Heroes Wanted! (Game Over)

[the worst]

UNVOTE:
thinking more on this

[MathBlade]

but there is one huge arguement against that: she did it cause she wanted to be a townread.

I tend to have a bias against the saying that scum did something that doesnt make sense as scum but makes sense as town for the reason of "To appear town" (or in this case "To be townread").
Sorry, i just dont believe it. It also doesnt help that i've seen this line of thinking invoked so much against me on my town games.

*facepalms*

What is the number one rule I said of Titus scum games?

Wait...I am universally townread.....

VOTE: Unvote

Ugh I just can’t. Like I can’t shake this feeling she is scum.

VOTE: Titus

What’s worse is I can’t explain it

[Nancy Drew 39]

FA already cleared that up but the irony of you reiterating FA’s math question - like what are the odds? XDD

I...don't like the tone of this

Why? What don’t you get about math/Math?

But I guess I’ll just have to spell it out for you I suppose. *sigh*

The subject involved a

math

question.

The poster I’m referencing is called

MATH

blade.

[Nancy Drew 39]

do you know the reasons behind why experienced players seem to think he’s town? and what players particularly? because that could be a basis for diving deeper, i think.

well not exactly, i dont remember THAT much, but i think it was FA and Nancy

Yeah, It’s mainly based both on meta - having played one game with him and being on the same hydra team. I am hower concerned about his and hebi’s recent lack of activity but I view that as likely NAi, so with UFO/Tor especially, I still think town.

[Nancy Drew 39]

When did Toogeloo replace in?

Same time stungun did, at SOD 3.

Tooeloo=BBmolla and Stungun=Nico/Brandi, I think.

[Nancy Drew 39]

Let us say you would actually have concerns about why ank died over me. Let me spin this chessboard around.

why would anyone have such concerns? cause they thought I was a more towny/valuable player than ank and that I could die. So as a person with a real concern you start the day saying why fa is alive over ank. Lets say you're also lazy to investigate that question that you had. you don't check the mechanics cause you're lazy. you don't check ank reads cause your lazy. and you come in saying I have mix feelings about fa cause she is alive. later when fa points out you act with stubbornness and throw those reasons/important things in trashcan and say if you're obvtown just become one instead of taking a stance.

It's either that or you not giving a fuck about why ank died over me and you wanting to mention it just so you look in a way that you're hunting.

I actually HAVE been floating that question in my mind.

I have been checking mechanics but they are just that mechanics. I am investigating that question just by listening. It is troublesome but that may be wine scum are throwing to manipulate me.

I am also wondering why I am so townread. It has me nervous that the only person scumreading me is 404 and 404’s reasoning/logic if you can call it that is just bad.

why would you worry about people not scum reading you?

Because almost every town game I am universally townread has gone horribly horribly wrong.

Lol but you know that’s not true. We won Labrynth, remember?

[Nancy Drew 39]

What I'm leaning on is that no power negation was used on ank last night and she died cause of using medium/scum thought she is safe kill cause she said she is doing medium.

we also need to medium her to make sure titus gave a power to ank in first place last night.

That’s my main reason for not voting her today. If Titus lied about Ank power, I’m fine with lynching there.

[MathBlade]

Let us say you would actually have concerns about why ank died over me. Let me spin this chessboard around.

why would anyone have such concerns? cause they thought I was a more towny/valuable player than ank and that I could die. So as a person with a real concern you start the day saying why fa is alive over ank. Lets say you're also lazy to investigate that question that you had. you don't check the mechanics cause you're lazy. you don't check ank reads cause your lazy. and you come in saying I have mix feelings about fa cause she is alive. later when fa points out you act with stubbornness and throw those reasons/important things in trashcan and say if you're obvtown just become one instead of taking a stance.

It's either that or you not giving a fuck about why ank died over me and you wanting to mention it just so you look in a way that you're hunting.

I actually HAVE been floating that question in my mind.

I have been checking mechanics but they are just that mechanics. I am investigating that question just by listening. It is troublesome but that may be wine scum are throwing to manipulate me.

I am also wondering why I am so townread. It has me nervous that the only person scumreading me is 404 and 404’s reasoning/logic if you can call it that is just bad.

why would you worry about people not scum reading you?

Because almost every town game I am universally townread has gone horribly horribly wrong.

Lol but you know that’s not true. We won Labrynth, remember?

I was horrible that game XD

I had good reasons for my reads but they were bad.

Thanks for trying though. Mainly I just see a lot of mechanics talk and not much on reads from people. It’s disheartening.

[MathBlade]

At least I ate a bullet that game.

[MathBlade]

FA already cleared that up but the irony of you reiterating FA’s math question - like what are the odds? XDD

I...don't like the tone of this

Why? What don’t you get about math/Math?

