Michael Scott is town because Nancy left her scumrange before replacing out
.
-Blake
Some reason you’re ignoring this, Icon?
Are you seriously shocked that I’m having trouble tr you rn?
My dude i'm seriously confused this game
that BW kill doesn't make sense and the only 'logical' conclusion I can draw from it is that I'm scum because Association and I know i'm not scum
I'm fairly sure there's scum in you/Aubrey because mechanics and I think Aubrey is more likely town
This is why my other heads are sl you because you are ignoring the fact that with our slot being put to L-2 or L-1, every fucking day since this game started, we are going to be stupid enough to kill a slot that lockcleared us?
Why would we be NK’d when scum clearly views us as easy mislynchbait? Explain that to me? I agree with you on Aubrey town, further reasoning why your argument is surface level.
A) Scum never NKs us here, when they know we’re obvious mislynchbait.
B) We don’t kill the one slot locktowning us unless you think we’re insane.
C) Why couldn’t Aubrey be saved for a later mislynch?
You need to think who benefits most by B & W dead? Not us, not Aubrey. As for Persi, I suspect B & W were not tr his partner and he wants us dead, which admit it - be impossible with B & W still in the game. That’s why he backed off of us onto zeebu, because B & W pushed him to.
I was not sr Persi until he kept doing this super sketchy policy lynch thing along with his sr. We realized that he was pushing that angle to justify his push when we flip green. Otherwise, why does he not just straight up sr us? Why also push the bs policy lynch crap as a backup?
The only other slot that had something to gain from BW kill is saudude
Possibly, I still think Persi is scummier though. I’m not opposed to Saudade lynch but I think the whole PL angle Persi is pushing on us, is scum indicative.
In post 1280, Iconeum wrote:Saud's been calling your lynch all game, and when on L-2 the entire time he doesn't wanna vote there
I think he has no problem hammering us. The only slot he won’t touch it seems is Persi.
And Persi has also been trying to lynch us all game too. If the majority want Saudade, I will definitely vote him but I just can’t get past why town!Persi keeps pushing the policy lynch angle every chance he gets. One post in particular really pinged me:
In post 1057, Persivul wrote:This game is going nowhere with Nancy in it. Just kill them.
In post 1281, Iconeum wrote:It may not mean much but Saudude might be the only one crazy enough to kill BW
B & W were obvtown leaders though, so I don’t know why killing them would necessarily be considered “crazy”? I still think that they were killed because they were preventing our mislynch, so unless you can convince me Persi is town, I still prefer him to Saudade.
I think that it’s probably unlikely that they’re SvS, since generally scumteams wouldn’t want to be this obvious.
In post 1082, Persivul wrote:If these PRs were both town, it would be highly unlikely that scum would let both live, even if scum have the captain. If scum have both the captain and commander it wouldn't matter, but that also is highly unlikely.
You are vastly oversimplifying things and your narrative of "I think LJK is scum because Zeebu flipped town, but I also just want to policy lynch Nancy" is incredibly scummy. I don't think that town!you seriously pushes for a policy lynch on day two after we have already had one mislynch because you don't think Nancy should be in this game. You also haven't even explained why you think town!Zeebu implies scum!LJK -- what is the connection there that suggests that we can't be TvT and Zeebu was simply wrong!town with respect to his read on our slot? Considering that we weren't even pushing Zeebu (we were pushing Saudade) on day one, if you are town why does Zeebu's town flip have you convinced that we are scum? Do you believe that his wagon was all-town?
It's also interesting how your takeaway from Zeebu’s town flip is that we are scum, considering you are the one who brought the Zeebu wagon back directly in response to Icon being wagoned:
In post 913, Persivul wrote:Actually I went off zeebu because I didn't see LJ slot and zeebu as S/S and wanted LJ worse. Now that I've backed off somewhat on the LJ/MS read, that doesn't apply anymore. Just read Icon and zeebu ISOs, and icon is clearly better.
