A Mid-Scummer Night's Dream - D.S. al Fine

[Sakura Hana]

That is a very colorful deadline

[Sakura Hana]

Why have you opted not to vote, and instead post what is essentially an empty "I'm here" post?

To see how many people ask why

[Sakura Hana]

^ BS

lol true.
I just wanted to say that once ever since i saw it in a game

But in reality, i have no specific reason to do so, saw no one was doing nothing and i just wanted to make a "hi" post and then go play some shadowverse while some ppl got here.

[Sakura Hana]

Ok, but then why not make a random vote and then go play some ForestCraft?

Or, like, vote on any of the tiny wagons people had already started to apply pressure with an empty vote?

I wonder why indeed.
I'm pretty sure you can guess?

Although even if you cant, i guess someone will tell you?

What i do wonder is why my lack of vote is making you wonder about it. When there's been at least 2 others who didnt vote either, what in my post made you decide to start engaging with me about it?

I mean even a "I randomly decided you out of all of you" is fine, im just curious

[Sakura Hana]

Oh i thought that meant about the "im here" post not the lack of vote.

[Sakura Hana]

Well i didnt really have anything specific in mind.

[Sakura Hana]

I did read her post, i was hoping for something that would tell me more about her personaility but i seem to have hit a wall.

[Sakura Hana]

Cya! have fun

[Sakura Hana]

Well if no one has any more questions im just gonna go again and wait for more people to get here.

[Sakura Hana]

LLD is dead on, she was waiting for something to jump on to.

?

[Sakura Hana]

Well Mr. Hiplop seems to have dissapeared.
Too bad, seems like he was still sleepy, he dreamed of things happening that never happened.

[Sakura Hana]

You're not the only one with "lots of experience" with me

[Sakura Hana]

Ok.

But you're still claimng im doing this im not doing so

[Sakura Hana]

hiplop's not wrong, pressure's the way to read me.

What i dont understand is this:

she was waiting for something to jump on to.

Because nothing of the sort was happening

[Sakura Hana]

I wonder where Imperium is, i've been looking forward to play with Nacho again for ages

[Sakura Hana]

Nacho <3

[Sakura Hana]

i dont understand those votes.
Maybe if you appended some reasoning at the end i would be able to follow your mindsets!

[Sakura Hana]

@Regfan: it's ok, i'd be surprised if i was anything other than null to anyone at this point.

[Sakura Hana]

Also didn't like the Sakura read of "I'm surprised she's not getting more pressure" since it feels like an attempt to deflect elsewhere.

?
This is weird, i know you're scumreading him, but why would anyone have an issue with me getting pressured?

If you're town here this isn't something you should feel happy with at all, would really like to see some actual reads and thoughts from you. What do you personally think of LLD's push on you initially, do you think it makes her more likely to be mafia/town/not worth reading into and why? What do you make of my reads and reasoning that I've put forward so far and what's your read on both Baku and Sunlit at the moment? Like I need you to start playing.

I didnt think much of it, it was random pressure on a random null post.
Baku and Sunlit i dont have any reads on.

[Sakura Hana]

Sorry regfan i keep coming up with a blank.

[Sakura Hana]

Gun to the head tho, i'd think you're town.
But i can't tell if that's because i wanna see the legendary ex paragon solve the game, or my gut.

[Sakura Hana]

I really have a hard time remembering who's hydra's who, aside from Imperium since i've known that one since forever.
But now that i remember baku and munna being random and shiro, i have mixed feelings about that slot.

[Sakura Hana]

Did you have any feelings about the slot before knowing who was in the hydra and can you put the 'mixed feelings' into some words for me.

Sure.
I'm having a hard time knowing who's posting what aside from some posts that apparently were done by random, but if most of them it's Shiro it's coming up very underwhelming and if it's random, im p.sure random is much more quiet as scum, but then again shiro should be relaying reads to him if they are town, so i have a hard time making up my mind.

[Sakura Hana]

Somehow forgot to answer this part:

Did you have any feelings about the slot before knowing who was in the hydra

I didnt strike me as anything particularly bad or good, as i said i've been coming up with a blank with most of this game.

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: Desperado
That reads list is fabricated.
I find it hard to believe that he has opposite reads on me and drealmerz, since we've both done literally nothing, and even if i can believe he can SR me for that, i find it hard to believe how drealmerz is anywhere close to a TR.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh boy, im getting FOS'd whatever shall i do!

[Sakura Hana]

I guess that explains Desp's reads list.

[Sakura Hana]

The vote and the first line of the post don't match up with the rest of it.

yeah tho i was mostly interested on the part where he was TRing Dreamlerz despite Drealmerz having done nothing at that point.
(Haven't read the latest stream of posts)

[Sakura Hana]

If anything from this 1v1 so far i am TRing LLD.

I'm not seeing the "overreaction" that drealmerz is talking about (or i didnt interpret it as an overreaction it sounded more like a "come at me, im ready to disasemble anything you have" kinda thing)

[Sakura Hana]

Ah! so that's where i remembered him from.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh, man, I was scum in that game?
My memory is absolute garbage, then.
This is why I don't rely on meta.

lol
And apparently i scumread you and drealz that game.
That was a nice trip to nostalgia land.

[Sakura Hana]

Seems more like a playstyle clash to me imo.

[Sakura Hana]

holy shit that's a big post that just ninja'd me.
The previous post was referring to LLD vs drealz

[Sakura Hana]

sakura, who are you?

