Open 724 - Pick Your Power X/Y [Endgame]

[The Janitor]

Hey how lovely you posted the first 5 pages overnight

Hmm I'm unsure of SIMYK being town this early? Wouldn't reasoning around the draft be WIFOM territory?

[The Janitor]

Serious question tho

[The Janitor]

Definitely agree that SIMYK has been contributing a lot and none of it seems like bad or too fluffy soooo she would be far from a scumread

But still the draft seems like wifom territory.

[The Janitor]

how is anything that you've posted useful to the gamestate then

I asked you a question about something that bothers me. Seems like part of a game to me honestly.

@SIMYK
The game is barely underway so I'm not really having a read on anyone. Sure scum could interact a lot but I'd imagine they're more comfortable in the shadows than here. But that again is also wifom-y which is why I'm slow in forming reads.

[The Janitor]

@simyk I don't see it as scummy.

@math why is questioning you useless? Also I'm not townreading simyk. As I said I'm more null, I didn't see the draft relating to the tr. Even if I'd townread her it wouldn't be due to the draft so what's the problem there?

[The Janitor]

okay SO

if BEEFSTER’S flight or fight reactions were TRIGGERED because of Mathdino’s post, wouldn’t he ALSO instinctually HIDE his claim instead of BROADCAST to everyone that he is the scum jailkeeper?

Sure I am not INTIMATELY FAMILIAR with Beefster’s QUIRKS but I assume a BASELINE where people are not SO bad at scum they risk their tean’s chances their FIRST POST just because they though town WANTED them to claim ( ⚆ _ ⚆ )

Is my baseline INACCURATE for Beefster?

also that dosent answer my question -____- - not knowing Beefster does NOT make the reasoning itself invalid （￣へ￣）

It's certainly possible he'd be more inclined to hide his role but it's not exclusive. But I don't see why town would blurt out their role, either.

@simyk I didn't want to question a NAI thing, I wanted to question something I found weird.

[The Janitor]

SIMYK is an alt yeah
so is the janitor

janitor the problem is that you seem more focused right now on tearing down information than building it
the point of early game is to go from low information to high information

i literally provided calculations proving that in this setup, there are people who are more likely to be scum
we have information, both from the draft and from 5 pages of content
but instead of commenting on it you've just questioned reasoning that i made in my first post
which i did specifically to produce more information.

Questioning you is the first thing that comes up in me and doesn't it provide a discussion and therefore info?
I'd rather tend to the more bigger posts when I get behind a pc. I'm phone posting now. I've skimmed through the thread, there's more to comment on, such as Beef, but this was the first thing that popped up in me... I wasn't ready to TR someone based on an assumption.

[The Janitor]

I don't necessarily find Mathdino's actions scummy per second... It just bothered me as a weird way to get a TR. Which isn't all too scummy in itself

Would Beefsters JK claim get him free tho? Could still be a scum Jailkeeper. Or am I too tired to process all that correctly now?

[The Janitor]

What's objectively bad about my posts ?

I don't think a mafia player should follow a set plan or scum/townhunt in a certain way... Maybe I play differently than you but if something bothers me, why wouldn't I question it?

I'm an alt yes

[The Janitor]

Even if I look at what's more probably I couldn't judge anyone from the draft honestly. I was calling you not scummy because you were participating and generating discussion which I mostly see as protown.

[The Janitor]

But what I mean is asking about MATH-SENSEI'S methodology. You EXPLICITYLY said you were NOT townreading and NOT scumreading it, and only found it WEIRD. Have you made any progress in DECIDING what seems more likely to you? (ʃ⌣́,⌣́ƪ)

I don't see how its useful as either party... If you're town you have a vague townread (imo) and if you're scum what do you achieve

[The Janitor]

Yeah I need to comment on the rest but that particular thing bothered me and I told you I'd get to the rest whenever I'm on my laptop.

Feels interesting that Math wants to lynch me now since iirc right after my question. Why, Math? Can't I ask about it?

[The Janitor]

Shading SIMYK here, based on using WIFOM. Almost everyone who posted at this time is 'guilty' of this. So why SIMYK?

Not simyk but Mathdino and it's based on his post and I didn't see anyone else townread someone after similar reasoning... or I skipped over it.

'I don't townread SIMYK because WIMOM, but it's for from scummy!' hedging

Because SIMYK was not doing the thing I was asking Mathdino about, SIMYK was just like, the subject of his action if that makes sense.

Not having a read? You made it clear you don't townread SIMYK, which is a read per definition.

Nor did I townread her at this point.

Same as with SIMYK, hedging Math's actions as 'not necesarilly scummy'.

I explained my reasoning for this, I can't see what scum!Math gains from this all but nor do I see what town!Math does. My thought process and nothing else.

[The Janitor]

@Janitor: quit the bs

your posts have not been useful and do not demonstrate a town mindset

i have obviously evolved my reads since my literal first post, you're harping on me trying to create information out of what i had available to me at the time

RVS is great and all but it's stupid when you have information available already

also your slot ALWAYS had higher scum equity to me. i picked 2 because i thought scum would pick it.

you picked 2. and i'm townreading iconeum and TW more than you, soooooooOOOOOO...

Again it's one of the first things that stood out to me. Skimmed over the rest. I found it weird regardless of whether it's post 4 or 400. I'd need to read your further progress in more detail which I'll do but that post stood out to me at first.

