Open 720: NOIR (GAME OVER)

[pinturicchio]

I'm not scumreading him, but I do think his post was ugly. Why are you townreading him tho? I would say he's a null at best

[MOMOMEN]

Why

first off, being too easy isn't necessarily a good foundation to start your read off with. saying you wouldn't discount him is super wishy washy and makes you come across as bad, so you should take a firm stance next time you want to make a read like that. even firmly null is better than fence sitting regardless of if you're wolf or town.

I'm not scumreading him, but I do think his post was ugly. Why are you townreading him tho? I would say he's a null at best

i seriously doubt scum korina ever plays like that here.

[pinturicchio]

I'm not scumreading him, but I do think his post was ugly. Why are you townreading him tho? I would say he's a null at best

i seriously doubt scum korina ever plays like that here.

Do you mean you have a metaread on him, or are you implying that any scum would play like that? Have you played with Korina before?

[MOMOMEN]

I'm not scumreading him, but I do think his post was ugly. Why are you townreading him tho? I would say he's a null at best

i seriously doubt scum korina ever plays like that here.

Do you mean you have a metaread on him, or are you implying that any scum would play like that? Have you played with Korina before?

i have a soulread on him

[pinturicchio]

I'm rather new to the site... What's a soulread? Or are you messing around?

[the worst]

Why

first off, being too easy isn't necessarily a good foundation to start your read off with. saying you wouldn't discount him is super wishy washy and makes you come across as bad, so you should take a firm stance next time you want to make a read like that. even firmly null is better than fence sitting regardless of if you're wolf or town.

Fair and duly noted. I'm bad for fencesitting people I don't have a strong read one way or the other one.

Soulread is fair.

[mutantdevle]

Sorry I don't really know if the name of that game was Stack the Deck, it's the game that the worst linked here where Dino was moderator and NM was scum

Oh yes, because I totally wasn't over explaining in that game...

Spoiler: Trump's wet dream

Sleep + college all day = 130+ posts to catch up on.

VOTE: not mafia

We can not let him get to endgame

Ik this is RVS but I would legitimately be on board to policy lynch N_M day 1.

I've never been scum

I thought every game was your scum game?

I don't want to rock the boat this game, so I'm not going to vote.

This post is ironic considering what came after.

VOTE: not mafia

We can not let him get to endgame

Mind elaborating on this?

I'm assuming she is referring to how N_M lost town the game by voting me in a 2v1 MYLO in a game we just finished at the VERY START of the day. No discussion, just a vote; followed by Almost50 hammering as the SK. It was both funny and quite frustrating. But in general, N_M is just a liability. He likes to lol hammer, barely contributes anything meaningful and is just generally trolly. He is either scum, going to be mislynched or is going to fuck us up endgame. Personally, N_M is one of those players that I am always going to be willing to wagon unless they either claim a PR or a confirmed town.

I am voting them. That’s the point.
Why is it hard for you to consider a L-1 a hammer Vote?

I'm not a fan of this playstyle but I can accept and deal with it. I would be willing to adjust my vote with consideration that each of those wagons requires 1 less vote to be lynched if you are not already on them. I will not, however, hold others to the same standard. I will not treat any L-1 voter as though they have just hammered and will likely consider you accountable for that (though this may depend on the situation).

I want to see more content from A50.

No you don't! I'm a bad guy.

I listen to Bob Geldof, watch Brian Gleeson & laugh at the jokes of Brad Garrett. (That's a yuckie combination indeed, Paddy!)

I'll do a quick catch up, but I don't think anyone said anything remarkably AI so far (up to this post I'm responding to)

This feels like a traitor claim.

Why?

Bolded

I'm in agreement with this. I can definitely see this being A50 failing to subtly hint his role. I'm going to view A50 in a biasedly negative way for the duration of this game and I expect him to rise no higher than a scum lean for me.

Also, if I was Mafia (main team) my picks would've been BP+RC+RECRUIT TRAITOR. Why would I want a 3rd member WHO KNOW WHOM THE OTHER TWO ARE out there with no coordination?

This statement means nothing since you are accused of being the traitor and not part of the main team. Furthermore, again telling us what you would have chosen also means nothing. We don't know the setup. For all we know, what you would have chosen could very well be the setup. The only time this would hold any ground would be if we had already caught scum. And since this entire post seems to consist of pure thirst for town cred, I think we just have.

