Mini 2018 - American Presidents Mafia (Game Over)

ISO · Post Post #1450 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:02 am

that's my exact stance

like it crossed my mind that it would be easy for scum to hide behind the push on me so I checked it out. Bernie's push felt the grossest to me but I'm assisted by the fact that I have sweet sweet tells and would be very surprised if he's scum here.

Mom didn't have those tells so the fact she reached the same conclusion I did is actually really telling for me.

skitter30 · Post Post #1451 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:06 am

ok so after checking it out do you think that there's scum in that group? and if so, who do you think it is?

ISO · Post Post #1452 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:08 am

nah not really

that's what I've been saying

skitter30 · Post Post #1453 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:11 am

ok i guess i misunderstood what you meant by that then, sorry

Mathdino · Post Post #1454 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:17 am

okay i'm here guys

i done goofed

i moved and didn't have wifi, was only able to visit the site briefly

ISO · Post Post #1455 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:36 am

welcome back fam
no rhymes?

Mathdino · Post Post #1456 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:50 am

no rhymes, i'm going to do the read throughs i promised

catch me up

ISO · Post Post #1457 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:58 am

what do you need? I honestly kinda skipped a bit of d1

Nauci · Post Post #1458 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:43 pm

In post 1420, Shoshin wrote:I have lots of reasons to vote Gamma besides everyone else being more town.

For starters, he spent the majority of the day laying low and offering a couple safe reads on Key and Stun. Yes, he offered the occassional commentary (e.g. 318) but there's no in-depth analysis of alignments.

570 is a scummy I'm-not-town post; questioning Key here doesn't make much sense from a town perspective.

571 feels like a bullshit excuse for not having the excitement he would have had as town.

1109 and 1110 seem like someone who knows Gustavo is town rather than someone who's reading him genuinely. And the follow-up in 1140 feels opportunistic.

Then he starts playing the game a bit more actively since he's under pressure but keeps going after easy targets - eventually votes the worst, keeps talking about NM as null but now he's voting NM.

Ty for this post

I agree that he spent a lot of time laying low or fluff posting, and I agree that the gus and nm votes look opportunistic

IMO "wait why would you town read me here" posts are towny; not accepting someone's town read of you and making them cough up a reason is scum hunting just as if it is with any other town read on any other player. That might be, to me, his most town post on a very short list of them.

And I thought the same thing about Gus so I didn't see that as scummy; I questioned the about face to voting Gus if anything

But I can see your perspective on them despite disagreements

Gus you said you can see them as scum together but we want to know: does that mean you think Shoshin is hard bussing here?

Nauci · Post Post #1459 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 12:54 pm

In post 1456, Mathdino wrote:no rhymes, i'm going to do the read throughs i promised

catch me up

My favorite prodigal son

IMO read with a focus on the slots that are/were most up for lynch today: gamma, the worst, NM, Bernie, momrangal, me, maaaaaybe gus and Irrelephant

There's probably no time to dive anyone else and no urgency

But I'd really like your in depth thoughts on the worst, Shoshin, Irrelephant, and Bernie down the line no matter what your alignment is

Shoshin · Post Post #1460 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:09 pm

In post 1458, Nauci wrote:IMO "wait why would you town read me here" posts are towny; not accepting someone's town read of you and making them cough up a reason is scum hunting just as if it is with any other town read on any other player. That might be, to me, his most town post on a very short list of them

I strongly disagree with this. I think questioning when someone townreads you is null by itself (I've seen town and scum do it) but the way it's done says a lot about someone's alignment. I have a hard time believing that Gamma was trying to sort Key there. Like, there's no analysis of Key, no follow-up, no nothing that shows an engagement with Key or Key's alignment. How is that town?

Nauci · Post Post #1461 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:27 pm

I don't think he's town. I think he's scum because he has cursory engagements but not follow ups and evaluations and lots of anger at being scum read.

But I disagreed about that post being a scummy one because, like you said, it's done by both alignments.

Mathdino · Post Post #1462 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 1:39 pm

is irrelephant actually ranmaru? because i was reading him under the assumption that he was

but he keeps posting onsite all like "wow i really love this new site!"

ranmaru literally said in my discord he was irrelephant wtf

Nauci · Post Post #1463 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:05 pm

In post 1462, Mathdino wrote:is irrelephant actually ranmaru? because i was reading him under the assumption that he was

but he keeps posting onsite all like "wow i really love this new site!"

ranmaru literally said in my discord he was irrelephant wtf

Is ranmaru an engaged graphic designer? Or Irrelephant very committed to the smurf experience? Because they have dramatically different styles and Irrelephant has mentioned being new like 20x in his games.

