BooneyToonz XIII: To Boon or Not To Boon - [END]

[Amrun]

My interpretation of what Boon said is that the (role) abilities are what gets disabled.
Modifiers are not affected and desperate is a modifier.

Mine as well. I think it’s pretty clear.

I have no reason to believe in the boogeyman existing.

I know there's a Renegade. That much is proven. From what they gave Titus I'd wager they aren't town. So, for an Enchantress to exist they'd either have to be town or at least a different alignment from the Renegade. And since this game was advertised as only having a single mafia entity? That means that either a) an Enchantress doesn't exist (highly likely), or b) something aside from an Enchantress, like a Rolestopper (as has been mentioned multiple times), hit A50. (less likely BUT answers why nobody could target A50).

I have reason to highly doubt Renegade exists. That’s all I’ll say.

What's your read of Titus?

BP

Town. Probably can’t be dissuaded from this.

[Venus and Mars]

sometimes the wording someone used is confusing, or the player just didn't get it that time, and restating it differently can help.
if Boon refused to clarify ever because he answered once and we found it confusing, that would be a problem.

I don’t respond well when I feel unfairly attacked, which is how BP’s “questions” are coming across to me.

Nancy, I already got cleared by Dave. So if I'm asking you a question its genuine. That doesnt mean I'm correct, but my agenda is to discern your alignment through tracking your logic. Not to shade you or make you look bad.

BP

I didn’t say I sr you for it or anything just that - and I honestly don’t mean to offend here but fmpov - you thinking my change of reads were based on “timing” and not “natural progression” and that I didn’t get my “preferred lynch”, when I was the one reconsidering it - fmpov, defy all logic but if you ask me questions without looking like you’re trying to confibias me or something, I will respond to you a lot more nicely.

So, I understand you obviously have no intention of doing that but it’s still nevertheless coming across like that to me.

[Venus and Mars]

wtf is an enchantress?

Enchantress
Spoiler:
Every night, you may target a player. You will force that player to commute, meaning any actions performed by or targeting your target will fail. If your target is not aligned with town, you will also commute during the night. You will not be informed of this. If you were to be roleblocked, your action will not go through.

[Venus and Mars]

Titus, I've voted for fewer people and fewer times than you. So for you to say I'm willing to lynch anyone is a laughable misrepresentation of what has actually transpired in this game. Especially considering I've spent today locked on all of two people.

"He'S a MaNiAc!"

Garbage.

Chara, you made me smile. In a game filled with rage and hate I just wanted to say I appreciate you.

dave, no. Plz no. Nips is non-mechanically null and there are too many non-existent people in this game for me to agree that Nips is the one out of the half dozen that need to be lynched. Joan, Clem, BEF... all arguably better lynches from a non-existent standpoint. And I townread one of them earlier!

You're on the wrong side of this, bud.

Mars, do you always devolve to being disrespectful when you feel like you're being misrepresented? If so, can I please get a few links for both alignments where you've acted like this?

50, what happened my dude? You get busy or something? You're kinda required here to nip this desperate/weak thing in the bud. I could just quote your last correspondence to the whole sitch but I'm feeling a little drainypoo from having to exhaustively (I'd say aggressively but I might ping dave and his wrinkles frighten me) go to work on this Enchantress nonsense.

Joan, BEF, Nips, Clem, Frost, Creature: more posty plz bb ty ily.

ISO me in Mystery Box of Silver 1, if you think that’s AI. You’ve already seen one of my scumgames, however I take issue with you calling anything I’ve done so far in this game as even being remotely disrespectful. You can also metacheck me. I’m not looking through all of my games but the proof is there.

[chkflip]

I have seen you scum flail and them vibes are here. Thus the question.

Joan, Clem, BEF... all arguably better lynches from a non-existent standpoint.

Why?

Also, if you flip scum, I am using the rule of 3 here.

I've meta-dove 2/3 of them and regardless of alignment they lurksack to the nth degree.

Nips is no different.

What's the rule of 3? I'm unfamiliar with it (or at least I'm not remembering it offhand).