I was Luna Fox on that game.

[Sakura Hana]

but it doesn't help me read LLD much.

I can see where LLD is coming from and i think the clash was caused by the fact that LLD has (as far as i remember) a very aggresive playstyle towards her scumreads and that drealz is a gut player that has a hard time wording his reads.

[Sakura Hana]

I still have a hard time believing Desp got a TR on drealz from the post he said he supposedly did.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh another thing:

that LLD didn't let go of her SR on me solidifies for me she's scum,

This is exactly the same thing you said on the pie game.
You were correct that time, but im still not convinced to call it a hard scum tell, SPECIALLY when you keep mentioning it (or at least i think so, i only have this one and that game as reference).
And i also remember i never let go of my beeboy SR and in the end we were both town.

[Sakura Hana]

Hope you get well soon LLD

[Sakura Hana]

Desp is still just lynchbait.

pfft hahahahaa
That was a good one.

[Sakura Hana]

Regfan agreeing with some of my reads give me some warm fuzzy feelings inside.
Unfortunately i've been slow af this game in terms of reads.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh i get it.
768 didnt have a colon.

[Sakura Hana]

I can compromise on baku if need be.

[Sakura Hana]

I think Varsoon is town.

[Sakura Hana]

or hebichan (Lean Scum), hiplop (Lean Scum), Sakura Hana (Lean Scum), Floodgates (Null Town) on Desperado. I started to see the Desperado wagon as a thing that'd maybe be, like, Desp flips town, then I'm next, and I was like, "Well, that would be a shite direction for the game to go."

This is the kind of paranoia a town player gets, imo.

[Sakura Hana]

All these swiftly changing votes are making me nervous.

[Sakura Hana]

tell me about Desperado without talking about Sunlit Diamond or Desperado's opening read list post.

A combination of gut and i havent liked much his posting.

[Sakura Hana]

But idk, all the ppl that were easily voting baku have now decided to pile on Desp and is making me second guess myself.

[Sakura Hana]

Actually i guess only Maria switched...
I don't know why i have this feeling of uneasyness then.

[Sakura Hana]

Sigh fineeee

Vote: baku

L-1

[Sakura Hana]

it's really annoying without knowing when the deadline will end up hitting.

[Sakura Hana]

I have a lot of thoughts going in my mind that i dont even know where to begin.

[Sakura Hana]

Ah! every time i keep organizing my thoughts they keep changing so i might as well just dump everything in.

Yesterday, I was agreeing with Desp that Varsoon's hammer was not town, but then baku flipped scum, while i was happy to get a scum flip that confused my thoughts about Desp and Varsoon's alignments, then i thought the way Varsoon hammered could be a bus, but looking back at it, the timestamp of Varsoon's hammer is within the 12 hours regfan asked for, and then idk what to think about Desp, like it's normal to think a quick move like that is anti town, but also we were pressed for time anyway, and idk if desp wanted to stall for time so that ppl would move off baku after seeing the claim, or is actually town, and i also am not sure if varsoon just said "screw it" as a town vote to avoid a NL, or was just busing.

tl;dr: im unsure about Desp and Varsoon now.

[Sakura Hana]

im going to vote for dream 3 because 1 sounds like a self protection or something boring like that

by that logic dream 2 sounds like a vig.
and dream 3 sounds like a global effect.

[Sakura Hana]

This could be of use though if we get mod confirmation that dreams and dreams ONLY can receive it

Highly doubt it.

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: Desperado
I guess ill go back to the "obvious scumfuck" wagon, then.

[Sakura Hana]

Liking syry's posting btw.

[Sakura Hana]

Another thing im wondering is why did floodgates die.

[Sakura Hana]

Maybe nacho's actually scum?

[Sakura Hana]

Fun fact: Jae literally told me last night "why aren't they buying our framejob?" in response to reading this post.

Yeah, just like biochem where scum went and NK SAD to frame MoI... oh wait.

[Sakura Hana]

Why does everyone think that every scum NK is a frame job is beyond me, more so mastina, who was in biochem.

[Sakura Hana]

Another weird thought in my head is that i played a really passive Day 1 and Nacho hasn't scumread me at all.

[Sakura Hana]

oh hey.
NMS did finally something that makes sense.
Also:

Why does everyone think that every scum NK is a frame job is beyond me, more so mastina, who was in biochem.

1) That was Jae. She even explicitly stated it was me.
2) You're misrepresenting my stance. My stance was that it sounds like you're whining in that post that no one is buying what you set up with the nightkill. If you're scum I see that post as a pretty blatant "Why is no one scumreading Imperium after I set them up with the nightkill?".

1) So? do you mind control mastina or something?
2) My issue with imperium is unrelated to the NK, my issue with imperium is "why isnt nacho scumreading me harder"

[Sakura Hana]

I mean if that's what Jae thought, i'd expect mastina to say something like "it makes sense for her to care about the NK due to biochem" or something.

[Sakura Hana]

Why cant ppl be more obvtown.
It makes my job harder.

[Sakura Hana]

You know, i've always liked voting the person that someone scumreading me is voting just for funsies.
But that was L-2 and day's just started, i dont want someone to randomly hammer and cut the day short.

[Sakura Hana]

She might be right actually!