I thought the ranmaru mention 20-30 pages ago was Bernie Sanders speculation

Irrelephant11 · Post Post #1464 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:18 pm

Bahahaha what

Who is Ranmaru

I guess I’m flattered? Hahahahaha

Irrelephant11 · Post Post #1465 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 2:19 pm

Also wow good memory Nauci, the one correction being *recently married

Nauci · Post Post #1466 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:01 pm

In post 1355, skitter30 wrote:actually i reconsider my take on the lack of opposition to the gamma thing; nauci, if gamma ever flips scum that's a gross post and you're my first bet for a partner

specifically i'm considered that the first time you brought up this take is *after* i made a thing about it, and that you've been pushing the gamma and/or his wagon for a while now despite not joining it

like how do you just now decide 'at a glance i find the lack of a counter wagon' possibly disturbing; you literally just had a thing about people's voting patterns, and nm has been on the wagon for like three irl days now.

Rereading pages 50+, I realized what Skitter's perspective looked like to the post that I typed up ignoring the 1-2 pages that happened after I started writing.

This post is an A+ reaction to those circumstances and reinforces my town read of skitter, I think. Just feels like a really good reaction that I 100% would have had in the same situation.

IDK how much credibility I have but what happened was that I spent 3 hours getting the vote count tracker just right, skimming the thread 3x for all of the votes and spending a lot of time tweaking Google Sheets formulas. I post it immediately because I was so excited to finish it. THEN I skimmed the posts that happened while I was working on that thing, and THEN I took some time to actually look at my own vote tracker.

I normally don't do VCA because it's just hard to keep track of mentally for me, so I wasn't paying attention to vote state before. I was totally shocked by the lack of counter wagons active, and then I took a look at the people actually voting Gamma. I thought that it was generally a concensus lynch by my town reads because people like Keyser *cased* Gamma, and I town read Shosh. But Keyser wasn't actually voting there (and it was a "you look like lynch bait" case, apparently), Shosh hadn't really talked about the scum read, and Math voted back in page 30 or so.

I basically agree with Keyser and Errant's notes on Gamma,

but neither of them were on the wagon

, so alarm bells went off BIG time.

In post 1293, Irrelephant11 wrote:That’s actually v true

I’m guessing at least two if not all three scum are in {Gamma, Bernie, people voting for Gamma or Bernie}

Otherwise they could easily be pushing one lynch or the other
Kind of like Gustavo seems to be doing?
Really can’t read Gustavo

While this didn't really apply because BS was v/la on his main, I appreciate it for teaching me what to look for when analyzing vote counts.

In post 1436, skitter30 wrote:i don't understand why it's super hard to make a mom wagon a thing tbh; the only people like townreading her are irrelpahnt and duckling

+Shoshin (IIRC Shoshin answered at least half of my prods at/about momrangal)

In post 1436, skitter30 wrote:
In post 1369, the worst wrote:794 and surrounding were solid af fmpov. like I am not a fan of how I was positioned as scum for my predecessor and irl busyness here. it crossed my mind several times that I was an easy af push for scum to hide behind, and I found Mom seeing things exactly the same way.

either she's town or has me pocketed hard but I'm not sure what scum!Mom's method is in WKing me here
well, duh, because she defended you

who are the scum that positioned your slot for a lynch?

i didn't like that post from her; most of her posting doesn't seem *sincere* or *real* to me; a lot of it feels kinda mechanical is maybe a good word? going through the motions? i don't know how to explain that better

--

In post 1370, the worst wrote:besides honestly that's just the wrong track. Gamma is just not town here, and it's seriously gross the way you're pussyfooting around his lynch.
you know, for someone who's that confident he's scum, i'm wondering why you're not on the wagon yet

--

In post 1375, Gustavo wrote:
In post 1347, skitter30 wrote:
In post 1338, skitter30 wrote:do you think shoshin and gamma are scum together, y/n?
@gustavo for like the third time
Idk
ok, let's try it this way. given that you scumread them both independantly what do you think of the fact that shoshin is pushing a gamma lynch right now?

Creepy mind melding with skitter continues (I'd like to think that a bunch of my previous posts were essentially these same thoughts; this isn't some I AGREE empty claim)

In post 1436, skitter30 wrote:
In post 1385, Nauci wrote:
Huh this post makes me feel better about momrangal, because I'm now seeing that "something doesn't feel right" about the gamma wagon...

