Silent Star 1: Lunacy

[Hectic]

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Votecount 1.6

[3] Tuxedo Mask:

Kanna, beeboy, Clover Ebi

[2] Dunnstral:

skitter30, midwaybear

[2] Clover Ebi:

lilith2013, votato

[2] beeboy:

Tuxedo Mask, Nahdia

[1] votato:

Morning Tweet

[3] Not Voting:

drusilla, Raven Branwen, Dunnstral

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to throw someone down the well.
The Day 1 deadline is in (expired on 2020-07-10 09:18:09).

[Hectic]

votato speaks up.

We should throw Clover Ebi down. He has 4 limbs so maybe we'll get lucky.

votato tries to tap his head but then realises he has hooves and that this would prove to be quite the challenge.

Meanwhile, Nahdia strolls up to beeboy who is admiring the weather. Their television screen for a head may look comical to some, but Nahdia wears it like armour. They switch it on and start playing a horror movie - looks like it's Saw. beeboy looks rather frightened; he never was good with jumpscares.

[Morning Tweet]

@Tuxedo; wrt to your points on beeboy, why is that *scummy*? what is your theory, that beeboy/dunnstral are a team?

Could be a team, could be white knighting. Just what I feel is the game was moving fast and revolving around Dunnstral wagon. Beeboy comes in and really try to pull the conversation off game stuff, and then hops in with a defense of Dunn. Neither of these things on their own would have pinged me, but together it feels like a good place to start. Like if Beeboy posted fluff and then hopped on the Dunn wagon I wouldn't feel they were trying to derail, or if they just hopped on with a defense of Dunn it probably wouldn't have stuck out, but the two together feels calculated(?).

@Dunnstral how do you feel about Beeboy?

I'm finding it hard to believe that fluff posting + defense = scumteam. I suppose i see what you're getting at but i don't think id put much stock in that theory.

I feel like it's very likely beeboy would've had that fluffy entrance as either alignment. Calling it a deliberate distraction is a stretch -- I don't expect scum!beeboy to think "Ah, my teammate is under fire. Bring out the 'heyheyhey', quick!"

All while not holding a scum read on the player you think I am defending?

I wouldn't be voting you if you were vocally scum reading Dunnstral. It's just without that step I think an already iffy case just has a clear logic error you seem to want to avoid.

Did you realize between these two I hadn't expressed any reads besides the one on you?

Anyways, my read of your actions can be independent of Dunn. Could be stepping up to defend a townie when no one else was, and could be trying to defend your partner. I don't know, but I find your actions scummy.

Also, your response feels like you're trying to avoid and OMGUS while still going after me. Like you wait till Kanna votes me first before you jump in. I don't see what changed from my first posts to now to warrant this vote, besides other players expressing doubt in my read.

Anyone can defend anybody. Saying "I don't know there's a plethora of possible scum motivations behind it" doesn't work for me. What incentive does scum!beeboy have to defend a townie when no one else was? And i mean there were other people defending dunn as far as i remember

I don't like this double down at all. I feel you should be noticing that your points aren't really adding up but instead you add an extra theory on that kinda assumes beeboy is scum more than it shows he is scum

VOTE: Tuxedo

[lilith2013]

VOTE: clover im ok with this

What's your reason for voting clover?

[lilith2013]

Spoiler:

In my experience from playing with midwaybear, he's always scum

Really? I played one game with you unless I know you somewhere else

I just looked over some of your games. I feel like you get into things faster as town. You start talking about something.

What were you expecting to see from her opening game post? I saw that she did that as scum too in mini 2136(talking about stuff in the game), so I don't think this meta read is correct.

skitter's vote on Dunn is fine because it was a bad push and maybe even a fake push. I do think Dunnstral was reaching with the argument, but I'm still not sure whether that makes him scum.

As the villagers erupt into offering their suggestions on who should be sent down, the bear walks over to the well.

Is this me

You weren’t on my radar until after I voted dunn. I don’t like that you jumped on him and then immediately backed off with “too scummy to be scum.”

I noticed this as well, but I didn't really think his backtrack was scummy. It just felt like he was reconsidering reads which I like.

how do you weigh that against lilith kinda playing both sides in the 1v1. like i agree with your reasoning, but im still getting pings from lilith stirring stuff up on both sides of the fight.

