revO emaG - TENET

[petapan]

But here's a question for you: Do you think that the SB9-LLD interaction from day 1 was S-S?

Is that your current stance?

i think it's plausible

That's pretty wishy washy.

I want you to elaborate on that. Like, right now you're calling SB9 your most confident scum, right? am I wrong about that?

and so I'm asking, for you to really nail this down for me. If it's plausible, in what way?

yeah.

what do you mean in what way? that you'd stage a fight with your teammate early day 1 to get townread? because yeah you'd do that

but even independtly i just don't townread you as much as other people

[petapan]

annies probably town just from reading the tracker

also sb9 is practically openwolfing

[petapan]

did a quick skim through of this game that just ended:

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=85074

Peta/Mwb/Ico scum team stomped the town and their play looks nothing like what's going on in this game

Though it could be that Peta and Mwb just had like 0 respect for the town in the game so they both decided to straight up open wolf their way thru the entire game balls out.

in that game the town kind of ripped its own face off so we didn't have to do much and the best thing was to sit back and let it happen. the cumulative number of times any member of the scumteam was voted that game was 2.

but yes, midwaybear is very nervous as scum and it comes through in his posts, several times he expressed to me in the PT he didn't know what to say, and here he just does not have the feeling of nervousness in his posting at all.

one of the things we

did

do in that game (well, mainly iconeum i think) was abuse setup spec to get the town to axe its own PRs (including our dear moderator) by stepping in and going "gee i dunno guys do you really think the setup would have two investigatives, this seems too strong" and get people to ignore logic of how, say, a certain player would never claim the way they did as scum and was towntelling very hard, and instead go "but balance!" when it turns out most people just don't have a good idea of how setups are constructed

and so that's why people trying to come in and get someone voted purely off setup spec is so scummy to me

[petapan]

So, like, SB9 cries about needing to be turnstiled over here for pretty much most of the game, complains about there not being a lot going on in inverted on Day 2 while they were waiting for us to elim someone, and he pretty much knew he was coming over here Day 3 anyway, and he just decides not to read the first 3 Days of this thread?

BECAUSE HE'S FUCKING SCUM

[petapan]

in hindsight i probably shouldn't be giving spiffeh a pass for sheer total incuriosity; having a50 as his sole scumread is also pretty shite

[petapan]

yeah i don't think the reasoning about the something smart flip is a good case


i just still think lld's scum

[petapan]

like personally if i was scum i'd have dug my heels in against that flip way more, but getting getting him out of the way means less of a distraction and people have to consider other votes

[petapan]

challenge for ya pooky

Petapan
Deacon Blues (fferyllt/borkjerfkin)
Dandelion Wine (Cephrir/Cabd)
midwaybear
Firebringer
Lady Lambdadelta
skitter30
superbowl9
Annie Edison

what order do you put these names in because you're putting townreads on most of the people in this list

[petapan]

didnt you just enter the day talking about midwaybear this game being nothing like his scumgame

[petapan]

I could go for FB but I want to talk to him more first.

???

[petapan]

oh i forgot to ask:

skitter, does your read on annie change with their tracker being outed

[petapan]

oh i forgot to ask:

skitter, does your read on annie change with their tracker being outed

ehhhhhhh tilts it slightly +town
enough that i no longer feel the need to tell the other thread they're scum literally every time they post, and i imagine that if i ended up there i'd re-evaluate it a bit more to figure out if i need to continue pushing it

basically that + the fact that they are in fact in the other thread is enough for me to put it on pause for just now, if that makes sense

it has nothing to do with their reaction, just that dunnstral outed who their counterpart is and was wondering how you'd address the incongruity with your reads

[petapan]

i actually think the game probably doesnt make sense unless at least one of pooky or spiffeh is scum and spiffeh at least has maybe some role stuff going for him, and i think pooky is being extremely political with his reads and trying to take advantage of turning skitter against firebringer

[petapan]

i'm not sure i know what you're talking abt

5390

[petapan]

How did you get a night two result when the tracker is in the other timeline?

this i saw, i still don't know who the counterpart is so ... didn't have much of an effect on anything?

man i wish people would put on their thinking caps a little bit

Spoiler:

it's almost50, he was in their timestream night 1 and invered day 2, and also was crumbing the fuck out of his role, which people pointed out. this is why him being spiffeh's sole scumread super sucks

i don't think pooky is trying ot turn skitter against me, but maybe egging on a firebringer case or something

well i think he wants to maybe put her attention on you and not on lld

[petapan]

because if one's town i'm gonna assume the other is and the play of the tracker makes no sense from an informed perspective but all the sense in the world from an informed perspective

[petapan]

I mean we're in Eylo if both threads are shooting are we not? Is it massclaim time? I honestly think the crumb detective work and guessing is just leading town astray and we would benefit from clarity here. Ofc if we could wait another day it would be optimal, hence why I think one thread not limming is an option, but if not I think massclaim is a good idea

you first

[petapan]

scum are looking for crumbs, which is why they shot vanilla townie zmuffinman lmao

[petapan]

the entire way he integrated himself into that thread and started pushing people is flagrantly scummy

[petapan]

and i don't buy for a fucking second someone who is going to hop timestream with a power role approaches it with such incuriosity

he's someone who's trying to get a clean slate by putting himself in a thread thats not looking to read him

[petapan]

like he was throwing out a scumread on dandelion but now that hes over there hes putting suspicion on dunn because its convenient, eff that

[petapan]

UNVOTE: turnstile petapan

i want to fucking dunk that scum fuck

[petapan]

no, because the way he played his role isn't how a scum pr plays it OBVIOUSLY

[petapan]

Oh, so now he wants to come over here.

Do you want to argue against it?

No, I was just making a joke about how we requested him earlier and he told us no.

i didn't want to deal with the noise when my attention was on one thread that was hard to keep up with and felt the turnstile would be better served by someone whose role did something useful

but now, now...

[petapan]

Cut the fucking potshots peta

It’s old as fuck it’s been coming from half the ducking game, I get it you don’t like how I play well too fucking bad it doesn’t make me fucking scum and it doesn’t make me want to listen to you by doing it

i'm on your side fella! i changed my mind! in part because of your transmitter, but still

[petapan]

Hot take-

Spiffeh and bowl just swapped as scum

it's possible it was done to escape pressure yeah although somewhat eh on spiffeh wanting to turnstile immediately. pretty fuckin mediocre reads from him though

[petapan]

hm sb9 was on it too maybe that play just needs to be ignored

[petapan]

but i wanna YELL

[petapan]

i'm gonna read spiffehs day 2 and decide if i wanna dunk him

because the thing that bothers me is that we had almost 2 days where the forward thread was locked and he professes to have read NONE of what was going on here and i dont care if it was leading up to NYE, when we were locked on the other thread i was GLUED to the forward one because it was the one moment they could have my undivided attention. and notty is saying he did the same thing because thats the townie thing to do

and spiffeh read none of it

in the thread he was fucking turnstiled to

like come on

[petapan]

lol wow this isos worse than annies

[petapan]

UNVOTE: Spiffeh

[petapan]

when your scumreads are a50 and muffin with reasoning so shit...

