Open 737: Stack the Deck (Game Over)

[Performer]

Skitter’s post about irrel yesterday – exactly, irrel's behavior at eod 3 was suspicious as I called attention to it as well yesterday .

night action summary, more for future reference than anything else:
Ruru no bg on n1 & n2, bg on alonzo n3, bg alonzo n4
Alonzo rb enigma n2, rb me n3, rb ? n4

The problem with this is if alonzo switches to another person & suddenly there’s an nk, then people will think I did the kill. Essentially scum is framing me. This along with irrel’s hilarious accusation, actually makes me more convinced on irrel & outer chance of Korina, with fos of ruru.

Another problem is if he switches onto someone else and there is still no kill, that’s alarming too…because what if scum just keep no killing to frame people?

The good thing is even if we go 7-5-3 from d4 to d6, with poe we should be able to ultimately win this. Of course, this heavily relies on if ruru & alonzo have been telling the truth.

I don’t see a no lynch helping us more than a lynch does, for this phase.

[Alonzo]

VOTE: PERFORMER

Blocked here last night.

[Irrelephant11]

The problem with this is if alonzo switches to another person & suddenly there’s an nk, then people will think I did the kill.

I'm still writing my case post on Performer, but I think this probably seals the deal
Alonzo hadn't said he targeted Performer

[Irrelephant11]

Alonzo - who did you target?

Who did you target?

I guess he implied it, but I read this as a wifom-y "ooh what will scum do if I imply I mayyybe blocked Performer?" so Performer's above post is extremely TMI I feel

[Irrelephant11]

dangit I shouldn't have posted 3028

[ruru]

Alonzo - who did you target?

Who did you target?

*shrug*

I interpreted this as a guilty and could see performer doing the same

anyway let's not lynch anyone until we get a mod answer on happily ever after

[Performer]

It's obvious that Alonzo targeted me regardless of if he gave a straight answer. Anybody could tell from his reply, though I'm still town .
If I'm somehow the lynch today, lynch irrel tomorrow.

Still , waiting on Korina before voting.

[ofrhz]

@Mod: What happens in an endless loop of no-lynch, no-kill?

The game would end in a draw, since neither factions wincon has been achieved

[ruru]

Lynch irrelephant

[Irrelephant11]

If you can prove mechanically that town always wins this with me dead, and if you'll hear me out on Performer before I go, I'm still fine with that.

I have a long draft regarding Performer but I have to go afk so I'll post it & more tomorrow

[ruru]

I mean if scum is in {you, enigma, performer} then lynching those three wins the game even if alonzo literally goes afk

skitter is 99% town

korina is 95% town

if alonzo is scum he gamethrew

if I'm scum I gamethrew

[Irrelephant11]

yes hello
@game

I'm not scum so if you're just settled on me at least do some work to sort for tomorrow's lynch. I would've shot last night, btw. There were good odds I'd be targeted based on what people told Alonzo to do, so what would be the point in holstering?

Anyway, performer slot case incoming

[Performer]

I mean if scum is in {you, enigma, performer} then lynching those three wins the game even if alonzo literally goes afk

skitter is 99% town

korina is 95% town

if alonzo is scum he gamethrew

if I'm scum I gamethrew

Why would enigma be in the scum pool?
Why would alonzo go afk?? He's not the kind of person I imagine to do this.

And if he's scum, he game threw???
If you're scum, you game threw????

What are these hypotheticals?????

[Performer]

yes hello
@game

I'm not scum so if you're just settled on me at least do some work to sort for tomorrow's lynch. I would've shot last night, btw. There were good odds I'd be targeted based on what people told Alonzo to do, so what would be the point in holstering?

Anyway, performer slot case incoming

Honestly if we're both town....then......someone like Korina or one of the prs, have fake claimed.
Thing is, I would've shot last night too if I was scum.

Starting to wonder if really should no lynch in this case, though I suggested no lynch is better in a future phase.

