Newbie 1968 - Game Over

[the worst]

Self vote is kinda irksome given I'd expect he has at least two scumreads esp. given small number of stated townreads

[the worst]

It's not outside his town range at all tho.

[the worst]

viewtopic.php?t=81283&f=11&st=0&sk=t&sd ... er_sort=Go

fresh spicy faustiv meta anyone~~?
main takeaway is he appears to be self aware to know how he's perceived when posting as scum; I don't think his awkward/disengaged posting here should really be taken as alignment indicative but I like where folks were coming from with it

Gjt's takes and frustration @ me might? be towny but they haven't really opened their brain enough for this to be a very confident read

[the worst]

top to bottom town:
tw
uncr
jv
alexc
gjt/thomth

ojoi gyro urist I'm least comfortable with aorn

[Uncrowned]

The thing is you can know something is a tell in your book and still do it

I did some active lurks last game and i turned out scum lol

[Uncrowned]

Tw wanna explain urists positioning or you keeping that to yourself for now

[the worst]

sure thing. meta is funny like that. this post probably won't be super interesting to folks who don't enjoy hard meta but if you're curious about it hopefully it's informative.

i've fairly consistently played mafia for the last couple of years straight now; i wouldn't call myself a GREAT PLAYER but i think i have like, fairly wide ranges as both alignments and i'm reasonably self-aware. i know a lot of my tells. i don't tend to change my meta from game to game just for the sake of it, because that is exhausting. but i'll definitely tweak my meta around to throw people in-game off the scent. "how i'd approach this game if i were scum" is not a very useful conversation rn, and is probably something better had postgame, but we can have it after d1-d2 if it's needed and appropriate (basically: having this type of conversation half way thru d1 is wifom and does nothing but obfuscate your ability to read me accurately).

so there's probably ~tells~ on me that i'm not aware of, but there would be many more outdated tells which i AM aware of. i don't think tonereading me in most situations is particularly fruitful. so if there's a certain tell you're curious about/working on, it maaayyyy work out in your best interest to talk about it, or ask for more specific examples. obviously, if i haven't produced enough content of a certain type, then you shouldn't out the tell yet.

pedit: bit o' both, i think i've been pretty transparent with having a firm eye on him for a while now

[Micc]

Votecount 1.10

ojoi (4) -

JacksonVirgo, Uncrowned, the worst, PvtUrist

PvtUrist (1) -

Thomth

Gjt (1) -

Gyro Zeppeli

Uncrowned (1) -

Alexcellent

the worst (1) -

Gjt

Not Voting (1) -

ojoi

With 9 players alive it takes 5 votes to lynch.

The deadline for Day 1 is in (expired on 2019-12-06 17:30:00).

Searching for a replacement for ojoi.

[the worst]

i'm not sure i scumread urist outright, there's just a bit of a hole in his pushes. he's scumreading me because of outdated meta (i don't think he's taken the time to check himself on how outdated/nuanced that meta is, which makes me think he's not actually giving it that much credit. this can come from either alignment (town can be like "hmm meta's just a small factor"; scum can just be signalling that they're using meta which means they're so towny!!!) but it's worth noting).

he's townreading you but wants it noted that you're a good scum player therefore this read isn't all that reliable

i think he likes JV as well but my memory is fuzzy

i have liked some of his votes but i fairly strongly disliked the recent self-vote

[Gjt]

Not calling anyone out specifically on this, but does comparing previous games really work. Another place I play I know some of the players quite well, but bar jokey D1 posts I ignore previous games because most people don't play the same way too often whether they role scum various times in a row or Town. I'm new here and know no one, only played one game so far and I believe only person from this game in that one is the person I replaced.

What saying is not to overthink previous games even if there are tales as that's how Scum end up slipping through. Someone may make similar posts from their scum game in their Town game

[Uncrowned]

Fwiw im not using tone anymore to read you since i think it's kinda a weak "tell" now given the amount of content you've provided

[Uncrowned]

That was @TW btw

[the worst]

Not calling anyone out specifically on this, but does comparing previous games really work. Another place I play I know some of the players quite well, but bar jokey D1 posts I ignore previous games because most people don't play the same way too often whether they role scum various times in a row or Town. I'm new here and know no one, only played one game so far and I believe only person from this game in that one is the person I replaced.

