on the pulse of the game to provide more direction and as conftown (or damned close) I am not the best person to be providing it.

[Bingle]

These messages are flavored as political writings and I'm assuming don't contain useful information (I don't get a copy). Bingle confirmed he received one as well as whom I wrote it about.

Can confirm. Letter was signed Lady Estelle and mostly rambled about me disapproving of my sister's love life.

I crumbed receipt of this with a post mentioning that I had just then realized TheFonz was my sister via flavor. Our last names are both Fenton.

[Bingle]

01. Pine - Motivator (Confirmed to exist)
09. BBmolla - Flavor Cop (Confirmed to Exist)
19. Pink Ball -- INNOCENT CHILD (Confirmed to exist)
23. RCEnigma - Messenger (Confirmed to Exist)
32. gobbledygook - Friendly Neighbor (Confirmed to Exist)
26. Elements - SK (Confirmed via night result and ML claim)

02. Untrod Tripod - PI
08. Rautherdir - Lie Detector
15. Bingle - FBI Agent
17. xofelf - Knows number of cult
25. Miss Lynch - Backup SK, makes SK viable to win with town.
34. chennisden - Faith Healer
28. pisskop - Random JoaT, flavor meshes
38. KidAmn - JK

18. Gamma Emerald (Not Cult N1)
33. Cephrir (Not Cult N2)

21. Dr Easy Bake
24. davesaz
36. Almost50
40. EspressoPatronum

I'm not sure if I missed any claims. If I did, please share. I think EP was confirmed via something, but I'm not sure what. Of category 2, KA can be confirmed to exist via targeting someone who has a tangible night result. (Myself, perhaps?) Xof, ML, Chen, and pk have minor equity as cult leader/scum. DEB, Dave, A50, EP similar.

[Bingle]

my first two recruits are always Bingle

This, btw, is a lie, but one I believe to be noncultindicative.

A50 absolutely would not have culted me because he would have been too concerned I was scum to risk it, (although he probably would have since I was confed), but town/scum A50 probably wouldn't have thought about that where cult A50 would be imminently aware that I wasn't a likely cult target early.

[Bingle]

xof is NOT CULT

Unless you were compromised post claim. I'm Occams razoring that you weren't culted before then, but it is feasible that you were culted and then cleared a cult player after the fact.

I'm not particularly interested in lynching xof atm tho.

[Bingle]

or, and this is my preference, elements could play to his win condition instead

Elements playing to his wincon right now is to play to keep the game going long enough to have ML's ability activate. The biggest threat to that is cult. Therefore, Elements should shoot for cult.

Scum should shoot people outside of the lynch pool who are likely to be cult or ML, because cult is the biggest immediate threat and shooting ML means we have to lynch Elements, which is a lynch we spend on not groupscum. Which one of these they want is based on whether they think cult can be bigger than scum, which at the moment looks likely.

I'm not going to talk about optimal recruitments because town gains nothing from cult recruiting optimally.

[Bingle]

I also think it’s weird because he investigated again last night when we had found the serial killer.

I mean... there's a nonzero chance of multiple serial killers. There's utility in knowing if my ability fails. And, perhaps most importantly, my ability is compulsive.

If we're leashing DEB it's onto a kill target. I'd be happy to see Elements kill DEB and Gamma.

EP 100% uses his vig today because holy shit we're not letting cult have that even some of the time.

Gobble's list looks okay-ish to me.

Dave, eta on being useful?

[Bingle]

Wait. If Deb was a hider... how did BB get a result on him

Because the most common implementation of hider isn't ascetic? It only stops kills.