[Irrelephant11]

To start, I'll answer skitter's question about Performer vs. his scum meta
pedit: if performer's 3037 isn't a "huh what???? I'm so confused???" meta then idk what is
Early on, my exact read of Performer's catch up was "none of these questions make sense, they're all weird, and I think he's just faking confusion". This was before ruru mentioned his scum meta, and it's obviously something ruru also saw or she wouldn't have brought in that quote from his wiki. Some examples:

Spoiler:

pgs 102-103 make me tr enigma. The summary and reads provided, also help my read.

But why was tw tunneling you?

Why ruru, do you sr enigma? Thanks for also providing a summary.

And you mentioned skiitter inno on you? As in...she claimed investigative, checked you, and said you were clear? Need to be sure what you're saying - if so, then you should be town.

town block so far: enigma.

reevaluating alonzo since he didn't go into why he has me & ruru as scum.

regarding skitter's question about my meta with alonzo - I played 2 games where he was town. He did alright. One of those newbie games I was a scum IC, they were lucky with a quick hammer type of player in their town ranks, and my partner and his replace in didn't do too well....anyway,

I'm probably not that reliable in reading alonzo.

His playstyle isn't exactly easy to read, and I would need to see more from him than many of his bare posts. I get that he has a family and probably phone posts a lot, but

bare posting constantly is scummy.

Bolded things that just kinda go nowhere, like there's a lot of questions and thoughts that Performer never actually uses, except to look confused/like he's sorting. He also contradicts his "to do: sort Alonzo" thing from a previous post by saying he's not reliable at reading him, and he "townblocks" enigma who later becomes his preferred wagon

@skitter I actually agree about partner-reading, so my bad
It just so happens that potential-traitor-Tw really hinted that he was Buj’s partner, and he also followed BuJ’s in-thread advice

Huh? Tw hinted that he was bujaber's partner??
This is simply suspect as I have a town role from the moderator.

I'd much rather have PRs living one more night so I'm strongly favoring no massclaim no lynch

yes I am of this thought as well, in this situation.
adding bujaber to town block.
sadly, the claiming has started already.
I really don't think no lynch is a good way to go. Have yet to see a good reason so I can't agree with no lynch.

just claim please.

I vote bujaber > irrel > enigma > alonzo > korina > skitter

buj's previous post & this post of ruru's , makes me more suspicious of ruru.
I still think it's fishy that ruru tunneled tw for 100 pgs and and thinks tw is town, while tw thought ruru wasn't.

-Says I'm "suspect" for scumreading him as a pair with BuJaber, while simultaneously implying he doesn't know the context/didn't read all my posts
-Wasn't looking for this originally, but "adding BuJaber to townblock" in one of his first posts isn't a good look post-BuJ flip
-Has clearly caught up enough to know that ruru/tw had a 100 page spat, but skips over ruru's reasoning for ultimately townreading tw (the rep out)

Buj - if we have majority do a no lynch, what if scum target a pr, then we'll be back to square 1. I like that he suggested I read at least the earlier part of d3, which I should get to...ugh...this is partly why I wanted to replace in with a hydra because I am somewhat time crunched, and the hydra would help a more in this situation.

continued fos: Alonzo for naked claiming ruru & I as scum team.

I'm surprised people took Alonzo so seriously re: ruru/tw scum team. I read his post as a tinfoil theory that he was projecting confidence onto to for reactions
But anyway, he "liked" BuJ for suggesting he read EOD3. That's just not a read, like what?

VOTE: Alonzo

okay, so

the worst is not happening because skitter is waffling

let's try this

anyone not naked voting alonzo with me can be scum with alonzo.

I have solved the game

three scums in {alonzo, gamma, bujaber}

Just vote alonzo

ruru d2

Thanks for elaborating on ruru. I am understanding better, of why tw voted ruru . This also changes me read on alonzo.

If anyone understands how performer reads Alonzo here and then thinks "oh yes, this is the answer to my question about Alonzo team-reading tw/ruru, thank you", let me know. I sure don't.

ok what is all this usage of hypo mean...does it stand for hypothetical?
and who is phantismo?