What saying is not to overthink previous games even if there are tales as that's how Scum end up slipping through. Someone may make similar posts from their scum game in their Town game

Sometimes, yes. Sometimes, no.
That's basically what this convo boils down to.

If you take Ellibereth games as an example, his meta expertise is so profound that his read accuracy rate as town is nearly 100%.
As a part of site culture, we do tend to use meta quite a lot. I'd suggest sometimes it's used a little bit haphazardly, which is why I'm super keen on theoretical conversations like these, even if they do detract *slightly* from traditional dayplay.

Hello there, btw. I'd be pretty interested in your thoughts on this;

Given this is a newbie and given the plist: do you think I shouldn't lead? I've been making a concerned effort to try and engage people, but am definitely reserving to/honouring newbies who are super active here (JV/Uncrowned are the obvious examples). I think my value add in this game is staying engaged and trying to engage others, not powerdriving lynches I want 1/3 of the way into d1.

You're kind of stopping half of the way to explaining why you think I'm scum. You don't like people taking the reins in early-game? Then you'd better avoid charismatic noisy folk. You don't like that I'm pressuring your slot for content despite having slots I think are more likely scum 72 hours into the game? Then you're not taking the time to empathise with the townies who are trying to read your slot, which makes me think you're pushing things you consider optically poor rather than scum motivated.

Town win by lynching scum. Scum win by lining up mislynches.
Casing me based on things you think are bad play or

might come from scum!

is something that's either misguided, or scum-motivated.

So if you're scumreading me can we work a couple of layers deeper than things you think are bad play? I'm interested to see what you think my motives are. If you think I'm leading the game in a malicious way, what do you think I'm doing that's malicious besides literally taking a leading stance?


Other consideration is my inactive vote.... With my stance on other players, the amount of time on the clock, and how little your pred did: do you not think I should be pushing you?

don't expect you to respond to the whole thing in detail - I'm just wondering how your read is progressing.

[Uncrowned]

Is that near 100% a slight exaggeration or do i just have to go see the magic for myself

[the worst]

not an exaggeration!

[Gjt]

This is why I mentioned tales because I tend to react the same whether Town or Scum. I wanna know who's willingnti easily jump on wagons, I wanna see who is easily led. When I'm scum I can take advantage or this as Town I use it to narrow out my suspects. I'm far from willing to say I don't Scum read you, its based on hunch and thread play. I honestly don't care (not in disrespectful way) about your previous games, if I play with you again you have a clean slate and I'll judge then.

I don't think your making bad plays, I look at who's making the strongest plays from the off and that's my first suspect because its rarely wrong. Someone from Scum comes out playing an active Town role. They ask the right questions and get the backing of majority of Town and bringing almost everyone up as suspects.

Take that as you will probably doesn't answer all your questions, but as time goes on they will be answered. I get most of my reads based on reactions whether it's the person I'm pursuing or reactions to potential wagons

[the worst]

yeah it's hard to read into policy type reads too much in general. understand why you didn't really have a response.

how are your other reads progressing?

[Gjt]

I'm pretty split down the middle half are Town Lean half Scum Lean. No outright 100% Town yet. I may post more of reads list later, it's not usually my thing and are only usually useful when we flip a Scum who's written one especially in bigger games as can take more from that.

[the worst]

scumhunting is definitely spicier on later phases. :> everything now helps tho!

[PvtUrist]

Writing from Singapore Chinatown

@tw for the amount of games Ive been in, my game is actually pretty bad regardless of alignment. Either I busypost and not do much D1 and try to sort once flips happen, or I tunnel my reads throughout the rest of the game, of which are usually incorrect. Neither playstyle is good and Im inclined to make my play less bad.

If I may ask, do you have any suggestions for me, especially engaging and sorting players throughout the game, but more importantly D1?

[the worst]

suggestions wrt...?

[Uncrowned]

I think I'm at the point where i need to do a thorough read of this entire game from scratch again bc I feel kinda lost atm.

[PvtUrist]

suggestions wrt...?

Like, how to interact with and sort players. Say, how I could start discussions with players this game.

[the worst]

suggestions wrt...?

Like, how to interact with and sort players. Say, how I could start discussions with players this game.

just like talk about what you're seeing

ask people what they think of what you're seeing

if you are confused or uncomfortable by something someone's saying ask them for more information on it

there's a lot of tricks to generating content but those are three pretty standard tactics I think..?

[JacksonVirgo]

Came just to flex my epic avi