[Bingle]

01. Pine - Motivator (Confirmed to exist)
09. BBmolla - Flavor Cop (Confirmed to Exist)
19. Pink Ball -- INNOCENT CHILD (Confirmed to exist)
23. RCEnigma - Messenger (Confirmed to Exist)
32. gobbledygook - Friendly Neighbor (Confirmed to Exist)
26. Elements - SK (Confirmed via night result and ML claim)
40. EspressoPatronum - Dayvig (Confirming or dying today)

02. Untrod Tripod - PI
08. Rautherdir - Lie Detector
15. Bingle - FBI Agent
17. xofelf - Knows number of cult
25. Miss Lynch - Backup SK, makes SK viable to win with town.
34. chennisden - Faith Healer
28. pisskop - Random JoaT, flavor meshes
38. KidAmn - JK

18. Gamma Emerald (Not Cult N1)
33. Cephrir (Not Cult N2)

21. Dr Easy Bake - Hider
24. davesaz
36. Almost50

I'm not sure if I missed any claims. If I did, please share. I think EP was confirmed via something, but I'm not sure what. Of category 2, KA can be confirmed to exist via targeting someone who has a tangible night result. (Myself, perhaps?) Xof, ML, Chen, and pk have minor equity as cult leader/scum. DEB, Dave, A50, EP similar.

Kills in the last category are the best, followed by kills in the second then the third, from a mechanical standpoint. Of the second category, myself, ML, Rauth, and Kid are bad options atm for various reasons.

My list would probably be {DEB, Dave, A50, chen, xof}. I wouldn't mind PK. Gamma is a lower priority given the early not cult result from UT, although he's definitely high groupscum equity given the passivity. If we're gonna double up on killing DEB, he's definitely not the dayvig, though. And I still want to hear from Dave about his promised contributions before the trigger is pulled.

[Bingle]

This was made in 2013. 0% chance if DEB is a hider it’s the most common version

2013 hider was about even split between ascetic and non, and weak was implied by the role. It's not a smoking gun.

DEB claimed specifically weak hider which is more eyebrow raising in itself.

Him dying is still +equity, although if he can die without losing us a town controlled kill that would be preferable. Similar to Rauth.

[Bingle]

Unconfirmed role, not townreading you, potentially cult leader.

I'd prefer other people die over you due to the theoretical utility of your role, but I won't shed a tear if you get shot. :shrug: The random nature of your results format claim also makes this unlikely to change.

[Bingle]

2013 hider was about even split between ascetic and non, and weak was implied by the role. It's not a smoking gun.

DEB claimed specifically weak hider which is more eyebrow raising in itself.

Was it really all the way back then? I thought the change happened more recently.

Why is the weak aspect the part that gives you pause?

Hider variants have always been a thing. I myself had a non weak version that was also a gunsmith given to me around 2013 in what was then a Normal game (variant role). The recent change was from hider being assumed weak to hider being just the "dies if target dies, otherwise unkillable" aspect. Explicitly naming it as weak is only something that's been relevant since the Normal updates, but still not damning because it's entirely reasonable to think chk might have updated role names or DEB might have just specified weak because he is aware of the addition to the role.

More than that though, the combination of no crumbs, targeting someone who he is unlikely to be able to read as town without crumbs, being willing to lynch a clear, and targeting someone he wouldn't trust even with the confirmation of their alignment makes it so I don't particularly believe the claim, but the fact that it's not the hider commuter combo variant isn't especially interesting.

[Bingle]

NO. You canNOT target the Hider directly. EVERYTHING fails. You are investigating an "empty home" because te Hider leaves home and "hides" at someone else's home. You target the person they are hiding behind and you get a result (ex: If DEB was hiding behind me, the only way you get a result on him is by targeting me. In that case, you get a double result, so your claimed role would have returned "Not SK, Not SK". That's how you know you targeted someone with a Hider behind them).

That is one of the various hider variants, yes, but not the most common one now or in 2013.

[Bingle]

I know EPs power
TSE was a failure
I know cephs role name
I know ml's character name
gams was a failure

Point to where you said EP's power before EP or cephs role name before ceph please, because I see neither, meaning you're still unconfirmed role.

hider has always meant 'immune to any other action' and has traditionally acted almost first in the NAR. im fact, hider is the only counter to strongman I know of.

bingle, are you cult?

