BooneyToonz XIII: To Boon or Not To Boon - [END]

[RCEnigma]

No it wasn't? It *could* be resolved with a red bambi flip, but the apparent rolestop was when bambi targeted Titus, not the A50/creature/titus trifecta

Are you NEIing?

I'm talking about chk rolestopping a50 n1.

Are you making the assumption here that Bambi is a scum rolestopper that outed that information themselves?

No, Bambi, if scum, is scum investigative that faked a failed action on Titus

That's kinda elaborate even for Bambi tho

If Bambi is town, then Bambi's failed action can only be explained by a role-stopper, since Bambi himself was rolestopped by CHK that night

vis-a-vis, Bambi town = scum rolestopper exists, Bambi scum = *shrug*

What I dislike is you acting as though BEF can only be scum with Joan when that disallows the Bambi-town+scum-rolestopper scenario, which you're apparently not even considering?

Also you're not considering how low profile bef was at all day 1. So for 1 it's not a priority cop check, or doc save. Which are what I assume scum rolestop would be hunting for. Even if I think there's a scum rolestop it's hard for me to construct a world that they Rand stopped bef to derail investigations on a slot that had no associations.

For that to happen it would have to be a very niche plan to asceticize me and push me on the bef angle which didn't happen.

[RCEnigma]

A.) I don't think scum has rolestop plus another method of voiding invests on top of it and a cop enabler to further inhibit invests and essentially nerf the role.

2.) Idk what happened there and there are probably a ton of roles the interfere on some level. I don't think flipping probable town slots to reverse engineer scum interactions is the best use of lynches but that's just me.

A) why the fuck not? this is role madness with an overwhelming amount of town power. You think traitor and doc is enough? hell no. Boon loves day play he's not going to actively create a game that can be easily solved mechanically

b) Most roles that interfere on some level cannot have resolved because of chk's rolestop on bambi. Roleblocker doesn't work.

I don't remember what bunyip does but it was like a doc right

Jailkeeper-alien would also work but that's what I'm talking about already basically

nothing else works for explaining it. Look at the list of roles. Tell me something else that explains bambi getting no result on titus other than:
a) bambi lying (as scum hopefully)
b) rolestopper/jailkeeper-alien

nothing else comes to mind for me?

I was thinking .ore along the lines of roles that disrupt Titus as a target and not Bambi as the targeter.

Things like busdriver redirector etc. For example consider scum redirector moving chk to Titus instead.

I'm not saying that's what happened just that it isn't as clear cut as your trying to tell me it is.

[RCEnigma]

Things like busdriver redirector etc. For example consider scum redirector moving chk to Titus instead.

don't roles that are not in OP required to be variants QED impossible given the existence of renegade?

has there ever been a redirector or bus driver in a boon game?

Ahh fair it's only previous roles besides variants. I'm not one for the setup side of things.

[RCEnigma]

Spoiler:

Welcome,

RCEnigma

, you are a

Town 1-shot Bunyip

.

Abilities:

• At night, you may target a player. You will find out if they are Vanilla or not. If they are Vanilla, you will also grant them bulletproof for the night.

Win condition:

You win when all threats to the town have been eliminated and there is at least one town player alive.

Game thread is here. Confirm by replying in your

Confessionals Thread

.

bunyip probably not in this game, just posting this here for my reference on what that role is

Hey, it me.

[RCEnigma]

They're both kinda convoluted claims tho

Chemist, if scum, had his partner gift him loyal so that he would never have to 'die' to fake a guilty and to make it almost impossible for him to 'claim' results

RCE, if scum, had his partner gift him ascetic so that he could use his powers without risk of roleblock/investigation

that being said both could *mechanically speaking* both be town according to the version of the role RCE chose not to mention existed until a day or two ago

The version of the role had been considered before you repped in. I think it was Dave that shit it down the first time.

[RCEnigma]

Or b) rce faked having a roleblock shot as a joat AFTER the town rolestopper died

Chk was still alive.

[RCEnigma]

Not that it could target 3 people. Just that split was a possibility and it was before Dave claimed a modifier I think?

[RCEnigma]

We do not have a reason for two modifiers to have been given out the same night identified yet. Is motivated an available modifier?

I don't think motivator is necessary anymore if renegade is split like traitor was.

Split only applies to a compound role like AF's party crasher / willbooster.
The same role can't be split, it has to be motivated or the like. But if motivated can be a modifier it doesn't require that role to exist.