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: Hebi

This reads taken a massive drop

vote: hebichan

Fuckity fuck fuck fuck I'm too impulsive.
I wanted to talk this over in the PT to get approval, to get better feedback, to see if my doubts were founded or not, and so on and so forth but I can't wait.
I talked myself into doubting my Desperado scumread.
If I get told, "mastina, no, ur being dumb", then I'll move our vote back (or Jae could do it for me), but.
VOTE: hebichan.
I want to do this instead of Desperado.

VOTE: Hebi

Hail to the chief.

I'm still good with a Desp lynch, tbh, but the ease at which so many people are pooling Desp and me makes me feel like they're ready to throw the lot out with the larder.
Wait, does that even make sense?
Baby with the scumwater?

P-EDIT: I think Cephrir is just pooter peeved that he's one of your scumreads.

Went into the problems I had with Hebis reads/actions on Baku yesterday in Post 959 but with Baku flipping mafia it's significantly worse, him chiming in to state that he thinks that the Sunlit slot was more likely scum than Baku in Post 266 and trying to get me to move across then has a lot of scum motivation behind it. Him on 18th stating that he agrees with the consensus that Baku is scummy in Post 878 but having his vote on what effectively was a vanity wagon on Varsoon instead to then progress to moving to Desperado in Post 922 and then stating that he doesn't understand the scum reads on Baku in Post 924 which directly contradicts his earlier comment is a huge scum tell here and his explanation behind it in Post 926 and Post 929 really don't make much sense at all. The lack of any sort of reaction postflip in Post 1024 and him pushing the angle of "Baku defending Desperado a lot" behind his vote when earlier he'd said "Honestly, I am not sure where to sort Desperado anymore, Baku might be defending them to get town credit, from what I read." points towards there being no real actual deep thought process behind his reads and is really really unlikely to come from town here. Feel pretty good about this scum read.

Vote: Hebi

All this happened within 3 pages, and 7 hours.
Talk about fastest wagon ever.
Desp is certainly scum.

[Sakura Hana]

All this happened within 3 pages, and 7 hours.
Talk about fastest wagon ever.
Desp is certainly scum.

How does the hebi-wagon speed have anything to do with Desp's alignment, especially since most of the people on the wagon suspect hebi (and have stated so in some capacity before they joined the wagon). It's not like the wagon just randomly came up out of nowhere.

Coz it's a counterwagon to desp

[Sakura Hana]

All this happened within 3 pages, and 7 hours.
Talk about fastest wagon ever.
Desp is certainly scum.

Last game I played here Mini Normal 1920 on D3 we ran up a player in ~30 minutes to L-1 on the same page day started that was mafia. I don't think wagon speed itself is the biggest indicator out of everything of alignment, particular players that are voting and the reasoning behind it is important and outside of Desperado I town read pretty much all the voters. What's the world you're looking at here if you think it's a case of "Hebi!Town & Desp!Scum" with the wagon being fast to save Desp, like who do you think is with Desp that's a voter there and why?

Mostly coz baku and munna took hella lot of effort to lynch (not from me obv, i was voting desp back then) that they ended up being lynched at the deadline.
I still have some uneasy feelings about NMS that i cant put away from my mind, specially how mastina's working out this game.
MariaR i dont have a good read there either, but im unsure about what her vote means.
And Varsoon and you are TRs.

[Sakura Hana]

Dunno I hope it's just me being paranoid.

[Sakura Hana]

Yeah anti used to say the same thing about wagon speed.

[Sakura Hana]

2) And my issue is with your post where you say "why is no one scumreading Imperium for the Floodgates kill?"

Except i never posted that?

[Sakura Hana]

1) No, I'm saying you have an issue with me thinking something about the way you commented on the nightkill...because mastina was in biochem??? mastina stated my thoughts on your post, and stated that they were my thoughts. You then went to try and discredit it because "mastina was in biochem".

That she did, i take issue with her not taking issue with them.

[Sakura Hana]

Like, are you taking me to believe that your hydra is supposed to be town and mastina isnt correcting your thoughts to read me more accurately?

[Sakura Hana]

Mostly coz baku and munna took hella lot of effort to lynch (not from me obv, i was voting desp back then) that they ended up being lynched at the deadline.
I still have some uneasy feelings about NMS that i cant put away from my mind, specially how mastina's working out this game.
MariaR i dont have a good read there either, but im unsure about what her vote means.
And Varsoon and you are TRs.

Day one lynches and wagons take longer than other days to get going and actually go through for several obvious reasons; today we actually have content from yesterday and interaction analysis to work with, I think it's pretty natural for there to be a bunch of votes going towards the same direction and it's not really a reason to worry, plus minus Desp I like the wagon composition here; I've run through my NMS town read in detail, I can somewhat get where you're worried about them from but it's not something I share. I have a townish read on MariaR but she's on my list of players I want to take another look at. The strongest reason for Hebi!Town that I can see is that I don't think Hebi/Desp are aligned here and I do also have a scum read on Desp, my scum read on Hebi at the moment is just stronger than the other one.

I'll drop the issue, but i cant help but feel paranoid about the way that wagon developed.

[Sakura Hana]

This really reads as if you're trying to put a lot of attention on Floodgates death and the narrative that Imperium killed Floodgates for being able to read them.
If you're scum that's exactly what it is. It's "why is no one buying my frame job here?"

Nope those are independent thoughts of mine!
You are the one changing their meaning to affect the outlook they have on the game, when mastina SHOULD know and SHOULD have informed you that i have valid reasons to be looking at NKA.

