Heroes Wanted! (Game Over)

[Toranaga]

one aspect of the ank kill on n2 is that she could have chosen BP on n1 (unless she claimed otherwise), and titus could not have both given ank power and also kill her on n2 without power negation. furthermore, taking power negation is by far the most sensible thing scum can do there.

if scum had power negation on n2, and titus had access to precog, then at least 1 scum other than titus got powers on n2.

stungun's NK on n4, and to a lesser extent shiro's NK on n3, are evidence that scum does not have power negation. stungun's NK is especially difficult to understand otherwise as he had no powers and wasn't a major townread/in townblock.

if scum had power negation on n2 but not on n4, that means titus was the one with power negation, which means another scum player picked precognition on n2 and coordinated with titus so she could claim that.

[hebichan]

Sure nero

VOTE: kokichi

[Drixx]

Math is "town" as in he has a green pm, I'd be most worried about Drixx as scum. His use of the doctor ability yesterday was extremely shady and I don't think he's really explained his reasoning yet.

I did. You just don't agree with me about the potential for unknowns to screw with us. Since you have less experience with me than my brain said you did when you entered the game, I would suggest you go look at Space Dandy 2. Mostly just the post-game and then check the hydra PT between Cerberus and I. We thought we were being aggressively paranoid and even we didn't realize scum could win day one.

I can't know what is hidden from us in this game, so I choose to think of what is the worst case scenario possible and act accordingly. What was the worst case last night? If the primary leader choice was killed off, we would be in disarray. BP negates one "strength" of kills. Add strongman and it's a +2 kill so it needs BP plus another protection.

That's not really hard to understand is it?

[Drixx]

@Nero - I'd appreciate a concise and specific list after the game of what is "bad" and what is "scummy" and why. Bad needs fixing. Scummy to casual view I don't give a shit about. My job isn't to be the most obvious townie who ever towned and get myself night killed straightaway. Especially since I'm hilariously bad on day one. It's basically a signature of Drixx play that you are going to suspect me.

I can throw out posts which tend to result in town recognizing me. I've done so this game and most of the folks I believe are probably town seem to believe the same about me. That's sufficient for my purposes. As long as I can advance our win con, I don't mind dying from paranoia when it's safe for that to happen.

[Sakura Hana]

I think strongman by definition bypasses all protections no matter how many you add on top of each other. Whether SS does that's another thing and i didnt think of asking the mod, but by definition it does look like the same.

But at least i know your thought process now.

[Toranaga]

we are not doing math's plan because it's not a good plan.

town benefits from playing this setup slowly. we control the leader and the abilities. we have ways to parse out our current POE and get the remaining scum.

why are we even considering that giving a bunch of POE'd down players access to the abilities is a good idea? we don't know if scum is infiltrated in towncore or not. we are not nuking this game on the hope that mafia doesn't have abilities with which to defend and redirect actions against them.

[Sakura Hana]

Can u guys parse a list for me of who's pro plan and who isnt like this

3 Bombs: Nero, Math
2 Bombs: FA
1 Bomb:
0 Bombs (basically no blow ups): Drixx

I promise ill take your opinions in mind over my own, and we can also use this as information to analyse.
Also leaders Nero and FA, choose who you want to vote. Tomorrow if we dont have 3 bombers then ill adjust my team list accordingly.

[Toranaga]

I'm heavily against the entire thing.

[Toranaga]

which has already been established multiple times it can’t

Why it can't happen?!

how did you establish this?!

It's litteraly near certain that a scum with power negation is in the game with titus flip.

No. It’s very likely scum have a power.

It’s unlikely that is power negate due to the townblock not dying and due to Tor getting his check off supposedly. They would have to have holstered three nights in a row for negate. The odds of that are small to infinestimal as noted by others

Makes no sense. why would scum (who had also titus) choose another power over power negate night 2? like how can you assume that? It's WAY more likely that they used power negate with shiro ank kill and holestered last night or used it on stungun to make sure he dies and nothing itefers.