[petapan]

tl;dr I find it unbelievable that the IC/watcher/doc combo being usable in one time stream would be at all balanced given what we know about the setup

cant wait til we find out what hes gonna claim!

[petapan]

a50s reaction to shellys claim day 1 is actually entirely consistent with how i would expect a town tracker to receive it, btw, since i saw it quoted in spiffehs iso

[petapan]

like he saw what shelly claimed and assumed he was a cc, and tried to nudge toward that without outright ccing because this setup is a big troll

[petapan]

yeah lol spiffeh reeks of opportunism in that other thread

[petapan]

gypyx got too much cred too early looking at this iso, and spiffeh defending him yesterday is p bad for both

[petapan]

takes me literally a few minutes to look at someone and spiffeh couldnt be fucked lmao

[petapan]

wtf are those flips

also random though, but maybe the protagonist was macho?

also this post is like quintessential gypyx-scum lol, eff hench calling it town

[petapan]

gypyx got too much cred too early looking at this iso

Supposedly Gyx can't put two sentences together if he's scum, so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

viewtopic.php?p=12443090&user_select%5B ... #p12443090

well, uh

[petapan]

i got why day 1 but he's fallen off

[petapan]

He's been saying stuff that's not useful, avoiding hunting, and has been on green wagons

LOL THE FUCKING IRONY

[petapan]

i got why day 1 but he's fallen off

He surpassed his range, the fact that we're now 2 days later doesn't really change that for me

that's a shit read

Peta, I don't think Gyx is scum.

it's a backburner issue because i don't think he's carrying a game as scum but shouldn't be getting townread

[petapan]

bears consideration because smth like spiffeh/pooky/gypyx seems not entirely unreasonable with bussing being heavily disincentivized while threads are split and the only name from forward thread i'd swap in on a gutcheck level is hench but i think their body of work far exceeds those others and i was possibly just being tunnely on stupid shit there

[petapan]

peta pan i think u should have gotten a punching bag for christmas

i'll just have to use u instead nerd

[petapan]

peta pan i think u should have gotten a punching bag for christmas

i'll just have to use u instead nerd

if u throw a punch ill tell my dad on u

im not afraid of ceph

[petapan]

He said there has to be at least one scum in <Bell, HP, Gyx, Spiffeh, or A50> based on Bell claiming to protect Imperium and Imperiium dying anyway, and that he just didn't really believe Bell. But I'm also pretty sure he was pushing Bell yesterday.

Do you disagree that there has to be at least one scum in that pool?

winnow it down further: it's not a50 and it's probably not spiffeh either given desire to be turnstiled so you're left with a group of 3 and oh would you look at that

[petapan]

i'm not even advocating for that pool but when it's as narrow as it is it's interesting

[petapan]

Shitty irl day.

Sorry guys.

Stuff tomorrow.

your neighbor buddy is getting pushed by the scumfuck you teleported

[petapan]

I just don't think it's bell. I think annie is more likely lying here - dunn why'd you come off annie again?

They made a good point in that they had no reason to come over here

I don't fully trust the tracker too, and I think annie/tracker are either both town or town/scum.

fwiw - they have played the way i would expect them to ply their roles as town, not as scum. like annie doesn't question you like that at day 2 start as scum, they keep it hidden and kill you. exactly like abr tracking cakez in 2180.

[petapan]

that's stupid mainly because he's not scum and you are

[petapan]

Oh I also probably should have noted I wasn’t positive how I’d receive the results given the wording.

I thought I would get “This person went x place”

But I actually got the names.

That’s why I wanted to come over. I figured it would be near impossible for me to crumb that accuratey without even knowing who was targeted.

But I’ve never been the receiving end of amnesiac, soooo

this is 100% town mentality and kill anyone who says otherwise

[petapan]

fwiw - there are so many failure points on these gated investigatives that i absolutely believe there would be some redundancy built in to the setup

[petapan]

in hindsight i probably shouldn't be giving spiffeh a pass for sheer total incuriosity; having a50 as his sole scumread is also pretty shite

You are misrepresenting me here

I did not have any confident scum reads coming into this thread because I have not read the majority of it. A50 and I started in the same thread and yes, he has been my only CONFIDENT scum read in this game and stand by it. If you disagree and are town reading him I would love to know why

Additionally, it should be clear from my brief time here that I don't have the warmest, fuzziest feelings about you or skitter so A50 isn't even my sole scum read anymore

because i read the shit he posted and it's not scummy and your case is nonexistent while your play transparently lacks critical thinking

[petapan]

ceph looks town this game, theres maybe something rotten with the hydras but i can't figure that out right now

[petapan]

we havent hit scum and you propose we significantly reevaluate by voting your one read you have had almost all game, the low poster

arent you supposed to be like good at scumhunting or something

[petapan]

UNVOTE: pooky too

talked yourself into it or?

[petapan]

I'm asking all of you to reevaluate your town reads on him

I am open to reevaluating my read there too, evidenced by my several requests for reasons why people are townreading him that have gone unanswered

He is a scum read that has had literally no attention so this is actually the time to shove him down everyone's throats

because i read him in the other thread and he is not scummy. he was just kind of there and trying to contribute where he could. plus the way he's played his role isn't how someone with an informed perspective would play it

[petapan]

i'm literally a mason

[petapan]

UNVOTE: pooky too

talked yourself into it or?

At the point where voting everyone i dont have a sufficiently strong tr on makes sense

glad to hear it tbh b/c i looked at the other thread and decided he probably makes sense

[petapan]

ffery what are your thoughts on peta's recent posting?

Rather than talk about peta directly, I'd like to talk about your A50 read. I can see a world where A50 is a scum tracker based on him targeting Dunn. And I feel like three amnesiac investigatives are a LOT. I don't think it's a slam dunk, though. I'm not bought into peta's world view, but I'm not scumreading him for it.

there's not three? just shelly and her receiver and the tracker pair

[petapan]

and annies just town, i got paranoid there because of their day 2 fade but that whole explanation for wanting to be stiled just doesnt come from scum

[petapan]

deacon have you given thought to who was scum that started in this thread

[petapan]

Petapan
Deacon Blues (fferyllt/borkjerfkin)
Dandelion Wine (Cephrir/Cabd)
midwaybear
Firebringer
Lady Lambdadelta
skitter30
superbowl9
Annie Edison

order the names

[petapan]

What are your thoughts?

i dont see annie as scum anymore. them and midwaybear are town. i think suoerbowl and lld are most likely and past that it gets fucky. i mean you could argue firebringer was lolbussing out the gates and i'd believe it but only because i don't have a solid clue right now

[petapan]

there were actually votes on muffin in the other thread the other day and he was eminently limbait, think scum over there just don't have a clue or he was on to someone

[petapan]

did anyone look for who they think gamma/bake protected

some people checked and thought it might be dandelion because he had put a townread on them

gamma claiming protection on us N1 and getting hit N2.

he said he was on superbowl n1

[petapan]

oh, somehow my memory messed that up, sorry. could have sworn it was different

[petapan]

no i'm

literally

a mason

[petapan]

i don't negotiate with terrorists

[petapan]

i don't negotiate with terrorists

but will you drink tea with terrorists

depends on the type of tea

[petapan]

i mean you can try but i'm telling you it's not gonna go anywhere

[petapan]

okay fine my mason partner is permabanned from this website i'll stop fucking with you

[petapan]

i was shelly's receiver, cabd picked up on it yesterday at some point. annie's confusion about their role is exactly how i thought mine would work although i never got it confirmed obviously. i don't think they take that approach as scum

[petapan]

i was jokingly calling myself a mason b/c i'm the other half of the dead town follower

i would appreciate it if firebringer would vote me

[petapan]

I think your personal health is way more important than this games end results.