I mean... she agreed with my read on it so... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

So first you say argue with me that "those were my thoughts not mastina's" and now you're saying she agreed with them, so i was correct to begin with.
VOTE: NoticeMeSenpai

[Sakura Hana]

Because if you didn't then why not Desp? y'know, the person Floodgates was actually voting.

You mean the person i was already voting?

[Sakura Hana]

Because if you didn't then why not Desp? y'know, the person Floodgates was actually voting.

You mean the person i was already voting?

I can't even tell if you're doing this on purpose or if I'm suddenly speaking in alien tongues.
It's like... how the fuck do you take everything I say, remove all the context of what we've been talking about all this time, and then come up with a question like that?

To remind you again.
We're talking about my read of your post being "floodgates died so imperium could be scum guys!! hey pay attention to this! Why is no one buying my frame job?!?"

I could say the same thing to you, because apparently you didnt read my posts or you dont understand that i never said that at all.

[Sakura Hana]

1040 and 1041 are probably just unrelated thoughts.

That's what i said:

Nope those are independent thoughts of mine!

[Sakura Hana]

I am exhausted sorry, no content from me for now.

[Sakura Hana]

I wonder why Syry hasnt asked me why i think Varsoon's town.
I wonder why Nacho is ignoring me and my scumread of his slot.
I wonder why mastina is being such a jerk and anti town.
I wonder why MariaR is not sharing anything.

Like seriously, it's going to take a lot of convincing that mastina's town here, and even if i were to believe they're town i'd still lynch them because i dont like playing with anti town jerks anyways.

[Sakura Hana]

Pedit: i have been a bit on the downer side but thats not really an excuse i feel better when people ask me stuff so go ahead and prod me sakura

What are your reads.

[Sakura Hana]

If that's what you mean by not sharing you can clearly see I have sr's on hebi and ceph

well yeah, but i mean everyone else.

[Sakura Hana]

I went back through your ISO i cant find the reason Hebi took a "massive drop". I'd also would like to know why you have Syry in the orange section.

[Sakura Hana]

if you look at it in a general standpoint we had no time left on the deadline and baku got lynched. Hebi didn't join the wagon and if that wasn't enough she;s on the main counter wagon (that was a lot bigger a few vc's ago) with confirmed town and scum.

Ummmm
She declared intent, varsoon just hammered first.

[Sakura Hana]

I can see why you think that, but by your logic everyone that was voting Desp incl. me would be suspect, so i dont see why she ending the day on the other wagon has any relevance after she had declared intent.
Regardless your contribution has helped me get a better read on you so thanks for that, i still would like you to reply to this.

[Sakura Hana]

and people aren't even glancing at

Careful! some person called Jae might come and interpret it as "why arent ppl buying my mislynch"

On a more serious note, I have certainly noticed hiplop missing lately, Ceph i used to remember someone telling me what his scum game was like, and then i forgot... maybe i need to take a look at Gistou (God help me) again.

[Sakura Hana]

@Syrana/Sakura (or really anyone that is contemplating or leaning towards NMS being mafia); I'm reading a lot of your complaints with the slot as a personality and playstyle clash with Mastina, I wish they'd be able to explain their Varsoon read clearer and think their confidence behind the read is somewhat exaggerated in thread but I've played with Mastina and obs'ed enough of their games to know that it's very much something they do as town. I think the interaction between them & Sakura was just a case of them talking past each other and not really reading the context and exchange properly, I don't think it was a case of scum pushing an agenda at all. I think their interactions and push on Baku and Bakus interactions back is a really strong indicator they're town here. I think the fact that throughout most of the game their reads have aligned with mine for similar reasons on lots of players is a very good sign they're town. I think their interaction as a hydra and how they're approaching the game is a big sign they're town too; for instance Mastinas "votes/change of votes/reads stated" and talking about when Jae is backing him up or not reads very genuine; it's not unfakeable as a singular action but to add up and be as genuine as it has been throughout the entire game really is hard to fake. If you've got any other specific doubts about their slot and want me to address those ones I'm more than happy to but they're town here, annoying at times, yes, but town and need you guys to minimise interactions with them and focus more elsewhere as much as you can.

Yeah well...
I dont like playing with ppl that act like jerks, specially when their reads are so wrong, I can't work with them, I can't trust them either.

[Sakura Hana]

Why can't you trust someone whos read is wrong? No one is perfect and no one is gonna land 100% of the scumteam end of the day mafia is a teamgame and you gotta put your best foot forward to try and work with people.

Not when they go like feel like being jerks to someone just because they are a scumread.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh cool, LLD's reads match mine.

[Sakura Hana]

who was ragging on reg for reading her and drealmz differently even though they admitted doing nothing.

?
On reg?
dont you mean on desp?
Ragging?

[Sakura Hana]

Smith's first post in the game is #1337
xD

[Sakura Hana]

You're probably one of my favorite players to play with.
In biochem you got in when I was already dead iirc.

[Sakura Hana]

I think I had circumstantial info in MassEffect that let me know Hebi was lying and frame-jobbing me.

As for this game, I just don't like their play very much so far.

Skim feels more lynchbait than anything, possible counterwagon to scum!desperado but I'm not really sure what to think on him so *shrugs*

That's what i already mentioned earlier.

[Sakura Hana]

I think I had circumstantial info in MassEffect that let me know Hebi was lying and frame-jobbing me.