Because Titus is an arrogant scum player who would likely think negate is inherently scummy.

Like this is completely irrational paranoia. It does not make sense.

ocaam razor says there is a power negation in game cause titus was scum. And yes the ability is scummy hence why she hide who got that power. If she wnated them to have a towny power she wouldn't choose a hidden scum for the ability.

You can say she didn't give any power to a scum instead of ank then with that logic but yours is built on moon.

oh god you've been saying this.

yes there was power negation! because ank died and titus was scum.

if titus had it or if power negation is sitting with a hidden scum player we don't know. stun's NK points at no power negation, which actually makes mathblade scum a lot here, as for titus to have power negation, at least one of her scumbuddies need to have picked precog in her place. and math picked precog.

I'm actually really uneasy that math (who picked precog n2, who gave stun power the same night wolves unexplicably NKed him) is also the loudest one about a ridiculously dangerous bombing idea that ultimately only benefits scum.

[Toranaga]

if wolves are all in POE, we will win this game anyway.

if there are hidden wolves who were picked by leaders or chosen leaders, we are handing them free kills. that's the only thing we're doing.

and we know for a fact that at least one scum was leader and we don't even know all the people she gave power to.

please wake up people.

[MathBlade]

Math I will literally kill you irl if you petrify anyone unless if only one scum is remaining. Hopefully there is also a healer around to revert the effect then for a safe victory

What a joy to come back to this.

FA this post is way over a line. I get that you and I disagree on setup. You have officially killed my will to care about anything in this game. I understand you are a passionate player. I know you as a person and I don’t think you would actually do this. However the mere fact you would threaten my in body persona of a game in order to win it is downright disgusting.

Especially to someone who you believe is on your own team. You made your points earlier and I said I was fine with bombing Creature if no Petrification. I took SS in order to try to trick scum into wasting a negate on me because I figured Sakura and you were higher priority targets.

However if I am going to be treated like the person behind the keyboard is not worth breaking simply for a different mechanical stance then even though I think Sakura’s plan is the best I withdraw my support for it. Right now I am trying to convince myself to care about this game as a whole.

If the townblock is going to threaten any voice that disagrees with bodily harm or other things that cross site rules I would rather have fun than continue to discuss the point. It won’t change my belief.

However that being said if we aren’t doing 3 doing none is the safer option after three. Two still doesn’t alleviate the townblock problem (neither does any but zero is still a little bit more risky than three)

Risk ordering: three zero one two

And for those of you who wish to know I am town I have literally nothing to offer you. I have not played this game to townfirm myself only to try to help us win. I broke down all of the math and the numbers and asked several times for input from people who I knew mechanics knowledge are sound and they did not provide a flaw other than what is in the town block.

I just really don’t care right now.

If anyone has any questions let me know. Otherwise I am checking out of this thread before I become a pile of mush.

[Toranaga]

VOTE: mathblade

[MathBlade]

which has already been established multiple times it can’t

Why it can't happen?!

how did you establish this?!

It's litteraly near certain that a scum with power negation is in the game with titus flip.

No. It’s very likely scum have a power.

It’s unlikely that is power negate due to the townblock not dying and due to Tor getting his check off supposedly. They would have to have holstered three nights in a row for negate. The odds of that are small to infinestimal as noted by others

Makes no sense. why would scum (who had also titus) choose another power over power negate night 2? like how can you assume that? It's WAY more likely that they used power negate with shiro ank kill and holestered last night or used it on stungun to make sure he dies and nothing itefers.

Because Titus is an arrogant scum player who would likely think negate is inherently scummy.

Like this is completely irrational paranoia. It does not make sense.

ocaam razor says there is a power negation in game cause titus was scum. And yes the ability is scummy hence why she hide who got that power. If she wnated them to have a towny power she wouldn't choose a hidden scum for the ability.

You can say she didn't give any power to a scum instead of ank then with that logic but yours is built on moon.

oh god you've been saying this.

yes there was power negation! because ank died and titus was scum.

if titus had it or if power negation is sitting with a hidden scum player we don't know. stun's NK points at no power negation, which actually makes mathblade scum a lot here, as for titus to have power negation, at least one of her scumbuddies need to have picked precog in her place. and math picked precog.

