Mini Theme 2077 - Restless Spirits Mafia [ENDED]

[Montosh]

Also I'm willing to give the Clemency slot some time to post and such. RAS was doing a fair bit of flailing but I could see it coming from town too.

he was saying there were bad votes on him, not that scum were voting him, though, and he was pushing me as scum, and I obviously knew his pushing of Nancy being AI was wrong.

Elbirn pushed the NAI thing and everyone should read it that way as wrong too.

Roster sheeps and tries to mindmeld with his town reads as town, and could have easily been scum going onto Ras, but Ras didn't state any of that. He just called them bad votes, which makes me feel he was scum caught for the wrong reasons kind of deal.

I'll have to ISO him later. I don't know but at first glance it feels like a very easy vote and very lynch-baity to me. I think all the replace-outs are messing with me here.

which lurkers?

like, uh
lil uzi vert
nmsa
i guess gamma counts

Just because they're lurkers? Anything stand out about any of them to you or is it just the lurking?

[Montosh]

I found it to be bad faith because it came off to me as if you’re trying to get Rooster to say he is town for it as opposed to showing why your particular argument might’ve been invalid.

This is still not making sense to me. Roster said "this is something I usually do" which is a factual claim. I asked for evidence to back up this factual claim. As in other games where he does this. He made a meta justification for actions and I asked for that meta.

Where am I not making sense to you?

And he still hasn't answered this.

**Lil Uzi Vert has been prodded on request**

For the record, I don’t like this.

I will force town to policy lynch me if anyone seriously requests for me to be prodded again.

Prod requests after 48 hours are part of the rules. This is a really exaggerated response. It strikes as fake frustration. Like I'm sure you glanced a the activity expectations when you started the game why is this such a big surprise to you and why are you making it a big deal?

[Montosh]

The votes keep being bad.

I don't know how to respond to this. Do you have a question?

[Montosh]

It's exactly the kind of role you might expect to find in a game where the central mechanic is talking to dead players.

A role which if you didn't claim it prior and didn't use it prior, to massclaim, your thoughts on the alignment of the player with it would be...

...Which alignment?

Town. Or scum. Depends on the player and how the game progressed. I'm not seeing automatic scumreads in a massclaim scenario. Am I the only one here?

Why, as town, would you immediately give scum that extra info and make it even easier to sort other slots?

Because if this is a role scum knowing about is a pro-scum thing for, then scum utilizing this info does nothing but good for the town.

For instance, say my role is a hard counter to a scum role and they've got panic to knowing that if I have an inkling of how to use it properly, it fucks their scum role over. They do something to stop that--but this is information I'd NEVER have, and the town would NEVER have, if not for the claim. If scum had a role which my role were a hard counter to, without me claiming it, I'd have no way of knowing said scum role existed. But by claiming my role, if said scum role exists, then scum's reaction to my role could give me an insight into the existence of what said role could be.

(I've thought about hypotheticals, but mostly they involve a scum being some sort of possessive spirit of some kind who can, I dunno, control the vote of the town player they're assigned to as a medium, or force the town player to commit the scum factional nightkill, or things like that. And if a scum role like that exists, then the scum panicking about MY role existing is worth claiming it.)

I'm definitely feeling this setup spec here. Seems like something that might be possible and a reason for such a role to exist in town hands. But I still have questions then. I mean, for one you're saying that claiming might panic the scum if they have a role you counter. But do you really think that "panic" is going to make them do enough for you to be able to sniff them out?

And I mean if that is true and they're panicking why not just nk you ASAP? Render your counter useless? If you're town, then you seem to be risking a lot for no tangible gain as I can see it. Why not just keep your role secret and try to sniff them out without publicly revealing yourself? If they do have such a role as you're suggesting they might then they'll maybe guess that a role like yours exists anyway. I still don't see why you give them the extra info of whose slot it's in.

Was this on your mind when you made the claim? Or have these ideas come together more in the last few days?

[Montosh]

VOTE: Montosh

Hey how's it going?

[Montosh]

And why are you conflating your role, which is only anti-town if you use it badly (and is definitely not if you never use it), with roles that passively screw with night actions?

You see a difference between them.
I see none.

I don't see how. You have control over what it does to night actions. The roles you're comparing it to do not. They're not at all the same.

[Montosh]

Mastina has a

tendency

to tunnel town me.

Any examples of this?

Just one that I can remember. It was expected based on comments in dead threads on my some of my older scum victories, though, that I knew that there was a high possibility based on the types of players we are that she'd push me when I'm town.

That's all I need to know she has the tendency to tunnel town me, but I feel she might adapt afterwards. I've tunneled town her once as well.

I'll find the game later for you, if you want. There might have been more, but only one I can remember. We

haven't played too much

.

What I'm getting here is she tunneled you one game. How is that a tendency?

[Flavor Leaf]

tendency was the wrong word, I agree. More like a knack.

Also, you said "easy to vote and lynch baity" which are NOT words associated with Ras ever.