I support this product and/or service

Peta you've maybe just said the like one thing that would prompt me to rethink annie

well glad to put it out there b/c their whole play doesn't work from an informed perspective, even if you presume scum could have amnesiac roles they wouldn't need to thread hop

[petapan]

i was jokingly calling myself a mason b/c i'm the other half of the dead town follower

it seems self evident to me that not both members of the pair have to be town
and in fact is likely there is at least one combo here that isn't all town

-b

having an investigative handing results to scum would be bastard and leave town severely handicapped from what we know

[petapan]

Can u just explain very slowly again why they'd want to thread hop? I'm not really following that bit

if you got the names how were you confused on who the tracker was?

Okay. So I was not told in my role pm my counterpart only that they start opposite me.

Through my reading it seemed like my results would be vague, like “Visited imperium”

Then when D2 hit I saw I was wrong and I got “Dunnstral went to Cabdrir”

As I said, coming into day two I was looking for those reach outs. After getting Titus’s I tuned a50 out. Cabd saw his, and it’s what we were crumbing about.

this is not a though process ta informed minority bothers to fake for really obvious reasons

[petapan]

Maybe i'm missing something but i still dont get how that motivates the thread hop

he didn't think he'd be able to communicate results effectively

but ask if scum ever thinks that? they don't need to hop because they know who is on their team and even if the PTs are separate they can crumb fairly surreptitiously. the whole thought process there would be just super hard to fake

[petapan]

maybe not necessarily but i don't see why they play it the way they did as scum

[petapan]

pretty sure peta is saying way they played their role is townie not role itself, which i go...eh?? not really? If anything them wanting to get turnstiled over other people who claimed better roles seems like the not townie thing to me.

dont think anyone but you had actually outed and they werent taking you seriously

but what i'm saying is i find their perspective would be incredibly unlikely to fake as scum, the assuming they would only get a result and not a target, the searching for who their transmitter is and being mistaken on it, like why even bother

and again had no reason to out the result on dunn

[petapan]

Ah cuz they both get the results if they're in the same thread, ok

Ok in the two pairs i think there's very likely at least one scum tho

like one of the lovers has to be scum, right

[petapan]

anyway, having played in a similar split-thread game many years ago, my recommendation is to play the game like a mini, and and keep your primary focus on your own thread to avoid information overload. don't worry about following everything going on in the other thread, just keep tabs from time to time. i'm personally probably not going to be paying too much attention to the forward timeline and put all my energy toward catching scum here.

fwiw, crumbed in my second post - "following the other thread". i figured whoever the transmitter was would look for that word. i didn't want to turnstile because i thought it'd be more fun to try to communicate with smoke signals and figure out who my counterpart was from guessing stuff, and follower results would be easy to crumb i think

then my transmitter in the other thread got run up and got modkilled and that's why i got pissy day 2

[petapan]

Also that scum team includes me which automatically invalidates all of your opinions for 24 hours

I am actually lol-ing I crack myself up

see you can have fun with this game

[petapan]

Fire and I being this low and Peta being this high gives me hives about you.

as of this page i think i've royally taken a wrong turn w/ you on this list and you should in fact be higher but i needed all the shit that happened since i posted my initial post to get there
peta i dunno; most of his shit has seemed pretty good on this gameday for me, even if i don't think he's considering a lot of the possibilities of alignment combos w/ sender-receiver (which could be a problem but isn't necessarily one)

i will say even if he is scum i don't think he's scum w/ mwb this time; he's definitely taken every opportunity to call that slot town even when mwb disappears for days at a time and pops back in w/ something kinda tangential, not a hint of "sorry you rolled scum again mr obtusebear" or anything the like, even off the cuff

-b

i wouldn't be this churlish and in people's face as scum but i feel i'm spoiling for a fight and the directions people have led things in aren't working. i also probably don' analyze nearly as much as i did end of day 2, i think the depth of thought isn't something i can reliably reach

i doubted midwaybear day 2 but every time he produces content it's townie and most of the people in this thread who could be scumspects have angled toward voting him

[petapan]

i wouldn't be this churlish and in people's face as scum but i feel i'm spoiling for a fight and the directions people have led things in aren't working. i also probably don' analyze nearly as much as i did end of day 2, i think the depth of thought isn't something i can reliably reach

boring

not sure how to respond to that

[petapan]

not sure how to respond to that

you could laugh a little dude

lol? (didnt realize it was supposed to be a joke)

[petapan]

firebringer what do you think of this ultra paranoia solve for this side:


dandelion
deacon
peta

if im right we r probly deado

too much paranoia for me.

one of three is fine. All three and this game was over long ago

i fucking wish i was scum

being town blows

[petapan]

Spoiler: LLD

i'm sorry for upsetting you i didn't think what i was doing would frustrate you that much. that was unfair of me to do. i just think our personalities are at odds since this always happens, it just happened later than usual this game. i do still legitimately suspect you but obviously i think we need to put some distance between us and let things cool off. once again i am sorry to have caused you personal distress with my posting and will try to be more respectful in the future.

[petapan]

Spoiler: LLD

i'm sorry for upsetting you i didn't think what i was doing would frustrate you that much. that was unfair of me to do. i just think our personalities are at odds since this always happens, it just happened later than usual this game. i do still legitimately suspect you but obviously i think we need to put some distance between us and let things cool off. once again i am sorry to have caused you personal distress with my posting and will try to be more respectful in the future.

bruh i'm

having a hard time reading this and not going "oh great scum trying to escape out from under my kill gaze" or sommat

but you can be scum and want to do that and also genuinely mean this so i will say

it's not just you, it's a whole host of people who decided it was more fun to post in obtuse ways even when asked to clarify multiple times to the point where i just broke

so it's not personal and you're forgiven and stuff?

i guess?

ye

Spoiler:

i mean just assume it's sincere regardless and not an attempt to influence the game, b/c while i am in the mood to rile things up i don't want to cause personal distress. i would like to talk things out after we've both calmed down. take care.

[petapan]

i don't see how that's town of him, he's just having fun with the prompt which he'd do as either alignment (and good on him)

[petapan]

PETA IS JEALOUS LEXI LOVES ME MORE

pooky we don't exactly get along

[petapan]

i mean yeah but you always get frustrated with how i play mafia

[petapan]

no i don't pooky

are you sure you want to tell me this read

[petapan]

i mean yeah but you always get frustrated with how i play mafia

?

