Everything Is Still A Lie v2 [Canceled]

[a Gun and a Rose]

I've explained thrice how my push has nothing to do with Iconeum "lolvoting". I felt as if he wanted to hide amongst other town because there were loads of "imma guilty" but, again, lolvoting isn't done without something to evaluate off of.

Iconeum came in the thread, had no idea who Minstrel was or what they've done and yet still decided to vote guilty. And the fake bravado afterwards makes no actual sense. He's like "Yeah, I wanted to lynch someone that I have no read on, town do this shit all the time, right?"

Where I feel like Iconeum would NEVER do that. And his recent post with "Town do this shit all the time" made me believe that I was right when assuming he was faking it in order to get town read.

VOTE: A Gun and a Rose

I'm sure Menalque isn't usually this boring

This is a notably bad vote

[a Gun and a Rose]

-rose

[a Gun and a Rose]

I've explained thrice how my push has nothing to do with Iconeum "lolvoting"

. I felt as if he wanted to hide amongst other town because there were loads of "imma guilty" but, again, lolvoting isn't done without something to evaluate off of.

Iconeum came in the thread, had no idea who Minstrel was or what they've done and yet still decided to vote guilty

. And the fake bravado afterwards makes no actual sense.

He's like "Yeah, I wanted to lynch someone that I have no read on,

town do this shit all the time, right?"

Where I feel like Iconeum would NEVER do that. And his recent post with "Town do this shit all the time" made me believe that I was right when assuming he was faking it in order to get town read.

Do you understand what lolvoting is?

And he’s not wrong that town do this shit all the time, regardless of whether it’s pro-town or not

And you’re saying that icon is scum exactly because icon did something that he shouldn’t do — only I think he would do that as either alignment and so you’re shitpushing him because you think his lolvote looks objectively scummy, which is not entirely wrong, but something having the appearance of scum does not in fact make that person scum

Added to that, I think you’re acting with a confidence level higher than it really should be on icon’s actions coming from scum, and I don’t see why you should have that level of confidence, esp when you’re being told by people who you didn’t think were scum earlier and who were saying that icon does do this sort of thing as town and who have fairly extensive experience with him individually

-rose

[Minstrel]

Liking Insomnia less and less.
I don't remember who Hectic is voting, but i think we should be voting here. A gun and a rose has been playing towny. His reason for scumreading them is off.
VOTE: Insomnia

- Norwee

[a Gun and a Rose]

the fact that he is a *highly* mislynchable player

Pushing a highly mislynchable player doesn't make you scum. I'm a highly mislynchable player and the players pushing me usually turn out to be town.

Pushing mislynchable players bc they did something that looks scummy instead of trying to read them more deeply is definitely +scum and the inability of towns to go beyond the surface level of mislynch bait is one of the main reasons they lose

-rose

Oh almighty master, please teach me the ways of scum hunting deeper than what I've already done. What else is there in "Lol i'm guiltying cuz fuck this game am i right"?

I don't like your sudden progression on me that basically ignores my slot completely and only when I make a push on someone you perceive as easily mislynchable, I become a suspect. Talk to me about why I'm scum because of that, I have explained myself.

Pushing mislynchable players bc they did something that looks scummy instead of trying to read them more deeply is definitely +scum

Besides, I thought that it was extremely townie to lolvote? So why choose this angle?

I don't even know if they're like both scum or Gun and a rose slot ended in a really bad wking positioning, but I feel like flipping this first

VOTE: Guns and a rose

defending iconeum here is actual TMIng, I thought he only posted NAI stuff, not once has any of you two actually said "This is more likely to come from town ico" , or "this post is really town for ico", you just instantly postured as defending ico without expressing a town read on him, with the sole purpose of reacting to my push.

Not one of you asked me how I perceived Ico's meta, and when I did, you didn't try to tell me how to read him properly. So the burden that you're placing on me to "read him deeper or you're scum" is really unfair. You didn't even read him, you town read him for this :

Icon is Town

hmmm
VOTE: insomnia
@whoever said they were TRing them can i get a tldr on that

-gun

which, what was this read even about, again? what has he done so townie that you guys read him town?

I explicitly don’t hard townread icon on his own posts, but I’m situationally TRing him because I don’t think that you’re SvS. The point is that, as mentioned, icon is basically NAI so far on posts — you literally just said this — yet you’ve been pushing the angle of him being scummy? That’s not an honest approach to his slot, that’s targeting him because as scum you think you can get a mislynch or as town ????

Datisi can speak for herself if she feels more confident on him being town so far in and of himself, my read is largely in relation to the interactions around him rather than any content he’s produced himself

Also, it’s not on me to tell you how to read him properly? And it’s not like that is some simple thing to just pass off, as it’s not an entirely rational basis and is at least partly an emotional feeling based on tone that comes through over time. The concept that this is TMIing his alignment is ridiculous, given that I’ve literally made it clear that I’m lightly town at best there and also just because you can’t see what takes someone from one level of read confidence to another doesn’t mean they’re TMIing it just often means they’re better at reading than you or that they’re wrong

Which, again, is something I think you’d be more aware of if you were approaching this game from a town perspective

-rose

[a Gun and a Rose]

Liking Insomnia less and less.
I don't remember who Hectic is voting, but i think we should be voting here. A gun and a rose has been playing towny. His reason for scumreading them is off.
VOTE: Insomnia

- Norwee

What’s been towny about us, norway?

-rose

[a Gun and a Rose]

Imagine arguing someone is scum because they’re better at reading than you

-rose

[a Gun and a Rose]

Fonz why are you limping on like that and why did you feel the need to give a weak ass justification with your vote?

