Mini 2014: Succinct Mafia (Over)

MathBlade · Post Post #675 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 3:09 pm

More than likely scum stayed off it because they would know the claim was real.

LuckyOtter · Post Post #676 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 4:54 pm

In post 675, MathBlade wrote:More than likely scum stayed off it because they would know the claim was real.

Why vote Magna then? SirCakez was on the Fuzzy wagon.

Will reread and rethink.

Dunnstral · Post Post #677 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 5:09 pm

iCk

VOTE: Eeveelution

This is still my scumread, I've noted that they were on a wagon by themself at day end which is scummy in my eyes

Kokichi Oma · Post Post #678 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 5:45 pm

No ragrets in lynching that.

Wisdom · Post Post #679 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 6:41 pm

VOTE: magna

lets lynch actual scum today

Wisdom · Post Post #680 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 6:43 pm

oh my bad, thought magna replaced Fitz

VOTE: umlaut

ISO · Post Post #681 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 6:55 pm

<<< Note to players: I will be V/LA without internet access from tomorrow until late, late Sunday. This shouldn't present a problem for this game, but you do need to be made aware of it. >>>

MathBlade · Post Post #682 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 8:35 pm

In post 676, LuckyOtter wrote:
In post 675, MathBlade wrote:More than likely scum stayed off it because they would know the claim was real.
Why vote Magna then? SirCakez was on the Fuzzy wagon.

Will reread and rethink.

Because Magna was off the Fuzzy wagon, being selective af about who he pushes afterward (Kokichi is also experienced as well), Magna seems to clearly have an agenda.

Dunnstral · Post Post #683 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 8:49 pm

Magna slot was voting Fuzzy though

MathBlade · Post Post #684 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 9:15 pm

In post 665, mastina wrote:
End of Day Votecount
TheFuzzylogic99 - 7 (LuckyOtter, MathBlade, SirCakez, Pine, Dunnstral, Kokichi Oma, Wisdom)

havingfitz - 4 (Momrangal, ArcAngel9, Hiraki, TheFuzzylogic99)
EeveeLution Army - 1 (havingfitz)
Pine - 1 (EeveeLution Army)

7 to lynch.

Deadline for D1: (expired on 2018-06-24 22:06:14).

No he wasn’t.

MathBlade · Post Post #685 (ISO) » Thu Jun 28, 2018 9:16 pm

Oh derp backwards
VOTE: Unvote

Still find it fishy Magna didn’t push Kokichi for the same thing.

MagnaofIllusion · Post Post #686 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 12:09 am

In post 673, MathBlade wrote:Nope.

It was right to lynch Fuzzy even without the counterclaim as if he was scum it would keep our cop hidden.

As a PR you have to play like you are a PR so your claim is believable.

I have no regrets about that lynch, sure it may have turned out bad but it was the right play.

VOTE: Mathblade

There is no way you can be Town and typing the above. None. You are too experienced to post that and believe it.

Day 1 you NEVER lynch an un-countered information claim. Ever. That is the kind of thing you learn in Road to Rome from an IC. In LYLO sure you have to use reason because scum faking a claim to win the game is a viable strategy.

The downside if you are wrong - you lynch a strong Town role before they even get a chance to use their ability or be killed by scum N1. Disaster if you are wrong. Which you clearly were.

The downside if you are right? None. The real Town information role gets a Night to use their ability and then counter potentially netting a two for one on scum or at worst potentially getting you a clear or quasi clear Townie. Worst case the real information role dies overnight and you make scum kill the Town roles.

MagnaofIllusion · Post Post #687 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 12:12 am

In post 678, Kokichi Oma wrote:No ragrets in lynching that.

BTW I'd totally lynch this to but given what I have seen this is a Firebringer style HSAT player and it would be more of a policy lynch. Given that then either Math or Pine who do not sacrifice their Town games to help their scum games are more likely to be actual scum.

Hiraki · Post Post #688 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 1:30 am

I feel like the overall problem with reads in this game is the assumption of inability to make mistakes this game.

Vote: Eevee

EeveeLution Army · Post Post #689 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 2:56 am

I still feel like pine is scum but im unsure on if anyone would go along with it....but tbh the fact mom died makes me less confident in it.

LuckyOtter · Post Post #690 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:31 am

In post 689, EeveeLution Army wrote:I still feel like pine is scum but im unsure on if anyone would go along with it....but tbh the fact mom died makes me less confident in it.

Why?

If you feel like you have a case on Pine, now is the time to share it.

