Shakespeare uPick | End

[Wisdom]

VOTE: Galron

Maybe we'll get to play before you get dayvigged this time

[Wisdom]

Also hi to DV, GL, Ceph, and whoever else I havent seen in a while

[Wisdom]

yep

Dont see anything interesting yet so Im saving up on posts

[Wisdom]

What about them? I just see an unexplained GL vote

[Wisdom]

too bad, tell him

[Wisdom]

VOTE: dunn

Do more than naked votes and fluff

[Wisdom]

The shakespearian stuff

[Wisdom]

ok maybe it wasnt that much fluff i was just lazy to parse

[Wisdom]

I dont think Gamma would tell her to antagonize me

[Wisdom]

VOTE: wheme

wagons are good

[Wisdom]

It will give us a scumflip though so all good

[Wisdom]

I love how I always seem confident
I dont actually have a read on wheme

[Wisdom]

Bowser is prolly town but don't @me
Wont be voting them anyway

[Wisdom]

Pretty uninterested in the dv wagon too
Wheme is fine, and I could vote COF too I guess

[Wisdom]

I Don't know wisdom well but I think if he were scum he'd be digging into someone.

Tunneling is like Wisdom’s signature so no
(At least back then. I don’t know if anything changed now)

Still is

[Wisdom]

My brain thought skybird and lukewarm are the same person for some reason

[Wisdom]

VOTE: cof

sure

[Wisdom]

I Don't know wisdom well but I think if he were scum he'd be digging into someone.

Tunneling is like Wisdom’s signature so no
(At least back then. I don’t know if anything changed now)

You mean he doesn't tunnel? He wrecked scum!me one game by tunneling.

We've played before astral?

[Wisdom]

379 gives me hives.

Also, Wis. Are you okay? I don't think I've ever seen you this inactive as either alignment before. Have you really not found anything to latch onto?

-Bell

Yep
Youll know it when i do

[Wisdom]

Just gonna claim now. I'm poisoned, I die at the end of night 3.

Flavor?

[Wisdom]

Icebox (1): Wisdom

huh? Pretty sure thats inaccurate

[Wisdom]

but anyway heres a new vote

VOTE: Skybird

[Wisdom]

bigger wagon

[Wisdom]

Also, good with our skybird vote, though a Luke wagon would be nice and spicy imo

That's what i thought too, gl vote above your post was awful

[Wisdom]

Eh 544 is more cheeky I guess
Ill stay on skybird

[Wisdom]

Ngl the way you’re disengaged reminds me a little of TGifP
But I’m probably not acting on that today

I had to search my wiki to find what youre referring to
I dont remember at all how I was feeling there, but my d1 looked pretty towny and not really disengaged?
Anyway I deserve one more relaxed game once in a while. Dont let it alarm you

[Wisdom]

Just because

[Wisdom]

I think i like 560 too
Looks like she genuinely wants to read lld

[Wisdom]

Dunn DV JC Cephrir

Plus Lukewarm

Not townreading any of those, so not bad

[Wisdom]

VOTE: Juliet

[Wisdom]

75 why? Wasnt it 150?

[Wisdom]

Just gonna claim now. I'm poisoned, I die at the end of night 3.

Flavor?

Child of Fairies do tell us whats the flavor justification for you being poisoned

[Wisdom]

Wheme wanna vote Juliet?

[Wisdom]

I like luke more now

OTH are still town

Top wagons are both good

[Wisdom]

Hey bowser let’s say I was mod confirmed town

You mean this?
I assumed you were talking about after youve flipped green

[Wisdom]

It isnt

[Wisdom]

You never know when it will spiral out of control
Ive had a game where I had like 800 posts D1

[Wisdom]

Give wheme a day, wont hurt

[Wisdom]

lld are you townreading juliet?