I bet votato is mad that beeboy townreads lilith and he's trying to get him not to.

VOTE: Dunnstral because I think he came out with a purposely bad push to make it look like TWTBAW. Him remaining so stubborn makes me feel good about this.
beeboy can be town for now(not really sure why)

What's TWTBAW?

[Morning Tweet]

Tuxedo's initial argument on beeboy is not a good one in my opinion. I think the hey-hey was meant to be a joke, and it didn't really derail the game in my opinion. Besides, it's an attention grabbing entrance that I don't think scum would take. beeboy's defense of Dunnstral was more of a thought, and it also provided good discussion because Lilith had recently played in a game where Dunnstral wasn't like that.
I like that beeboy seems to be reading tux in good faith by letting him talk about other reads.
Tux's entrance is very similar to dunnstral's because they both picked bad reasons to scumread someone. Not liking him as of now.

this is a better midway post. At least echoes my own thoughts

And lol you are right in the last sentence, but what separates this for me is that we're not really in RVS and it's less blatant than "You used exclamation points". It feels like Tux is trying to make beeboy scum more than he's convincing me why beeboy is scum

[lilith2013]

How do I say this properly...

Lilith I looked at your back and forth with Dunn and I think you're a bit tunneled/focused on him too much. Like, if Dunn is scum I doubt a lot of the reasons you're calling him scum went through his head and was an action he decided to consciously take as scum. That's just, so much early game when really it isn't needed at all.

What a strange post. You’re talking to me like you know I’m town and you’re talking about Dunn like you know he’s town and you’re trying to defend him but you’re not actually pointing out anything towny about him, it’s a very null defense.

VOTE: clover

I mean, you're not exactly wrong but what's the problem with that? I always start my games viewing everyone as town until I see otherwise, but even besides that point I am townreading the two of you so yes I am talking about you guys like I think you're town. Plus my first point on Dunn was my defense. I don't really have much else at the moment.

How do I say this properly...

Lilith I looked at your back and forth with Dunn and I think you're a bit tunneled/focused on him too much. Like, if Dunn is scum I doubt a lot of the reasons you're calling him scum went through his head and was an action he decided to consciously take as scum. That's just, so much early game when really it isn't needed at all.

What a strange post. You’re talking to me like you know I’m town and you’re talking about Dunn like you know he’s town and you’re trying to defend him but you’re not actually pointing out anything towny about him, it’s a very null defense.

VOTE: clover

this is a weird reason to vote clover imo
like i'm not sure he's really talking to you like he thinks either you/dunn are town (also didn't he just say on the last page that he was townleaning both of you?)
and i'm also not sure that givng a 'very null defense' is a reason to vote him?

I think it's hard to articulate why this kind of defense feels so off to me - but basically I feel like this is the kind of defense I'd try to make as scum, where I'm trying to stop a wagon but I don't really give AI reasons that someone shouldn't be wagoned (maybe you remember [redacted]?). Clover's appealing to me to "tunnel less" (when I don't think I'm tunneling at all...) instead of trying to convince me why Dunnstral's town. Also I think "that's so much early game when really it isn't needed at all" is also a horrible argument for why someone wouldn't be scum, along the same lines as "that'd be a bad play as scum."

To sum up, I just feel parallels between that post and a post I would make as scum trying to derail a wagon.

How do I say this properly...

Lilith I looked at your back and forth with Dunn and I think you're a bit tunneled/focused on him too much. Like, if Dunn is scum I doubt a lot of the reasons you're calling him scum went through his head and was an action he decided to consciously take as scum. That's just, so much early game when really it isn't needed at all.

am i tunneled/focused on dunn too much?

I looked at your iso again and it seems very reasonable/open. You're talking to others and taking other angles that don't involve Dunn. I don't think you're tunneled atm.
@Midway Wah? Huh? I just like the emojis!

You keep saying I'm focusing on dunnstral but I'm really not....

