Datisi's University [game over!]

[Aristeia]

no you stole first from me

[Aristeia]

VOTE: Dannflor

[Aristeia]

i am not sure if this is how the game works;

TPR points dont have to be used right away

for example if there is a protective and they require like 100 tpr points. assuming there are 14 town then them getting 100 tpr points today would only give the mafia 7.1 spr points (100/1400)

if there is a doctor and they decide to study later. for example when there is 8 town alive, then 100 tpr points would give the mafia 12.5 spr points.

ofc if the person is shot then the saved tpr points will be wasted.

i think there r lots of different strategies etc but agree with dann it is probably bad to direct people that we dont know. lets trust each other to be smart about playing this game.

[Aristeia]

well it makes the slot easy to sort

if its alive on d4 its probably mafia

[Aristeia]

unfair expectations

[Aristeia]

well it makes the slot easy to sort

if its alive on d4 its probably mafia

if her plan simply to get nightkilled though i guess i kinda hope untruthful

like ranger’s very good can get herself nightkilled without claim

and if doing so via claim would hope that actually studying 0 percent was untruthful which would be inconsistent with my knowledge of mastina but idk how applicable that knowledge is to ranger

I don't think its that important for us to figure it out unless we think she is mafia?

if she is town it is up to mafia to figure her out - which is a majority of worlds.

[Aristeia]

I thought your reaction was fine Dann and probably a little townie, if we want to talk mech we will just ignore you

[Aristeia]

also like even if this is a mafia gambit there is a 3p in the game and it feels p suboptimal for mafia to paint themselves as a target for crosskills. the last 3P was an SK i think so probably that just makes ranger town.

[Aristeia]

?

i am not ignoring dann

i thought he was feeling bad for raining on ina's parade and i was consoling him by telling him we would probably just do whatever we want to do and just not listen to his command of not talking about mech.

[Aristeia]

i think ina is excited by mech as both alignments so its nai for her.

[Aristeia]

VOTE: Dusa

[Aristeia]

i think ina is excited by mech as both alignments so its nai for her.

What do you actually make of ina? So far? If you had a gun to your head, what would you say she is?

probably town because she has some of the same thoughts as me but it's not anything she can't fake as mafia

[Aristeia]

also, I'm fully on board with BlueSnakelet's reasoning and plan and I'm gonna give him a whole heap of D1 towncred for posting it

it looks kind of scummy to me though

like just neatly packaging things that everyone should already know?

[Aristeia]

i am not sure if this is how the game works;

TPR points dont have to be used right away

for example if there is a protective and they require like 100 tpr points. assuming there are 14 town then them getting 100 tpr points today would only give the mafia 7.1 spr points (100/1400)

if there is a doctor and they decide to study later. for example when there is 8 town alive, then 100 tpr points would give the mafia 12.5 spr points.

ofc if the person is shot then the saved tpr points will be wasted.

i think there r lots of different strategies etc but agree with dann it is probably bad to direct people that we dont know. lets trust each other to be smart about playing this game.

[Aristeia]

I don't think everyone "already knew" to do all their non-studying Week 1.

I did not!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dusa has many things to learn...

? I'm assuming you've read my posts as you're voting for me so I'm kind of curious how you don't know this since I've already talked about it?

[Aristeia]

VOTE: Drew

[Aristeia]

Drew wagon was of interest to me in the sense that both Drew and the wagon could easily all be town, rather than of interest in the sense that I might vote there.

In other words, with it being the biggest wagon and all I was waiting for a scummy hop on vote to scrutinise and one seems to have appeared

Aristeia, please elaborate on your drew read

I don't really have one. the wagon looked pretty clean and I like all the people on it so I thought it would be nice to join them.

[Aristeia]

skimmed drew iso pretty briefly and didnt find anything that was notably townie. i dont really have a good track record of reading drew and have only played with him in one completed game so far.

[Aristeia]

i rememebr someone said he was townie for a reason and i thought it was a good reason when i read it.

[Aristeia]

I'd like a Dusa

Aristeia, please elaborate on your drew read

I could go for a Dusa read too

I didnt like how Dusa said I was ignoring Dann. Ignores the context of my comment and felt like it was instigating.

[Aristeia]

I really like Fire Assassin's 137

I had been getting similar vibes from Dusa's posts - I'm a bit torn on whether it's AI or whether it's just her character roleplay + general early game awkwardness, but the fact that FA directly called it out makes me feel good that he is town.

[Aristeia]

What was persuasive about that post to you?

I was already scumreading/voting Dusa so him calling her out for being performative is +town.

[Aristeia]

i didnt read FA's post

[Aristeia]

he feels pretty townie and enthuiastic

[Aristeia]

his enthuiasm makes him townie

[Aristeia]

because I've played with scum!andres and he did not enjoy being scum

[Aristeia]

@Dann I just reread the section where Dusa is posting shade at me and you can see there are two posts that directly contradict each other:

I thought your reaction was fine Dann and probably a little townie, if we want to talk mech we will just ignore you

I don't like this response!

It is too kind! In your heart you should know trying his patience can show his loyalties.

Aristeia is definitely a daughter of Aphrodite and maybe a daughter of the Professor.

^ here she's accusing me of being mafia who is being nice to Dannflor and should test him further if I were town?

I thought your reaction was fine Dann and probably a little townie, if we want to talk mech we will just ignore you

I'm not okay with ignoring someone and I don't like that you appear to be.

