Micro 789 - Alternating 9p - Mafia wins

[Lovebird]

I don't see why scum cheeky chooses you to push like that.

[Raskolnikov]

christopher and ZZZX have some level of content I just kinda don't like ZZ's and chris's is just so whatever

[CheekyTeeky]

If you think NM/ZZZX are scum then why are you voting me? From your waffling I only see these reasons from your scumread on me:

- I haven't changed my theory of why you're scum.
- I haven't done research. How is that AI?

Your scum read makes no sense and this is your second OMGUS. If you're town then be more towny and analyse the wagon on you/try to see where people are coming from/make better votes.

[Raskolnikov]

I mean I like to powercase medium targets as scum, if you're just looking for things to make a case on it's a lot easier, gets you townread and you get to lynch some of the more reasonable or actually decent players as well if you succeed

[Raskolnikov]

If you think NM/ZZZX are scum then why are you voting me? From your waffling I only see these reasons from your scumread on me:

- I haven't changed my theory of why you're scum.
- I haven't done research. How is that AI?

Your scum read makes no sense and this is your second OMGUS. If you're town then be more towny and analyse the wagon on you/try to see where people are coming from/make better votes.

the thing is usually I see some level of second guessing by now even if someone overall still thinks the same way

[Raskolnikov]

VOTE: N_M
IDK if revoting this even does anything but I guess everyone kinda does townread cheeky, if I'm not around at any point keep in my mind what I said though.

[Raskolnikov]

My lynch preference looks something like N_M > Cheeky > ZZZX > Chris (Ico's not actually so bad tbh)

Would do ZZ too or compromise on chris if its over me btw

[Raskolnikov]

Just don't have reasons for lynching nm or zzzx or chris, but that's because they're so low-content.

You don't even lean on the tone or anything?

[CheekyTeeky]

If you think NM/ZZZX are scum then why are you voting me? From your waffling I only see these reasons from your scumread on me:

- I haven't changed my theory of why you're scum.
- I haven't done research. How is that AI?

Your scum read makes no sense and this is your second OMGUS. If you're town then be more towny and analyse the wagon on you/try to see where people are coming from/make better votes.

the thing is usually I see some level of second guessing by now even if someone overall still thinks the same way

You mean how I said I don't know if NM is town but the whole situation is fishy af?

[Raskolnikov]

that's like moonlogic though. would you think any d1 wagon on a lurkish slot is fishy af? would you never consider lynching a lurkish slot d1 in general? I don't know how you make the leap from a possibility to a probability

[Raskolnikov]

I pretty much never hesitate lynching these kinds of slots or even speculating entire scumteams out of either nulls or nullscums ever since my like most memorable newbie had both scum flake and replace out and town were chasing chickens the whole time

[Raskolnikov]

actually I literally joined this game because I thought the rule restriction would mean less chance of this kind of thing

there's also a thing I've seen from you this game which is draw a certain false equivalence and call me a hypocrite here, the problem with that being although I haven't been as active or pushing as earlier I still think I've given by far enough content this game for anyone to judge my slot on. But as I said earlier it's not even as simple as even that either.

[Raskolnikov]

If N_M is a town led wagon who is scum cheeky?

[CheekyTeeky]

that's like moonlogic though. would you think any d1 wagon on a lurkish slot is fishy af? would you never consider lynching a lurkish slot d1 in general? I don't know how you make the leap from a possibility to a probability

It was an initial impression and when I read the game the whole wagon and the behavior was fishy especially yours. You can discredit my read all you want but I've been clear about how and what I think.

[CheekyTeeky]

If N_M is a town led wagon who is scum cheeky?

If? Don't you mean since? I'm not playing. If it turns out that way I'll rethink then.

[Raskolnikov]

Given it's wrong (or fake), it should be discredited.

[Raskolnikov]

If N_M is a town led wagon who is scum cheeky?

If? Don't you mean since? I'm not playing. If it turns out that way I'll rethink then.

Really?

[Raskolnikov]

@GL, Bujaber, Ico, etc

ordered list of lynch prefs like 419 please

[GreenLiquid]

Rask looks like eager town to me.

The posts quoted here are literally the worst possible ones for making this read. This feels like a way-too-lazy LAMIST post.

I'm kind of offended that you think I'd be so thuggish in my chainsaw defense of my scum buddy. I could tell you reasons why that makes no sense but it all boils down to WIFOM.

Slightly pinged by this. I'm not sure whether this is innocuous or is AtE + defensiveness to try to get me to drop the pos. association.

I don't like Lovebird's progression from 383 to 387 and 389 to 409 and 411. That's way too fast of a turnaround from a Raskie town read to an L-1 vote, and the timing is convenient given the wagon's momentum.

397 - 399 also stick out to me as overly-defensive, but I might be confbiasing off my read here.

