Mini 579 - The Plagues of Egypt Mafia - Over

[hasdgfas]

Hackerhuck, I can see what you are getting at but I'd prefer you criticize the content of my case and that you make clear your opinion on lord_hur.
What's phony in my case apart from the aggressiveness - which I can assure you is genuine?

The implication of my post is that you are scum bussing your scumbuddy lord_hur. I believe you are faking anger/emotion at him being scummy. I'm not disagreeing with what you said, rather how you said it.

I could move this along with a

vote: Lord_hur

The way that you phrase this makes me think that you don't think Lord_hur is scum. Why would you vote for someone that you don't think is scum?

Lord Hur is not scum.

Do I see a soft claim?

What wonderful fishing from you, sl.

SL, I don't know what your intent is, but please remember this is a no-reveal game. If a person claims, he/she will not be confirmed. Everything he/she says will not be taken for sure pro-town talk, even after death. So (though based only on my reasoning, as it's my first no-reveal game) claiming is a lesser strategy than in normal games.

lord_hur, do you know that the person lynched today will not have their role revealed?

[lord_hur]

SL, I don't know what your intent is, but please remember this is a no-reveal game. If a person claims, he/she will not be confirmed. Everything he/she says will not be taken for sure pro-town talk, even after death. So (though based only on my reasoning, as it's my first no-reveal game) claiming is a lesser strategy than in normal games.

lord_hur, do you know that the person lynched today will not have their role revealed?

You're right, "partially no-reveal game" would have been more appropriate. I am not sure on the logic behind it (and I was bashed earlier for trying to uncover it, so I guess you're thinking it's useless), but it seems, from the current ratio (2/3), that there's a good chance to not get revealed.

[HackerHuck]

Hackerhuck, I can see what you are getting at but I'd prefer you criticize the content of my case and that you make clear your opinion on lord_hur.
What's phony in my case apart from the aggressiveness - which I can assure you is genuine?

The implication of my post is that you are scum bussing your scumbuddy lord_hur. I believe you are faking anger/emotion at him being scummy. I'm not disagreeing with what you said, rather how you said it.

I could move this along with a

vote: Lord_hur

The way that you phrase this makes me think that you don't think Lord_hur is scum. Why would you vote for someone that you don't think is scum?

I phrased it this way so I wouldn't get the kind of question that SpringLullaby asked me - "If I'm scummy, why didn't you vote for me?" Considering my subject of my post was Springlullaby, I chose to use those words to explain why I picked Lord_hur as my vote. When choosing between two of my likely scums, I will go for the scummier of the two or the one who is likely to be lynched. I think a wagon will help at this point in the day.

I'm still getting the feeling that lord_hur and SpringLullaby are not very genuine in their interactions.

[lord_hur]

Okay, this post did have interesting questions and did not have "I HATE YOU / YOU SUCK" written all over it.

If you think I was rolefishing and that it is scummy, why aren't you voting me?

Because I don't think it is enough to justify a vote.

Right now, my viewing of you is :

- attack backed up by some good arguments : -10
- use of some inappropriate arguments (in my opinion ; that's what I all craplogic) : +5
- role fishing : +15
- lacking the most basic rules of politeness : 0

Scum rating : 60 % - not enough to justify a vote

What gambit? What are you even talking about?

Hmm, then why were you asking for a votecount ?

"Take great delight in your disappointment'? Wtf?

That was not proper english ? Sorry, it is not my first language. I meant it will please me to counter your plans of getting me lynched.

?????? Please evidence of my being 'mentally twisted'?

Because all* of what I said have a pro-town explanation, but you never aknowledge it and always go straight for the scummy explanation, however unlikely it might be.

* Even casting that vote on HH : it was premature, and I only did it because Mr Stoofer asked everyone to cast a vote, but I did not do it to please him, but because he was right in saying that votes make the game go forward. If the request is justified, town will try to answer it positively too.