This is somewhat similar to my thought! Not that I think I'm as smart as Titus..

^ here she's propping up Titus who claims I'm being mean to Dannflor and ignoring him while saying Titus is smart for thinking this.

It doesn't make sense for her to believe both things - that I'm being nice to Dannflor and that I'm ignoring him.

[Aristeia]

What's different then? What posts make you think "Andres is beyond his scumrange here"

It's really weird the way you're framing these questions

[Aristeia]

the way I'm reading Andres is that his thoughts are chaotic in a way that feels like he's just sharing what he thinks about the game and the players in it without any real plan - it's very believable to me as a person who is just playing the game and trying to figure it.

What do you think about Ina, Drew? So far the only thing I've got is a raised eyebrow.

I also had a raised eyebrow about Ina's tone but this just seems like the way that she talks in general. I also couldn't think of any scummy or towny behavior that her strange tone might indicate.

Without giving all the usual caveats (uncertainty blah blah), I actually think this is the scummiest post so far.

also would you be able to add a little more here why you think this is a scummy post? I got an initial "trying too hard and overexplaining" ping from 175 but when I noticed they don't have a lot of history on the site I figured it might just be a newbie-being-thorough thing, and I don't see anything wrong with 167

Sure. What does the post

actually

say? Nothing, really. It’s shading ina without saying it, calling the tone “strange”. It’s one of those posts people put out when they don’t want to make a case but want to open up the possibility of a vote against a Town if momentum picks up.

this is a very believable thought process and the way he responds to GL about sail just feels like andres!town talking things out

[Aristeia]

What's different then? What posts make you think "Andres is beyond his scumrange here"

It's really weird the way you're framing these questions

I mean, if you elaborate the first time then I don't have to ask the same question in 3 different ways

saying someone is townie does not require them to be "beyond their scumrange"

He is not that limited or bad as a scum player that I can definitively solve him on like page 15 or whatever.

I am just saying he looks townie so far - you are setting some very strange goalposts in your questioning.

[Aristeia]

oh wait nvm you already posted in between on the next page so you had a chance to respond already so I'm just gonna dump this and keep going

It doesn't make sense for her to believe both things - that I'm being nice to Dannflor and that I'm ignoring him.

I'm not quite following you here - I thought Dusa's 103 was saying you shouldn't just TR+ignore Dann because it's harder to find his alignment that way, and then in 118 she's just +1ing again that ignoring Dann seems suspicious to her. I think the inconsistency you're calling out is reconciled if you believe that ignoring someone

is

being nice to them (in a mafia game at least), as the alternative would be pressuring/sorting them and that's what makes scum players uncomfortable.

the context of my post is that Dann felt bad about raining on Ina talking tech.

me saying to Dann that me/ina would just ignore his command about talking mech and talk mech anyway if we want to is not the same as ignoring Dann period as in his admonishment doesnt really matter to us who want to talk mech.

I am not saying i will ignore Dann in general. She should know that since she should understand that context since she said i am being much too kind to Dann.

[Aristeia]

jjh feels like hes chainsawing for drew and i would yeet him without hesitation if drew flips mafia

[Aristeia]

well you're basically implying its scummy to vote drew? that feels like you are trying to keep people from voting him?

[Aristeia]

like do you have drew sorted as town? why?

[Aristeia]

the way i think about it is

I think Andres, GL and Dannflor are all pretty good at finding mafia(sorry fire assassin i havent really played with you much)

they all seem somewhat townie in different ways.

I dont see why i shouldnt help them if they all think drew is mafia?

its a large theme and wagons and action is how you solve the game. scum have a lot of room to stall/ignore wagons because it takes so many votes to yeet someone so it makes sense to build wagons quickly and get results quickly.

[Aristeia]

well you're basically implying its scummy to vote drew? that feels like you are trying to keep people from voting him?

I said nothing of the sort. I believed a low effort vote was likely to come from scum and you came in with a low effort vote so I gave you the business over it. Low effort vote there comes from either scum or lazy town, but I expect lazy town to be able to demonstrate flexible thinking in response to probing and gradually build up reads rather than clarifying and defending a static postion like you did

lazy town are the ones sitting on vanity wagons and doing nothing with their vote. not the ones trying to build wagons to create actual action in the game. your framing is ridiculous.

[Aristeia]

saying i am either lazy town or scum is just absurd

[Aristeia]

if i was lazy i wouldnt even answer your pointless questions

[Aristeia]

I'm a lot more bothered by your failure to demonstrate town thought process on the townreads you have claimed to hold than I am by the drew vote.

For example, your reference to GL's post on FA feels much more likely to have come from scum paying attention to how other players are being read than it does a town player trying to place people, particularly given you managed to totally forget the very simple reason given for the read you supposedly agreed with

are you trying to convince me that I am mafia?

[Aristeia]

if not what is the point ?

[Aristeia]

I dont expect you if you're mafia to say "yes you are right i am chainsawing for drew"

[Aristeia]

so why would i care about your misread of me if you're town?

do you expect me to think you actually believe this nonsense?

