I will never subscribe to a read based on 'tone'.In post 2335, projectmatt wrote:anyway for clarity, i scumread moment largely for tone issues (i articulated it in the post above.)
yay playstyle clashesIn post 2350, Brian Skies wrote:I will never subscribe to a read based on 'tone'.In post 2335, projectmatt wrote:anyway for clarity, i scumread moment largely for tone issues (i articulated it in the post above.)
1) I don't think a lot of players are actually very good at doing this, and most of the time it's mostly because they're just bad at explaining reads.
2) I don't read players on tone anyway.
3) Scum can easily try to substantiate a 'scumread' based on just 'tone' and I've seen them do this.
again, i'm not about to make up reasons and grasp at straws just so i can justify why moment is mafia. i think he feels off. i think his tone feels manipulative.In post 2000, projectmatt wrote:i do try to feel my way into scumreads, and why is that a bad thing? the thing about reading games based on tone is that you subconsciously pick up on stuff that you may not be able to put into words. i think it's completely valid to assert that a post feels "off", and i don't see the need to make up some fake logic about why i found it bad as opposed to being honest and saying that i think his tone is scummy.
You would think that theIn post 2132, projectmatt wrote:as for my actual top choice, i'd probably want to vote muffin ormoment. i'll elaborate on those when it's not 4 am.
In post 2337, projectmatt wrote:i came to the realization that a lot of the reasons i scumread sakura seem to boil down to playstyle/site meta that im not familiar with, as opposed to legitimate scumtells. her play improved considerably after my original catch-up post. their tone reads a lot more sincere and i think they're approaching the game in a way that scum almost definitely wouldn't. stuff like this:In post 2334, Spiffeh wrote:What changed your mind?
In post 2094, Sakura Hana wrote:Actually I have a gut feeling that purrcocet is scum, but i dont care enough right now.
or
doesn't look scum-motivated to me at all. it is fence-sitting like i pointed out previously, but the difference is that sakura is being brutally honest about their indifference/apathy toward getting their reads lynched, and that makes a lot more sense coming from a town perspective than a scum one.In post 1104, Sakura Hana wrote:Tbh, i do think muffin's scum, but i feel kinda nervous/anxious about lynching him coz i'd feel bad if he's actually town here and im wrong.
UNVOTE: MattIn post 2335, projectmatt wrote:anyway for clarity, i scumread moment largely for tone issues (i articulated it in the post above.)
i scumread muffin because his reads feel weirdly non-commital and stuff like this pings the hell out of me:
i dont get the impression from his posts that he's trying to gamesolve or sincerely find the mafia, but it does look to me like he's posturing between a bunch of different scumreads and relying on his erratic playstyle to justify not articulating himself.In post 2118, zMuffinMan wrote:my evil conscience is like "STOP OVERTHINKING SHIT, IT'S NANCY TBG" but my good conscience doesn't fully trust my evil conscience and is like "but nancy could just be bad. maybe maria tbg?" and both consciences are too busy doing other things to really give a shit about who's right tbh
i elaborated on muffin and i re-explained why i think moment is mafia based on his tone. i guess maybe saying "ill elaborate later" was misleading, but i stand by my read.In post 2355, Brian Skies wrote:You would think that theIn post 2132, projectmatt wrote:as for my actual top choice, i'd probably want to vote muffin ormoment. i'll elaborate on those when it's not 4 am.elaborationwould be more than just 'tone.' But that's just me.
In post 2341, projectmatt wrote:maybe one day when i manage to perfectly adhere to mafiascum.net site meta and become a household personality i'll stop getting mislynched in games
Her and Dunn is tvt and I don't think either of them are fake sorting the otherBrian Skies wrote:Where did this happen?In post 2336, Purrcocet wrote:Cause she towntold?
He's either pushing obvtown or trying to act like Tbg slot is scmmier than it isBrian Skies wrote:
How would you know if all his Srs are town?