You're like a lawyer, only presenting the side of the case that suit your needs (and yes, I think all lawyers are mentally twisted, at least when they build a case).

In fact, you seem so one-sided, I begin to think you're, like a lawyer (where the cash comes from = good side), absolutely sure of the side they have to be on, so 2 possibilities :

- you're town : that you can legitimately be sure of my being scum means that I have made such ridiculous mistakes that they leave no room for uncertainty. The problem is, you're the only one who noticed them. So, unless you're some kind of all-seeing genius, it is quite unlikely.

- you're scum : in this case, you *are* sure that I am town (or scum, if you would be trying to bus me, though in this case, I think we'd be pretty awesome actors).

In short, I'm beginning to suspect that you're too sure of my side to be town.

[undo]

Not voting:

hasdgfas, Musher333

With 9 alive, it's

5 to lynch

.

Prodding thevampireofdusseldorf.

Deadline may be imposed soon.

[SeraphicMirth]

dunkpost! i will try to piost something good soon cuz i have thhoughts like stuff.

[Singing Librarian]

I suppose it's good that so many people are voting, but pretty weird that we're split five ways with no clear bandwagons emerging.

I'm having a difficult time forming a solid, explicable basis for thoughts on anyone's alignment in this game.

My strongest feeling is the case of Musher333, who I really feel is spending far too much time trying to manipulate the town by pretending to misunderstand people's posts. A re-read of tvod suggests that my early suspicion of him was merited - I think his posting style may have contributed to my feelings of irritation with him, but distance doesn't make the posts seem less scummy now, with the worst action being to bring up lines of thought which distract from hunting for scum.

[SeraphicMirth]

Ok, so, basically my thoughts are since people are unsure of TVoD, though I feel like he is probable scum (though I do need to re-read for his intractions with Guardian, I guess), I also feel that Musher is scum and I'm comfy with that from what I cited in my first post. So, I'll

Unvote

,

Vote Musher333

.

[HackerHuck]

A Musherwagon now? I'm not sure what to think about that one. I'm going to be away from the computer for a few days, but I'll have chewed on that before I get back.

[springlullaby]

hasdgfas, musher33, where do you stand?

[Musher333]

hasdgfas, musher33, where do you stand?

On what? I agree that there was over-acting between the interaction of you and lord hur but it didnt come from him, it came from you, it could have been wifom but he didnt seem scummish and well.... that leaves you doesnt it.

[lord_hur]

I'm not quite satisfied with a Musher333 wagon either :/

I've done a complete redread on him and didn't get any scummy vibe.

However, his semi-nonsensical style of play (misunderstanding lots of things, having somtimes a limited view of the game, etc) is quite hard to read for me, so I resorted to metagaming :

- as I've already said, his play is consistent with last game's, in which he was town ;
- in his post 44, he said :

I would ask everyone to do that, if i get lynched i get lynched but remember if/when i do and i come up town who was pushing for my lynch.

which was about the same thing he said in Mafia 80: Nice Shot!, just before getting lynched as townie 3 days ago ;
- I don't picture him as saying this, and later that he would claim if necessary, in order to deceive us.

These are certainly not decisive arguments (especially as my meta is truncated, as he has not been confirmed scum in any game yet), but enough to make me say there are other, more scummy targets in my opinion.

[Musher333]

I'm not quite satisfied with a Musher333 wagon either :/

I've done a complete redread on him and didn't get any scummy vibe.

However, his semi-nonsensical style of play (misunderstanding lots of things, having somtimes a limited view of the game, etc) is quite hard to read for me, so I resorted to metagaming :

- as I've already said, his play is consistent with last game's, in which he was town ;
- in his post 44, he said :

I would ask everyone to do that, if i get lynched i get lynched but remember if/when i do and i come up town who was pushing for my lynch.

which was about the same thing he said in Mafia 80: Nice Shot!, just before getting lynched as townie 3 days ago ;
- I don't picture him as saying this, and later that he would claim if necessary, in order to deceive us.

