SUPP 2017 MAFIA: COMPLETE

[Shoshin]

not pulling some fake guilty nonsense

I wonder if you were inspired by Fire's play, in which case you knew his alignment before his flip...

[Shoshin]

DV, why'd you use your role on Nahdia?

[the worst]

not pulling some fake guilty nonsense

I wonder if you were inspired by Fire's play, in which case you knew his alignment before his flip...

heh have you read much of my scum meta?

[Shoshin]

VOTE: PenguinPower

The Nahdia wagon is also cool, but with no Nahdia around I would feel a bit empty voting there right now.

Really bad vote that got the PP wagon going. Will come back to this. Also,

Also, just going to go with Screen's reads and vote his lowest ranked person, for the moment.

VOTE: PenguinPower

I have no issues sharing his rankings if someone asks.

This is equally as bad.

I'm fairly confident there's scum in these votes.

[Shoshin]

not pulling some fake guilty nonsense

I wonder if you were inspired by Fire's play, in which case you knew his alignment before his flip...

heh have you read much of my scum meta?

Nah, I've got the one town game with you and the other ongoing games. I've skimmed your posts when reading others but haven't really looked into your meta. You seem like one of those people who don't have a meaningful meta, better to just focus on what you do in each specific game.

[the worst]

huh so Krazy roleblocked DV last night?
do we know what's up with the cat thing? (I recall that's DV's doing)

[Shoshin]

Yeah, we need DV's claim. He said his role has two parts, both provable...

[Shoshin]

We also need your claim, duckling.

[the worst]

I'll claim after we work out the Krazy/DV shenanigans. also gonna collate claims starting now.

[the worst]

Punreader - BP to all players ranked lower, vig to all players ranked lower 
DeasVail - cats??!?!!!?
Espeonage - some betting thing I think he lost
the worst - it's a surprise
Shoshin - ???
Krazy - roleblocking thing???
guacamole - Connector
Vaxkiller - shady unproven vig claim


have I missed anything?

[Shoshin]

So why would one post destroy your entire scumread on PP? And if it did why focus exclusively on someone to the exclusion of all others if your case is that bad?

Look at these questions, MWNN. How are these not evidence that Sheperd is pre-inclined to read me as scum?

I just think there's a big difference between misrepresenting something and being mistaken. I don't think there is enough in that one post to make the leap to misrepresentation and lynch him based on it.

I don't like this.

[Shoshin]

DV, what're your thoughts on Sheperd?

I’m on the road right now and have only skimmed their posts but they’re still on my potential scum pile.

I just want to lynch PP tbh

I also don't like this.

[Shoshin]

I'm ranking immune townie.

[Shoshin]

Also Chara I’m interested in if you gained anything from asking for links to my recent games or was that just an empty question.

I’d also like to know why you’re suspicious of me being potentially open to lynches of PP, Nahdia-slot and Shoshin. I would think it pretty usual for someone to be potentially open to more than one lynch, and you have also expressed an openness to multiple lynch options, so it seems weird that you would scumread it.

This is also bad.

DV keeps saying he's open to lynching Nahdia's slot but everything he's doing when pushed on the slot suggests otherwise.

[Shoshin]

DV, can you say a bit about why you want to lynch PP over Sheperd?

While I have reasons for scumreading PP as I’ve described in-thread, I don’t have anything specific on Shepard to scumread. I mildly townread Nahdia Day 1 for her spearheading the end day movement, but by the beginning of Day 2 I wasn’t feeling the townread so much anymore. But still not as suspicious for scum as PP imo. I do plan on looking at Shepard’s entrance more closely when I get more time, but from first impressions, I don’t get strong scum vibes. There may be a weak town tell based on how they’ve interacted with me today, but I want to see more before divulging what I’ve been looking out for.

This is bad. I basically called out exactly why Shepard was scum and he's referring to some vague towntell to justify PP.

[Shoshin]

gut has spoken

VOTE: Shoshin

Wow, terrrible vote. Joins Shepard on me instead of making any decision between PP and Shepard.

[Shoshin]

If it comes to a 1v1 between you and CShep my initial read had his slot down as town, and I actually think his case on you is reasonable. I'm not sure what you mean by saying that you don't think his reasons are adequate coming from him to vote you but if he's caught up and found you scummy that's kinda... how scumreads work.... :/

Terrible.