[Aristeia]

I have an issue with the Aristeia wagon in that I played a game a while back with scum!Ari where town got absolutely suckered and she was in control of the game , playing town leader and leading us astray, I felt so hoodwinked at the end.

and I feel like she's made no real effort so far and the stuff people are registering as scummy is not stuff that scum!Ari is incapable of faking or doing well

so it seems a little too easy to me, I haven't found a reason to TR her but I'm skeptical that scum!Ari couldn't or wouldn't be doing more right now if she needed to

That makes sense. The only recent Aristeia scumgame I can find is new year's dance party in which Ari was limmed Day 1. She just shitposted the entire day and got flipped, and she only made content when she had to. In Eurybia's Curse (towngame) she had decidedly more content, especially in the early game. This game seems a bit more similar to that scumgame, but I also didn't do a whole lot of reading.

thats probably fair

I generally dont put out a lot of content unless I have time and motivation

[Aristeia]

in eurybia though i think i just mostly shitposted about the boat party and vibed because it was fun to do.

in the dance game i didnt really care as much because there were a number of tvt conflicts and my partners were set up very well and i knew my flip would help them go much further in the game. my motivation was also pretty flat because my partner was widely scumread and people wanted to flip him.

[Aristeia]

jjh feels like hes chainsawing for drew and i would yeet him without hesitation if drew flips mafia

well you're basically implying its scummy to vote drew? that feels like you are trying to keep people from voting him?

Explain.

He said the people on my wagon are probably town.

And why is saying 'hey Drew might be town's causing such an issue with you?

And someone asked, but I haven't felt any urgency to move off of Osuka at any point, and nothing they have said in there brief catch up here compels me to move.

I don't get there vote on Ranger as well(osuka I mean), have you played with them before?

I probably need to go into sheep mode, so far no real strong scum vibes I am getting yet.

Who wants a loyal sheep to follow them?

the point that I am making is that his goal is to prevent more people from voting you by saying scum or lazy town would hop onto your wagon.

him saying the people on your wagon are likely town do not have anything to do with this.

[Aristeia]

If that was my goal, why didn't I do that before you hopped on the wagon in a lazy and poorly thought out manner

(1) you need a new target for your counterwagon

(2) you need to scare other people from joining the wagon and you think interrogating me is a good way to stop others

(3) it's pretty blatant if you just say nobody vote drew he's town and you don't actually have a reason he's town - it creates a more obvious associative and its unlikely to work or be convincing

(4) you think presenting this line of thought would make people think you're town

[Aristeia]

You can focus on the drew wagon bit all you want but that was just the basis for the push which caught you off guard. It's not some critical component of my read, nor is it going to feature in a push on anyone else because I have already done it once and that would make it less useful for placing someone. Right now of course, I have already found scum

I am responding to drew's question

[Aristeia]

I don't see why you need to talk to me if I am "lazy scum" who is caught in your "ingenious trap"

[Aristeia]

and that makes me scum because?

[Aristeia]

I don't see why you need to talk to me if I am "lazy scum" who is caught in your "ingenious trap"

Because ultimately I am still pushing and placing at all times

if you like the sound of your own voice so much I think you should ask for a notes pt

[Aristeia]

or maybe simply save yourself some time and record it and then play it on loop back to yourself

[Aristeia]

is there a point in continuing to tell me I'm mafia?

do you think you will eventually convince me that I am actually mafia?

[Aristeia]

you think I'm mafia

I know I'm town

Is that the difference you think we can resolve by you continuing to tell me I'm mafia?

[Aristeia]

That's still not what I am trying to tell you or get you to do.

There are two things you have refused, in the simplest possible terms:
1. Someone who scumreads you does not have to be scum
2. Someone who scumreads you might consider that you may also be town

I usually expect all town players to be capable of thinking along these lines eventually. I have been continually prodding you for any semblence of town thought process

I have never said either of those things.

[Aristeia]

The point is more that the longer you have gone on entrenching your position and pretending things are simpler than they are for the sake of an easier defence, the more confident I have become on my read on you.

i dont even believe its a real read

[Aristeia]

I am going to sleep.

I have already explained my thought process to you.

[Aristeia]

But I want to townread Ari for #82, so I guess it's TvT.

if you think it's TvT then why did you post 501? like what was the goal of that post

Make Ari stop doing that.

I don't understand how anyone would think I actually want to talk to jjh

[Aristeia]

I guess maybe if you think I respond to him poking me because I enjoy it?

well I don't enjoy it. I find it frustrating, tedious and boring. I actually lose sleeping time over it because I get wound up and I should stop.

I will refrain from talking to or about him in the future. If he's mafia the rest of you can figure it out.

I personally think he is but it's not impossible he actually thinks he is the central detective character of a poorly written book.

[Aristeia]

Ari do you think jjh is scum?

I think the way he approached me was pretty agenda'd. I think he had a destination and basically tried to get there, it didn't feel like he was actually curious. the framing of the questions just feels very weird to me like he was trying to get some kind of gotcha or make me look bad. The conclusions he reaches are kind of level 0 thought that dont really make sense with his level of confidence.

I understand I am a pretty biased person and I don't really trust myself to read people who tilt me.

I think if drew were to flip mafia it would make sense as a way of defending his slot and creating a counterwagon.

I dont really know if drew will actually flip mafia or if we even want to flip drew here. the day is still pretty early and more than half the pl is stuck vanity voting or not voting so its p shrug to me.

I dont think interacting with jjh further is going to make my read on him any better.

[Aristeia]

Hi Norwee nice to see you again. hope we are on the same side this time

[Aristeia]

i liked defending him tho he was a qt

[Aristeia]

Ari do you think jjh is scum?