I feel better about Muffin being scum than Matt.In post 2339, Purrcocet wrote:Brian townreading muffin makes this weirder for me
I'd probably be willing to vote muffin if Nancy Wisdom Moment join the fun
i completely agree with this btwIn post 2359, Ankamius wrote:306 was a huge post of a bunch of soft stances and wording it in a way that is both incredibly useless and yet can be used as a way to ensure that taking certain hard stances later will feel more natural while also not feeling all that bad if you need to go the opposite way because of how weak the read is.
It's literally a read of 'looking busy and providing outs'
ISO him in Minuet and see if your conclusions change.In post 2354, projectmatt wrote:again, i'm not about to make up reasons and grasp at straws just so i can justify why moment is mafia. i think he feels off. i think his tone feels manipulative.In post 2000, projectmatt wrote:i do try to feel my way into scumreads, and why is that a bad thing? the thing about reading games based on tone is that you subconsciously pick up on stuff that you may not be able to put into words. i think it's completely valid to assert that a post feels "off", and i don't see the need to make up some fake logic about why i found it bad as opposed to being honest and saying that i think his tone is scummy.
Why would you switch? What about anything Matt's said makes you think he's town here?In post 2361, Purrcocet wrote:granted 3-4 of the people on your wagon haven't even said anything but "site meta" is hardly why you're being lynched
i'm probably willing to switch
So which of these was a 'towntell'?In post 2361, Purrcocet wrote:Her and Dunn is tvt and I don't think either of them are fake sorting the other
A lot of her posting and stances that's been pointed out as "scummy" probably indicates the opposite to that effect
I'm pretty sure scum Maria doesn't just fold when pushed
She had minimal pressure on her and Ate'd or something
I was scumreading her hard too
it's speculative and insecure but it also outs definite reads and puts pressure on another player.In post 113, Moment wrote:Not all that much to do before we can vote. I've got light townreads for one (likely poor) reason or another on Kokichi, HS, hebichan and Dunnstral.
If I could vote, it'd likely be on Kaede for this post:I have a hard time believing that anyone could actually have this sort of thought process and ask that question.In post 82, Kaede Akamatsu wrote:What makes you think it's a fake claim?In post 79, Dunnstral wrote:Nice fakeclaimIn post 77, mastina wrote:BTW investigatives should stay off me; they'd be wasting their action.
I'm a D3 Innocent Child.
If you are wondering, no, not automatic; I have to manually trigger it.
Reveal
it reads to me like moment is scared to commit to any reads or even to interrogate another player. it feels like his express purpose is keeping his options open while still setting up to vote people later in the game. this is different from his first post in minuet, in which he takes hard stances and asserts himself.In post 306, Moment wrote:Oh, I guess I wasn't really clear in my wording; I didn't mean that I had past-tense "gotten" a chance to look through things, I meant that my chance started right then (and is now completed).In post 303, projectmatt wrote:do you have reads?
No strong reads as of yet, but I've got some leans going either way. Kokichi, you (matt), Dunnstral, Nancy andperhapsSakura (pending taking a look back at the last game for comparison on something) all seem town enough to me for now. I agree with others on Ankamius' posting just in general not being the best so far, but that's not really a strong scumread at all.
I haven't liked some of what Spiffeh has been saying; specifically, it was these two lines that really stuck out to me:In post 157, Spiffeh wrote:Nancy, you admit yourself that your early game is inconsistent but when you're wagoned you say that they shouldn't be scum reading you here because of how you acted in the beginning of Necromancer.The first line from 157 is logically correct, but it's the kind of logically correct thing that someone could point out regardless of alignment, and I feel like a scum Spiffeh would be more apt to take that opportunity to point it out than a town Spiffeh. When it comes to Nancy Drew, that kind of logical inconsistency really doesn't seem particularly alignment relevant - at least, that's how it seems to me - and so pointing it out would be more of an attempt to look like you're doing something than actually doing something.In post 202, Spiffeh wrote:Some would argue that there won’t be any meaningful contribution before votes actually count.
