Geriatric Ruleset Discussion Thread

[AnonymousGhost]

Thanks for making this.

Would games that use that ruleset have an average of a longer day length? Let's say that the average is two weeks per day phase. Or would this be a case by case scenario depending on the Mod?

[AnonymousGhost]

Point for longer day phases:

- Limited # of posts per day = less "space" available to players to convince their fellows that so and so is a certain alignment

This is a bit moot because probably it's a case by case base for each player and how charismatic they are. In theory, the more charismatic they are the less posts they'll have to use to persuade the other players that so and so is of a certain alignment.

There is another point that I would like to discuss.

As an overly general rule, any post that is shorter than three sentences is too short, and any post that doesn't fit on a single computer screen is too long.

I think the latter half of the rule is too subjective. The size of a computer screen can vary depending on the make, model, and price. Then you have to factor in what is and what is not a computer and whether or not someone is viewing the post in a browser that was stretched to the length of the screen or not.

I think the replacement could be

a.) a certain number of paragraphs per post

or

b.) fit into a one page document

The paragraphs per post could be Mod-decided, but there should probably be a limit to the number of run on sentences allowed in a post. We want to avoid someone's sentence becoming the size a paragraph.

I kinda like the one page document idea better. Basically, someone would type out their post into the "Quick Reply" space and then copy and paste it into a Word file - any type of software where the page displayed fits the standard printing paper size - to see if it would fit within a page or not. Then they could edit it as they see fit, repaste it into "Quick Reply" and then hit "Submit".

[AnonymousGhost]

Quality over quantity is what I think Geriatric supporters are hoping for. If a player posts nothing but game advancing one liners than they should be fine.

[AnonymousGhost]

778 was more a case of bad modding killing game momentum

Solution

: have non-geriatric players mod geriatric games

Discuss.

Should non-Geriatric players mod Geriatric games?

[AnonymousGhost]

The current meta is very vulnerable to prod dodging lurking.

More discussion. Trying to avoid clogging up the other thread.

Do you think the quoted statement has merit?

If it has merit, how could we fix the current meta?

[AnonymousGhost]

What happens if the anti-town player is a town Doctor? Do you PL them to advance day play or suffer a decrease in day play for the chance that night play is improved? You've obviously "taught" them to stop their bad behavior, if your PL goes through. Whether or not they stop their behavior is up to them.

Since MS emphasizes Day play over Night play, I'm surprised that more people aren't willing to lynch an anti town PR that's showing no intentions of fixing their play style.

Something I learned from modding; you should have some type of mechanism that punish the town if they don't lynch. Somewhat similarly, if you advocate to PL someone for shit play and it's within the realms of cite meta, then there's your punishment. No mechanic needed. People learn that if they play like shit, town won't put up with their shit.

Interesting... Should pushing a policy lynch be NAI? Should joining a policy lynch be AI? Probably not. IMO it's probably a circumstances thing, more than a blanket statement thing.

So, I guess the question is; how do you decrease the stigma that is associated with PLing someone?

[AnonymousGhost]

Interesting.

Can you give me an example of how that'd work?

[AnonymousGhost]

revive the topic of "is geriatric townsided or scumsided, and why?"

Well, so far it's been established that a.) the current meta is very vulnerable to prod dodging and lurking. (Curtesy of T-Bone! )

And it's also been "established" - let's say - that b.) a geriatric game shouldn't be an excuse to go two to three days or more without posting. (Curtesy of mastina! )

The "purpose" of Geriatric games is to let people post at a reasonable rate, without getting swamped by pages and pages and pages of multi posts made by other players. But this doesn't excuse a player from going without posting for more than the prod setting allows, since they technically "shouldn't" have an "excuse" to flake out i.e. the pages and pages and pages of posts made by other players.

However, with only a sample size of three, the only "real" conclusions we can some to right now include:

i.) The current meta is not suitable for past modding meta (Curtesy of Mastina!)
ii.) Towns cannot pull a victory if they are not active (TBF... this applies to both Geriatric and Non-Geriatric games)
iii.) Towns can pull a victory if they are active (Again... pretty obvious & this applies to both Geriatric and Non-Geriatric)
iv.) More DATA!

Shameless plug...

FWIW I do plan on hosting a Geriatric Large theme during the summer, but I've made a modification to the ruleset regarding prods. Specifically, the number of prods players are allowed to have before I replace them. I'm also going to be adopting Plotinus's Get A Room mechanic into the game as well.

So, discuss how a reduced # of prods (i.e. only allowed two prods instead of three) could affect the geriatric ruleset and/or current meta!

Transporting to other thread.

[AnonymousGhost]

Boop.

Geriatric Games - Wins and Losses

Micro 778: Geriatric Grey Flag Nightless - Town Loss/Mafia Victory

Mirco 765: Chill Mafia - Town Victory/Mafia Loss

Just Play the Hits - Town Loss/Serial Killer Loss/Mafia Victory

Instead of tracking wins/losses (like lol who cares?), we should be tracking if geriatric games have more/less overall instances of flaking and whether they encourage a greater diversity of players.