These are certainly not decisive arguments (especially as my meta is truncated, as he has not been confirmed scum in any game yet), but enough to make me say there are other, more scummy targets in my opinion.

I would be careful, you just referenced an ongoing game.

[lord_hur]

Yes, but I did not comment on it.

[SeraphicMirth]

lord_hur - you say there are many more scummy people but you haven't made any great cases for anyone. Besides spring lullaby, who I read as doing a completely normal analysis that got blown out of proportion, who are these people you think are so much more suspicious than musher? I saw one post where you did like one line on a few people, care to expand on anyone? what are you thinking?

I still feel my points, as well as others', on Mushers are valid. But, I will read through again in reference to your recent post in defense of him and see what I think.

[lord_hur]

lord_hur - you say there are many more scummy people

Well, it's not so much others that look more scummy than Musher333 who looks slightly less scummy to me. Right now I'd give him a 40% scum rating, which means that most people are at the same level or above him.

Besides spring lullaby, who I read as doing a completely normal analysis that got blown out of proportion

I hope you're kidding ? I've read a lot of games, and I've never read such an acid-laden case. I've even read some of her other games, and, unless I missed something, this is the first time she does this. She clearly wanted to bring me down with one huge blow, and when it wasn't enough, went over the top with another even more acidic write-up.

She designed it to be out of proportion, it is not my doing.

who are these people you think are so much more suspicious than musher? I saw one post where you did like one line on a few people, care to expand on anyone? what are you thinking?

springlullaby (65%) : already covered (the 5% more are for my reasoning about her being too sure)
HackerHuck (60%) : in addition to what I said earlier - quite uncommittal, comments on things but from afar, even that vote's justification was pretty neutral in addition of being light (but the vote still is there)
hasdgfas (60%) : confirmation of what I said earlier : 2 posts in nearly 20 days
Mr Stoofer (55%) : nothing more, as he's away

[Mr Stoofer]

OMFG how have we not lynched Musher yet? Do you guys not understand the fact that he gave himself away, by accusing me of being scum

for defending Guardian

. That means that

he knew that Guardian was scum

. And the only way he could have known that was if he was Guardian's scum buddy.

FFS guys, can we get this game going please?

[hasdgfas]

You may be right.

Musher333, can you explain - as precisely as possible - (I can't stress this enough, and please, more than one sentence) why you are thinking that Mr Stoofer seems "really scummy" ?

Its mainly because ( i know i have said this before and he has probably gave reasoning but i can't remember) that either he or guardian was staying close to the other and then as soon as the chances of guardian breadcrumming cop goes and he claims miller, BANG! Stoofer pushes hard for his lynch (Very much like he is for mine atm).

Musher333: As you know, I thought Guardian was a Cop until he admitted that he wasn't. So in fact, my plan was:

• I thought Guardian was a Cop --> I followed his votes and defended him.
  
• Guardian admitted he was trying to deceive people into thinking he was a Cop --> I tried to get him lynched because that is the behaviour of Scum.

Please explain why that is not a valid explanation for my interactions with Guardian.

@SeraphicMirth: TVOD is unlikely to be Scum, because of his interactions with Guardian-scum on day 1. And yes, I am prepared to assume that Guardian was Scum because only Scum pretend to be Cops when they are not.

Well i never thought of it like that, i understand the reasoning behind this style of play (much better than the style or lack of it that i use), i don't know why but although that should have seemed obvious it didnt look like that to me,

Unvote

.

Ok, sorry about not contributing to this game, but I kinda forgot about it.

I wanted to make a few comments about some things I've seen while reading.

The post I've already quoted: Stoofer had already explained his thought process for day 1, but just NOW you decide to listen and unvote?

Hackerhuck, I can see what you are getting at but I'd prefer you criticize the content of my case and that you make clear your opinion on lord_hur.
What's phony in my case apart from the aggressiveness - which I can assure you is genuine?