Like maybe these questions are real questions but it's just this pattern of repetitive posts of wide-eyed bewilderment, that was his whole catch up.

Ok some things:
alonzo why did you choose a50 & enigma to block? especially a50 of all people?

skitter what do you mean blocking a50 matches with d2 big scumread?

I see what irrel & skitter meant now. Vex's 600s look really good . Combined with his d3 perpetual catchup and other posts though, I would have to null him.

irrel I can go bujaber or ruru , but I also want to see what skitter & ruru say as they're the last ones. I need to reread my ISO for what I said about enigma.

Underlined is like the first thing Performer posted where I was like "yes, reasonable, I get it"
Bolded is more ott confusion

thats quite a narrow view of the situation. I was trying to give TW some space as I do not Town!read TW easily.

Around page 95 I said I was going to Re read, by the time i got to the RR there was a huge show and TW suddenly subbed out and the game was another 10 pages to read.

rurur really seemed to believe her SR of TW then went cold on it. The whole thing seemed unnecessary.

Not knowing TW's alts I was surprised in the break of character that followed, he broke the 4th dimension if you will and still not sure how to read it.

But If your ISO is not what your scum meta is like, then I don't see why ruru lined up Korina>skitter>ruru in some sort of meta comparison of people who weren't playing to their meta.

Why would you object an enigma wagon??

----------
@alonzo: interesting. I've seen tw's town meta consistently show he gets irate when things don't go his way, but that's about as "4th dimension" as I can see regarding tw. As for alts, I'm not aware of what alts he has...though I don't how that would matter.

I still think it's very scummy that ruru claimed to have been in sorting tw for 90+ pgs and when I replaced in , she suddenly put me as tr. Despite that, a re-ISO of her & checking ISOs of others after some time has gone by this phase - ruru is hardly the scummiest .

--------

I'm starting to wonder if the remaining scum are a certain pair in here.

- "Why are you being consistent with all the posts you've posted???"
- "I refuse to try to understand ruru's reasoning for changing her read on my slot. However, I also see she's not very mislynchable"
- "~mysterious game solve~"

Isn't there 1 more person who didn't claim?

I seriously don't like that answer from ruru, looks very suspicious.
Bg role is created to protect others, especially prs.

I think this is literally the first time I've ever seen this kind of reasoning and really , really don't like it. I mean, who says they don't want to protect Alonzo at this point with the mass claiming going around?

That's the only answer they should give at this point .
At the same time - if she fake claimed, that is next to suicide for scum to do. On top of that, this is basically suicide from what ruru is saying if she is scum...so I'm inclined to think she can't be scum saying such things.

Also why did Creature of all people, claim his IC role on d1 in post 5?? What the!?
This G A I M is messed up.

Anyway, trying to think if it makes sense with 12 - goon, traitor, another scum role, IC, town rb, town bg. Considering the setup features, it actually sounds plausible .

This all just reads as "wow things are happening????????? Confusing!"
I'll stop here with the examples for this particular question.

Next, I'll show again why tw and BuJ's ISOs are obv!partners (idk if anyone else has done this, but it's actually so insanely obvious that I have to assume none of you have. If anything, my only paranoia here is that it's too obvious, though the fact that BuJ flipped red has removed a lot of that paranoia)

pedit2:

Thing is, I would've shot last night too if I was scum.

yes, you would have, and you got blocked
lol

I'd be interested to hear you talk more about korina

[Performer]

@irrel
Korina has been lurking - in this case, less active than others. His play since d3 has a lot of iioa, and I feel like he's trying to be null. So he's one of the folks I trust less than the others. At the same time though, he and others have stated you as a scumread.

And iirc buj stated you & I were his final sr.
Buj said his scum meta was to mess with associatives. So what if the 3rd person - if group scum rather than traitor, is actually not his sr (irrel or performer) ? I've been wrestling with this idea so it's also a reason why I distrust Korina .

What's

your

reasoning for having Korina in your sr?