[The Janitor]

wait okay quick thing, janitor

are you purposefully trying to play with a different playstyle/speaking-style from your main? (so you don't get identified)

i'm not hunting for your main to be clear

Not necessarily at least rn, sure I guess I could try out stuff and see if games go better or worse for me. as for speaking style I guess that one will seep through regardless lmao

[The Janitor]

Night 3 Vigilante/Vengeful: people keep crumbing this, stop crumbing. vig/venge someone based on community consensus. i doubt town picked vengeful but if anyone claims vengeful, policy lynch them (this is optimal play)

1-Shot Vigilante OR 1-Shot PGO: vig someone who's either dead weight or is likely to be lynched tomorrow. luckily we have a list of "most likely to be PR" to "least likely to be PR" so just try to hit vanillas imo. doubt anyone ever picks PGO in this setup

Cop OR 1-Shot Redirector: we hypoclaim cop targets tomorrow, remember to actually act like you have an inno

Universal Backup OR Role Cop: role cop is surprisingly not terrible. rolecop people at the top of the list. look for scum picking vengeful, redirector, etc.

Neighborizer OR Fruit Vendor: i sincerely hope no one picked fruit vendor. neighborize talkative hard-to-sorts who won't get NK'd. i used to be a great neighbour but now i just get NK'd so don't neighborize me thanks

This seems townie and I'd agree with all of it except I'd have Neighbor'd people I trusted to possibly discuss stuff in private. And I think scum could pick PGO to kill PRs but I take it you weren't talking to scum here.

i mean if beefster is scum he probably legitimately didn't get the jailkeeper/tracker

i doubt he'd lie about that

Beefster is bottom half of the draw and JK-tracker seems like a relatively strong/popular set to me so it's very well possible that someone else chose there and then scum!Beef wouldn't fakeclaim no.

@ico I've explained my reasons for not being able to get a solid grasp on what alignment a certain post is coming from, so how do I form a read from that? I'm slower in having reads, I wanna be sure of stuff I'm doing. I'm taking a stance, that stance being "I find this weird, but in itself, it doesn't form a read for me".

[The Janitor]

A50 it's probably not who you think it is?

also i maybe know who janitor is too now? doesn't matter but lol

was trying to figure out if what i was scumreading was alt awkwardness, i.e. trying out a different style and looking horrible/scummy for it

back to our usual program though

I'm curious now! I figured I could try out some different stuff or playstyles but not rn.

[The Janitor]

I just let my thoughts flow on matters that stand out to me. How does that make me scum immediately? What you could do is weigh in on the matter itself. And I'm pretty busy replying to stuff I can form opinions about right now

[The Janitor]

Did I say you're scum? o.0

Was this aimed at me? I wasn't replying to but to Ico.

If you're stating your thoughts clearly and transparently most of your thoughts are either

1) unneccesarily paranoid--i.e. you're probably not experienced particularly with forming townreads?
2) that you don't like much of the progress town is making w sorting

For the record I suspect hidden alts are the bane of my existence

Eh I have experience with townseeking. No, I didn't like the initial sorting process based on the draft, may that be clear... I'd have more trust in what happens in the game itself. But as far as I know Mathdino's he's pretty okay at setup discussion so that's a difference between us I guess.

[The Janitor]

Probably a good idea... breakfast has made my mind some clearer

[The Janitor]

^ to the worst.

[The Janitor]

That's the thing I'm not really certain on reads after less than 12 hrs of a game.

But if you want it
Townleaning to SIMYK and the worst. Very slightly on you based off this type of prodding. Math feels townish due to some stuff I noted above but you know what I thought of his first post and immediate vote on me after a question.

[The Janitor]

Aside from being an active participant and thinking along well, it seems, she also acknowledged a bit of a flaw in Math's setup spec despite it resulting in her being townread, and the above quote (directed to me) seems like a townie attitude

I mean that's the question I want to see YOU solve - my prespective SO FAR is that Mathdino is compiling weak reasons to townread people and then STRENGTHENING or ADJUSTING them with the game's CONTEXT so I think he's town! BUT if you see the vagueness of the read as an interesting point to interact with I think you would be GOING somewhere with it and to me it looks like mostly a dead end （○□○）

[The Janitor]

Spoiler: Pretty big post

Hmm 218 seems good to me, although I haven't played with you before Taly, not on this account. Good points made.

Vengeful, as a role, is not statistically AI for this setup. But yes, obviously lynch anyone who claims the role.

Wouldn't you think scum would want to pick it? It guarantees hitting a PR bar the redirector I think? As opposed to a vigilante which can a) hit Vanilla Town and b) can only be used N3. I guess Vengeful could be useful for both parties but picking vig would make more sense for town I think.

Personally, I don't think picking a high number is particularly AI in either way. However, if Saske does flip scum, then her partners almost definitely picked low ones.

Correct assumption I'd guess, picking high gives you big odds of being early in the draft.

VOTE: Janitor

(...)

Everyone else I don't find too noteworthy.

Why me then? Any opinions on what I posted? You didn't mention them, did you find my posts bad like the other people on my wagon?