Can boon bank roles be compounded?

The only claimed modifiers were myself and Titus at this point.

[RCEnigma]

We do not have a reason for two modifiers to have been given out the same night identified yet. Is motivated an available modifier?

I don't think motivator is necessary anymore if renegade is split like traitor was.

Split only applies to a compound role like AF's party crasher / willbooster.
The same role can't be split, it has to be motivated or the like. But if motivated can be a modifier it doesn't require that role to exist.

Can boon bank roles be compounded?

The only claimed modifiers were myself and Titus at this point.

does this mean aaron knew which scum specifically was the renegade?

Not sure, he did still decide to join Joan's PT so that's one of the scum he was aware of.

[RCEnigma]

Joan would have to have knowledge of the renegade and would have had to relay that to Aaron around drew. Or after drew was lynched.

[RCEnigma]

I blame not getting emails for pm notifications. Amrun was my target but I doubt she would be doing the kills anyway.

[RCEnigma]

For R&J, all scum didn't even know each other

Wait, I was under the assumption that the 1 scum pair didn't know who was in the other pair?

We don't really know what scum knew and when.

[RCEnigma]

Hello, why kill my brother and send him to me?

So did Chemist's gifted loyal offset his weak modifier? His N3 target was Creature/TSE so his weak didn't go through.

What does that mean for his N5 action on RCE?

Pretty much, he can't target scum so the weak didn't matter. This was why I was trying to get creature tracking chemist, the weak wouldn't hit but a successful visit tied chemist alignment wise and you get to a point scum has to deal with it or there are enough visits/no visits to confirm slots.

Eg. Chemist is tracked visiting 3 separate players with a successful visit, if 1 scum goes down it rules chemist out as scum and his visits.

Both slots that could make this happen though were both scum so it doesn't really / wouldn't have mattered.

[RCEnigma]

Oooh.

Haha.


Ok, barring that, day 5 or something made me think BEF wasn’t scum with creature.


VOTE: RCE


This has got to go. Although we can go back to Weiss honestly... I’m obviously not scum at this point so pushing it still is annoying at best.

I think Weiss could be deepwolf but you look like you're feeling out whatever sticks going back to the last day phase.

This was going to be a question but bef asked it already, kind of.

[RCEnigma]

@RCE and Nips

You can answer the above question as well please.

Nips/A50

Coming into the day it would have been Weiss. The night before Dave died Weiss had a short line asking Dave's final thoughts in a way that felt like A.) They knew he was dying or 2.) If the plan was favorable they could kill around it.

I think the reevaluating in a close to lylo situation is pretty townie when they could just lynch me today and bring bef to lylo.

The issue I have with being the lynch here is it means it ends up being a 50/50 tomorrow between is it A50 town and nips scum with a Joan save throwing a false positive to A50 or scum A50 with a game pocket on town flippy.

On play I'd say flippy is the more likely to flip scum but I don't discount anything as a possibility when A50 rolls scum.

[RCEnigma]

yeah but
a) do u think 50J gets creature to go along with checking him to softbus when he's asceticizing himself?
b) do u think scum was like informed of flips miller?
c) do u think 50J forgets he asceticized u n1 or pretends he forgot to asceticize u n1?

vs.
what is the mech explanation that allows nips to be scum short of a 50j aneuryism?

If creature/A50 are same pt then they wouldn't need him asceticized. They can fake results anyway. It would be a Gambit on a Gambit though, to successfully catch that A50 was really rolestopped.

Possibly. Flips was also under scrutiny day 1 before Romeo flipped and before traitor AF flipped. Joan pt scum could have been calling out flippy as traitor and protecting that investment.

I dunno, it's A50.

[RCEnigma]

yeah but
a) do u think 50J gets creature to go along with checking him to softbus when he's asceticizing himself?
b) do u think scum was like informed of flips miller?
c) do u think 50J forgets he asceticized u n1 or pretends he forgot to asceticize u n1?

vs.
what is the mech explanation that allows nips to be scum short of a 50j aneuryism?

If creature/A50 are same pt then they wouldn't need him asceticized. They can fake results anyway. It would be a Gambit on a Gambit though, to successfully catch that A50 was really rolestopped.

Possibly. Flips was also under scrutiny day 1 before Romeo flipped and before traitor AF flipped. Joan pt scum could have been calling out flippy as traitor and protecting that investment.