[Wisdom]

Nah i liked skybird

[Wisdom]

Hes not naming it so it isnt obvious for scum ns, ffs
Though its already pretty obvious

[Wisdom]

what does notty mean

[Wisdom]

Wisdom is probably scum here btw

~Spiffy

Incorrect

[Wisdom]

Im not saving them as you can see

[Wisdom]

Im just more relaxed than youre used to, same thing I told Gamma

[Wisdom]

Juliet

[Wisdom]

Agreed with Luke, staying on Juliet

[Wisdom]

let's talk about who we want to elim today

Dunn maybe? He hasn't done much

[Wisdom]

VOTE: dunn

[Wisdom]

Yep she was scum

[Wisdom]

steal

[Wisdom]

Wisdom, you were so close.

I wasnt just close, i did steal the pagetop but ffery deleted something to take it back

[Wisdom]

Does anyone townnread Ceph or DV and is able to sell that to me

I feel like other than maybe Dunn I'm townreading everyone else but can't read those two

[Wisdom]

Galron explain

[Wisdom]

Can we let him talk

[Wisdom]

Loverizing others does sound like a scum ability, yep

[Wisdom]

We're not killing anything until galron explains

[Wisdom]

Its not even a guilty
Def a buddy or two in those easy votes if hes scum

[Wisdom]

he hasn't even claimed

[Wisdom]

I believe the claim

[Wisdom]

My role pm does not call my role by name either, it just uses Shakespeare text, so that's prolly true for him too

[Wisdom]

Additionally, full tracker, loverizer, parity cop, friendly neighbour, and some other shit is just too much imo.

Loverizer is likely scum, the others are just three roles in role madness. Def not too much

[Wisdom]

We agree then, im staying om dunn

[Wisdom]

Actually, I'd like to just kill Cephrir.

Wisdom, thoughts?

Sure, wouldn't mind at all

[Wisdom]

Also dunn is still scum

[Wisdom]

You're right, probably better to elim me for no reason than to get the guy who visited the night kill

You're right, its better because youre scum and hes not

[Wisdom]

Vote dunn with us or Ceph if you prefer and we'll join you

[Wisdom]

Dunn wagon doesn't inspire any good feelings in me at all, I don't see anything he's done as disingenuous or scum-motivated and I think Galron spewed him as town

Except Galron has not flipped so stop reading people based on him
And Dunn is pretty scummy

[Wisdom]

Imagine shading the most obvious town person in this game.

Dont know who youre referring to but both OTH and Luke are town

[Wisdom]

I haven't read up properly (even "skimmed" would be generous) but why are we voting Dunn?

Are you townreading Dunn or is this just an empty post?

[Wisdom]

I just don't get how any town player gets SR'd and goes "No, you!" this hard

It happens a lot.

[Wisdom]

Gamma you could make this right by just voting obvscum guiltied Galron

I know you want your role to be useful but Galron is likely what he claimed and not scum. Take a step back.

[Wisdom]

Thought so

What is your stance on Galron?

[Wisdom]

OTH is obvtown

[Wisdom]

Yes spiffy it's a coincidence. This is role madness. The coin steal based on the last line of the mechanic explanation is part of the mechanic anyway

[Wisdom]

Like his targets make sense for a parity cop
He targeted someone about to die or be conftowned and someone he wanted to read

[Wisdom]

Just lim dunn

Galron will either be killed or provide more results

[Wisdom]

No

[Wisdom]

Im not killing oth

Dunn > Ceph > DV

[Wisdom]

We know that scum almost certainly visited Skybird

Disagree

[Wisdom]

Beware! Where there is gold, there are thieves.

Gold stealing is part of the mechanic
It could easily be coming from town trying to steal from their scumreads

[Wisdom]

i'm now against the dunn elim

Totally liming ceph after the dunn scumflip

[Wisdom]

I think that GL was doing that under the asumption that Galron is scum. So tracking him is not terrible. But from a town!Galron pov, that is a terrible plan

No, in that scenario scum are forced to kill galron, a limmable player
Ita still a win for the town

[Wisdom]

I can see that defense for CA but I call all the bullshit regarding True Love, your lover partner was probably the key reason you didn't get yeeted with extreme force that game.

And his scumbuddy being a good manipulator, no? (:

[Wisdom]

lurk Dunn = town Dunn.

No. Dunn lurks as scum.