But I guess I’ll just have to spell it out for you I suppose. *sigh*

The subject involved a

math

question.

The poster I’m referencing is called

MATH

blade.

Halfway debating replacing in as an alt so this type of stuff doesn’t continue.

[Nancy Drew 39]

At least I ate a bullet that game.

Tbf, with no NK before LYLO, I don’t see any world we don’t lynch random.

[Sando]

@sando, can you list every player you have a scum read/scum lean on in case you are to be lynched?

How about my wagon, they're in order of confidence within each group:

Scum:
the worst - this should be obvious, you don't need me to flip to see how bad that move was from duckling
Nos - I've outlined repeatedly why this is scum, but I think using a tunnel on me for three days to avoid doing anything means that some-point soon you're gonna have to sort it.
Gaaaaap goes 'ere
Gamma - Urgh, the jumps onto me have been bad, and I really haven't seen him contribute anything, but saying that me pointing out that I shouldn't be lynched pre-leader sorting is scummy is pretty lol
Titus - Nothing about the wagon is particularly bad from Titus, I find her independently scummy
Toog - Nothing changed here from last discussion

Town:
Sakura - Even the "terrible" 180 has been described in harsher terms by Sakura than I would give credence to, I think this is town genuinely trying to get the most out of the wagons
Creature - Creature is creature, this looks like town creature
Kokichi - Urgh, the jump onto me is stupid and lazy, but then I'm pretty sure Kokichi is stupid and lazy...

Others of note:
FA I'd consider basically 0% chance of scum at this point. My initial fears (the same ones people seemingly have about Titus) were answered by Shiro/Cerb, so unless something there is shown to be false I wouldn't bother looking there. I think she's wrong about the Ank kill and I don't think should be leader again anytime soon (I don't think it's a good idea to elect people more than once or twice regardless), but I can't see scum here at all. If shiro flips scum I'd give FA maybe 1% chance of being scum, and if the medium turned out to be a really elaborate lie I'd be willing to lynch FA, but other than that, 100% town.

Stungun - Town, pretty obvious and will be more when I flip town

Nancy - Townlean, some setup spec here borders on poor enough logically to be scummy, but overall I think a townie slot

Math - Town, but I think flowndering and I think a bit of a pocket target for scum, has reigned it in D3 which is I think overall positive for town and we're getting better from him.

zMM - I'm really struggling to read zMM, but townlean probably

Shiro - Town, I don't think scum gambit to link with Cerb unless it serves a purpose. Only purpose I could see was protecting scum-FA but actually being linked with town-Cerb who is clearing FA of that particular accusation says that's not the gambit.

Tora - Scumlean, the buddying with me D1 was weird and I eventually progressed to a scumread then, that hasn't changed.

Drixx - My D3 wagon in light of his push D2 on me is fairly interesting, I don't know what to make of it, but it's interesting I think.

[zMuffinMan]

Stungun - Town, pretty obvious and will be more when I flip town

y?

[Sando]

Stungun - Town, pretty obvious and will be more when I flip town

y?

Comes in and consistently TRs the easy D3 mislynch, instead of being "talked around" to me being scum and getting the mislynch or just ignoring it and getting the mislynch, doubles-down on me being town.

[zMuffinMan]

yes, that's why i asked "y?"

those are all things scum would do when a mislynch is probably gonna go through anyway but even if it doesn't who cares?

[Sando]

those are all things scum would do when a mislynch is probably gonna go through anyway but even if it doesn't who cares?

To that degree? I mean sure, scum would love to cred for TRing a town-slot that gets mislynched, but it's a matter of degrees and opportunities. Also did the slot need the TR? Without me being town-flipped I doubt I'm the only person with a decently strong TR of the slot, why call attention to the wagon for extra cred?

[Nancy Drew 39]

yes, that's why i asked "y?"

those are all things scum would do when a mislynch is probably gonna go through anyway but even if it doesn't who cares?

The really important thing is that Sando’s walls don’t make me want to gauge my eyes out with hot pokers.

[Nancy Drew 39]

yes, that's why i asked "y?"

those are all things scum would do when a mislynch is probably gonna go through anyway but even if it doesn't who cares?

The really important thing is that Sando’s walls don’t make me want to gauge my eyes out with hot pokers.

But seriously, probable mislynch.

[stungun0404]

yes, that's why i asked "y?"

those are all things scum would do when a mislynch is probably gonna go through anyway but even if it doesn't who cares?

it is true that scum could fight the mislynch — i won’t lie and i’ll admit that i’ve done that before as scum. however, this is a more genuine push that i would probably not make as scum and is based off a comment sando made in rvs in 34 that actively works to make the job for scum harder. what scum motive is there EVER to actively make their job harder? i don’t care what the circumstances are — that’s anti-wincon theoretically speaking. occam’s razor would support this as being town, not scum.

also, why haven’t you answered my questions yet? the longer they go unanswered, the more my townread fades on you.

