Labyrinth Mafia (Endgame)

[Wisdom]

Or, you decided that you can sell not targeting anyone as a towntell and went for it

[Shoshin]

If I say something's a town-tell or scum-tell, it doesn't mean that the player is guaranteed town or scum. It means the probability that they're town or scum is higher.

[Shoshin]

Or, you decided that you can sell not targeting anyone as a towntell and went for it

That's a possibility, not a probability.

Mafia is a game of probability, not possibility.

If you want to catch scum, you weigh probability, not possibility.

[Shoshin]

Like the honesty = town thing

That's naively false

Yeah, I was tricked by that in a past game. A player was 100% sincere about feeling bad being sick and unable to contribute to the gamestate but was wooden about everything else.

That's the sort of thing that isn't AI.

[Wisdom]

Like, why do you not apply your logic to me? I could have made up a million reasons to townread tw, especially if i was scum and thus knew for a fact hes town. Yet you instantly assume i cant explain it.

So how is it different when people dont buy your "didnt target anyone" thing?

[Shoshin]

Like, Nancy, think about it. You're comparing honesty about a game-related action vs honesty about outside factors (e.g. feeling sick) when they're obviously very different. You need to add more nuance to your analysis.

[Reality Check]

I already showed I was getting info you didn't know about regarding targets

It's hard to justify lying as easily with that in the open

[Shoshin]

Like, why do you not apply your logic to me? I could have made up a million reasons to townread tw, especially if i was scum and thus knew for a fact hes town. Yet you instantly assume i cant explain it.

So how is it different when people dont buy your "didnt target anyone" thing?

Or the worst is scum. Or you didn't read the game and didn't know where to even start building a townread on the worst.

Either way, I'm weighing probability, not possibility.

As a matter of probability, scum can't explain reads more often than town, because town always have reasons for their reads whereas scum often don't. That's called probability, not possibility.

[Shoshin]

I already showed I was getting info you didn't know about regarding targets

It's hard to justify lying as easily with that in the open

So if I'm a scum bodyguard, why not just target someone last night?

[Shoshin]

I already showed I was getting info you didn't know about regarding targets

It's hard to justify lying as easily with that in the open

And actually I had no idea what you were referring to.

[Wisdom]

ok enough theory more lynching chick

[Reality Check]

Because you wouldn't be a bodyguard as scum

[Nancy Drew 39]

Look, mafia is a game of probability. Nothing is certain. Certain behaviors or associations make one alignment or the other more probable. The town-tell is honesty about against-the-grain behaviors when a less-scummy-sounding lie could have been told without any harm or risk of detection.

In my case, I could have said I targeted Sajj because I thought she was vig. I could have made up all sorts of shit. But I didn't. And that's a town-tell in this case.

But no one else thought that before she claimed.

Your excessive anger towards CS doesn’t make any sense either. It almost seemed that you were happy he was dead and no longer a threat to you.

It seems to me that you scumread anyone who scumreads you?

Could you be a 3P?

I’m not picking up you being aligned with anyone. I don’t see you and Chick being w/w together but I could be wrong about that since random’s been pushing TPF since D1 but she’s pushing you over him.

But then you’d be targeting Wheme over random, so your only partner by default if you’re scum, has to be Wheme. I don’t see a Shoshin/Chick w/w connection.

[Reality Check]

Shoshin

Scum need reasons for reads or it will get them caught

Town don't necessarily need reasons

[Shoshin]

Because you wouldn't be a bodyguard as scum

You think I lied about being a bodyguard? I claimed it on D2 and you saw me visit Nico on N2...

[Shoshin]

Shoshin

Scum need reasons for reads or it will get them caught

Town don't necessarily need reasons

Lol?

If town don't need reasons, then neither do scum. Good logic, Reality.

[Wisdom]

I don’t see you and Chick being w/w together but I could be wrong

you are

[Shoshin]

Shoshin

Scum need reasons for reads or it will get them caught

Town don't necessarily need reasons

You're actually missing the point. This has nothhing to do with "need," it's about the nature of town and scum.

Town by their nature have reasons because by their nature they're trying to distinguish town from scum from an uninformed perspective. You can't have a read as town without also having an accompanying reason, even if you don't consciously know the reason (e.g. gut).

Scum, by their nature, don't have reasons because they already know who the town are. Scum, by their nature, must fabricate reasons.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Like, Nancy, think about it. You're comparing honesty about a game-related action vs honesty about outside factors (e.g. feeling sick) when they're obviously very different. You need to add more nuance to your analysis.

How was Wisdom being dishonest about the game? Name one thing so far he has lied about?

[Reality Check]

Shoshin you realize that scum need sensible reasons to not get caught, right?

Town don't need to make sense to everybody else, all that matters is the conclusion

All that matters to scum is the process because they need to be wrong or they lose

[Nancy Drew 39]

I don’t see you and Chick being w/w together but I could be wrong

you are

Not thinking you’re scum doesn’t mean this is persuasive. Try harder.

[Shoshin]

Look, mafia is a game of probability. Nothing is certain. Certain behaviors or associations make one alignment or the other more probable. The town-tell is honesty about against-the-grain behaviors when a less-scummy-sounding lie could have been told without any harm or risk of detection.

In my case, I could have said I targeted Sajj because I thought she was vig. I could have made up all sorts of shit. But I didn't. And that's a town-tell in this case.

But no one else thought that before she claimed.

Your excessive anger towards CS doesn’t make any sense either. It almost seemed that you were happy he was dead and no longer a threat to you.

It seems to me that you scumread anyone who scumreads you?

Could you be a 3P?

I’m not picking up you being aligned with anyone. I don’t see you and Chick being w/w together but I could be wrong about that since random’s been pushing TPF since D1 but she’s pushing you over him.

But then you’d be targeting Wheme over random, so your only partner by default if you’re scum, has to be Wheme. I don’t see a Shoshin/Chick w/w connection.

Yeah, I was pretty upset with CS. I claimed to him because I trusted him but it turns out he was actually a shitty player and he told my claim to someone I scumread. And then he started pushing for my lynch on policy. I had no issues letting him die. I don't think he's a good player as town and he's not someone I want around over myself.

I scumread anyone who scumreads me? WTF? I scumread Random before he scumread me. Like, what are you talking about?

[Wisdom]

I don’t see you and Chick being w/w together but I could be wrong

you are

Not thinking you’re scum doesn’t mean this is persuasive. Try harder.

Give me your moonlogic about why theyre not scum together

[Shoshin]

Like, Nancy, think about it. You're comparing honesty about a game-related action vs honesty about outside factors (e.g. feeling sick) when they're obviously very different. You need to add more nuance to your analysis.

How was Wisdom being dishonest about the game? Name one thing so far he has lied about?

I wasn't talking about Wisdom when I brought up my honesty as a town-tell.

But to answer your question, Wisdom's townread on the worst is fake, though I'm not sure if it's a lie (that depends on the worst's alignment).

[Wisdom]

Wisdom's townread on the worst is fake

How is it different than, say, my townread on Reality? I havent explained that one either