Hmm.

UNVOTE:
bleh, no, why'd you hop off?

Any time I go to sleep or be afk from a game in the final 72 hours, I unvote unless I'm *confident*. The last thing I did was ISO momrangal and I was seeing some towny stuff I had glossed over before. If her "something doesn't feel right" comment was for the same sentiments we had, then I was willing to give her some room.

In post 1436, skitter30 wrote:
In post 1399, Gustavo wrote:People are probably bored like I am. I called for the day to end a while back. We just need to end it. The stall could be because you are scum and it’s mostly town on it, or you are town and it’s scum led.

Who knows
um, no, the the entire point of the game is to figure out which of the two it is; atm i think it's the latter from the complacent gamestate

Get out of my head kthxbai

In post 1436, skitter30 wrote:i'm literally always down to pl nm if there's nothing better in the given gamestate but there's like legit scummy people in this game so idk why we'd settle for this today. like this is just a cop out.

and idk why his naked vote on gamma is enough to make you question your read on gamma; he always does that as either alignment and like i don't think that vote is ai like at all tbh

like this just feels like such a lazy resolution to today, even worse than a gamma lynch

if there's like a vig he's always a great shot; same with a cop check imo

there's justs so many scummy people in this game i have no idea why we'd settle for a pl in this gamestate

I didn't have as many strong scum reads as you do. While waiting for the weirdness on the Gamma wagon to shake out, I realized a ton of the weirdness was because how much frustration NM added to the whole evaluation. I went back and saw comments like "NM NEVER contributes" and "he never does anything pro-town" and thought that it was something to confront. Also I hadn't seen an NM game nearly this quiet. Thank you for the meta context here; I'd been waiting for Math to tell me about NM.

In post 1439, the worst wrote:
In post 1436, skitter30 wrote:who are the scum that positioned your slot for a lynch?
re-read my ISO
literally said the idea crossed my mind, net all things I didn't find anyone particularly scummy for it. the way Bernie pushed it was a bit icky but he's already a hard townread.

still means I find it townie for someone to reach the same conclusion.

I frequently look for that kind of scenario but your posts for the first 45+ pages were *so* devoid of townness that it's not fair to consider it lynchbait analysis.

In post 1465, Irrelephant11 wrote:Also wow good memory Nauci, the one correction being *recently married

Congratulations!!!

In post 1419, Nauci wrote:
Irrelephant11/the worst
now that he's back at -3 are you going to vote gamma

I'd like this answered but more importantly I'd like to know why those votes haven't gone up because TW only unovted to avoid quickhammer.

Nauci · Post Post #1467 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 7:07 pm

I assume Brass won't adopt my VC because that'd be endorsing its veracity/endorsing me in some way so I'll keep posting these every 5 pages or 5 votes or so

Spoiler: UPDATED unofficial vote record

Nauci · Post Post #1468 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 8:01 pm

Hard to decide where to vote. Still waiting for follow ups from math/keyser/errant/gustavo/etc.

I hate the fact that I have so many scum reads because of a lack of reason to town read/lack of activity, versus having a few strong scum reads because of noticeable scum motivation.

Errant, why still no vote?

Momrangal + Skitter + anyone else previously giving The Worst room to breathe: how do you read him now? That wagon fell apart on the basis of giving him more time, but we didn't really come back to re-evaluate properly. I will answer this once he answers me.

Just did a full ISO on Bernie and I don't see anything suspect beyond a lack of super dramatically towny posts (Keyser do you still think Bernie-Mom could be a thing when now that they're voting each other?).

I'll vote with 2 of my town reads while I wait VOTE: momrangal

ISO · Post Post #1469 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:36 pm

In post 1464, Irrelephant11 wrote:Bahahaha what

Who is Ranmaru

I guess I’m flattered? Hahahahaha

Be flattered Ranmaru is a great lad

ISO · Post Post #1470 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 9:48 pm

uh what am I meant to reply to?

Nauci · Post Post #1471 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 10:14 pm

In post 1470, the worst wrote:uh what am I meant to reply to?

End of 1466 I asked you + irrelephant 1419 again

ISO · Post Post #1472 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 10:31 pm

o ye
VOTE: Gamma

brassherald · Post Post #1473 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 10:33 pm

Sorry for missing the VC last night, fell asleep super early. It will come normal time today

brassherald · Post Post #1474 (ISO) » Sun Jul 01, 2018 11:36 pm