[Korina]

I've been busy here.
I've been looking at colleges. If you look at my entire site-wide activity, I haven't been active.

[Korina]

My posts today have been me trying to catch up on things that I've missed the past two days.
And also, I have a completed newbie game where I literally used IIOA the entire late game, and I flipped VT.

Nice try though.
I don't think scum no-killed as gambit, I legit think they got blocked.

[Korina]

Here's the newbie game as well:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=77380

I dedicated more activity to it towards the end because I was geniuinely interested in solving.
This game is starting to lose my interest only because it seems like we got the game solved, we just aren't acting upon it, plus other reasons I can't get into.

[Irrelephant11]

Spoiler: antihero had a lot to say in defense of sky's traitor claim

i like ruru's entrance

Explain?

also ....
pedit: sigh

she kind of goes against the grain of the thread so far by criticizing the PR spec and my train of thought on the matter is sort of similar (in that i think scum have an incentive to talk UP the number of PRs than the amount they really gave here so it gives them more wiggle room come mass claim time)

Sky's entrance to the game is alarming. Everything she said so far "could" be interpreted as a mere joke. However -in my experience- joking about lynching the IC always comes from scum. And her last post/joke is even more alarming. I feel like it's been made for the sole purpose of declaring herself as the true traitor. It's as if she took ruru's earlier post about the traitor as an inquiry and is responding to it in fashion.

So,

my case on Sky is she is the Traitor

ehhhhhhehrehrhehrhhe

i HAVE seen scum "scumread" the IC but that was bc it was either a calculated move for towncred ("oh LOLZ looks at the TOWNSLIPS, see scum would be paying more attention") or an honest mistake. sky's isn't doing either. she's trolling.

and this post^ is reachy even for page 5.

Once upon a time, a50 and I played a game where he (as town) scumread the outed IC

because he wasn't reading the game

Well, the underlined makes a hell of a difference, doesn't it? What I'm saying is you don't

joke

about lynching the IC as town when you're

totally aware

they have been confirmed as the IC, and that it almost always comes from scum who think it's one way to appear "too scummy to be scum".

i mean....... i don't think sky (or anyone with a mental capacity exceeding a dog turd's) seriously thinks trolling is going to get them townread

what don't you like about a50? i'm pretty sure he's town here tbh

>my gut rxn from his "omg i'm this eccentric and random wizard from the moon, isn't that cute?" shtick is that it's overwrought for the purpose of showmanship given i haven't seen any flashes of it that feel... natural...? idk what the word is
>the whole initial angle on skygazer felt like pointing out things that are antitown (hypoclaim traitor and call to lynch the IC) but don't really even have superficially apparent scum motivation

and add
>he's using "lol POE" and the IC's reads to very conveniently vote park me (so everyone knows his reasons are pure... and he with those reasons he gets to avoid engaging w me BONUS)

your use of "here" makes me think part of this is meta so if ur going to do that, plz link one recent scum and town game tia

Spoiler: probably ignore this, it's only interesting if you assume I'm right as a starting point

mod, plz replace me

i now cannot devote any time or effort to this game, sorry mod and everyone

@orfhz: i need to replace out

more and more stuff keeps piling on at work and school and i cant reasonably keep up in this game when i'm already ridiculously behind in it. I feel like it's unfair to those actually playing rn

sorry to all :/

totally thought a50's super super super early posting about traitor was

traitor indicative which would put his team at antihero/FraJa

but eeehhh I think he's just town or groupscum, his reads feel like actual reads

defs leaning town there atm

for a minute I thought FraJa was the NM slot but it's me so RIP

VOTE: ceejayvinoya
if I'm wrong on this blow my mind,

friend

FOS Buj as well but despite being a

friend

I don't have as strong a feel for his scumgame

skitter is pinging town on second impressions but I will only have a good read on her when I read the game chronologically T_T

Calls both flipped goons "friend" in two consecutive posts. Pretty subtle traitor callout

Not sure how long Buj has been voting for A50 though. Antihero's A50 reaction/case struck me as pretty towny.

