Newbie 1904 - Game Over

[Child]

I don't like AbyssalLord's vote, though. "they have been following votes around" - AL, can you explain why that makes her more likely to be scum?

classic ToS play where you try to follow votes early, in order to appear as a townie. players in high elo VFR people who vote near the last, vote slowly,
or don't vote at all. still stuck in the ToS mindset.

scumslip
VOTE: abyssallord
you just admitted to making a mafia play. nice.

[Child]

I don't like AbyssalLord's vote, though. "they have been following votes around" - AL, can you explain why that makes her more likely to be scum?

classic ToS play where you try to follow votes early, in order to appear as a townie. players in high elo VFR people who vote near the last, vote slowly,
or don't vote at all. still stuck in the ToS mindset.

scumslip
VOTE: abyssallord
you just admitted to making a mafia play. nice.

nevermind, thought you were talking about yourself. ignore this.
UNVOTE: abyssallord

[Irrelephant11]

I really really don't think Lamees is scum here
I recognize that her play could potentially have the goal of pocketing me but I don't feel at all pocketed - my reason for townreading her has next to nothing to do with the fact that her votes match mine. Rather, it's her play on the whole. And I don't think her using her vote very freely is scummy - actually, town usually feel much more comfortable throwing their vote around (scum don't like the attention it gets them)
Please do not lynch Lamees today.

Is anyone strongly townreading abyssallord, aside from the "slip" (which is easily faked)?

[Lamees]

Child with that sneaky way of getting off my wagon lol

[Irrelephant11]

lamees what do you think of a {child, abyssal} team?

[Lamees]

Still getting used to the names. I haven't seen anything suspicious between the two of them, besides post 150/151. Don't know what that was about.

[Irrelephant11]

as in, you think they're both town?

[Irrelephant11]

If everyone could provide readslists in the next 24 hours, that would be extremely helpful. We need to arrive at a lynch soon, and I don't think Lamees is a good choice.

[Irrelephant11]

*soonish
We have five days, actually, which isn't as short as I thought. Still, though, readslists will help us see where everyone is at

[Micc]

Dongempire replaces auhsoj.

[AbyssalLord]

My lean-list, sorry if this is abnormally made.
Heavy/Med maf: none
Slight Maf: Lamees, Irrelephant (defending someone vehemently over a gut feeling* is sus to me), Jim has been a bit lurky *gut feeling as in town lean
Neutral: auhsoj, have been afk, child (nothing has been too AI to me.), Okx, ceejay,
Slight Town:
Med Town: muh316 seems like a very experienced player, explained his maflean on me clearly (from what I remember.)
Heavy Town: me, of course. (what's a joke?)

anyways, that's my list. tell me if I made it terribly or it explains stuff.

[Jim Hawkins]

*soonish
We have five days, actually, which isn't as short as I thought. Still, though, readslists will help us see where everyone is at

Wouldn't a group read-list also give the mafia more information to use when making their night kills?

[AbyssalLord]

oh tarnation savant flummery

[muh316]

I really really don't think Lamees is scum here

Are you sure you're not being pocketed? I would ask that you look through Lamees's ISO and tell us if there's anything towny in there to support your claim. I have a feeling you have a soft spot for Lamees from previous games and this is purely gut feeling. It would make sense if you were a cop/neapolitan saying this D2 after a night action, but D1 it makes no sense to me.

[muh316]

Wouldn't a group read-list also give the mafia more information to use when making their night kills?

No, because the Mafia already knows who's town and who's not. The goal of Mafia is to get rid of players they either don't like or who they think are PRs. Readlists help the town the most because they help us narrow down possible suspects.

[muh316]

If everyone could provide readslists in the next 24 hours, that would be extremely helpful. We need to arrive at a lynch soon, and I don't think Lamees is a good choice.

Since you asked I'll put it in your format

Town
{Myself}
{Irrelephant}
{Ceejay}
{Jim Hawkins}
Null
{Child} (for the recent sneaky slip off the wagon)
{OkX}
{Lamees, Abyssal}
Scum


The bottom two are people I would be fine with getting lynched today. There were two major wagons on Lamees and Abyssal both of which can get us a lot of information for D2.

Irrelephant, have your reads changed since your last readlist? Specifically I want to know about your placement for Child and Okx.


@Okx and Child, please place your vote somewhere.

OKx, if you're confused as to who to vote you could either join a current wagon or you could ISO some players who are possibly scummy and see what you think about them.

[ceejayvinoya]

I really really don't think Lamees is scum here

Are you sure you're not being pocketed? I would ask that you look through Lamees's ISO and tell us if there's anything towny in there to support your claim. I have a feeling you have a soft spot for Lamees from previous games and this is purely gut feeling. It would make sense if you were a cop/neapolitan saying this D2 after a night action, but D1 it makes no sense to me.

This mirrors my thoughts exactly.

I'm not seeing anything towny at all from her ISO.

[ceejayvinoya]

Wouldn't a group read-list also give the mafia more information to use when making their night kills?

