BIOCHEMISTRY - game over, finally, it's only been 5 months

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Hello.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

So did you guys both enjoy Re:Zero? Because I found it to be annoying and probably one of my lowest rated in a long time.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

bee wanted me to watch it last year, is it really bad?

Well if you like random otaku transported into fantasy world where he becomes the hero this fantasy world needs, which slowly turns into a harem and filled with moe, then you might enjoy it! (I say might because even then you have the plot failing completely and the show trying too hard at being ~intellectual~ but it backfires).

The only interesting character was betelgeuse.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

CHEETORY is a good vote.

Vote: Gorkington

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Spiffeh you won't be able to buddy me this easily.

You already know I love votes on me.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Wait seriously? you'd be the direct opposite of me then.

Yeah!

I get reads better when people are scumreading me.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Anyway town points for sakura firebringer yoshi.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I, too, dislike Spiffeh's posts.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yoshi is town because I think scum would play more consciously than the way he proceeded on first page, plus I liked his other posts after.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

He changed votes like 3 times on the first page lol.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Marquis you made the worst post in the game so far

This posts reeks fake holy.

Seems like he's trying to imitate his town game but it lacks any emotion.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yeah that too, "I have Marquis townread now for ~secrets~".

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I feel like some of these scumreads on Spif are fake and scum are just trying to read the table to see what's possible right now but this is mostly gut.
-Rem (Ali)

Tbf it's like 2 people, me and Vifam.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

The real question is when are we gonna get the BLEACH DRINKING Vifam of Mafiastuck?

Damn that was a super fun game.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Vecna is town
Creature is town
Cheetory lean town
Voices by far my strongest scumread

Vote: Voices

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I love it.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Ty NAD+/NADH we literally couldn't live without you if you didn't shuttle electrons during cellular respiration!!!!

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Let's see if we can lynch Titus before she comes back for fun.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

All their posts are commenting from the sideline and boring attempts at scumhunting.

"Let me catch up via relying to random things in the thread aren't I so town guys look at how stream-of-consciousness my posts are."

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I didn't get scumvibes from Firebringer btw.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I'm glad we have all come to terms with Titus scum.

Please proceed to step 2: lynching. Blood for the blood god.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

No I am an independent mafiascum player who don't need no questions or answers.

Also I play by selectively ignoring things that are boring. You should try it CHEETORY basically erase any post from your memory that you did not like or aren't bothered enough to respond to.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

SAD if you're looking for me to get off you then ignoring me is the worst way to make that happen

I love it.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I am not a town hero or leader.

I am simply a mafia PRODIGY. My sole purpose is the satisfaction of solving the game as best as I can. If a post does not help me fulfill that agenda then is it really worth making???

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Especially since I agree with you on Titus and if you were town we could have a nice little thing going if you try to address my concerns?

Titus is scum whether she is lynched or not!

It would be helpful if she were lynched because the wincon is to lynch scum. But beyond identifying scum, step 2 (lynching scum) is not the work done by a mafia PRODIGY, it is done by town heroes and leaders, of which I am not.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I am Steven Quartz and also a Millipede.

This is scum too.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Tier list

Sakura, Yoshi, Creature
Gork, RemRam, RickAndrea, Vifam, Vecna, Marquis
MoI, Majiffy, kuro, beeboy
Spiffeh, Steven
Voices

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

youre not going to get lynched while youre gone.
come back when youre not busy and engage the game then.

Or, for fun...

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

@Yoshi I've seen nothing alignment indicative from Arthur so far, I get the feeling he's actively shitposting.

!!!!

HS I am actively FIGURING the game out!

I am just waiting for my mafia PRODIGY epiphanies to set in.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I am Steven Quartz and also a Millipede.

This is scum too.

OH NO!
YUME GETS A SCUMREAD!
NOW SHE'LL NEVER POST IN THREAD AGAIN!

What an easy scumread to fake dude.
-Rem (Ali)

I'm sorry that she is scum? Like don't blame me blame random.org I just call it how it is.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yeah Rem Ram posting on page 13 felt super icky. I actually kinda liked their posting before that, but the double-team thing on page 13 felt forced.

I'm glad you're bussing early Voices.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

It's okay you can join me on the dark side and become a one man wolf pack who don't need no town to cooperate.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Wait, you're an SK maker?

Yes.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Cool to hear other neighborhoods are being used.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

There is most likely one scum in each hood.

Holy

moly.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

That it is cool to hear other neighborhoods are being used...

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I'm not interested in using the neighborhood when there's still so many people alive if you think I'm implying that ours isn't being used and I'm not content with that.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

R&R is scum?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

News to me.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Oh okay glad you found the explanation for yourself.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yeah I was just wondering on how Spiffeh could read I have scumread on Rem Ram but not read the explanation right after and then ask me questions to look busy.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

All of your "pushes" are surface level bullshit

Sadly this is why I barely give explanations anymore most people are logical or tonal or meta reads.

I get epiphanies so it's hard to put into words and when I do people are never satisfied with the reason and always want ~more~.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

readers*

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I like to have fun when I have correctly identified all the scum I live for that satisfaction.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

There's too many people who have thrown side shade on Voices but refuse to commit to the wagon. Recipe for early scum catch with scum trying to divert attention elsewhere.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

At least fully commit to the buss come on.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Spiffeh's all over the place with his questions keep on keeping on buddy.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I think Titusdra is just low-hanging fruit at this point. No one has committed to a townread on the slot.

Yeah no scum buddy are willing to townread such an obvscum on thread but a bunch of people throw a soft throw and then vote else where like ???????? at least form a wagon somewhere even if it's not your strongest scumread it will form a much better result and yield better responses than 1 vote off wagons.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yeah tbf I'm a hardcore busser as scum this would be so me.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Whatever gets a scumflip ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Wait what.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yeah Rem Ram posting on page 13 felt super icky. I actually kinda liked their posting before that, but the double-team thing on page 13 felt forced.

I'm glad you're bussing early Voices.

???

Oh okay glad you found the explanation for yourself.

You said Im glad you're bussing early tho which implies

Yeah I was just wondering on how Spiffeh could read I have scumread on Rem Ram but not read the explanation right after and then ask me questions to look busy.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

How beautiful the conversation looks when continued.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

And Spiffeh continues to ask pointless questions that are serving him no purpose b/c he's not following up on them

Sakura what do you think of SAD?

Do you have any scum reads atm?

beeboy why are you scum reading Rem and Ram?

Majiffy I have ISO'd you and remain unconvinced

What do you think of SAD?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

But you single mine out because you need to discredit me before my true tunnel is UNLEASHED

3spooky5me

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yeah I am.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Anyway I just ISOed Spiffeh in DEFCON and he also did the weird shtick of calling random posts awful and asking random questions.

Few examples:

oh hey I finally rolled town in a large
but now I have 23 slots to sort...
I'll probably just sheep people who are actually good. (Which is like, everybody. Except me. )

THIS ONE'S MINE

Cheet what do you think of Ser Arthur Dayne?

He performed the harder and more EDGY of the tasks requested (giving reads vs setup analysis)

This is awful

MoI do you have any strong reads other than SAD?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

This really looks like you're just throwing this out there just to get Spif discreditted.
-Ali

Actually I don't want you to get away with this. I really don't know if you're purposely trolling or???

People ask me to explain my reads. I explain them. People tell me they're bad and that it is a scummy explanation.

I'm literally telling people I get reads extremely weirdly and that it'd be better if I don't explain them. But people still ask. So I provide my mafia PRODIGY explanations.

What exactly are you looking for?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

B/c this side shade throw is huge redflags for me Alisae.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Dayne there can only be one mysteriously awesome town leader in this game and that's me bucko so find a new shtick, Captain Jiffy's back in town.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yes, my reads list came before page 13, which was a terrible page for your hydra and dropped you down to tier list 4. It literally says that in the post you quoted.

And glad to know 2 people cannot have different reads on a 3rd player without one yelling at the other that they must be scum because of it.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

And my tier lists are not static they are dynamic think of them as the ever changing water omi manipulates in xiaolin showdown.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Maybe my neighborhood consists of the scum team and myself

That would be fun

Amazing scumteam sign me right up.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

MoI's 593 reads bad so many red flags for starters why is he outting the neighborhood and second of all why is he voting someone before a catchup on such a weak logic as having a differing opinion and generalizing scum in such a broad way ("I think every scum wouldn't wanna use the neighborhood, and anyone who opposes it must be scum!")