[Wisdom]

Ceph/Dunn/??? are my like, scum concepts rn.

DV? Maybe pav

[Wisdom]

OTH/Galron/???

Oh look, my current solve

Both town, fix your reads

[Wisdom]

The only quote I have is "be not afraid the island is full of noises"

That cant be true, ffery even asked us to confirm our role pms using the text of our third ability if I remember correctly
So you should have at least three

[Wisdom]

I am being dumb again, what I mean is I do not know if a uPick means the names and flavors and inputs from players have anything to do with alignments when they shake out in role assignments.

They don't
I only picked villains and I'm town

[Wisdom]

We only have like 21 hours left as of this post.

Move your votes to Dunn.

[Wisdom]

His claimed ability to upgrade to rolecop doesn't make sense because parity cop is equal to if not a stronger role.

Pretty sure he said the upgrade is he gets the role of one of the players on top of the parity cop

[Wisdom]

GL I like your reads. Ceph, DV, Pav are down there for me too, and I similarly had written Pav off too for some reason. I'm sure if it weren't for your wrong take on Galron we'd agree on Dunn too.

[Wisdom]

We only have like

21 hours

2 days left as of this post.

Move your votes to Dunn.

[Wisdom]

Wisdom, and lld, how do you guys feel about cephir?

I can kill ceph too, ive said so already
Lld agrees too

[Wisdom]

I can choose two players to see if they're in the same troupe. I've already told you my past results. If I collect 6 gold pieces I can upgrade it to see what one of the players roles is.

@Dunn

[Wisdom]

If I'm scum with Galron, I'd be taking the opportunity to vote Dunn (as some other people have pretty vehemently pushed for, and he's a decent second wagon). I still think Galron should go, even though it costs us Icebox.

And if you're scum without Galron?

Like, this is so classic, scum defending themselves based on the faulty assumption in the case

[Wisdom]

why would anyone be able to upgrade their role to something worse.

Rolecopping one of your parity cop checks is not worse.

[Wisdom]

And OTH asked me about one specific Shakespearean quote -- the one related to my cop ability. That's why I didn't list the others.

Makes more sense, but shouldn't you list all of them given youre almost dead?

[Wisdom]

I actually thought I'd be able to go deep this game, but I get scum read as town with many in this group all the time. Several of you should know better.

I had you as a town lean before your double track to scum night activities

So really, that track sucked for you regardless of your alignment

No it didn't, you guys just cant read people for motovations
Galron was obviously not scum

[Wisdom]

And after Skybird fucking revealed she was not robbed at night people should have unvoted but nooo

[Wisdom]

Dunn, Pav, Bowser, scum

Bowser is probably not. The others plus Ceph and DV, yes.

[Wisdom]

Fair enough, didnt read that. I was going based on this

I can choose two players to see if they're in the same troupe. I've already told you my past results. If I collect 6 gold pieces I can upgrade it to see what one of the players roles is.

@Dunn

[Wisdom]

if Galron is actually town after all then Ceph's stock takes a huge dive

What about dunn's stock?

[Wisdom]

ugh this will be painful if he doesnt flip
you will all continue spamming he was scum

[Wisdom]

Hey, so, Bowser Jr. Pavowski, Lukewarm and I are in

A scum PT together

a neighborhood and none of us are admitting to making it.
As all good townies do, you shouldn't post in them. It's bad.

I have already done my traditional dunking on of the scum team in these two neighborhoods and so,
for the third time: lmao.

VOTE: OTH

-Bell

Well THAT'S mighty convenient because we are a neighborhood with: NOBODY!!! And we have no idea who made it either, except marci thinks cream the rabbit might be involved?

-GE

I guess someone will have said it later, but pts were made according to what play your character is from

[Wisdom]

I don't feel like gamma is scum but given how galron went i dont wanna insist too much

[Wisdom]

Cof are you still dying tonight?

[Wisdom]

You cannot target the same player for steal and kill in a single night.

Since skybird didnt get stolen from and didnt receive a dialogue
What did galron target her with
When i saw the flip I assumed galron sent the dialogue to wheme since nobody else claimed to receive it

[Wisdom]

Figured it out in my pt

[Wisdom]

Mercutio is from romeo & juliet.