VOTE: zeebu
In post 915, Blake x Weiss wrote:I'll let Weiss have this one. We can lynch scum tomorrow, then.
The likeliehood of Zeebu’s wagon being all-town is next to zero, yet all you seem interested in is pushing our slot.
And why even mention anything about a policy lynch if you are convinced that we are scum? If you are town and fully convinced that we are scum, then there’s nothing “policy” about pushing us – you would simply be pushing your strongest scumread. Adding in the secondary reason of “It’s policy” just gives you something to fall back on lylo to defend yourself with in the event that you push our mislynch through today.
And no, it isn't mechanically confirmed that at least one of {us, Aubrey} is scum. Especially in the scenario where the command structure isn't all-town and the secondary scum win condition of "kill off the entire command structure" doesn't apply, there's no reason for scum to focus on killing officers specifically. In that scenario scum has to win "the old-fashioned way" by getting three mislynches -- in which case it makes sense for scum to prioritize killing off obvtown players/threatening players over PR's and/or officers. B&W was obvtown on day one, our slot wasn't despite claiming both PR and Lieutenant. That alone is a good reason for scum to nightkill B&W. Furthermore, if both the Captain (Datisi) and Aubrey are town, then scum has to assume we might be protected on night one, so they aren't going to try and nightkill us before dealing with Aubrey. In that scenario their choices are to 1) nightkill Aubrey so they can come after us next or 2) kill a strong town player that was unlikely to be protected. Scenario 1 only really makes sense if the entire command structure is town and the secondary scum win condition applies; scenario 2 makes a lot of sense if there is scum in the command structure.
In fact, even if the command structure is all-town it still makes sense for scum to not nightkill us if they think they can push our mislynch through on day two. Assume that both Aubrey and us are town, and that the entire command structure is town. Let’s furthermore assume that scum concludes Aubrey isn’t an officer, given that he immediately claimed doctor when he was at L-1 because he wanted his wagon to die down, and if he was both an officer and the doctor he likely would have claimed both given how concerned he was about his wagon. So on night one there were eight people alive: us, Aubrey, the two members of the scumteam, and the four remaining townies. From scum’s point of view in this scenario this would mean that both the Captain AND the Commander would be among those four other slots, which included B&W – so killing in one of those four slots already gives scum a 50% chance of hitting the Captain or the Commander. Even in the case where they don’t hit the Captain or Commander on night one, that means that on night two they have at least a 66.66~% of hitting either the Captain or the Commander, depending upon who is lynched on day two (because both the Captain and the Commander are among the three other slots that weren't nightkilled on night one). That’s not bad at all, especially if scum is able to push our mislynch on day two – because that negates the need to prioritize killing Aubrey in the first place, because the purpose of that is strictly to open our slot up as a nightkill on night two.
An Aubrey nightkill really makes the most sense if 1) the entire command structure is all-town and 2) scum doesn’t think they can push our mislynch through. Barring both of those things being true it makes more sense to prioritize killing someone who is 1) an obvtown player with a lot of influence over the game and 2) likely to become a significant threat to the scumteam. B&W arguably met both of those criteria more so than any other slot in the game on day one.
The nightkill of B&W especially makes sense if there is scum among {Iconeum, Datisi}, considering B&W's final reads list and the fact that they wanted to lynch in one of those two slots before you shifted the focus away from Iconeum towards Zeebu instead:
Michael Scott is town because Nancy left her scumrange before replacing out.
Aubrey is town.
Persivul is town.
Zeebu and Voted I feel have the most consistent mindset in a way that I believe they'd struggle to have as scum. I think they would've buckled or at least shifted a bit to pressure.
Saudade is just perpetually null, I don't care enough to sort him.
Iconeum has this weird undertone to his posts that make me think he's not speaking naturally, something about how he's emphasizing certain things at certain times that don't sit right or something, either way I don't get the impression that he's legitimately sorting as much as putting on the show to.
Datisi doesn't feel like she's sorting at all, just sitting in the back coasting. There's been a few instances of reads being given, but it's few and far between and otherwise I haven't gotten the impression she's been trying to solve the game this whole time.