I think the way he approached me was pretty agenda'd. I think he had a destination and basically tried to get there, it didn't feel like he was actually curious. the framing of the questions just feels very weird to me like he was trying to get some kind of gotcha or make me look bad. The conclusions he reaches are kind of level 0 thought that dont really make sense with his level of confidence.

I understand I am a pretty biased person and I don't really trust myself to read people who tilt me.

I think if drew were to flip mafia it would make sense as a way of defending his slot and creating a counterwagon.

I dont really know if drew will actually flip mafia or if we even want to flip drew here. the day is still pretty early and more than half the pl is stuck vanity voting or not voting so its p shrug to me.

I dont think interacting with jjh further is going to make my read on him any better.

a further caveat; i think there is a decent chance that jjh can be agenda'd town who wants me to be mafia and him to have caught me or whatever.

[Aristeia]

Ari do you think jjh is scum?

I think the way he approached me was pretty agenda'd. I think he had a destination and basically tried to get there, it didn't feel like he was actually curious. the framing of the questions just feels very weird to me like he was trying to get some kind of gotcha or make me look bad. The conclusions he reaches are kind of level 0 thought that dont really make sense with his level of confidence.

I understand I am a pretty biased person and I don't really trust myself to read people who tilt me.

I think if drew were to flip mafia it would make sense as a way of defending his slot and creating a counterwagon.

I dont really know if drew will actually flip mafia or if we even want to flip drew here. the day is still pretty early and more than half the pl is stuck vanity voting or not voting so its p shrug to me.

I dont think interacting with jjh further is going to make my read on him any better.

a further caveat; i think there is a decent chance that jjh can be agenda'd town who wants me to be mafia and him to have caught me or whatever.

That is a strange take, do you have experience with JJh that would make you think this?

Pre Edit: Norwee, what do you think of their(JJh) stance on me?

i dont think ive played with jjh before

maybe i have and i forgot

its more of a personality read. i have dealt with a lot of arrogant people who are convinced they are right and a hero complex.

[Aristeia]

I've seen her iso and feel she's not bothering to hide her scum role PM. I thought it obvious if anyone viewed; if it truly wasn't, then I'll say simply: gut. Her posts appear lifeless. She's putting effort in, sure, yet I don't see effort to actually solve; I see effort to poster, positioning for manipulation. I don't see a vibrant iso. She's devoid of passion.

I think you're just talking about yourself here

[Aristeia]

I think of all the people voting me that this one is most likely to be mafia;


VOTE: KKFC

the long catchup feels like busywork and over justification of a vote

[Aristeia]

A lot of the posts I'm about to reference in my catchup posts are from a really long time ago. They are partially for myself. Feel free to skip over these and ask me questions under the assumption that I've read everything.

31: Agree with Drew that this is sort of fishing, but I'm not really of the opinion that it's that alignment indicative? Could just be excited. Personally I'm of the opinion that Datisi balanced the costs of all the roles fairly well so people should just do what they think is best.

34: Isn't Ranger basically claiming that they're a very strong town role here? This is just WIFOM so I'm going to move past. Also, full sending it if your role seems to be stronger earlier in the game (particular investigative roles, recruiting, etc) seems pro-town, not anti-town.

36: bothers me more than 31 mainly because town is never winning 14-4-1 based off of scumhunting, imo

49: is this a claim?

59: I'm just going to gloss over all mentions of Mastina for the time being because it's probably not going to help me figure out what's going on

83: Dannflor case on ina seems to be based on the idea that people want to be seen as proactive early on in games. Is this even true? Is it likely to be true in the case of ina?

99: Dusa posts fucking rock keep it up.

100: I think I agree with this.

130: Dannflor picking on people who choose not to interact with the game as a whole during the early game makes me feel 1) better about him getting a little mad at me later but 2) nothing about his alignment

140: Dannflor either town or scum who is really bossing it up. Weight of probabilities probably leaning town as of this point!

143: I understand where this motivation comes from.

146: explains 173 but still kinda mean ngl.

174: policy votes are interesting to me. I feel like the people behind them probably just always skew town? It probably reads different now than it did in a period of high posting where it's meant to get Dusa to interact more meaningfully.

181: has a point and makes me wonder why Dusa thinks/thought Ranger is/was town?

184: does anyone ever play mafia where if they start thinking someone (in this case Drew) might be scum then, because their reads on that player are usually really bad, they come to the conclusion that the player might be town? Not saying GuiltyLion did this but rather it's my thoughts when reading this post.

189: last three words phrasing

194: I suspect a lot of Sail's wording like "thought process" is newer town trying to put forth an argument with evidence. I looked through one of my Newbie games and found a really similar sounding post.

195: Town

241: I think this is a town post.

242: I think this is not a town post, but maybe I should just come to terms with Guilty being a more declarative player? Tracks with 241 at least.

277: Wondering if how I'm feeling about Dann can be summed up by him being pretty one-track in finding inconsistencies in how people play and prodding them into places where he can learn more about them. Is this town!Dann play?

301: Don't really get this post as a response to 230?

319: Titus would probably find the same defense as either town or scum but the post is very valid

348: How do one-directional interactions tend to go when it comes to town or scum? The number of people Dusa has interacted with seems to indicate to me it's probably more random and depending on if Dusa wants to post, but maybe there's a pattern I'm totally missing.

360/361: Posts are funny to me because jjh is right that post is not even trying to be persuasive.