You might wanna go check the wiki, but I did mention that there are a fuckton of hider variants, which again, you've mentioned one of. The variant you're talking about (weak and ascetic) was about half of the meta in 2013.

[Bingle]

Updated:

At least one degree of role confirmation:

01. Pine - Motivator (Confirmed to exist)
09. BBmolla - Flavor Cop (Confirmed to Exist)
19. Pink Ball -- INNOCENT CHILD (Confirmed to exist)
23. RCEnigma - Messenger (Confirmed to Exist)
28. pisskop - Random JoaT, flavor meshes (Confirmed via softing? Ceph)
32. gobbledygook - Friendly Neighbor (Confirmed to Exist)
26. Elements - SK (Confirmed via night result and ML claim)
40. EspressoPatronum - Getting confirmed today or dying.


Claimed but not confirmed

02. Untrod Tripod - PI
08. Rautherdir - Lie Detector (Confirmable via Death)
15. Bingle - FBI Agent
17. xofelf - Anti Cult Spotter
21. Dr Easy Bake (Weak Hider) (Confirmable via Death)
25. Miss Lynch - Backup SK, makes SK viable to win with town.
34. chennisden - Faith Healer
36. Almost50 - Martyr (Unjester?)
38. KidAmn - JK (Confirmable via targeting player with visible results (Bingle, Pine, BB)

Cult Copped but not Claimed

18. Gamma Emerald (Not Cult N1)
33. Cephrir (Not Cult N2)

Unclaimed and unconfirmed

24. davesaz

@dave: eh. Random JOAT in this case is dreaming god esque. He targets and uses a random one of 5 abilities. I don't see that as an exact counterclaim, but I also don't really believe the claim.
@pk: Of your list, Rauth and DEB both claimed roles that die, I've been copped, and KA is pretty much the strongest remaining PR. Pine is fairly town via claim. GE is aggressively not cult leader.
@Gamma (I think): I didn't include cult cop targets after N3 because they were either independently confirmed not to be cult (the sk) or untrustworthy because they came after the claim when it was very likely UT would be recruited.


There's an inconsistency that makes me think Ceph/pk are groupscum together.

Spoiler:

Well it seems incorrect for one, so you saying you can confirm yourself is disingenuous.

Except ceph can confirm i knew his flavor.

and sometimes not even that, but some nonsense like 'dwarven barkeep, but you forget his name'

Cephir made a comment earlier that made me feel like he was also Thode because he thought he was my lynched target, but we’re just soulmates, and that’s how my best bud Cephir and I bud around.

Cephir isnt a thode.

And if what you are saying is true than ceph isnt your buddy.

but it does explain why you and he are connected.

I know EPs power
TSE was a failure
I know cephs role name
I know ml's character name
gams was a failure

PK claims to know ceph's role name, while it is hard implied that he knows his flavor to be a dwarven barkeeper from this series of posts. (The FL enemy post particularly, as FL claimed to be a drunk who was stuck in town because of a barkeep he owed money to.) This, of course might mean that both are scum together, but likely means that they are both not cult. Or at least, not cult recruiter.

[Bingle]

@UT can you give us a list of who you cult copped + on what night?

I see the information is in your ISO, but it's a real pain to figure out when it all happened.

In order:

Gamma
Ceph
PB
Zor (Thought this was Ele, for some reason, but it's still an irrelevant result)
Xof

[Bingle]

@UT can you give us a list of who you cult copped + on what night?

I see the information is in your ISO, but it's a real pain to figure out when it all happened.

oh wow I wonder how Bingle figured that out

it's almost as if he he has fucking superpowers

[Bingle]

I have a flavor result from RCEnigma that strongly implies Dave is not C.L.

FTR, I'm not sure what an incriminating flavor message from RCE would look like for the cult, nor do I particularly trust RCE's role to be overtly useful in this fashion.