All three of our heads agree on you being scum, and we think Icon is most likely your partner. It’s fairly self-explanatory why the B&W nightkill benefits scum!Icon –- before B&W switched their vote to Zeebu (a counter-wagon to Icon which you started), they clearly wanted to lynch Icon specifically on day one. Scum!Icon knew that B&W would be coming after him today. Furthermore, as Nancy pointed out, B&W townreading you is not as significant as them townreading us – Ank/Blake has never incorrectly townread scum!Nancy before, whereas Ank/Blake has incorrectly townread scum!Perisvul before, and she admits she has a hard time reading Persivul accurately. Meaning that scum!Persivul would know that Ank/Blake’s townread on him was unstable and could change at any time (see: the first CoC game and B&W’s ISO in it –- town!B&W initially incorrectly townread scum!Persivul on day one in that game and then later flipped their read on him).
So in addition to protecting scum!Icon from being pushed by Ank/Blake, the B&W nightkill furthermore benefits scum!Persivul because it denies B&W the opportunity to flip their read on him. And scum!Persivul also knew that Ank/Blake would continue to hard defend us today if she were still alive, making it much harder for him to push our mislynch through. It’s incredibly scummy how Persivul accepted Ank/Blake’s townlock on our slot at the end of day one and backed off of his push on our slot based on that alone (he specifically backed off of pushing our slot when he came to learn that Liz is Nancy -- see 897, 898, 913), then pushed Icon, then changed his mind and pushed Zeebu, and is now arguing that Zeebu’s town flip implies that we are scum despite us having nothing to do with Zeebu’s lynch – and all the while he is now completely disregarding Ank/Blake’s townlock of our slot despite accepting it on day one (Ank/Blake repeatedly said we are locktown towards the end of day one: see 686, 737, 739, 868, 870, 875). Persivul is scum and it’s obvious that he is trying to chain Zeebu and our slot as back-to-back mislynches. He couldn't continue to push our slot once B&W started hard defending us towards the end of day one, but now that Ank/Blake is gone he feels confident to resume his disingenuous push our slot.
In post 1082, Persivul wrote:If these PRs were both town, it would be highly unlikely that scum would let both live, even if scum have the captain. If scum have both the captain and commander it wouldn't matter, but that also is highly unlikely.
You are vastly oversimplifying things and your narrative of "I think LJK is scum because Zeebu flipped town, but I also just want to policy lynch Nancy" is incredibly scummy. I don't think that town!you seriously pushes for a policy lynch on day two after we have already had one mislynch because you don't think Nancy should be in this game. You also haven't even explained why you think town!Zeebu implies scum!LJK -- what is the connection there that suggests that we can't be TvT and Zeebu was simply wrong!town with respect to his read on our slot? Considering that we weren't even pushing Zeebu (we were pushing Saudade) on day one, if you are town why does Zeebu's town flip have you convinced that we are scum? Do you believe that his wagon was all-town?
It's also interesting how your takeaway from Zeebu’s town flip is that we are scum, considering you are the one who brought the Zeebu wagon back directly in response to Icon being wagoned:
In post 913, Persivul wrote:Actually I went off zeebu because I didn't see LJ slot and zeebu as S/S and wanted LJ worse. Now that I've backed off somewhat on the LJ/MS read, that doesn't apply anymore. Just read Icon and zeebu ISOs, and icon is clearly better.
VOTE: zeebu
In post 915, Blake x Weiss wrote:I'll let Weiss have this one. We can lynch scum tomorrow, then.
The likeliehood of Zeebu’s wagon being all-town is next to zero, yet all you seem interested in is pushing our slot.
And why even mention anything about a policy lynch if you are convinced that we are scum? If you are town and fully convinced that we are scum, then there’s nothing “policy” about pushing us – you would simply be pushing your strongest scumread. Adding in the secondary reason of “It’s policy” just gives you something to fall back on lylo to defend yourself with in the event that you push our mislynch through today.