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

But let's be real is there ever a time when I didn't scumread MoI we are just not compatible people at least in the way we approach the game so this might be one of his crazy thinking style.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I regret even posting in my neighborhood I didn't realize neighborhood members are not known till after posting zzzz.

Would've been easier to pull gambits but alas I shall still find a day.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

a way*

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Cool to see you're OMGUS reading me Titus.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Or does it.

Strengthening a scumread from "let's see where this goes" to "I want to lynch" is also an OMGUS. So you put me at somewhere lean scum I guess (the first post you quoted doesn't even say I'm scum it says you don't know if I'm town or scum - which is literally the only 2 alignments I have no idea what the point of that post was, and second is such a wishy-wash non commital read). But then I went to super hardcore scum when I called out your obvscum posting.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Second, if you think I am bussing Rem, why don't you just vote RR? Why try to divide on two wagons rather than unite? Is it because you don't want me clear on a Rem scumflip?

LOL

Holy moly this might be the scummiest thing I have ever seen in a mafia game.

My scumreads pre-flip are independent of each other. I can maybe see why you would think I'm tying you two together since I mentioned bussing but that was more in the context of half joke as there's only 1 scum team. HOWEVER even if we let that slide, anyone who has read my posts should know that my scumread on you is much stronger.

This, combined with "why try to divide the wagons" is so so scummy.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Say, why don't you do another reads list?

I have the reads list in my mind at all times. But the beauty of it is that it comes when you least expect it.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Lmao I called MoI scumreading me in scumchsr before this game even began or got role PMs I love it so predictable.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

But anyway I'm not in the mood to get dragged with you in a back and forth in yet another game b/c it's such a waste of time always so keep on keeping on buddy.

Pedit @MoI

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Creature is town.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Damn the Rem Ram wagon feels so garbage.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Damn the Rem Ram wagon feels so garbage.

Kind of would like more of why you said this SAD.

B/c counter wagon to Titus scum and it grew much faster and larger than Titus wagon even though I got the vibe more people scumread Titus in the beginning.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I mean if he keeps making bad calls like MOI is being scummy and Creature is town. Meh.
I still have town read on him.

-Rick

Did you not get the memo me and MoI are archnemesis we have to scumread each other every game.

I told you this in scumchat!

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Oh that was the obvious scum of UT being counter wagoned by my town read of S_S.

I needed to push my (correct) agenda of UT scum (even of S_S flipped scum) so I make up whatever I got to.

I am now trying to push my agenda of Titus scum so I make up what I got to.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Are we going to spend the rest of the day looking for SAD's/RR's/R&A's scum partner?

Okay SAD.

You are town reading someone claIming they have three scum dead to rights AT THIS STAGE

Yeah but it's creature if he was scum he would have like 0 reads right now.

Reads creature is town Creature.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I don't believe that is remotely true.....
Proof?

-Rick (Fire)

Really Firebringer...

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Okay, tomorrow I'll fake a guilty on Rick and Andrea.

I don't believe that is remotely true.....
Proof?

-Rick (Fire)

Really Firebringer...

Pretend I am a idiot.
I'd go hunt for it myself but you have the burden of proof.

I am not going to claim I am a god at reading Creature.

-Rick

I really do not. If you want to believe he is scum by all means go ahead I'm not gonna defend him from you. I am telling you though he is heavily town from my experience of his meta, choose to do with this whatever you want feel free to ignore it.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Since when is bad play scum?

I'm not saying he's a good player or that his reads are good (lmao ffs he's scumreading me) but reads Creature is town Creature.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Or that your vote hasn't changed in more than ten pages

Firebringer imma let you in on a little secret

Spoiler: For firebringer's eyes alone

I'm not moving my vote off of Titus today

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Or that your vote hasn't changed in more than ten pages

Firebringer imma let you in on a little secret

Spoiler: For firebringer's eyes alone

I'm not moving my vote off of Titus today

Okay, I can understand that.
I am in no way helping, but I can understand.

Why aren't you trying to get more people to join though?

-Rick (fire)

I'm trying my best my man! I've always had trouble of transitioning from catching scum to lynching scum, but I do try my best.

Exs:

I'm glad we have all come to terms with Titus scum.

Please proceed to step 2: lynching. Blood for the blood god.

There is most likely one scum in each hood.

Holy

moly.

There's too many people who have thrown side shade on Voices but refuse to commit to the wagon. Recipe for early scum catch with scum trying to divert attention elsewhere.

At least fully commit to the buss come on.

I think Titusdra is just low-hanging fruit at this point. No one has committed to a townread on the slot.

Yeah no scum buddy are willing to townread such an obvscum on thread but a bunch of people throw a soft throw and then vote else where like ???????? at least form a wagon somewhere even if it's not your strongest scumread it will form a much better result and yield better responses than 1 vote off wagons.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Would be lovely if 8 other players proxy their vote to me but ~convincing~ people is hard work.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Voices, I'm trying my best to buss them.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

SAD and Rem have called each other scum most of the game, but never voted each other.

Lol what.

All the while he's been finding everything under the sun about ME that he can paint as scummy

and hasn't justified the Titus scum read at all

Lol what.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

P sure I have more posts and stronger push on Titus than you you aren't special buddy just b/c I have a scumread on you. And Voices is in another world if she thinks my Rem scumread is strong at all. I have said in at least 3 instances it was a very weak scumread, and that I also liked some of their other things they did, AND that I hate the wagon. Why the fuck would I get on a wagon that I think is garbage.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

This post is from the standpoint that he knows I am Town and is trying to leverage Defcon where we mutually scum-read each other as Town to discredit my read on him and thus scummy.

MoI if we are both town this game again you must agree to never scumread me again in any game b/c you clearly can't read me.

No, you are not going to respond sarcastically to this, or say I am scum for saying it. You will say you agree. And if you don't I will skip every post you make this game, I am not planning on getting into an argument with you every game we're in.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I have no idea what you did.

If it's a champion 1v1 thing like in Dance with Dragons then rip you.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Lol @MoI ignoring my post that's how you can tell he's bsing.

This post is from the standpoint that he knows I am Town and is trying to leverage Defcon where we mutually scum-read each other as Town to discredit my read on him and thus scummy.

MoI if we are both town this game again you must agree to never scumread me again in any game b/c you clearly can't read me.

No, you are not going to respond sarcastically to this, or say I am scum for saying it. You will say you agree. And if you don't I will skip every post you make this game, I am not planning on getting into an argument with you every game we're in.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

MoI is making very convincing arguments about SAD, and all SAD does is "You always scumread me"

He made a pretty convincing argument on why I was "scum" in DEFCON too (I will not spoiler this so everyone can witness how garbage MoI reads me):

So let’s have a look at how strongly SAD works Day 1 to protect SomethingSmart shall we?

oh hey I finally rolled town in a large
but now I have 23 slots to sort...
I'll probably just sheep people who are actually good. (Which is like, everybody. Except me. )

I'm dayvigging the shit out of you.

SAD’s response to SS’s scummy opening. But wait for it …

Why is MoI going after low hanging fruit.

Something Smart is probably town.

Oh look – the second someone voices suspicion of SS suddenly he’s “Low hanging fruit”. Funny that a great person to Nuke suddenly is Town simply because they were getting suspicion.

PAPAZITO IS TOWN

CHEETORY666 IS TOWN

Something Special and Reck leaning town.

And the Town read (with no reasons for such) continues …

You were making hella awkward posts though I needed to PRESSURE you like others did for Something Special.

Now you're both in the VI category of low hanging fruit that are prob town.

Now I will SET MY TRAP CARD:

To see who goes for the low hanging fruit.

MoI and Ceph have already fell into it.

Note the SAD is acknowledging that SS’s posts were worth pressure but everyone who pressured him is suspect. Nice little dichotomy.

Because low hanging fruit != town.

Well they usually lean town if they're making VI yet genuine sounding posts.

Which both Something Special and Nahdia are doing.

STREEETTTCCCHHHING to justify that Something Smart’s posts were a reason to Town read him.

re: the setup, I'll think about that when it's not 2 am.

^ This sounded genuine.

I think scum would have already discussed the setup in their private thread and most of them have already formed opinions about it.

So if scum were asked, even if they have have not formed a strong opinion themselves they would have leaned one way or another due to the amount of discussion regarding the setup in the private thread.

Now obv that's assuming scum discussed the setup, but I strongly believe in that and willing to go on that assumption.

Oh look – terrible reasoning to further justify his “genuine” read on SS’s posts.