I don't recall playing another game with you since I've been back.

Or like ever.

I've played 3 games. This, Deathcurse and FGO.

there was the /in-vitational years and years ago, which of course you probably don't remember but i went back and looked at it and you were convinced i was scum there for how i was playing. jesus christ i was toxic that game. not proud of that one at all. i try to not be that bad anymore but i still feel at heart like i'm the same person and can't resist provoking you even when it's a bad idea. (this is also why i got worried you were buddying me with that comment about find me as town and solving the game because, like, i don't think our mindsets work together)

[petapan]

no i don't pooky

are you sure you want to tell me this read

its cuz you haven't bussed any scummates yet :3

so either you're green or you have to be scum with exactly Cabd/Fiery because those are the only 2 people you wouldn't bus in this player list.

lol

i mean i swept that game with midwaybear even though he's super bussable. although i did set up the possibility of bussing him all game if i needed to. in general when i've bussed it's because i felt like i had to, not because i wanted to

tbh if i was scum i'd have set myself on the 2 side of a 2v4 split because i'd feel like i'd be able to carry a side with less support

[petapan]

isn't that the person I thought was scum and then became innocent child and worked with for the rest of the game, lol

yep and i leaned too hard into taunting you for scumreading me in that game

[petapan]

also was in xeno in a hydra with prism

dude i had to go look that up

it is so recent

okay my dissociation is being very bad today

uh... didn't we do fine in Xeno?

IDK

i did jump on flavor leaf's stupid lolwagon on you and you yelled at me for it, i deserved it because my reads were ass that game tbh

[petapan]

in terms of etiquette? i don't think you're crossing any lines. it's my bad.

if you're town you need to learn to read me but that's not a personal failing of any sort obv

[petapan]

and if you're town obviously i can't read you for shit either

[petapan]

yeah idk i'm calling it a night let's talk another day

[petapan]

i spent the night looking at old cakez theme games and thinking we're fucked but it made me think about things



fire do you have a role that works in the other timestream or not

[petapan]

theres this kind of paralelism between all the claimed and known prs between all the threads, claimed protective starting in both threads, two roles that need to be stiled, the receiver pairs

im not saying they all have to be town because i don't know that and it'd be weird (plus all the pr claims are scummy) but things really do seem to mirror each other


and the intent with the turnstiles is obviously to create a logjam where not everyone can get to the other thread to do something useful and that weakens the expected effect of any potential power role

and most of the PRs basically outed themselves day 1 asking to be turnstiled, which is bizarre to me but id almost expect some multiplicity by design because of the whole logjam thing. i would think scum would theoretically have roles that only work on the other side too to give them some incentive to cross over but i dont know. it would still seem to be unconventional to me to ask to be turnstiled right away as scum just to block town and get locked into a pr claim but clearly not everyone thinks like me in that regard

but even saying that, if we split the two threads into pairs

two ivestigatives + a protective + two other gated PRs of some stripe

is not really outrageously far out of line with what seems to be standard balance for mini games in 2020? obv that is complicated by there being other roles and it'd be super dumb if scum just werent trying to get turnstiled but i cant stop thinking about how things seem to mirror

[petapan]

Both sides STARTED with a protective. There seems to be. Protective/blocker that can swap over to the other side- we have two claims on the table that fit this grouping from inverter.

pisskop's flip + whatever spiffeh is started in the forward side and only work in inverted

thats 2 and 2 on both sides. hard for my mind to not see the parallels even though it seems super fucky but 2 PRs per thread that need to be inverted to start seems less weird than just 1? i feel as though that lessens the impact

[petapan]

Yeah, I suppose that’s fair about Spiffeh peta.

Assuming we use the one in four logic from our set id assume that set follows a similar rule and I expect there’s a fourth in the either side set as well

i think the one in four logic is very arbitrary and dont care for it

[petapan]

k phew thankfully thats out the window now

[petapan]

Petapan
Deacon Blues (fferyllt/borkjerfkin)
Dandelion Wine (Cephrir/Cabd)
midwaybear
Firebringer
Lady Lambdadelta
skitter30
superbowl9
Annie Edison

order the names

forgot about this;

i don't quite hold the same opinion now as i did then but i kinda expected some followup from this regardless of what my answer ended up being

-b

fom me?

[petapan]

yeah - were you comparing reads? any in particular you didn't like?
just wondering why you wanted a readlist from us right then and there

-b

i didn't really want to compare, just know where you were at because i didn't have a good sense on who people thought was the original timeline scum as compared to the other thread


i have only vague feelings toward a majority of people on the list and probably couldn't assemble one myself but i felt like asking

i guess i didn't really have any ideas to further discuss anything and most of my energy went to aimlessly lashing out

[petapan]

i'm probably gonna throw in the towel and kill pooky though because if hes scum great and if hes town we'll lose soon and the game will be over anyway

[petapan]

Firebringer, I don't know. Ceph has him as very town, but if I were a solo player I'd have him null at best. This game kind of needs try-harding and Fire seems content to keep joking around and such. I made comparisons to 420 in illicit (Who was town, a hectic alt) but unlike there, fire never really dropped the mask for a long period of time?

my jokes have degraded very largely since day 1. Now i am just a grumpy sad clown.

how can you be a clown if you're not making me cry

[petapan]

also i think u guys are scum now cabd.

do you think they're trying to townblock scum

@peta no i am just a vt

k lol

[petapan]

i reread my role pm and dont know how annie had the misconception they wouldnt get names of targets. even though i backed them up on that point. but i still dont think they play things the way they did as scum.

[petapan]

I can make you cry peta

tell me a sad story pooky

[petapan]

One day Pooky signed up for a game of mafia.

he was very very excited.

He was dealt a red role pm, that made him less excited but he put on a brave face.

His mafia buddy was someone he had never played with before!

After saying hello and exchanging ideas, Pooky and his new best friend set out to fool the town.

Except late at night Pooky's new friend took out a gun and shot Pooky in the back of the head.

He then murdered everyone else in the town.

He was a bad bad man who had psychotic hopes of murderizing everyone because he was never hugged as a child.

damn thats fucked up

[petapan]

do you think they're trying to townblock scum

Dont know what u mean by this.

i mean like if you think they're scum, do you think they're trying to smuggle their partners as townreads or what

also more relevant why do clowns make u cry

its a joke i cannot explain at the present moment i am sorry for subjecting you to this

[petapan]

k just trying to get ur thought process

[petapan]

not like higher level plans necessaily but just where you think teammates are positionally. like i wouldnt think he'd be scum with skitter but i don't really know shit

[petapan]

well i think my townread on ceph was pretty shallow to begin with. like i originally thought "ohh scum cephrir would show more difficulty posting" and ceph even said that wasnt true and the more i think about it this could be that ali vs pine game ceph. and the sorry fact the most defining aspect of ceph town game is hating to play the game. which i don't feel is here.