[zMuffinMan]

lol @ thinking im paying close enough attention to this game to notice anything asked me in the mass of useless posts i skipped

[stungun0404]

i’ll make it easy for you, zmuffinman

@zmuffinman, is gamma emerald likelier to flip town or scum in your opinion? and why?

[zMuffinMan]

dunno, i need to read stuff =]

i thought town previously but hes on my reassess-and-make-sure-im-not-missing-something list

[stungun0404]

thank you sando for providing the full reads list btw!

[stungun0404]

@frozenangel, for the slots that so far cumulatively have less than 150 posts in the thread, who do you feel is towniest and why?

I suck at reading people who I haven't engaged with.

It's a talent I lack so i just avoid these slots and watch them from distance as other people take stances about them then I evaluate their reactions to such stances and those pushes to see whay I think about those slots.

But from top of my head, I liked the little posts brandi posted, Creature was in his town meta imo when he was posting actual stuff. I'm not sure about you and nosfertu yet and I must do my deep readings to form a more solid opinion on your slots.

Toogeloo and Katsuki are in different levels of slight scum imo first for the way they were derping earlier which just felt fake and excessive there and because of molla and second because of hard active-lurking

I really need to check hebichan iso before saying things about them eitherway

why not engage with people with lesser content? maybe it’ll get them to start speaking up! there’s no reason not to. :p

i would like to see you commit to someone in particular there by taking a hard stance. would creature be your choice if you had to choose one then, and if so why? or would it be my slot because i replaced in for brandi who you mentioned there, and if so why?

[MathBlade]

@sando, can you list every player you have a scum read/scum lean on in case you are to be lynched?

How about my wagon, they're in order of confidence within each group:

Scum:
the worst - this should be obvious, you don't need me to flip to see how bad that move was from duckling
Nos - I've outlined repeatedly why this is scum, but I think using a tunnel on me for three days to avoid doing anything means that some-point soon you're gonna have to sort it.
Gaaaaap goes 'ere
Gamma - Urgh, the jumps onto me have been bad, and I really haven't seen him contribute anything, but saying that me pointing out that I shouldn't be lynched pre-leader sorting is scummy is pretty lol
Titus - Nothing about the wagon is particularly bad from Titus, I find her independently scummy
Toog - Nothing changed here from last discussion

Town:
Sakura - Even the "terrible" 180 has been described in harsher terms by Sakura than I would give credence to, I think this is town genuinely trying to get the most out of the wagons
Creature - Creature is creature, this looks like town creature
Kokichi - Urgh, the jump onto me is stupid and lazy, but then I'm pretty sure Kokichi is stupid and lazy...

Others of note:
FA I'd consider basically 0% chance of scum at this point. My initial fears (the same ones people seemingly have about Titus) were answered by Shiro/Cerb, so unless something there is shown to be false I wouldn't bother looking there. I think she's wrong about the Ank kill and I don't think should be leader again anytime soon (I don't think it's a good idea to elect people more than once or twice regardless), but I can't see scum here at all. If shiro flips scum I'd give FA maybe 1% chance of being scum, and if the medium turned out to be a really elaborate lie I'd be willing to lynch FA, but other than that, 100% town.

Stungun - Town, pretty obvious and will be more when I flip town

Nancy - Townlean, some setup spec here borders on poor enough logically to be scummy, but overall I think a townie slot

Math - Town, but I think flowndering and I think a bit of a pocket target for scum, has reigned it in D3 which is I think overall positive for town and we're getting better from him.

zMM - I'm really struggling to read zMM, but townlean probably

Shiro - Town, I don't think scum gambit to link with Cerb unless it serves a purpose. Only purpose I could see was protecting scum-FA but actually being linked with town-Cerb who is clearing FA of that particular accusation says that's not the gambit.

Tora - Scumlean, the buddying with me D1 was weird and I eventually progressed to a scumread then, that hasn't changed.

Drixx - My D3 wagon in light of his push D2 on me is fairly interesting, I don't know what to make of it, but it's interesting I think.

Don’t get me wrong some setup spec points can be scummy ala Titus for example with the randomization bullshit.

What matters is the intent.

A town player can be absolutely horrible at mechanics but what matters is the intent.

Take Shiro for example. I can think of reasons scum!Shiro would take FA I can think of all sorts of things scum could do to fuck with me and the rest of town. It feels like you’re starting from “this is how I expect things to be played” instead of “this is reality” what is it telling me.