As for this game, I just don't like their play very much so far.

Skim feels more lynchbait than anything, possible counterwagon to scum!desperado but I'm not really sure what to think on him so *shrugs*

That's what i already mentioned earlier.

Sakura buddying me by sheeping my read in advance

Minus the lynchbait part and with an added "wagon too fast" part but otherwise yeah the same thing i said

[Sakura Hana]

Yeah well...
I dont like playing with ppl that act like jerks, specially when their reads are so wrong, I can't work with them, I can't trust them either.

I can settle with you not liking working with them and avoiding them when needed, I can even settle with you side eyeing them despite the fact that I'd bet a lot that you're both town, what I need to stop happening is you voting them though and instead work with me and look elsewhere. What's your read on Dreamlz, what's your read on Hebi excluding wagon speed? What do you think the odds are of Hebi/Dreamlz/Desp containing 0, 1, 2, 3 scum % wise? I'd go 4%, 55%, 40%,1%.

Ok i can settle with that, as long as it's not my fault if they turn out to be scum and we lose the game for it

Unvote

As for the other question i think there's 80% chance of 1, possibly 2 with a maybe 40% chance? I think still Desp is scum and my read on Drealmz is starting to head through the null scum pile
I'll go back to Desp
VOTE: Desperado

[Sakura Hana]

especially since like half of what I remember was her theater w boon *shrugs*

lol that game.
I still read over that specific part of day 2 every now and then coz i like to remember that one theater i pulled off.

[Sakura Hana]

For once something i agree with Desp about!
OMG the world's gonna end.

[Sakura Hana]

Pfft

Hahaha, that's kinda funny actually.
I am looking forward to NMS reaction to that "scum team" considering they were saying i was supposedly "framing" nacho

[Sakura Hana]

You run out of steam?

[Sakura Hana]

You run out of steam?

so does that mean you're not town?

No it means i dont remember Nos ever running out of steam. As any alignment.

[Sakura Hana]

You run out of steam?

so does that mean you're not town?

No it means i dont remember Nos ever running out of steam. As any alignment.

IF they don't run out of steam as either alignment, why bring it up?

Yeah, why would i bring up someone doing something that's something they don't usually do.
Might as well just let it pass by ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Are you being serious right now.

[Sakura Hana]

I'm just wondering what you think it means?

That's what I wanna know.

[Sakura Hana]

Today I learned that Desp doesnt like people having fun ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Sakura Hana]

Pretend I asked and we can go from there

or hebichan (Lean Scum), hiplop (Lean Scum), Sakura Hana (Lean Scum), Floodgates (Null Town) on Desperado. I started to see the Desperado wagon as a thing that'd maybe be, like, Desp flips town, then I'm next, and I was like, "Well, that would be a shite direction for the game to go."

This is the kind of paranoia a town player gets, imo.

I had this feeling near day 1 end, got confused near day 2 start, then Reg woke me up, so i still have that same feeling.

[Sakura Hana]

Anyway as i was going to ask before i got RUDELY INTERRUPTED.
@Nos: Why are you running out of steam?

[Sakura Hana]

Eh, I think that might be a good idea for me too wrt NMS actually ^^;;

[Sakura Hana]

@People that think im scum with Imperium: Would you help me vote Imperium then?

[Sakura Hana]

Who would those people be? My reads are not mutually inclusive.

Well so far, you and Desp.

[Sakura Hana]

I don't think any of you necessarily have to be buddies with each other. I just listed people I think could be scum based on how I feel and thinking most of the other players could be town (with the exception of Syr who I'm unsure of and dreal who I really couldn't care either way if he got lynched or not).

So I guess that's a No, then?

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: Imperium

[Sakura Hana]

as scum I'm expecting most of her votes on me to push on me lurking/bring low effort

Really? Well my memory may be wrong, but wasnt the only time i've been scum and you town that one newbie game where you were TRing me the entire game until Wisdom rep'd in? Scum me would have their best interest in keeping you alive so you'd defend me.

I really like the "for people who are scumreading both of us, why not vote Imperium?" - think that if she was scum trying to get people to vote the townie in their suspect list that she wouldn't be so incredibly blatant about it.

This one is very true actually.

[Sakura Hana]

Hey Nacho, could you share all your reads?

[Sakura Hana]

ftr 1506 is making me second guess myself about you.

[Sakura Hana]

Ah sorry LLD but regfan is scum is nigh impposible

Unvote

[Sakura Hana]

Ah sorry LLD but regfan is scum is nigh impposible

Unvote

Why do you say that?

That reason uhh...
Might as well keep it a secret for now.

I don't have the same grade of confidence on Nacho, hence why I was voting him earlier, but idk, his posting feels genuine to me now.

[Sakura Hana]

As for Nacho, given I know for a fact his shit is fucking fake as hell, you'll just need to trust me that it's not genuine. I'm kind of in a unique position where I know what he's saying is being faked because he's played so much with me, and there's no damn way he genuinely believes I would do anything he mentioned. Straight up.

I haven't played with Nacho in a long while, it's quite possible my meta of him is outdated.
But the way he went about explaining his read on me feels genuine to me.
Idk, if it's just that I want to believe he's town, or that I want to see one of the scumhunters i admired do his work, but now im having a hard time reading his posts and not seeing genuine all over it

[Sakura Hana]

It feels like you might be a little starstruck by Regfan and Nacho, to be honest.