I think i more wanted ceph/caabd to be town over deacon cause i don't really like deacon. But i think deacon is overall probably way more likely town

guess im gonna have to meta ceph

the most defining aspect of ceph town game is hating to play the game

should probably rephrase this to be not hating to play the game but like a huge more amount of i hate you all and this game kind of posts.

yes i'm very familiar with that ceph from the game we played together where i shittunnelled him as clear and pissed him off

[petapan]

i don't think they would ever be on the table today anyway but i wanna evaluate everyone i guess even though we're probably boned i keep wanting to think about the game

maybe i just wanna shoot the shit idk

[petapan]

Spiffey can i get u interested in solving if i call u scum a bunch?

i tried and it didn't work

[petapan]

no Firebringer I would be so devastated at such accusations that I would do less than I am doing now

did you feel personally aggrieved when i insulted your scumhunting

[petapan]

no Firebringer I would be so devastated at such accusations that I would do less than I am doing now

did you feel personally aggrieved when i insulted your scumhunting

Nah I am hoping you're scum and you don't actually mean what you're saying!

are you just hoping i'm scum because it upset you

[petapan]

he's already unvoting me at lld's behest even tho he doesn't scumread me

[petapan]

spiffeh is there an actual reason you think i am scum or are you mad that i was rude to you

[petapan]

btw why does no one ever throw shade on me for voting my town reads?
I voted flavor leaf, no one calls me scummy for doing so.
I voted SS and said we were killing 3 townies that day (titus/ss and well didn't read pisskop town but thought we doing three townies)

No one is shading me for my flip flops even when i never scumread the people i am voting.
I am kind of stunned.

idk

just doesnt feel like scum to me

[petapan]

i mean i guess all that emotion and stuff can be faked and its dumb of me to read things that way but i guess i just wanted to be called town and you don't feel like you're manipulating me to do anything

[petapan]

Peta you're town because if you're not you'll break my heart.

frankly i think my play has been heartbreaking enough already

Also, do you still want to murder superbowl?

How did you feel about Dunn's comments about superbowl sounding lost?

i haven't been keeping up as ardently but my head's all muddled and don't feel like trying to dictate things i still think hes kind of scummy and dont think dunns comment is a great reason to townread him but i dont really know shit

[petapan]

im trying to figure out if spiffeh legit got his feelings hurt because that'd probably be townie although it's hard to reconcile when is rude about ur gameplay as i was to him

[petapan]

Additionally, I should say that our role has a conditional negative utility modifier that would come into play should we be put into a purple room, so for that reason I'd like us not to be purple roomed.

-E

btw was this just a lie or what

[petapan]

btw was this just a lie or what

yep

last time I fakeclaimed miller I ate a n1 kill because scum thought I was covering stronger power (which... I was), so I was hoping miller claim would get me killed tbh. also sometimes you can get good reactions from a miller fakeclaim and/or check rolecops. additionally it's telling cops not to check you which, given I want to be able to solve the game, is generally good. I actually find there to be very little reason to not claim miller as vt, although the larger philosophy of vts lying about their role in RVS is probably not productive to this gamestate right now

the downside was that I actually went through the hassle of crafting a miller fakeclaim just as a way to get a handle on the setup but this actually hurt me when it came to shelly's claim since I thought it was really clear that "tenet operative" was specifically a vt claim so when she bungled her claim it really really clearly seemed like a scumclaim

ah ok

not gonna be mad over the shelly thing anymore because she was an idiot and played her role like trash in addition to being a dirty cheat

[petapan]

OK. Looks like I'm outed as the Amnesiac Tracker. *Sigh*

I'll try to so something useful before my imminent perishing tonight

UNVOTE: Turnstile Skitter

I'll be back soon enough

@skitter: This is why I am confident Annie is Town. I knew they were my recipient when they claimed my result on Dunn on N1, and it does not make any sense to have me info-feeding scum in this setup

ppl are using that overkill game you modded to argue when part of a pairing could be scum

[petapan]

wow that's a lotta V/LAs

VOTE: superbowl9

also Petpan, you wanna get in the purple room with me?

why

[petapan]

both to putting him at E-1 and asking for the purple room (while putting someone at E-1?)

[petapan]

sb9 if you are town i respectfully ask you despite what differences we have had to not utterly fuck everything over

[petapan]

im trying to figure out if spiffeh legit got his feelings hurt because that'd probably be townie although it's hard to reconcile when is rude about ur gameplay as i was to him

I am scum reading you independently of your comments about my play, but I admittedly get slightly triggered when people bring up me previously being Paragon when I have a bad game because that's been happening nonstop for the past three years

You're not the one who brought up me being Paragon though so I don't blame you for that

snark aside i'm not understanding what your ~process~ is supposed to be here

[petapan]

what's your plan for forming reads and evaluating people, how do you approach the game, what are you doing right now as part of that. i hate the term "solving" but like, how are you doing that, what are you looking for

because right now i see someone who was lobbying to come over since page 1 but not only appwears to have done no homework but is not really doing much in the way of critical inquiry and is instead just getting mad at me and i'm rather confused by it. i would assume you would put some value on dayplay and not just solely wanting to come here because of your role, because it can't be that valuable, so like

what's your process

[petapan]

wow that's a lotta V/LAs

VOTE: superbowl9

also Petpan, you wanna get in the purple room with me?

why

fowards was kinda getting stuck, and voting is good

well, you're one of the only peoples i know in fowards lol, plus i decently feel you as town, and i recall you being pretty talkative in PTs

why do you feel me as town? i don't think we've played outside of marathons (i replaced into that PYP after you were already eliminated an read you there though), which is kind of a weird thing to base a request on?

[petapan]

UNVOTE: Turnstile - skitter

What is your read on skitter and what's the basis for it?

Gun to my head she is town

I thought her approach towards me early in the Day was jumping on the bandwagon but her I buy her explanation about why her town read on me turned so quickly and I feel like she has done more to understand where I'm coming from in regards to A50 than anyone even though she is hard-townreading him

Compare this with peta who's just me bad and scummy and shut down attempts I've make to pressure A50 before he's even posted for the Day, or get others to reevaluate my most confident scum read at this critical point in the game and skitter looks a whole lot better

is disagreeing with you strongly a scumtell. is speaking reasonably a towntell

[petapan]

like personally imo tbh as scum i would get no value from shutting down a push on a50 regardless of his alignment

[petapan]

what's your plan for forming reads and evaluating people, how do you approach the game, what are you doing right now as part of that. i hate the term "solving" but like, how are you doing that, what are you looking for

because right now i see someone who was lobbying to come over since page 1 but not only appwears to have done no homework but is not really doing much in the way of critical inquiry and is instead just getting mad at me and i'm rather confused by it. i would assume you would put some value on dayplay and not just solely wanting to come here because of your role, because it can't be that valuable, so like

what's your process

I think you are overstating my desire to be over here. I requested it immediately Day 1 purely for role purposes and than rescinded that request because I thought trying to clear Forwards of scum was a stronger use of the turnstile than anything I could offer with my role

I also wasn't aware the Purple Room had a turnstile until I was hammered so I didn't really expect to be over here until Day 3 at the earliest. You are right that I have done no homework but I did have a few reads as a baseline and feel I have been doing my due diligence today to get reads on people and I've been transparent with them

So I don't agree with this train of thought

okay i didn't remember you rescinding the request, sorry, i have not been keeping track of everything. that's fair and understandable. mostly i'm trying to understand how you think about the game and want that stuff answered

[petapan]

Compare this with peta who's just me bad and scummy and shut down attempts I've make to pressure A50 before he's even posted for the Day, or get others to reevaluate my most confident scum read at this critical point in the game and skitter looks a whole lot better

this is the meat of your peta read after everything?