The implication of my post is that you are scum bussing your scumbuddy lord_hur. I believe you are faking anger/emotion at him being scummy. I'm not disagreeing with what you said, rather how you said it.

I could move this along with a

vote: Lord_hur

Ive got to agree with this, there seems to be just a lil over acting going on there.

What sort of overacting are you talking about?

Hackerhuck, I can see what you are getting at but I'd prefer you criticize the content of my case and that you make clear your opinion on lord_hur.
What's phony in my case apart from the aggressiveness - which I can assure you is genuine?

The implication of my post is that you are scum bussing your scumbuddy lord_hur. I believe you are faking anger/emotion at him being scummy. I'm not disagreeing with what you said, rather how you said it.

I could move this along with a

vote: Lord_hur

The way that you phrase this makes me think that you don't think Lord_hur is scum. Why would you vote for someone that you don't think is scum?

I phrased it this way so I wouldn't get the kind of question that SpringLullaby asked me - "If I'm scummy, why didn't you vote for me?" Considering my subject of my post was Springlullaby, I chose to use those words to explain why I picked Lord_hur as my vote. When choosing between two of my likely scums, I will go for the scummier of the two or the one who is likely to be lynched. I think a wagon will help at this point in the day.

I'm still getting the feeling that lord_hur and SpringLullaby are not very genuine in their interactions.

What makes you think they're not genuine in their interactions, HH?


I will

vote: Musher

as I want to hear more from him, and because I find him scummiest right now.

OMFG how have we not lynched Musher yet? Do you guys not understand the fact that he gave himself away, by accusing me of being scum

for defending Guardian

. That means that

he knew that Guardian was scum

. And the only way he could have known that was if he was Guardian's scum buddy.

I see another possible reason, but I'm not going to say it as I don't want to give him any outs.

[Musher333]

You may be right.

Musher333, can you explain - as precisely as possible - (I can't stress this enough, and please, more than one sentence) why you are thinking that Mr Stoofer seems "really scummy" ?

Its mainly because ( i know i have said this before and he has probably gave reasoning but i can't remember) that either he or guardian was staying close to the other and then as soon as the chances of guardian breadcrumming cop goes and he claims miller, BANG! Stoofer pushes hard for his lynch (Very much like he is for mine atm).

Musher333: As you know, I thought Guardian was a Cop until he admitted that he wasn't. So in fact, my plan was:

• I thought Guardian was a Cop --> I followed his votes and defended him.
  
• Guardian admitted he was trying to deceive people into thinking he was a Cop --> I tried to get him lynched because that is the behaviour of Scum.

Please explain why that is not a valid explanation for my interactions with Guardian.

@SeraphicMirth: TVOD is unlikely to be Scum, because of his interactions with Guardian-scum on day 1. And yes, I am prepared to assume that Guardian was Scum because only Scum pretend to be Cops when they are not.

Well i never thought of it like that, i understand the reasoning behind this style of play (much better than the style or lack of it that i use), i don't know why but although that should have seemed obvious it didnt look like that to me,

Unvote

.

Ok, sorry about not contributing to this game, but I kinda forgot about it.

I wanted to make a few comments about some things I've seen while reading.

The post I've already quoted: Stoofer had already explained his thought process for day 1, but just NOW you decide to listen and unvote?

Hackerhuck, I can see what you are getting at but I'd prefer you criticize the content of my case and that you make clear your opinion on lord_hur.
What's phony in my case apart from the aggressiveness - which I can assure you is genuine?

The implication of my post is that you are scum bussing your scumbuddy lord_hur. I believe you are faking anger/emotion at him being scummy. I'm not disagreeing with what you said, rather how you said it.

I could move this along with a

vote: Lord_hur

Ive got to agree with this, there seems to be just a lil over acting going on there.

What sort of overacting are you talking about?

Hackerhuck, I can see what you are getting at but I'd prefer you criticize the content of my case and that you make clear your opinion on lord_hur.
What's phony in my case apart from the aggressiveness - which I can assure you is genuine?