-rose

[a Gun and a Rose]

On the plus side of this, a shitpush on our slot may be what actually gets me into this game

-rose

[Iconeum]

On the plus side of this, a shitpush on our slot may be what actually gets me into this game

-rose

i mean i could try if you really want me to?

[Minstrel]

Liking Insomnia less and less.
I don't remember who Hectic is voting, but i think we should be voting here. A gun and a rose has been playing towny. His reason for scumreading them is off.
VOTE: Insomnia

- Norwee

What’s been towny about us, norway?

-rose

Initial posts weren't all that great, but i'm liking your (mena's) input in the later posts. I remember scum!you usually taking a backseat. As for Datisi i don't think she'd bring up the points about me "playing scummily as town" during the trial if she was scum. Since that's usually not a point scum would care about bringing up.

- Norwee

[a Gun and a Rose]

On the plus side of this, a shitpush on our slot may be what actually gets me into this game

-rose

i mean i could try if you really want me to?

I meant what insom is already doing

Although in fairness he’s not “pushing” it that much thus far

-rose

[Minstrel]

I just don't agree at all with Insomnia's points about why A gun and a rose are scum.

- Norwee

[a Gun and a Rose]

Liking Insomnia less and less.
I don't remember who Hectic is voting, but i think we should be voting here. A gun and a rose has been playing towny. His reason for scumreading them is off.
VOTE: Insomnia

- Norwee

What’s been towny about us, norway?

-rose

Initial posts weren't all that great, but i'm liking your (mena's) input in the later posts.

I remember scum!you usually taking a backseat.

As for Datisi i don't think she'd bring up the points about me "playing scummily as town" during the trial if she was scum. Since that's usually not a point scum would care about bringing up.

- Norwee

Based on which games? I don’t think that’s my scum game at all and the meta you’re working with is oudated if you think it is

Why would datisi not bring up those points and why would scum not care to bring it up? She’s a smart scum player as demonstrated in multiple games and wouldn’t go for lhf “this looks scummy” stuff because it’s too obvious to get caught for so why wouldn’t she make that point?

-rose

[a Gun and a Rose]

Icon what is your read on us again?

-rose

[a Gun and a Rose]

Chem, I’m concerned because normally I think I’d have warm feelings towards you by now and I don’t

-rose

[Minstrel]

Based on which games? I don’t think that’s my scum game at all and the meta you’re working with is oudated if you think it is

Why would datisi not bring up those points and why would scum not care to bring it up? She’s a smart scum player as demonstrated in multiple games and wouldn’t go for lhf “this looks scummy” stuff because it’s too obvious to get caught for so why wouldn’t she make that point?

-rose

Meta read based on the open game with Nibbui/Volpe, you and The worst as the scumteam. Where i remember you playing like that.
I don't know Datisi's scumplay but i'm assuming she has a relatively stable town meta? If not i might be reading her wrong.

- Norwee

[Minstrel]

The worst

Sorry, i meant Wicked.

- Norwee

[Iconeum]

Icon what is your read on us again?

-rose

It's too early to have a good read on either of you. Like I said, the stance you are making wrt to my slot is what I'd expect from the both of you, coming from either allignment.

Like me, neither of you haven't done a lot of AI stuff yet. Which is totally ok for the record, this is a meme game and i don't expect anyone to be treating this very seriously at the start of D1.
Which is why I'm on the fence with insomnia: I kinda understand his push on me, but I think it's too serious right now.

[insomnia]

I explicitly don’t hard townread icon on his own posts, but I’m situationally TRing him because I don’t think that you’re SvS. The point is that, as mentioned, icon is basically NAI so far on posts — you literally just said this — yet you’ve been pushing the angle of him being scummy? That’s not an honest approach to his slot, that’s targeting him because as scum you think you can get a mislynch or as town ????

I didn't read anything as NAI, I was being sarcastic because you were saying he's NAI and yet you're here giving him a town read for what it seems to be my "awful surface push" rather than him actually posting town stuff.

[insomnia]

Also, it’s not on me to tell you how to read him properly? And it’s not like that is some simple thing to just pass off, as it’s not an entirely rational basis and is at least partly an emotional feeling based on tone that comes through over time. The concept that this is TMIing his alignment is ridiculous, given that I’ve literally made it clear that

I’m lightly town at best there and also just because you can’t see what takes someone from one level of read confidence to another doesn’t mean they’re TMIing it just often means they’re better at reading than you or that they’re wrong

I explicitly don’t hard townread icon on his own posts, but I’m situationally TRing him because I don’t think that you’re SvS.

The point is that, as mentioned, icon is basically NAI so far on posts

— you literally just said this — yet you’ve been pushing the angle of him being scummy? That’s not an honest approach to his slot, that’s targeting him because as scum you think you can get a mislynch or as town ????

my read is largely in relation to the interactions around him rather than any content he’s produced himself

[insomnia]

Which is why I'm on the fence with insomnia: I kinda understand his push on me, but I think it's too serious right now.

So I make sense but just because I make sense too early I am scum?

[insomnia]

Menalque, for your bloating and you belittling my contribution, I have yet to see you do any analysis that's anything above surface level.

[Iconeum]

Menalque, for your bloating and you belittling my contribution, I have yet to see you do any analysis that's anything above surface level.

actually leaning more to town then scum on you, because with your most recent post where you explained the scumread I can actually understand that coming from town!you

at this point p much just frustrated at you for pushing something i don't even take seriously this hard

[Iconeum]

Menalque, for your bloating and you belittling my contribution, I have yet to see you do any analysis that's anything above surface level.

I think your expectations for this game are too damn high