-b

spiffeh reads most players based on how they interact with himself.

really?

[petapan]

UNVOTE: pooky

[petapan]

thanks midwaybear

[petapan]

p much

[petapan]

me:ok

[petapan]

okay, why is that

[petapan]

target selection of pooky over a50 and your reasons for the pooky push inducing more apathy into the thread is the most recent reason, but I'm not sure why I need to explain myself to you

well i'd like to dispute your arguments. i've tried to explain why i don't think almost50 isn't scummy, and i admit this may be very bad mistake on my part. defending a50 here as scum would basically offer no benefit to me whatsoever, though. i just don't really trust any of the people casing him. pooky wasn't my first choice vote but i was willing to compromise because i'm willing to listen to the people who want him dead. i did think how he started this day off was scummy. i know you say he's town but i don't trust you so i don't have reason to follow that read.

and i'm probably wrong on some of the people scumreading me but idk what i can do about that. you, pooky, and spiffeh are voting me for reactive, emotional reasons, and if i was looking at it objectively firebringer is probably the scummiest vote there because he's just blind sheeping you but on overall reactions this game hasnt seemed scum so idk what to think.

[petapan]

VOTE: pooky

[petapan]

Uhhhh sure I guess.


When did you start reading peta as scum, and was it always intense or was it something that built gradually over time? Was there a specific catalyst or set of posts to this read?

Like... Walk me through the mommy stork and the daddy stork that loved each other very much and made this read.

Day 1 I was heavy on the peta town train cause my dude really hit all the notes I wanted. He was charismatic, needed answers and wasn't interested in being snowed by anyone. It felt like he had townie mentality.

But as the days went on... more or less after the FL elimination and no one stopping it, I was super jaded. FL was a huge town read of mine, as you know. So I began looking at the people in power. I fake shot you to get reads on you and Deacon, and I tried mindmelding with Peta to get stuff there.

Peta and I being unable to connect... and Peta only wanting to talk about his read on me, gave me a bad worrying taste. I was worried he was gonna setup into day 3.

So I resolved, day 3, if Peta came out swinging after day 1 and 2 not stopping FL elimnation and being kind of passive day 2, I was gonna hard suspect it.

He came out swinging at me and when it got no traction, look where he ended up.

Pushy apathy style at Pooky rn.

It just lines up too perfectly from a Peta scum who feels in control and gets to do what he likes.

So that's when I got there. It was the way Peta handled things and the results we got. Someone in power is scum and made FL happen. If it's not you or Deacon, it's Peta.

i mean functionally i didn't really make FL happen, i made a bad argument that mostly got ignored, took a nap, woke up to pooky hardshoving him but didn't dispute it despite my fear because i was really sick of day 1. i did not anticipate FL selfhammering to end the day though.

suspecting me because we don't see eye to eye is fair though, i get it

[petapan]

VOTE: pooky

Where do you think your (un)votes belong?

i don't really know. i'm still unvoting lld and spiffeh. tried getting in spiffehs head earlier and he basically slapped me away i think because he was still taking what i said as a personal insult. i don't really have reads.

[petapan]

i made a bad argument that mostly got ignored,

This isn't how I recall it but now I've got MORE reading home work.

if i'm wrong then my own memory is at fault but i don't deny basically acquiescing to it

[petapan]

because he was still taking what i said as a personal insult

don't really see any evidence of this. he just called you scum for slapping him away

-b

Sorry if it isn't up to your standards

that came across as bitter when i was just questioning him trying to understand how he thinks about things. i think his reasoning for his reads is undercooked and he's plying in a reactive emotional fashion but that's how i get as town when things are going poorly so i don't know


i'm falling asleep in my chair as i'm writing this so i'm going to step away

[petapan]

gypyx's vote timing on sb9 was weird to me but then the reaching out and asking to be purple roomed with me feels like it'd be really left field as scum reflecting on it

[petapan]

put him and gypyx in there i wanna read that hood

[petapan]

Vote LLD?
Also, is it absolutely necessary that we elim today?

it's better for us to do that

didn't you want to kill pooky? what's with asking for his vote?

[petapan]

who's on first though

[petapan]

well this is literally the first time he's mentioned it

[petapan]

i'm so frustrated lol

same but also defeated

[petapan]

the prospect of a night 4 purple room seems fairly unlikely

[petapan]

the implication was the game ends day 4

[petapan]

the implication was the game ends day 4

That qualifies as feeling pretty defeated.

i just find little reason for optimism and if there's one thing that's weird for you it's that you're out of sync with how degraded things are. if you're town you need to call your shot today because it should be treated as effectively do or die

[petapan]

I drank too much caffeine I should not be awake rn but now I'm UPSET

is the most you're going to put out just this sort of petty anger?

[petapan]

yes because I have done nothing else this entire Day

largely no in my view, at some point i have to wonder if the anger is a defense mechanism to avoid contribution. i was hesitant because i know putting a player on tilt is going to impede any rational decisionmaking but i tried to give you space and then talk to you to get inside your head and you gave me basically nothing in return. i am struggling to understand your mindset as a town one and want to see more than complaining when people mention suspecting you

i'm feeling pretty hopeless but i've still tried to take swings at explaining why i think things because that's all i can do, i've started to doubt the big scumread i entered he day with and don't know where to go but i'm still trying to talk with people

[petapan]

i'm trying to figure out whether you're scum with nothing to say or town who doesn't feel like putting in work because mad but in my view a significant chunk of you posts have just been complaining

[petapan]

I also am interested in how you feel I have given you 'nothing', but the emptiest slot in the game, A50, has ACTUALLY done nothing in this thread ever since he got here (and not much in the other one) but he seems to be a pretty confident town read of yours to the point where you don't really want to reevaluate him today?

i wouldn't say he's actually done nothing and to make that argument seems shortsighted or disingenuous, give me a moment

[petapan]

why would it not be worth continuing to converse? are you that convinced i'm scum?