[the worst]

Punreader - BP to all players ranked lower, vig to all players ranked lower 
DeasVail - cats??!?!!!?
Espeonage - had a bet with Dunn that Vaxk would be ranked higher han FA (lost)
the worst - ???
Shoshin - Ranking immune townie
Krazy - roleblocking thing???
guacamole - Connector
Vaxkiller - shady unproven vig claim

[Shoshin]

Probably - I'll need to reread the past few pages for comprehension, but that's not convincing enough to say he's scum.

Why's he misinterpreting my posts if he's town?

There's more than enough to say he's scum. It's the misinterpretation plus the fact that Shepard likes playing with me as town so he wouldn't have been inclined to misinterpret, plus the fact that he's scum by poe, plus the fact that he's skirting around the issue of PP's alignment (first he says PP is scum because of my case, then he says PP is scum only if I'm scum?).

Shepard is really good as scum so you can't clear him because he sounds a bit town, you need to look at precisely what he's doing, who he's defending, who he's attacking, and how he's reading the game.

He entered the game defending PP by voting Fire. But then he says PP is probably scum because of my case, but instead of ever voting PP, he votes me because I unvoted PP. Then he says PP isn't scum unless I'm scum. His logic lacks any internal consistency. How is PP scum for behaviors until the point where I unvote, after which PP is scum only if I'm scum?

Anyway, this post should clear me. No way I lobby this hard for votes on Shepard. I'm forcefully trying to get every single undecided player to switch onto Shepard here. If I had been successful, Shepard gets lynched D2 over PP.

[Shoshin]

Taly, you obviously don't understand how Shepard plays as scum. His response to being copped as scum would in almost all cases be "fuck yeah," because that's how he plays as scum.

More lobbying on my part. This doesn't happen if I'm scum.

[Shoshin]

I would like to not be prodded, but also, I'm not looking how the focus went from working together to all of a sudden some people got spooked by a wagon.

VOTE: PenguinPower

I'll be back on Monday

As I start lobbying for Shepard votes, MWNN puts his vote back on PP. Okay, not good for MWNN.

[the worst]

going by our meta and experience with reading each other I'd be really surprised if MWNN was scum here.
that slot's use of its power has been pretty solid from what I've seen, too.

[Shoshin]

i'm so so tired and i am really not going to case anyone, but i think ManWithNoName is a great candidate for scum and that's based on his play, not Srceen's. i know this because i forgot he had replaced Srceen until i checked just now.
not interested in lynching Shoshin anymore. i've decided to listen to those few moments of "oh, this really looks honest" over the parts that bother me.

wish we had more time because there are a bunch of things i want to look at in light of that but can't.
Deas/Shepard/NoName/someone i overlooked?
could be Penguin but it feels easy. i don't want to have been fooled by him, though.

Very good post from Chara.

[Shoshin]

going by our meta and experience with reading each other I'd be really surprised if MWNN was scum here.
that slot's use of its power has been pretty solid from what I've seen, too.

I don't put much stock in your reads, sorry. MWNN's play was atrocious on D2. How can you say he's town after that? What's the towntell you're relying on that outweighs his refusal to come anywhere close to lynching Shepard?

[Shoshin]

worst: granted, NoName scum has a lot to do with Penguin-town being a thing. so if i'm wrong there, this read doesn't matter. (and i could be wrong, i suck at this.)
it's a combination of small things. unlike Shoshin, there isn't anything from NoName where i can look at it and think 'hmm, that's towny.' his entrance pinged me as scum who was very concerned with the player he'd replaced, too.
also, the speed of the Penguin wagon. NoName's argument is that the wagon being around for a while means it's been difficult to form, and therefore scum are protecting him. if that were the case to NoName, i'd expect some sort of judgement on players like myself who are resisting it. instead it's a very general "his partners are trying for other wagons". that, and a player being unpopular but not getting immediately lynched doesn't make them scum.

unfortunately, Penguin-scum doesn't make NoName town, but it does mean that most of this case is irrelevant.

Another good post from Chara on MWNN and Penguin.