And no, it isn't mechanically confirmed that at least one of {us, Aubrey} is scum. Especially in the scenario where the command structure isn't all-town and the secondary scum win condition of "kill off the entire command structure" doesn't apply, there's no reason for scum to focus on killing officers specifically. In that scenario scum has to win "the old-fashioned way" by getting three mislynches -- in which case it makes sense for scum to prioritize killing off obvtown players/threatening players over PR's and/or officers. B&W was obvtown on day one, our slot wasn't despite claiming both PR and Lieutenant. That alone is a good reason for scum to nightkill B&W. Furthermore, if both the Captain (Datisi) and Aubrey are town, then scum has to assume we might be protected on night one, so they aren't going to try and nightkill us before dealing with Aubrey. In that scenario their choices are to 1) nightkill Aubrey so they can come after us next or 2) kill a strong town player that was unlikely to be protected. Scenario 1 only really makes sense if the entire command structure is town and the secondary scum win condition applies; scenario 2 makes a lot of sense if there is scum in the command structure.
In fact, even if the command structure is all-town it still makes sense for scum to not nightkill us if they think they can push our mislynch through on day two. Assume that both Aubrey and us are town, and that the entire command structure is town. Let’s furthermore assume that scum concludes Aubrey isn’t an officer, given that he immediately claimed doctor when he was at L-1 because he wanted his wagon to die down, and if he was both an officer and the doctor he likely would have claimed both given how concerned he was about his wagon. So on night one there were eight people alive: us, Aubrey, the two members of the scumteam, and the four remaining townies. From scum’s point of view in this scenario this would mean that both the Captain AND the Commander would be among those four other slots, which included B&W – so killing in one of those four slots already gives scum a 50% chance of hitting the Captain or the Commander. Even in the case where they don’t hit the Captain or Commander on night one, that means that on night two they have at least a 66.66~% of hitting either the Captain or the Commander, depending upon who is lynched on day two (because both the Captain and the Commander are among the three other slots that weren't nightkilled on night one). That’s not bad at all, especially if scum is able to push our mislynch on day two – because that negates the need to prioritize killing Aubrey in the first place, because the purpose of that is strictly to open our slot up as a nightkill on night two.
An Aubrey nightkill really makes the most sense if 1) the entire command structure is all-town and 2) scum doesn’t think they can push our mislynch through. Barring both of those things being true it makes more sense to prioritize killing someone who is 1) an obvtown player with a lot of influence over the game and 2) likely to become a significant threat to the scumteam. B&W arguably met both of those criteria more so than any other slot in the game on day one.
The nightkill of B&W especially makes sense if there is scum among {Iconeum, Datisi}, considering B&W's final reads list and the fact that they wanted to lynch in one of those two slots before you shifted the focus away from Iconeum towards Zeebu instead:
Michael Scott is town because Nancy left her scumrange before replacing out.
Aubrey is town.
Persivul is town.
Zeebu and Voted I feel have the most consistent mindset in a way that I believe they'd struggle to have as scum. I think they would've buckled or at least shifted a bit to pressure.
Saudade is just perpetually null, I don't care enough to sort him.
Iconeum has this weird undertone to his posts that make me think he's not speaking naturally, something about how he's emphasizing certain things at certain times that don't sit right or something, either way I don't get the impression that he's legitimately sorting as much as putting on the show to.
Datisi doesn't feel like she's sorting at all, just sitting in the back coasting. There's been a few instances of reads being given, but it's few and far between and otherwise I haven't gotten the impression she's been trying to solve the game this whole time.
