Heroes Wanted! (Game Over)

[zMuffinMan]

no, it isn't

you're interpreting that incorrectly

[MathBlade]

VOTE: zMuffinMan

So done. Saying you’re wrong is not helping
You’re not addressing your Titus townread
You’re not helping me catch up

This is just spam.

[zMuffinMan]

frankly, anyone town player who thinks i'm scum should probably just quit mafia altogether

i'm so beyond caring about dealing with players like you that i really don't give a shit

[Sando]

Is there anything particularly wrong with the idea of a {

Sando, Titus

, Shiro, BBmolla} team?

Yes, this is silly. You can say I hammered my buddy, or you can say I spent most of D1 with a safe-ish vote on Titus, but the idea that I spent all day distancing from Titus only to hammer my other buddy for a 129/Titus/Sando trio is just silly. Pick me or Titus if you want, but thinking we made a trio is just insanity.

[Sando]

Drixx doesn’t play traditionally d1. He is more concerned with blocking and communication than reads day one.

You know it's D2 right? See up there next to the game name, in brackets, it says "(Day 2)".

If you can find his reasoning for the vote on me, maybe you'd have a point?

[MathBlade]

VOTE: Sando

Just getting that out of the way and not part of a big wall of quotes.

weird sass, idk what to make of it. Only other real note is didn't Sando spec about multiple scum kills earlier? Sando why do you think that's ever a thing?

Number of players, how many mislynches and NKs do we need to lose? Seems like a lot, and I wasn't seeing any other killing roles, but BP was being handed out like candy. I don't play many theme games though, so I'm looking at it through an Open games light.

but opens practically never do that
and the numbers seem fine
5 day perfect town win with lynches only, 5 day perfect scum win one death per day or night phase seems like reasonable speed, plus vigs are possible

VOTE: Sando
kinda agreeing with this at the moment

Titus: Basically everyone active in the game is telling you to stop with the focus on just one tiny aspect of the game. At the moment it's NAI to me, because town!you would pick at this particular scab (especially with some who are intentionally antagonizing you and keeping you focused on it) and scum!you would gladly take the cover others are providing. You don't really need anyone else to point out where you're hurting yourself and the game state.

Yeah this is a good point btw. Now that I've pretty much taken down most of the "logic" I'll probably avoid engaging Titus' points on that barring direct responses.

oh, right, that reminds me. drixx is scum

OMGUS much?

Yes I am aware it is day two. It is day one for Drixx’s existence I believe.

Far as I can tell he had a problem with your wall. He also had some other well developed points but this one could have been and imho should have had a bit more from him. He is still town this just reads like bad town play.

[Sando]

Yes I am aware it is day two. It is day one for Drixx’s existence I believe.

Far as I can tell he had a problem with your wall. He also had some other well developed points but this one could have been and imho should have had a bit more from him. He is still town this just reads like bad town play.

Wait so we're saying that no matter what day Drixx replaces in on he'll play like D1? So if he replaces in at Lylo he won't be concerned with reads?

Why are you quoting Gamma regarding Drixx's case?

[MathBlade]

Yes I am aware it is day two. It is day one for Drixx’s existence I believe.

Far as I can tell he had a problem with your wall. He also had some other well developed points but this one could have been and imho should have had a bit more from him. He is still town this just reads like bad town play.

Wait so we're saying that no matter what day Drixx replaces in on he'll play like D1? So if he replaces in at Lylo he won't be concerned with reads?

Why are you quoting Gamma regarding Drixx's case?

1) I don’t remember and I don’t think Drixx would replace in at lylo. If he did he would be very slow and methodical and probably have 2000 real life things happen. The first day for Drixx is always a slow methodical crawl. He is concerned with reads he just takes his sweet ass time and pressuring him won’t change that.

2) I am quoting Gamma to demonstrate while that specific point was underdeveloped, he has had several good contributions and many people see that and I am trying to show you how Drixx is town.