The second quote really just stuck out to me for the wording. He wasn't making that argument, he was just saying that "some would argue" that. It's weasel wording which, in all honesty, is probably not scum indicative, especially for such a tangentially alignment-related issue as the starting of the day. Even still, it stuck out to me upon reading through and I felt it worth mentioning.
first one if you wantBrian Skies wrote:In post 2361, Purrcocet wrote:Her and Dunn is tvt and I don't think either of them are fake sorting the other
So which of these was a 'towntell'?
In post 1599, Moment wrote:Oh, I kind of skipped over the Maria discussion. Having read back through the game during the night, I didn't think that scum Maria would talk about the Mylo wagon the way she did. I'd imagine that scum, seeing their partner go down, would almost always choose to try to gain some kind of credit from it rather than make a defense that would certainly be futile. Some of these quotes should show what I'm referring to:
Spoiler:
In contrast to scum betraying their knowledge of everyone's alignment, I feel like comments such as these betray alackof informedness.
In post 2367, projectmatt wrote:it reads to me like moment is scared to commit to any reads or even to interrogate another player. it feels like his express purpose is keeping his options open while still setting up to vote people later in the game. this is different from his first post in minuet, in which he takes hard stances and asserts himself.In post 306, Moment wrote:Oh, I guess I wasn't really clear in my wording; I didn't mean that I had past-tense "gotten" a chance to look through things, I meant that my chance started right then (and is now completed).In post 303, projectmatt wrote:do you have reads?
No strong reads as of yet, but I've got some leans going either way. Kokichi, you (matt), Dunnstral, Nancy andperhapsSakura (pending taking a look back at the last game for comparison on something) all seem town enough to me for now. I agree with others on Ankamius' posting just in general not being the best so far, but that's not really a strong scumread at all.
I haven't liked some of what Spiffeh has been saying; specifically, it was these two lines that really stuck out to me:In post 157, Spiffeh wrote:Nancy, you admit yourself that your early game is inconsistent but when you're wagoned you say that they shouldn't be scum reading you here because of how you acted in the beginning of Necromancer.The first line from 157 is logically correct, but it's the kind of logically correct thing that someone could point out regardless of alignment, and I feel like a scum Spiffeh would be more apt to take that opportunity to point it out than a town Spiffeh. When it comes to Nancy Drew, that kind of logical inconsistency really doesn't seem particularly alignment relevant - at least, that's how it seems to me - and so pointing it out would be more of an attempt to look like you're doing something than actually doing something.In post 202, Spiffeh wrote:Some would argue that there won’t be any meaningful contribution before votes actually count.
The second quote really just stuck out to me for the wording. He wasn't making that argument, he was just saying that "some would argue" that. It's weasel wording which, in all honesty, is probably not scum indicative, especially for such a tangentially alignment-related issue as the starting of the day. Even still, it stuck out to me upon reading through and I felt it worth mentioning.
I don't think anything he's posted here is insecure or noncommittal (that would actually more aptly describe your play, not his). And his immediately following post segues nicely into where he does actually end up moving his vote. Nos' posts up to that point did feel incredibly forced at the time, and it was a read I agreed with him on.In post 307, Moment wrote:And despite all those words spent on Spiffeh, I think the best place for my vote is actually on Nosferatu. His series of posts starting at 292 strikes me as forced, and I feel more confident in that actually being scum indicative than any of the other thoughts I've mentioned so far.
I'll also be keeping my eye on Mylo and MariaR.
VOTE: Nosferatu
Really? Because his posts read as him whining that people are scumreading him. Not to mention he even at one point said he should be read as obvtown, and I don't think there's anything in his iso that should indicate this.In post 2370, Purrcocet wrote:i don't think matt is trying to pander to us so he can live
i think he believes some of the things he says that i think are crazy
i believe his actions re:nancy slot more than I do muffins
i also can see him scumreading moment cause i totally misread them last game