Oh boy I haven't been called vi in years.

Lucky, I get called VI almost every game. I'm starting to think it might be true

VOTE: mutantdevle
His sole contribution being to vote on "screenplay" in RVS, causing my RVS vote on him... and he hasn't appeared since, so this vote is for his lurking.

Yeah, sorry about that. My explanation of that is at the top of the thread. I can assure you, I am no lurker. My meta can be sure to prove that.

The post you referred to as being a Traitor claim was actually a BodyGuard strong crumb. Bad Guy, Bob Geldof, Brian Gleeson, Brad Garrett. Brad Garrett isn't even Irish to the best of my knowledge.

I almost believe this until:

VOTE: Almost50 - that BG-claim was always there as a backup-strat.
He is the traitor and tried to crumb it - trusting my gut here.

I feel like this is probably much more likely.

plus I wasn't under any real pressure to crumb and claim like that.

This sentence is scummy IMO. No one was saying you were under pressure to crumb. Also, if there was no reason for you to crumb or claim, why did you? You have literally no reason to crumb BG at all. It's not a role that needs to crumb. Why did you crumb? The only reason someone would make this kind of crumb would be for town cred. Only scum are that thirsty for town cred.



I thought that Almost was just going to sit in my scum lean pile all game due to the potential traitor crumb. However, the scummy BG crumb is enough to make me vote for him since he had NO REASON to crumb BG. Crumbs that involve hiding the letters or words in the post are designed not to be seen until pointed out by the crumber. This is only done in anticipation of having to defend yourself and gain town cred. Not only did Almost NOT need to rectify himself with town cred at the time of this post but BG is also a role that is best not known to anyone and doesn't need to be crumbed nor claimed.

VOTE: Almost50



Sorry about the wall. These would have been individual posts but obviously I was not around to make them. Please don't have a fit over it Elmo <3

VOTE: mutant

This is even more scummy than Una's since mutant did play me twice already (finished games).

1. This vote is OMGUS.
2. You haven't really mentioned a reason why Una's post was scummy other than that they are bad. So the fact that my post, in which I outline logical reasons as to why your claim is scummy, can be scummier makes literally no sense.
3. We have only played 1 game together, in which you were scum. (Unless I'm being completely stupid here).
4. I fail to see how the number of games we have played together would relate to how scummy my post looks anyway.
5. Instead of dodging my questions and ignoring my thoughts on you, how about you answer those questions and justify why you would crumb BG?

Bodyguards do not need to crumb; it is not an investigative role. Claiming bodyguard has no benefits to the town. The type of crumb you did is almost impossible to notice unless pointed out. This means the only purpose of it is to receive town cred at any time of your choosing. This is only done when you anticipate being scum read. You had no reason to think that if that post wasn't intended to be a traitor wink to your scum buddies.

Had there been no crumb and you role claimed with a wagon on you then I would have believed you. But in its current state, your claim just screams desperate scum.

So, I'm "desperate" because "there's no wagon me"?? Explain how the claim works from a "desperate scum" when you ALSO acknowledge there has not been a wagon on me.

There was no wagon on you when you made the crumb. A wagon had since started to build on you after it was pointed out that something you said in the post could be a traitor soft claim. That is my point. Obviously, the wagon has currently gone no further than that. If you truly are the BG, then the claim was a TERRIBLE idea. You clearly claimed just to shut down the building wagon which is one of the things that I consider as panicky rather than waiting until you were at L-2 or L-1 to claim which is a more rational thing to do. If this had occurred later in the day then perhaps your crumb would be more believable. Your crumb was a long-term plan to confirm yourself if needed but you have jumped the gun and used it in the short-term. It just doesn't add up to me.

@mutant: I don't care about your alignment right now (in this post), but you're assuming I play the same way as someone who had only joined the site 3 months ago (actually 2-3 days later than 3 months ago, but whatever). Look at my stats and tell me if Scum!me could ever be caught by Town!you (assuming you are Town ONLY for the sake of the argument) on D1.