Actually take this response on a whole:

VOTE: For

Something_Smart.
Can you give some thoughts on the setup or some reads?

good question

re: the setup, I'll think about that when it's not 2 am.

re: reads, initial feelings say:
towny: Cheetory, mastina, UT, MoI, Spiffeh
scummy: Nukebringer, GiF, Cephrir
conflicting feelings: RC, LLD, Nahdia
discussion tabled for now- Reck

What's easier for scum:

To give thoughts on the setup
Or to give reads.

I think theorizing about the setup or giving your opinion about it etc is much much easier for scum seeing as they have other people who they've already talked to or seen talking about the setup.

The fact that he skips the setup question and answers the reads question just reads super genuine and townie.

To quote DJ Khalid – and another one …

What do you think about what I said about Something Special?

Do you see it as genuine, someone who sincerely hasn't given much thought/bothered with the setup (because I can assure you scum would have much more thought about the setup - so your only two options really are that it reads genuine or that he faked not having any thoughts about the setup)?

Do you disagree that he went after something that is more dangerous when he could've went with the easier route?

And is this:

oh hey I finally rolled town in a large
but now I have 23 slots to sort...
I'll probably just sheep people who are actually good. (Which is like, everybody. Except me. )

^
RED EVERYWHERE IN THIS POST

You only reasoning for your scumread?

Pedit: @GIF

And here we see throwing shade at GiF to suggest that his suspicion of SS is bad – classic chain-sawing.

How are you guys gonna strawman this hard:

every post is a reaction test if you think about it the right way

>being flippant to dodge the point I made

what's your point? obviously it wasn't intended to produce reactions. that doesn't mean I can't look at the reactions it did produce.

He admits he didn't intend for it to be a reaction test, he just happened to be looking at the reactions that it stirred up. I don't see the problem with that?

And yet another defense of how Town SS was.

MoI your whole interaction with Something Special is really

really

really

fucking forced.

I lolled hard when I got to this part of his ISO.

So SAD - why don't you clearly give us a scum read list and any Town reads you might have?

Cheetory, Something Special, Reck
Accountant, Mastina, Zito, Greyice, Nahdia
Mcmenno, EP, Vax, UT, Fate, Cephrir, hiplop, Nukebringer, RC, lrcher
Spyrex, MoI, LLD, GIF, Spiffeh

Oh look one Red Commie Scum flip in this Town and a Blue True American flip in his Null reads. This will be useful for further dissection when SAD flips scum.

It has been 96 pages since Something Special's first post and UT wants to use it now to scumread him and want him lynched.

This is a shallow way of looking at it. UT is entirely right that the opening to a game is one of the most vulnerable times for scum.

I mean, if he caught it on page 3,

or 5, or 10, or anything that's not near page 100, sure.

But he's literally just using it now to scumread someone.

I typically don't like tipping my hand to the scumteam as it is, in this game where I get to just fucking shoot them I'm even less inclined.

A man after my own heart.

I've been slammed lately, but I'm off work Wednesday-Sunday so I'll go back tonight and see what I've missed or skimmed. Off the top of my head though, I'm unsure why SS is getting a pass going into D1 considering that he hasn't done anything that made his first post(s) in the game less awful and his vote on my wagon was opportunistic and scummy as shit. mastina is still terrible and nukeworthy. Grey is town as fk. not a huge fan of Cheet's post right before this. Accountant is town.

vote SS

I still want this to die. I'm nuking it tomorrow, if I don't live that long someone else needs to nuke it.

> "I still want SS to die.
> First time mentioning Something Special in his life.

Cut to much later where SAD is still chainsawing at anyone who suspects SS.

Zzzz Something Special's wagon looks like a disaster of a lynch waiting to happen.

LOL.

Well I guess SS is viable again ...

VOTE: Something Smart

Congrats you have jumped on all 3 leading wagons without good reasons.

Got to give him credit for balls calling my vote for someone he’s been calling me scum for suspecting as “without good reasons”.

Here is where I'm at currently before end of Day1

Reck, Mastina, lrcher, Something Special,
Cheetory, Nahdia, Accountant, Greyice, Cephrir, hiplop, Spiffeh
Zito, Mcmenno, Nukebringer, RC, Fate, EP
Vaxkiller, Spyrex, GIF
UT, MoI, LLD

Need to evaluate some of those reads esp like tier 2 and 4 cuz I have faint memories of some of the slots. And need to actually put in the ~effort~ to pay attention to and prob reread some of the null slots.

prodge because thanksgiving, etc

Claim asap tia.

DO NOT

DO NOT

COUNTER CLAIM

If you don’t see a pre-planned sequence here I can’t help you. It could not be more obvious that SAD knew the Cop claim was coming and wanted to make sure it didn’t get counter-claimed to save his buddy.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Here is another gem from DEFCON

I will nuke you the first second I will get a nuke.

Well I have not a worry about that then since you'll be roped and hung well before DEFCON 1.

I'm sure your partners will be prompt and send your Red Commie Stealth Bomber my way after your flip.

LOL

Gl buddy.

Ftr you have pushed me every game we've been together - Saw Mafia, Kingdom Hearts, and A Dance with Dragons. I no longer give a shit what you do because I'm convinced you get orgasms from purely arguing pointlessly.

We can add DEFCON and this game to the list, making a grand total of 5 out of 5 times MoI has misread me as scum.

It's p fair to say that I will avoid any and all games with him in the future. Not only is he a garbage reader, he argues with you until you're frustrated as fuck and, even worse, distracts you from actually scumhunting. Literally never saw such a consistently garbage tunneler before.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

@SAD, You've called Spiffeh terrible, MoI terrible, me terrible/scum. At some point, if you're driving all of town to scumread you consistently, either a) you're scum or b) you're doing something wrong. The entire town doesn't have a vendetta against you.

I mean, all 3 of you are my scumreads lol? Out of 17, I've called a grand total of 3.

But anyway I never even called MoI terrible, and if I did, that's mb. He's in the garbage tier at reading, which is far under terrible. Terrible isn't necessarily a bad thing, it could mean you're having a one off game or can't get in the zone or you're scum. The other tier is when I have large experience with you that you show no signs at improving and continue to be bad.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Also notice how Titus continues to misrep.

I have nothing wrong with Creature's scumread on me. Nothing wrong with Vifam's, or Sakura's, and even Alisae barely any problem.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Like I'm sorry I correctly scumread the people pushing me and now you're trying to paint me as some lunatic who is just lashing out vs anybody who scumreads me?

Do what you gotta do to win sister.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

It's the con of identifying scum so early scum team manipulates wagons and votes easier off their scum partner and have much more time to create distractions.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Maria you're sadly wrong this time.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Tier list

Yoshi, Creature, Vecna
Sakura, Gork, Vifam, Marquis, Majiffy
MoI, kuro, RickAndreas, RemRam
Spiffeh, Steven, beeboy
Voices

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Maria you're sadly wrong this time.

Do you think I'm town wrong or scum trying to jump on your wagon wrong?
~Andrea

I think the way you have not been interacting with me as much is sus and I don't like it. I also do not like Firebringer's back and forth on me, it's something he did a lot in DEFCON where he was super wishy-wash reads and here it feels like he's trying to put me in a convenient position where he can pull a townread or scumread card on me which ever best fits his interest.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Why is Vecna a top townread

His posting is super genuine.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Oh look i dropped a tier after voting SAD.
How interesting.

Nope you dropped a tier after refusing to give a concrete Titus read in 586

Who isn't down to vote Titus and why are you that way?

I'll reserve my judgement until Titus decides to finally read my supposedly want to sort early self.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

*856

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

You're the one who implied something wrong (on why I dropped you a tier) and I corrected you. I don't give a fuck how you play.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

No there's always one scum who defends me when I'm being wagoned I suspect that's you.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Actually fair point I don't remember you interacting with people much anyway when you get reads. You're still null though. Help me wagon Titus for townie points!!!

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

(The firebringer point is still valid btw I still hated how he danced around giving a concrete read on me)

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yet the wagon hasn't gotten bigger than like 2 people.

Lol.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Meanwhile you don't think the Rem/Ram wagon which got to like 6 votes in a couple of hours is town.

Okay.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Why...

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Two of them have like 0 posts and the other unvoted Majiffy iirc...

Pedit: Yes that's what it seems

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

No one is making scum do anything...

Literally I've never seen a scumteam play as a collective enough to manipulate their "not voting" so they don't get caught. Everyone just kinda does their own thing, if they agree to buss they pile on a wagon, if they agree to push something they do that, etc.