[AnonymousGhost]

Micro 778: Geriatric Grey Flag Nightless

# of Replacements: 5
# of Replacements that should've happened: 8

Replacements Per Slot + Alignment Tracking:

• Hopkirk replaces CultofAthena
  
  
• The Golden Paradox replaces RayFrost
  
  
• Titus replaces BlackVoid; BlackVoid replaces A Simple Plan; A Simple Plan replaces Luca Blight

# of Prods in chronological order: 19 (

Luca Blight

,

A Simple Plan

,

Korts

,

xRECKONERx

,

BlackVoid

) - (Last slot should've received a total of 14 prods)

Micro 765: Chill Mafia

# of Replacements: 2

Replacements Per Slot + Alignment Tracking:

• MathDino replaces sheepsaymeep
  
  
• UC Voyager replaces GinghamDog

# of Prods: 0

Just Play the Hits

# of Replacements: 3

Replacements Per Slot + Alignment Tracking:

• Kublai Khan replaces Godel
  
  
• Chara replaces Assemblerotws
  
  
• Titus replaces SleepyKrew

# of Prods in chronological order: 13 (

Assemblerotws

,

Napoleon III

,

Assemblerotws

,

Vaxkiller

,

Godel

,

Napoleon III

,

hebichan

,

Assemblerotws

,

pirate mollie

,

Varsoon

,

Sir Elton Hercules John

,

Espeonage

,

Chara

)

# of Force Replacements: 2 (

Godel

,

Assemblerotws

)

# of Mass Prods: 1 (Day 3)

[AnonymousGhost]

That I have no clue. As of this moment.

I suppose that you'd have to factor in where your "control" group - is that even the right term for something like this? - is coming from i.e. Newbie, Open, Normal, Micro Queue, etc. and how drawing from certain queues could affect prods/replacements in general. Newbie games might have a greater need for replacements/prods due to newbies site flaking and therefore might not be a good comparison to Geriatric Games for example.

As of this moment, I have no idea how to track whether or not Geriatric encourages a greater diversity of players/play styles since I'm not familiar enough with the play styles of the players - except probably Chill Mafia where I could take an "educated" guess since I have played with a couple of people from CM - from earlier years than my join date.

[AnonymousGhost]

Open Queue
Sample Size = 6

Open 711: Stack the Deck

# of Replacements: 3

• Sky_Paladin replaces TheYankeeReaper
  
  
• JaydragonKing replaces Creature
  
  
• northsidegal replaces Elmo TeH AzN

# of Prods: 5

• TheYankeeReaper
  
  
• Creature
  
  
• Montosh
  
  
• Elmo TeH AzN
  
  
• UnaBombaH

Open 714: Tit for Tat

# of Replacements: 1

• mutantdevle replaces marshy

# of Prods: 1

• northsidegal

Open 713: Jungle Republic

# of Replacements: 2

• Almost50 replaces BuJaber
  
  
• Tchill13 replaces Korina

# of Prods: 7

• Unavailable/Not Recorded by Mod

Open 710: MK Ultra

# of Replacements: 5

• Alisae replaces Mikan Tsumiki
  ,
  Mikan Tsumiki replaces Technical Difficulties
  
  
• springlullaby replaces Mumble
  
  
• Aneninen replaces Hawk
  
  
• Firebringer replaces Sesq

# of Prods: 6

• Kop
  
  
• Kop
  
  
• Not_Mafia
  
  
• Sky_Paladin
  
  
• GuyInFreezer
  
  
• Iconeum

Open 708: Pick Your Power

# of Replacements: 2

• Transcend replaces PenguinPower
  
  
• RadiantCowbells replaces Bellaphant

# of Prods: 10

• PenguinPower
  
  
• CultOfAthena
  
  
• Errantparabola
  
  
• texcat
  
  
• CultOfAthena
  
  
• Errantparabola
  
  
• Klick
  
  
• mozamis
  
  
• Flubbernugget
  
  
• Maxous

Open 707: JK9++

# of Replacements: 4

• sheepsaysmeep replaces BigFinn
  
  
• Srceenplay replaces Assemblerotws
  
  
• Gamma Emerald replaces AnonymousGhost; AnonymousGhost replaces RedFlavor

# of Prods: 7

• Assemblerotws
  
  
• BigFinn
  
  
• Hawk
  
  
• Kop
  
  
• Assemblerotws
  
  
• Assemblerotws
  
  
• havingfitz

[AnonymousGhost]

Open 715 had... 5 replace outs - I think.

Nope. 4 replace outs.

The easiest solution - without involving PRs - is to make a "soft" requirement to try to have players post at least one game related post per every 24 hours.

[AnonymousGhost]

out of practice towns

May I ask what this means?

I thought a big setback to the Open 715 Town was the fact that no one stopped to reevaluate from their death tunnels i.e. Fitz on QM, Alchemist on Fitz, and MoI on Fitz.

[AnonymousGhost]

geriatrics should get a cop head start to better align them with more skilled mafia communities

Devil's advocate: does this really solve "the problem" of the geriatric ruleset's current meta?

[AnonymousGhost]

So, what's the current site meta?