I'm assuming the first part of this is a cheap shot at the amount of time I've been on this site? I've actually been playing mafia for 6-7 months now but my months before joining this site was spent on a site that only ever has 72 hours days and isn't taken too seriously which results in half the town lurking and only 3 pages worth of posts per game day. I'm still in adjustment from the culture there to here. I also do not believe registration time means much. You can nail it on your first game (my most sucessful game was actually my first ever one on that other site) and even the strongest of veterans can fail hard at times. Despite your impressive stats, you are not exempt from this. You've lost games in the past and you can certainly lose games and make mistakes again. So yes, there is every chance town me could catch scum you. I wouldn't exactly call this my catch though if you are scum. I didn't see the potential of your post being a traitor soft claim until it was pointed out and I believed your BG claim until someone pointed out the crumb could have been planted as a backup. Had neither of those things happened scum you would have fooled me easily. You also forget that I almost caught you last game. Had anyone but N_M made it to that 2v1 I would have been able to at least get a word in about why I thought you were the SK (even if some of the logic was wrong). We won't ever know if I'd be able to convince the other person of your guilt but the point is that I was thinking along the right lines. Of course, just because I was right then it doesn't mean I am right now. But it certainly refutes the idea that I am not good enough to see through you. As far as I am concerned with our last game, you did deserve the victory as you would have won anyway had there been no mod error and your kill on Fitz went through.

My advice is this: IF you're Town, back off NOW (and save yourself the embarrassment). If you're Scum though, I'm not about to tell you how to improve your Scum play.

You have no right to give me any advice on how to play until you have flipped or the game has ended. Until then, your words have no meaning. Sure if your town your words have meaning but for all I know you are scum trying to manipulate me. This is, after all, a game of manipulation. There will be no embarrasment if I am wrong. Everyone is wrong at times in this game. I've been wrong before. I'll be wrong again. And if I am wrong now, then I appologise. But until you give me reason to believe I am wrong, I am not going to assume I am wrong. I'd appreciate it if, instead of insulting my play, you focused more on refuting my points and showing me how I am wrong rather than telling me I am wrong. Because that way, I am prepared to listen.

@Everyone: I want mutant lynched today. If he flips Mafia it is proof enough for me that Mafia actually DID recruit their Traitor already, so the RC can actually catch the "Goon" they are assigned to catch.

You probably don't believe this but I'm not going to flip scum. You, at the very least, have to think about what that would mean. You'd have to lead the town to lynch the other 2 that are on your wagon in search of proof for this theory. If you do get me lynched, I reccomend not doing that and instead going after people you think are legitamately scummy rather than OMGUSing the people that are hesistant to believe your claim. If the people you scum read are also currently on your wagon then that's just a bonus.

so the RC can actually catch the "Goon" they are assigned to catch.

RC? As in Role Cop? You mean Goon Cop (GC) right?

Like what does 'until' mean? You wouldn't have had a problem with it if Una didn't say he thought he was a traitor?

Correct. I believed the BG claim until the idea that the crumb was set as a backup for if his traitor soft claim was too obvious was put into my head. From there, I thought about that idea and it made more sense to me.

So, are you arguing that only investigative roles can/should crumb? Like are you saying that if he did the exact same thing except claiming Goon Cop instead of BG you would have been fine accepting it?

I wouldn't be okay with it in this context. He wouldn't be crumbing his results, he'd be crumbing his role. Crumbing a role doesn't make sense to me unless you expect to have to role claim. There was nothing at the time that would suggest that he would need to do this. Hence, the crumb makes no sense to me as it was unwarrented.

I don't really understand the bolded - you're arguing that he anticipated being scumread so he decided to crumb BG and at the same time crumb traitor? Like why make the traitor crumb at all just then which could easily backfire on him? Does this theory still hold if he was groupscum and not a traitor?

Of course the theory wouldn't hold any ground if he was group scum. But if we knew he was group scum then we need not have this discussion What I'm arguing is that Almost is the traitor. As a result, he soft claimed the idea that he was a "bad guy" in the hopes the group scum would pick up on it. However, he knew there was a chance that town members would pick up on it and argue that he was the traitor. So, to counteract that, he also crumbed BG so that he could claim that if he needed to.

Why are you still voting him ...?

Because I am under the impression he is the traitor. Just because scum would join the wagon if they knew he was town doesn't mean I can't join the wagon if I think he is scum.

I don't get it. Why is he desperate scum? Why was he so desperate at the time that he felt the need to set all of this up?