Plus voting early as scum is important to control the flow of the game.

PLUS 2 of those people are inactive and the other was voting already just unvoted so the whole point is moot.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I agree btw with whoever said Cheetory might be scum he's really not in this game at all he would've been more engaged by now.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I ISOed Vecna again and still heavy gut town.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I love it when people get mad after I express my opinion.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Come on Cheetory you gotta put more life into it.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I love that too.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

3spooky5me

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I don't know what you're expecting from me?

If you think I'm gonna react or care about any votes on me you're wrong and you already know I don't...

But people are barely posting so I'm just in a corner waiting for people to post more so I can get better reads

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Well I mean, you already voted me.

There's no point to talking to you one way or another if you've already determined I'm scum and voted me. I'll assess your alignment from your interaction with other players, because any interaction with me would probably devolve into you saying I'm scum anyway, since you already voted, and you've already made a statement like this:

or is this just dumb mindless posturing to push me off balance now that a bunch of people are giving me shit?

It's pointless. Pretend I answer a multitude of different ways, and run through the scenarios. You'll have a smart sarcastic response to anything I say and call it more "posturing", MoI will come here jerk himself off and say to vote me, and you'd sheep. Am I wrong?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Great.

Then in DEFCON I got super town gut read on you.

Here I didn't.

What do you do with this information?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

If your next question is why I got a super town gut read on you there

I suppose we could use the dayvigs like extra lynches?
In which case could not effectively do like.. five lynches a day or more?

Like, what's to stop town from just powerlynching through the playerlist with nukes?
Time limitations?

Can even force people on the chopping block to be the ones to drop the nukes so they can't hail mary as they die.
o.o

Am I missing something here?

Why not? We could hash out deadlines and be organized about it.
I'm probably barking up the wrong tree with this game and playerlist but I mean, theoretically this setup could be easy as fuck to basically give town so many more lynches than they normally get.

Oh fuck true. I forgot not everyone is going to take nukes [though there's really nothing stopping anyone from not taking nukes other than the fact that people aren't going to follow a set plan like that in practice].

Scum are more likely to dislike the random element of TOTAL WAR and oppose it

This is barf.
Are you actually standing behind that stance in practice? Because I would expect scum to be pretending to be cautious in doing something like this, not to actually try to oppose Total War for some mechanical purpose.

GOOD poster.

Spiffeh vs this guys posts are like night and day.

(I also correctly called Spiffeh scum in that game)

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Maybe SAD will reply to me one day :<

Maybe!

We can only hope and wait.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Okay but I died day 2 and till I died I had you as strong town how am I supposed to know how I felt about you after I died if I asked mod for spoilers right after I died..

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

What I compared you to is in DEFCON you came out the gate guns blazing and here you felt unmemorable and sliding under the radar with trollish posts. There you had more content and more substance by calling people out and giving reads.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Okay then that's on you. Not on me.

Again, what do you with the information/answers I provided to your questions?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

It's pointless. Pretend I answer a multitude of different ways, and run through the scenarios. You'll have a smart sarcastic response to anything I say and call it more "posturing", MoI will come here jerk himself off and say to vote me, and you'd sheep. Am I wrong?

im actually much more likely to try and parse things through with someone if they talk with me.

So who was closer to correct ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

See how that was a huge waste of time and lead to nothing while I could've used the time to read interactions b/w other people to get better reads or wait for other people to interact so I can get reads.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I will tell you a short story Cheetory.

I used to be a young paladin once who played mafia by the rule book, answering questions, asking my own questions, trying to figure out people, interacting with people, and acted very pro-town all around. But over time, I noticed I continued to be mislynched all the time for some reason! It got so bad that it made me dislike this game and the people. Why put so much effort when I am still getting mislynched by people who barely put any effort. And some people have the AUDACITY to tell me that the way I put so much effort indicated I was trying too hard or that I was trying to trick people by looking pro town? It made me dislike this game! So I took a long hiatus from this game. But then I spectated a game where a player, who was one of the few players I met when I first started to play, played spectacularly and was able to catch all the scum super quickly. It brought an inspiration within me! I realize what first drew me to mafia in the first place. Catching scum! So I decided to the game. But I decided that being a pleasant pro-town super helpful player was not the way to go. And at the end of the day, I actually don't care too much who wins, etc. This is a game after all! The point is to have fun with it. And what is fun for me is correctly identifying scum. Which is why I still play - to correctly identify scum. If I deem something as worthless it's not because I'm trying to be a jerk or big meanie. It's literally that it does not help me with my goal - finding scum. You will notice I ask very little of other people and mostly play as an observer who commentates on other interactions. That's because I know I refuse/dodge a lot of questions myself, it's not fair to then turn around and expect other people to answer questions from me. What fascinates and interests me is the little interactions that people have, and the fun and satisfaction I get is from correctly identifying who is trying to manipulate and trick others. You might be thinking at this point,

mastina

SAD, why don't you just observe? Simply put, I get no satisfaction from being right as a spectator, because

I

am not in any danger myself. It's easy for someone sitting on the high seat to see the full gladiator arena. They are sitting in their comfy chair away from the blood and gore! But to be inside the gladiator arena and still be able to tell which people are on your side wanting to help you out and which people belong to Cesar alone and have lost empathy and want to only tear you to shreds, now THAT'S a satisfying feeling. I am but a gladiator risking my life to tell apart the spies from the heroes. But I am not a hero myself. This is why I say I'm not a town leader or champion. It's true! I aim to be a mafia PRODIGY to identify scum correctly (which is why I hate being scum so much so boring), but I am not there to lead town to victory.

I mean me too thanks.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yeah.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

But it was enjoyable to write so it was worth for the fun alone whether anyone else reads it or not.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Wow SAD that was probably the most boring story I've ever heard you should talk to Michael Bay about it I think it needs more explosions

It was supposed to be a picture book imagine cool and interesting pictures on the left side of the page.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Hmm this day is feeling like it's going to be 100+ page slumber fest and I still don't know why people are ignoring Titus.

I say we lynch one of me or Titus asap.

I will take comfort in the fact that I 1v1ed a scum whether I win or not.

And I trust in you guys to be able to tell the opportunistic wagon jumpers if I get lynched dw I believe.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I reread Rem Ram btw and there's few things I don't like (I still don't like their posts on page 13) but overall I get the felling they're trying genuinely and I see town things from HS esp with the latest post.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I didn't want to wagon Arthur, because Arthur is a strong player, and I sincerely believe that a wagon on scumArthur will create good and towny responses from Arthur that will get him townread.

This is town-thinking.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Sakura's latest posts are really bad btw. Her early ones were super strong I've never seen someone go 180 that fast.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Majiffy isn't as town as I thought, Spiffeh MIGHT not be as scummy as I thought I need to reread him, Firebringer reads scummy for the things I already mentioned Maria reads alright but I kinda want to see more from her, Cheetory might still be town?

Anyone else in my strong piles remains there. kuro + Steven need to post. Beeboy's almost entire ISO reads fake esp 801 (there's few townie glimpses but I'd rather just keep an eye on that to see what he's doing for now).

Idk I don't think I have much more so that's it for now gn I'll catch you peoples tomorrow~~~

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I will tell you a short story Cheetory.

I used to be a young paladin once who played mafia by the rule book, answering questions, asking my own questions, trying to figure out people, interacting with people, and acted very pro-town all around. But over time, I noticed I continued to be mislynched all the time for some reason! It got so bad that it made me dislike this game and the people. Why put so much effort when I am still getting mislynched by people who barely put any effort. And some people have the AUDACITY to tell me that the way I put so much effort indicated I was trying too hard or that I was trying to trick people by looking pro town? It made me dislike this game! So I took a long hiatus from this game. But then I spectated a game where a player, who was one of the few players I met when I first started to play, played spectacularly and was able to catch all the scum super quickly. It brought an inspiration within me! I realize what first drew me to mafia in the first place. Catching scum! So I decided to the game. But I decided that being a pleasant pro-town super helpful player was not the way to go. And at the end of the day, I actually don't care too much who wins, etc. This is a game after all! The point is to have fun with it. And what is fun for me is correctly identifying scum. Which is why I still play - to correctly identify scum. If I deem something as worthless it's not because I'm trying to be a jerk or big meanie. It's literally that it does not help me with my goal - finding scum. You will notice I ask very little of other people and mostly play as an observer who commentates on other interactions. That's because I know I refuse/dodge a lot of questions myself, it's not fair to then turn around and expect other people to answer questions from me. What fascinates and interests me is the little interactions that people have, and the fun and satisfaction I get is from correctly identifying who is trying to manipulate and trick others. You might be thinking at this point,

mastina

SAD, why don't you just observe? Simply put, I get no satisfaction from being right as a spectator, because

I

am not in any danger myself. It's easy for someone sitting on the high seat to see the full gladiator arena. They are sitting in their comfy chair away from the blood and gore! But to be inside the gladiator arena and still be able to tell which people are on your side wanting to help you out and which people belong to Cesar alone and have lost empathy and want to only tear you to shreds, now THAT'S a satisfying feeling. I am but a gladiator risking my life to tell apart the spies from the heroes. But I am not a hero myself. This is why I say I'm not a town leader or champion. It's true! I aim to be a mafia PRODIGY to identify scum correctly (which is why I hate being scum so much so boring), but I am not there to lead town to victory.