[petapan]

hm, i hadn't noticed a50 had voted pisskop, that's at least a little concerning. it's no, not as strong as i thought. but his reasoning on the pooky track and defending him made sense. there was some degree of questioning people but not as much as i thought. i still feel like he played the role in a townish manner with how he reacted to shelly's claim and set up his role but that's not incredibly strong. like it could be faked but my gut says he's an easy target right now and scum doesn't play the role the way he did. i can't claim to be strongly confident in that, i think people raised some doubts about the stuff he said and it does resonate, looking at the iso here is concerning, but i have doubts about everything right now. what i do look for in the game is that he feels like a slot scum would want to push because the arguments are easy and it largely feels like scum are more likely to be in less suspected people where the arguments are going to be harder and they won't be as easy to spot

someone should ask him why he tracked dunnstral night 1

mostly i'm just puzzled why you think me strongly defending someone makes me scum

[petapan]

can't see those reads being remotely close to right even though i like the hydras as they speak kindly and reassuringly to me

[petapan]

i also have to wonder if you honestly think the setup would contain two amnesiac investigative pairs with half of each being scum making both effectively worthless and the majority of other PRs being timestream gated such that there is a strong possibility town has absolutely 0 useful night actions on night 1 aside from a bodyguard, maybe

because if you stop to think about it for a single second that's extremely implausible

[petapan]

and it largely feels like scum are more likely to be in less suspected people where the arguments are going to be harder and they won't be as easy to spot

Who are the players you feel could fit this mold then?

basically anyone you have listed in your townreads, i don't outright suspect anyone there aside from LLD but can find reasons to doubt all of them (like, skitter's post about eliminating you did feel a little sketchy but then you came in and looked even worse) and i'd be shocked if that group contains 0 scum at this point

[petapan]

i guess i should ask why fb and skitter are both town to you

[petapan]

{A50, petapan, Hench Princesses, Annie Edison, and two of {Pooky, midwaybear, Bell, superbowl}}

now that's just actively asinine

[petapan]

anyway i'm sleeping but i find it hard to believe on a gut check level someone would think that makes any rational sense. suppose i'll review things tomorrow

[petapan]

it beggars rational belief that someone could be sincerely arguing that every single claimed investigative role aside from skitter is scum. someone who's actually looking to solve the game takes pause and asks themselves if such a team can possibly make sense. someone who's just looking for tactical positioning plows ahead and keeps attacking who they can regardless of role

[petapan]

i should have read 7330 before i posted that

[petapan]

i'm isoing spiffeh and the continued insistence on wanting to come to this thread i can't help but read town. the rest is thoroughly mediocre though

[petapan]

even my minimalism loving self cant townread someone who halfheartedly farts out empty reads and does nothing with them

[petapan]

eh 1744 reads town but not impossible to fake

[petapan]

If I feel like efforting tomorrow I'll try to ISO my null reads and try to feel some type of way about them

this is much like something you said with your reads yesterday and i really don't love it

while i've certainly promised to do things later as town and had trouble delivering i think it's much easier to fall into the trap of promising to deliver content later as scum and then not actually following through because it's harder to get the engine running but talking about how you're going to do something makes people want to give you time and often don't follow up. i realize at the point in time this was said the game was going a mile a minute but in general i think continually making statements about how you're going to put in work and not actually doing so are scummy

[petapan]

thoroughly mediocre

perfect description of my town game I'm glad you've finally come around!

this is why i keep asking you stuff, trying to figure out how you think about things because i don't -really- have experience with you. so i have to consider whether this is simply a matter of playstyles clashing as the self-deprecating wounded pride stuff seems real enough to me, but every time you get pushed on things i feel you never really open up and understanding you is completely impossible for me

[petapan]

what i'm seeing in this iso is that you'll make some reads, give a little bit of backing to them, but you look like you've been afraid to really push on anything, you joined the push on shelly after there was momentum on her and helped bury her, opened day 2 voting almost50 but doesn't feel like a vote with conviction, it's stuff like "bad iso with words without meaning", it's how i would talk as scum if i was trying to get a lurker chopped, and to an extent it feels like you're throwing that out there without really making an effort to be persuasive, it's just a thing that you're doing. when i ripped skitter i was similarly annoyed with her throwing out votes i felt were halfhearted but it felt consistent with a townie who has little conviction in their reads and i've played with her some so it felt in character. this feels like a read you claim to have conviction in but don't really assert much and it feels incongruous

[petapan]

Specifically his posts after acknowledging shelly's claim feel like he's coaxing the wagon along without having to commit any feelings toward it

OK, so let me ask the more experienced mods amongst you about this:

Cop/Tracker/Follower/Watcher/Voyeur/Motion Detector

How many of those would you include in a game like this?

Like this is a completely useless thing to ask because we don't know anything about the make-up of the scum team so it's fruitless to try and outguess what info roles town would have

this, in particular, is interesting to me because knowing what we now know, it doesn't feel like at all a fair justification for a scumread - i think this is exactly how a town-aligned tracker would respond to a claim like shelly's, with a role that not only is seemingly redundant to theirs but mimics its function exactly. i think it fits in with his play so far of trying to stay low key.

[petapan]

but the thing about trying to ding a50 for his response to the claim is, well, look at spiffeh's trajectory there:

314 - early town read on shelly
392 - "I don't really get why shelly is being scum read" "posting was very stream-of-conscious which I think is hard for newer players to fake as scum"
464 - cites a string of posts as stream of cosnciousness
466 - wouldn't said shelly to the other thread if the plan is to turnstile scummy players
467 - attacks muffin for shading his read on shelly
473 - criticizes bell for not giving a reason why he's confident on shelly being scum
485 - "shelly could very well be scum, I just don't feel that way and apparently a lot of people disagree"
557 - asks shelly to explain her brian skies scum read
612 - says shelly is too low in unwnd's readslist
1021 - "shelly just isn't DOIN IT for me" (in the context of who he should vote)
1271 - votes shelly, "I know I said I was townreading her earlier get over it"
1479 - gives a poe of {Pooky, Almost50, pisskop, shellyc, Hench Princesses}
1894 - reads list with shelly as a scum lean, "I initially town read shellyc but p. much all my town reads are scum reading her and her naked vote on Pooky without even acknowledging her previous certainty that Bell was scum doesn't make any sense"
1980 - "I think it's possible she realized her Bell push was being met with a lot of resistance and scum reads so she's lurking it out"
2545 - "I think shelly's probably telling the truth about her role, but that doesn't really mean anything one way or the other in terms of her alignment"
2653 - "She could literally be telling the complete truth about her role and still be scum"
2725 - "The longer shelly remains absent after her claim the more I want her to die"
2764 - "I'm fine with limming any of {shellyc, Almost50, Gypyx} today, in that order with strong preference to shellyc"

This, to me, is exactly what i would describe as someone looking to "coax the wagon along without having to commit any feelings toward it". sure he names her as a scum read, but there's not really a lot of substance to it, just saying he's following his townreads, then accusing her of lurking out and casting doubt on her claim when people were considering not eliminating her. i think him trying to put blame on a50 for his approach to the wgon when he behaved this way is hugely scummy.

[petapan]

VOTE: LLD

down to a singular focus today

[petapan]

why is that?

