Alisae V Pine: Trees Apparently Make Good Treestumps

[the worst]

We can lynch mastina
VOTE: mastina

yeah welcome

Btw
I don’t actually think Fire is scum

you've made that quite clear. why not?

[Alisae]

I don’t actually think Fire is scum

tho he did just make the game harder

he’s a dick.
He’s not scum
Just a fucking baby who has to die at some point within this game.
He’s probably not flipping scum
But he has to die

[Firebringer]

alisae u never wanted to work with me in this game. So don't expect me to want to work with you.

[Alisae]

Part of me wants to think that Pine saw Fire as a towny who wants to go against me, made an offer to him that looks very appealing, and he took it because Pine is the devil and now Fire has the tool he needs to basically shit on me all game.

[popsofctown]

You've explained in this post how the correct, pro-town stance, is, "I wanted to play in such a way that when I turned up dead N1, everyone would be positive that I was not the nightkill target Pine selected, but instead the target I crumbed was, clearing them".

Not what I said and outright false?

The only way a bodyguard dieing is definitively from a successful protection is if the bodyguard was playing shitty enough to never be the nightkill by dayplay.

There's nothing correct about playing shitty enough that you're never the nightkill.

It's always correct to be playing good enough where you could plausibly be the nightkill, even if you personally know it was due to a successful protection.

This is stupidly obvious.

You're moving the goalposts to obscure your scumslip.

Yes playing pro-town always justifies itself.

You posted that you

wanted

-

town

- to be unsure if you successfully BGed.
You are correct that you can't really achieve the opposite goal without scumsiding and as a result you shouldn't ever approach BG that way.

But you posted that you

wanted

town and only town

to be unsure if you successfully BGed and you can't delete it even if you try to recharacterize now.

[Alisae]

alisae u never wanted to work with me in this game. So don't expect me to want to work with you.

you didn’t want to vote LLD
I told you to vote LLD
We got a scumflip

Who do we have to blame for that fucking awful townread?
You

[Firebringer]

Part of me wants to think that Pine saw Fire as a towny who wants to go against me, made an offer to him that looks very appealing, and he took it because Pine is the devil and now Fire has the tool he needs to basically shit on me all game.

[mastina]

hey alisae ur crossing a line.

Only if you're scum.

You deserve every word and then some if for some mystical reason this is you as town, but thankfully it isn't.

I do agree with you given you being scum that Ali's reaction is a bit extreme tho.

[Dannflor]

I skimmed the last 20 pages because fuck that

Pops, can you summarize in like 1 paragraph what Mastina's slip was?

[Firebringer]

hey alisae ur crossing a line.

Only if you're scum.

You deserve every word and then some if for some mystical reason this is you as town, but thankfully it isn't.

I do agree with you given you being scum that Ali's reaction is a bit extreme tho.

ohh go fuck yourself mastina

[Formerfish]

jingle, does hider act before bodyguard in the NAR order?

Doesn’t matter. Bodyguard protects from kill attempts. Neither dying from the Weak modifier nor as a Hider side-effect is an external kill attempt.

So it could be that Ank thought hiding beind Nacho coming in as a replacement could have been a safe place and died when he died?

[popsofctown]

I wanted it to be that when I flipped N1 people

[note the "people" consists entirely of town aligned player]

would wonder if I was Pine's nightkill target

This is a scumclaim

[Menalque]

dann, where's the scum motivation for me to say "hmm, think dann's TR is a little too fast and that he could be part of a scum bloc" instead of just eating it up like a good lil scumbag who was being SR at the time and probably would have been looking for supporting voices? why do I risk alienating you?

well, I wouldn't really take issue with it if it was just a direct scum read so much

Instead it was kind a fencesitty "he's not that scummy but um he could be scum" and the reason you listed for it did not sit well with me. It's like you wanted to agree with that scum block theory but didn't want to outright scum read me—and thus alienate me ig