I mean me too thanks.

Suspicionpoints for people that ignore this post after this point and do keep their vote without engaging some of this stuff.

It's because most people are just bad players compared to how the game used to be played. They think they want to engage with me until I actually give them something then they realize "holy moly he's obv town but my pride!!!"

Anyway, I'll look at my wagon tonight and do analysis as to who are the scum. Usually pref to wait till it's L-1 but I might not have that much time later in the week.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Alright time to analyze only wagon I know is on town day 1: mine. Thanks for the votes! Wagon at its peak:

Ser Arthur Dayne (7) L-2: Spiffeh, MagnaofIllusion, Sakura Hana, Rick and Andrea, Voices of Truth, Gorkington, Creature

Spiffeh's

vote and related posts:

Spoiler:

VOTE: Ser Arthur Dayne

Marquis you made the worst post in the game so far

This posts reeks fake holy.

Seems like he's trying to imitate his town game but it lacks any emotion.

Lol this is garbage

You can point to literally any post in the game and attach this reasoning to it. What "emotion" do you expect me to have?

Yeah that too, "I have Marquis townread now for ~secrets~".

I can buy Vifam believing that a sudden read shift would be grounds for suspicion but you're better than that

The expectation that early reads are going to be static is fucking ridiculous and you should know that

I have early town reads on Sakura Hana, Rem and Ram, Marquis, BigYoshiFan, and kinda on Rick and Andrea

These are subject to change

Because it's early

And that's ok

VOTE: SAD

Hey SAD

Marquis you made the worst post in the game so far

This posts reeks fake holy.

Seems like he's trying to imitate his town game but it lacks any emotion.

Lol this is garbage

You can point to literally any post in the game and attach this reasoning to it.

What "emotion" do you expect me to have?

I'm not scum reading SAD because of his tone or for his opinions being disagreeable?

He basically plucked a post of mine and gave the most surface level reasoning for scum reading it. I wouldn't have a problem if he found my posts "fake" or w/e but the fact that he tries to overjustify it with bullshit reasoning makes him scummy

SAD if you're looking for me to get off you then ignoring me is the worst way to make that happen

I will be interpreting this non-response as a scum claim until further notice

There's literally no reason for you to ignore my problems with you

Especially since I agree with you on Titus and if you were town we could have a nice little thing going if you try to address my concerns?

VOTE: SAD

Going back here

SAD's read on me continues to be bullshit

What am I supposed to have "followed up" on?

The reasons I asked those questions should be abundantly clear, but you ignore that and do anything to paint me in a scummy light

SAD town reads are no longer acceptable

I could probably point to several other questions people asked that weren't "followed up" on

But you single mine out because you need to discredit me before my true tunnel is UNLEASHED

You aren't town

Gorkington

SAD has claimed to not be moving off of Titus today

All the while he's been finding everything under the sun about ME that he can paint as scummy and hasn't justified the Titus scum read at all

Does this not bother you

Along with everything else I've pointed out about him?

First time he voted was I'm assuming RVS. But without any real emotion attached. Actually I think that's largely the problem I had with Spiffeh early game. He seemed to be trying to come off as a ~passionate~ player but it came off so robotically. This is pretty noticeable when he took an p random Marquis post and called it "worst post". 2 things wrong with that. First off all, the "game" was not that long at that stage. When people say "you've made the worst post so far in the game" usually they do it when there has been a lot of substance/meat in the game, not on like page 2. Second, with no reasoning attached and the Marquis post not being obviously bad at all, it just looks contrived that he would take a random player and call one of their posts bad. It feels like he's trying to get a 1v1 going, scum love to have back and forths with people because it keeps them busy. This is also extremely apparent when he continues to "get annoyed" when I do not respond to him. Why does he care so much about me responding to him if he has already deemed me as scum? I understand when someone wants to interact with his scumread to maybe realize they are wrong, but Spiffeh's approach borders desperality, almost like he's begging for a 1v1 to happen. It's similar to what I did in Masquerade ball with Shadow, I repeatedly continued to focus his attention on myself so I can hide in the spotlight, it's a pretty good scum tactic to employ and one I think Spiffeh attempted to use here. A lot of little things in his ISO give off HUGE redflags. Post 265, I have not mentioned or cared about his vote on me, and he starts it with "if you want me to get off you". Again, back to the forced 1v1. Post 512, "before my true tunnel is UNLEASHED". Cringey forced, and again, I don't care about him or his vote I pointed something out and he took it upon himself to try and direct my attention on himself. Post 755, "All the while he's been finding everything under the sun about ME that he can paint as scummy and hasn't justified the Titus scum read at all" Even if we assume he missed the page, again, a person can have multiple scumreads and early vote locations can be used more to pressure than to just put it on top scumread. Even IF I had justified my Spiffeh scumread more, that a) does not mean my scumread on him is stronger nor b) mean that my vote belongs on there.

MoI's

vote and related posts:

Spoiler:

Early Scum read on SAD for what I see as forcing casualness. Defcon SAD lashed out at people scum-reading him Day 1. Thus the “I get better reads when scum-read” rings very false. And the scum read on Yume at 275 smells like day old rotting fish. The R-Twins get some townpoints for 311 pointing this very thing out.

Oh and then we get 367. Cool. Makes my decision easy …

VOTE: SAD

Not a fan of Spiffeh’s early content. Am in agreement with his SAD read obviously. Will need to look back at Defcon versus Thing to see if what I am seeing is potentially alignment indicative.

MoI's 593 reads bad so many red flags for starters why is he outting the neighborhood and second of all why is he voting someone before a catchup on such a weak logic as having a differing opinion and generalizing scum in such a broad way ("I think every scum wouldn't wanna use the neighborhood, and anyone who opposes it must be scum!")

Yeah seeing this after my catchup post makes me happy. Vote is well placed.

MoI's 593 reads bad so many red flags for starters why is he outting the neighborhood and

second of all why is he voting someone before a catchup on such a weak logic as having a differing opinion

and generalizing scum in such a broad way ("I think every scum wouldn't wanna use the neighborhood, and anyone who opposes it must be scum!")

And now that I have more time to post about this … what we have here I see as a classic scummy pre-emptive post.

Let’s start with the inference that outing Neighborhoods is scummy. It’s not. It is rock solid Town play. Inorganic and Organic Chemistry and Anti’ UPick Science clearly show that Anti is not going to evenly spread the 4 scum between them evenly. So one of the Neighborhoods is going to be All Town. Secondarily keeping the make-up of the Neighborhoods “secret” is not going to keep information from scum regardless of the distribution. Scum are going to know all the Town players posting in Neighborhoods even if they choose to not post (like SAD). So giving Town a full slate of knowledge about the Neighborhood makeup and who isn’t posting there is evens the playing field.

Next let’s move to the point that scum are going to avoid the Neighborhoods – damn straight if anyone is they will. There is no Pro-Town motivation for not posting and sorting in the Neighborhoods. Period. So anyone not posting there is scum who want to minimize the amount of threads they can be scum-hunted in or VI Town.

Lastly note the bolded above – SAD as Town should have no clue the depth of the discussion in the PT between myself and Vecna to judge the level of the logic of why I am finding Vecna scummy. Vecna’s stance in the PT boiled down to two points ..

1. It will “keep scum in the dark”.
2. There might be some super sekrit mechanics that mass-claiming would help scum to activate.

Point 1 is clearly wrong for all the reasons I posted above. Point 2 doesn’t align at all with how Anti has shown to use mechanics in Inorganic Chemstry, Organic Chemsitry or UPIck Science. And I explained in some depth in the PT about how I looked (or played in) over those games and how they showed that a Neighborhood claim was Pro-Town.

