Open 714: Tit for Tat [Game Over]

[Luca Blight]

Well I don't see how saying I don't mind your lynch is scummy or bad, unless you view yourself as above suspicion, so...

[JaydragonKing]

I just wanted to see if you would say where you get such Suspicion, really. The reasons behind it and such.

[Luca Blight]

I pretty much said it already - I don't think you're contributing anything. The only reason you've got away with it so far is because of your reputation for doing such.

I don't massively scumread you - you're just one out of about half the player list I wouldn't mind lynching.

[JaydragonKing]

Just wanted to confirm that was all. Thanks for answering.

[Gamma Emerald]

hai
I might overturn my reads and just look at the game with a few reads I feel comfortable keeping (Mathdino and Luca as town being two)

[Gamma Emerald]

Anyone who takes stock in metareading creature has him as locktown
Gamma I believe
A50 by virtue of sharing a wagon
NSG should be locktowning him if she isn't

Look ill somewhat consider A50 scum but I'm really not considering Creature scum at this point
It's just more helpful to have other discussions and sort other players

Also i have reason to believe that talking about creature actually hurts the prospect of reading him

Actually no, he vanished again, this could very likely be scum creature that just popped up once
like wasn't Creature active in the beginning of JK9++?

[Gamma Emerald]

Re: 5 slots: Dude, if everyone outside those 5 slots is town, I'm a damn scumhunting legend, because it means people inside those 5 slots each have a 60% chance of rolling scum. You just can't claim a 60% accuracy based on an ISO alone. Townhunting works wonders.
And even if I'm wrong and one scum is outside those 5 (which is likely, due to Jay, jmo, NSG), that's still a 40% accuracy rate within those 5 slots, which is significantly better than random.
I get the feeling you think this is unfair. And to be fair to you, you'd think that as either alignment.
To get out of a PoE scumread, you basically argue that I'm townreading scum, or that the other people in my lynchpool are scummier than you.

Re: Creature: Good catch.
You can't activity-tell Creature while complaining about his activity, or while calling him scum early on. You activity-tell him by leaving him to his own devices and seeing if he picks up interest in the game entirely on his own. I realised this about halfway through, and considered asking everyone to stop talking about Creature, but "WOW MATHDINO STOP CONTROLLING THE TOWN", so I didn't.
My thought process around that time was, if Creature is scum after all, he's 100% going to be today's lynch once people realise he's checked out of the game. But it takes a long time to realise he's checked out (usually results in him getting prodded), so I'm really just better off assuming he's town for now until proven otherwise.
Lo and behold, the very next page, he showed up despite being townread and started doing shit.
My read progression on Creature was more tactical than reads-based. Wanted to see what he'd do if people trusted him (which I do, if he's town).

Re: Walls: Ughh you actually want me to do that? That was a "might".

Ah so it's the timing of his appearance, idk about that but if Creature

does

end up flipping scum you're pretty locktown

[Gamma Emerald]

VOTE: Luca Blight

Seems fine to me now, so this will be where I want the Lynch to happen for day 1.

badvote
would use one of giggles' memes but can't seem to find one

[Mathdino]

I recommend just not trying to read Creature until you're 90% sure he's scum.

Like, don't even do the "Wait a second is Creature scum?" or "Where's Creature?" because that ruins the tell. He gets lynched one way or another if scum.

[Creature]

Let's get spicy:

VOTE: jmo16mla

[Gamma Emerald]

Let's get spicy:

VOTE: jmo16mla

You know what I'm actually down with this; for all his early-game bluster about getting the game going jmo has been a complete non-entity
VOTE: jmo16mla

[JaydragonKing]

I'm on page 19. Prod dodging for now. In laws are in town and I don't have much time. I will try to post tomorrow.

Prod dodging again. I will devote time to this tonight.

Reading now.

I believe your feeling that way because he's been away for a total of 6 days.

[pinturicchio]

Some updates:
- Luca, Paradox and Dino are still town
- I'm gonna trust Dino on his Creature read only for this Day for practical reasons
- My "usual suspects" are the ones who could be lurking thanks to Dino's loudness: A50, Jay, NSG and Keyser Söze.
- jmo could be included in the list above but I haven't thought about him since the beginning of the game
- Null read on Gamma and Aneninen; Gamma because I really can't read him (my problem) and Aneninen because I can't remember what I think about him (my problem too, sorry). If I recall correctly, his last posts were townie, but don't trust me on that.
- Mutant is still my most scumread

VOTE: Mutantdevle

[mutantdevle]

I'd vote jmo as well, mainly out of my day 1 policy of lynching the useless. His last proper post was 368 and his 3 posts since then have all be prodges. I'm comfortable on Gamma for now though.

Also, I can kinda agree with some of the stuff said about Math, but I still think this is obviously his town game. The only way I think I'd reconsider my read on him is if either he or a theoretical partner majorly slipped or Gamma flipped scum on the basis that math's attitude towards their wagon could easily be bussing scum who backs out when it gets serious. But yes, I can scum read Gamma and town read math because A) Gamma hasn't flipped and B) Math wouldn't automatically be scum for that 1 thing.

@jmo if you do decide to magically start contributing then please address my question I asked you a while ago.

[pinturicchio]

Wow, speaking of the devil

[Creature]

Wait, Keysor Soze is playing?

[mutantdevle]

Mutant is still my most scumread

Yeah but why? Your point about me being scum is basically that I chose to scum read Gamma, why do you think that? You have a reason to scum read me but no real basis.