I dunno, it's A50.

Hmm, that doesn't work, flips would have to be Joan pt.

[RCEnigma]

can literally anyone come up with a way that nips could be scum mechanically?

Boon pulled some shit mechanic out of his toot toot would be a good explanation if that's the case.

Everything about this game already makes my head hurt.

[RCEnigma]

Nothing makes sense. Is it just me?!?

[RCEnigma]

? How so?

[RCEnigma]

If I'm scum with Bambi they just claim no result or something.

[RCEnigma]

I'd eat several hats if I inno'd scum two games in a row.

[RCEnigma]

I'm hoping we hit scum today in one of nips/A50 because if we hit town today I'm the likely lylo Lynch and that's a scum win in a town dominant.....ish game.

[RCEnigma]

I had and still have a commute. But since I was Ascetic there really wasn't a reason to claim it. It's a dead shot basically.

[RCEnigma]

Flips is more likely to me in the sense A50 has been by far townier and I don't have a clear idea on what could have, did, would happen etc. Mechanics and setup wise.

[RCEnigma]

A50 did you say it was recharged on a town visit or recharged if it fails?

[RCEnigma]

lynch rce, if game isn't over and I die confirm super saint claim, BEF vote flips, 50J hammer flips, see endgame

I'll hammer supersaint today IDC.

[RCEnigma]

Disclaimer: I don't believe nips is supersaint and it's a claim addition to live another day minus Weiss or bef.

[RCEnigma]

Nope but I feel strongly about bef town and probably you town. So it can get sorted tomorrow.

[RCEnigma]

Like if flips is actually a supersaint it outs A50 as the only suspect left.

[RCEnigma]

Oh, your right. I wasn't thinking about the numbers.

[RCEnigma]

I do think it's a fake claim regardless.

[RCEnigma]

Walk me through your read on 50j?

It's lean town mostly from day 1.

So I brought up the enjoyment tell which he was showing early in day 1 as a vocal town presence. The engagement with me where he flipped his read to follow me onto Titus was +town. Mostly because it didn't turn into a hard pocket.

The agreement on Joan!scum day 1 onward. I would say that the conspiracy mech spec is town indicative but I've found it to be in his scumrange as well.

But in the moment those were posts that I was like, yeah I can see town!A50 taking that angle.

I don't have a mech reason to townread him or scumread him, it's just how the game shaped out and I think he's played well as either alignment.

[RCEnigma]

@RCE: I somehow think you don't volunteer to hammer today if you were scum. I would be willing to trust your read on BEF (and give you shit post-game if you are wrong). you can vote Nips and convince one of Weiss/BEF to put him @L-1 and I'll hammer.

If bef is scum here and there were doc shenanigans then yeah that's on me.

[RCEnigma]

If bef is scum here and there were doc shenanigans then yeah that's on me.

I actually have no problem with joan doccing bef

what I have a problem with is Creature tracking BEF to Chara on a night when as a split renegade he also would have had to have given macho to davesaz, meaning that Creature was bussing BEF in such a way that if BEF flipped Creature would be confirmed scum, which makes 0 sense whatsoever

Wait in that world how does that confirm creature scum? You'd have to assume no multitasking and know how often renegade can target in a given night which would probably be in the role pm but it's not a given.

[RCEnigma]

My ego can't take false confirming scum again tbh.

[RCEnigma]

What we're Joan's claimed saves?

[RCEnigma]

Give me a bit to think it over with my shot out of the equation.

[RCEnigma]

What's the vote situation on Joan like atm?

What's the vote situation on Joan like atm?

I think with Titus, that makes 8 votes. I think we need 11 to lynch right?

ok so I'm not hammering.

VOTE: joan

UNVOTE:

UNVOTE:

@V&M

Do you think we are dealing with scum!chara here?

I’m tr everyone on Joan wagon. I can’t help but wonder if the two slots most opposed had a tmi on Joan.

I feel exactly the same. I really want to believe the Joan claim but something isn't right. It's either what you said or the claim is BS.

I think the claim saved them from the lynch today.

[RCEnigma]

I liked most of this real time but this is a downward trajectory that looks like an attempted wagon stall. Maybe to prevent the claim in the first place.

Trying to get V&M onto Chara looks worse in retrospect.

[RCEnigma]

I want bef to get a chance to speak before anything.