372: Cannot tell if my opinion of Aristeia going down is a result of posts or Ranger coloring my judgement. 372 feels like a very different level of preparation/understanding of what's going on compared to earlier posts like 82. Similarly, jjh going full prosecutor mode makes me feel weird. SvS? Is that even a thing that was possible at that stage in the game?

385: It is at this moment that I realized the scumteam are called the Professor's Pets. Take this comment as you wish.

398: please don't get mad it's only short words but what does this post mean @osuka

409: do people ever bus, or at least not do anything to help alleviate the wagon, here with a 4 scum team?

430: Second guessing seems natural at this stage, in general I like GuiltyLion's posts, but I always wonder if at some point you just overthink yourself back into a position that's essentially WIFOM.

444: jjh claiming that he gave someone the business unironically makes him town in my eyes.

513: Is this a fair point to have though? Like if the idea is that Ari is a good player then shouldn't both have better defenses to jjh's prolonged push. I think the frustration on previous pages comes across as played up, but I also don't know what GuiltyLion would butt in, because another 20 pages and I think some people (like myself) would probably have their eyes glaze over and proclaim TvT.

I'm aware of the fact that I've outsourced a lot of the thinking and generation of reads this games to other people, and that a lot of my comments are basically just "agree" or "disagree" or even like "please explain".

I guess at this point I'm wondering what things would look like if jjh is town and Ari is scum. I think I would play it somewhat similarly to how Ari did, but doubling down and not really explaining townreads is also something frustrated town (along the lines of "fuck you I don't need to explain myself to anyone" vibes) would do.

I think if KFFC was actually interested in answers to his questions he would ask individually instead of putting them next to post links because most people dont really read wall posts and its not clear who some of these questions are directed at.

it feels like a "show your work" post. the line about first finding out the scum faction are called the Professor's Pets in post 385 pinged as kind of lamisty.

[Aristeia]

the long catchup feels like busywork

do you think, scums would have a harder time finding things to say about me than town?

I don't know

[Aristeia]

Does it feel that way? I've not even called you scum yet and everyone else on Drew's wagon is varying levels of probably town

well you're basically implying its scummy to vote drew? that feels like you are trying to keep people from voting him?

this is the first interaction in the game that actually has me furrowing my eyebrows in response

really fucking weird here ari

Lots of people do tell me I'm weird but I don't really care because if I'm not me I might as well not exist

[Aristeia]

sure

[Aristeia]

no his issue was that you seem to be always stuck in catchup mode which is really easy to fake for mafia

[Aristeia]

no it is not

[Aristeia]

@Aristeia What is your opinion on jjh switch on you?

I am trying to digest your KKFC read, and I don't agree on how the catchup was busy work to justify a vote. It seems like a lot of different thoughts on different posts, which parts look "busywork", and even some of his thoughts on you I can see where coming from.

it felt like busy work because i dont see how he expects to get answers to his questions when they are not even to the people he is supposedly asking them to.

[Aristeia]

the catchup isnt really to justify the vote ig

[Aristeia]

he is saying you catching up on things that happened a while ago is a way to not have takes about things actually happening right now.

[Aristeia]

@Aristeia What is your opinion on jjh switch on you?

I am trying to digest your KKFC read, and I don't agree on how the catchup was busy work to justify a vote. It seems like a lot of different thoughts on different posts, which parts look "busywork", and even some of his thoughts on you I can see where coming from.

i dont really know? it kind of fits into my initial theory about him chainsawing for drew p well. i want to see where he goes from here. i dont think id start to trust him until he actually catches some bad guys.

[Aristeia]

yea thats my point hes just writing questions to show a thought process not to actually get answers? which feels like scum who doesnt really want to get answers?

[Aristeia]

VOTE: Sail

[Aristeia]

vote count 1.07b

with 19 votes in play, it takes 10 to make a decision. week 1 ends in (expired on 2023-08-31 19:00:00).

dismissal

osuka [8]:

Doctor Drew, furtiveglance, Dannflor, Titus, RCEnigma, Dusa, Andresvmb, Ranger

Sail [4]:

NorwegianboyEE, GuiltyLion, Aristeia, Fire Assassin

Aristeia [1]:

KatyKimFanClub

Doctor Drew [1]:

BlueSnakelet

furtiveglance [1]:

jjh927

Dannflor [1]:

osuka

Ranger [1]:

WhemeStar

not voting [2]:

ina marija, Sail

did a VC because haven't seen one in a while and

Osuka is at e-2 currently

[Aristeia]

I am not impersonating the mod I just like his formatting

[Aristeia]

I am kind of creeped out by how quickly that went from 4->8 and nobody even seemed to notice how close we are to limming him in a large theme

[Aristeia]

my page 46 guess for the scumteam is Sail Titus Ranger Andresvmb

I don't expect it to be right but I reserve the right to claim I totally knew what I was doing if I am right

[Aristeia]

Dusa for 3P

[Aristeia]

her soul feels like chaotic evil

[Aristeia]

instead of responding to eleven different things maybe just write out why you want to vote out RCEnigma?

[Aristeia]

it just feels like the sort of thing asking to be fooled by aristeia as angled interactions directly in her wheelhouse

that's kind of true but he's also never played with me as far as I remember so I don't see why he wouldn't just use the same methods he uses on everyone.

I agree the read feels a little too strong to be natural but he might just be a supremely confident individual.

have a good night Ina.