Vecna’s reasons for opposing the mass-claim don’t stand up to scrutiny. Thus he’s scummy.

Lol @MoI ignoring my post that's how you can tell he's bsing.

This post is from the standpoint that he knows I am Town and is trying to leverage Defcon where we mutually scum-read each other as Town to discredit my read on him and thus scummy.

MoI if we are both town this game again you must agree to never scumread me again in any game b/c you clearly can't read me.

No, you are not going to respond sarcastically to this, or say I am scum for saying it. You will say you agree. And if you don't I will skip every post you make this game, I am not planning on getting into an argument with you every game we're in.

Nah. I mean you are pretty obv-scum at this point so no point in engaging when your first line is "If we are both Town". All that post was meant to was to posture as if you are Town. The fact that you are now trying to discredit my read says all that needs to be said ... scum scrambling to find any way to shut down the pressure on you.

@Everyone

- Note how this post shows that his earlier "I get the best reads when scumread" was forced casual posting. If he really felt that as Town he'd not worry about me pursuing a scum read on him. But he's clearly worried since he's doing everything he can to discredit me while not addressing the reasons. More SAD votes would be very appropriate and much appreciated!

Looking back, especially towards the initial votes, 2 reasons were give for his scumread on me. First that I was acting differently than in DEFCON. Second was that my "scumread on Yume 275 smells like day old rotting fish". The first point he states is because I don't care about the votes on me here while I "lashed out" more at people in DEFCON. While it is definitely true I was more aggressive in DEFCON, I actually wasn't aggressive towards the voters on me. While and up till the point I got lynched, I really didn't care much (and I never do care much about getting lynched as town - if anything me caring more is a scumtell for me not the other way around). The second, I have no idea why. I have no prior experience with Yume and disliked that post. And literally no one else called it scummy. So pretending like I was going for a low hanging fruit when I don't know the player and no one else suspected Yume at that point is plain false. However, while he's off, I don't think these specific reasons are ill intentioned in and of themselves. Honestly, I feel like if anything, he looks like he believes in what he is saying. Post 828 is the post I really liked from him though. It didn't read as a scum response. First he ignored it and then when I asked him again he did reply sarcastically. It felt more typical style "I am always right and a master at mafia" MoI than him just looking for an easy scumread. Idk overall even if he has incorrect logic, it just reads like he believes in what he is saying.

Sakura's

vote and related posts:

Spoiler:

Sakura don't make me regret town reading you so early

But townreadnig me early is the best way to make me produce alignment relevant content!

Sakura what do you think of SAD?

I think that i dont know why he townreads or scumreads X or Y.

Maybe you shouldn't bother arguing with scum.
P-Edit: @SAD

VOTE: SAD

Dunno RR seems to have lost votes, and SAD seems to have gained them, what are you doing Titus?

Who isn't down to vote Titus and why are you that way?

I'll reserve my judgement until Titus decides to finally read my supposedly want to sort early self.

Oh yeah? Well too bad im not playing the way you want me to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

You're the one who implied something wrong (on why I dropped you a tier) and I corrected you. I don't give a fuck how you play.

ok

I should probably just go back to relaxing and not putting effort before i end up flipping out on someone.
P-Edit: I dunno, I liked MoI's points about SAD and I voted him, his consecuent deterioring of his read on me felt all sorts of OMGUS, so my vote is now stuck like glue.

Honestly real talk taking this is straight up scum ISO according to every "how to scum 101". Wishy wash justification of reads and straight up dodging questions at time (posts 394, 856). Sheeping another player onto a wagon. Misrep and fake *shrug*. Extremely conscious of her position in my tier list (I've actually never seen someone before who dropped from strong town tier to weak town attack like I dropped them to strong scum pile). In 539 responds to me like I'm town ("Maybe you shouldn't bother arguing with scum, SAD"). But then flips 180 short time later. And while she does 180, she has a problem with me dropping her ONE tier, and misreps that my read change on her is an OMGUS and because she vote me. Literally reads opportunistic scum. The only thing that holds me back a bit is that this is Sakura we're talking about, and last (and only) time I played with her (which was a while ago maybe 2013) she was scummy as hell too and generally did a lot of confusing things. I need to compare that to this game, and also look at a bit of her scum meta. Until then I'm giving her a slight benefit of the doubt for being Sakura.

Rick/Andrea's

vote and related posts:

Spoiler:

My sleeping schedule is really really horrible right now.

Reads:
Town: Marquis, Yoshi, Sakura
Weak Town: SAD, Spiffeh, Vifam
Null: Everyone else.

Have no scum reads yet. Unfortunate.

~Rick (Fire), Leader

Okay SAD.
Should I at all be worried your not trying to convince me of Titus scum then?
Or that your vote hasn't changed in more than ten pages
Or that your vote has only moved once.

I went back to look at DEFCOn and you are definitely missing some bite.
What's up?

-Rick

There's several things missing from SAD DEFCON than SAD here, but that doesn't make him scum.
I am more concerned that he seems bent on more posturing than pushing, but posturing is a go to for him regardless of alignment I think.

-Rick

Remember when I had a sr on SAD within 5 posts of the last game we played and I was right? Yeah....idk who were voting but if Rick's got a problem with it he can poke me

VOTE: SAD
~Andrea

Gork, weren't you saying you don't want much filler in the game right now? Don't see why you posted that.

Anyways, right now I am not 100% against SAD lynch, but I am worried about Beeboy and Creature atm, because I feel Beeboy reads and thoughts are just empty space. Creature with his reads just being super bad.

I had an argument with Maria earlier about why she scumread SAD, and I decided to let her keep pushing that.

I prefer to lead hydra, obviously but she knows SAD much better than me.


~Rick (Firebringer), Maria Subordinate for today.

Ugh hydra's are actually super annoying to read and why I generally try to avoid playing with them. I have experience with both of these so it wasn't as bad as it could've been, but still annoying. Anyway from what I understood Firebringer is ~undecided~ about me and Maria scumreads me. I think Firebringer's side, as I have already mentioned, reads wishy wash and possibly coming from scum. Towards the end, however, I liked 1041 particularly from him. I think that it shows he genuinely is confused about me, rather than if he had said something like "I will sheep Maria's scumread on SAD", he says that he will let Maria push me. But cleaning his hands from my push reads much more townie and genuine, it shows he is still confused and not sure of how to read me, and will delegate the read to Maria for now. Maria side reads p townie in retrospect. Ik I first thought she wasn't interacting with me enough, but then this actually felt like typical Maria. I think 860 is good attack that she believes in. She's not going the easy route, she already knows I have a good game when I can. So for her to scumread me and mention Masquerade ball reads less opportunistic. If she's scum she knows I'm town and I wouldn't put up with that BS from her, she just wouldn't take that risk. Her putting her "ability to read me well"/pride on the line is much more likely to come from town-Maria, at least I'd like to think so.

Voices of Truth

These have way too many posts that I don't feel like quoting. Feel free to pull their ISO in another tab. Anyway I tried putting aside my conf bias. Their posts w/r/t me feel as them trying to push a mislynch. I don't exactly know how to describe the feel. A lot of things like 1088 "If I am wrong, eliminating noise factor plus VCA advantages." This is EXTREMELY scummy. I can't put into words how scummy that sentence. There is def merit in lynching even if a person has big chance of flipping town because of analysis. But 2 things wrong with the way Titus said it. First, she said it offhandedly after saying "eliminating noise factor" in an attempt to belittle me. Second, and most importantly, you don't say that when you have a strong scumread on someone. You say it when you're unsure about someone. The way she said it looks like she's trying to backtrack after my town flip. "Whoops, well at least I eliminated noise factor I can now focus". Like what the fuck, no fuck off. I'm not letting anyone who is scumreading me this hard get away with bs like that after I flip. If you're town you better look at my town flip and feel ashamed. And if you're scum then I'm not letting you get away with my death for free. As I already said, it is much more likely the latter (Titus-scum). She is a competent player, I don't expect her to be unable to deal with me to such a level that she just wants me lynched because of that instead of actually scumhunting. Anyway, 847 p much misrep and it reads like she's talking to someone she knows is town. A lot of things actually not related to me also read scummy. Her interaction with Rem/Ram, esp 1023 "@REM, I am fully capable of reconsidering. Begging me is not effective. Tell me who else is scum. That is effective. Pleading with me is manipulative AtE. Scumhunting is town" is terribad. Dumb champion 1v1 thing with R/R that would've actually been a town gambit if Titus had followed up on it AT ALL. The fact she posts it, asks 2 people who they think will win, then never follow up on it, is more pointless and fake ~scumhunting~ Titus wants to look like she is doing.