I think IF Janitor is JUST an inarticulate townie then whatever INFO DUMP he writes will be the BREAKING POINT in determining his TRUE motivations (〇o〇✿；)

Well here we are. Guess I'm inarticulate then. Curious for all these identity guesses. I'm probably bad at hiding this stuff, and also at trying out a really drastically different playstyle so eh I'll prob keep it to one account

(response to A50)

THIS first response pinged me a little - it DOESN'T answer the question I asked and instead seeks to BRUSH OFF my read! ( ⚆ _ ⚆ )

Fair point here. Why does knowing Beef necessarily correlate to being able to townread/scumread him correctly? Every newbie's gotta read people correctly at some point, that isn't because they know the people they're reading, I think? Surely meta may play a part but I'm not one to metadive honestly.

Not a big fan of birdie's short posts here and I don't quite get the Ausuka wagon?

@Mod: I know SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis looks like half the player list in one word, but they still count as one vote.

Can we really blame the mod for this

{A50, mutant}

Why these 2 in a bracket? Without scrolling back I don't really recall any meaningful interactions. Just setup spec and one saying he's bad at reading the other

Just ftr, I won't vote outside Iconeum/The Janitor until they both flip.

Even ignoring my own name here, what's the town benefit here especially if there are 3 scum?

too much setup analysis and appeal to WIFOM

Don't think setup spec is that bad in itself but yes I do think it's mostly a bunch of wifom. But Math does it more I guess... still no big fan.

you don't know the meaning of WIFOM. scum does not send in draft numbers in this setup to fake town out, they send it to rob town of PRs and get good PRs when possible

so talk to me in specifics instead of trashing everything i have to say

do you think 2 scum would pick the same number to fake out town? if so, who in this setup would do so? i already discussed this possibility
do you think scum would pick all high numbers, essentially guaranteeing town gets the cop?
do you think scum would pick {1, 2, 3}?

Blending in here but
WIFOM as far as I know it points to situations in which you can't draw a conclusion in which you can't possibly say with any security that a certain action is typical for or implies a certain alignment... Such as certain numbers. Can we honestly answer any of the last 3 questions with any certainty? Scum can guess low certainly but they may tie with others. But they may also play high to ensure a non-tie. The same goes for town.. at least that's my view.

scum is {Janitor, Ircher

How much a role does Ircher+me advocating against (too much) setup spec play in you scumreading us?

Heading out. Hopefully back tonight.

[The Janitor]

Back tomorrow, sorry! Time to enjoy a free saturday night!

[The Janitor]

Okay I have 30 spare minutes let's gooooo

Spoiler:

VOTE: Ircher

why do you find it unnecessary to not address any of his concerns and naked vote inistead?

how do you read me (besides adorable)?

Is there really any other way to, honestly?

Vengeful has been in 7 PYP X/Y games. Of those, 57% (4) have been town.

Ya, I figured picking Vengeful is not really typical for either faction but would you agree about scum profiting more from it from the vig option and/or a vig being more likely town?

@janitor; If you believe Simyk has been posting lots of non-fluffy content, why doesn't that make her town to you?

I'm townleaning there after catching up.

425 to 428 seems mostly fluff to me when there's enough to discussion I reckon

In the future shall we see what you had PLEDGED to PROVIDE (O_O ;;) ?

What exactly?

Okay and I'm out again! Sorry for being shit at planning.

[The Janitor]

Hi dave, and

bon courage

Beefster, hope all turns out well. My catch up until this point, but I'm going to sleep soonish, so chances are I have another 5 pages to read tomorrow...

Spoiler: Final part of catching up... before going to sleep

More high quality post walls coming up

For the PURPOSE of the RECORD, Janitor, my INITIAL INTELLECTUAL INTUITION is that your IDENTITY is Something_Smart ╭( ･ㅂ･)و ̑̑ ＂

Sorry to disappoint, but no ب_ب

i can't work with the way ircher is gathering his reads

and if he wasted about a page responding to each of my posts trashing it, i don't have enough respect for that kind of play to really work together with it

idk but isn't this more a case of "suck it up"? Why would town just plainly want to ignore someone who *can be* town? Sure he's scummy but nothing's confirmed yet I'd think.

Let's ruin this game because I'm playing with a bunch of nutters.

Uhhhh.... Good excuse?

3) 429 and 520 is an extremely expansive analysis, almost post-by-post, of someone's reads. Unless Ircher is doing his very best to dictate the perception in this thread - which I extremely doubt he's doing, given there's almost no defense for his wagon - tells me that his effort is coming from a sympathetic and individualistic standpoint.

I'm really unsure how to interpret this (Ircher's lists, not your comment). On one hand it's very well possible scum!Irch is fighting an uphill battle wanting to look townie but on the other hand it might just as well be town!Ircher trying to prove himself. Others, what do you think of this? Can you associate it to either alignment and/or tell me why it doesn't fit one of the alignments?

ALL scumhunting is luck.

Hard disagree, weak defense I guess. Well I guess there's always a luck factor but setupspec-scumhunting is way different in that aspect from scumhunting by actions in the game, I feel.

"WELL SCUM COULD'VE DONE IT!"

Well then is this really a weak argument

when it's actually possible

Scum motivation: Looking like town without having to take responsibility for actions this game because no one's going to read word he writes and he isn't attempting to influence the gamestate.

Wouldn't scum!Irch be hoping and/or thinking that town would actually listen to his reads when he posts them this elaborately? Thereby gaining responsibility? Besides if his motivation is to look town I feel that would require people to appreciate and read his posts/walls. I feel this doesn't quite fly.