[Aristeia]

1503 feels like a very town!furtiveglance read.

it's like horribly wrong but only in the way furtiveglance can be when he's like town.

[Aristeia]

I haven't actually played with scumfurtiveglance but it does feel like when he was pushing peta in Hollow Knight.

I guess he could replicate it to get townread but I don't think he would because he has a sense of pride imo.

[Aristeia]

I didn't call you a bad player I said your read is wrong in a way that is likely to come from town!you

[Aristeia]

I didn't bother to address your points because ina already did and there is no point for me to repeat what she already said

[Aristeia]

Spoiler:

Lower strengths..

Spoiler:

I'm not creative enough to understand this

[Aristeia]

I don't like this wagon on Ranger.

I think this osuka-sail-Ranger movement is gonna force me to go all Detective Drew on how these wagons formed and how they led to Ranger.

Been a bit since I put in effort lol.

I am unprepared for this experience

[Aristeia]

ready to be wowed any day now Detective Drew

[Aristeia]

[Aristeia]

I think of all the people voting me that this one is most likely to be mafia;


VOTE: KKFC

the long catchup feels like busywork and over justification of a vote

This selection of Aristeia's voters as a potential votepool is survivalistic/defensive

yea thats my point hes just writing questions to show a thought process not to actually get answers? which feels like scum who doesnt really want to get answers?

JJH scumread but no vote

VOTE: Sail

Unexplained/unprecedented in terms of read on Sail, who previously expressed scumread on Ari

my page 46 guess for the scumteam is Sail Titus Ranger Andresvmb

I don't expect it to be right but I reserve the right to claim I totally knew what I was doing if I am right

No JJH in here

it just feels like the sort of thing asking to be fooled by aristeia as angled interactions directly in her wheelhouse

that's kind of true but he's also never played with me as far as I remember so I don't see why he wouldn't just use the same methods he uses on everyone.

I agree the read feels a little too strong to be natural but he might just be a supremely confident individual.

have a good night Ina.

Mixed read on JJH which I interpret as more of a hedgy scumread.

Furtiveglance and Aristeia distancing in here?

why would i shoot jjh after he townbins me

[Aristeia]

VOTE: Osuka

[Aristeia]

Dusa if you're a jester type role you just have to help us catch two mafia and we will vote you off as a reward <3

[Aristeia]

I guess there's 4 mafia so maybe help us lim three mafia?

[Aristeia]

I guess there's 4 mafia so maybe help us lim three mafia?

:>

I am definitely trying to help you dismiss three or more children or the Professor.. I would love if that makes you like me..

I have always liked you

[Aristeia]

Also no one else has brought it up but I’m fairly sure jjh was targeted because of their eod post reminding players to submit their percentages. Not for their read accuracy or push on wheme (not to discount either).

wild take

[Aristeia]

Does anyone want to do anything while we wait for Sail to exist?

If nothing else make sure you have put sufficient thought into and then sent in how much study time you are putting in

This post said to me jjh has a pr. A VT isn’t going to give thought to if the prs in the game are paying attention to the method they have to input study time.

So for scum it’s worth putting a shot there.

Ari if you are more inclined to think jjh is dead because they were pushing Wheme, fine. I’ll vote there on the condition you put your full force behind a ranger elim if they flip green.

? I'm not voting for Wheme?

I wanted to see the Day 4 Ranger Super God of Scumhunting tbh

[Aristeia]

why would i shoot jjh after he townbins me

Unless you want to make the argument that if you were scum you are the one calling all the shots on night actions, I don't see the point in anyone arguing that they wouldn't kill jjh.
I wouldn't kill jjh either, he was a scumread for myself when I did. That doesn't make me not scum just because I personally wouldn't go to kill him. So arguments like this are pointless.

where exactly did this observation come from? like why are you connecting furtive and ari here?

It was a random thought coming to my head as I was thinking about furtiveglance being very quiet in this game. That post when leading up to end of day seemed to be defending the flipped town while pushing or distancing with partner to me. I want to hear more from furtiveglance though given his lack of pressence today and even near end of day yesterday.

I will miss you.

[Aristeia]

has anyone other than Ranger actually done any meta on CCS?

[Aristeia]

so whats your meta analysis say ?

[Aristeia]

VOTE: kffc

i cant believe people finally decided kffc was scummy

[Aristeia]

wheme feels town to me because my bar for wheme is pretty low to the ground

[Aristeia]

like the way wheme reacted to the "slip" he caught about Ranger felt like townie excitement and not mafia faking excitement over catching a slip.

and if you can find me a game where scum!wheme faked excitement I'd be happy to look at it but from what I remember of reading his scum games he's pretty boring(don't ask me which games I literally don't remember because he's that boring)

[Aristeia]

again he chooses the most random inconsequential stuff to comment on, then he completely misinterprets Ranger's point in 2158 and 2168

and Dusa made a good point that D1 Wheme was shouting in thread that Ranger slipped and then D2 he's treating her with less confidence in a scumread

2158/2168 look fine to me?

i dont really think ranger is re-evaluating anything either but thats pretty nai

[Aristeia]

yeah but actually reading her posts she was saying

other

people need to re-evaluate, she wasn't including herself in the group of people she was calling out. wheme's suggesting hypocrisy where there is none

you don't think its hypocrisy for someone to call for

other

people to re-evaluate when her own reads have barely changed over 90 pages or whatever we're on