[petapan]

the votes on me are LLD, spiffeh, pooky (all of whom i have consciously agitated) and firebringer, who townreads me but is sheeping LLD

[petapan]

i was just wondering if there was anything more to it, that's fine

i'm kind of w/e on the purple room in general

could i interest you in a spiffeh (un)vote

[petapan]

he called me a fucking idiot and made me feel bad

[petapan]

Thank you everyone for universally deciding I should be flipped the week I am V/LA because of work

midwaybear is probably scum for hopping on so easily and Bell looks atrocious cheering this on from the other thread

there are literally 3 votes on you and it is hardly unanimous in agreement that you will be voted off, i don't actually have much sway

all the anger looks like you're trying to scare people off more than anything

[petapan]

@everyone we get it spiffeh isn't solving hard enough. Can u show the scum motivation in his plays tho

i outlined my issues in the last couple of pages but my main feeling is the way he's going after a50 doesn't feel intellectually honest because he based part of it on his response to shelly's claim when i feel spiffeh's trajectory there largely shifted with popular momentum. i think pursuing a lurker scumread at this stage is just kind of tone-deaf and looks like a vote of convenience more than anything. he's mainly arguing a50 "isn't doing anything" but i know and you know that isn't actually a scumtell. like it feels like the kind of target i would want to push as scum because it's an easy argument to make and most people don't like lurkers. like you just got out of a game where scum hardshoved you for "not doing anything" and he feels like he's arguing in a similar way. also i dislike the extent to which he's resorting to AtE already.

if thats not enough for you to believe me its fine

[petapan]

I'm not sure why scum spiffeh pushes the button in the velvet room?

because he was told to and not pushing the button would be seen as suspect. of course i was screaming it was bad because it was deathtunneling sb9 at the time but he wasn't even reading at that time and would have no reason to listen to me

[petapan]

Peta out here on and off voting people, not committing, just barely doing enough to be called targetting spiffeh while not interacting with him.

that's completely detached from reality

[petapan]

Peta out here on and off voting people, not committing, just barely doing enough to be called targetting spiffeh while not interacting with him.

that's completely detached from reality

It's really fucking not. You have voted and unvoted pooky several times. You have complained about this game ending on day 4 regardless.

My assessment of how you have been playing is PERFECTLY accurate.

yes, at times today my thinking has been effectively defeatist because i think the game is in a difficult pot right now and town's chances of winning are low. i know that's unhelpful but hard to not let pessimism sink in and influence my play. but i'm still compelled to keep swinging, keep trying when i'm not in a bad mood, and that was true when i began to engage spiffeh in conversation last night

i've interacted with spiffeh extensively because i wanted to try to further a read on him because i fully acknowledge he could be town who's just having an off game as this has been a struggle for basically everyone. i try to converse to see if he can open up, he shuts me down. i go back and iso dig to try and clarify my feelings and see if i've misjudged or not, i find some things i don't like, i thoughtdump them into the thread. i'm not gonna fault him for not being able to respond because he's supposed to be V/LA but he got 3 votes on him and started doing AtE and the timing felt confusing.

but i don't know how anyone looking at this could say we're "not interacting"

[petapan]

Peta hasn't even once tried to get me to unvote u even though he knows i townread him.

hasn't tried to get me to unvote him* not u.

tbh i did ask once politely, i don't remember why, but i feel basically no need to beg or panic at this point in time. i don't feel threatened despite the votes on me.

[petapan]

apathy as a tactic was never really my bag, i preferred to go out and push people

i did do the intentional apathy thing in my recent scumgame but it nearly killed me inside to do it because i always want to go out and post and drive the action

and my fear is always that doing nothing and allowing the town to talk will allow them to find each other and come together

and in fact in that game most of the town came close to having the correct solve if it hadn't been for gamma basically quitting on the game

i feel like it's always better as scum to be out driving the agenda if you can (which you could argue i'm doing right now by casing spiffeh, but w/e i'm town)

[petapan]

So why are you making posts like "this game is gonna end on day 4" then bruv?

Who do you think is gonna flip town from the current wagons as a result to cause THAT kind of post?

Answer quickly please.

because as a whole i felt like the town hasn't been good at coming together and finding scum and there was something of a leadership vacuum. i just had the feeling of dread that whatever decision we came to would likely be a compromise one that wouldn't flip scum because it didn't feel like people wanted to ask tough questions. i guess i still feel like a50 would be that one here as most of the arguments against him revolve around him lurking. the other thread i have no fucking clue on who is scum anymore. that was actually a big part of it was that i had no really confident scumreads at the time and when that's the case i feel scum are more likely going to be able to influence the elimination. so to try to fix that i've been conversing with people to attempt to gain some clarity.

sorry for being pessimistic, i guess?

[petapan]

I want to scream rn.

I want to go old LLD and burn shit down.

I have literally been asking questions to power.

Since YESTERDAY.

AND YOU FUCKING SHUT ME DOWN A BUNCH.

YOU WOULDN'T WORK WITH ME.

GOT PARANOID OVER MY FUCKING ATTEMPTS TO FULLY FIND YOU AS TOWN.

AND NOW HOW I HAVE YOU AS SCUM YOU GIVE THE FUCK UP AND IT'S NOT RELATED?1?212/23.WERL'AWEM;SDF

PETA I'M GONNA HAVE AN ANEURYSM

i was wary of you yesterday yeah

i think ultimately the issue here is we simply don't think about things in remotely similar ways and if you're town we are just never going to see eye to eye or work well together. like i never really understood your deacon read, distrusted the logic you came into the day with on roles.

my pessimism is more due to the fact we have eliminated town 5 times so far? but even with all the shit i said yesterday i've hardly given up. (i think pooky asaying i was playing like a fucking idiot had a part in that). what i am doing right now objectively does not look like scum giving up. the defeatist sentiment wasn't really related to you.

[petapan]

Peta you come out swingign at me, refuse to engage with me on day 2 about reads and now you're full blown apathy mode.

the main problem was actually that i tried to read reassess in the time we had, i tunneled superbowl, you told me "fu he's town", and that was about the end of it. over the night decided i didn't have good reason to townread you compared to other people

and i'm not in apathy mode no matter how many times you say it, nor is apathy a scumtell for me

[petapan]

I'm town and I think Peta is town.
and if both groups miss we lose right?

p much

We have one day after this I’m pretty sure?

I’m really struggling with their scumread on you.

we'd have "one more day" but the likelihood of a comeback from 7:6 is astronomically small, scum only need one incorrect vote to win the game from there. between town disunity and advantage in numbers it's virtually guaranteed, if not on day 4 then on a later day. it's like a team being down 2-0 in the NBA - game 3 isn't literally "must win" but it is effectively that, since coming back from being down 3-0 simply does not happen.

If they seriously elim peta this games a joke lol

there's no actual chance it happens unless one of the people currently townreading me flips on me (and if they do, it's a scumclaim)

[petapan]

Peta you come out swingign at me, refuse to engage with me on day 2 about reads and now you're full blown apathy mode.

the main problem was actually that i tried to read reassess in the time we had, i tunneled superbowl, you told me "fu he's town", and that was about the end of it. over the night decided i didn't have good reason to townread you compared to other people

and i'm not in apathy mode no matter how many times you say it, nor is apathy a scumtell for me

cause he's fucking town

and i'm sorry you can say I'm not apathy mode all you want but

you're vote parking me and saying we're gonna lose we're gonna lose

what's your read on me rn then?

i think me vote parking you implies i don't really think you're town and no one's trying to talk me down out of it