I looked at your iso again and it seems very reasonable/open. You're talking to others and taking other angles that don't involve Dunn. I don't think you're tunneled atm.

i'm not sure what the difference is between me and lilith then?
lilith has definitely taken other stances too

if anything i would maybe say i'm tunneled on dunn since lilith has moved on and was open to voting votato and i've been doubling down

^^^

I looked at your iso again and it seems very reasonable/open. You're talking to others and taking other angles that don't involve Dunn. I don't think you're tunneled atm.

i'm not sure what the difference is between me and lilith then?
lilith has definitely taken other stances too

if anything i would maybe say i'm tunneled on dunn since lilith has moved on and was open to voting votato and i've been doubling down

I think the main dif that I'm running into with it is you seem very calm and rational where Lilith seems quite angry with Dunn so I can't tell if she

wants

Dunn to be scum and is just adding reasons (and I think that's the case atm) where you're a lot more calm and relaxed so I didn't get the same vibe between the 2 of you. Does that make sense?

re: "seeming quite angry" I think you'll find that's just how I react to people trying to snark at me?
What reasons do you think I'm making up to support scumreading dunnstral? and if so, why are you townreading me?

[Kanna]

i found beeboy's reaction fine.

Its a 1+1=2 situation, 1 you tried to slow the game down with fluff and 1 you defended the current wagon together seems like 2 scum you wanted to defend Dunnstral but made it safe for yourself first. If it was either of those things on their own I probably wouldn't have found it scummy.

i think this 1+1=2 only works if beeboy is dunnstral's partner, no? but this connection just feels so random and possibly unnatural. i don't like the omgus accusation either.

don't like what nahdia said here.

I don't think these are complex thoughts either yet they make your argument come across as incredibly flawed. And now your centering all your content around this 1v1.

beeboy this feels like a huuuuuuge stretch. i actually agree with your initial assessment of tuxedo mask's case but you engaged Tux; why is it scummy for him to focus on responding to you?

[lilith2013]

I looked at your iso again and it seems very reasonable/open. You're talking to others and taking other angles that don't involve Dunn. I don't think you're tunneled atm.

i'm not sure what the difference is between me and lilith then?
lilith has definitely taken other stances too

if anything i would maybe say i'm tunneled on dunn since lilith has moved on and was open to voting votato and i've been doubling down

I really like skitter's questioning here and currently liking her for town

[Morning Tweet]

i'm surprised Nahdia is finding beeboy scummy. Also found Clover scummy? Interesting, it's really chainsaw-y but it's too obvious, i would think. For example 191 is discrediting midways defense of beeboy / suspicion of Tux but not really commenting on it itself

Am I the only one who is getting like, no scum pings from Dunnstral/Skitter/Lilith/Votato? I got townie pings from the first 3 and nothing from Votato. Just me? Okay.

scumposting.

VOTE: Clover Ebi

Why?!

im getting weird vibes

was there gonna be any followup to this

@dunn asked you a question earlier. do you still stand by the reasoning you gave for the early skitter push? is there any more context?

Nahdia why do you think that post by me was scum?

uhhh actually i misread it. i thought it said you were getting no pings on anyone, not that you were townreading them. my impression was that you were excusing yourself from forming reads

VOTE: beeboy

Why?

overreaction to tux.

is that it? What is your opinion on Tuxes' case itself?

[Kanna]

Tuxedo's initial argument on beeboy is not a good one in my opinion. I think the hey-hey was meant to be a joke, and it didn't really derail the game in my opinion. Besides, it's an attention grabbing entrance that I don't think scum would take. beeboy's defense of Dunnstral was more of a thought, and it also provided good discussion because Lilith had recently played in a game where Dunnstral wasn't like that.
I like that beeboy seems to be reading tux in good faith by letting him talk about other reads.
Tux's entrance is very similar to dunnstral's because they both picked bad reasons to scumread someone. Not liking him as of now.

i don't understand this.
tux's argument = not good = townie
tux's entrance = not good = don't like him?

[midwaybear]

lso, wtf -- this comes a bit after Lilith started a push on Clover that votato joined. You didnt mention Clover in your catchup post. what prompted you to theorize out of the blue that clover is using emojis to hide nervousness? Just seeing a couple of emojis?

lol it was a half-joke, but basically

What's TWTBAW?

To wolfy to be a wolf. It's sorta like votato's point that Dunnstral is town because his push was bad. I disagree with this because I don't think being anti-town is exclusively for town. I think scum can act anti-town to get the village to ignore them. In fact, it's a viable strategy for scum to act anti-town if you believe in this TWTBAW logic.

tux's argument = not good = townie

I don't think I ever said that his argument was townie.