[Aristeia]

thats literally the definition of hypocrisy

[Aristeia]

you don't think its hypocrisy for someone to call for other people to re-evaluate when her own reads have barely changed over 90 pages or whatever we're on

not in the context of the D1 wagon flipping town after she said she thought it would

like her point was obviously that the people who thought Sail was scum and Ranger's scumreads were town are the ones who need to re-evaluate

it's not hypocritical to say "I'm right and you're wrong and you need to re-evaluate", she didn't say "everyone in this game needs to re-evaluate"

ok but if you're whemestar and ranger scumreads you all game and you know you're town does that not seem hypocritical to you

[Aristeia]

Why does the act of voting me deserve towncred?
If you think I'm that scummy how does that explain your gameplay up until now?

i like their reasons not just their vote on you

what was my reason for thinking kffc is mafia

[Aristeia]

ok but if you're whemestar and ranger scumreads you all game and you know you're town does that not seem hypocritical to you

but she hasn't scumread him all game, she initially had him as a null/townlean which Whemestar himself called out

her read on him instead progressively sank over time and with D1 execution flipping town as Ranger said she thought it would, why should Wheme expect her to then re-evaluate?

no what he called out was that she had him as lower townread and scumread at the same time

[Aristeia]

VOTE: ccs

[Aristeia]

@Ari - eh you're right on that, but either way it's immaterial to the point

Ranger was very clear that she thought the people who scumread Sail and townread/ignored Ari and CCS need to re-evaluate

Wheme comes in like "but you aren't re-evaluating tho?!?", completely disregarding what she was actually saying

whether that's a genuine misunderstanding or willful ignorance is maybe up for debate but you're steering the argument into something irrelevant (Ranger's read on Wheme)

as someone who is being tunneled by ranger i kind of get how wheme feels about ranger calling people out for "re-evaluating" or whatever

[Aristeia]

it is hypocritical for someone to call on other people to be open minded when they are not really open minded

this has nothing to do with being right or wrong its just how you treat other people.

[Aristeia]

I'm only voting CCS to reclaim the crown

[Aristeia]

well thats one lower tier i suppose

there can only be one

[Aristeia]

page 100 pagetop

[Aristeia]

VOTE: kffc
i cant believe people finally decided kffc was scummy

I can't believe people haven't realized Aristeia's blatantly scum.

If I ask you to explain/case this, will you?

Not sure I can rn. If I can, then yes.

It's a combination of who they are pushing/defending and when, as well as a general lack of effort to read the majority of the game.

What reads/stances of Aristeia's can you think of, without a deep iso dive? What thoughts can you remember her having? Without going back, can you think of what she has given? Her iso in a scumgame I feel is heavily reminiscent of what she's done this game, in both volume (amount of posts) and content.

In a random towngame, her iso was completely different. Here's another similar random towngame. Completely different volume (Aristeia was far more active), and has a completely different feel.

I can't write a full case atm, yet contrary to GuiltyLion saying this doesn't look like Aristeia's scumgame...her play here absolutely does.

I think you're confusing how much I enjoy playing a game with whether I'm actually mafia.

[Aristeia]

I'm proactive in games I enjoy playing

[Aristeia]

nope

[Aristeia]

How to lift the mood:
1: Tell everyone how not much fun you are having.

I didn't really want to say it, I am explaining because she says I am mafia for it.

[Aristeia]

Datisi hates looking for replacements

[Aristeia]

you should vote for snivy

I don't know what I would do without Ranger telling me I'm mafia every other page

[Aristeia]

I just like the attention tbh

[Aristeia]

Enchant is Fire Assassin and I think Fire Assassin is town so Enchant should be town

[Aristeia]

Fire Assassin is significantly funnier and more casual when he's like actually mafia imo

[Aristeia]

if it matters 0% yday and 20% today so i have 3 shots in essence

think this is pretty anti-town to do when you might die today

[Aristeia]

ari why is kkfc mafia

i dont think kffc has to be mafia

[Aristeia]

also idk if youre implying that im mafia with that statement but that reasoning wouldnt work considering i cant even submit study time as mafia

I'm saying it sounds like you don't really have a town mindset about study time which is +scum

[Aristeia]

holy shit i misread my role pm

im basically just a loyal babysitter

(i thought my protect would go through if i targetted scum)

I think the obvious question here is

if he thought he was a babysitter who could kill scum, why does he need three uses of his ability

[Aristeia]

Meh, i believe for some reason.

I think I believe it as well, I probably wouldn't use if I had that role. What I am questioning is why CCS has chosen to accumulate the points at all?

this post feels scummy to me, furtive is throwing shade on CCS over something NAI despite ostensibly wanting to see Ranger eliminated today instead

it is not nai

[Aristeia]

holy shit i misread my role pm

im basically just a loyal babysitter

(i thought my protect would go through if i targetted scum)

I think the obvious question here is

if he thought he was a babysitter who could kill scum, why does he need three uses of his ability

i thought i would protect, but not kill scum

also snakelet set it at 0 so i presume he wanted at least 2 uses. im still a doctor, arent i?

if you're town you're basically a walking doublekill for the scum atp

[Aristeia]

well if i die and ranger doesnt then ranger is scum

in the world where you are town;

if ranger is mafia, she just won't shoot you and we won't know anything

if ranger is town, you're just handing a doublekill to the mafia on a platter.

you cannot telegraph your role at all.

