Gunner Mafia [Endgame]

[the worst]

VOTE: Srceenplay this is a good sheep. sorry Nero.

Does anyone have decent meta knowledge of Grey? Kinda feeling like the last few pages should be telling in some way or another.

[Hopkirk]

Screen isn't a townread anymore Thor.
Phone posting is hard.

Someone should meta me. I have a couple of obvious scumtells.

[the worst]

Screen isn't a townread anymore Thor.
Phone posting is hard.

Someone should meta me. I have a couple of obvious scumtells.

> aware of meta
> tells us to look for scumtells to prove towniness

....wat

[Mulch]

Votecount 1.55(3451)

GreyICE(8)

~ Nero Cain(222), Creature(294), Gorkington(229), Centipede Syndrome(219), Spiffeh(142), Chickadee(409), Hopkirk(203), Tchill13(95)

Srceenplay(5)

~ Thor665(72), Brian Skies(137), CheekyTeeky(155), Bins(110), The Worst(100)

Panopticon(2)

~ Ausuka(90), Srceenplay(72)

Hopkirk(2)

~ GreyICE(156), Panopticon(200)

Tchill13(1)

~ Beeboy(87)

Bins(1)

~ randomidget(190)

Players dead: MariaR

Not Voting (3): Town Gunner(0), Mafia Gunner(0), Brigand Vvulf(94)

With 20 alive it takes 11 to lynch.

Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2018-04-25 12:53:00)

[Hopkirk]

Screen isn't a townread anymore Thor.
Phone posting is hard.

Someone should meta me. I have a couple of obvious scumtells.

> aware of meta
> tells us to look for scumtells to prove towniness

....wat

Absence.

@Brian- preferably your thoughts.

[Creature]

Do we go the safe way or the high-risk-high-reward way?

[the worst]

Do we go the safe way or the high-risk-high-reward way?

Are you talkin srceen vs grey?

[CheekyTeeky]

Thor you're weirding me out. Just saying.

So is TChill no longer a thing then?

[the worst]

I have TCooled off on it.

Why is Thor weirding you out?

[Chickadee]

Chickadee slot is a crapper - quick wasn't great, but his replace out felt town. He realized no one was listening to him, and quit in frustration. So town. Unfortunately Chickadee is just dumb, but don't let stupidity get in the way of a town read on that slot.

Yea, you’re really making me not want to lynch you by calling me dumb.

I replaced Shad btw, not quick.

[CheekyTeeky]

Idk his enthusiasm is weird. I think I'm just too used to him being scum.

[Creature]

Do we go the safe way or the high-risk-high-reward way?

Are you talkin srceen vs grey?

Yep

[Creature]

Say hi to my school friends

[Creature]

If there's scum somewhere on the GreyICE wagon, it's most likely between Spiffeh and Hopkirk.

[Thor665]

Does anyone have decent meta knowledge of Grey? Kinda feeling like the last few pages should be telling in some way or another.

The last few pages have been the most toe-curling for me as far as what I would consider 'normal' Grey.
But it doesn't quite feel like I would expect either town nor scum Grey to do. I personally read it as him checking out of the game and just tossing insults for the most part.
I am not so excited to defend his wagon anymore, but I'd still rather lynch Srceenplay.

Screen isn't a townread anymore Thor.

Well, it's probably a good thing I never claimed that, and was simply talking about what you and I *did* do in this game.
Why are you wasting time with this?

Thor you're weirding me out. Just saying.

So is TChill no longer a thing then?

Your lack of sheep is weirding me out, so there's that.

TChill feels less optimal after the MariaR flip, no?

[the worst]

If there's scum somewhere on the GreyICE wagon, it's most likely between Spiffeh and Hopkirk.

Amen bro. I am starting to dislike the Grey wagon and like Thor's posting though. Should we wagon Hopkirk or Spiffeh instead?

Srceen is a decent compromise but I can't read him for shit while his activity is so low.

Also hi Creature's friends

[the worst]

The last few pages have been the most toe-curling for me as far as what I would consider 'normal' Grey.
But it doesn't quite feel like I would expect either town nor scum Grey to do. I personally read it as him checking out of the game and just tossing insults for the most part.
I am not so excited to defend his wagon anymore, but I'd still rather lynch Srceenplay.

Honestly my desire to lynch Grey because he's a scumSmurf has been replaced by this desire to lynch him because he's annoying me. I think I need to sheep better players than myself on him, but if there's scum on the wagon atm I don't get the feeling there's much towncred to be gained from their positions..

[CheekyTeeky]

Your lack of sheep is weirding me out, so there's that.

TChill feels less optimal after the MariaR flip, no?

Lack of sheep? Yes lack of sleep. I guess?

[the worst]

<unnecessary sheep joke>

[Thor665]

The last few pages have been the most toe-curling for me as far as what I would consider 'normal' Grey.
But it doesn't quite feel like I would expect either town nor scum Grey to do. I personally read it as him checking out of the game and just tossing insults for the most part.
I am not so excited to defend his wagon anymore, but I'd still rather lynch Srceenplay.