It's possible that's the case with Nacho, but if it is that means I wouldn't have any way of seeing eye to eye with you on this, but I doubt this is the case, maybe, i haven't had qualms lynching Scumcho in past games, I thought i was one of the few that could read him accurately, unfortunately im not feeling the same degree of confidence i used to have, he probably could be scum just hitting the right notes with me like pie once told me he did as scum, i know that.... and yet.... i have a hard time seeing him as scum now.

With regfan is a different story, im telling you he's town. Well rather it's impossible for me and regfan to have different alignments so he's town.

[Sakura Hana]

Regarding Nacho, what about his things strikes you as genuine, knowing that I am telling you without any doubt that his claims about how he should expect me to behave are at minimum wrong and misguided, but far more likely designed and intentionally wrong.

His read on me
also post 1506
The fact that he'd self hammer over letting hebi lynched (if he's lying about that then im 100% lynching him tomorrow)

[Sakura Hana]

Also Nacho would have an easier time swinging a ML on me than you.
P-Edit: @LLD

[Sakura Hana]

what's the opposite of a lyncher?

a savior?

is imperium your savior? wincon: you lose if X player is lynched ?

Isn't that bastard?

[Sakura Hana]

So when I defend Hebi, Imperium and Regfan both show up with swords drawn ready to cut it down however they can, but it doesn't work and the wagon's stalling a bit. Not enough, but a bit.

But didnt Nacho defend Hebi too? I'm confused.

[Sakura Hana]

Maybe that sort of thinking is too complicated for me.
But the way you're explaining the events sounds different from what I remember.

[Sakura Hana]

He popped in to defend hebi, and also said something like "is regfan feeling alright?" or something, and then left again without explaining why hebi was town.

[Sakura Hana]

I guess that wasnt exactly a defense, he said he'd be depressed if she got lynched, and then asked someone why they thought she was scum.
Still that doesnt look like pushing the wagon through that looks at worst stalling it and at best trying to derail it.

[Sakura Hana]

Uhh...
I still think it'd be easier for scumcho to just push for my ML. Considering there's a decentish ammount of people scumreading me and I have a harder time putting up a fight when im getting ML'd

[Sakura Hana]

Uhh...
I still think it'd be easier for scumcho to just push for my ML. Considering there's a decentish ammount of people scumreading me and I have a harder time putting up a fight when im getting ML'd

Do you really think he could swing a lynch onto you from the position he was in when he began onto me? I really don't think he has 7 other votes who will move with him.

Well obviously he sealed the deal when he said he TR me, he hadnt commented on me at all until then he could easily have faked a SR when there's several ppl (Desp, Brian, NMS, maybe smith?) that would be pretty happy to vote me.

[Sakura Hana]

Also, had he tried to do that, would you still think he was town?

Probably not?
If it happened during D1 then yeah i would, as I said earlier, me being underwhelming D1 should have triggered his alarm bells, but that's not the same story D2, hence my initial scumread on Nacho was based off he not scumreading me D1 or at least commented on it.

[Sakura Hana]

But could he get you lynched over himself that way? That's the question.

The answer is no.

Dunno, but considering how i tend to react to pressure it's possible.
It's really hard for me to say.

[Sakura Hana]

Just to verify but @LLD: do you remember Xenologue?

[Sakura Hana]

It was a very long time ago so I wouldnt be surprised if you didnt.

[Sakura Hana]

By the way for the record:

I am not lynching LLD, Imp or hebichan today

P-Edit: hi regfan!

[Sakura Hana]

By the way for the record:

I am not lynching LLD, Imp or hebichan today

P-Edit: hi regfan!

Hey! I'm still like 5 pages behind but would like you to touch on the Imperium/Hebichan reads if you haven't in those pages + state who you actually prefer to lynch here.

I touched a lot on the imperium read with LLD, hebichan im just not feeling it and I trust LLD's take on her too, as much as I also trust Nacho's take on her.
I'd prefer to lynch Desp, anyone else would be on compromise.

[Sakura Hana]

Well MariaR, smith, you and Syry are other townreads that i wouldnt lynch, but i didnt mention them coz i dont see them in any danger of being lynched anyway.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh and Varsoon TR too... lately i tend to forget he's in this game, he's been pretty low activity.

[Sakura Hana]

I doubt my role contradicts anything LLD is softing.

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: dreal
Would prefer Desp but this will do

[Sakura Hana]

Alright
VOTE: Ceph

[Sakura Hana]

I think that's L-1?
P-Edit: yeah

[Sakura Hana]

That took a while to read, but regarding the deadline i was under the impression that battery deadlines rewarded activity and drained slower when there's a larger ammount of content or something like that?

[Sakura Hana]

Yeah, I find it unsettling that I never know exactly when the deadline will hit.

[Sakura Hana]

If at least when it ended the mods would go like "Oh hey the dream timer has drained, you have 24 hours remaining" or something.

[Sakura Hana]

Well I dont.
Eh I never had enough time to revisit Gistou to review Ceph's scumgame, but i'm not townreading him either, I would've rather have Desp, but that went and gone while I was napping apparently

[Sakura Hana]

I've voted #1 and think I oppose #2 if it's anight option but am curious what others think.

I've voted #2 actually

[Sakura Hana]

From baku's flip "Nightmare" and our roles "Dreamers" doesnt look like flavor would fit a 2nd scum team.
Also only 1 NK on N1

[Sakura Hana]

He did?