VOTE: OTH

and?

And why arent you in a pt with cof

[Wisdom]

tempest

what
Didnt you just say youre from Romeo and juliet

[Wisdom]

Nvm i misread and i assume ceph did too

[Wisdom]

Is nobody else alive from Romeo & Juliet?

I'm in a neighbourhood by myself as well.

To clarify for others, these two sentences felt connected, like you were saying you're from romeo and juliet but nobody else is so youre in a hood by yourself

But you were actually replying to gamma

[Wisdom]

I have no clue who's scum though. Galron threw me off. I should prolly reread but as of before that flip people id like dead are {ceph, dv, pav}
Dunn left the pool due to Galron flip

[Wisdom]

ordinarily my kneejerk reaction would be why would scum wisdom go so hard on defense of a doomed partner but a scum flip from JC kinda makes that make more sense

Elaborate please
I was one of the main jc pushers

[Wisdom]

I also would like more gold but i def cant make a sonnet

[Wisdom]

Oh ok

[Wisdom]

People who I'm too scared to label as townreads but I'm not really concerned enough about them to pursue things further right now:

Dunnstral
Juliet Capulet
Galron
WhemeStar

Noting that dv had both scum as nulltown here

[Wisdom]

Wheme wagon is stale. CoF wagon is hot. Nothing particularly towny in their ISO.

VOTE: CoF or wow me with some dank reads.

Also, you should vote somewhere.

why not

VOTE: cof

Those hops on cof wagon happened right after luke's case on dv (with dv being the leading wagon)

[Wisdom]

And Galron additionally tries to case COF (448, 451)

[Wisdom]

Galron, why did you case COF in 448 after you had already voted them? Woosh-gate in particular was already discussed by several players in thread.

It feels kinda performative, like regardless of your alignment you decided to vote COF first without thinking, but 448 rings as if you want to make sure the rest of us know you are evaluating their slot. Gives me "tell" instead of "show" vibes

GL explains it better

But the addition is that it's likely he did it in an attempt to get attention off DV

[Wisdom]

UNVOTE: Cephrir
VOTE: Juliet

DV has zero mentions of scumreading Juliet before this (and had her in nulltown previously)

[Wisdom]

And for context Juliet has 5 votes at this point and I am asking people to vote her

[Wisdom]

Ok

VOTE: wheme

Ceph counterwagoning (Juliet at 7 votes)

[Wisdom]

Finally people are coming back around on the Wheme wagon

VOTE: Wheme

Pav also joins the cw

[Wisdom]

Im gonna vote dv when i finish rereading

[Wisdom]

But unless i find otherwise all of {dv, pav, ceph} need death

[Wisdom]

Im at end of d1 and have to go

VOTE: dv

[Wisdom]

Wisdom (1): Wisdom

wat

[Wisdom]

vote:oth

This is disappointing

[Wisdom]

My right brain would vote OTH. So meh

Plus both wagons are shit.

So are these. What happened to your dv read?
I thought we agreed

[Wisdom]

DID WISDOM EVER SAY WHY HE THINKS IM TOWNIE

is this gamma
because i doubt gamma needs me to explain
if its marci ask gamma

[Wisdom]

but as someone who is known (at least in my experience with him) to be very headstrong about reads even when they're wrong, to go ridiculously all in on Galron being town feels like a good strategy for Wisdom-scum. I don't think he's town because I don't think town in their right mind could have been so confident in Galron being town.

Youre contradicting yourself
"Wisdom is known to be headstrong even if he's wrong"
"I can't see how Wisdom can be so confident"

[Wisdom]

If we are assuming Juliet is scum we should VOTE: Pavowski

Why was that? Just wondering if I missed any associatives

[Wisdom]

I am just impressed with the verse and I think Juliet should make it to endgame for all the effort she's putting in

I bethink thee has't react'd in an exaggerat'd way towards juliet's efforts. The lady hast but writ a verse 'r two and thee has't scrambl'd f'r that lady favor, and madeth a point to alloweth everyone knoweth

Ah for the "I am never voting Juliet" stuff

Eh dunno if I agree with the specific point

[Wisdom]

but u cant explain either

Im just good at reading gamma

[Wisdom]

Fine, I'll break the silence.