Honestly my desire to lynch Grey because he's a scumSmurf has been replaced by this desire to lynch him because he's annoying me. I think I need to sheep better players than myself on him, but if there's scum on the wagon atm I don't get the feeling there's much towncred to be gained from their positions..

Personal annoyance is always a thing to struggle with when it comes to scumreads, I know it's a giant bug-a-boo for me.
My inability to clearly describe why Grey is scum as presented by other people makes me think there is attitude votes on the wagon though.

Obviously the Grey wagon blew up so fast due to a combo of town and scum votes.
Grey was being a wanker, so I'd happily bet at least a handful of votes are town (and scum?) who just got annoyed at listening to him.
I don't have a good read on if the rest was just town being damn clever and spotting scum and other town noticing/scum rushing to bus or if it was just a 'hey, wagon of the moment' type thing. I like that we have the wagon info, and I can understand the desire/need to flip Grey at this point. I disagree that it's a particularly larger need than flipping a number of other slots.

I disagree with the idea of flipping Spiffeh or Hopkirk today.

[Gorkington]

ooooo heres a fun bit:

I recommend stopping this, because I have some respect for both Elli's reads and Elli's theater

You're hilarious.

But sorry, this Maria wagon is not my jam.

The Panopticon wagon is so obviously scumdriven it hurts me.

So I'm left between picking on Tchill or Maria. I don't even feel this is very hard.

Vote: Tchill

Not too opposed to MariaR, wouldn't vote Panopticon if you paid me after those fucking votes.

MariaR(7) ~ Centipede Syndrome(140), Gorkington(135), CheekyTeeky(93), Creature(148), Panopticon(93), Tchill13(70), Brian Skies(79)

these are the maria votes.
tchill is the only stated scumread that i can see that grey is pushing at around that time and hes not even committed to it.
he jumps around onto like 3-4 people at around this time.

grey has respect for elli's reads but has no inclination to actually follow through when he reveals his biggest scumread? when hes not really outwardly scumreading the wagon?
and theres no specific diving into maria's ISO to indicate why at any point and he even goes so far as to say that hes unopposed to voting her later (but also doesnt).

this is the posting from maria in between his "nope not okay with this" stance on mariawagon vs his "i am unopposed but hey look heres a tchill vote":

If you're going to listen to Eli do it tomorrow I'm too important to die yet can't believe I have to stop lurking for this
The gunner can shoot me all you like but 1 day is ,100% needed

Judging on other games and anti claim any anti claim should be shot based otherwise the game isn't fum. I can claim if we want to risk it but hey if something happens just strong me up

I was lurking on purpose
Dying right now for me is really bad rn but if I have to waste mafia resources to d it I will

Town as of rn but chara needs to post more
I don't think scum them tries to ml me unless there scared of me reading chara but I don't think Eli respects me enough to do that.
Aka town
Pedit fair

i dont really see what in here would change his mind from maria which wouldnt have changed from other things that maria had done previously.

does this not mean anything to you thor?
i think on the face of it, the progression here looks skeevy and the explanation that grey's given doesnt make me feel much better about it.

im planning on throwing effort at srceen during my lunch in 1.5 hours. i promises

[Thor665]

1417 is basically saying "please out the read"
2011 is saying "I'm disagreeing with the read"
2438 is saying he's softly okay with the read but finds Tchill scummier.

I actually don't see the inherent issue in there unless you enter into it with the presumption they're scumbuddies, in which case I'll agree nothing rules that out. But you could play that exact same game with me and how I behaved to the MariaR wagon also - but people aren't because I'm not acting pissy and so...would be a harder wagon? Makes it not feel legit to me as a scum case.

[Thor665]

Where does the disrespect towards Elli's read enter in?
Seems like he respects it fine.

[Thor665]

I have more issue with Grey nuthugging the TChill read after the flip and showing no read progression - there, I feel like I just made a better Grey=scum case than anyone voting him (which is thus a decent argument for Grey=town).

[Gorkington]

Where does the disrespect towards Elli's read enter in?

i feel like youre not understanding the point of what im trying to say here if you think im saying that grey was disrespecting his read?
[and if you really want to get semantic here, grey did in fact try to discredit elli's reads in general in a post before the quoted ones]

2011 is saying "I'm disagreeing with the read"
2438 is saying he's softly okay with the read but finds Tchill scummier.

??????
how is this something that youre just brushing off? especially when theres literally nothing to indicate why he should have changed his read there?
am i misunderstanding some portion of your assessment of the transition? because i frankly have no idea how youre handwaving it.

i also think its super fucking lame to just say that im voting grey because hes abrasive.
if anything im less inclined to push people who are abrasive because i dont want to deal with the blowback that usually comes with pushing them.

i think hes scum because
i) the maria read transition is skeevy to me
ii) his tone is really off this game
iii) i dont really believe his pushes and i think townhim puts more effort into getting people to sheep him on lynching people he thinks are scum instead of soapboxing

i dont really feel like you disagree with the second point either, so im kind of confused as to why youre trying so hard to dismantle the grey wagon