The way I am phrasing it probably isn't the best way to be honest and I'm probably overusing the word desperate. He wasn't desperate at the time he set this up. But if he is indeed scum, then it means his backup plan to claim BG has failed (at least it has in regards to those of us on his wagon). Panicky or nervous would probably be a better word than desperate tbh. His reactions to both my own and Una's accusations feels like he's not too sure what to do. His vote on me is pure OMGUS and based on nothing more than his belief that I am wrong (which would be his belief as either allignment). In general, he is coming across as caught and trying to find a way out.

As for you being wrong, how am I supposed to convince you? You say the crumb was a long-term plan and I say it wasn't. All you need to do is wait until I flip to know you're wrong.

And YES, everybody's can be wrong, but not everybody is so naive at it. You acknowledge I'm good at being Scum (good enough o have deserved the win as the lone SK), but you're accusing me of making a BASIC mistake in my play. Why would I ever signal myself out to my proposed team if I wasn't even suspected before that point? You have it all backwards. If I was a Traitor I would have waited to see if a wagon ever formed on me before I tried to wave my hand on my friends to help me out. Otherwise, I would have just stayed put. The Traitor -after all- has a 1-shot BP, so it's not like my proposed Scum team could accidentally kill me.

But GOOD JOB at making me second guess my SR on you.

When it comes to convincing me, I'm not too sure what you can do. That's kinda your problem :3 It might not be a case of convincing me that your innocent but rather convincing me to vote someone scummier (since there's the possibility you're a PR that doesn't strike me as too hard). I'm not willing to let you live past day 3 though unless something major happens that makes you confirmed town during that time. As for the basic mistake, basic mistakes are the most common mistakes that professionals make. Correct!me would mean that you felt confident in your backup BG claim and expected that to work (and hence explains your shakey actions in your surprise that it didn't for at least 2 of us).




Just to clarify something, is this style of claim and crumbing common on this site? I have only ever seen it done twice (once on this site, once on the other I used to play) and on both occasions the crumb was by caught scum. So I'm not sure if I'm being anecdotally biased here.

Mutant, why aren't you voting?

I don't typically vote unless it is for pressure, I am sure of my read, or time is running out. When time gets low I always vote for my strongest wagoned scum read. I apologise for barely being useful today. I haven't been putting a lot of thought into the game due to irl stuff. I'm usually far more active and my posts are usually chunky. It's very unlike me to not have a solid reads list down by now. It's honestly surprised me that no one has picked up on my way more active meta. I've been intending to reread the entire thread + iso people + analyse posts + make cases and finally post a reads list but I just haven't gotten around to it. I will do that eventually though but I'm beginning to think I'd have to wait until day 2 for that. Hopefully, I will get it done on Tuesday but if I fail that I'd try for Thursday and if not I will try to get in done during N1. I give no promises for any of this though.

Mutant has
A) jumped on A50 sheeping Una: Defence: not heavily invested into the game

That was not sheeping. I added my own opinions, thoughts and explained my own thinking. If I was sheeping I would simply post a simple post with the general meaning of "I agree" and had been done with it. I made pushes against A50 and backed off when this push had both nothing left to gain and nowhere to go in terms of a wagon. And my own acknowledgement of not presently being very interested in the game was not a defence of my posts against A50. Almost all the posts I have made day 1 were posted with a lack of full interest (including this one). You will see what I mean when I start posting more frequently and with higher scum hunting quality. I stand by what I said about A50, I still think it's plausible he is scum and I would definitely consider him a scum read if not for the claim which is self-resolving.

B) defended srceen calling him an easy lynch and naturally scummy, THEN saying he should be lynched even though he is not confident srceen is scum. In hindsight of my town read, SCUMMY as it is good to put pressure and perhaps a lynch onto srceen without being on the wagon

I never said he

should

be lynched. I said:

if he's going to get mislynched eventually then we may as well get it over with

I never said I think he IS scum nor do I advocate for any wagon or any pressure. Saying that I think he should be lynched is a blatant misrepresentation of my opinion. If anything, I describe him as a mislynch. I think we can all agree that the later during the game a mislynch happens the more damaging it is since the stakes are higher and there is more pressure.

C) posted intent to hammer Srceen "if only for the claim" --> very scummy IMO. PR hunting (srceen, that is what real PR hunting looks like)

I believed that him saying he wouldn't claim until there was intent was a waste of time. It also posed the risk that someone would lolhammer without the claim. My purpose of stating intent was to cut the crap and save some time in getting the claim. I'm under the impression that it's standard practice to claim at L-1 is it not?