VOTE: Galron

And I'll bet my rug GL is town after a post like that.

i feel like pav figured GL is softing a guilty so he got the first seats on the bus while he could

[Wisdom]

Does anyone townnread Ceph or DV and is able to sell that to me

I feel like other than maybe Dunn I'm townreading everyone else but can't read those two

If anything Ceph's lack of attempt to get me to townread him after I started suspecting him is sort of town.

Also I think I am town and will sell you that read for 2 gold?

--

GuiltyLion, I like your comprehensive post on Galron. I don't have the time right now to revisit Galron's posts and my thoughts on them more specifically, but essentially I'd say he's probably in the bottom half of my reads, and I remember thinking that it would be weird for him to be scum but I don't remember exactly why. The only specific thought about him that I remember is that the meltdown over Wheme being Friendly Neighbor and the crier claiming it anonymously but not in thread would be a strange thing for scum to fake caring about.. but I could see it in some sort of bizarre world where Galron just decides to see how much he can get away with making up.

I plan on engaging a bit more with your Galron read tomorrow and sharing more detailed thoughts.

Grand plans do not always eventuate, but further to the above I guess what I lack from Galron is any real effort to look town, and that makes it difficult for me to have him as a strong scumread. A lot of the jokey non-serious stuff seems reasonably likely from town just doing whatever.

DV subtly defending Galron

Probably this means DV and Pav are not both scum. If Pav figured there's a guilty, he'd say so and DV would not be trying to save him.

[Wisdom]

I'll point out again that even though there were opportunities for me to hop off the Galron wagon, I never did, though there was a perfectly serviceable Dunn wagon happening at the time (and maybe another? I dunno I've been finding this game hard to follow, not used to so many players).

That doesnt mean much

Galron was guiltied, he'd die eventually. If you left the wagon you would look bad.

[Wisdom]

Vote dunn with us or Ceph if you prefer and we'll join you

VOTE: Dunnstral
I’m feeling like the points against Galron aren’t enough to condemn him when his claim could do some good imo
Dunnstral meanwhile has felt consistently scummy even after his PR dropped
marci also sus ceph and I’m lean town on him but also a bit tbd

-GE

yo oth voters

scumbuddies dont vote the counterwagon when Galron is fucking guiltied. They join and look for cred.

[Wisdom]

I dont remember your play there at all, I didnt know its you until you were dead plus I was scum so I never read your posts trying to read you

@gamma

[Wisdom]

Dunnstral (4): Lady Lambdadelta, Wisdom, Off The Hook, Titus

The only one I can see as scum here is LLD, who weirdly claimed she didnt believe the claim but wanted to keep Galron alive for mechanical reasons (but also wanted Dunn who was obviously not aligned with Galron, so ???)
OTH and Titus are ++ town for the reason I said. Scum dont hop on the counterwagon while theres a guilty.

[Wisdom]

I haven't read up properly (even "skimmed" would be generous) but why are we voting Dunn?

This is more like a scum mentality

"You caught Galron, guys, I dont get why youre voting Dunn"

[Wisdom]

Yes spiffy it's a coincidence. This is role madness. The coin steal based on the last line of the mechanic explanation is part of the mechanic anyway

Beware! Where there is gold, there are thieves.

