Overkill 1: Serenity/Firefly (GAME OVER)

[Toogeloo]

i'm confused as to where you get the second anti-town from here.

TPFKAP and MalaKitty.

[Chara]

oh. well, we already got him. i see what you were saying though.

[Chara]

eliminating anyone not of their faction is what scum want to do. a lyncher on a town target can only ever scumside, unless we as a town agree to hand Mala a win because... why? because we think the role is unfair? is that how we're playing mafia now?
Mala isn't someone scum is going to be going out of their way to eliminate, to the point they're going to shoot either blind or on flavour guesswork.

[Chara]

i can accept holding off on lynching Mala

today

if we can hit scum instead, sure. cannot accept letting her live much longer.

[BuJaber]

I don't think we should lynch 3p yet.

I'm not arguing to keep them alive just delay their lynch for now.

Given all the claims and town spewing and (imo) a non-partner associative with RC/Tora, we have a decent chance of shooting scum in the remaining pool if we lynch randomly, better if we shoot scummy slots. Since we have lost no townies yet I'd rather go for a lynch that could land on scum than one that is almost guaranteed to be 3p.

[Chara]

that's fine, but remember what i said about never allowing Mala a hammer opportunity.

[BuJaber]

If it makes you feel better .. I can guarantee you Mala cannot easily satisfy her wincon even if she knew who Mal is.

[Elsa Jay]

If Mala lives I know at the very least town will hang them before me, so I'm not opposed to you all leaving her alive. But I also won't deny the lynch either should you choose to kill em.

PS: Mala claimed full Bulletproof, so a vigi shot would not even put a dent in her, unlike my single BP.

[Chara]

your claimed single BP. :>

[Elsa Jay]

your claimed single BP. :>

Shhhh....

Anyway, I'd also rather we still try and find killing scum then anti-town 3p like Mala. And we have many more options, like perhaps Ari if he doesn't feel like catching up. We also got other less suspicious slots that could use some investigating.

[Chara]

Ari would be my preference too, but i want to give him some time to do some work here if he's town.

[Gamma Emerald]

Yeah
I think not just pressuring Ari might be for the best if he is town

[Jingle]

eliminating anyone not of their faction is what scum want to do. a lyncher on a town target can only ever scumside

Actually, this is untrue.

Mala wants to lynch specifically Mal. (God, that is gonna get annoying fast.)

Outside of that, her next preferred lynch target is: Scum with a nightkill. She actively wants every non Mal town player to stay alive, because the longer that is true, the more likely it is that Mal doesn't get shot. See how that is not scumsiding? Good. I know it's not explicitly townsiding either, but she is definitely not going to scumside because she loses the game if they win before she exits.

Additionally, the spec says that we have exactly 9 town players. That means, given multiple KPN, that we are very quickly going to approach an untenable position unless scum crosskill or cross target. It also means that we can fairly easily determine when it is likely all of the groupscum are dead. If we have more 3rd parties that we can accomodate without having to push them into scum's camp, I'm all for taking advantage of it. If we're at a point in the game where we can give an additional player the win without jeopardizing our own chances, I'm all for it.

To counter Toog's claim that lynching Mala is confirmably lynching two non town on what is effectively D1, that is true enough. But, more importantly, lynching Mala is not lynching group scum. It also doesn't decrease the KPN. And, and this is by far the most important part: We don't have to lynch Mala to win. We're getting damn close to a PoE here off of claims. If we can narrow down scum and just lynch down the line, we don't ever have to lynch Mala to win. If Reynolds flips, we don't have to lynch Mala to win. We DO have to lynch the group scum to win, unless we get super lucky on crosskills. They are a bigger threat, therefore we prioritize dealing with them. We should definitely be aiming to lynch group scum.