The implication of my post is that you are scum bussing your scumbuddy lord_hur. I believe you are faking anger/emotion at him being scummy. I'm not disagreeing with what you said, rather how you said it.

I could move this along with a

vote: Lord_hur

The way that you phrase this makes me think that you don't think Lord_hur is scum. Why would you vote for someone that you don't think is scum?

I phrased it this way so I wouldn't get the kind of question that SpringLullaby asked me - "If I'm scummy, why didn't you vote for me?" Considering my subject of my post was Springlullaby, I chose to use those words to explain why I picked Lord_hur as my vote. When choosing between two of my likely scums, I will go for the scummier of the two or the one who is likely to be lynched. I think a wagon will help at this point in the day.

I'm still getting the feeling that lord_hur and SpringLullaby are not very genuine in their interactions.

What makes you think they're not genuine in their interactions, HH?


I will

vote: Musher

as I want to hear more from him, and because I find him scummiest right now.

OMFG how have we not lynched Musher yet? Do you guys not understand the fact that he gave himself away, by accusing me of being scum

for defending Guardian

. That means that

he knew that Guardian was scum

. And the only way he could have known that was if he was Guardian's scum buddy.

I see another possible reason, but I'm not going to say it as I don't want to give him any outs.

I couldn't find the post i was looking for so i found the post in which lord_hur described spirngs attitude towards him:

Things

- overaggressiveness
- insults
- heavy word twisting

Need any more?

[lord_hur]

Hmm Musher333.... sorry, but hasdgfas' attack hardly compares. He's rather civil, not overaggressive and did no word twisting.

hasdgfas is apparently only following Mr Stoofer's opinion (he gave absolutely no reason for his vote, so that's my best guess).

So please reply to Mr Stoofer's (valid) question. I don't share his views, but I am also very interested in your answer.

And, for god's sake, try to construct your answer for once (take that as an exercise if you will : as long as you don't perform decently in this, you WILL get lynched simply for playing badly, over and over):/

[hasdgfas]

hasdgfas is apparently only following Mr Stoofer's opinion (he gave absolutely no reason for his vote, so that's my best guess).

Hello misrepresentation. Just because I didn't explicitly state my reasoning for my vote doesn't mean I'm just following stoofer. I definitely have reasons for it, but I really want to hear some defense from Musher before I say too much.

[HackerHuck]

OMFG how have we not lynched Musher yet? Do you guys not understand the fact that he gave himself away, by accusing me of being scum

for defending Guardian

. That means that

he knew that Guardian was scum

. And the only way he could have known that was if he was Guardian's scum buddy.

FFS guys, can we get this game going please?

I'm not buying this one right now. Mr Stoofer is making the case that Guardian was scum, so I don't see how this is a smoking gun on Musher. He only seems to be using Mr Stoofer's argument against him.

Lord_hur - how have I been non-commital? I believe I locked onto Guardian and stuck with him almost all of day one.

[Singing Librarian]

What on Earth was the point of your most recent post, Musher? Two unconnected (as far as I can work out) posts linked by a statement that you couldn't find the post that would prove something.

[lord_hur]

Lord_hur - how have I been non-commital? I believe I locked onto Guardian and stuck with him almost all of day one.

Actually, that's another thing I have against you, thanks for reminding me : you voted for Guardian while at the same time saying you didn't know if he were town or scum.

But here, I was talking about day 2 :
- your only attack this day (springlullaby bussing me) is pretty weak and hard to give credit to in my opinion - though I might be biased, so if someone else could comment on this...
- your Musher333 vote was only following Mr Stoofer with no additional argument -> weak vote
- you basically voted me just because someone else was voting me (and someone you're apparently suspecting of being scum, at that), while implying that you voted just to get the game going -> weak vote

[Mr Stoofer]

Since lord_hur and Musher333 are the two lynch leaders at the moment, I'd like to see each of them post detailed thoughts on the other.

Thanks.