Gork's

vote and related posts:

Spoiler:

im not valuable wtf.

also, sad.
being dodgy is bad.
stop being dodgy.
respond to spiff.

If a post does not help me fulfill that agenda then is it really worth making???

if youre distracting people, then yes, it is anti-town to be evasive.

town works as a collective.
it isnt a solo show.

and the people who act like it is and toot their horn when they were right about reads are still bad because they couldnt work with town to get shit done.


also, spiff, seems more like firebringer was annoyed at you that game than scumreading you. and when he did start saying you might be scum, it at least came across as reasonable from a framework of OMGUSness. where this push on me just feels a lot more like him trying to fake paranoia of me.
i humbly disagree with your comparison between this game and that game.
if there are examples that illustrate the point better i'll lurk them.

I agree btw with whoever said Cheetory might be scum he's really not in this game at all he would've been more engaged by now.

right.

like, seriously, lets talk about how disengaged i was in like 75% of defcon.
did you read after you died?
or is this just dumb mindless posturing to push me off balance now that a bunch of people are giving me shit?

should i even bother asking or are you just going to ignore questions as per your apparent MO this game.

yeah thats why im mad because youre expressing your opinion.
:')

how dare you.
come into this fucking game.
and express.
your god damn opinion.
you mother fucker im gonna make you regret.
having the audacity.
to think that you HAVE THE RIGHt.
TO EXPRESS YOURSELF HERE
ASDOIFHSDFKJDFKJHKDJFDKFJKDJF

nah lets put less life into you instead.

vote: sad

im the sketchy uninvested scumguy coming to mislynch u bro here i come.

if your goal is to make everyone super fucking apathetic youre doing a great job.
keep up the good work.

"cheet would be more invested"
"i was pretty uninvested in most of defcon, thoughts?"
"wow u mad bro?"

yeah its the lack of reaction to the vote im upset about and not your stupid avoidance of anything actually fucking related to the game.

im actually much more likely to try and parse things through with someone if they talk with me.
rhetoric and ignoring me are probably my two biggest pet peeves in all of mafia.
push rhetoric or ignore my questions and expect me to be really fucking annoyed at you.

did you want me to setup spec here too?
because i cant because it doesnt apply in the same way.
if i had setup info to parse, i would probably walk through it in a similar way i did there here and be obviously town for it.

people started doubting i was town after that point because i got apathetic.
almost as if when i get muddled, i dont post as obviously towny for a bit.

i troll more when i play on this account.
i play this account more because i tend to hate playing and being stupid makes this game barely bearable.

okay have fun reading interactions and waiting for people.
im gonna go drink until my brain stops processing this garbage.

i seriously dont understand why some people become so fucking unbearably unpleasant when they play mafia.

did you know that all of the effort you put into that post is going to be worth approximately nothing?

i thought you were busy reading people's interactions.
:')

This is hardcore town. Before yesterday night's posting I was actually becoming extremely wary of Cheetory really read disengaged and from what we talked about in scumchat + seeing him in DEFCON I thought he had a stronger early towngame. However, from yesterday's interaction with him I really think there's not way he's scum unless he's a master at faking emotions. You can see multiple times through out the ISO his emotions change from "trollish" to angry/annoyed. I think this is him trying to keep his cool/keep the fact he is a more of a troller on this account, but can't let go of the fact I was annoying him because I was not directly answering his questions. Those sparks of emotion remind me of the old DEFCON Cheetory esp w/r/t his argument with LLD in that game.

Creature's

vote and related posts:

Spoiler:

Good thing we got scum D1

VOTE: SAD

Sorry SAD, try to be less obvious next time.

SAD wagon is promising.

VOTE: SAD

Should be L-2 unless I missed a vote after the last VC.

Hmm this slot is gonna take a dip in the tier list not sure where I'm gonna place him yet. I still think there are a bunch of townie flashes for Creature, they are just jumbled together in a mass of badish posts. I think the reason might be that his heart is in the right place, but his mind is not. I do not like the static reads however. He hasn't really changed his reason me me since like his first post (which he claims is not an RVS vote). A lot of the wagon hopping I don't like, it looks like right now he's just trying to stick to anything that will lead to a lynch. That COULD be scum trying to just get a mislynch, but it could also just be lazy/VI townie. Honestly for Creature however still reads like his town game from my limited exposure I have with him. I will need to look into his meta more to look for subtle specifics. But I'm leaning towards "VI townie" more than "manipulative/ill intentioned scum" because the posts read BAD but not SCUMMY.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

The tl;dr is replace out if you're not planning on reading everything everyone posts in a game.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I mean or yeah feel free to keep it subtle and to yourself.

But don't ask for a tl;dr.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Sakura, NY 169

viewtopic.php?f=55&t=34691

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Nah that's something I do and try not to where I let other people's reads influence my own to a degree (in this particular game people townreading you) but it almost always turns out badly.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

P much exactly like DEFCON where I had you nailed but people kept townreading you and I let that influence my read on you and I didn't push it as hard as I should have.

In an ideal world I do pure independent reads b/c that works best for me.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Anyway if people are skipping most of the post they should really really at least read the Titus part.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Dw my man you are on my "to meta list" along side the likes of Sakura and Creature.

This has a lower priority than ISOing the other slots in the game though so I'll get to it when I can maybe upcoming days.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Please read how confident Titus is here about me scum and then read her "Even if he's town it'll take down the noise factor and maybe even help VCA". Bs justification she put to backtrack out of my town flip.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

These have way too many posts that I don't feel like quoting. Feel free to pull their ISO in another tab. Anyway I tried putting aside my conf bias. Their posts w/r/t me feel as them trying to push a mislynch. I don't exactly know how to describe the feel. A lot of things like 1088 "If I am wrong, eliminating noise factor plus VCA advantages." This is EXTREMELY scummy. I can't put into words how scummy that sentence. There is def merit in lynching even if a person has big chance of flipping town because of analysis. But 2 things wrong with the way Titus said it. First, she said it offhandedly after saying "eliminating noise factor" in an attempt to belittle me. Second, and most importantly, you don't say that when you have a strong scumread on someone. You say it when you're unsure about someone. The way she said it looks like she's trying to backtrack after my town flip. "Whoops, well at least I eliminated noise factor I can now focus". Like what the fuck, no fuck off. I'm not letting anyone who is scumreading me this hard get away with bs like that after I flip. If you're town you better look at my town flip and feel ashamed. And if you're scum then I'm not letting you get away with my death for free. As I already said, it is much more likely the latter (Titus-scum). She is a competent player, I don't expect her to be unable to deal with me to such a level that she just wants me lynched because of that instead of actually scumhunting. Anyway, 847 p much misrep and it reads like she's talking to someone she knows is town. A lot of things actually not related to me also read scummy. Her interaction with Rem/Ram, esp 1023 "@REM, I am fully capable of reconsidering. Begging me is not effective. Tell me who else is scum. That is effective. Pleading with me is manipulative AtE. Scumhunting is town" is terribad. Dumb champion 1v1 thing with R/R that would've actually been a town gambit if Titus had followed up on it AT ALL. The fact she posts it, asks 2 people who they think will win, then never follow up on it, is more pointless and fake ~scumhunting~ Titus wants to look like she is doing.

I will quote this on every page if I have to until people read it and give me their thoughts.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I have played with you before the fuck you talking about.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Why would I dismantle a wagon on obvious scum/scum helpful SAD to wagon Creature when scum are piling on my wagon to save SAD?

If I am wrong, eliminating noise factor plus VCA advantages.

Lmao.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

You have never played with me before.

Yeah, I don't recall you.

Lmao.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

In the same fucking game I linked to Sakura earlier maybe if you're reading and clicking shot you'll see your huge name in the player list.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Anyway I'll respond to the other Titus bs when I get home and not on mobile.

Pedit: Are you trolling click on the game my name is right there I was myself.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

He's very confident I am a threat to him.

LMAOOOOOOOOOO

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

if sad is scum, i do not think he sees you as a threat here.

And then why the exclusive tunnel? Why do his buddies pile on? The behavior doesn't make sense but for scum saving SAD regardless of SAD's alignment.