[Montosh]

Ok RAS:

---

133 Opening post. Has a town-read of mastina not because he agrees with her logic but because he feels it's a town reaction to have. This was similar to my initial reaction so I don't really fault it. Has some mostly tonal townreads on Titus/Nero/myself. It's early in the game and there's not much to go on so I don't see anything up with this. Votes Creature based on their opening posts and doesn't give much explanation.

158 Having a discussion with me about the mastina claim issue, which is the major thing to come up to this point. Don't agree with his logic but he made arguments in what I feel to be good faith.

206 Votes for the Rx/leaf slot after nancy's issue with roster. More tonal arguments. Also can't fault him for this. I kinda agreed with it to some extent until the replace out which I felt was pretty NAI.

208 CMM challenges RAS on the Creature read and provides two posts he didn't like. Good points, especially 104, where Creature is ignoring the fact that this was the main discussion and somehow deciding that mastina having meta for this as scum doesn't matter. This is a good post and not at all scum.

218 Ironic since they would also later replace out. But half-right. Frustration is not a town-tell and I can't stand when people say it is. It's NAI at best.

Next few posts explaining and talking about the nancy thing

229 Right to point out that roster's read didn't have much attached to it

233 Clearly annoyed, getting aggressive. Decides to relent and move onto Creature. I don't see this as a bad thing if town. Moving on from a discussion that isn't going anywhere at that time is a good town thing to do. Gives people a little time to breathe (and yourself most of all) so you think clearly. The subsequent votes clearly messed that up and he got annoyed and replaced out. Sucks that he did that and it's on him, but it's not scum. The flailing on Rx is the closest thing you might get to scum here and reading through it the slot seems town.

I don't know that's all I got. I don't like the RAS/Clemency wagon. I don't like how there seems to be little resistance to it. It feels off.

[Montosh]

tendency was the wrong word, I agree. More like a knack.

Also, you said "easy to vote and lynch baity" which are NOT words associated with Ras ever.

Don't know RAS. But in this game the slot seem easy to vote and lynch-baity. As was your slot to some extent. In many ways for the same reason, an emotional replace-out.

The wagons against both of you seem to be for some similar reasons. Why is one better than the other?

[Montosh]

Is NMSA even here? What are your thoughts on the last 10 or so pages?

[Flavor Leaf]

tendency was the wrong word, I agree. More like a knack.

Also, you said "easy to vote and lynch baity" which are NOT words associated with Ras ever.

Don't know RAS. But in this game the slot seem easy to vote and lynch-baity. As was your slot to some extent. In many ways for the same reason, an emotional replace-out.

The wagons against both of you seem to be for some similar reasons. Why is one better than the other?

Because Ras is Ras, and Nancy is Nancy.

Crappy to meta it there, but can't help it. I'm also conf bias because I know we're town.

They're similar sure, but they aren't the same.

It's like The Force Awakens to A New Hope; they definitely follow a similar narrative with a lot of parallels, but are they the same thing to you?

[Elbirn]

El, do you think Nancy's hydra/dlavor leaf is scum?

No they're town I think

[Clemency]

I don't think FL is capable of rolling scum so can we just Lynch RAS or something.

I am lean scum on Ras, but I don’t like lynching Clemency. I was scum recently, and I mislynched him for the win and I felt bad, so I feel clemency has high equity to pocket me eventually because I never want to kill him. He even came in in a way where he was like “FL, you’re wrong, but I understand why you thought Ras was scum. He was scum, but I’m not.” If that makes sense.

which game was this again

[Flavor Leaf]

the game I just lynched you in...and I was scum. with ausuka. let's talk about an ongoing game.

i got my new sig quote from you from it

[Clemency]

oh yeeeea that one

[Clemency]

which lurkers?

like, uh
lil uzi vert
nmsa
i guess gamma counts

Just because they're lurkers? Anything stand out about any of them to you or is it just the lurking?

i said this because i was more or less townleaning the active players at the time

[Nero Cain]

oh good, gamma is within range for me to request a prod. And NMSA has 14 hours until I get to.

MOD PLEASE PROD GAMMA

this game is boring.

[Clemency]

its amazing just how little power can get to your head

[Nero Cain]

lol

[Nero Cain]

tbh, I bet the mod is gonna get sick of me requesting prods and will change the rule :/

[Ankamius]

**Gamma Emerald has been prodded by request.**

[ConManMick]

VOTE: Montosh

Hey how's it going?

Hi Montosh. I think Mastina is essentially a named miller and I think it was fair to claim, so I didn't like your 304.

(Also for ease of reading, can someone remind me how to hyperlink posts? I'm VERY rusty on Mafia-relevant formatting, I've been hiding away in the Speezy for too long)

[Nero Cain]

text (least i think)


for posts ITT just wrap them in post tags

[Nero Cain]

Also I don't really like mastina's claim and I think she's scummy 4 it. Y is Mont scummy 4 it and not me?