D) a few posts later town reading srceen, even though you were "serious" about the intent. To seriously intend to hammer you are normally convinced someone is scum, why did you flip your opinion, I did not see a reason? You seem a bit wavery on screen going from calling it a sheep wagon to posting intent to hammer then town reading. Scummy IMO

The intent to hammer was 100% purely for the claim. Has he claimed immediately, there would have been no intent. Because I don't explicitly scum read him. This entire game he has been in my "town lean but needs a closer analysis as so many people scum read him" pile. As part of my catchup, I intend to look into him a bit more to see if I agree with the town's opinion that he's scummy scum. But as I am not properly invested in the game yet, I am yet to do that. The intent was 'serious' in the way that if he refused to claim after my intent I WOULD have followed it up with a hammer. I was barely around at the time so there was a good chance I wouldn't be taken seriously. I wanted to make it clear that I mean what I say and I don't make empty threats. You might want to remember that for later.

E) supposedly set up a50 for a lynch, not sure how I feel about this right now

What do you mean 'supposedly'? As in you don't actually know? And then, either way, you don't know what you feel about it. This is a list of criticisms against me right? So why is this pointless statement here that you aren't even certain about how valid it is?

F) Joking well after RVS is over causing votes, wtf?

So it's

my

fault that

someone else

is basing their vote on a joke I made? Shouldn't you be criticising them instead for such a weak vote? It doesn't hurt to make jokes you know, plenty of people have been doing it and I don't see you attacking them for making jokes after RVS. If you ever role claim as the goon cop then I'd definitely believe it since clearly you are the fun police.

I'm maybe 60% scum

Omg, I think this might be a traitor crumb in disguise.

Why did my role matter if you were not going to hammer anyway?

I believed that him saying he wouldn't claim until there was intent was a waste of time.

So you declared intent to hammer but you didn't mean it because you didn't scumread him but you would've done it if he didn't claim even though you didn't scumread him

Is his defence like.... an epic bluff or a scumclaim?

I would have hammered because I don't town read him enough to consider it worth it to go out of my way to keep him alive. My most common position on people I don't believe are scum is the hammer. I don't get why it's so hard to understand I would only hammer if he refused to claim thereafter anyway. You claim at L-1, that's my opinion. At the very least, you claim a PR you don't want to reveal.

Sure, but you had declared an intent to hammer with a timeframe, and the wagon was kinda fizzling a bit by that point as people were focusing on Jay/Creature. Given that interest it would have been suspicious to hammer at that point.

I heavily disagree with this statement.

It seems even more dangerous to get another claim day 1, though.

So... you're saying we should definitely lynch within the 3 people who have already claimed? This seems like you are trying to get us to lynch screen here. We have a claimed BG, roleblocker and VT. If we HAD to lynch out of those 3, literally everyone would go for the VT.

So, which was it? Like can you clarify what your read on him was in 321, and also what your read was when you posted intent?

I don't mean 'this entire game' as literally as you are taking it. Obviously, I didn't have this view before he has even posted. On both occasions, and even now, my read is a weird mixture of null and town lean, both at the same time in a kinda way. My impression/memory of his post yields town lean, but everyone else's scum accusations towards him and the natural kinda scummy-ness in his tone makes me null read him until I reread the entire thread.

I don't really get why your willingness to hammer was independent of reads but instead based on whether or not he claimed. Like I'm not sure why the bolded didn't apply to the first scenario?

Independent of reads because ALL my reads are currently weak due to not being invested in the game yet. I had said I'd hammer if there was no claim and I would have followed to prove that my words are not empty.

So, like, what's the point of stating intent in order to make him claimm? You say you weren't explicitly PR fishing ... but the more VT claims that there are the easier it is for scum to PoE who the PRs might be. No matter what he claimed, you helped scum out by forcing him to do so.

He should have claimed anyway. He was at L-1. He said he'd claim with intent, there is no way someone else wouldn't have placed intent if I had not, by getting the intent out of the way everything happens faster and we waste less time.

Has been a busy and emotional last few days for me which is largely why I have been uninterested in this game. That is over now (well not over but I don't have to put time into anything anymore) so from now on I plan to be more active and productive in this game. I did plan to complete the re-read and stuff that I've been saying I'd do for a while now tomorrow but then I saw that I was at L-1...

