Newbie 1876 - Game Over!

[2 718281828459]

What I wrote...

(within reason, but I doubt two scum would instantly jump on this wagon unless they were suicidal) causes you to lose the townread?

OK, so brass says this is a slip...

1. I was being hypothetical there; I did not "know" whether brass was town or not.
2. If brass
   were
   scum, then it would still be suicidal because the scum team would have just lynched their own for no apparent reason.
3. But really, I was mostly trying to figure out why I was getting heat for voting for brass, and I explained why I thought it was safe to give the L-2 vote, just in case the mere fact that it was L-2 was the reason for the heat. I was trying to write 120 as a question to the IC.
4. @Brassherald: Are you actually scum reading me, or are you just trying to pressure me by putting me at L-1? (Genuine question.)

[GuerillaWoo]

You didn't respond to his point at all.

[TrinityNZ]

Ok I’m changing votes. Thinking more about brassherald, he seemed to be a bit annoyed early in, and I firstly was suspicious of this. Now though I think he wouldn’t have done that if he was scum. Nonny on the other hand, is coming across as more suspicious by being self-deprecating, as someone else mentioned.

As for numbers, I think he is Bri g a bit naive. It could be deliberate, to try to throw us off, but I don’t think so at this point. So

UNVOTE: brassherald

VOTE: nonny

Why is self-deprecation suspicious? How is being light-hearted or charismatic more deserving of a vote than irritability? The latter shows a distinct lack of confidence.

Ok so I thought I had replied to this earlier but the post had disappeared - any ideas on what might have happened? I can write it out again but would prefer to find it if it’s gone somewhere strange. I tried looking for all my posts but can’t get that to work either...

[2 718281828459]

You didn't respond to his point at all.

Uh, I thought I did. What specifically did I not respond to?

Ok so I thought I had replied to this earlier but the post had disappeared - any ideas on what might have happened? I can write it out again but would prefer to find it if it’s gone somewhere strange. I tried looking for all my posts but can’t get that to work either...

Just write it again.
Did you know that if someone else posts right before you, then your post is held back and you can review their post and make a change? That might have something to do with it.

[GuerillaWoo]

Nvm I misread what he thought the slip was. Still, saying the reason you put someone at L-2 is cuz you didn't think the scumteam would hammer is very slip-like and there's some circular reasoning going on there that's evidently not a real explanation. Are you still voting for brass? Who are your scumreads?

Like, you just created this weird logical maze rationalizing away your own assumption that you were being scumread for putting someone at L-2. That's diversionary. There's the underlying appeal to being new: "I do not understand why I'm being scumread, is it cuz I did the thing someone else did??". Then there's the reason for the vote in the first place. Bins says you can pressure players with votes and then you announce your vote is only a pressure attempt. You instantly deflated that pressure. Then there's asking whether Brass' vote on you is genuine, like you're trying to gauge whether you should be concerned but in an underhanded way trying to delegitimize said vote.

It's odd behavior and there's this underlying need to avoid blame here. That's what it all amounts to. Preemptive avoidance coupled with active avoidance.

It's simple. Do you want brass lynched or not? Why or why not?

[GuerillaWoo]

I think there's at least one mafia between 2.7, nonny, and formerfish.

2.7 for reasons I just wrote out
Nonny I'm tone reading as guarded and careful
Fish came in strong and has been mostly absent since. Not a fan of people coming in, kicking up dust, then checking out while we deal with it

[GuerillaWoo]

Oh sorry, forgot to mention Trinity for reasons I'd rather not state until he responds

[Formerfish]

I'll be around this weekend. I've had a lot going on this week and I'm trying to get my life right.

Don't you worry Woo, with a face like that how can I stay away from you for long?

[TrinityNZ]

Ok I’m changing votes. Thinking more about brassherald, he seemed to be a bit annoyed early in, and I firstly was suspicious of this. Now though I think he wouldn’t have done that if he was scum. Nonny on the other hand, is coming across as more suspicious by being self-deprecating, as someone else mentioned.

As for numbers, I think he is Bri g a bit naive. It could be deliberate, to try to throw us off, but I don’t think so at this point. So

UNVOTE: brassherald

VOTE: nonny

Why is self-deprecation suspicious? How is being light-hearted or charismatic more deserving of a vote than irritability? The latter shows a distinct lack of confidence.

I think it’s suspicious because being self-deprecating is a tactic to try to make people like you. One reason to try to make people like you is because you’re scum and you’re trying not to get lynched. If someone is irritable, they are not caring as much if people like them, so they are not as afraid of being lynched.

[TrinityNZ]

I'll be around this weekend. I've had a lot going on this week and I'm trying to get my life right.

Don't you worry Woo, with a face like that how can I stay away from you for long?

Hope your daughter is OK?

[Bins]

Is there a reason why adding more pressure to the player you voted for (within reason, but I doubt two scum would instantly jump on this wagon unless they were suicidal) causes you to lose the townread?

Or am I misinterpreting something?

I'm very confused on what your question means.

[Bins]

post 106

Scum normally look for reasons to lynch people, not look for reasons to not lynch people.

Unless he's trying to further defend why he has a townread on me... I guess. I suppose that's kind of icky.

[GuerillaWoo]

I'll be around this weekend. I've had a lot going on this week and I'm trying to get my life right.