As far as scum wanting to take out more bodies? Yeah, that's still definitely a thing. Mala actively wants to lynch scum. They will shoot town, town being shot is how she loses. Therefore, Mala is a threat to scum. Removing threats is how scum wins. As scum, you don't leave a serial killer alive because he might shoot town. You kill the serial killer because he might shoot you. Chickadee is obviously the bigger threat, but she's also obviously a better Doc target. Scum can't afford to miss kills when we have this many probtown. EJ is a decent choice for a scumkill just so he can't protect anymore, but the bp screws all kinds of hell with that logic. Objectively, the best kills here are in obvtown like me, power roles with the possibility of confirming town, like Chick, and people who represent multiple votes that want to lynch scum, like our dear unidentified Captain. ANY chance that scum will shoot for the last (and incidentally might hit other scum) is worth saving.

And, finally: Mala can explicitly win with town given her Role. She cannot be a game ending Lyncher (the reason not to leave Lynchers alive under normal circumstances is to prevent them from screwing the town by being an exclusive wincon lyncher).

Because the dots are fairly easy to connect from there, we do not have a serial killer in this game. The serial killer wincon is incompatible with the rules.

[Chara]

assuming Mala is telling the truth about leaving the game, i guess that checks out.

[Jingle]

4- The game ends when either all threats to town have been eliminated or all town members have been eliminated.

The game doesn't end when a lyncher succeeds, explicitly.

A serial killer would have to kill all of the scum before killing all of the town, which is ridiculous.

Literally, our best case scenario is lynching one of the HoB and having the other get shot overnight. This reduces the odds that anyone of the other faction dies at night (which they're likely to be happy with), so the other scumteam wants this as well. Therefore, we should be lynching not Mala, because by virtue of the claim, she is almost certainly not HoB. Additionally, if any other 3rd parties come out of the woodwork right now, it narrows down our chances of hitting them and aims our lynch at groupscum. Groupscum is the real threat here. Anyone who can win with us is secondary at worst and never needs to be considered at best.

[Jingle]

In order for me to win I need a player to be lynched.

Oh, and btw. Assuming your role is as described, it is not in any way unfair. You would still be able to win posthumously if Mal was lynched after you died unless you have the specific clause of needing to be on-wagon/hammered. Lyncher is actually more likely to win than most 3rd parties.

[Jingle]

Is anyone else getting the feeling that having specifically me (the guy who wants 3rd parties to win all games with 3rd parties) might be messing up the balance of this game a little?

[Jingle]

hammerer

FTFM

[Elsa Jay]

Is anyone else getting the feeling that having specifically me (the guy who wants 3rd parties to win all games with 3rd parties) might be messing up the balance of this game a little?

You just gained a 20 % bigger chance to be healed.

[Chickadee]

At work, it's a busy busy day. Just checking in to say I'm ok with postponing the Mala lynch, but Mala doesn't live long. I alos don't want other 3p to claim if there are any. It just narrows the pool for scum.

Also if anyone else is BP, please stop claiming it. BP shots should be trying to draw shots, not claiming it so people don't wast shots (specifically scum).

I realize some of us have different priorities, but for the love of god, stop climing BP so early.

[Elsa Jay]

The only BP claims are Neuts tho. One of which doesn't even die and the other who very much wants to live.

[Jingle]

At work, it's a busy busy day. Just checking in to say I'm ok with postponing the Mala lynch, but Mala doesn't live long. I alos don't want other 3p to claim if there are any.

It just narrows the pool of scum.

Also if anyone else is BP, please stop claiming it. BP shots should be trying to draw shots, not claiming it so people don't wast shots (specifically scum).

I realize some of us have different priorities, but for the love of god, stop climing BP so early.

FTFY.

Agree on the no point. Optimal play for mala was to claim something powerful for town that makes sense as mal in order to draw the nightkill.

[Jingle]

Bp not no. Fuck phones sometimes.

[Reasonably Rational]

What is the PoE anyone who isn't Jingle?

-Cerb

[Jingle]

If necessary, I can give the list of players who I believe mechanically should not be the lynch for today. It's specifically subjective reads that I'm avoiding giving out right now.