You don't fucking spoiler your reads list if you want it to affect the game.

How is this relevant at all to someone's intentions or alignment
I spoiler these posts because otherwise it takes everyone else in this thread a full hour to scroll past them

Please, stop degrading and mocking my insights.

If only everyone on this site would read this message, yes thanks and let's continue. Seriously.

Janwagon: Icon null-town, Beefster probtown, Ircher likely scum onwagon.

What about the people that were on my wagon at its peak? Don't recall who they were exactly but eh

ITT: people give me shit by claiming that my reads are entirely based around setup spec/the draft and ignore anything outside of math

while A50 proposes a scumteam literally solely based on the draft

Yeah I'm no fan of that

But I don't see any reason for any alignment to pull shit like that. Like it's gonna land you suspicion anyway and who wants that at this point?

568 seems to me as a good townie post with both information and reads/analysis.

Vig is exactly 50/50 out of 8 games. But I do think scum would rather have a vig than vengeful.

See this is why I don't do setup spec

Ausuka making the one big post where she goes from scumreading ircher to townreading him is weird. If you read through and change your mind before post is finished, why do you include first parts in the first place.

This actually shows organic progression I'd think, no? I'd reckon that's beneficial for town rather than not. It's opening up.

[The Janitor]

I was gonna do a fancy list but my internet just stopped working. The elevator pitch version of it all is Taly and Aukuka seem town. A50 scumlean. Math somewhat of a scumlean. Duckie seems town too. Yessiree scumlean. SIMYK townlean. All in no particular order, just the order in which the names came up in me

[The Janitor]

If you insist we may be able to talk for a while, gonna do my catchup anyways ☜(˚▽˚)☞

[The Janitor]

I know The Janitor has reads, and they have been working at catch up... But again, why are you not voting at the present time?

My meta is basically that I'm really hesitant in voting... it's one of the things I thought of "Hey let's get an alt and see if this works" but I guess I can't put myself to it

617 is very IIoA and I think activity shouldn't be a reason in itself... Hell, I went out today due to the amazing weather, who knows what others are doing.

Lalendra flaking out is not correlated with her alignment guys

Feels good to say I agree with you

635 is very true and it's all fluff which... isn't good.

Awww players are dropping like flies here. I wanted to play with you brass but we'll see each other I suppose!

[The Janitor]

Um I don't recall @simyk but I'll try

Gonna go hike in a lil while so if you don't hear from me you know why. Def logging in tonight still.

[The Janitor]

I picked tracker and came back VT.

Is that what you're looking for?

Dunno what this was achieving. Confirms the tracker-jk bracket - which seems powerful to me - was used in the top 7 of the draw. If this flips scum could it be protection of the lower half of the playerlist and eventual buddies?

I also don't know in what way Math was rolefishing really

the worst is being goofy. He's a lot more serious as scum. Town

This imo is a weak TR reason. scum!Beef could indicate scum!duck would be the first thing popping up in me. On a second thought it might just as well scum!Beef trying to WIFOM by hoping townplayers think like I thought at first. I'd consider that the more likely option actually.. But as long as Beef (or well, Mylo) is not flipped it's not too big a deal.

Aaand I'm out I'm so sorry

[The Janitor]

Iconeum

1

the worst

3
Lalendra 5

Ircher

11

SaskeIsMyYaoiKismesis

413

Mathdino

2

The Janitor

2

Beefster

4

Taly

4

Almost50

8

mutantdevle

8
Ausuka 6
Lovebird 6

brassherald

6

eyyyy lmao get fucked ausuka

Hmmm interesting in red while others have talked about my posts and called them townish at the least. Don't think I've seen you comment on them. Care to?

it's more of a collective representation of the reads of myself and the people i respect

i'm personally townreading lovebird and there's more ausuka paranoia

so get vigged ausuka

Who are those people exactly?

Good, it wasn't a gambit.

Town

Why exactly?

[The Janitor]

Ausuka-chan's vote is town since if I KNEW I was townie and saw someone writing 587, I would just vote them aswell~

This is good reasoning and since I doubt Ausuka is scum at this point this seems like a very townie post.

OK lovebirds reads are backwards enough that I'd be cool with a policyvig there

Simyk did you see my request for a scum pt fanfic

Why would the unofficial town leader argue for a policy vig? Who knows some of his reads may be right.

@Math well SIMYK has certainly been... Nicer to me the past few days.

[The Janitor]

I would THINK scum shooting someone WIDELY TOWNREAD such as me, eddie-kun, ahiru-tan, taly, or you would be a GOOD indication ╭( ･ㅂ･)و ̑̑ ＂

Would scum ELECT to avoid shooting someone townie just because there could be a TRACKER? (ʃ⌣́,⌣́ƪ)

pedit: LOOKS like we're in agreement!

Eddie and taly widely townread?

Taly to me seems town. Would scum want to hard defend 2 widely scumread people if the scum player in question is not in any hot water?

[The Janitor]

Taly is one of the most obnoxious people ive seen lmao what the fuck

It's like that kid who tells the teacher you came in 30 seconds late or rattles on you for shoving Jimmy

The actual fuck?

Hey Eddie Cane we both generally trust simyk
Why is she wrong about the janitor?

