Why does town do so badly with the White Flag mechanic?

[chennisden]

grey flag is townsided.

[chennisden]

you just have to find one scum out of 3 to win.

[chennisden]

scum spew themselves a lot.

it's just up to town to find it

[chennisden]

That's why you need to make sure town's leading the game

[chennisden]

good thing i picked the right read to sheep

thonk

[chennisden]

how to be good as scum: dont roll scum

[chennisden]

ftr i prefer mountainous open setups with some sort of twist because

1) vanilla mountainous is boring and
2) relying on setup spec doesn't make me a better player

[chennisden]

i dunno

the whole point of bussing is to make yourself look better than other townies when your scum teammate goes down

but scum don't know how to make other townies look worse on their flip

[chennisden]

I think these non-PR games are a lot more fun personally. It reduces to the basics of scumhunting & manipulating, and exposes skill differences much more dramatically. As a result, the games might look much more one-sided, either in town or scum's favor. I don't think that means the game is inherently imbalanced to one side.

I agree with this

[chennisden]

I haven't played a single game where every slot has actually tried.

[chennisden]

Kaivernan has a "majority to end day early, 1/4 plurality to lynch at deadline rule" that I think is very good.

But it also allows people to no effort

[chennisden]

If good lists are scumsided it is what it is

[chennisden]

I'd rather have everyone try and it be scumsided than get a free win because scum/town weren't trying

[chennisden]

The reason town does so bad in white flag btw is because you need a D1 solve and for most players that's really really situational

[chennisden]

I haven't played a single game where every slot has actually tried.

To be honest, those tend to not be very fun games and tensions run high. Look at any scummies invitational.
You do need a mix of hardcore and casual players

I'm not talking about every slot tryharding and making wallposts on every other player.

I'm just talking about not lurking out the game while TECHNICALLY fulfilling activity requirements up to the point that you literally don't defend yourself at all during LyLo.

[chennisden]

No.

We just need certain players to stop no efforting

[chennisden]

Exactly

The "no asking for someone else to replace out/be replaced out" rule is stupid because it doesn't make exceptions like these.

I don't get why people sign up to play games and DON'T PLAY THEM and DON'T REPLACE OUT

[chennisden]

I haven't played a single game where every slot has actually tried.

Except for newbie games. That's part of why I still sign up for them

[chennisden]

There isn't
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=79321

[chennisden]

I think it's easy to tell who exactly is lurking the hell out of the game.

So I'll just add an addendum to my rules: "If I feel that you have made minimal meaningful contributions to the game and/or are only passing the activity requirements by technicality rather than in spirit, I may force replace you at my discretion without warning."

[chennisden]

it is detrimental to the game's atmosphere to demand others replace out, particularly if it's not on the basis of activity but rather player expectations of how a player should play the game

It does leave some leeway around for inactivity though

Obviously this should be done privately with the moderator in terms of activity.

[chennisden]

Yet mods refuse to do this anyway

[chennisden]

It's really, really easy to tell when players are breaking this in spirit.

I don't think it's unreasonable to expect mods to just force replace them without warning at that point. Yet mods refuse to do this

[chennisden]

I forgot who said this

But they suggested "replace out = temporary signup ban"

[chennisden]

Are there issues with that proposal? Yes. But I think this is a good first step towards fixing a big problem

[chennisden]

If only we could stimulate players to stop replacing out.

Or like start not allowing them into our games.

Hard to do

[chennisden]

Idk

This might make people take prods more seriously:

If you get prodded, the mod will search for a replacement. If none is found then great you can stay

I've never been prodded before and I've had some times when I was REALLY busy.

[chennisden]

Idk

This might make people take prods more seriously:

If you get prodded, the mod will search for a replacement. If none is found then great you can stay

I've never been prodded before and I've had some times when I was REALLY busy.

I don't like prods because it's not fair for players that post a ton of content then disappears for about two or more days out of exhaustion/to focus elsewhere while there are other players posting one "content" post every two days to dodge prods.

Frequently I end seeing a ton of 10 or less posters by the end of a day.

This is true, but post amount isn't a good measure of content. Wallposters post more content in one post than I do in two pages of spam and fluff

I honestly think the current system is unusable and moderator discretion should be used instead.

In the first case just "poke" them (i.e. send them a PM saying "Hey, post!" but don't look for a replacement) and for the second case I think you should start looking for a replacement.