Gold stealing is part of the mechanic
It could easily be coming from town trying to steal from their scumreads

btw I really think these posts make it really obvious I did not have knowledge of the actual steal mechanic after all, but guess you guys can argue I am just good at faking and I wouldnt blame you

[Wisdom]

WhemeStar (7): Bowser Jr., Cephrir, Skybird, Off The Hook, Pavowski, Lukewarm, Juliet Capulet
Juliet Capulet (6): Tamora's Angel, GuiltyLion, Wisdom, Lady Lambdadelta, DeasVail, WhemeStar
DeasVail (1): Icebox
Bowser Jr. (1): Dunnstral
Off The Hook (1): Child of Fairies

Not Voting (1): Galron

I'd probably want some kind of further confirmation on JC's alignment before diving too hard down this rabbithole but I would say this is a good VC to return to later. If JC was in fact conf!scum, I'd bet there's at least one other scum on the Wheme wagon. I'm hard townreading Bowser Jr and Lukewarm, and we have effectively a mechanical inno on Skybird (in either world of town/scum Galron then Skybird is town), so I'd look in {Ceph, OTH, Pav} for another scum.

mhm. That'd be ceph, pav, or both.

[Wisdom]

pagetop

[Wisdom]

If Notsci thinks I'm scum, he and Spiffy are moving into my scum pile along with Pav and Dunn.

rule of 3 says hi to pav

[Wisdom]

But eh probably less accurate when youre guiltied and almost dead

[Wisdom]

That is 2 very good players who rarely agree, agreeing. That should tell you something.

This gives me a little pause

DV quotes this mockingly, and given the thing LLD and I agree on is Galron not dying, it's a weird thing to mock for a Galron scumbuddy

And tbh if he's town I'm inclined to agree with this. My LLD paranoia is increasing.

[Wisdom]

That is 2 very good players who rarely agree, agreeing. That should tell you something.

This post was meant to be accompanied by

"I can't handle this stroking of Wisdom's ego, but otherwise, good post.

Galron I thought you were only voting Dunn as the biggest counter, not due to Dunn being in your scumpile"

or nevermind, disregard the previous post completely

[Wisdom]

OTH/Galron

I feel like you know better than this

[Wisdom]

If I'm scum with Galron, I'd be taking the opportunity to vote Dunn (as some other people have pretty vehemently pushed for, and he's a decent second wagon).

Already addressed that today when he repeated it, but nope. Like I said in regards to OTH, scum dont vote the counterwagon when their buddy is guiltied. It's just asking for trouble.

[Wisdom]

It sounds like your role turned yourself vanilla for targeting wrong

Or for choosing the wrong box?

What if the one who offered you the boxes is scum and you get vanillized for choosing wrong

[Wisdom]

^@icebox

[Wisdom]

LLD probably town too.

LLD, I will never ever ever let you push me around.

I could see this as being scum theatre with LLD being a buddy

Galron is evidently in trolling mode given the following post

I want to be cremated and sprinkled over the scum team.

[Wisdom]

And thus I finished D2 and I'm done rereading

Things learned:

- OTH is never a Galron buddy. Scum don't vote the guilty scum's counterwagon after the guilty.
- Pav, Ceph and DV continue being the most likely buddies for both Juliet and Galron.
- Pav and DV are probably not scum together. Pav felt like he picked up on the guilty and secured an early bus, while DV tried to steer against the Galron wagon before the guilty was known. If they were on the same team, Pav would warn and DV would not do this.
- LLD joins the scumpool. Her approach to Galron is weird, she supposedly disbelieve Galron's claim but wants Dunn, who obviously is not a Galron buddy, dead. She is a very capable scum player and this could easily be a powerplay to give Galron a night and get a town lim. She can get out of this even if Galron will flip eventually. Galron remembering to include LLD in his "final reads" could easily be what he thought would be distancing. He wasnt a very good scum player.
- I found no reasons whatsoever to doubt my townreads on {Titus, Luke, Skybird, OTH, Icebox, Bowser, COF}. A townblock which Dunn also joins now due to anti-associatives with Galron.

[Wisdom]

And the last thing is that I happen to know the identity of the box giver, thats why I'm putting this up for discussion.

It sounds like your role turned yourself vanilla for targeting wrong

Or for choosing the wrong box?

What if the one who offered you the boxes is scum and you get vanillized for choosing wrong

[Wisdom]

sorry dv but yes. Either I'm headstrong and confident and many times wrong or I'm not.

[Wisdom]

Wisdom-town has had much more "weird" takes than this, but you havent played enough with me so I dont hold this against you too much

[Wisdom]

UNVOTE:
I wanna hear from icebox first

[Wisdom]

GL had you as pretty bottom in his reads. Does he object to you dying?