[Sakura Hana]

Huh, i totally forgot about that

[Sakura Hana]

So does that mean that we actually hit a scum PR?

[Sakura Hana]

Dunno why, i was fully convinced that "Nightmare" was the scum flavor and we hit a goon, i didnt realize it had Mafia on it.

[Sakura Hana]

That didnt answer the question tho!

[Sakura Hana]

Although i know you scumlean me, so the answer's kinda obvious

[Sakura Hana]

Unvote

[Sakura Hana]

After NMS posting i have so many things in my mind that everything seems to be spiraling.
Like we're pressed for time, and they are CCing LLD.

At this point i'd be more pressed to believe NMS than LLD, specially after Tammy's wall, but i dont feel like lynching either claim because being wrong can save scum a bullet.

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: Drealmerz
For anyone wondering my lynch priorities havent changed much other than i dont want to lynch NMS.

[Sakura Hana]

I think an LLD lynch is the correct one for today tho because even in the chance she's town gambitting it saves us mislynching her later when it's worse to do so given numbers.

I mean the damage is already done.
Specially if you're both town.

[Sakura Hana]

We're scrambling for a lynch, yet this scrambling will probably end up buying us time to begin with.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh btw, im hard claiming D3, regardless of anything.

[Sakura Hana]

Like if we're gong to lynch "this claim could be fake" that'd be ceph and his sketchy "I don't want to claim because magically it nerfs my role" and yeah I'd be ok tom g back there even if I don't feel super confident.

no, he's saying there's no point in claiming because on the off chance he's not getting lynched he doesn't want to be outed, and in the case where he was getting lynched anyways then his role isn't something that is likely to sway anyone.

There are now dueling cop claims on the board and he said his role sucked (and even before there was whatever LLD was claiming on the board). So yeah "keeping options open and stalling" makes as much sense as however that theory town role might have worked.

Actually he said he'd self hammer rather than let either of the claims be lynched.
Which is actually, pretty town.

[Sakura Hana]

Btw what's loyal?

[Sakura Hana]

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Main_Page

Ah i see, thanks

[Sakura Hana]

I know what weak is i just didnt know what Loyal was, when drealmerz linked the wiki i just looked it up.
Anyway i dont get why we keep discussing what IS THE POSSIBLE PR LLD AND NMS COULD HAVE, instead of... you know, let scum figure it out and just not lynch either?

[Sakura Hana]

I mean if one is scum and scum decides to not shoot the other to keep the 1v1 going then they get more nights to use whichever PR they have, and if scum shoots the other then they save us having to figure it out ourselves, and if both are town, then it's obvious why lynching either is a bad idea.

[Sakura Hana]

And no naked nurses this time please.

[Sakura Hana]

I think we may have more than 20 mins, the pie chart hasnt moved like at all with this explosion of activity.

[Sakura Hana]

So that's L-1 then?

[Sakura Hana]

I just wanna see Drealz claim.
Still almost certain Drealz is actually town because this reminds me a lot of how town scramble in other games of his that I've seen.

wtf

[Sakura Hana]

wait, is being receptive an ability of yours drealz, or just flavor?

isnt dream receptive everyone?

[Sakura Hana]

It seems like we're all having a hard time agreeing on something.

[Sakura Hana]

I still rather lynch the VT claim over the PR soft, but fuck logic right?

[Sakura Hana]

I would much rather wait for regfan if we have time but.... i dont even know how much time we have

[Sakura Hana]

you need to put the video code in the youtube tags, not the entire URL

[Sakura Hana]

Didn't godfathers become bastard at some point? or was that just non normal.

[Sakura Hana]

So MariaR wanted to hammer before Regfan had a chance to appear huh

[Sakura Hana]

PSA: I'm now open to lynching MariaR after that hammer attempt.

[Sakura Hana]

If people could give me a quick summary it would be very much appreciated.

Wagons are flying left and right, LLD's been softing something, NMS also softed something while CCing LLD, smith's voting everything that moves, my read on NMS changed, Drealz claimed VT, hebichan claimed VT, and people want to lynch Syry now and smith saved a hammer attempt from MariaR before you had the chance to appear.

If i missed anything someone else can fill in the blanks

[Sakura Hana]

If people could give me a quick summary it would be very much appreciated.

Wagons are flying left and right, LLD's been softing something, NMS also softed something while CCing LLD, smith's voting everything that moves, my read on NMS changed, Drealz claimed VT, hebichan claimed VT, and people want to lynch Syry now and smith saved a hammer attempt from MariaR before you had the chance to appear.

If i missed anything someone else can fill in the blanks

this is a great thing just because of the start sounding like a racing commentary or something so everything was read in that voice from there

haha xD

[Sakura Hana]

@regfan: this summarizes most of what happened between the 2 claims considering i had to post these you can imagine:

I know what weak is i just didnt know what Loyal was, when drealmerz linked the wiki i just looked it up.
Anyway i dont get why we keep discussing what IS THE POSSIBLE PR LLD AND NMS COULD HAVE, instead of... you know, let scum figure it out and just not lynch either?

I mean if one is scum and scum decides to not shoot the other to keep the 1v1 going then they get more nights to use whichever PR they have, and if scum shoots the other then they save us having to figure it out ourselves, and if both are town, then it's obvious why lynching either is a bad idea.

[Sakura Hana]

#HereWeGoAgain

[Sakura Hana]

Godfather only fucks with cops tho afaik.