Your consistent slow roast of setting me up for a future lynch is awfully brave of you, btw.

[Venus and Mars]

My interpretation of what Boon said is that the (role) abilities are what gets disabled.
Modifiers are not affected and desperate is a modifier.

Mine as well. I think it’s pretty clear.

I have no reason to believe in the boogeyman existing.

I know there's a Renegade. That much is proven. From what they gave Titus I'd wager they aren't town. So, for an Enchantress to exist they'd either have to be town or at least a different alignment from the Renegade. And since this game was advertised as only having a single mafia entity? That means that either a) an Enchantress doesn't exist (highly likely), or b) something aside from an Enchantress, like a Rolestopper (as has been mentioned multiple times), hit A50. (less likely BUT answers why nobody could target A50).

I have reason to highly doubt Renegade exists. That’s all I’ll say.

What's your read of Titus?

BP

Town. Probably can’t be dissuaded from this.

+1

Drew’s Titus’ game comparisons make that obvious.

[davesaz]

@Chara, if Dave is right about scum being informed about delinquent, than how does chk claiming miller help find delinquent?

You're so close to seeing it on your own here.

[Venus and Mars]

I have seen you scum flail and them vibes are here. Thus the question.

Joan, Clem, BEF... all arguably better lynches from a non-existent standpoint.

Why?

Also, if you flip scum, I am using the rule of 3 here.

I've meta-dove 2/3 of them and regardless of alignment they lurksack to the nth degree.

Nips is no different.

What's the rule of 3? I'm unfamiliar with it (or at least I'm not remembering it offhand).

Your consistent slow roast of setting me up for a future lynch is awfully brave of you, btw.

I don’t know if this is directed to me or not but I’m neither flailing nor scum here. My play here should have already made that beyond obvious to you.

[Chara]

Chara, you made me smile. In a game filled with rage and hate I just wanted to say I appreciate you.

dave, no. Plz no. Nips is non-mechanically null and there are too many non-existent people in this game for me to agree that Nips is the one out of the half dozen that need to be lynched. Joan, Clem, BEF... all arguably better lynches from a non-existent standpoint. And I townread one of them earlier!

You're on the wrong side of this, bud.

<3

i followed dave's vote, do i get a speech?
i'd like to lynch Joan but i agree that leaving her alive is probably the better option mechanically with her being self-resolving. Clem and BEF are also pretty null yes. but why are they better lynches than Nips?

[davesaz]

To be fair though, after looking for it (evidence that scum was able to find JD) I don't see anything to suggest that part of my big post is correct.
So I'm back to the original guess that EJ's kill was due to thinking there had been a lover reference.

[davesaz]

The unnecessary defense of nips bothers me.
I was actually against that wagon when it was all about the lurk.
I was against the VCA only approach.

I don't get how non-mechanical null as a defense fits in to a game which is mechanics heavy. If it ain't a townread then why is any other wagon superior?

[Chara]

chk: i see you already answered Titus on it, so i'll reword my question to be: why are Clem or BEF (not including Joan because there are reasons for her to be scum that i'm aware of) necessarily better lynches than Nips? i'd quess it was the possible clear but we're talking non-mech reasons i think.
i can also say that while i lack scumgames with Nancy (i think..?) her play and reactions haven't contradicted anything i know from town her.

Nancy: delinquent has a miller component (it investigates as mafia) and so a miller claim from chk could be used to get the town delinquent to react in some way, either by CCing or by distrusting chk's claim, is what i think was dave's point.

[AaronFrost]

To paraphrase Titus's VCA, there were 3 wagons all at 5 or so, and two of those have flipped or been mech cleared as town. This implies the 3rd wagon was on scum.

Correct. Wagon participation also is a factor too. The higher the wagon participation the more likely one of the people is scum.

If you disagree, then scum should be heavily off wagons.

This is true, I think it's considerably likely that scum was on it as well regardless of nips's alignment seeing that he was (still is) lurking. It was an easy wagon they could hop onto without their hands getting dirty.