I'm actually really uneasy that math (who picked precog n2, who gave stun power the same night wolves unexplicably NKed him) is also the loudest one about a ridiculously dangerous bombing idea that ultimately only benefits scum.

Can u guys parse a list for me of who's pro plan and who isnt like this

3 Bombs: Nero, Math
2 Bombs: FA
1 Bomb:
0 Bombs (basically no blow ups): Drixx

I promise ill take your opinions in mind over my own, and we can also use this as information to analyse.
Also leaders Nero and FA, choose who you want to vote. Tomorrow if we dont have 3 bombers then ill adjust my team list accordingly.

Put me down as I don’t give a fuck.

Because I really don’t anymore.

[MathBlade]

We have town going off the rails from a townblock I helped build.
We have people screaming at each other that they shouldn’t be alive.

We have drowned out all the voices we need to actually listen to.
We aren’t even asking questions to each other anymore we’re just talking mechanics.

It’s just not worth it.

[MathBlade]

@Nero - I'd appreciate a concise and specific list after the game of what is "bad" and what is "scummy" and why. Bad needs fixing. Scummy to casual view I don't give a shit about. My job isn't to be the most obvious townie who ever towned and get myself night killed straightaway. Especially since I'm hilariously bad on day one. It's basically a signature of Drixx play that you are going to suspect me.

I can throw out posts which tend to result in town recognizing me. I've done so this game and most of the folks I believe are probably town seem to believe the same about me. That's sufficient for my purposes. As long as I can advance our win con, I don't mind dying from paranoia when it's safe for that to happen.

This is how I feel.

I don’t see anything I am doing that is “bad” or all of a sudden worth death threats or just needing affirmation.

I am right here and people can talk with me. I also don’t mind dying for the cause so to speak but please at least give me something I can interact with. I have been bending over backwards to do this the MS way with townblocks because of the setup. I feel like I am being penalized for being open honest and transparent.

[Toranaga]

you were trying to nuke the game and give scum a bunch of kills if there's scum infiltrated in towncore

your mechanics would potentially lose us the game

that it took me so long to start figuring out the mechanics of this game is on me but you are doing this bombing plan over my dead body

[MathBlade]

I will check back in a hour maybe two. If someone has something for me to interact with I will.

[MathBlade]

you were trying to nuke the game and give scum a bunch of kills if there's scum infiltrated in towncore

your mechanics would potentially lose us the game

that it took me so long to start figuring out the mechanics of this game is on me but you are doing this bombing plan over my dead body

I already said I withdrew my support.

And three scum with power echo would be insane.

And if it would make FA feel better I can submit a precog here and now. Then everyone knows I am not using petrify.

[Sakura Hana]

Ugh, this isnt what i had in mind, i wanted healthy discussion, not people getting mad at each other >.< Can't we all please be nice.

[Toranaga]

I'll investigate how you brought this idea up.

[MathBlade]

I'll investigate how you brought this idea up.

The worst did.

Not me I enhanced it to try to be safer.

*leaves the thread*

[Sakura Hana]

Technically Theta wanted to suicide, then duckling agreed and brought up the potential plan, Math then just reinforced it.

[Toranaga]

I'll investigate how you brought this idea up.

The worst did.

Not me I enhanced it to try to be safer.

*leaves the thread*

don't be like that math :/

at some point you went from merely suggesting and not liking it to being extremely confident it would work. It CAN work, but we're not doing this cause it's gross and potentially game throwing. the setup benefits town. unnecessary kills are bad.

[Toranaga]

Technically Theta wanted to suicide, then duckling agreed and brought up the potential plan, Math then just reinforced it.

I suggest you pick your towncore and we move from there

we only lose if scum slips into our lists. if we control the abilities, we'll always control the game.

[hebichan]

I'm pro two bombs. One either to creature or me doesn't matter, and two to actual scum.