Well maybe she isn't and you should re eval your read and/or my posts?

...

Playerlist:

"Where's Taly?"

Taly:

"I'm going to think a bit deeper about this guys!"

Playerlist:

"Why? Also, what is wrong with your reads?"

Taly:

"I'm explaining this a bit in depth here, can you elaborate on yours?"

Playerlist:

"Lol, no. Your opinions are weird, and the reasons you apply mean mean little to us as a whole."

I'm not doing another round of

"Ignore

Taly

while he gives unique opinions in the game"

. I've got shit to do tomorrow, I'm generally working through a frustrated mental funk, and I'm disliking the gamestate right now.

Maybe I am wrong about some of my townreads and scumreads, but I'm not spending another minute here right now to be pissed on.

Goodnight.

Yeah I mean... This. Regardless of alignment this does seem like the 2nd time Taly is respecting different read/playstyles while not being respected back. Please, y'all.

Explain my other reads in depth?

WHO

do you know that explains every read they give in depth?.

Ircher and Taly in this game alone no? And how is asking you to elaborate scummy in any way? What's keeping you from opening up if you have nothing to hide?

[The Janitor]

While your scumreads are 2 people that should mechanically not be lynched today and 1 person that needs to be alive for vig fodder

I agree about that but it doesn't make them town.

I mean how much of a dick move would it be if I tried to reveal lol

I mean try. I'm too stubborn to change my style it seems so I'll just stop the alt business I guess.

@math fair point with that Taly post. Sorry.

[The Janitor]

VOTE: Iconeum

Does this vote bother anyone else?

Yes as does Bird's posting style in his recent posts...

Lynch Ircher
Vig Ausuka
Lynch Janitor
Lynch Iconeum
Vig Lalendra
Lynch Lovebird
Lynch Myloninja13

I think this wins even without the 6 other power roles
Assumes we have 1shot vig and n3 vig ofc but i rarely see games without them

PRs copclearing questionable slots and making good saves gives us more lynches too

Is D1 really the time to plan out the next 5 days

Why lynch Ausuka again?

GASP DOES THIS MEAN YOU'LL REVEAL WHO YOU ARE??

Perhaps at the end? I'll keep playing on this account for iso/continuity purposes

[The Janitor]

Why VIG* Ausuka again?

[The Janitor]

like honestly i'm just wanting to vig people who lost the draft that are also somewhat suspect

Ah right.

Ausuka didn't you provide a few links while saying you thought this is Irchers scumgame?

[The Janitor]

She said that and then she later REVISED her read to null/town in 568 (ʃ⌣́,⌣́ƪ)

That's wacky. Don't see town motivation in that post if it came after the initial scumresd on Ircher. Scum might want to keep him alive I think?

[The Janitor]

I don't necessarily think scum!Ausuka's action connects to Ircher, it's out of Ircher's control.

If Ausuka-chan were town how do you think she would have went back on her IRCHER read? Σ(-᷅_-᷄๑)

I'd think a townie motivated post would have more power behind it so to say? After going from a scumread on a semi widely scumread player to seeming to pardon him from the lynch. Right now it mostly seems meta. Dunno if I feel good about that as a reason but I'm also just a bit adverse to meta play

[The Janitor]

Hmm I guess that's my bad then but I'd have liked to see more arguments than mostly or only that if you understand.

[The Janitor]

Since I'm not part of the townbloc, my opinion doesn't matter. Thus, I should just VOTE: Ircher and let the townbloc coordinate a town win.

Dude how are these things ever good?

Anyway I'd agree with whoever mentioned that Ircher is more active and open than Lalendra at this point. I feel that even if Ircher is scumread then maybe having an active played on d2 can be helpful?

Still no fan of Lovebird...

Probably gonna be here with quotes and more elaborate stuff later today.

[The Janitor]

No.

Look at Lovebird vs Lalendra. Love is easily more scummy then Lalendra. I know you have trouble pushing other birds, but put that aside for now.
We can make a deal. Help me push Love now, and if by the end of the day nothing comes of it we re-evaluate Lalendra (more content)

I'm no big fan of either but I slightly agree, at least Lal has had some longer posts right now. But as I said I'm not feeling either.

right but does it matter

if town doesn't have them and scum makes bad shots, we can just lynch them

we have the leverage here. yeah they can use it as an extra kill, but they either remove people from the lynchpool or put themselves in the lynchpool come massclaim

leashing scum ftw

All true but do you hold it for possible scum picks it (tries to) just to keep it away from town?

Lal's wall posts on page 44 seem IIoA to me which meh

[The Janitor]

.................................................................................What did you think about letting a cop check me N1 and lynching Janitor D1? (Although, it is not guaranteed we have a cop, but.........................................................)

Or having a cop check me and lynching you Day 1?v How does this argument make sense?

I think ircher is probs town

It ain't impossible... But certain things don't sit well with me. This calls for an ISO read/skim sometime soon.

I'll place my vote where it seems to be useful for generating material to read from.

Hmmm I've been generating content while I had smaller wagons. Why not push Lalendra/Lovebird the same way? How do you see their activity or content?

it's mostly A50's contributions that make me town read that slot.

Do you care to explain?

[The Janitor]

Sorry duckie but I don't think I'm the go to guy for setup discussion

[The Janitor]

I mean that mislynchable self thing is a wet dream for scum to have in a signature. Obviously Lalendra isn't scum because of it but scum would love to fall back on that.