All three of our heads agree on you being scum, and we think Icon is most likely your partner. It’s fairly self-explanatory why the B&W nightkill benefits scum!Icon –- before B&W switched their vote to Zeebu (a counter-wagon to Icon which you started), they clearly wanted to lynch Icon specifically on day one. Scum!Icon knew that B&W would be coming after him today. Furthermore, as Nancy pointed out, B&W townreading you is not as significant as them townreading us – Ank/Blake has never incorrectly townread scum!Nancy before, whereas Ank/Blake has incorrectly townread scum!Perisvul before, and she admits she has a hard time reading Persivul accurately. Meaning that scum!Persivul would know that Ank/Blake’s townread on him was unstable and could change at any time (see: the first CoC game and B&W’s ISO in it –- town!B&W initially incorrectly townread scum!Persivul on day one in that game and then later flipped their read on him).
So in addition to protecting scum!Icon from being pushed by Ank/Blake, the B&W nightkill furthermore benefits scum!Persivul because it denies B&W the opportunity to flip their read on him. And scum!Persivul also knew that Ank/Blake would continue to hard defend us today if she were still alive, making it much harder for him to push our mislynch through. It’s incredibly scummy how Persivul accepted Ank/Blake’s townlock on our slot at the end of day one and backed off of his push on our slot based on that alone (he specifically backed off of pushing our slot when he came to learn that Liz is Nancy -- see 897, 898, 913), then pushed Icon, then changed his mind and pushed Zeebu, and is now arguing that Zeebu’s town flip implies that we are scum despite us having nothing to do with Zeebu’s lynch – and all the while he is now completely disregarding Ank/Blake’s townlock of our slot despite accepting it on day one (Ank/Blake repeatedly said we are locktown towards the end of day one: see 686, 737, 739, 868, 870, 875). Persivul is scum and it’s obvious that he is trying to chain Zeebu and our slot as back-to-back mislynches. He couldn't continue to push our slot once B&W started hard defending us towards the end of day one, but now that Ank/Blake is gone he feels confident to resume his disingenuous push our slot.
In post 1281, Iconeum wrote:It may not mean much but Saudude might be the only one crazy enough to kill BW
B & W were obvtown leaders though, so I don’t know why killing them would necessarily be considered “crazy”? I still think that they were killed because they were preventing our mislynch, so unless you can convince me Persi is town, I still prefer him to Saudade.
I think that it’s probably unlikely that they’re SvS, since generally scumteams wouldn’t want to be this obvious.
I consider it crazy because I'd go after the doc. They didn't, so I have to assume doc is either scum, or controlleable by scum.
Maybe i'm looking into this too much and should just relook into my scumreads without mechanics
Rawr!
#stopmodabuse
#Town!Ico.never.does.that.
"paying to play mafia is like paying someone to punch you in the face" ~ Datisi
-A player who voluntarily replaces out may replace back in
IF I deem that such an action will not negatively affect the game
. Any instance of this will be considered on a case by case basis, and will be allowed ONLY ONCE. A second voluntary replace out is PERMANENT regardless of the situation.
If you have an issue with this decision, please take it up with me after the end of the game as I cannot discuss it until then, thank you.
This was possibly the worst modding decision I've ever seen. You and Nancy completely fucked up this game.
There is only one instance in which it's acceptable for someone who replaced out to come back into a game: the slot's been on the replacement queue for more than two days with no takers.
mod, please replace me.
I know that's not the proper way to replace out, but we know how much you care about the replacement rules...
When I asked to replace back into the game, Chibi/pisskop consulted a list mod for advice and it was on the okay of that particular list mod, that it wasn’t in violation of the rules for me to replace in. @Persi, your behaviour here - especially unfairly trashing the mod for strictly going by the book no less - is an absolute disgrace to this site. You should feel thoroughly ashamed for your actions.
I don’t see how two prs still being alive = scum hydra. There was a strong chance they were going to be protected since they are a PR and a chain of command. In what world does scum go after them over me, or someone else less likely to get protected? I don’t see how mechanically they look worse than me.
You questioning my alignment makes sense from a mechanics POV. I was shocked to learn I didn’t bite the bullet. I can only make assumptions.
Then your arguing captain must be scum, so I’ll ask you the same thing I asked the hydra. What is the scum motive for 2 Protectives protecting Pers? She coulda protected pers and the hydra and gone from there just as easily.