[Sakura Hana]

This progression here from MariaR makes significantly more sense coming from scum than town and the timing of it where the vote on Dreamlz looks like a hammer attempt is a huge scum tell there, disliking the reasoning behind NMS's vote on Dreamlz, wanting to lynch and being confident that Ceph is scum to then joining them voting Dreamlz makes very little sense. There's two possibilities here a) She'd taken notice of Mhsmiths vote movement to Syrana or b) She hadn't taken notice of Mhsmiths vote movement to Syrana. If b) is the case the blitz hammer attempt there feels almost like a scum claim and if a) is the case her not joining him on Syrana while claiming to scum read him in that exact post of hers and previous ones of hers points towards the reads from her being fake.

I 100% agree with this btw, and is why MariaR moved to my lynch pool after that.

[Sakura Hana]

VOTE: Nosferatu
Yeah ok

[Sakura Hana]

Well im gonna be sleeping in less than an hour most likely.
So you can't count on me to switch my vote after that happens.

[Sakura Hana]

either scum could mess with the dream selection (plausible)

Uhhh...

10. There is at least one ability in the game that will modify dream choices.

Also considering how the dream was called "The Nightmare" and there wasn't any dream with that name, and the dream name matches baku's flip, i think it's a fair assumption that this was caused by scum.
Regardless I voted for #2 first then #1

Also why not call them Siblings instead of Mason-Lovers

[Sakura Hana]

I think scum used a global roleblock due to being worried about the potential of both NMS and LLD, since they could only kill one, they wanted to prevent the other from obtaining any results.
That combined with how the arguments went yesterday it should be fairly obvious that LLD is town.

Unless im wrong about something in my assumptions.

[Sakura Hana]

I mean, I'm pretty much assuming that "the nightmare" was the "murder and mayhem" dream outcome, though admittedly I guess it's possible that's mistaken.

If you look at Night 1, the dream title was the same as the dream name we voted, I doubt it'd have a different name.

[Sakura Hana]

I mean, also the fact that it was a global roleblock EXCEPT for factional abilities show that said Nightmare was a proscum dream, and im not even sure how that would relate to Murder and Mayhem to begin with.

[Sakura Hana]

you don't have to revote if you don't change your choice

You can confirm your vote tho, remember that confirmed dream votes also affect when the moonrise phase ends if it doesnt time out.

[Sakura Hana]

wonder if the nightmare was caused by the hammerer...

Hmm, if that was the case wouldnt the nightmare have happened instantly instead of having a moonrise phase?

[Sakura Hana]

I think one of those wagons that got derailed was scum.

ya, yours

OR you know, yours.


VOTE: Imperium

Nah.
Tammy's wall was def. not a scum post.

[Sakura Hana]

Oh wait, i thought you were replying to Imperium for some reason.
Why the Imperium vote when saying that drealmerz is scum.

[Sakura Hana]

I was being sarcastic to drealmz idea that I'm scum.

Sorry should have said /s.

Oh ok, it wasnt obvious to me, but im bad at picking up some sarcasm and jokes

Give me a counter wagon, because I'm not giving maria a death here.

This made me realize there's currently only 2 people im willing to vote atm, i should probably go over my reads again (ftr those 2 are Maria and Desp)

[Sakura Hana]

Also I am good at controlling my temper thank you! It's a shame dream 2 went in cause I could've been vigged but I guess I can eat a lynch.

#Thor #SelfVoting #Scum #AtE

[Sakura Hana]

Also I am good at controlling my temper thank you! It's a shame dream 2 went in cause I could've been vigged but I guess I can eat a lynch.

#Thor #SelfVoting #Scum #AtE

Self voting is NAI for me I've done it as scum and town it's up to you to make of it as you will. I don't believe anything I've really posted is ate? If it is I'm not trying to make it come off as it.

Self voting IS AtE, I know, i used to self vote a lot, even self-hammer a few times in the past.
Now what i meant by those hashtags was this thread: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=59109

P-Edit: And trust me from personal experience, self voting/hammering WONT make ppl look at your reads, heck ppl dont ever look at dead people's reads even when they are shot by scum or ML'd.

[Sakura Hana]

Anyways
VOTE: Desperado
No longer wishing to vote Maria.

[Sakura Hana]

Sure my action may not be the most...normal of actions but in my mind it seems like a pretty good outcome

Been there... done that...
it's not something you want to be associated with, ever.

[Sakura Hana]

Just like when me and Dunn left the dance I did it to take myself out of the picture because we were heavily fos'd and people were able to get the last scum that no one listened to me about lynching.

Just wondering, did town win that game?

[Sakura Hana]

Speaking of claiming, i did say that i would claim today.

[Sakura Hana]

Did you hide last night?

I did, but it failed. Global Roleblock apparently triggers first.

I dont think it's about triggering first, since i think hider only escapes targeted actions.
Regardless i think something as powerful as that global roleblock should only be 1 shot or something otherwise scum has no reason to not use it every night. So it looks like you lucked out.

[Sakura Hana]

if it is tied to the hammering it could be "works any time a scum hammers"

I doubt is something as convenient as that, otherwise we'd just lynch whoever hammers anytime it happens.

[Sakura Hana]

Ok i think im finally getting my head around, i had too many townreads, but of note is that im still getting bad feelings from Desp and Drealz, Syry has taken a dive too, and smith has gone to null pile.