And so begins a lot of "ehhh BuJ is just town because because" that tw reiterates whenever asked

Frank early posting is p sketchy
He's casing lynches not casing alignments

biggest ping: he states very few townreads then proceeds to more or less ignore them. feels more like he's tryna trip up his scumreads


this is half playstyle pingy stuff tho I kinda wanna see content from him that isn't crap before I have a stronger read his take on A50's setup spec and read on antihero + sheeping him onto the wagon is kinda slightly more likely to come from town I think

either way if I had to pick I'd still call Buj slot town / FraJa scum before I'd call the other way around or s/s. there's probably 1-2 town in here.

FOS Buj as well but despite being a friend I don't have as strong a feel for his scumgame

skitter is pinging town on second impressions but I will only have a good read on her when I read the game chronologically T_T

oops I hard townread Antihero's early ISO
Read tentatively redacted

@Gamma I'm not feeling the Buj thing much anymore

want me to like go and try to work out what was going through my mind or

I don't want to

-readslist snip-
Town reads:

Sky - start was overly jokey in a way that's very in-your-face. Seems like something that only comes from relaxed town. 89 made me laugh. 452 good town list for this point in the game. I hate 595. Big post from Vex about sky is quite convincing. It still feels weird that she's being so obvscum. TW's entrance seems pretty good though. Coupled with the too scummy to be scum thing I say this is likely to be a townslot.

Scum reads: -snip-

actually Buj do you reckon you could tier your reads for me? (even loosely is fine)

I guess something along these lines:

{Creature, me}
{Vex}
{A50, skitter}
{Ruru, TW}
-----null line----
{Gamma, cjv}
{Enigma}
{HWS, Frank}

given cjv's spot, tw looks like the other partner imo

alright I can dig it.

"look at us we're interacting"

I wouldn't be so sure. I've played with scum!TW once and he won the game by being kinda vague and sheepy with his reads. He felt like a confused little innocent duckling all game and got himelf townlocked brilliantly. It probably involved a lot of bussing his partners but it was worth it in the end.

can you link the game?
and what is your read on him rn?

viewtopic.php?f=54&t=75184

A weak town read based slightly on his tone

but mainly on me just not seeing how skygazer could be scum and be so obvious about it.

BuJ "uhhhh town I guess"s tw too

which slots am I lacking progression on

hey, if you TR absolutely everyone, it'll mean that the vast majority of your reads is correct :thumbs up:

and elaborate on buj please

ctrl+f antihero and Buj in my iso please if you don't mind, that's one of the slots I'm not lacking thoughts on its just a quiet one

Unable to elaborate, points back to his (pretty blank in this respect) ISO for his BuJ read

your SR of Antihero was just the stick in butt tone realistically right
like you can see his posting coming from town reaction to your posting surely

Creature why are you voting TW?

okay whatever I'm afk for the night

I'm not sure if what tw did is really the towntell I think it is, also the evasiveness is fairly pl-worthy

nm seems to be playing his scum meta so far

{skitter, a50 (skitter)} - this is an actual hard tr based on her being out of her scum meta and not a day 1 "oh skitter's presence in this game is +ev" type of thing, I really mean it this time
{vex} - assuming the self-meta is accurate
{a50, enigma}
{gamma}
{ejji}
{bujaber, hws, nm, tw (a50)}
{tw, nm (a50/tw)}

I'm trying out a new readslist format so people can see both my personal reads and aggregate reads in case I'm shot and the people I was sheeping flip red; it should be pretty self-explanatory

You think tw/nm are partners?