if you are town you should not charge for the rest of the game and use RNG when deciding whether to use to protect

[Aristeia]

but don't you think he would still want the protective ability

especially since he's not really widely townread, that's the sweet spot to use a babysitter action

I don't see why someone who might get yeeted would decide to charge their ability because if they get yeeted their ability points go to waste

[Aristeia]

holy shit i misread my role pm

im basically just a loyal babysitter

(i thought my protect would go through if i targetted scum)

I think the obvious question here is

if he thought he was a babysitter who could kill scum, why does he need three uses of his ability

It fits with blues mentality that stacking tpr earlier is more cost efficient.

ok but a babysitter who can kill scum only shoots once and doesnt need three bullets

[Aristeia]

I doubt CCS was thinking on D1 "oh shit I might get yeeted on D2, guess I'll just forfeit using my role at all then lol"

im talking about him charging on day two

[Aristeia]

also why does scum!CCS bother to lie about this, too. like he could have easily just said he 0% studied yesterday and 100% studied today. this is striking me as fundamentally trying to push someone for being bad town and I Do Not Like

because scum CCS would want us to think he's got all these TPR points saved up and we dont want to lose those now do we

[Aristeia]

like it's so easy to understand why someone would do 0% study on D1 with that role??

if he thought his protect goes through on scum he should only be charging one shot because babysitters die with their targets no? i thought they worked like suicide bombers, if they get shot they kill their target with them?

[Aristeia]

holy shit i misread my role pm

im basically just a loyal babysitter

(i thought my protect would go through if i targetted scum)

I think the obvious question here is

if he thought he was a babysitter who could kill scum, why does he need three uses of his ability

It fits with blues mentality that stacking tpr earlier is more cost efficient.

ok but a babysitter who can kill scum only shoots once and doesnt need three bullets

You’re working on the premise that his one shot just happens to be the night he gets nightkilled and that he would know that in advance so he doesn’t have any use for any more shots…

if he misses he can just charge again the next day?

[Aristeia]

and also that is to say "bad town" in quotes cause I think assuming town!CCS then his play to 0% study yesterday is Correct

p-edit: ok, I guess that is a Plausible but Extremely Uncharitable interpretation of why CCS would claim to charge points today.

0% study with a role like that is absolutely incorrect if your TPR is bad you charge one use max, you dont charge up 180% thats nonsense

[Aristeia]

Group 3: This is the group for the most powerful of roles, such as the standard Cop. People in this group will get and spend no more than 200 TPR each. They'll study 0% of the time during Week 1, and will do all of their remaining not-studying during Week 2. Judging from the Datisi's Café roster, only one person should be in this group.

do you really think a loyal babysitter fits in group 3

[Aristeia]

if he misses he can just charge again the next day?

for example if there is a protective and they require like 100 tpr points. assuming there are 14 town then them getting 100 tpr points today would only give the mafia 7.1 spr points (100/1400)

if there is a doctor and they decide to study later. for example when there is 8 town alive, then 100 tpr points would give the mafia 12.5 spr points.

im talking about using the role as a suicide bomber not a doctor

[Aristeia]

holy shit i misread my role pm

im basically just a loyal babysitter

(i thought my protect would go through if i targetted scum)

this implies that his intention was to use his role as a suicide bomber to kill mafia right?

why would a suicide bomber need more than one shot?

[Aristeia]

Group 2: This is the default group for most PRs. Roles that can stop the Weekend expulsion like protectors and blockers fit here. Weaker investigators such as Traffic Annalist fits here too. People in this group will get and spend no more than 100 TPR points each, and will do all their not-studying in Week 1. Ideally, most of people not in Group 1 should be in this group.

Group 3: This is the group for the most powerful of roles, such as the standard Cop. People in this group will get and spend no more than 200 TPR each. They'll study 0% of the time during Week 1, and will do all of their remaining not-studying during Week 2. Judging from the Datisi's Café roster, only one person should be in this group.

^ this is Blue's plan

do you really think he believes a loyal babysitter is in Group 3 and not Group 2?

[Aristeia]

I'm gonna go take a walk and maybe think about this some more but probably not

UNVOTE:

[Aristeia]

i guess if hes town he shouldnt live for very long so its fine

[Aristeia]

furtive is just town

[Aristeia]

the scum reaction to a town trueclaim is not to begin doubting it and trying to poke holes in it.

[Aristeia]

like if mafia see a town babysitter claim and telegraph their actions they just rub their hands together and wait to cash in that sweet doublekill

[Aristeia]

if im mafia and ccs is town i dont doubt his claim i just let him charge away and give me free spr and then cash him in for a doublekill down the road

he is literally a walking gift

[Aristeia]

me niether

[Aristeia]

me niether

don't even give me who is town who is mafia then
just go down the playerlist and list what comes to mind when you think of that player

maybe later if i feel like it

[Aristeia]

actually thats kind of a lie i hate this game

[Aristeia]

2 uses of BlueSnakelet's ability costs 110! That is beyond the budget of group 2!

I actually wasn't paying attention to his role's cost or thinking about that at all. I had assumed it was 100 for two uses, this is a good point

fuming

[Aristeia]

eyeroll

[Aristeia]

I wish I could kill people at night

[Aristeia]

VOTE: CCS e-1

[Aristeia]

gg

glad to see we won despite my terrible play/reads

ty for modding Datisi <3

[Aristeia]

ty alisae - you are very sweet