No, because the Mafia already knows who's town and who's not. The goal of Mafia is to get rid of players they either don't like or who they think are PRs. Readlists help the town the most because they help us narrow down possible suspects.

I think Jim's concern is that mafia will kill the towniest guy based on the readlists. Anyway, @Jkm, mafia often prioritizes pr targets first.

[Lamees]

You don't pocket someone by following their votes. Besides, If my latest vote was just sheeping irrel I would have said so. I'm not just sheeping, I gave a reason for my vote. Coincidence that irrel happened to be voting for that player too.

[Child]

Child with that sneaky way of getting off my wagon lol

Lamees with that sneaky way to push suspicion on me

I didn't even notice that. I can go back on if you want to, i don't think it matters if i am on or not. i am active enough to place my vote on who i want to before EoD, and smart enough to not hammer on accident. If you think it matters if i place my vote back on, your opinion is simply wrong.

Muh, this goes out to you too, ohx is the one who has to vote, not me, as ive stated my opinions before. He has only done townreads, and that concerns me. A good position to place my vote in for now.
VOTE: ohx

Scumreads are lamees and ohx, only townread is jim.

You don't pocket someone by following their votes.

you do, people who agree with you tend to be more townie in your eyes. Your vote on abyssal is good, the others are not.

[Donempire]

I suppose. You're acting quite I guess commanding which maybe makes me think of you as a PR but also a regular townie is possible too

Alright, why do you think that means pr? As far as prs go, an outstanding pr is absolutely mental. Besides, i dont like the fence attitude with maybe town, maybe pr. Dont speak unless you have any concrete reads, reading someone 3 pages in is unnecessary imo.

Vote: No Lynch

What?

Anyhow, how is it, mates? Im on mobile so i'll try to read the rest of the thread after. These are two posts that stood out to me (maybe not the second one, i cant figure what its supposed to mean).

[Donempire]

I was thinking that Abyssal's townslip is genuine. That's why I unvoted.

which townslip?

I picked up irrel wants to get past RVS which I think is good for the game (either alignments) and I think a wagon is the perfect way to do so. We just happened to get a wagon on the wrong player the first attempt.

hmm... what could this lead to?

Actually wait, auhsoj might be the wrong player too lol. He hasn't posted in over two days.

VOTE: jim

Alright, without the previous post, i could let this slide. But now i cant see your reasoning.
Why are you trying so desperately to get a wagon? Most of the people you voted didnt even write anything contributing to the convo. There are two reasons you seem to bring about with this wagon:
First is to get out of RVS, in which case voting anyone and seeing their reactions will do fine. No reason in changing from whoever you were voting before.
And in the second post, you say that joshua might be the wrong player. And what do you mean by wrong player? He hasnt responded yet, and you just seem to want to jump from wagon to wagon. Explain what you want to do, clearly, uncontradictary.

I mean, I can't really do anything productive when I don't know how to play, compared to someone who started playing nearly a decade ago.

VOTE: AbysallLord
So you're new huh? Tough luck, you could've just passed this off as simply "i dont know how to play" but you had to compare yourself to muh. Not taking the blame and shifting it by comparing your newbie self to someone more experienced to gain sympathy is the oldest trick in the book. You're going to the gallows, regardless of how much experience you have.

[Donempire]

Hey Lamees. Nothing to say on the wagon on you?

you're %100 town, arent you?

[Lamees]

I picked up irrel wants to get past RVS which I think is good for the game (either alignments) and I think a wagon is the perfect way to do so. We just happened to get a wagon on the wrong player the first attempt.

hmm... what could this lead to?

Actually wait, auhsoj might be the wrong player too lol. He hasn't posted in over two days.

VOTE: jim

Alright, without the previous post, i could let this slide. But now i cant see your reasoning.
Why are you trying so desperately to get a wagon? Most of the people you voted didnt even write anything contributing to the convo. There are two reasons you seem to bring about with this wagon:
First is to get out of RVS, in which case voting anyone and seeing their reactions will do fine. No reason in changing from whoever you were voting before.
And in the second post, you say that joshua might be the wrong player. And what do you mean by wrong player? He hasnt responded yet, and you just seem to want to jump from wagon to wagon. Explain what you want to do, clearly, uncontradictary.

It's all here in the posts themselves. But I'll try to explain. I think we all agree that wagons in RVS is a nice way to progress the game. So that's why I joined irrel's wagon. Then as you can see, the first and second RVS wagon were both on inactive players, who got subbed out. And you even state here in the quote that the player has not reacted to the wagon, EXACTLY. Which is why I shifted away from the useless reactionless INACTIVE PLAYER wagon. Why am I having to explain this btw...

[Lamees]

It's like everyone agrees that a RVS wagon on an inactive player who isnt going to give responses/info/reactions is useless. I AGREE WHICH IS WHY I CHANGED TO A DIFFERENT PLAYER. I even clearly saw and notified everyone that a wagon we have is on a player that hasnt posted in two days so I think we had the wagon on the wrong player and I changed vote.

Oh and remember at the development of these wagons, the players weren't inactive at the time.