I think tw's play has been results-oriented in a tmi way: he expects to deliver us a redflip and then not die as a result, without really scumhunting or doing anything else towny

ok so you literally witnessed what happened the last time I tried to bus so please tell me you actually think I

*clears throat*

> rep'd into a scumslot
> decided to expose scum!cjv for towncred (?) when he'd just been dropped into his usual "too hard to read" bin
> cjv then spewed antiassociatives and then flaked from the game because.....?? he didn't like my bus strategy? waht
> I suddenly got really really good at bussing and changed my bussing ethos dramatically

like this conclusion is so vague and has nearly no thought behind it. I'd feel better if you jumped into the thread with a fucking fake guilty. seriously. stop tunnelling me and pay attention to the fact cjv and I were obviously not scum together.

actually fuck it this could be scum. will revisit later

hypo inno Bujaber

Tw - do you have a scum game where you posted a lot? I only have the one scumgame to go on and d1 you sort of played to that meta but d2 it's different. Like you're arguing more than I would expect but some of the things you're saying are just so weird.

I find it weird that ruru is able to push tw for bussing cjv which seems rather reachy

. Like I don't think tw is obvtown here by any means, but I don't think the way he pushed cjv was scum-indicative. It only makes sense if you go into it thinking 'what would tw do if he repped into a scum slot' it doesn't feel like the correct order of thoughts. Unless ruru genuinenly looks at that and says oh that looks like bussing. If someone other than tw did the same thing would you also think they're bussing ruru? At least then I could understand. Just feels like an awkward attempt at bussing and if he is as good at it as you say I'd expect a smoother attempt.
Also coming from the same person the gamma tr is weird. You are prone to believing that scum!tw had this elaborate bussing strategy, but don't believe scum!gamma could fake forget his partner? Particularly someone who flaked from the site and wasn't talking much he's easily forgettable for real even.

Enigma seems like he's pushing an agenda/creating nk wifom and he continues to post rvs'y posts like 'first' which is just like... why man? A50 did TR him though. I also still think gamma's play is more in line with his scum meta.
I hypo inno alonzo

I need help sorting tw/ruru

, vex/skitter still town, alonzo is town, scum pool for today is {ejj, enigma, gamma}

VOTE: gamma

So many words that say "I don't townread tw but you shouldn't scumread him"

Spoiler: This whole conversation about tw's meta basically goes nowhere and also "sabotaging myself" reads as traitor confirmation

Tw - do you have a scum game where you posted a lot? I only have the one scumgame to go on and d1 you sort of played to that meta but d2 it's different. Like you're arguing more than I would expect but some of the things you're saying are just so weird.

lmao maybe
Try open 733 or earthbound or the newbie game nancy modded or sharing is caring by almost50

going by your question I don't really know what you're looking for? like just high post count as scum? either of those games should be fine, I talk a lot

hold on yeah
try open 733, that might be closer to what you're after I think

ik nm is just a troll.
that's why im so fine with him getting hung d1.

...especially when he reps into a meta scum slot
hence why we don't leave him to be vigged by a vig that ~may or may not exist~

I'd like to have a mini discussion on this after the game.

I skimmed through your posts in open 733. Looks like there's more to your scum game than what meets the eye.

I think I need to play with you more before I can meta read you.

See in giyga's curse (feels like years ago) you had this air of uncertainty and lack of solid opinions and I would have described you as a shy/passive go-with-the-flow kind of player. A common enough scum technique but also if done well can get away with it undetected. General theme would be 'hiding' from direct attention.

In 733 it seems you were following a more proactive 'point attention elsewhere' technique. Less talking about yourself, more pushing of cases, more asking direct questions that don't require you to give opinions yourself but allow you to divert attention onto the person being asked the question.

In terms of post quantity I'd say this game is closer to 733, but content wise I'm not seing a consistent agenda of avoiding the spotlight here. You're neither hiding nor trying to avoid getting into it with people. But I'm not sensing any real motivation to figuring things out either. It reads like that one tired player in every rl game asking everyone "aren't we done yet?"

In terms of post quantity I'd say this game is closer to 733, but content wise I'm not seing a consistent agenda of avoiding the spotlight here. You're neither hiding nor trying to avoid getting into it with people. But I'm not sensing any real motivation to figuring things out either. It reads like that one tired player in every rl game asking everyone "aren't we done yet?"

