Starcraft Mafia -- Game Over!

[Kokichi Oma]

i'm an IC hard claiming. so explain now.

[Kokichi Oma]

i'll become one after you reveal your soft. so explain now or we lynch you once i'm IC for fake claiming.

[the worst]

Lol. I am not going to tell you what I know so you can fakeclaim around it.

[AlmostNancy]

Skitter30 has died during the night! They were Torn Apart by Zerg Forces

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Vanilla Town

Welcome to Starcraft Mafia!

You are a Terran Civilian, a

Vanilla Townie

.

Your only powers are your words and your vote!

Win:

You win when all non-town killing roles have been removed.

Game thread here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970

Confirm:

Please confirm by responding with your alignment and role name

I was not expecting this. A50 was convinced that we were dead. Why Skitter over Varsoon?

[AlmostNancy]

Where is Varsoon?

I don’t understand this game.

[AlmostNancy]

i'm an IC hard claiming. so explain now.

@mod can you confirm this?

[AlmostNancy]

i'll become one after you reveal your soft. so explain now or we lynch you once i'm IC for fake claiming.

Lol. I am not going to tell you what I know so you can fakeclaim around it.

Can we get a resolution on this?

[the worst]

my gut is telling me to L-3 kokichi and see what happens

i really doubt i'm saying shit until he's fullclaimed with actions.

[AlmostNancy]

my gut is telling me to L-3 kokichi and see what happens

i really doubt i'm saying shit until he's fullclaimed with actions.

Do you have some sort of guilty on him and was Mewtaph wrong about him having a townie modifier?

*confused*

[AlmostNancy]

So, he’s lying about being an IC then?

I honestly thought he might be a cop because his play, reminded me a bit of CoH.

[the worst]

I don't think Mewtaph was lying about him having a towny modifier, but I have a reason to think he might be scum.
there's no way I'm coughing up any more info until he's claimed though. he's FPSing at the cost of us being able to actually solve the game.

[AlmostNancy]

i'll become one after you reveal your soft. so explain now or we lynch you once i'm IC for fake claiming.

You mean you’re going to ask the mod to confirm you?

[AlmostNancy]

I don't think Mewtaph was lying about him having a towny modifier, but I have a reason to think he might be scum.
there's no way I'm coughing up any more info until he's claimed though. he's FPSing at the cost of us being able to actually solve the game.

So, we’re at a stalemate?

[the worst]

If he keeps posting and stalling I'll just vote him.

[AlmostNancy]

Spoiler: Re:Shoshin's Spoiler

Well, you do know if your investigation has been messed with due to redirection, because you should get a different target.
IE: I target SCUM Shoshin with a cop, but am redirected to TOWN Metalsonic
Result I get "Metalsonic is town."
Does that make sense?

I generally think that designing false positives and fails like miller and godfather into a setup is really awful on the mod's part and compromises the game entirely because people rely so hard on role info. After all, if a cop claims a guilty, dies, is confirmed to be a cop, you lynch that guilty. It just makes sense.

I was saying it was game-throwing, because, by design, my role gets the most useful info by being hidden and surviving to D5. Outting gets me killed, which means that even though I get townread, it might not really help us all that much. If our doctor was still around, this would be less of an issue, but, ay.

Anyway, I do generally agree that outting roles earlier rather than later benefits town more often and I tend to design my setups around scum being able to sabotage such play.

Do you think there’s a redirector in THIS setup?

[the worst]

Non-Normal Roles that CAN be in this game include:
Janitor, Survivor, Lyncher, Bus Driver, Lightning Rod, Nexus, Redirector, Framer, Vanillaizer, Arsonist, Godfather

straight up, yeah

[AlmostNancy]

My thoughts on claims/roles:

Spoiler:

I think most players care too much about keeping their roles hidden. I don't think it hurts towns to get multiple early claims from scummy players. I also don't think it hurts to get early claims from townies when those claims are helpful to sorting alignments (e.g. Varsoon's information, miller claims, etc.) or to avoiding catastrophe (e.g. Irrelephant's PGO claim). Yes, roles sometimes help confirm players as town (e.g. vig shooting mafia, doctor preventing a nightkill), but competent scum also fake these sorts of behaviors (e.g. forfeiting nightkill to fakeclaim doctor/bulletproof). I don't see why players place so much value in roles when they don't help nearly as much as people seem to think. From what I've seen, they often lead to mislynches (scum love to push mislynches through role analysis).

I also think most players put too much weight into investigation. I've seen scum fake investigative results in most of my theme games, mini or large. I've seen town get faulty results in half my theme games. I've seen town get mislynched because of faulty guilty results. I've seen scum get cleared from faulty innocents. The reality is that you never know if the investigation has been screwed with by a redirector, bus driver, lawyer, framer, etc. The benefit of investigations from my perspective is to corroborate behavioral reads (e.g. in RC's recent game, an investigative result corroborated strong townreads on NSG and scumreads on Nico), or to encourage players to reevaluate someone you've been townreading (i.e. to combat confirmation bias). I'd never lynch someone because of a guilty, nor clear someone because of an innocent investigation.

I also think the players talking about "game-throwing" in this game because we outed Varsoon's information are overreacting. We outed some information. So what? If he dies, he dies. If he doesn't, he doesn't. The benefit of outing him is that we're getting stronger townreads on his slot, as well as valuable behavioral reactions from Nancy. From my perspective, that's much more useful than keeping his information hidden. I feel more comfortable townreading both him & Nancy after this, which means we're refining our reads in productive ways due to Varsoon's play. It also hedges against the risk that he dies before he outs the information. I see this as a win-win.