[The Janitor]

A50 was playing solidly in his scum meta until basically his last wallpost

i'm waffling on A50

i don't like iconeum but i'm very reluctant to go icon today because
- guaranteed PR vs unlikely PR
- A50 putting icon first before janitor is weird to me, and i feel like scum-him sheeps me essentially where he did

need more data basically

So I'm trying to read ISOs and this seemed really townie to me

It's either town!Math trying to save a PR or scum!Math heavily insinuating an Ico-Math duo.

[The Janitor]

How do you feel about 151 and 828 Mutant

I have my doubts about Math but these seem protown.

[The Janitor]

Hmm I think my issue with setupspeccing by Mathdino is known by now?

My other concerns are that sometimes there are stretches of posts where he doesnt seem to be hunting but moreso stating stuff and the fact a part of his reactions seem to hinge on the fact Irch/me disagree(d) with setupspec

But he's pretty good as town no? I'm fine if people don't want to lynch him today but I'm just letting my stance be known here.

[The Janitor]

@Ed

My reads are duck, Taly, SIMYK, mutant town and lalendra and lovebird I find scummy. Have concerns with Dino that I voiced. Ircher is also wacky but lovebird and LAL are less active atm. Ausuka light suspicion

[The Janitor]

What do scum accomplish from a self-voting? A weak AtE argument. How many times do I have to explain this anyway? I've already done it like twice.

Still doesn't make it pro town in any way and I'd agree that it seems scummy to me. Also agree with the below:

What do scum accomplish from a self-voting? A weak AtE argument. How many times do I have to explain this anyway? I've already done it like twice.

they gain the ability to call their wagon a policy-wagon and start going on about how self-voting comes from town more often than scum

i've lost to scum self-voters don't give me this shit

It does seem to create a shitton of wifom

i generally agree with the sentiment that "if lalendra is scum, y'all got lucky"

she happens to be in the PoE pool

and keep in mind she's going to be an important mislynch candidate for scum if she's town

Wouldn't that be a good thing if she's lynched d1 after all? Sure lynching town is bad but but she's not too active and scum can't push as easily later if she's town?

[The Janitor]

Sorry for the inactivity. I'm not convinced of Town Lovebird either so intent to hammer I guess? We're stalling anyway

[The Janitor]

I was gonna reply to Math's post on Lovebird but I mostly agree with what Eddie said. (edit: as did Ausuka but I didn't see that when initially writing this)

PYP X/Y is insanely difficult to get a scumlynch on D1 due to numbers. And when scum IS lynched on D1, it's because of bussing or a hilariously bad scumteam.

That alone should tell you Lovebird is town.

The fuck? How does this even make someone conftown? It's not like scum literally can't be lynched D1...

Would I be right in my assessment that scum!Math would like Lovebird alive over Lal? Not that this makes Math scum of course but I have my concerns... and he's really hard defending Lovebird here.

why would scum bus their most powerful PR?

For massive towncred (by your own reasoning among others) if they have 1 or 2 more powerroles in the team. If they do not have those rules it;s probably fair to assume that scum wouldn't want to bus Lalendra.

Janitor not using his vote (and likely being scum) heavily implies a double town wagon gamestate.

Hmm why exactly is scum!me not voting indicative of Lal/bird being town? When I've called out reasons for both to be scum(my) (I think?)

Barely voting is something I do more often etc etc but idk how important you consider that, and this is an alt anyway.

Math what again are your reasons for scumreading me since the start of the/my game? To me it feels a big part of it is still me disagreeing with setupspec. But I may have overlooked stuff.

1583 seems town to me --> Initiates action, seems like gamesolving/trying to gamesolve, it calls out pocketing simyk which hasn't been really talked about,

[The Janitor]

I'm not saying you're WKing.. The opposite, you're scumreading me and I was asking why.

[The Janitor]

Janitor, where is your head at in the game? You haven't placed a vote down and while you have been engaging and forming reads, you've done next to no pushing. Thoughts on the current wagons?

Let's try. Hoping to ignore the little voice in my head saying "hehe you suck and you're wrong anyway" Until further investigation (aka after my math final tomorrow)

Townread SIMYK Taly

Townlean mutant, duck, Ed

Neutral Mathdino (Ausuka), Ico, Ircher**

Scumlean (Ausuka), dave*, Lalendra, Mylo, Bird

Scumread

-------------

That's it I guess. SIMYK/Taly solid townreads. Really liked that Eddie post I referenced but idr him being really town to me before but it might come upon a reread. Ausuka had me torn between Neutral/Scumlean. Mylo/Beef is an inact slot so it might also fit into null moreso than neutral if that makes sense.

*dave is mostly based off of me not being a fan of A50 being town and dave not having redeemed that (so far)
**Ircher desperately needs a reread honestly

[The Janitor]

We can generally accept that Iconeum is probably just scum here though right? And we're just chickens for being unwilling to lynch him because he can produce results for us?

I'm gonna be going through coordinations of draft strategies for scum. If Aster last game is any indication, it seems like scum almost always shoots for the #1 spot with one or two from {1, 2, 3}. Scum's greatest advantage this setup is their coordination. Throwing the #1 spot away just to get Follow the Cop'd later on is shit for scum. Then a lot of scumteams pick a token "large" number with some arbitrary definition of large.