I've definitely hit a point where I just post more than I used to hahaha. I was kinda starting to get fired up in Earthbound when Mathdino spewed that he meta townread me being uncertain so I seriously hammed up the "maybe I think I don't know" vibes.

I am kinda a tiny bit bored of mafia in a general sense and

I need a break but keep sabotaging myself which prolly aids that "aren't we done yet?"

feeling.. :p

it seems like there's a lot of fluffy stuff and I'm getting a kinda self important/lotta clout energy but also like non nuanced 1 dimensional reads but i guess that's pretty consistent with his town meta so *shrugs

This is true but that's more recently.

Like he posted a whole lot and townspewed and got himself townread by pretty much everyone. Then he justifiably kinda started egoposting as a result since roughly the last few pages of day 1 when he was talking about who will get NK'd.

You really think he'd get comfortable enough to do that as scum? Not the impression I got from Forest Fire.

You really think he'd get comfortable enough to do that as scum? Not the impression I got from Forest Fire.

> get townread
> start prodging
I feel it

Still think he's more likely just town tbh but that's more of an holistic read than my own

"look at us we're interacting"

the people i townread are: vex, ruru, enigma, creature

the people i don't are: buj, alonzo, tw, ge, ejji

and three of them are on that wagon

And that makes sense to you?

We know there's a traitor and a groupscum left alive.

You have to ask yourself if both could be on gamma in only 4 votes or if one of them is bussing the other (gamma) in only 4 votes.

If the answer is no to both of those then ejj should either be confirmed scum to you or you know for a fact you are townreading scum.

I have reason to think BuJ's bolded statement here is a real info slip (ask me later if you're curious, I'm moving on)

I can't remember why but I have the HotWaterService/Alonzo slot down as pretty town

Only player getting inno'd by two people

So far BuJ/tw have only had completely benign, "huh, yeah, you said it" interactions
Neither gives a strong townread on the other but they never push each other as scum
Lots of hedging their reads of each other

Sky's? I'm trying to make sense of her actions.

Nothing she did here really aligns with how she played in pyp. I just still don't know how someone who puts that much effort into trying to win (she really stepped up as soon as she felt comfortable ausuka was town, their analysis of setup was really good, and she continued to try and utilize her neighborhoods), can roll scum and switch the attitude around completely.
But maybe A50 was right. Maybe sky really is a traitor who's just going for broke and being obvious about it.

Got any scum meta on sky? Could you see that from her?
Might be easier than trying to sort tw.

maybe it's just bujaber+tw

here's where things get interesting. Mild, relaxed, logical BuJ sees the above, and...

Spoiler: Notably, while "nullreading" tw, BuJaber continually defends him through this entire argument

Yeah we tried this new strategy where 1 of us flakes out, 1 of us jesters it up then replaces out, and the last one refuses to bus either. Totally plausible

Because that was tw and not me and that was at a time when cjv wasn't an obvious lynch. There were many other optioms to shade.

tw apparently isn't an obvious lynch either.

So why are you drawing the parallel between us then?

TW if scum, bussed his not-obviously-getting-lynched partner.

Now you're saying if I'm scum I'm NOT bussing my not-obviously-getting-lynched partner.

I think tw is more likely to make endgame right now than ceejay was to make endgame even before tw claimed a guilty

I would agree but if that was the plan behind tw's bussing why wouldn't scum!me join the cjv wagon also?

yes, both of those are things that scum do.

So how did you decide it was scummy for tw to do it then?

If both options are things scum would do how do you determine when it's actually AI?

yes, both of those are things that scum do.

So how did you decide it was scummy for tw to do it then?

If both options are things scum would do how do you determine when it's actually AI?

I believe I have several posts on this subject

Yes but when I read them earlier I got the impression it was specific to TW. Now that you are presenting it in this way it contradicts that notion. So it's not clear to me anymore why you thought TW was scum if this is a general thing that scum would do in that scenario.

let's talk about this:

That is more indicative of there being a wagon on scum right now.