You do have a valid point that that vote was underdeveloped however in the grand scheme of things Drixx is town and does expand on things when he feels confident enough to do so.

[zMuffinMan]

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[MathBlade]

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I lack the context of what this is and have trouble with colors on forums.

What is this?

[Sando]

2) I am quoting Gamma to demonstrate while that specific point was underdeveloped, he has had several good contributions and many people see that and I am trying to show you how Drixx is town.

You do have a valid point that that vote was underdeveloped however in the grand scheme of things Drixx is town and does expand on things when he feels confident enough to do so.

Ok...but you're quoting things where (I think) he and Gamma are agreeing that Titus' game-setup logic is bad, and thus they're also in agreement on the read on me. This ignores that I spent most of D1 going after Titus for bad game-setup logic. Surely if that's what you're in vehement agreement about, you don't then just automatically agree that one of the main people deriding Titus' game-setup logic, is scum?

[Ankamius]

frankly, anyone town player who thinks i'm scum should probably just quit mafia altogether

i'm so beyond caring about dealing with players like you that i really don't give a shit

not working with me is going to do very little for my read of you

[MathBlade]

2) I am quoting Gamma to demonstrate while that specific point was underdeveloped, he has had several good contributions and many people see that and I am trying to show you how Drixx is town.

You do have a valid point that that vote was underdeveloped however in the grand scheme of things Drixx is town and does expand on things when he feels confident enough to do so.

Ok...but you're quoting things where (I think) he and Gamma are agreeing that Titus' game-setup logic is bad, and thus they're also in agreement on the read on me. This ignores that I spent most of D1 going after Titus for bad game-setup logic. Surely if that's what you're in vehement agreement about, you don't then just automatically agree that one of the main people deriding Titus' game-setup logic, is scum?

1) The way I see it is that Drixx is saying “hey stop picking at that small bit. Your points are bad no one believes you and it is antitown.”
2) I think Gamma agreed with this point
3) I haven’t read D1 it is on my list of things to do but even if what you are saying is true, a valid point is not what is alignment indicative. I had tons of valid points in prior scum games. Especially if you are a competent setup player and Titus was spewing shit and you didn’t attack her it would be bad. It doesn’t matter who attacks who. It matters who attacks who AND why.

[Ankamius]

With an events summary like
— FA leader here
— FA decides powers here
— Vote discussion over leader of FA or leader of Titus starts here
That type of shit is a lot easier to work with

Or like not even post numbers just something searchable so I can build it

The problem is... I'm a replacement myself and I only really started getting a grasp of the gamestate after I mostly threw out what my thoughts were before my replace-in.

There was a lot of talk and claims for the leader votes early on in the game.
There was a bunch of discussion early on about how to handle selecting teammates too, Nancy and Titus were both arguing that it should be randomized to some extent. Frozen Angel was supporting a fully conscientious pick followed by a claim D2 of her picks
Eventually I replaced in and started fighting with Titus about that same thing as well as having a two-way tunnel with Nancy.

Then numbers got lynched, flipped scum, and Titus was named leader for day two.

[MathBlade]

I also have been boneheadedly bad in my town ones. If being perceived as valid was alignment indicative damn my games would be different.

[Sando]

I think they just said for the first day vote naturally as if you were town.

They already have a chance of getting powers without having to worry about being found out, plus look how paranoid it made some people. By doing nothing other than acting naturally they only win.
Thing is by voting on likeness they also raise their chance of being picked because if someone likes you more your chances of being picked are better imo
Sooo

Again, I'm not saying that scum did X or Y, or saying that anyone assuming scum did X or Y is scummy.

What I'm saying is that Titus seems to assume scum coordinated to elect FA and then does not follow that assumption through to it's logical conclusion.

It's the not following through that I find scummy/worrying, not the underlying assumption.

I wasn't saying that being bad at the logic was scummy, I was saying that not following through with the bad logic to actually scumhunt was scummy.