[Kanna]

Tuxedo's initial argument on beeboy is not a good one in my opinion. I think the hey-hey was meant to be a joke, and it didn't really derail the game in my opinion.

Besides, it's an attention grabbing entrance that I don't think scum would take.

beeboy's defense of Dunnstral was more of a thought, and it also provided good discussion because Lilith had recently played in a game where Dunnstral wasn't like that.
I like that beeboy seems to be reading tux in good faith by letting him talk about other reads.
Tux's entrance is very similar to dunnstral's because they both picked bad reasons to scumread someone. Not liking him as of now.

?? it could be just me, but i'm finding this confusing

your twtbw point is reasonable.

[midwaybear]

oh the bolded was talking about beeboy because he sorta made himself the center of things by making people say hey to him. Now I realize the point isn't as valid because perhaps beeboy was trying to pocket people by lightening things up, but I still find him townie for treating tuxedo in good faith even though tux's case wasn't that good.

[Dunnstral]

lso, wtf -- this comes a bit after Lilith started a push on Clover that votato joined. You didnt mention Clover in your catchup post. what prompted you to theorize out of the blue that clover is using emojis to hide nervousness? Just seeing a couple of emojis?

lol it was a half-joke, but basically

What's TWTBAW?

To wolfy to be a wolf. It's sorta like votato's point that Dunnstral is town because his push was bad. I disagree with this because I don't think being anti-town is exclusively for town. I think scum can act anti-town to get the village to ignore them. In fact, it's a viable strategy for scum to act anti-town if you believe in this TWTBAW logic.

tux's argument = not good = townie

I don't think I ever said that his argument was townie.

Well you've seen me play mafia twice and I never really played like this from the get go

[midwaybear]

well I townread you in one game(though that was lazy game) and scumread you in the other. That means you can change ur approach to scum.
Your point is acknowledged, but not accepted.

[Tuxedo Mask]

Hmm, I just don't know how else to express it. Like if you reread the game in context the wagon is forming on Dunn on page 1, and they aren't RVS votes. Beeboy makes an entrance on page 2, but says nothing. Doesn't even RVS vote. They post again at the end of page 3, only to reintroduce their entrance post. Content doesn't come from them till page 4. It's just so weird like he is there watching the game unfold but not commenting on anything, while the game seemed clearly passed RVS.

Besides all that.
I have town pings from MT, Lilith, and Kanna.

Votato and Nahdia aren't sitting right with me.

[Kanna]

oh the bolded was talking about beeboy because he sorta made himself the center of things by making people say hey to him. Now I realize the point isn't as valid because perhaps beeboy was trying to pocket people by lightening things up, but I still find him townie for treating tuxedo in good faith even though tux's case wasn't that good.

oh, my bad. on a second readthrough then, i more or less agree. i think i'm mindmelding with Morning also which means she's probably town(!)

[skitter30]

VOTE: nahdia
I want to try this but i note that dunn is still scummy

[Kanna]

Hmm, I just don't know how else to express it. Like if you reread the game in context the wagon is forming on Dunn on page 1, and they aren't RVS votes. Beeboy makes an entrance on page 2, but says nothing. Doesn't even RVS vote. They post again at the end of page 3, only to reintroduce their entrance post. Content doesn't come from them till page 4. It's just so weird like he is there watching the game unfold but not commenting on anything, while the game seemed clearly passed RVS.

i liked this thought process more, although i disagree with the conclusion.

can you elaborate on votato?

VOTE: Nahdia

[votato]

talk to me about nahdia? i have a hard null read there.

[Raven Branwen]

I’m not yet fully caught up but so far, I’m liking Kana and Clover and maybe MT as well.

@mod, the light orange font isn’t showing up on my iPad.

[skitter30]

talk to me about nahdia? i have a hard null read there.

feeling off

[Dunnstral]

Wow skitter, that's so much better than your case against me, I can see why you'd move your vote.

[skitter30]

- posting feels 'flat'
- don't really like the clover push
- don't really like the beeboy push/vote, and in fact i kinda agreed with the beeboy side of the beeboy/tux thing, so the fact that nahdia is using that to push beeboy is slightly worrying