@GL, Bujaber, Ico, etc

ordered list of lynch prefs like 419 please

BuJaber > Lovebird = Christopher >> Not_Mafia
I think of these, Christopher is the most realistic lynch and I'd like people who are scum reading elsewhere to take a second look at his ISO.

My town read on Raskie is wavering but I still think he's a bad lynch for today. For one thing, he was an early town read and I don't feel pinged enough by him to totally erase that. Also, at this point the core of the case against him is that he's pushing low activity slots and seemingly not developing scum reads based on content, which I'd expect a scumhunting player to have done by now. This is true, but as he points out (while this is admittedly WIFOM), he could have fabricated reads as scum easily enough and probably could have avoided this wagon that way. It seems to me like his overall trajectory thus far makes more sense coming from town!Raskie than scum!Raskie, because scum!Raskie could have relatively easily ended his suffering earlier by faking a read.

That said, there have been a couple of things bugging me and wearing down my read lately:

VOTE: Cheeky
feeling either with n_m or, if I'm wrong on n_m scum who knows n_m is town tbh

A white knight play from Cheeky is kind of plausible, but this vote switch seems way too convenient for the situation. It doesn't divest Raskie from his read on Not_Mafia, it lets him counter-vote the person pushing him the hardest, and I see potential for it to be contrived: if he's scum, I would bet that the bit after the comma was added when he realized that voting Cheeky on associative grounds instead of staying on the stronger read of the two was inconsistent, and he needed something else to cover for the switch.

Also, this post caught my interest:

the thing is, I've been in this situation before and every time just ending and seeing the flip made the game interesting again otherwise I'd have considered replacing or something (well and the game was explicitly dont replace)

This potentially contextualizes the vote switch onto Cheeky, but IMO Not_Mafia and ZZZX would be the

least

interesting slots to flip right now. A scum!Not_Mafia flip points towards scum!Cheeky but doesn't do much of anything else other than vindicate Raskie, and I have no idea what a ZZZX flip either way would indicate about the game at all. Actually, let me put it like this: Rask, if by some magic you got your way and Not_Mafia were lynched right now, who would you be suspecting tomorrow if he flipped scum? Who if he flipped town? You already suspect Cheeky, so in my opinion if your answer to either question is Cheeky, I don't see how that changes your view of the game state at all.

I get what you mean about Cheeky though because I do feel some paranoia about Cheeky, especially because she's voting alongside two of my scum reads and a slot that hasn't caught up to the current state of the game yet. But scum often avoid voting together so perhaps that feeling is mistaken.

@ZZZX -- I am interested to know if your read of Raskie changes at all after your full catch-up.

[CheekyTeeky]

he was an early town read and I don't feel pinged enough by him to totally erase that.

Sorry if I'm making you repeat yourself but can you go over your rask read progression from the start?

[CheekyTeeky]

It seems to me like his overall trajectory thus far makes more sense coming from town!Raskie than scum!Raskie, because scum!Raskie could have relatively easily ended his suffering earlier by faking a read.

I don't get how you can argue for a town rask but you can't see how silly it would be for a scum me to come into this game disagreeing with everyone and pushing for people to scum hunt. Best strat would've been for me to come in quietly and follow everyone else's reads even if that meant bussing my scum buddy. Yes it's WIFOM but you're using that to argue for town rask.

[Iconeum]

Everyone should read GL's 443, and then reread it again. It's just a great post.
Lovebird is so obviously scum it's ridiculous.

Read especially the part about the read evolution from town to an L-1 vote.
Before that, I also called out his vote in 203, his vote in 198. Naked L-1 vote on NM. This was after being prodded. He also failed to mention that was an L-1 vote.

VOTE: lovebird


If you agree with this and agree with GL's read on love, you should be voting lovebird.
This lynch is so much better then Rask's or NM's...

[CheekyTeeky]

Everyone should read GL's 443, and then reread it again. It's just a great post.
Lovebird is so obviously scum it's ridiculous.

Read especially the part about the read evolution from town to an L-1 vote.
Before that, I also called out his vote in 203, his vote in 198. Naked L-1 vote on NM. This was after being prodded. He also failed to mention that was an L-1 vote.

VOTE: lovebird


If you agree with this and agree with GL's read on love, you should be voting lovebird.
This lynch is so much better then Rask's or NM's...

Why does this feel like you're just upset about Lovebird for scumreading you? He mentions other scum reads too, with Love like 3rd in priority.

Your read progression on Bu was also pretty rubbish.

[Iconeum]

No. I'm not townreading Buj, but there is little to gain in continuing down that track.

If you think this is an OMGUS reaction from me, that means you disagree with what I wrote on him? Do you disagree with the GL lovebird scumread as well?

[Iconeum]

If you think I'm OMGUS'ing lovebird here, is that AI?
What do you think was rubbish about my read progression? Maybe you can call the scumread on how he is playing bad, I could understand that.

I'm not letting you sidetrack this away from lovebird, though