Janitor picking 2 is also a major reason I'm scumreading him. Yeah, it's pre-flip, but the only flips that matter here are {Iconeum-1, the worst-3, Beefster-4, Taly-4}. Of these, Iconeum's flip is all that matters.

Janitor flipping town or scum would give us significantly more draft-based information than Lovebird flipping town. LB scumflip really just clears Ausuka/Eddie Cane/mutantdevle.

1st paragraph - I'm not very sure yet on either alignment for Ico but fact is, he is a conf!pr. And probably a good one as well. If he's town, he may be roleblocked or killed even I'd think. In conclusion... yeah it's cowardlyness.

3rd paragraph, why is picking 2 scummy? Why is wanting a PR scummy? And what do you mean by the names in brackets?

how does LB flipping scum clear mutant? He didn't pick 6 like bird/suka/Ed. Who do I clear if I flip as any alignment?

[The Janitor]

Janitor

, if you scumlean both

Lalendra

and

Lovebird

, what is your points behind them being scum and who would put a vote on at the moment?

It's ye olde quality vs quantity debate! Lovebird has more posts but Lalendra has like, longer posts... I think both aren't being protown, at the moment. Fact is that Lalendra's odds of being PR are like 75% while its near 0 for Bird. If we gotta lynch and possibly mislynch within these 2, would it be better to get Lovebird?

[The Janitor]

Hm okay re: that draft analysis by Math.. scum does seem to pick a lot of 1s BUT I don't feel this alone directly makes Iconeum scum; it could have also been an attempt to block scum from a PR, no? How do you distinguish? I'd say it comes down to reads in the end.

Hmm 3 not picked by town is... interesting cough cough.

General idea seems to be 2 low numbers (<= 5) and one higher. Could we assume this is accurate for like 2 of 3 scums this game?

Why does 1!town + 2!town = 11!scum though? If the above is correct you'd assume 11 can be scum anyway. Would 1+2 town make Lalendra, Beef/Mylo, Taly, more suspicious?

pedit: Wait how does town!Eddie = town!Mutant? I'm missing this one? Also by your reasoning town!bird also equals town!Ausuka no?

peditpedit: Yeah everyone here seems active or at least was initially. I guess coordination is safe to assume.

[The Janitor]

Townbird doesn't mean tien Ausuka, what?

Sorry. I meant scum!Bird means town!suka because of the "scum ain't picking the same number" jazz if we can believe you on taht.

[The Janitor]

A scumflip from bird clears Ed and Mutant, a scumflip from me clears you, right? that'd make a scum!bird flip better info. Not sure what exactly a town flip would mean for the both of me and bird... none of our reads suddenly become correct by default.

pedit: bad wording, of course we can believe you in that it happens. What I meant is that if we assume it's true.

[The Janitor]

Lovebird scum requires Ausuka town and Eddie town and mutant town

I see your arguments I guess but you tr 2 of these if I'm not mistaken? Unsure where you stand on Ausuka.

And yes I talk a lot. do you still scumread my latest/later posts? Because right now I'd say Lovebird is not being very protown, less so than me.

[The Janitor]

What would a townflip from both me and bird give us? Not much I reckon? Except narrowing down the scumpool if everyone somehow decides scum picked 2 and 6

[The Janitor]

Eh. I see your arguments. I'm town obviously from my own perspective etc and I would be against a lynch of myself and for lovebird but it seems you really aren't into that idea. Just promise me I'm getting a new broom and mop if you're responsible for my mislynch.

[The Janitor]

Aren't there other people to vig? Lalendra has at least had some effort posting.

[The Janitor]

Ok humour me. Why does a townie pick role cop in this setup?

Ok humour me. Why does a townie pick role cop in this setup?

Deny to scum?

Hmm okay it's kinda fishy to me, it seems to me as though scum would love the rolecop.

i think we should lynch ausuka actually.

shit i think that confirms lalendra as town

that's never faked

any better ideas for a copcheck?

I mean go ahead and copcheck me if it clears the air. Here to help. How is it not faked? I just can't like, let go of a scumlean just like that.

Ok ircher can fuck off with the bolded caps, I'm claiming because math requested it and hadn't done so in response to ircher's previous requests for some weird reason...oh that's right, I was V/LA! Ha ha. Silly me.

Sorry my V/LA was inconvenient, it was for something that I do every single year, so...sorry not sorry? Also I have pneumonia and am tired of being called lynchbaity, bad, or a liability, so I'm done defending myself. Not gonna self-vote because it's a pussy move but if I die, Math will ride all your asses into the ground.

Town role cop. Planning on following maths plan if I live to N1.

for the purpose of the record this is TOWN (*•̀ᴗ•́*)و ̑̑

Why? ლ(ಠ益ಠლ)

[The Janitor]

skimming over Ausuka's posts there isn't a whole lot that seems explicitly town to me. but I'm no fan of bird. Can anyone (except Math I guess as he already towncased bird) sell me on either wagon?

[The Janitor]

Sure wagon me when Eddie points out what is basically a guilty.

Any way to get your out of your tunnel dino? How can you outright refuse to believe a possible innocent on me? How can you like, not stay open about it? Has it ever come up that you may be wrong and I may be town? Since well that's the case.