[AnonymousGhost]

By allowing people to go three days without posting probably affected the game. I don't know if Geriatrics - as a whole - follow this pattern.

Edit: Nope.

Button man's is the only Geriatric Game so far to allow players to go three days without posting. All the rest follow the 48 hour pattern.

[AnonymousGhost]

Alternatively, you could

try

to make a requirement that a player has to post once every 24 hours and allow only X amount of times that they can go without posting 24 hours without being replaced. In theory, this sounds nice. In practice, this probably would be a train wreck.

[AnonymousGhost]

D2 - Flubber wagon was counter wagon to Fitz and QM wagon that didn't really have good foundations.

[AnonymousGhost]

^ - This.

Even though I consider myself a "spam poster", I consider Geriatric games to be the best fit for me right now because of my ever changing and busy schedule.

If I go away for 24 hours, I can count on the fact that a geriatric game won't have 15+ pages when I get back home and instead might have a manageable 5~ pages.

[AnonymousGhost]

"Basic psychology" of writing: if it looks intimidating, then the chances are the reader will say 'nah' and not read it or skim over it.

That's a part of the reason why I adjusted my posting style from WALLS WALLS WALLS to short, sweet, and straight to the point.

If you take a look at the Geriatric Grey Flag game, there's a lot of walls. And that's fine. There's absolutely nothing wrong with it. If a player wants to play that way, by all means, let them do so.

Another perk of Geriatric games is that wall posters don't have to worry about being pedited 10+ times because of the posting limit. Geriatric allows for a wider range of posting styles to "co-exist" side by side because it's set at a slower pace.

At least, in theory.

[AnonymousGhost]

On the other hand, people should be able to recognize their limitations before signing up for a game, regardless if it's Geriatric or not. It's only fair to the others players and the Mod of the game. It's almost like making sure to read the rules before you play. You should do it to ensure that everyone has the best quality game.

Also this. This is very important.

Not just to Geriatric games, but all games in general.

But maybe just a little bit more to Geriatric in order to counter the perception that a certain types of meta that involve posting only after a prod should be issued are acceptable.

[AnonymousGhost]

I don't think Geriatric is scum sided by itself.

When you factor in who's more active - town, scum, or both - it certainly has the potential to be scum sided but only if the majority of town lurks. Chill Mafia was a geriatric win for a town who were all very involved in the game, for instance.

I do think that Geriatric should have a 36 hour prod timer, however.

Unless you're schedule isn't suited for being heavily involved in a game - this begs the question of what are you doing here in the first place if you can't commit -, then there really shouldn't be an excuse for going 72+ hours without posting. The game's not going to suddenly gain 15+ pages in the time that you start your catch up and the time that you post.

[AnonymousGhost]

I guess the next question would be... how long should a player be allowed to go without posting any game relevant content in a Geriatric game? And what about players who are on V/LA?

[AnonymousGhost]

A naked "prod dodge" does not reset the prod timer. To avoid being prodded/replaced for inactivity, include some game advancing content in your prodges, such as "got prodded; xxxx is still scum."

[*]If you have not posted for 48 hours you will receive a prod. If you do not post within 24 hours of a prod you will be replaced. A naked "prod dodge" does not reset the prod timer. To avoid being prodded/replaced for inactivity, include some game advancing content in your prodges, such as "got prodded; xxxx is still scum."

[*]Please announce if you are going on V/LA. I prefer this announced in thread unless there is a specific reason not to. If you are on V/LA, you are still expected to post in thread at least every 96 hours. If this is an issue for you, please discuss it with me PRIVATELY via PM.

Sorry. I was thinking of prod dodging posts and whether or not those reset the prod timer based on game advancing content.

[AnonymousGhost]

Is it easy to get disengaged in a geriatric mafia game?

Don't think this was ever answered.

@Ranmaru - My opinion's slightly biased because I was two things:

a.) scum
&
b.) highly engaged in Open 715

For the sake of promoting discussion - and I think it'd be interesting to hear other people's opinions on this -, I'd say it's not easy to get disengaged with a geriatric game.

Ironically, it's easier for me - and this is just my opinion - to disengage from a non-geriatric game at this point. Non-Geriatric games are reaches an average D1 length of 50+ pages due to the lack of a posting restriction and faster pace. Since I don't have the time to dedicate to keeping up with those games, I have no current interest to /in for those types of games because it's very likely that I'd get behind which I would feel very bad about.

But because Geriatrics are at a slower pace, I can keep up and won't immediately think with dread, "How many pages will I have to read this time?"

Which I don't think is a good mindset for me to bring to a game since I'm turned off from engaging before I even begin and, obviously, isn't fair to everyone else involved.

[AnonymousGhost]

How do I post less and cope with that?

I think there was only once I went over my daily post limit but most of my posts were engaging someone in a conversation, so I could've fallen into the trap of going over my post limit more than I had. I think it helps that everyone else has the same posting limit as you do, so the conversation has its own ebb and flow.

Pedit - Korts has a good method. Alternatively, you could try to limit yourself to no more than dedicating 15 minutes to an interaction.