I'd rather kill A50 over the night phase out of a twisted love for 3ps. I'd rather kill DEB over the nightphase out of a desire to conserve lynches. I'd rather kill Rauth via hammer. I'd rather confirm KA than kill him.

Of the remaining players, I think we should be killing exclusively in groups 2 and 4 until the Cult leader is dead. After Cult Leader is dead, cult should be unable to recruit and thus less of an issue than group scum, meaning we focus on Group Scum. Due to the claim, scum probably shoots ML after cult is dealt with but before we have 10 people remaining, so that's a thing.

There is a slight chance that pk/ceph is a cult gambit to pseudo clear pk as not cult leader via action. I don't really buy that, though, as they've been setting up for it for a long time.

Thus I would prefer EP shoot in {UT/Bingle/Xof/ML/Chenn/Dave/PK} and then we also lynch in that pool.

ACTION GUIDE:

DEB targets A50, who is also vig killed by Elements. KA targets someone whose ability has a tangible effect (preferably me or Pine as strong cult/NK options) but doesn't specify which. Tomorrow, KA claims his target first, and then we corroborate or counter as relevant. Pine motivates Rauth, since Rauth is dying at the end of the day tomorrow regardless. Rauth uses two lie detects unless the second would explicitly either kill him or prevent him from dying (say, by removing his vote). We still need to come up with an investigation pool for that. RCE sends a message about our 3p to someone trustworthy, potentially someone who has already received one BUT who is not a potential JK target. Survivors among BB/pk/UT/chen/dave/ceph/ge should all be able to make their own decisions about who to target, although a word of caution me/Pine is a bad protection given KA should already be there. If guidance is needed let me know.

[Bingle]

Rauth claimed that if he activates as a lie detector once more he becomes a priest (dies if he casts the hammer vote). I would rather he die by casting the hammer vote than be vigged/lynched.

A50 has claimed (softed?) that he wins if we shoot him over the night phase, which I have no problem allowing to happen.

DEB dying in a protown use of his power is better than DEB dying via lynch/vig, but the PoE is small enough that I don't particularly think it's worth it to use him as an investigation at this point, especially since I don't really trust him to be true claiming.

If A50 dies and DEB doesn't, we lynch DEB. If DEB dies and A50 doesn't, that's a guilty on A50. Elements wants to kill as many people as possible as fast as possible, so the kill that makes 2 people die is optimal for him.

Did you understand everything else?

[Bingle]

I don’t feel comfortable telegraphing that much power, Bingle. Depending on how today goes, I could get behind Elements killing DEB/A50 in one fell swoop.

It's really not telegraphing a lot of power.

In addition to the DEB/A50/Elements triad, I'm only really directing KA, Pine and RCE. RCE is of questionable use, and I'm directing Kid Amn to protect one of two people who are both high priority targets for both cult and scum. KA can't not go along with it if compromised because it would mean he's instantly caught. Pine can't not go along with it if compromised because it would mean he's instantly caught. Scum could kill Rauth to stop two investigations, but they'd also be spending a nightkill to not advance their wincon given that Rauth is a dead man walking anyway.

I can agree to delaying the discussion of whether Rauth hammers til he would need to hammer though. Really we should be completely reevaluating tomorrow anyway based on a metric fuckton of information via flips and associations.

[Bingle]

That argument does nothing for me. Do something town if you want to live.

Do something town even if you don't want to live. There's a boatload of analysis in the thread, but not a lot of feels reads and you're a decent feels-reads-player. I promise to come back to your reads if you flip town and I'm not likely to be going anywhere any time soon.

[Bingle]

Also, Bingle, you do realize if Kid protects Pine then I can't get motivated, right? I need people to target within and have posts I can target before we end the day anyways.

Yup. I'm assuming Pine's cult because holy shit how do you not recruit the motivator.

[Bingle]

also i'm working through d2 now and i so far i think we are focusing on all the wrong people today

FWIW, I agree that there's scum in group 1. I just want to kill the CL before the game becomes unwinnable.

[Bingle]

The last line is weird, Bingle, and it feels overtly pockety

Yup?