[Wisdom]

VOTE: pav

[Wisdom]

That sounded like lining up a push on me after dv

[Wisdom]

Do explain why me and DV cant both be town

[Wisdom]

I dont take issue with who you think is more likely

I take issue with the dichotomy

[Wisdom]

Lots of people have "bad associatives" with galron, don't see why youre picking us two

[Wisdom]

The quotes because I cant imagine you believe with a straight face that i have associatives with galron

[Wisdom]

Yeah there's no basis for that

You just said two names and went "1 scum in these two"

[Wisdom]

@Wisdom,

Mod said I was vanillized N1, but I opened the casket during the day.
Also I got the same casket today and picked right and the effect is pretty pro town, though this time I picked the casket during the night phase. Or at least pretty wifomy.

-Bell

Oh ok there goes that theory

[Wisdom]

VOTE: LLD

WAGON HO

I am a sheep wearing two eye patches

VOTE: lld

I dont dislike these but why does the pav claim make you think hes town?

[Wisdom]

And the last thing is that I happen to know the identity of the box giver, thats why I'm putting this up for discussion.

Also I got the same casket today and picked right and the effect is pretty pro town,

I think this convo got buried. Should this be outed as a possible soft-inno then?

uh no?
And unless there's more to it than I know I dont see it as such a "pretty protown" effect

[Wisdom]

Pav, when did you loverize them?

[Wisdom]

You know what, I will not even wait for the answer

I’m at work, but I’m breaking my rule to say that someone loverized me with Galron.

-Bell

This is where Icebox announces it, which is after the guilty. And it's not like Icebox held to it either, because they announced everything else in their first post of the day (1020).

Which means it happened after the guilty was out.

Which means it's Pav loverizing a doomed guiltied buddy to a townie.

Am I missing something?

[Wisdom]

Mod said I was vanillized N1, but I opened the casket during the day.

You had already picked it by your first D2 post so I assume you mean you picked it at dawn?
Can you confirm with the mod that you got vanillized before that? Maybe the mod meant to say at dawn of N1 or misremembered

[Wisdom]

If I visit certain players, I could lose my abilities it says, but doesn't specify what that means.

oh or maybe it was because of this
I didnt remember this

[Wisdom]

So the way I understand the Icebox timeline is

- Icebox targets GuiltyLion N1 and is vanillaized as a result (but the mod incorrectly does not resolve that)
- Icebox receives the caskets at dawn/start of D2
- Icebox picks a casket, was empty. Something probably happens to him?
- Later during D2 (after the guilty), Pav loverizes Galron and Icebox. They learn of this.
- At some point, the mod realizes that was incorrect, pauses the game, and informs them they are not loverized. Also she now tells Icebox about the N1 vanillaization.

So the scenarios I can see are two.

a) Picking the empty casket made Icebox ascetic, or at least immune to loverization (fits the flavor), meaning Pav's loverization failed but the mod missed that until the pause. I find this a little unlikely however because picking the empty box is supposed to incur a punishment, and both becoming ascetic and immune to loverization seem like beneficial effects.

b) The N1 vanillaization caused by visiting GuiltyLion also included an ascetization or a "you're immune to loverization" effect. This makes more sense because seeing as GuiltyLion is town, I find no reason to just punish Icebox for visiting him without adding in something beneficial. And those two being connected also makes sense seeing as we know the mod forgot about both of them until the pause.

[Wisdom]

The only question I have if b is the case is why would Nick Bottom have such an interaction with The Bear. Unless the mod error runs deeper than that and Icebox was redirected to someone else like Luke's Titania or something.

[Wisdom]

When did I do this? This was my night action n1, and if icebox is town that is easy to confirm.

I call bull but sure let's hear from Icebox

[Wisdom]

I'm not the one who made the lovers. That was foisted upon me by someone.

Can u elaborate when it happened

-GE

Dawn. It wasn't true when night ended, but it occurred during Dawn. Is that right, Icebox?