Don't you worry Woo, with a face like that how can I stay away from you for long?

Please, Woo is my father, just call me Guerrilla.

(Hope your family's ok)

[GuerillaWoo]

Nonny what do you think of 2.7?

[2 718281828459]

Nvm I misread what he thought the slip was. Still, saying the reason you put someone at L-2 is cuz you didn't think the scumteam would hammer is very slip-like and there's some circular reasoning going on there that's evidently not a real explanation. Are you still voting for brass? Who are your scumreads?

I have had a hard time getting scum reads, but I still think brass may have jumped a bit

too

quickly on me... so I am keeping my VOTE: brassherald. Day 1 scum reads are already hard; when you have 4 people voting for you it gets even harder.

Like, you just created this weird logical maze rationalizing away your own assumption that you were being scumread for putting someone at L-2. That's diversionary. There's the underlying appeal to being new: "I do not understand why I'm being scumread, is it cuz I did the thing someone else did??". Then there's the reason for the vote in the first place. Bins says you can pressure players with votes and then you announce your vote is only a pressure attempt. You instantly deflated that pressure.

Ok, that makes sense. Of course, now I think I can get out the air pump again because my best hunch is actually brass = scum.

Then there's asking whether Brass' vote on you is genuine, like you're trying to gauge whether you should be concerned but in an underhanded way trying to delegitimize said vote.

That was because I was considering that vote to be scum-like, but I wondered if it was just a townie trying to get information. Big difference.

It's odd behavior and there's this underlying need to avoid blame here. That's what it all amounts to. Preemptive avoidance coupled with active avoidance.

It's simple. Do you want brass lynched or not? Why or why not?

"Do you want brass lynched" well, I mean, if I were forced, right now, to lynch any player then it would be brass, because of the somewhat... what's the word... hasty response to my vote. I think I had a few other things on brass as well, although I would need to study the past posts more closely if you want me to write them out.

[GuerillaWoo]

Yeah that's just textbook non-committal bud. What do you think about Nonny?

[GuerillaWoo]

Also, what is the appropriate amount of time you think brass, or anyone else, should've waited before voting for you/scum?

[Skygazer]

@Bins, why are you losing your townread on 2.7?

I don't really think 2.7 has been playing well at all, and he's been super defensive and non-committal in his reads. What I'm concerned about, however, is that they seem like he'd be an easy mislynch for scum to pull off if he happened to be town.

I agree with the nonny self-deprecation argument, it definitely reads to me as a defense mechanism, especially considering she's been much more concerned with defending herself than with scumhunting. Also, one of the few times she did appear to be scumhunting she didn't even back it up with a vote (and it kind of seemed like she was trying to score town-cred for not voting).

I would still like to see more from Ice, but I can kind of see their playstyle as valid, especially if they're not confident in their reads. I do want to see more from them as the game develops further so I can actually establish a read. For now, though...

VOTE: nonny

[2 718281828459]

Yeah that's just textbook non-committal bud. What do you think about Nonny?

I keep going back and forth on that. Now that I have been asked, let me go and review the thread.

Also, what is the appropriate amount of time you think brass, or anyone else, should've waited before voting for you/scum?

Well, maybe it was just how confidently brass (mis)read my post as a direct scum slip. From the look of that post, it sounded like brass just instantly jumped to a conclusion and acted as though it was the only possible conclusion. That seems a bit scummy to me, so I keep my vote on brass.

"Hasty" was the wrong word (in 139), perhaps...

(Oh, nice, I

just

saw Skygazer's post.) I think I am coming to a more solid decision about brass, and I should go check on nonny again and come to a conclusion. Does anyone know if there is a way to search this thread for only posts by one user?

[2 718281828459]

Does anyone know if there is a way to search this thread for only posts by one user?

I just found it.

[Skygazer]

I think I am coming to a more solid decision about brass

It's kind of convenient that your read suddenly gets stronger with no new content from brass after you were called out for having a noncommittal read, wouldn't you think?

[2 718281828459]

So, after looking at nonny's 11 posts, I fail to understand this "self-deprecation" thing. Currently I read nonny as neutral or pro-town, and if I learned anything from those posts, it is that Formerfish almost seems to be more scummy than nonny.* (Although, I guess you could consider that only having made 11 posts can be a scum read.) I almost wonder if the "nonny is scumish" people are simply getting biased by reading the counters to nonny's posts...

Am I right that both me and nonny are at L-1?

*Well, admittedly I was only looking at Formerfish posts that nonny quoted, hence that "scum read" is groundless.

[2 718281828459]

I think I am coming to a more solid decision about brass

It's kind of convenient that your read suddenly gets stronger with no new content from brass after you were called out for having a noncommittal read, wouldn't you think?

Yeah, but I have been thinking about the situation more ever since I have been called out. Sometimes your thoughts become clearer purely due to time.

I just looked at the discussion again... Trinity almost looks like she is going off of wrong interpretations of nonny's behavior. I can see reading nonny as scum for inactivity, but not for this "self-deprecation" thing that (to me) is a bending of the facts. And then there is Formerfish. Maybe I can investigate them later (need to do other things now).

If it seems suspicious that I am "suddenly" investigating a lot of people, it is because I realized that I only have one real read right now, and I think I need more.

[Jackal711]

{bump to put VC at top of next page)

[Jackal711]

(ditto)