I want you active. I don't have to care how I look because unless I was cult recruited recently I'm town and I'm objectively the least cult person in the thread atm so I can be as pockety as I want.

PEdit:

I'm still shooting for CL over groupscum, ceph.

[Bingle]

Why not out the masonry if it's already presumably compromised?

[Bingle]

I don't want to know more about the possible masonry right now, though it would be a pretty nice claim for cult.

Why not?

There are cop clears, a friendly neighbor claim, and an Innocent child that scum already aren't killing.

Our biggest threat is the Cult Leader, who is necessarily not a mason unless the mason PM is specifically Not Mafia.

BB says he thinks a mason has already been recruited to the cult.

I see absolutely no reason not to pursue this today, especially when it is potentially useful in narrowing down the cult leader.

[Bingle]

Targeting ML will allow us to determine if you're the town version of a special role that was scum last game.

No it won’t. Either way the role can be scum or town. He’s just almost certainly not CL.

[Bingle]

I have been cleared
by a lie detector have you?

Yes. When were you cleared again?

And yes, I was lurking while moving across country. I’m going to go back to lurking when the trailer with my stuff shows up. Keep pushing that angle, it’s cute.

[Bingle]

Updated:

At least one degree of role confirmation:

01. Pine - Motivator (Confirmed to exist)
09. BBmolla - Mason Flavor Cop (Confirmed to Exist)
19. Pink Ball -- INNOCENT CHILD (Confirmed to exist)
23. RCEnigma - Messenger (Confirmed to Exist)
32. gobbledygook - mason Vig (Confirmed to Exist)
26. Elements - SK (Confirmed via night result and ML claim)
40. EspressoPatronum - Dayvig+


Claimed but not confirmed

02. Untrod Tripod - PI
08. Rautherdir - Lie Detector (Confirmable via Death)
15. Bingle - FBI Agent
17. xofelf - Anti Cult Spotter
21. Dr Easy Bake (Weak Hider) (Confirmable via Death)
25. Miss Lynch - Backup SK, makes SK viable to win with town.
34. chennisden - Faith Healer
36. Almost50 - Martyr (Unjester?)
38. KidAmn - JK (Confirmable via targeting player with visible results (Bingle, Pine, BB)

Cult Copped but not Claimed

18. Gamma Emerald (Not Cult N1)
33. Cephrir (Not Cult N2)

Unclaimed and unconfirmed

24. davesaz

Notes for PB. Rauth is self resolving and probs dies tomorrow. A50 claimed Unjester which is much less scummy than survivor given he wants to die via vig/groupscum/sk and there’s an SK claim. I still support DEB suiciding behind A50. Also there are three cultists via xof.

Of your Should die, I’m vaguely trusting of UT’s not CL claim on Gamma.

@gobs: if cL flip shoot for group scum. If not cl shoot in groups 2 and 4.

[Bingle]

I don’t think you’re dying tonight because you’re pretty obv not group scum via pk. I’d say claim tomorrow so cult doesn’t know if you’re worth recruiting.

[Bingle]

{UT/Bingle/Xof/ML/Chenn/Dave/PK}

Being right about pk didn’t change my opinion here. Chenn/Dave are also the only ones that don’t have a reason not to kill them.

Also, my suggested actions remain unchanged.

[Bingle]

If we miss the CL in our Lynch, we need Elements to target one of the other CL options while KidAmn targets another. We can have gobble shoot the third.

Imo:
lynch DEB,
jail UT,
SK chenn,
vig A50 or Gamma

This is an awful list. Not only are you lynching the only potentially self resolving role there, you're giving the SK the target that is least likely to be useful to the SK to shoot. Gamma can't be CL unless UT was compromised on D3 (preclaim). UT is a fucking awful JK target because he's both unlikely to be killed and potentially has useful results if town.

Putting forward terrible lists distracts from the perfectly viable one we already have.