MathBlade · Post Post #691 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 3:58 am

In post 686, MagnaofIllusion wrote:
In post 673, MathBlade wrote:Nope.

It was right to lynch Fuzzy even without the counterclaim as if he was scum it would keep our cop hidden.

As a PR you have to play like you are a PR so your claim is believable.

I have no regrets about that lynch, sure it may have turned out bad but it was the right play.
VOTE: Mathblade

There is no way you can be Town and typing the above. None. You are too experienced to post that and believe it.

Day 1 you NEVER lynch an un-countered information claim. Ever. That is the kind of thing you learn in Road to Rome from an IC. In LYLO sure you have to use reason because scum faking a claim to win the game is a viable strategy.

The downside if you are wrong - you lynch a strong Town role before they even get a chance to use their ability or be killed by scum N1. Disaster if you are wrong. Which you clearly were.

The downside if you are right? None. The real Town information role gets a Night to use their ability and then counter potentially netting a two for one on scum or at worst potentially getting you a clear or quasi clear Townie. Worst case the real information role dies overnight and you make scum kill the Town roles.

That is a general rule, not a hard one.
And this game isn’t about PRs it never has been.

Go look at my flipless win rate or F2F where in 10+ years of playing have never missed a vig shot IRL.

I do better when no PRs and if I was wrong it was unlikely he was going to get a check off anyway as the majority of people scumread him.

Again you’re attacking me specifically when Kokichi has had similar no regrets.

VOTE: Magna

Back to this can die. He is looking to tunnel me because I am an easy mislynch versus actually thinking about what he is saying.

<<<

INFRACTION

: Fifth post on a page in under 24 hours; user has been warned. >>>

Umlaut · Post Post #692 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:22 am

o/

I'm going to skip the part where I spend the first five IRL days promising I'm going to do a full read-through from the beginning of the thread Real Soon Now, and just admit that that's never going to actually happen and that I'm probably going to review Day 1 sporadically at best. If there's something specific you think I ought to see, point me to it.

In post 686, MagnaofIllusion wrote: There is no way you can be Town and typing the above. None. You are too experienced to post that and believe it.

Day 1 you NEVER lynch an un-countered information claim. Ever. That is the kind of thing you learn in Road to Rome from an IC. In LYLO sure you have to use reason because scum faking a claim to win the game is a viable strategy.

The downside if you are wrong - you lynch a strong Town role before they even get a chance to use their ability or be killed by scum N1. Disaster if you are wrong. Which you clearly were.

The downside if you are right? None. The real Town information role gets a Night to use their ability and then counter potentially netting a two for one on scum or at worst potentially getting you a clear or quasi clear Townie. Worst case the real information role dies overnight and you make scum kill the Town roles.

I agree with the sentiment here that lynching an uncountered cop claim, or really any plausible positive-utility PR claim, on day 1 is bad. But (having had no experience with MathBlade specifically) I don't have any trouble believing that MathBlade could say what she said sincerely. I've seen similar statements made by equally experienced players, including one in particular who I understand shares quite a bit of genetic information with MathBlade. Though I find that when town advocates ideas like this they are usually hard-tunneling the PR claimant in question rather than espousing their consistent and principled position on awaiting counterclaims.

In post 652, Kokichi Oma wrote:Fuzzy isn't cop. We only have 8 hours and need a lynch.

...

VOTE: fuzzy

8 hrs remain this is L1 someone hammer. I can guarantee he isn't cop.

(quote altered to remove vote tag)

Kokichi Oma:

Do you generally believe that 8 hours isn't enough time to build up a new wagon?
What made you so certain Fuzzy wasn't a cop?

In post 690, LuckyOtter wrote:
In post 689, EeveeLution Army wrote:I still feel like pine is scum but im unsure on if anyone would go along with it....but tbh the fact mom died makes me less confident in it.
Why?

If you feel like you have a case on Pine, now is the time to share it.

Seconding this. If you think someone is scum then it doesn't matter how unsure you are if you can convince anyone, you have to make your best effort to do so.

MagnaofIllusion · Post Post #693 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:36 am

So I’ve finished my read. Phone posting now and will not have time for a full post due to lack of computer access til Sat.

Town - Otter, Wisdom, Eeve

Scum - Math, Pine, Uumlaut

Everyone else is between with Arc being closest to Town. If I could suicide bomb any two of my three scumreads would do so Immediately.