If this is LYLO, would you be in favour of a mass claim, eventhough, the setup states specifically that scum have fakeclaims?

[the worst]

if there's a town redirector/bus driver/nexus/lightning rod etc. they should claim but that's insanely rare

[the worst]

i'm pro-massclaim rn but kokichi would be going first

[AlmostNancy]

Non-Normal Roles that CAN be in this game include:
Janitor, Survivor, Lyncher,

Bus Driver

, Lightning Rod, Nexus,

Redirector

, Framer, Vanillaizer, Arsonist, Godfather

straight up, yeah

I wonder if there could possibly be either a bus driver or redirector in this game? Creature and Skitter NK’s seems weird to me.

[AlmostNancy]

Non-Normal Roles that CAN be in this game include:
Janitor, Survivor, Lyncher,

Bus Driver

, Lightning Rod, Nexus,

Redirector

, Framer, Vanillaizer, Arsonist, Godfather

straight up, yeah

I wonder if there could possibly be either a bus driver or redirector in this game? Creature and Skitter NK’s seems weird to me.

I guess Nexus is possible too but that would only explain one of them.

[the worst]

During the night,

Creature was shot!

He was...

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Town Even-Night Loud Vigilante

Welcome to Starcraft Mafia!

You are Edmund Duke, a

Town Loud Even-Night Vigilante

.

On even-numbered nights, you can attempt to kill a player in the game. Your target will know that you are the one that tried to kill them if you visit them. Your weapon type is bullets and people killed will show up as being shot at daybreak.

Win:

You win when all non-town killing roles have been removed.

Game thread here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970

Confirm:

Please confirm by responding with your alignment and role name

During the night,

Irrelephant11 was shot!

He was...

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Town Two-Shot Paranoid Gun Owner

Welcome to Starcraft Mafia!

You are Rory Swann, a

Town Two-Shot Paranoid Gun Owner

.

You will attempt to kill the first two people who visit you. Note that you are not bulletproof. Your kill type is bullets and kills you make will be revealed as being shot.

You have two bullets. You will be informed when you have used a bullet.

Win:

You win when all non-town killing roles have been removed.

Game thread here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970

Confirm:

Please confirm by responding with your alignment and role name

Skitter30 has died during the night! They were Torn Apart by Zerg Forces

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Vanilla Town

Welcome to Starcraft Mafia!

You are a Terran Civilian, a

Vanilla Townie

.

Your only powers are your words and your vote!

Win:

You win when all non-town killing roles have been removed.

Game thread here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970

Confirm:

Please confirm by responding with your alignment and role name

it's definitely confirmed that neither of the n1 kills were performed by the zerg faction Varsoon is informed of. but yeah I can't work out why Creature would have been vigged and how Rel died unless like Creature was
redirected to Rel somehow to perform the NK? but I think that's too bastard

[AlmostNancy]

During the night,

Creature was shot!

He was...

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Town Even-Night Loud Vigilante

Welcome to Starcraft Mafia!

You are Edmund Duke, a

Town Loud Even-Night Vigilante

.

On even-numbered nights, you can attempt to kill a player in the game. Your target will know that you are the one that tried to kill them if you visit them. Your weapon type is bullets and people killed will show up as being shot at daybreak.

Win:

You win when all non-town killing roles have been removed.

Game thread here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970

Confirm:

Please confirm by responding with your alignment and role name

During the night,

Irrelephant11 was shot!

He was...

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Town Two-Shot Paranoid Gun Owner

Welcome to Starcraft Mafia!

You are Rory Swann, a

Town Two-Shot Paranoid Gun Owner

.

You will attempt to kill the first two people who visit you. Note that you are not bulletproof. Your kill type is bullets and kills you make will be revealed as being shot.

You have two bullets. You will be informed when you have used a bullet.

Win:

You win when all non-town killing roles have been removed.

Game thread here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970

Confirm:

Please confirm by responding with your alignment and role name

Skitter30 has died during the night! They were Torn Apart by Zerg Forces

Spoiler:

Spoiler:

Vanilla Town

Welcome to Starcraft Mafia!

You are a Terran Civilian, a

Vanilla Townie

.

Your only powers are your words and your vote!

Win:

You win when all non-town killing roles have been removed.

Game thread here: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=77970

Confirm:

Please confirm by responding with your alignment and role name

it's definitely confirmed that neither of the n1 kills were performed by the zerg faction Varsoon is informed of. but yeah I can't work out why Creature would have been vigged and how Rel died unless like Creature was
redirected to Rel somehow to perform the NK? but I think that's too bastard

The killing action could have been redirected to Creature but Creature was even night vig, so he had no actions N1.

But I see your point, N1 kills were performed by a different faction than N2. So, it now looks like Irrelephant11 was likely SK kill and Creature might have been vigged, where as Skitter looks like scum/Zerg kill. However, if there is either a bus driver/redirector/nexus in this setup, we might never really know, who the real targets were.

Neither Creature nor Irrelephant11 had

active

night actions on N1 and Skitter being a VT, obviously also had none. So if any actions upon them, were redirected by others - bus driver/redirector/nexus. If there is something like that in the setup. It wouldn’t at all surprise me, if there were.

[AlmostNancy]

Spoiler:

HAPPY FESTIVUS, EVERYONE!!!

[Nauci]

Why Skitter over Varsoon?

Why Varsoon over a claimed gunsmith?