I'm still not convinced nips is the best lynch today but I do think he should go before we hit lylo.

[Venus and Mars]

@Chara, if Dave is right about scum being informed about delinquent, than how does chk claiming miller help find delinquent?

You're so close to seeing it on your own here.

I’m unfortunately still not but I’m interpreting this as you agreeing with Chara?

Unless you think he was trying to get Jet to CC. but that would be beyond insane for Jet to have done that with such an important role.

I don’t really care much for his recent posts shading me and labelling me as being “disrespectful”, because I honestly don’t think I have been but what bothers me is that he is fixating on that to the exclusion of everything else I’ve done in this game and that’s the only part of that that concerns me. It’s valid for him to be suspicious of my reactions since I got pissed at him as scum in the only other game I’ve played with him for sr me for the wrong reasons but for him to ignore practically every other single thing I’ve done in this game and suddenly push me only AFTER Chara is sr him, is definitely concerning. Like why now? Why wasn’t chk suspicious of that after my 1v1 with BP on D1? He never even mentioned anything but now that he’s being sr, suddenly it’s an issue for him ?

[AaronFrost]

To paraphrase Titus's VCA, there were 3 wagons all at 5 or so, and two of those have flipped or been mech cleared as town. This implies the 3rd wagon was on scum.

Correct. Wagon participation also is a factor too. The higher the wagon participation the more likely one of the people is scum.

If you disagree, then scum should be heavily off wagons.

Another thing I remember you saying (I'll try to find that post in a minute) is that you thought me and BEF were driving the wagon onto R&J. What made you think this?

I looked at the wagons between the 10 R and J vote and the 5 5 5 split

What does this have to do with me/BEF leading the wagon away from flips? I don't think I was ever on the flips wagon either.

[Venus and Mars]

chk: i see you already answered Titus on it, so i'll reword my question to be: why are Clem or BEF (not including Joan because there are reasons for her to be scum that i'm aware of) necessarily better lynches than Nips? i'd quess it was the possible clear but we're talking non-mech reasons i think.
i can also say that while i lack scumgames with Nancy (i think..?) her play and reactions haven't contradicted anything i know from town her.

Nancy: delinquent has a miller component (it investigates as mafia) and so a miller claim from chk could be used to get the town delinquent to react in some way, either by CCing or by distrusting chk's claim, is what i think was dave's point.

Oh I see but you’re memory needs some work. You’ve forgotten Overkill 1 but I was technically an SK, so it is true I’ve never been mafia in a game with you before. Yes exactly, which is why I’m seriously floored by chk’s fixating on my emotional reactions to the exclusion of everything else I’ve done in this game. So, I’m no longer hard townreading him for that.

[Venus and Mars]

To paraphrase Titus's VCA, there were 3 wagons all at 5 or so, and two of those have flipped or been mech cleared as town. This implies the 3rd wagon was on scum.

Correct. Wagon participation also is a factor too. The higher the wagon participation the more likely one of the people is scum.

If you disagree, then scum should be heavily off wagons.

This is true, I think it's considerably likely that scum was on it as well regardless of nips's alignment seeing that he was (still is) lurking. It was an easy wagon they could hop onto without their hands getting dirty.

I'm still not convinced nips is the best lynch today but I do think he should go before we hit lylo.

Who’s your alternative then? I think considering that one of Creature/A50 had to have been roleblocked /rolestopped and only A50 claimed anything on D1, Nips wagon makes the most sense because if he’s scum, it could be based on him playing rl mafia with jet but there does seem to be a huge resistance to it and then there’s the dumb Joan push as well.

[AaronFrost]

I kinda feel like this entire day has just been a lot of back and forth between the same few people explaining the same things over and over again. I think we need another flip.

PEDIT: Honestly I'd rather do Drew than flipple nips today because I think he has a higher chance of flipping scum.

[AaronFrost]

I kinda feel like this entire day has just been a lot of back and forth between the same few people explaining the same things over and over again. I think we need another flip.