If everyone, town and scum alike, are posting very little scum cannot bus and risk a quick hammer from the absent townies. They cannot aggressively push the counterwagon because as soon as a mislynch occurs the other player would be a prime suspect.

so, suppose this implies gamma is scum because your vote is there so I assume you mean him

the counterwagons of tw and alonzo have basically been aggressively solo pushed by me; one of them must be town

do you think scum would be displaying support when I push town?

Not without some town support first. One vote is not a wagon.

Well gamma I think is scum.
Vex and skitter I think are town regardless of how they vote.
Alonzo is hypothetically innocent
That leaves enigma who I still scumread and

tw who's more like null.

Even if I accept that you would scumread two opposite behaviors in the same game, I still don't see how you jumo to me being a teammate of tw.

if being at l1 would make you more motivated that could definitely be arranged

This line was funny to me. Sounds like it's from a cheesy old mafia movie.

TW: were you reading the game at all before replacing in?

not a word of it!
I like the setup and I ofrhz is teh best so when I saw she needed a replacement I PM'd reflexively.

Right.. so why would town!you here care to read sky's posts at all? Why would town!you feel the need to state that you don't need to townread her? Why would you care about what she was or wasn't thinking? And why would you care what we thought about your predecessor at all?

Nobody should ride on people's townread of their predecessor. Presenting a towncase on a predecessor is stupid as you can't even read them as an informed 3rd party. So why are you stating the obvious?

Only scum would care so they can be consistent with their prdecessor or not blow up associations.

I totally agree with everything you just posted which is why I produced my own content instead of focusing on my pred.

conversationally ruru picked up it was weird she wasn't more anxious around skitter30. like incidentally this is something I agree with but I also don't think it would be surprising if Skyg played this the same way I would have played it so it's kind of a moot point.


why the hell are we all talking in circles about this? I feel like I'm being read for my pred who made her intentions with this game pretty clear by replacing out. can we focus on the game or

this is maybe the only interesting potentially not-svs interaction these two have up to this point...

{Tw, enigma, elephant, alonzo}
If I'm not cop that's my scumpool.
This is my scumpool if I'm cop:
{Enigma, elephant}

VOTE: Enigma

skipping ahead because I want to get to:

Why are you so sure ruru's town?

Why are you so sure ruru's town?

believe me I haven't given the read out easily

I'm not arguing against the read I want to know your reasons if you please.

Because from my pov he's been given a case for you being scum but not really pushing it and like I expect you to be suspicious of him for that.

about 36 hours (iirc) after this, tw scumreads ruru for the first time all game

VOTE: performer if I'm not already. enigma pretty much has to be town for the same reasons I am regarding night actions + BuJ wanted him dead for most of the game. skitter is just town, leaving only korina or ruru as possible partners. I'll only really consider either of those being the case if performer flips green, until then, game feels solved fmpov. Lynch me -> performer or just lynch performer, up to y'all.

[Irrelephant11]

Also I just remembered skitter posted her scumcase on my slot and I'd like to respond to it but besides the exhaustion of writing the above post I need to get off MS for a few hours so idk how likely it is that will happen
Given Performer probably gets lynched after me if I get lynched I'm fine with it

[Irrelephant11]

I need to get off MS

lol but also I'm overgamed so I'll be here foreverrrrr

[Performer]

Maybe tw played with buj in the past so he called him a friend. But yeah, point is obviously we can go speculate about what anti said about sky, or what tw did and the meaning of his posts, but I wouldn't know why the two of them played like that. Clearly those 2 have different playstyles.

[Performer]

Korina you caught up yet or do you have anymore thoughts to provide?

[Irrelephant11]

Maybe tw played with buj in the past so he called him a friend. But yeah, point is obviously

we can go speculate about what anti said about sky, or what tw did and the meaning of his posts,

but I wouldn't know why the two of them played like that. Clearly those 2 have different playstyles.

I mean I'm not asking *you* to *speculate* about your preds, I'm asking everyone else to evaluate your slot.