I am a Vanilla Townie. You will find that I crumbed that. Not sure where, but I'm sure you could probably find a post where 2 words next to each other start with V and T respectively.

Now here's the thing, I don't want to do extensive catch up on the game and waste my time if y'all are just going to lynch me. As such, I won't be doing that unless the bandwagon on me dies down a bit.

My assumption right now is that I am to be lynched. We have had enough wagons today and it's about time one of them went somewhere. It's a shame really because I was looking forward to playing with NSG again now that I have more experience from our last game. As such, I believe replying to accusations of "you're scum" with "no I'm not" is a waste of time and instead I will use the little time I have to properly state my reads (prior to this post I simply hint them) and say some things to steer town in the right direction for day 2.


Reads list:

Town

Espeonage - I agree with a lot of what he says.
Sky_Paladin - Again, I really like the things he has been saying and the scum hunting comes across as town.

Town Lean

Srceenplay - I think I've said enough about Screen in this game tbh.
northsidegal - Liked the entrance, definitely seems like she is scum hunting from the perspective of someone who doesn't know who scum are.

Null

Not_Mafia - If he isn't vig killed tonight then policy lynch him tomorrow. Scum isn't going to kill someone who is such a MYLO threat.
JaydragonKing - Has said a lot but doesn't stand out.

Scum Lean

the worst - Not entirely convinced he is scum, but if he is then one of his partners is skitter30.
skitter30 - I could honestly believe that worst and skitter are the same person in disguise.
Montosh - Are you doing anything?

Scum

Almost - I'm tempted to say I don't actually believe his BG and had there not been one I'd have been looking to tunnel him. But since it's self-resolving, lynch him day 3 when you find he isn't dying.
legoboyvdlp - My top scum read off the top of my head. I plan to REALLY look into him if I get a chance to do my catchup. I feel like he is giving an illusion of helping without actually adding much substance.
UnaBombaH - Scumm and slightly opportunistic IMO.


Something I just want to say is be cautious of people pushing the traitor hunting agenda. There is no guarantee there is a traitor and only the scum will know the answer to this. Out of all the scum options to pick, traitor is probably the most likely one that scum would risk having another PR over. But still, some people insisting a traitor really exists could be scum trying to make people focus less on hunting by association.


Also, this isn't the first time I've been put to L-1 for allegedly role fishing when I really wasn't intending to. And as it turns out, scum founded that wagon. So, y'know, just sayin'. I've found that history does tend to repeat itself.


If y'all are going to lynch me then I'd appreciate it being done in the next 16 hours. I don't think I have anything to add if the phase turns to twilight and I have time to do my catchup tomorrow but ideally want to know if it is worth it by the time I wake up.

[mutantdevle]

what would you expect town!me to react with given my activity this game?

To be fair, given how active you are, I feel like you would be likely to address everything that goes on the thread. It is kinda odd that you seemed to ignore the pressure on you.

[mutantdevle]

as I said before I'm just assuming Alonzo is going somewhere here because his catchup post is dreadful

Il stick with you. You are a better Lynch than Notmafia today.

And tomorrow.

I don't think you should be to so quick to write off N_M as an early lynch candidate. If there's no vig in the game, I'm definitely going to be all for his lynch tomorrow. You either kill off shit posters early or let them live until endgame - and I don't really want N_M in the endgame.

[MOMOMEN]

I dont really want u in the endgame

[mutantdevle]

Ugh, the whole interactions with Alonzo on page <26 is making my brain hurt but it still makes me lose a little confidence in the worst. Sando is looking good from it though.

I get the feeling that there's 1 scum in the worst and Alonzo though.

[mutantdevle]

Ceejay is adorable but unfortunately could be scum

Sando I owe you a beer

I agree.

An update on my previous post is that if either Ceejay or Alonso flip scum I think the worst would be town based on general interactions (Alonso recently and Ceejay throughout the thread). Alonso's and Ceejay's flips won't say much about each other though.

[mutantdevle]

In other news....devle why did you roll scum?! I like you! So unfair.

What makes you think I'm scum?

Last time we played you were obvtown as shit to me WHILE being mislynched. Like you took stances and explained yourself well as I recall it, the haters just rebutted beautifully and town were of inconsistent quality

Here it feels like youre trying to avoid taking stances or explain yourself. IIOA vibe from substanceposts. If this is just my hungover self being a mess please show me where I'm wrong.