PEDIT: Honestly I'd rather do Drew than flipple nips today because I think he has a higher chance of flipping scum.

[AaronFrost]

Oops didn't mean to post that twice

[AaronFrost]

To paraphrase Titus's VCA, there were 3 wagons all at 5 or so, and two of those have flipped or been mech cleared as town. This implies the 3rd wagon was on scum.

Correct. Wagon participation also is a factor too. The higher the wagon participation the more likely one of the people is scum.

If you disagree, then scum should be heavily off wagons.

This is true, I think it's considerably likely that scum was on it as well regardless of nips's alignment seeing that he was (still is) lurking. It was an easy wagon they could hop onto without their hands getting dirty.

I'm still not convinced nips is the best lynch today but I do think he should go before we hit lylo.

Who’s your alternative then? I think considering that one of Creature/A50 had to have been roleblocked /rolestopped and only A50 claimed anything on D1, Nips wagon makes the most sense because if he’s scum, it could be based on him playing rl mafia with jet but there does seem to be a huge resistance to it and then there’s the dumb Joan push as well.

Whichever one was roleblocked depends on whether or not we have an enchantress. Creature def could've been roleblocked (possibly by town as well) or A50 rolestopped. I made a whole post explaining this and it got ignored

You do have a point about him knowing jet irl though. Is flippy nips the kind of player who would tend to kill those that know him?

[Venus and Mars]

I kinda feel like this entire day has just been a lot of back and forth between the same few people explaining the same things over and over again. I think we need another flip.

PEDIT: Honestly I'd rather do Drew than flipple nips today because I think he has a higher chance of flipping scum.

I think that knowing that Creature’s actions failing on A50, make Nips’ more informative. Also, that wagon almost went to L-1 with virtually no resistance, so unless you think scum was bussing, it seemed weird to me.

[chkflip]

UNVOTE: Joan of Arc
VOTE: Doctor Drew

The unnecessary defense of nips bothers me.
I was actually against that wagon when it was all about the lurk.
I was against the VCA only approach.

I don't get how non-mechanical null as a defense fits in to a game which is mechanics heavy. If it ain't a townread then why is any other wagon superior?

I like how you keep talking about me instead of talking to me.

I'm of the opinion that Joan's doc claim has given them the feeling that they can just post their fucking feet up and not do much of anything for the rest of the game and that's not okay. Y'all want to wait it out? Whatever. We can wait until she's even more worthless. That's suboptimal but fine.

BEF has been far more obvious with his prodgy lurksack behavior. He has no mechanical reason to coast yet does so openly and honestly anyway. Probably across the board. But anyone who comes in and asks to be included in the group more than once will always peeve me.

Clemency's role is now moot and still he's here but not here much the same as Joan. Only we have no mechanical reason to keep him around. He has actually been gone long enough to be both prodded and replaced, so, Idek why his name hasn't been added to look for a replacement.

So don't look me in the eyes and tell me that it's a lurksack wagon 'cause it ain't.

Don't look me in the eyes and tell me it's a VCA wagon because we BOTH KNOW that's not a proper use of VCA at all. There are two other vote counts with just as much "voting inclusion" and ffs three half-wagons isn't exactly a telling fucking thing at all.

Asinine.

If it wasn't obvious by now, I'm hard town-reading 50. I've no reason to believe that he full outs as scum from a page 5 Miller claim. That's just so fucking weird and out of the realm of possibility even for him. Or RCE. Or even Flavor Leaf. WHO WOULD DO THAT!?

Nobody. Not as scum. That's insane.

Therefore:
- A50 hard town.
- I don't believe in the abominable snow enchantress
-- This also means I believe 50 cleared Nips
- There are arguably better lurksacks to lynch

I will never believe that Nips, who is arguably just as cleared as you, or Haggle, or 50, or Frost, or anybody else who has claimed, is a good viable scum wagon.

Absolutely. Fucking. Not.

[Amrun]

chk is probably town because we mindmeld too much here.

I could tickle clemency a bit too.

[chkflip]

Motherfuckin