I told you I rarely use votes but that's frowned upon every game so yeah I kinda need to change that.

VOTE: Lal

Better?

[The Janitor]

Wait - how is waiting for tomorrow to massclaim taking away info? I'd guess that if anything scum would have a lead on who's PR or not? And how is Ico claiming a guilty? sorry but I just don't grasp it.

[The Janitor]

So the remaining PRs:
N3Vig/Venge
Doc/Roleblocker
Neighborizer/Vendor
1-shot Watcher/Commuter

are distributed among {Ircher, SIMYK,

Janitor

, mutant}.

Interesting. I'm a VT.

[The Janitor]

Sorry I was out for the entire day.

I tried for Neighborizer but didn't get it.

[The Janitor]

Math if you're basing a scumread off of meta on me, what's my main, I'm curious. I'm not using this account again probably cause it's been proven to me that a fake name doesn't help me change my style

[The Janitor]

I'm still town. And I don't think Ico checking you is that bad. If you can be conftowned you're an asset even more than now.

I'm not skitter.

Also Ircher neighborizing doesn't make him conftown right? Not that I'm scumreading him atm but still.

I think mutant's theory makes sense. It's very well possible that Ico is lying and the thing about not wanting role cop as first pick makes sense to me. Especially seeing Lalendra was high enough up on the list to have a decent chance to try and get the RB/Cop slot.

However... Lalendra couldn't have fakeclaimed UB/Rolecop while actually being Docslot with 100% safety on D1 right? Unless SIMYK is scum who actually got the slot. But I doubt SIMYK is scum and even if she is she'd have claimed one of the {Cop, Jailer, Neighborizer} slots I assume?

So I think we are for sure not lynching the Roleblocker here.

IF Lalendra flips RB though that would pretty badly incriminate SIMYK but I doubt this happens.

If there is a scum RB it's among {Me, Taly, Dave, mutant, Ausuka, Eddie} but I townread Taly/Eddie and well, I am town leaving Dave/Ausuka/maybe mutant as Roleblocker OR Iconeum is scum, correct?

As Iconeum said himself... If the Roleblocker is around, he's getting blocked (I doubt they will find the neighborizer really worth blocking) or he's getting killed if the roleblocker dies.

I'd think Iconeum flipping scum (sorta?) clears {Dave, Ausuka} and him flipping town confirms a roleblocker among those 2 or well, {Janitor, Dave, mutant Ausuka} for those sceptical of me. While flipping in {Dave, Ausuka, Mutant} doesn't necessarily get us info like that. It seems like a decent plan for tomorrow for me. I doubt he's gonna get us results

Comments? Or am I ridiculously wrong somewhere in this all?

[The Janitor]

Yeah I'm still town - Mathdino isn't correct by default - but I doubt y'all would believe me at this point. I don't trust dave too much still. He could be the roleblocker. But I'm guessing if it comes down to me and him, y'all are lynching me.

Let me know what you wanna know. From my perspective if Dave is the RB then Ico is town, if Dave is town Ico is scum. But Dave could say the same. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[The Janitor]

I'm still town. But it seems all of you don't buy it. Neither dave nor Ico have been more townie than me I feel. But if you really think you need to lynch me to go ahead and win, then by all means...

Still think there's scum in Ico/Neighborizer picks. If you lynch Ico you have disclosure. Ico town --> RB in the neighborizer picks, Ico scum --> scum lynched.

[The Janitor]

I'm here

I just lost a bit of motivation. It's like an anatomy class where I'm a cadaver being dissected by all of you :/

I saw we got a replacement, rip simyk I'll catch up later today hopefully

[The Janitor]

Wait what? We're suspicious of SIMYK now?

Gimme a bit of time though I was mostly checking in because replacing into this slot seems hellish lol

I still think dave is a prime candidate and I didn't remember him adding a whole lot to the game after my last post in which I still had my mind in the game.

Taly, Irch, Eddie strongest townreads, I feel I explained those? Well mostly Taly/Eddie but I can buy Ircher being town by draft et cetera

[The Janitor]

there's dave, and I was really unsure of you, but your posting on this page seemed good on first glance. Ausuka and mutant aren't scumreads per se for me but they are not townreads either so to say - I townread the other players waaaay more.

I probably need to read what Kat has to offer to better read the simyk slot... Could've fooled us!

[The Janitor]

I guess SIMYK slot can be scum... But I'm no fan of Dave still. Ico>Dave but unsure on both.

[The Janitor]

I'd have never guessed that scumteam what the fuck

I did atrocious here but yet this was one of the most fun games I've every played, until D3 where I genuinely lost interest

[The Janitor]

I warned you people... I was town...

Don't follow Math around when he has an early scumread on me

[The Janitor]

Eh. I see your arguments. I'm town obviously from my own perspective etc and I would be against a lynch of myself and for lovebird but it seems you really aren't into that idea. Just promise me I'm getting a new broom and mop if you're responsible for my mislynch.

Reminder for dino

Wait what? We're suspicious of SIMYK now?

Gimme a bit of time though I was mostly checking in because replacing into this slot seems hellish lol

I still think dave is a prime candidate and I didn't remember him adding a whole lot to the game after my last post in which I still had my mind in the game.

Taly, Irch, Eddie strongest townreads, I feel I explained those? Well mostly Taly/Eddie but I can buy Ircher being town by draft et cetera

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