[RCEnigma]

Err you've got other game obligations fair enough. Intent for hammer by 10:30 Est.

[RCEnigma]

I was in a rush before my shift so didn't get around to the hammer thing. Yesterday was a self day and tomorrow I might be out for the MHA movie but I'll get around to catching up.

Many sorries,
~RCE

[RCEnigma]

Oof right in my heart. Weiss how convinced are you that if it's not me it's bef?

[RCEnigma]

Idk I think it's probably just nips and we don't have all the pieces.

Like honestly I see this happen with Bef so often it's hard not to defend him here. I guess even if it's me vs him.

It's AtE but this is literally becoming LNT with Bef as a probable mislynch and then I get the moose in Mylo with inactive scum stealing a win.

We can only blame ourselves tho in that case because Titus pushed hard there for so long and she caught a ton of shit for it.

[RCEnigma]

[RCEnigma]

Mostly for bef playing my heartstrings and killing me.

[RCEnigma]

Yeah, unfortunately I was playing for Mylo when I should have just been playing the day.

Bef I probably should have thrown that hammer down. I figured I'd regret not doing it.

[RCEnigma]

I didn't start as Ascetic no.

[RCEnigma]

I talked about the rb shot in the pt but I was hedging on snuffing a recipient of either fruit and the other end was just trying to mess with setup spec. It worked but it didn't work.

[RCEnigma]

It's also like super outside of my scumrange to do something like that but nobody really bit on that.

[RCEnigma]

LOL

Well, you still played it very well up until the last minute. Your team probably got hit bad by having 2 weaker members (with all due respect to Joan/Creature).

Also, why did you clear BEF early into the game?

I mean.... Early in the game I was considering trying to manipulate some flips to deepwolf Joan but that in itself is...awkward.

That's the exact reason I made Dave macho but he didn't really defend Joan off the back of it like I thought he would.

I just wanted bef in my pocket but he's a clever fishy.

[RCEnigma]

I'm assuming AF knew I was scum and Bambi was scum since he was able to get into Joan's PT.

The conflict with deepwolfing Joan was that I also wanted Joan to die to get Bambi into our pt.

[RCEnigma]

Scum knew who the other scum were. We also knew there was a traitor. I definitely thought it was you originally making a play with the miller thing.

[RCEnigma]

When 1 scum died the PT's would be merged. But Bambi dying and merging with Joan wouldn't do much since I was already mostly alone in the pt already.

I wonder actually how this game plays out if we didn't kill Chara.

[RCEnigma]

Oh yeah I have been outed scum for quite awhile. I didn't think this was super winnable but there was like a small chance I could bullshit into Mylo so I played it out.

[RCEnigma]

Titus actually outed me by not targeting Joan. I was trying to hide the Ascetic modifier because I'm basically compulsive and double Ascetic was so suspicious.

So yeah I thought hiding the modifier was the best chance for me to become "mech cleared" down the line.

Titus dropped an obvious crumb that she was targeting Joan so in my head I was like it's so obvious that it seems like a bait. But that might be intentional or she wants scum to think it's a bait and to double dupe scum she's just gonna target Joan anyway.

[RCEnigma]

GG all!! Shame I couldn't make you all lose lol.

[RCEnigma]

Man I got one of the most fun roles ever and I died night 2

I think if I had stayed alive longer scum would've been better off. Learning that Joan wanted to protect me but then didn't in the dead PT was frustrating. My plan was to try and establish a connection between the two scum PTs, which is why I joined the hood with Joan and tried to turn it around onto Drew (I knew about Joan and RCE, didn't know about the other two).

gg all

Yeah so we were told that you had an additional method to joining our team. So traitor hunting wasn't the biggest concern. I figured the traitor would work towards that condition regardless of what scum did.

[RCEnigma]

I wanted to go RCE first but caved on Amrun too easily. Pretty much the only regret this game.
Weiss came in and saved a slot that was so doomed it wasn't funny.
That's the definition of the White Knight scummy IIRC.

Agree - plan to nom this! I encourage everyone else to do so too.

Agreed. I think without Weiss repping in scum still could have run the table.

[RCEnigma]

Also, Titus could have died instead the night Chara killed traitor. It's probably a whole different game just on that one decision.

[RCEnigma]

Mostly for bef playing my heartstrings and killing me.

Are we back in love again?

I didn't hammer you. But I'll forgive you, we're back in love.