Will 1v1 both Pine and Math as both are pretty obv. Laut is more based on associations with unflipped Pine and Math and reads of Mom. Not as confident there but will vote it today if a wagon there outgrows Math or Pine.

Also Math playing the “Im lynchbait” card is a full on scumclaim.

MathBlade · Post Post #694 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 4:41 am

In post 692, Umlaut wrote:o/

I'm going to skip the part where I spend the first five IRL days promising I'm going to do a full read-through from the beginning of the thread Real Soon Now, and just admit that that's never going to actually happen and that I'm probably going to review Day 1 sporadically at best. If there's something specific you think I ought to see, point me to it.

In post 686, MagnaofIllusion wrote: There is no way you can be Town and typing the above. None. You are too experienced to post that and believe it.

Day 1 you NEVER lynch an un-countered information claim. Ever. That is the kind of thing you learn in Road to Rome from an IC. In LYLO sure you have to use reason because scum faking a claim to win the game is a viable strategy.

The downside if you are wrong - you lynch a strong Town role before they even get a chance to use their ability or be killed by scum N1. Disaster if you are wrong. Which you clearly were.

The downside if you are right? None. The real Town information role gets a Night to use their ability and then counter potentially netting a two for one on scum or at worst potentially getting you a clear or quasi clear Townie. Worst case the real information role dies overnight and you make scum kill the Town roles.
I agree with the sentiment here that lynching an uncountered cop claim, or really any plausible positive-utility PR claim, on day 1 is bad. But (having had no experience with MathBlade specifically) I don't have any trouble believing that MathBlade could say what she said sincerely. I've seen similar statements made by equally experienced players, including one in particular who I understand shares quite a bit of genetic information with MathBlade. Though I find that when town advocates ideas like this they are usually hard-tunneling the PR claimant in question rather than espousing their consistent and principled position on awaiting counterclaims.

In post 652, Kokichi Oma wrote:Fuzzy isn't cop. We only have 8 hours and need a lynch.

...

VOTE: fuzzy

8 hrs remain this is L1 someone hammer. I can guarantee he isn't cop.

(quote altered to remove vote tag)

Kokichi Oma:

Do you generally believe that 8 hours isn't enough time to build up a new wagon?

What made you so certain Fuzzy wasn't a cop?

In post 690, LuckyOtter wrote:
In post 689, EeveeLution Army wrote:I still feel like pine is scum but im unsure on if anyone would go along with it....but tbh the fact mom died makes me less confident in it.
Why?

If you feel like you have a case on Pine, now is the time to share it.
Seconding this. If you think someone is scum then it doesn't matter how unsure you are if you can convince anyone, you have to make your best effort to do so.

How do you have no experience yet are misgendering me as she?
If you have no experience what made you think I am a chick?

MagnaofIllusion · Post Post #695 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 5:00 am

Last post this page ...

691 is so scummy if Math doesn’t get a ton of votes before I can post again I will be shocked and saddened.

Appeal to Authority? Check - look how good he is in these other places. But his absolute failing Day isn’t an indication of being scum but other people being bad.

Better without PRs? The game was specifically balanced for a Town Cop.

Not attacking KoKi? Clear lie since I quoted said player on this very page. This also means Koki is less likely his partner BTW with this “why not them” finger pointing.

Town MathBlade who makes mistakes is willing to acknowledge and reevaluate. I can like Math to a recently finished game if you want to fight me on this.

Maths entrance and response to me is not that behavior at all.

Hang this.

Hiraki · Post Post #696 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 6:24 am

Why Eevee in the town pile? Even if you're reading current posts, there's nothing TRable there.

Wisdom · Post Post #697 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 6:40 am

In post 688, Hiraki wrote:I feel like the overall problem with reads in this game is the assumption of inability to make mistakes this game.

Vote: Eevee

this is still scum
If we don't lynch Fitz slot this should be the lynch

Wisdom · Post Post #698 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 6:45 am

Math I'm very close to sheeping magna tbh
Im only not doing it because i know youre bad as town

Kokichi Oma · Post Post #699 (ISO) » Fri Jun 29, 2018 6:52 am

In post 687, MagnaofIllusion wrote:
In post 678, Kokichi Oma wrote:No ragrets in lynching that.
BTW I'd totally lynch this to but given what I have seen this is a Firebringer style HSAT player and it would be more of a policy lynch. Given that then either Math or Pine who do not sacrifice their Town games to help their scum games are more likely to be actual scum.

Just say you want to lynch everyone who was on the wagon. I was wrong, it happens. Doesn't make me scum.