Ok nevermind looks like Pav is truthful about that

It messes a little with my timeline but not very much and it def does not change Pav being scum

[Wisdom]

Yeah the change to my timeline this brings is that it makes scenario a impossible, so it really is just scenario b, with the added possibility of the GuiltyLion visit giving him some untargetable for the night effect, which would also negate the loverization. In any case the two are connected.

[Wisdom]

Hi Enchant
Please get an avatar
I recently reread the game and quoted whatever I found important, you might find that useful.

[Wisdom]

Still fine with pav dying

[Wisdom]

some of the things brought up more recently make pav+dv feels possible

I do not think pav+dv is possible for the reason I said
I feel nobody reads my posts

[Wisdom]

And similarly I do not understand why oth is still on the table when I said multiple times that they are obviously not a galron buddy

[Wisdom]

Perhaps Loveriser failed because of same sex of targets flavors?

Loverizer most likely failed because of the GL visit like I described

[Wisdom]

Enchant I need content from you, I also scumread Ceph and so far you're not helping me change my mind

[Wisdom]

{Pav, LLD, Enchant}, DV

I see no reason for anyone to change their minds on Pav based on today's posts and if anything the claim should do the opposite. Loverizer is 99.999% a scum role.

Already talked about how she's likely a Galron buddy & The only thing LLD has done today is to indicate she wants OTH who looks obvtown to me, so unless that changes she's scum.

Ceph never did anything to make me think he's town and Enchant is not helping either.

DV is an outlier waiting to join in if Pav and/or Ceph end up being town somehow. Or maybe could be a 3p if there is one

Everyone else is town

[Wisdom]

OTH was in my Galron scum pool yesterday. I don't see why I should change that opinion after OTH botched a claim badly and then flailled and then convinced people it was genuine?

I dont see what's wrong with OTH's claim? Explain it to me like I'm five

[Wisdom]

And I will note you are saying nothing about Pav. Do you townread him? Do you think we have a town loverizer? Take stances.

[Wisdom]

So yeah OTH today, accept no substitutes.

I am kinda wavering on that just because they claim to self resolve, so we could hunt for their partner.

Why were you all aboard the "let galron live, so he can possibly get results - let's hunt for his partners" train, but you are not interested in letting the the self killing cop claim fire, and hunting for the other scum?

because one of those was her buddy and the other isnt

[Wisdom]

Might still be wrong on Dunnstral but that was a specific "if galrpn is town, then this" read.

No it wasnt. You were pushing for Dunn while claiming Galron is scum.

[Wisdom]

sigh inb4 everyone calls this tvt and lld survives forever

[Wisdom]

Show me whats wrong with OTH's claim.

As well as explain to me why they think that voting Dunn after Galron is guiltied is a good play.

And finally explain to me why you're not considering or even commenting on Pav.

And if your arguments are good I will listen.

[Wisdom]

Off The Hook (4): Dunnstral, Child of Fairies, Lady Lambdadelta, Icebox

Can those four people kindly vote Pav or Enchant

[Wisdom]

Wisdom voting Dunn for last after this is meh, i expected some meta knowledge from him.

What do you mean?

[Wisdom]

The only parity cop I know targets two people and learns if their alignments match. Idk what you're talking about

[Wisdom]

Happy scumday btw

Since you read the Galron lim day, how do you feel about OTH and LLD based on their actions that day?

[Wisdom]

Why is it a suicidal scum play?

Do you have experience with LLD btw?

[Wisdom]

I disagree, LLD is a skilled scum player and voting weaker buddies is expected behavior from her

[Wisdom]

And she didnt even bus either Juliet or Galron that hard.

Note this progression:

Vote: Juliet

Vote: Whemestar

Vote: Off the Hook

lld are you townreading juliet?

lld are you townreading juliet?

eh.

I asked her this because she voted OTH instead of rejoining the Juliet wagon when Wheme fizzed out

And as for Galron, you saw it. She supposedly didnt believe his claim but wanted to keep him alive and lim Dunnstral, while she agreed that Dunnstral and Galron arent buddies.

So what bussing?