Whats going on from your POV here devle cos this just seems grim to me.
Seems like 'throw shit and if it sticks great! ..... If not.. well... reasons'

Assuming this is a question for me:

I never really read this comment as a scummy reason to scum read me. I just though he was another player trying to read me based on a certain thing I did in a certain way in a certain game. I've had a fair few players expect me to replicate my exact playstyle each time when I'm a little more varied than that. I assumed this was just another example of that.

[mutantdevle]

Actually, you don't have to answer, this post is bleeding town (676)

I disagree that you should be giving Townie points for being "logical." Scum can make cases on people too, and in fact, I'd say more often than not Scum default to being rational and Town default to being unsound/chaotic/unknowledgeable/ignorant/doubtful. The reason for this is simple: Town are automatically in a place filled with chaos while Scum are in a place of order.

I translate 676 as the following, and it reads very townie to me:

Okay, yeah, I see what you're saying.

But I maintain that in ideal world, things would be such that I would be right!

And even if you're right, his reaction would be bad in that scenario, too!

And now I'm frustrated that I've come all the way down this rabbit hole and oxy is either bad!scum or bad!town but it's his bad play that got me into this mess

so I'm going to keep voting him regardless

And you could be right about him being terribad!town so I don't want to continue arguing with you about his alignment

But people better step the fuck off with the unsubstantiated insults

^Close enough

I really like Sando's reaction here.

[mutantdevle]

It's actually a good case for a playstyle, and yeah, it's my playstyle except I hadn't really thought consciously about fighting off TR's I don't like.

I was really just in a shitty mood, and I felt like he was coming at me, so I told him his read was shit instead of trying to be diplomatic.

Again, I like this reaction. I don't think scum would brush off someone defending them like this.

[mutantdevle]

Doesn't mean that you weren't doing it unconsciously.

This makes me feel uncomfortable because it feels like you are trying too hard to defend him.

[mutantdevle]

But beyond that, on reflection the interaction with mutant was off. At the time it made sense, but as mutant pointed out, there's really no need to vote-pressure him. Anyone properly looking at mutant watched the mutant/sando/duckling interaction and would realise that all you had to be was direct and you'd get an answer to your question. Felt like the vote was an attempt to look like he's doing something and that if he didn't vote he'd be seen as wishy washy and uncommitted.

Felt like a player realising they're not keeping up with the game and seeking to show that they're doing something. Didn't feel like a genuine effort from him.

I like this observation. I was just passing him off as someone who didn't really understand me but now I can see there could be scum motivation behind his play there.

[mutantdevle]

Though something to note is that the only time I have really pressure voted someone for something like this was indeed to look busy and seem like I was using my vote. I was town on those occasions though. However, I'm not sure if that's just because I'm the kind of player that doesn't tend to throw their vote around too much.

[mutantdevle]

I've always disagreed with Sando's Oxy read but I'm finding Sando more agreeable in his argument with Quick in and around the page 29 area.

[mutantdevle]

I don't like Momo's entrance. Not because they call me scum in it but because they start with the typical WIFOM of "glad we're not scum, lol!" and then proceed to be very aggressive.

That's probably a playstyle thing more than anything AI indicative though. But they strike me as a player that I'm going to find inherently scummy and struggle to sort :/

[MOMOMEN]

:/

[mutantdevle]

if i just called you scum or unsorted, lost a link of ur town and wolf game or else ill fucking tunnel you into the ground.

Town:
1 2 3 4 5 6

Scum:
1 2

Each from most recent to least recent.

[mutantdevle]

i'll know each of u so well i'll be whispering sweet nothings into ur ear while feeding u chocolate strawberries.

It appears you already know me

[mutantdevle]

@quick I've never played with a hydra before. Any advice on dealing with them? Like just treat them like anyone else?

For the most part, you do treat them like anyone else except sometimes you can find yourself reading each head differently.

Why did you specifically ask for Quick's advice on this?

[mutantdevle]

Hm?

So duckling is the lynch today, then.

I agree with what you imply here. It's really scummy and awkward the way the worst is brushing off these accusations.

It kinda reminds me of when someone makes a joke about you being gay and you don't deny it because you don't want to lie to them but you don't want to come out yet either so instead you just laugh.