[Ankamius]

I should probably point out that the reason I was scumreading Titus for her leader-should-be-randomizing push thing is because I think she's competent enough to know that's not a good idea for town... yet is also competent enough to know that it's a good idea for scum since it's been proven that a random set of picks has good odds of catching at least one scum within it.

[Ankamius]

Probably yes

There's a case to be made for the most town people that aren't necessarily an optimal kill choice otherwise, but that depends on the gamestate itself enough that it's too much of a can of worms to open right now.

Yeah that’s simply not a thing
If you’re giving it to town that is not obvTown you’re giving it to potential scum
Well with the exception of people who are obvTown but never nightkilled

It’s almost certainly better to give powers/stuff/things to obvTown but dispersed. It’s better for power to die then to be with scum. We have lynches after all

While I'm thinking of it

I rethought about this and yeah, my suggestion isn't a good idea.

[MathBlade]

With an events summary like
— FA leader here
— FA decides powers here
— Vote discussion over leader of FA or leader of Titus starts here
That type of shit is a lot easier to work with

Or like not even post numbers just something searchable so I can build it

The problem is... I'm a replacement myself and I only really started getting a grasp of the gamestate after I mostly threw out what my thoughts were before my replace-in.

There was a lot of talk and claims for the leader votes early on in the game.
There was a bunch of discussion early on about how to handle selecting teammates too, Nancy and Titus were both arguing that it should be randomized to some extent. Frozen Angel was supporting a fully conscientious pick followed by a claim D2 of her picks
Eventually I replaced in and started fighting with Titus about that same thing as well as having a two-way tunnel with Nancy.

Then numbers got lynched, flipped scum, and Titus was named leader for day two.

Uhmmmm randomization is just stupid.

You’d get like assuming what 4 scum I think,

17/20 odds of not hitting scum for first pick assuming leader can’t pick themselves and numbers was excluded as a likely lynch and if you assumed him flipped already

Best case scenario is
17*16*15*14*13/20*19*18*17*16 = around 40% chance of not hitting scum

Furthermore we play mafia and even if we accidentally give scum a PR we gain more from the reads of it.

Like randomization just denies reads why the fuck wasn’t Titus lynched day one for this?

[Ankamius]

Math is town

[MathBlade]

I think they just said for the first day vote naturally as if you were town.

They already have a chance of getting powers without having to worry about being found out, plus look how paranoid it made some people. By doing nothing other than acting naturally they only win.
Thing is by voting on likeness they also raise their chance of being picked because if someone likes you more your chances of being picked are better imo
Sooo

Again, I'm not saying that scum did X or Y, or saying that anyone assuming scum did X or Y is scummy.

What I'm saying is that Titus seems to assume scum coordinated to elect FA and then does not follow that assumption through to it's logical conclusion.

It's the not following through that I find scummy/worrying, not the underlying assumption.

I wasn't saying that being bad at the logic was scummy, I was saying that not following through with the bad logic to actually scumhunt was scummy.

?? I don’t understand what you are trying to say here.

Like I don’t understand how this connects with Drixx. I have known Drixx a long while. When Drixx gets fired up you’ll know it and see it. Like I see him scumhunting but that point was underdeveloped and I see him trying to form a town block. So I see your point (a tree) but I don’t see the forest,

[MathBlade]

Math is town

Okay. Well you me FA are town. Do you townread Drixx?

[Sakura Hana]

Like randomization just denies reads why the fuck wasn’t Titus lynched day one for this?

Because we lynched Numbers instead.

[Ankamius]

Ankamius
Frozen Angel
MathBlade
Toranaga

Brandi

?

Human Sequencer

?

Nosferatu

?

Sando

?

BBmolla
hebichan
Katsuki
Kokichi Oma
Myloninja13
Nancy Drew 39
Sakura Hana


Drixx

?

Gamma Emerald

?

Shiro

?

the worst

?

Titus

?

zMuffinMan

?

[Ankamius]

Oh I should've done the ISO of Drixx first like my mental note said

well, oops