[mutantdevle]

Wow, speaking of the devil

I'd just like to take a moment to appreciate this phrase as I like how it coincides with my love for puns when used specifically about me.

[Gamma Emerald]

Wait, Keysor Soze is playing?

nope

[pinturicchio]

Scumlean: mutant. His "I don't conform to site meta. I usually look more an more townie" still seems scummy to me. I agree with Creature saying he seems fence sitting, his posts aren't that thoughtful, and saying he's interested in jumping on NSG wagon without really doing it was weird as hell. There's only one reason I'm not scumreading him: I feel like his reads are outdated, so I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt until I see where is he now.

I said this about you long ago and I'm still feeling it, mostly because of PoE now. If you give us and uptaded readlist I could reconsider but that would screw me as I really wouldn't know where to go; I don't know who of my "usual suspects" would be a better lynch.

[pinturicchio]

Wait, Keysor Soze is playing?

nope

Loool there's a player called Keyser Söze? I was making a joke because of my "usual suspects" list. Sorry for the confusion

[Gamma Emerald]

Yeah
I think we were all in Divergent Mafia (me creature and keyser)

[mutantdevle]

Scumlean: mutant. His "I don't conform to site meta. I usually look more an more townie" still seems scummy to me. I agree with Creature saying he seems fence sitting, his posts aren't that thoughtful, and saying he's interested in jumping on NSG wagon without really doing it was weird as hell. There's only one reason I'm not scumreading him: I feel like his reads are outdated, so I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt until I see where is he now.

I said this about you long ago and I'm still feeling it, mostly because of PoE now. If you give us and uptaded readlist I could reconsider but that would screw me as I really wouldn't know where to go; I don't know who of my "usual suspects" would be a better lynch.

The thing that annoys me about people who call me scummy because I said I don't conform to site meta is because y'all are treating it as though it was something I brought up to justify a scummy thing I did. Not only had I barely spoken prior to this but I was also not the one who even brought it up. Math described my playstyle as scummy, I refuted that Idea by saying I simply just don't conform to site meta.

The only justification I can see for scum reading me based on that is if you think I'm trying to say "please excuse my scummy actions, that's just my play style". But, if anything, I was saying the opposite by refuting the claim that my playstyle is scummy. Furthermore, I haven't actually done anything scummy that's needed justifying by such a claim; unless you count human error as scummy like Gamma seems to.

And if your point is more literal than that by trying to say that my notion of not following site meta is scummy, then friendly reminder that it's my meta to not follow site meta as many people present can confirm on a whim. So basically, to everyone using this 1 sentence as a tell on me (not just pintu): stfu. The only valid reasons I think anyone could scum read me at this point is not being townie enough - either in general or compared to my previous town games. All other reasons I'm going to find inherently suspicious.


Also Pintu, I gave a reads list in 827 which wasn't that long ago. If you want an update from that then just pretend Jay is sitting in null. I would also drop you from a town lean to a null but I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt in being a noobie (I really hope I'm not just underestimating you here). Finally, for some reason, I feel like moving jmo to a scum lean but I have no idea why since he hasn't actually said anything - I'm probably just losing patience with him.

[pinturicchio]

Scumlean: mutant. His "I don't conform to site meta. I usually look more an more townie" still seems scummy to me. I agree with Creature saying he seems fence sitting, his posts aren't that thoughtful, and saying he's interested in jumping on NSG wagon without really doing it was weird as hell. There's only one reason I'm not scumreading him: I feel like his reads are outdated, so I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt until I see where is he now.

I said this about you long ago and I'm still feeling it, mostly because of PoE now. If you give us and uptaded readlist I could reconsider but that would screw me as I really wouldn't know where to go; I don't know who of my "usual suspects" would be a better lynch.

The thing that annoys me about people who call me scummy because I said I don't conform to site meta is because y'all are treating it as though it was something I brought up to justify a scummy thing I did. Not only had I barely spoken prior to this but I was also not the one who even brought it up. Math described my playstyle as scummy, I refuted that Idea by saying I simply just don't conform to site meta.

The only justification I can see for scum reading me based on that is if you think I'm trying to say "please excuse my scummy actions, that's just my play style". But, if anything, I was saying the opposite by refuting the claim that my playstyle is scummy. Furthermore, I haven't actually done anything scummy that's needed justifying by such a claim; unless you count human error as scummy like Gamma seems to.

And if your point is more literal than that by trying to say that my notion of not following site meta is scummy, then friendly reminder that it's my meta to not follow site meta as many people present can confirm on a whim. So basically, to everyone using this 1 sentence as a tell on me (not just pintu): stfu. The only valid reasons I think anyone could scum read me at this point is not being townie enough - either in general or compared to my previous town games. All other reasons I'm going to find inherently suspicious.


Also Pintu, I gave a reads list in 827 which wasn't that long ago. If you want an update from that then just pretend Jay is sitting in null. I would also drop you from a town lean to a null but I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt in being a noobie (I really hope I'm not just underestimating you here). Finally, for some reason, I feel like moving jmo to a scum lean but I have no idea why since he hasn't actually said anything - I'm probably just losing patience with him.

Sorry, must have missed that readlist, gonna check it out right now. About the site meta thing, I wast just quoting what I said about you long ago; you said I was scumreading you because "basically that I chose to scumread Gamma" and "you have a reason to scum read me but no real basis", so me quotting myself was more about "this is why I was scumreading you, not the Gamma thing". My scumread on you now is, as I said, mostly because of PoE.

[mutantdevle]

Ehh, I suppose that's fair if you think everyone else is town.

Of course, the biggest concern there would be that you think everyone else is town :3