"His buddies pile on"
"Regardless of SAD's alignment"

Twice she has done this "SAD is 100% scum" then backpedal out of it okay.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

If SAD spamming stops you from getting said scumreads, isn't that reason alone to vote him?

Because so many other people are posting Including your hydra partner.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I've actually never seen someone use activity as a reason to lynch me usually it's my lack of acitivity that's a huge scumtell for me so this is a new fascinating feel.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yeah thinking just VI at this point but Imma add her to my meta list.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Worst case scenario, sad's flip still helps town.

So by this logic you want everyone to lurk day 1 and barely post so they avoid getting mislynched for "town info"?

Fuck right off.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Is that what your hydra partner is doing???

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Did ThinkBig post anything relevant?

No he's hiding behind Titus for what I assume would be him thinking she's a stronger player.

Little did he know she's driving the slot into the ground I feel sorry for him. If I was him I would rein the slot.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

It's possible SAD and VoT are scum together and Titus is trying to tie me with SAD.

I mean she's trying to tie you to Sakura now implying her voting Titus is to detail your wagon.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Let's just lynch Creature.

Sakura voted me after I indicated I would vote Creature.

This is directly implying Sakura-Creature scum how are you gonna lie.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Hmm?

No p sure if you read my analysis post you'll see I distinguished the scummy voters on me from the townish ones.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

It isn't. Even for his townreads SAD basically calls them pieces of shit, particularly MoI.

If it's true it's true LOL.

If you're terrible you're terrible. You can be town terrible that doesn't mean you suddenly become good.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

So then describe Creature town meta, Firebringer.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

"Oh no, X could suddenly be playing ultra towny as scum"

Yeah honestly this is bad argument to make for why Creature is scum.

As I said before this activity and involvment from Creature for a his town meta from what I've seen. Saying he suddenly changed his scum style to got his town in extremely short amount of time (esp as one of the few arguments being made against him) is :S

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

VOTE: Vecna

Vifam who are you scumreading and what do you think of Titus now.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

People are gonna try to make me doubt my Vecna strong town read but I'm honestly gonna stick to it b/c I trust myself more.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

I guess i was just mad, but FB scum trolls more.

^

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Majiffy might be scum hmm.

I need to reread a few more people to get concrete tier list though.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Yeah he basically just called the while player list carting shades of town.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

whole*

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

varying* ffs autocorrect

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Okay so few other ISOs.

Rem/Ram - have some stuff I like and few stuff I dislike. Largely part of the reason for my dislike is that I feel like I am being pocketed. Idk I don't feel like HS would get such an easy "townread" on me (I feel like I would def like this more if HS actually explained why she has a townread on me). Other than that, I don't like Alisae's change of stance on me. Early game I got the feeling that Alisae had a strong scumread on me (even mentioned post 805 "Also for some reason HS changed my vote off of SAD and I dunno why and HS townreads SAD for a sad reason that's sad because I dunno why because he hasn't told me why but I think it's really bad tbh."). I liked the interaction with Titus, I liked 1079, and as I said already I liked 1007.

Vifam - Not much here from a content POV, but I do get a good gut vibe from him. Idk he kinda feels like in Mafiastuck where he did a bunch of stream of consciousness, and the "I am getting bored now" post from him feels genuine. He's a p strong player from memory though so I don't know exactly ~how~ strong his scum game is. For now though p good gut vibe.

Kuro - Idk the posts feel so empty. And I strongly dislike his preemptive vote on me that he was going to put when he finished catching up. Also sheeping MoI is extremely scummy because he tends to make logical posts so saying you're particularly sheeping him is extreme buddying towards MoI, and MoI

loves

being buddied. (IIRC Sakura also did this).

Vecna - I've already explained a lot about this slot. Stream of consciousness looks super genuine, him being self aware of how much he is buddying reads townie. The only thing I somewhat dislike is his kuro vote before kuro posted anything of substance, but even his justification for it ("what's your problem, it's just a placeholder vote?") reads townie.

Majiffy - Yeah I can def see majiffy scum here. The aggressiveness feels off a bit. The creature push especially feels disingenuous.

Yoshi - I liked his early posts as I already mentioned somewhere. Nothing has changed since then he just went on V/LA

Steven - lol. Fwiw, the one post made did give me bad/scum vibe a bit. But I was really hoping I'd get more from this slot.

Marquis - I generally like his posts when he posts. His lack of posting kinda feels like he's lurking and just letting things unfold, which could be scum motivated, but for now I'll agree with Vifam that his post about not feeling this game felt town.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Tier list

Gork, Vecna, RickAndreas
Yoshi, Vifam, Marquis, MoI
Creature, RemRam, Steven
Spiffeh, kuro, Majiffy, beeboy
Voices, Sakura

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Sure. What changed in your mind from

Also for some reason HS changed my vote off of SAD and I dunno why and HS townreads SAD for a sad reason that's sad because I dunno why because he hasn't told me why but I think it's really bad tbh.

to

{Spiff, MoI, SAD, Majiffy, Gork, Vifam} <--- Don't want to Lynch today tier

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Antihero this is some shady flavor.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

You have to start from the basics of biochemistry can't just jump into random things.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

If I am town, scum will go to a night without feeling pressured at all. If we push more wagons, scum will have to bleed to survive the day.

If you are town?

Town would be saying "if I am lynched". Not "if I am town".

The fuck is this shit

Hmmmmm.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Creature do you have reads right now.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Don't quote me your strikeout list.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Hey all, I have been incredibly busy this week with midterms (chemistry midterm is today and that should be he last one). I will be posting tonight after work. Sorry for the inactivity.

-TB

Interesting...

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Okay I might actually be wrong about a slot but we'll see.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

For now

I WILL SET MY TRAP CARD.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

A NEW HERO

RISES

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

What are the most important other things that have happened so far?

I claimed day cop with guilty on your slot but people wanted to wait for Steven replacement.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

What gambit.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Oh the day cop.

No I got a 1-shot day cop from an inventor, and I claimed that in the neighborhood PT with guilty result, but people said to wait for Steven replacement before announcing it.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Is it scummy though?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Anyone would be infuriated with the way MoI pushes them by misrepping everything and thinking he knows their exact thought process (like not just as scum his pushes as town are equally as wtf)

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

Have you ever been pushed by MoI?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

It's soul crushing.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

It does though.

The amount of times I've seen MoI wrongfully hardcore tunnel on town means I have 0 trust in his pushes anymore. The amount of times he is correct is not higher probability than if he were picking a random person from the playerlist.

But a lot of people have wrong reads all the time. The real problem with MoI is that once he has you as a scumread you cannot do anything to not get scumread. He plays with a caste system, and will make huge walls with a bunch of your posts and call them scummy in a sarcastic way. You can't ignore him either because people for some unknown reason listen to him and then pile votes with him (usually scum because it's so easy to sheep a big wall of logic that looks right).

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

You're saying MoI has valid points about Vecna and that they are logically correct.

That is MoI every time whether he is wrong or right. He will find weird connections, misrep quotes, selectively quote certain things, ignore context, and then put that all together into a wall directed at a person.

Other people then read that and go "hmm that seems about right" without looking at things for themselves.

Pedit: @Gork

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

like you yourself saying that its no more different than random chance, so why is it NEGATIVELY affecting it?
thats entirely different.

It is extremely anti-town because once he starts tunneling on a person that person gets extremely distracted and can no longer focus on actually scumhunting themselves. Moreover it creates SUCH an easy way for scum to sheep onto a wagon.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

if you dont want to support a wagon because you dont want to support moi because you dislike him, fine.
but dont try to pretend like thats a rational argument.

p-edit: i said i agreed with him that vecna's approach is lazy.
that isnt me giving an entire approval of his case.

??

Okay what's your independent read on Vecna?

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

lol.
isnt it hypocritical for you to complain about creating anti-town noise with a tunnel when you were literally doing that with vot earlier?

Yeah but VoT is scum...

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

i said that vecna is scummy because of the way hes responding to moi.
it feels way more like hes angry scum than angry town with a scumread.

I just explained to you why any interaction from any person towards MoI is just as likely to come from town as it is to come from scum no body wants to deal with his bs.

[Ser Arthur Dayne]

yeah okay.
lets dismiss all of my points because generic reasons that dont mean anything yeayayayayyayayayayayayayay

Yeah I'm serious.

I would probably have less of a problem with MoI pushing random person he pulled from random.orging the playerlist if it wasn't one of my strongest townreads in the game, but I'm not interested in letting things get too far with people sheeping MoI and purely focusing Vecna.