DEB, hide behind A50.
Elements, kill A50 because it kills two players and gets you closest to your wincon.
KA, jail either me or Pine. Your choice, don't specify which until Night.
Pine, motivate Rauth.
Rauth, lie detect people who are not conftowned, I'll give you a list in a moment when I look at the various conftowning claims.
Vigs, vig for Cult Leader (groups 2 and 4 of my claimlist). If chenn flips cult leader, vig for scum.

VOTE: Chenn

I think it's more that cultists really don't matter right now.

Okay, let me explain this a moment. Lynching a recruited cultist is bad. We want to hit CL > Groupscum > Killing 3P > Cultists > Town. If we kill off the first three groups, it becomes a game with no scum nightkills, meaning we can just no lynch until UT has investigated everyone then lynch UT. And then we have a nice nightless setup with people who may or may not be able to be made completely IC. People who are cleared early are effectively still cleared by this metric, because they are at best worse lynches than Elements.

[Bingle]

Confirmations in descending order of strength:

34. chennisden - De facto lynch, so no need to sort.
19. Pink Ball (Mod Confirmed not CL or Groupscum)
09. BBmolla (Mutually confirmed not CL or Groupscum with Gobbles)
32. gobbledygook (Mutually Confirmed not CL or Groupscum with BB)
26. Elements - SK (Confirmed via admission and my own Night action result)
40. EspressoPatronum (Confirmed Not CL or Groupscum via Rauth. Soft Confirmed Not groupscum via successful Dayvig)
15. Bingle (Confirmed Not CL or Groupscum via Rauth, Rauth is self resolving)
21. Dr Easy Bake (Dies tonight)
36. Almost50 (Dies tonight)
08. Rautherdir (Dies tomorrow without expending a vig/lynch)
18. Gamma Emerald (Not Cult N1 via UT, not cult prior to yesterday via combination of UT and xof)
33. Cephrir (Not Cult N2 via UT, not cult prior to yesterday via combination of UT and xof)
17. xofelf (Not Cult Today if UT is town)


That leaves lie detection in (Ordered via my preference, with reasoning):

02. Untrod Tripod - HIGH PRIORITY SORT. Knowing he's currently town gives us an higher degree of accuracy on the cult list than any other invest. He could also theoretically be CL with a ballsy claim, but that's really unlikely. If IC'd, probably not killed by GS early because he doesn't threaten them at all but does provide a weapon against their enemies.
24. davesaz - Suspicious, and probs not dying tonight given gobble trusts RC flavor message. Good Lie detect target.
23. RCEnigma - There's a thing here that's not worth claiming. Me and RCE crumbed a thing back and forth, and I'm going to out part of it, but I'd rather he be conftown if possible.
25. Miss Lynch - Probably killed by scum at some point, but I wouldn't mind sorting this. Very high cult equity.
01. Pine - Unarguably the best cult recruit, but probably not CL and almost certainly not GS based on the fact that he's provably motivating town and moderately confirmed town.
38. KidAmn - Very much doubt this is GS with a flipped roleblocker. Very much don't care if this is recruit with confirmable role.

[Bingle]

@Bingle your list assumes DEB is telling the truth. If Chenn flips town, we need to JK the next best CL candidate... which is DEB.

My list works just fine if we swap around UT, Chenn, and DEB accordingly.

If DEB survives the night, he is lynched tomorrow.
If DEB dies but A50 doesn't, it's a guilty on A50.
If A50 and DEB both die, WE DIDN'T WASTE A VIG OR A LYNCH ON EITHER.

Well, you can take pisskop off that list, 8722 reported true. My next price is becoming macho.

VOTE: Iconeum
I'm fine with this dying.

This means Rauth 110% casts the hammer vote tomorrow, btw.

[Bingle]

Me and RCE crumbed a thing back and forth, and I'm going to out part of it

I am either bullet proof or recruit proof, I will not specify which. There may be a restriction to this, but I am notified if this power is used. Nero gave me a magical item that made this happen on N1.