I'm still town reading you for the most part, you're just in my bin of names of people I'm in the process of revisiting because I sort of tossed them in one pile or another D1 for ease of playing this large of a game

yeah, that's fair. the problem is that I was really in two minds as I think I said at the time: that either (1) the consensus was right and we were more or less going in the right direction after lynching lld in which case I should just trust that bloc and go with it or (2) the lld lynch was intentionally set up by pine to give the right people towncred later in the game so we wouldn't question why they were still alive, a worry bolstered by the fact that I

know

lld is known for a strong scum game and I found it somewhat implausible that we'd have caught her that early on

also, I think you could give me a little credit: I don't think scum!me would be so blatantly fence sitty. I think in my scum games I've tended towards picking a line and hard pushing; for me, indecision and doubt is town!indicative

the other thing that's changed since then is that Added to the Group Chat finished, and that was with some of the same players here (Pine, SS, PB, PP, sky for most of it) and honestly this game was kinda intimidating to come into given how well most people know each other and how new I am compared to pretty much everyone

the fact that I've had two games finish recently where I got scum right on D1 both times (pine in one, skitt in another) has given me a bit of a confidence boost, and it's why I've been digging my teeth in more since EoD yesterday because I kinda feel more like I should be here

you revisiting me makes sense, and I think I'm TRing you now because I think I was just being paranoid before. if you wanna hit me up over any other stuff, go for it

[the worst]

mastina's push on me feels opportunistic but pops' push on mastina feels opportunistic ffhfhfhfn

who's feeling objective? help

[mastina]

Just surprised Ari is so active if he's scum

Aristophanes is incredibly active as scum when he is given sufficient reason to want to impress.

Any game where he is specifically chosen by the lead scum and has said scum's coaching is reason to want to impress.

[Something_Smart]

Btw
I don’t actually think Fire is scum

Okay sure there's a world where Fire is town, but does it really benefit us to consider it?

[Menalque]

dann can you talk to me some more about why I should TR the duck?

[Firebringer]

mastina's push on me feels opportunistic but pops' push on mastina feels opportunistic ffhfhfhfn

who's feeling objective? help

pops is town

[popsofctown]

Read 5836 Dann.
She claimed that Day 1 she played to a gameplan that accomplishes the goal of hiding information from town.
She thought she was LAMISTing because she didn't shift her mindset all the way around to town!mastina and realize that Pine would know who the nightkill target is because he submitted it. So she LAMISSed. She did not actually do this day 1 at all, she made it up today.

[mastina]

We can lynch mastina
VOTE: mastina

Of course you can.
But you're being an absolute fucking moron if so because this is stupendously obviously my fucking towngame and I have every fucking reason to be town and the "scumreads" on me are utter fucking bullshit and quite obviously so.

[Dannflor]

also, I think you could give me a little credit: I don't think scum!me would be so blatantly fence sitty. I think in my scum games I've tended towards picking a line and hard pushing; for me, indecision and doubt is town!indicative

I can give you that haha

the problem is I've played with quite a few players here as town but I don't know everyone's scum game—and I don't have time to do cold meta on everyone—so it's kind of guess work figuring out if people are playing differently for good reasons or because they're scum

[the worst]

dann can you talk to me some more about why I should TR the duck?

because I'm down DUH

hey your promised scumcase on me never came out. cough up, pal.

also don't feel intimidated due to not knowing people. playing mafia with people who know each other well is generally scumsided if those people are interested in playing scum (which the scumteam will be, invariably). you're a voice of clarity and objectivity. don't be scared to use that.

[Firebringer]

tell you what alisae, since ur already voting mastina ill give you a good deal. You think i can't work with you? I will prove you wrong. We lynch within one of my scumreads today, and ill let u decide when and if i ever use the govern.

I think that's a good deal

[Alisae]

Btw
I don’t actually think Fire is scum

Okay sure there's a world where Fire is town, but does it really benefit us to consider it?

yes because going out of our way to do something about it when he’s probably town is what Pine wants and is not good for us.
We shouldn’t be going after stupid townies like Fire
We should be going after scum

[popsofctown]

the worst you were a way easier push today if I was scum going to opportunistically shoot within FB's scumreads.

And it is pretty hard to get people to understand this scumslip because it does have one step of abstraction to it.